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(BBC)   Bomb disposal squad called in to deal with live ammunition from the Second World War. Sorry, did I say Second World War? I meant the Seven Years' War   ( bbc.co.uk) divider line
    More: Scary, Quebec, archaeologist Serge Rouleau, Saint Lawrence River, bomb disposal experts, senior munitions technician, British besieged Quebec, Officer Sylvain Trudel, Le Soleil news  
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7349 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Jul 2017 at 8:45 PM (13 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-07-15 06:25:04 PM  
Was this "7 years war" the same thing as the "French and Indian War"?
 
2017-07-15 07:16:47 PM  
The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.
 
2017-07-15 07:58:57 PM  

Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.


But then they wouldn't get to make a cannonball from 1759 go "BOOM".
 
2017-07-15 08:23:08 PM  
They sure it wasn't more recent?

img.fark.net
 
2017-07-15 08:47:18 PM  
I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.
 
2017-07-15 08:48:43 PM  

Kevin72: Was this "7 years war" the same thing as the "French and Indian War"?


Yes, but not to be confused with the War of 1812, when Canada invaded the U.S. and we bravely fought and defeated them and their British allies at the Battle of New Orleans after they had captured Detroit.  In the biggest strategic blunder of our history, we agreed to take back Detroit after the British and Canadians realized what they had done.  At least, I think that's what they taught us in grade school.
 
2017-07-15 08:50:57 PM  
Wet gunpowder.  Scary
 
2017-07-15 08:52:01 PM  

Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.


Quebec is in Canada.
 
2017-07-15 08:54:08 PM  
The 7 years war lasted 9 years. Discuss amongst yourselves. I'm getting verklempt.
ddppchicago.files.wordpress.com
 
2017-07-15 08:55:13 PM  

Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.


The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.
 
2017-07-15 08:57:51 PM  

Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.


No, it won't.
 
2017-07-15 08:58:45 PM  
That map of Canada which was in the article so you could situate Québec City; they should have included more of Ellesmere Island.
 
2017-07-15 09:02:58 PM  

Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.


Also known as the Battle of the Hemp Bales.

I swear it's true.
 
2017-07-15 09:07:03 PM  

Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.


There's an entire side of Fort Pulaski in Savannah that has cannonballs and rifled shells in it from the civil war. The SCMPD Bomb Squad still gets calls about cannonballs when they do development downtown.

/we also had our very own Iron Clad type ship the CSS Georgia sunk in the river.
 
2017-07-15 09:07:17 PM  

Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.


In Quebec from the same time, but solid metal:

s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com
 
2017-07-15 09:07:47 PM  
If that stupid incendiary cannonball had gone off, the French might have won.
 
2017-07-15 09:11:25 PM  
Why are these people posing beside unexploded ordnance?  Was it not labelled in French?

La Bombe?  Or La Bomba?

ichef-1.bbci.co.uk
 
2017-07-15 09:12:52 PM  

PushF12: Why are these people posing beside unexploded ordnance?  Was it not labelled in French?

La Bombe?  Or La Bomba?

[ichef-1.bbci.co.uk image 410x230]


I am guessing they assumed it was either solid shot or so old as to be no risk.
 
2017-07-15 09:14:32 PM  

PushF12: Why are these people posing beside unexploded ordnance?  Was it not labelled in French?

La Bombe?  Or La Bomba?

[ichef-1.bbci.co.uk image 410x230]


Le 1759.
 
2017-07-15 09:14:34 PM  
Yeah, work was a blast.
 
2017-07-15 09:39:08 PM  
Fired from Levis? Beans and pants were rather powerful back then.
 
2017-07-15 09:41:21 PM  

Kevin72: Was this "7 years war" the same thing as the "French and Indian War"?


Pretty sure the French and Indian War is the American name for the North American theater of the Seven Years War.
 
AOW
2017-07-15 09:50:02 PM  
Still waiting for someone to deal with the wreck of the SS Richard Montgomery, she sank in 50 foot of water near Sheerness, UK  with 1.5 kilotons of explosives aboard during WWII and is still there, bombs and all, despite reports that a collision or even the bombs shifting could set off a massive explosion it was decided to leave her and hope nothing bad will happen
 
2017-07-15 09:51:05 PM  

Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.


Satanic_Hamster: No, it won't.

As someone who has accidentally handled live projectiles from the early 18th century, Satanic_Hamster is closer to correct.  Yes, you want to immerse the shell in distilled water, but that's to stop the corrosion.  Rendering the gunpowder inside generally requires electrolysis supervised by trained specialists.

Iron, being being vulnerable to oxidation, loves to develop concretions.  Not only does this induce more corrosion, making the iron shell potentially unstable, but if it's dense enough it can also act as a sealant to keep the powder dry over the centuries.

Once you take an iron shell out of the water (or muddy soil), the outer layers of the concretions can dry and harden.  This can cause stress on the object, accelerate corrosion, and cause the iron to become brittle and unstable.  At best, you lose an artifact.  At worst, the artifact takes something or someone with it.

 There have been a number of local yokels who unearth a shell and just leave it to dry in the backyard, thinking they'll chisel off the concretions and sell a cannonball on Ebay.  Next thing we hear, Seven-Finger Steve has made the evening news.
 
