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(Vox)   Steve "Pinocchio" Mnuchin gets schooled on his tax plans by everyone's favorite crazy uncle, Bernie Sanders. 'Twas most glorious indeed   ( vox.com) divider line
    More: Obvious, percent, This Week, Donald Trump, Taxation in the United States, Tax, Ivana Trump, Good Morning America, percent average boost  
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2722 clicks; posted to Politics » on 02 Oct 2017 at 8:45 AM (2 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-10-02 07:39:45 AM  
As opposed to everybody's batshiat insane uncle, Ron Paul
 
2017-10-02 08:49:56 AM  
This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters
 
2017-10-02 08:50:18 AM  
Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.
 
2017-10-02 08:52:35 AM  

randomjsa: Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.


Really?  How the HELL do you justify that statement?  Keep in mind that I don't like Sanders but pretending universal health care has to explode spending is moronic.
 
2017-10-02 08:56:00 AM  

bigfatbuddhist: randomjsa: Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.

Really?  How the HELL do you justify that statement?  Keep in mind that I don't like Sanders but pretending universal health care has to explode spending is moronic.


The thing you've responded to doesn't justify things because they mostly exist to make inflammatory anti-"Lib" comments and get people riled up.

He's like what they'd call a troll elsewhere but we don't have trolls in Fark so he isn't one of those. He's here to offer a diverse marketplace of ideas.
 
2017-10-02 08:56:15 AM  
The trouble is, the GOP has found a defense against facts and logic- they have totally and brazenly embraced lies and hypocrisy.  You cannot shame that which has become shameless.  You can vote it out.  However the rubes aren't feeling enough pain to do that yet.
 
2017-10-02 08:56:28 AM  
Like it matters.  The truth is meaningless to Trump's regime and its supporters.
 
2017-10-02 08:56:31 AM  

randomjsa: Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.


OR...you're just an asshole.

Bernie has been representing the people of Vermont for over 30 years, and he has an approval rate  among his constituents of somewhere near 80%
 
2017-10-02 08:57:35 AM  
When asked if he could guarantee that the president won't get a tax cut under his own plan, Mnuchin responded: As I've said all along, the objective of the president is that rich people don't get tax cuts, and we're perfectly comfortable explaining to the American people how that works and we'll give plenty of examples.

We're not asking for 'plenty' of examples.  Just one.  One specific example.

One specific example, which for any president in the last half century other than Trump, we would already have.
 
2017-10-02 08:59:30 AM  

holdmybones: bigfatbuddhist: randomjsa: Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.

Really?  How the HELL do you justify that statement?  Keep in mind that I don't like Sanders but pretending universal health care has to explode spending is moronic.

The thing you've responded to doesn't justify things because they mostly exist to make inflammatory anti-"Lib" comments and get people riled up.

He's like what they'd call a troll elsewhere but we don't have trolls in Fark so he isn't one of those. He's here to offer a diverse marketplace of ideas.


So what you're saying is that they're the 2AM Home Shopping Network of intellectual talking points?
 
2017-10-02 09:00:55 AM  
Moving forward, the debate about Trump's tax plan will likely orbit around the administration's promise, at least according to one senior official, to offer a system that is as progressive as the current one but which doesn't "shift the burden from higher-income to lower-income households."

So they want to shift around how much everyone is taxed, but the end result will be that everyone pays the same as they are now.

That seems like a lot of work to no effect.  Or just a bald faced farking lie.
 
2017-10-02 09:03:06 AM  
F*ck your autoplay videos, Vox.
 
2017-10-02 09:04:14 AM  
"As I've said all along, the objective of the president is that rich people don't get tax cuts, and we're perfectly comfortable explaining to the American people how that works and we'll give plenty of examples."

And nobody gave him a chance to do so?  WTF, did they run out of rope to give him?
 
2017-10-02 09:07:05 AM  

Karac: Moving forward, the debate about Trump's tax plan will likely orbit around the administration's promise, at least according to one senior official, to offer a system that is as progressive as the current one but which doesn't "shift the burden from higher-income to lower-income households."

So they want to shift around how much everyone is taxed, but the end result will be that everyone pays the same as they are now.

That seems like a lot of work to no effect.  Or just a bald faced farking lie.


In "theory" simplifying the tax code so that everyone pays the same as before, but less paperwork is needed could save businesses and some individuals money. But that's not the actual Republican goal, of course.
 
2017-10-02 09:12:00 AM  

randomjsa: Bernie Sanders lecturing people about their bad ideas concerning taxes and government is about like hearing a serial arsonist lecture us on the responsible and safe use of fire.


To be fair, a serial arsonist would know Moreno then anyone else about fire safety. Afterall, that managed to survive each arson they've set, maybe we shouldn't listen to them.  It's like hiring a PC virus creator to head up your anti-virus department.  Or hiring hackers to work for the CIA.  Or hiring successful businessmen to run your business.
 
2017-10-02 09:13:08 AM  
Did Bernie actually elaborate on how he would have he government pay for his policy ideas this time?

