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(Washington Post)   Kentucky man has truck stolen by US border patrol enforcing Mexican laws   ( washingtonpost.com) divider line
    More: Asinine, Crime, Civil liberties, Asset forfeiture, Serrano, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, Human rights, Criminal law, Gerardo Serrano  
•       •       •

7618 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Sep 2017 at 1:20 AM (12 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



89 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2017-09-14 09:58:20 PM  
While I wish him luck I doubt he's going to get his truck back.
 
2017-09-14 11:51:29 PM  
Robert Everett Johnson of the Institute for Justice, a civil liberties law firm that is representing Serrano in federal court

NRA - *crickets*
 
2017-09-14 11:59:06 PM  
"Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.
 
2017-09-15 12:15:33 AM  

img.fark.netView Full Size

 
2017-09-15 01:24:48 AM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: [img.fark.net image 800x600]


They didn't even promise that, though.
 
2017-09-15 01:25:02 AM  

Boo_Guy: While I wish him luck I doubt he's going to get his truck back.


General SOP: was sold at auction within 90 days.
 
2017-09-15 01:27:01 AM  

BafflerMeal: Boo_Guy: While I wish him luck I doubt he's going to get his truck back.

General SOP: was sold at auction within 90 days.


That's pretty much what I thought when it said he was still making the payments on it, it's already gone.
 
2017-09-15 01:27:13 AM  

FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.


You really just made this an anti-GOP rant? WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office? Or the Democrat congress that passed the laws in 1984? They didn't lose control of Congress until 1994, 10 years later. Clinton was President until 2000, and things only got worse during that time.

Take your head out of your ass. Authoritarianism is alive and well in both major political parties.
 
2017-09-15 01:29:10 AM  
This "Where are they now" is boring
static.adweek.comView Full Size
 
2017-09-15 01:29:12 AM  
Why in the fark were police departments ever allowed to profit off of confiscated items, let alone confiscate items permanently without a charge?

Seriously, there is no way that was ever NOT going to lead to massive corruption. Just farking fund the police departments properly in the first place, and don't encourage them to steal shiat to make money.
 
2017-09-15 01:29:32 AM  
Virtually everyone outside law enforcement who has this properly explained to them is against it.  Law enforcement says 'taking drug related, ill gotten gains' and people buy it.  It's hard for right wingers especially to imagine cops nakedly being liars and thieves
 
2017-09-15 01:31:30 AM  
"I'm sick of hearing about your rights," the agent said, according to Serrano's lawsuit. "You have no rights here."

aclu.orgView Full Size

[Link]
 
2017-09-15 01:33:49 AM  

fusillade762: Robert Everett Johnson of the Institute for Justice, a civil liberties law firm that is representing Serrano in federal court

NRA - *crickets*


This is what I try to tell my NRA-loving friends and acquaintances: "When the f*ck has the NRA actually defended somebody's gun rights?"
 
2017-09-15 01:34:11 AM  
Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.
 
2017-09-15 01:34:24 AM  

FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.


It's always funny when commenters channel the assumed  attitudes and beliefs of people whom they've never met nor spoken to.
 
2017-09-15 01:34:29 AM  
That's when the trouble started. One of Serrano's photos shows two Customs agents looking in his direction, hands held up.
Customs declined to say whether there's a prohibition on photography at border crossings. And a real journalist would have made some further inquiries, maybe contacting DHS or the Attorney General's office or, god forbid, a lawyer, but... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
2017-09-15 01:38:43 AM  
Nope, no asshole LEOs here...
Nope, no outright thievery or extortion here...
No overstepping of ethical boundaries or even general decency either.

And Sessions just reversed the limits Obama put on these actions. America, home of the free (to be robbed).

And are 5 bullets actually against the law in Mexico, without a gun or anything?
 
2017-09-15 01:40:00 AM  

Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.


If you can't exercise your rights when faced with authority, you don't really have rights.
 
2017-09-15 01:41:42 AM  

jjorsett: It's always funny when commenters channel the assumed  attitudes and beliefs of people whom they've never met nor spoken to.


I mean, let's just start with what's in the article: a lifelong Republican voter. Who drives around with ammo rolling around in his new truck. Who spouts off about "freedom and liberty." Who "always" has his gun on him. Who ran for political office on a "2nd Amendment" platform.

Yeah, I think the article pretty much covers it. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts this guy had no problems with civil asset forfeiture when it happened to "other people."
 
2017-09-15 01:42:51 AM  

Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.


Wasn't Border Patrol.
 
2017-09-15 01:43:10 AM  
By the way, this is total BULLSH*T. But, it's bullsh*t LARGELY created from people like this.

Democrats are not blameless. Far from it. But, I'd bet Democrats would try to fix this issue if a bunch of simpletons didn't try to turn it into a "soft on crime" meme.
 
2017-09-15 01:47:01 AM  

Percise1: Nope, no asshole LEOs here...
...
And are 5 bullets actually against the law in Mexico, without a gun or anything?


Yeah. Any bullets at all will get you in trouble with Mexico. Their gun control laws are very strict.
// set sarcasm on
You can see how much it helps, too, with the extreme lack of crime south of the border.
// set sarcasm off
 
2017-09-15 01:50:37 AM  

Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.


If someone took a tire iron to the kneecaps of everyone involved at CBP, I'm not saying I'd condone it or look the other way or take part. I would, however, use my personal cell phone to call 911 dozens of times to make sure there were no police in whatever area it were happening.
 
2017-09-15 01:52:40 AM  

puffy999: By the way, this is total BULLSH*T. But, it's bullsh*t LARGELY created from people like this.

Democrats are not blameless. Far from it. But, I'd bet Democrats would try to fix this issue if a bunch of simpletons didn't try to turn it into a "soft on crime" meme.


Obama did fix the issue, with rules placed on Justice Department. Sessions undid them, vote for stupid people win stupid prizes.

Just remember the Americans we send to Mexico aren't our best and brightest, they are criminals, thieves, rapist and frat bros, but some I assume are also good people.
 
2017-09-15 01:55:16 AM  
I have never heard of a .380 that is loaded with a "clip". A magazine? Yes. Sorry, pet peeve. Just being nitpicky...

Yeah, nobody cares.
:-)
 
2017-09-15 01:58:39 AM  

LordJiro: Why in the fark were police departments ever allowed to profit off of confiscated items, let alone confiscate items permanently without a charge?

Seriously, there is no way that was ever NOT going to lead to massive corruption. Just farking fund the police departments properly in the first place, and don't encourage them to steal shiat to make money.


War on Drugs.

You know, for the safety of the precious children.
 
2017-09-15 02:08:01 AM  
The tears of the gander, how sweet are thee...

Seriously though, I hate to see this guy getting his car seized for no good reason, but let's face the facts--up until they took his car for no reason, he actively aligned hilarious with those he knew would take your car for no good reason.  Leopards and faces, my friends.  Leopards and faces.
 
2017-09-15 02:10:19 AM  

dropdfun: Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.

Wasn't Border Patrol.


I'm not sure if you're being pedantic or if you didn't read the first line of the article.

On Sept. 21, 2015, Gerardo Serrano was driving from his home in Kentucky to Piedras Negras, Mexico, when his truck was searched by U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents at Texas's Eagle Pass border crossing.
 
2017-09-15 02:10:36 AM  
Don't cross a border with a smart phone.
If you must cross a border with a smart phone, don't lock it.
If you must lock it, unlock it when asked.
If it has to be cracked because you lost the password, expect an extra 6-10 years on your sentence.
These are very simple rules. Don't provoke the man, to him, surveillance is a threat. Threats require response.
 
2017-09-15 02:11:43 AM  

jjorsett: Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.

If you can't exercise your rights when faced with authority, you don't really have rights.


Yup. He certainly didn't have the rights he thought he did.
 
2017-09-15 02:11:56 AM  

punkwrestler: fix


Fix. Obama sort-of patched the issue. He couldn't have fixed it if he tried, but not of his own doing.
 
2017-09-15 02:22:25 AM  

LarryNogo: I have never heard of a .380 that is loaded with a "clip". A magazine? Yes. Sorry, pet peeve. Just being nitpicky...

Yeah, nobody cares.
:-)


"Clip" is a word used (improperly) by people who watch too many movies and want to sound cool.   I would guess he keeps the chamber empty so he can always do the cool guy slide rack before shooting too.

This guy claims to be a "gun guy", yet he can't get his terminology right and doesn't check his truck's contents thoroughly before trying to cross the Mexican border.  The whole seizure deal sounds shady, but the bullets in the truck were still wrong.... he should've known better.
 
2017-09-15 02:38:19 AM  

Naido: Virtually everyone outside law enforcement who has this properly explained to them is against it.  Law enforcement says 'taking drug related, ill gotten gains' and people buy it.  It's hard for right wingers especially to imagine cops nakedly being liars and thieves


I think we're past the hard to believestage.  If the election of Trump proved anything, it's that people in Red States are actively encouraging such behavior for the vicarious thrill of knowing their support makes continued abuses possible.
 