(They're not bad ideas, but they do lack a concrete foundation)
 
2017-10-02 09:17:43 AM  
Rich people aren't going to get tax cuts, they're just going to pay less taxes, you see.. 'course all you moochers in the lower and working classes are going to have to do without services and some of you might see tax increases, but all that money from the wealthy will make its way down to you peons. Don't you worry.
 
2017-10-02 09:18:12 AM  

Hyperbolic Hyperbole: Did Bernie actually elaborate on how he would have he government pay for his policy ideas this time?

(They're not bad ideas, but they do lack a concrete foundation)


Mostly by raising taxes, I know you never hear of this as a reason, so its a little unusual, but there it is.
 
2017-10-02 09:18:21 AM  
Talking about tax plans giving benefits to the rich is right in Bernie's wheelhouse. The Big Bang Theory should give him weekly airtime to rant about this week's bad Republican tax idea. It'd probably be more entertaining than whatever's happening on that show.
 
2017-10-02 09:21:26 AM  

Karac: That seems like a lot of work to no effect. Or just a bald faced farking lie.


It makes the noises the mouth breathing hatefarks like to hear.  So, it will get overwhelming support.
 
2017-10-02 09:28:00 AM  
Sanders didn't own Mnuchin.  The article giving numbers doesn't help either, at least not very much.  You have to appeal emotionally to people.

Let people know Trump is lying to them and that these tax cuts are stealing from them.... They're taking your money, they're stealing your highways and PBS and whatever it is these Trumpers care about.  Stealing money feom veterans who need medical care....
 
2017-10-02 09:34:03 AM  
More money for the Lollipop Guild at the expense of working people.
 
2017-10-02 09:39:06 AM  

weddingsinger: Sanders didn't own Mnuchin.  The article giving numbers doesn't help either, at least not very much.  You have to appeal emotionally to people.

Let people know Trump is lying to them and that these tax cuts are stealing from them.... They're taking your money, they're stealing your highways and PBS and whatever it is these Trumpers care about.  Stealing money feom veterans who need medical care....


These people have been told for over 2 years that Agent Orange is lying to them.  The only thing that might, might get through to them is their own stigginit turned against them.

/horse-water-drink-yadayada
 
2017-10-02 09:43:32 AM  
It doesn't matter what Sanders says; he won't change the direction of the debate on arc second.  What needs to happen is for a GOP Senator to come forward and say, "I was against the US spending money we don't have when Obama was President and I am against it today."  You know that will never happen.
 
MFK
2017-10-02 09:46:52 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters


you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.
 
2017-10-02 09:48:14 AM  
Did Mnunchin use his Prep H for toothpaste?
 
2017-10-02 09:51:36 AM  
Facts don't matter to republicans.

They're lowering the top marginal rate, eliminating the AMT and eliminating the Estate Tax.

At the very same time they're repeating over and over again that "the rich aren't getting tax cuts."

This is the political version of "stop hitting yourself."
 
2017-10-02 09:58:25 AM  
If Trump had not been his typical idiot self when speaking and he just HAD to make the grandiose and totally fabricated statement that the tax plan was not good for him (Believe me!!!), it would be one less major talking point during these interviews.

Seriously, what benefit is there to that statement?  It's easily proven false by any number of methods.  As a reporter asked during the white house press briefing, (paraphrasing) - Why wouldn't Trump just be candid about his tax plan being beneficial to him?

Because Trump is seemingly incapable of not lying in some fashion when he speaks.
 
2017-10-02 09:58:33 AM  
For how can you compete,
Being honor bred, with one
Who were it proved he lies
Were neither shamed in his own
Nor in his neighbors' eyes;

~W.B.Yeats
 
2017-10-02 09:58:35 AM  

MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.


One of the worst aspects of the way the US funds election campaigns is that a certain amount of capitalist stockholm syndrome is required to win on a national level from "the left".
 
2017-10-02 10:03:27 AM  
These tax plans are just a new flavor of the Randian Fantasy that the right has been pushing for 30+ years

It's never once worked in real life without exploding the deficit or cratering the economy (or both!). Ask Kansas how well it works.

That's the result *every farking time*. The theory itself is more deeply & inherently flawed than organized religion, FFS. It *can't* work, it was never intended to actually work, and it will never work
 
2017-10-02 10:06:13 AM  

MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.


That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.
 
2017-10-02 10:07:05 AM  

damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.


Which half century is that?
 
2017-10-02 10:08:22 AM  

Hyperbolic Hyperbole: Did Bernie actually elaborate on how he would have he government pay for his policy ideas this time?

(They're not bad ideas, but they do lack a concrete foundation)


yes, in the plan he proposed, there is a funding mechanism to be deficit neutral
 
2017-10-02 10:10:14 AM  

Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?


Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.
 
2017-10-02 10:12:04 AM  
This farker looks like some sort of fish...wearing glasses..in a suit. Dunno why, but that's what I see.
I hope he dies horribly surrounded by people who hate him.
 
2017-10-02 10:16:18 AM  

damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.


Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.
 
2017-10-02 10:16:44 AM  
So that's taken care of.
 
2017-10-02 10:20:28 AM  
FTA: Asked again about Trump receiving a tax cut...