2017-09-15 02:53:32 AM  

backhand.slap.of.reason: Naido: Virtually everyone outside law enforcement who has this properly explained to them is against it.  Law enforcement says 'taking drug related, ill gotten gains' and people buy it.  It's hard for right wingers especially to imagine cops nakedly being liars and thieves

I think we're past the hard to believestage.  If the election of Trump proved anything, it's that people in Red States are actively encouraging such behavior for the vicarious thrill of knowing their support makes continued abuses possible.


Gotta disagree.  I live in the south, and when I tell people that cops can take your property without so much as filing charges, people look at me like I suggested that Elvis was on the grassy knoll.  Way too much reverence for law enforcement, and belief that any treatment of brown people is justified, but they are largely oblivious to this particular problem.
 
2017-09-15 02:56:03 AM  

fusillade762: Robert Everett Johnson of the Institute for Justice, a civil liberties law firm that is representing Serrano in federal court

NRA - *crickets*


He can get help down at the crossroads... Just remember not to drink from a bottle someone else opened...
 
2017-09-15 03:08:43 AM  

tukatz: LarryNogo: I have never heard of a .380 that is loaded with a "clip". A magazine? Yes. Sorry, pet peeve. Just being nitpicky...

Yeah, nobody cares.
:-)

"Clip" is a word used (improperly) by people who watch too many movies and want to sound cool.   I would guess he keeps the chamber empty so he can always do the cool guy slide rack before shooting too.

This guy claims to be a "gun guy", yet he can't get his terminology right and doesn't check his truck's contents thoroughly before trying to cross the Mexican border.  The whole seizure deal sounds shady, but the bullets in the truck were still wrong.... he should've known better.


Well said. I guess some folks DO care...
 
2017-09-15 03:15:58 AM  

Carousel Beast: WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office?


Is that a joke?
 
2017-09-15 03:30:52 AM  

LordJiro: Why in the fark were police departments ever allowed to profit off of confiscated items, let alone confiscate items permanently without a charge?

Seriously, there is no way that was ever NOT going to lead to massive corruption. Just farking fund the police departments properly in the first place, and don't encourage them to steal shiat to make money.


Originally it was conceived of by the USPS and FDA who found themselves with pallets of unclaimed patent drugs. The people who were supposed to receive them would get wind of the coming bust and simply not show up. At that point they just submitted redemption codes to get these shipments, no IDs were checked because in a lot of cases people didn't have ID. So they would just be left with pallets of unclaimed, illegal merchandise. It wasn't real property so normal condemnation proceedings didn't apply. Civil asset forfeiture was the administrative process they came up with to claim it without knowing who the rightful owner was on the basis of "we have it, it's illegal" so they could legally destroy it.

Decades later Congress responded to the hue and cry over illegal drugs by making a law that allowed the government to do the same thing when the item itself was not illegal or when the owner was known but they could tie it in some hypothetical way to illegal acts that led to its ownership.

Because this alternative funding was available, many state and local governments drastically underfunded law enforcement, allowing them to claim lower tax rates. Abuse of civil asset forfeiture became institutionalized. what started as a way to dispose of abandoned illegal merchandise today is a way to fund normal law enforcement activities. There are towns out there that pay police $10 an hour. Despite appearances law enforcement can be very underfunded, with reliance on civil asset forfeiture and fines exerting downward pressure on budgets.
 
2017-09-15 04:16:09 AM  

Carousel Beast: FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.

You really just made this an anti-GOP rant? WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office? Or the Democrat congress that passed the laws in 1984? They didn't lose control of Congress until 1994, 10 years later. Clinton was President until 2000, and things only got worse during that time.

Take your head out of your ass. Authoritarianism is alive and well in both major political parties.


It's still funny when people think there are two parties. The Dems and Reps are just one giant Unibrow Party.
 
2017-09-15 04:59:15 AM  

Carousel Beast: FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.

You really just made this an anti-GOP rant? WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office? Or the Democrat congress that passed the laws in 1984? They didn't lose control of Congress until 1994, 10 years later. Clinton was President until 2000, and things only got worse during that time.

Take your head out of your ass. Authoritarianism is alive and well in both major political parties.


So Much THIS!
One of my major reservations about most of the national Democratic leadership is that this sort of thing is OK as far as they are concerned.   I doubt that Hillary would have made removal of civil asset forfeiture a priority and I am even more sure that Uncle Joe Biden would be OK with it.  Same goes for many other top Dems including my Senator, Feinstein.

This is not to say the GOP is better -- it is worse on average -- but the rich and powerful don't face assaults on their liberties like this unless they really do something bad.   Party is irrelevant.   BSAB applies in this case.
 
2017-09-15 05:03:59 AM  

Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.


I don't think that it started out as doing so intentionally.  They are the ones who were looking for an excuse to go off on someone.  He just didn't see any justification for it and voiced his disagreement.
 
2017-09-15 05:30:04 AM  

Krieghund: Let's be honest. The clip is was just a pretense. He got busted for giving the border patrol a hard time.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying he should have known better.


Yep.... long story short, self righteous idiot gets shafted due to being self-righteous idiot
 
2017-09-15 05:36:15 AM  
I love how 99% of threads like this contain nothing more than finger pointing.
 
2017-09-15 05:39:30 AM  

tukatz: LarryNogo: I have never heard of a .380 that is loaded with a "clip". A magazine? Yes. Sorry, pet peeve. Just being nitpicky...

Yeah, nobody cares.
:-)

"Clip" is a word used (improperly) by people who watch too many movies and want to sound cool.   I would guess he keeps the chamber empty so he can always do the cool guy slide rack before shooting too.

This guy claims to be a "gun guy", yet he can't get his terminology right and doesn't check his truck's contents thoroughly before trying to cross the Mexican border.  The whole seizure deal sounds shady, but the bullets in the truck were still wrong.... he should've known better.


Seriously.  I drove to Canada through Maine last year and I bet I scoured my jeep, my luggage and my fishing gear 5 times. I always carry a gun and my fishing gear has multiple knives. I made sure I had nothing of interest to Canadian Border Patrol. And I didn't see US Border Patrol when leaving the US. CPB officer did like my Yeti.

Dude's an idiot but I'll never agree with civil forfeiture.
 
2017-09-15 05:46:07 AM  

ArcadianRefugee: "I'm sick of hearing about your rights," the agent said, according to Serrano's lawsuit. "You have no rights here."

[www.aclu.org image 700x525]
[Link]


Remember it is 100 miles from international points of entry - so there should be heaps of other circles around airports that have international flights.
 
2017-09-15 06:00:57 AM  
Everyone just stop going over the border for a few days.
 
2017-09-15 06:27:39 AM  

Benjimin_Dover: Carousel Beast: FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.

You really just made this an anti-GOP rant? WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office? Or the Democrat congress that passed the laws in 1984? They didn't lose control of Congress until 1994, 10 years later. Clinton was President until 2000, and things only got worse during that time.

Take your head out of your ass. Authoritarianism is alive and well in both major political parties.

It's still funny when people think there are two parties. The Dems and Reps are just one giant Unibrow Party.


I know, right!  Obama and Trump are exactly the same!
 
2017-09-15 07:21:09 AM  

Carousel Beast: FormlessOne: "Civil forfeture's just fine, fine with me, 'cuz yer takin' drug money offa them illegals - hey, whatcha doin' with mah truck?!"

The idea that local, state, and federal authorities can just seize personal property, including money, without even the semblance of a charge - never mind an actual criminal act - should enrage Americans, no matter on whom it's perpetrated. The only reason we have "outrage" here is that it happened to a right-wing white guy.

He's become disillusioned by the government he once sought to join as an elected official.

Welcome to the goddamned farking club, pal. Here's a thought, though - maybe, next time, you'll understand that the folks who've already suffered for years at the hands of this government may have actual grievances. Y'know, now that you've experienced a small bit of what they've gone through.

You really just made this an anti-GOP rant? WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office? Or the Democrat congress that passed the laws in 1984? They didn't lose control of Congress until 1994, 10 years later. Clinton was President until 2000, and things only got worse during that time.

Take your head out of your ass. Authoritarianism is alive and well in both major political parties.


https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/07/sessions-forfeit​u​re-justice-department-civil/534168/

Eric Holder scaled them back, Jeff Sessions pushed them forward again.

Yes, I know, details require work, and if things are not 1 or 0 for you, it's all the same because thinking is a pain in the butt.
 
2017-09-15 07:37:12 AM  
The tragedy of it is he finally bought a decent truck, and they took it.  I would cry too if I had to drive a Chevy.

After decades of aluminum being used in commercial trucks and trailers to prove it can hold up to hard work, I look forward to owning a newer F150.  Means they solved the body rust problem for us MI people.
 
2017-09-15 08:00:44 AM  

willfullyobscure: Carousel Beast: WTF did Obama do to fix this travesty during his 8 years in office?

Is that a joke?


If it was a joke, he would have started with "2 priests walk into a bar...".
 
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