Ya know what, that gives me an idea. We should all start calling this plan the "Trump Tax Cut". Because that's exactly what it is. A huge (potentially BILLION dollar) tax cut for Trump. Everything else is just incidental.
 
2017-10-02 10:24:06 AM  
Hey Munchie - saying it doesn't make it farking so.
 
2017-10-02 10:29:19 AM  

cefm: Hey Munchie - saying it doesn't make it farking so.


Republicans create their own realities now... and while you are studying this reality, they'll be off creating another. Paraphrasing the bullshiat from the Bush era..  but it stands. It's what they do. And why every sane person is confused as fark.
 
2017-10-02 10:37:35 AM  

Psylence: cefm: Hey Munchie - saying it doesn't make it farking so.

Republicans create their own realities now... and while you are studying this reality, they'll be off creating another. Paraphrasing the bullshiat from the Bush era..  but it stands. It's what they do. And why every sane person is confused as fark.


Now?

Were you not paying attention for the (R) presidents since Nixon?
 
2017-10-02 10:39:55 AM  

Karac: damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.

Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.


Try getting some reading comprehension before calling anyone a "dolt", O Brainless One.
Or perhaps learn some History.
Either of those couldn't get elected  dogcatcher in today's GOP.
Eisenhower built the Interstate Highway System, and warned us of the Military-Industrial complex; Nixon created the EPA, OSHA, EEOC, and signed theClean Air & Water Acts into law.
Damn Sosh'lists...
 
2017-10-02 10:44:48 AM  
National Debt interest is 6.5% of the budget, about 1/4 of the social security total, and the fifth category of spending. 266 billion.

Deficit spending is fine, but that's a hell of a lot of money to spend on almost nothing every year.

Tax them or eat them.
 
2017-10-02 10:46:46 AM  

Muta: It doesn't matter what Sanders says; he won't change the direction of the debate on arc second.  What needs to happen is for a GOP Senator to come forward and say, "I was against the US spending money we don't have when Obama was President and I am against it today."  You know that will never happen.


Rand Paul has been doing that, he even once said

"You can't call yourself a conservative but be liberal with military spending"

But gen was derped down with "if you think defending this country is expensive, not defending this country is even more expensive"
 
2017-10-02 10:53:15 AM  
"DEFECITS!?!"
img.fark.net
 
2017-10-02 10:58:24 AM  

damonm: Karac: damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.

Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.

Try getting some reading comprehension before calling anyone a "dolt", O Brainless One.
Or perhaps learn some History.
Either of those couldn't get elected  dogcatcher in today's GOP.
Eisenhower built the Interstate Highway System, and warned us of the Military-Industrial complex; Nixon created the EPA, OSHA, EEOC, and signed theClean Air & Water Acts into law.
Damn Sosh'lists...


Reagan's amnesty program for illegal aliens.
 
2017-10-02 11:15:20 AM  

damonm: Karac: damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.

Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.

Try getting some reading comprehension before calling anyone a "dolt", O Brainless One.
Or perhaps learn some History.
Either of those couldn't get elected  dogcatcher in today's GOP.
Eisenhower built the Interstate Highway System, and warned us of the Military-Industrial complex; Nixon created the EPA, OSHA, EEOC, and signed theClean Air & Water Acts into law.
Damn Sosh'lists...


Nixon engineered the southern strategy, fought against a single payer health care reform led by Ted Kennedy, cut taxes, and was so obsessed with stiginit that he ordered the burglary of Democrat party headquarters.

I think he'd fit in just fine with today's Republicans.
 
2017-10-02 11:22:07 AM  

Karac: damonm: Karac: damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.

Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.

Try getting some reading comprehension before calling anyone a "dolt", O Brainless One.
Or perhaps learn some History.
Either of those couldn't get elected  dogcatcher in today's GOP.
Eisenhower built the Interstate Highway System, and warned us of the Military-Industrial complex; Nixon created the EPA, OSHA, EEOC, and signed theClean Air & Water Acts into law.
Damn Sosh'lists...

Nixon engineered the southern strategy, fought against a single payer health care reform led by Ted Kennedy, cut taxes, and was so obsessed with stiginit that he ordered the burglary of Democrat party headquarters.

I think he'd fit in just fine with today's Republicans.


"Fought against a single-payer health plan" - just like Republican Nancy Pelosi...
 
2017-10-02 11:39:45 AM  

Karac: damonm: Archidude: damonm: MFK: HotWingConspiracy: This will be a tough one for the Bernie haters

you know, it IS possible to agree that he is in fact noticing and pointing out objective reality AND wish that he and his minions would stop undermining the only party that has a chance of taking the Republicans out of power.

That party will first need to quit undermining its own damn self & get back to the policies that made it damn near invincible for almost a half-century - AKA, the sort of policy Sanders is backing.

Which half century is that?

Try 1933-1980 - when even REPUBLICANS were Liberal.

Nixon, you dolt.
Also, Eisenhower.


There's also the part where the Democratic power base during that half-century was anchored in the rural white working class that everyone insists the Democrats should stop "pandering" to and the Blue Dogs that everyone insists need to be purged from the party.
 
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