2017-07-15 09:56:37 PM  

PushF12: Why are these people posing beside unexploded ordnance?  Was it not labelled in French?

La Bombe?  Or La Bomba?

[ichef-1.bbci.co.uk image 410x230]


Ritchie Valens - La Bamba
Youtube jSKJQ18ZoIA
 
2017-07-15 10:01:06 PM  

leevis: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Quebec is in Canada.


I was not talking about Quebec or Canada.  I was talking about Europe.  Or did you not understand what I wrote?
 
2017-07-15 10:05:26 PM  

Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.


Fort Pulaski in Savannah also comes to mind.

img.fark.net
 
2017-07-15 10:06:45 PM  

UNC_Samurai: There have been a number of local yokels who unearth a shell and just leave it to dry in the backyard, thinking they'll chisel off the concretions and sell a cannonball on Ebay.  Next thing we hear, Seven-Finger Steve has made the evening news.


For sale: wet cannonball.
 
2017-07-15 10:07:16 PM  

clownpenis.fart: Kevin72: Was this "7 years war" the same thing as the "French and Indian War"?

Pretty sure the French and Indian War is the American name for the North American theater of the Seven Years War.


Nice to know. Because we need some kind of follow up question to people who actually say " the British" when asked "who won the French and Indian War".
 
2017-07-15 10:21:54 PM  

Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.


I'm glad you added MO, because of course I thought MA.

Wiki says

The First Battle of Lexington, also known as the Battle of the Hemp Bales or the Siege of Lexington, was an engagement of the American Civil War, occurring from September 12 to September 20, 1861,[3] between the Union Army and the pro-Confederate Missouri State Guard

Which really reminds me again how retro this country is about hemp. We're still fighting about marijuana prohibition. And with 45 naming Supreme Court justices, abortion prohibition is guaranteed.
 
2017-07-15 10:22:54 PM  
Pretty sure that's the war dittybopper served in, judging by him preference in weaponry.
 
2017-07-15 10:24:01 PM  

Kevin72: Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.

I'm glad you added MO, because of course I thought MA.

Wiki says

The First Battle of Lexington, also known as the Battle of the Hemp Bales or the Siege of Lexington, was an engagement of the American Civil War, occurring from September 12 to September 20, 1861,[3] between the Union Army and the pro-Confederate Missouri State Guard

Which really reminds me again how retro this country is about hemp. We're still fighting about marijuana prohibition. And with 45 naming Supreme Court justices, abortion prohibition is guaranteed.


That hemp was primarily used for rope, not smoking.
 
2017-07-15 10:37:49 PM  

cgraves67: Kevin72: Darwin Approves: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

The old courthouse in Lexington, MO (Lafayette County) has a cannonball in one of its columns from the Battle of Lexington.

I'm glad you added MO, because of course I thought MA.

Wiki says

The First Battle of Lexington, also known as the Battle of the Hemp Bales or the Siege of Lexington, was an engagement of the American Civil War, occurring from September 12 to September 20, 1861,[3] between the Union Army and the pro-Confederate Missouri State Guard

Which really reminds me again how retro this country is about hemp. We're still fighting about marijuana prohibition. And with 45 naming Supreme Court justices, abortion prohibition is guaranteed.

That hemp was primarily used for rope, not smoking.



We can't even have that.
 
2017-07-15 10:49:28 PM  

Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.


Fort Pulaski, GA, would like a word with you:
otrwjam.files.wordpress.com

Lots and lots and lots of shells still embedded in that wall.
 
2017-07-15 11:00:30 PM  

Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.


Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.
 
2017-07-15 11:06:47 PM  

AtlanticCoast63: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Fort Pulaski, GA, would like a word with you:
[otrwjam.files.wordpress.com image 850x637]

Lots and lots and lots of shells still embedded in that wall.


Where in my post did I say that there were no such sites outside of Europe?
 
2017-07-15 11:14:36 PM  
Well hush my mouth and call me Steve. Good thing the only things I ever find buried in the back yard are old beer-can pull-tabs.
 
2017-07-15 11:21:28 PM  

leevis: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Quebec is in Canada.


Citation needed
 
2017-07-15 11:30:03 PM  

Mock26: leevis: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Quebec is in Canada.

I was not talking about Quebec or Canada.  I was talking about Europe.  Or did you not understand what I wrote?


It's easy to assume from your comment that you haven't read the article which is about a live cannonball found in the city of Quebec, in Quebec, Canada. I'm sure most of us assumed the live cannonball had been found in Europe before reading the article.

I think finding stuff like this in the Americas is even cooler that finding it in Europe.
 
2017-07-15 11:42:36 PM  

AtlanticCoast63: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Fort Pulaski, GA, would like a word with you:
[otrwjam.files.wordpress.com image 850x637]

Lots and lots and lots of shells still embedded in that wall.


man I knew infrastructure projects were backed up but I didn't think it was a 200 year backlog
 
2017-07-15 11:58:14 PM  

Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.


This.  The only boomstuff they had back then was black powder, which is completely inerted with water.  In fact, it takes some effort to get your your gun to go boom in wet weather.

img.fark.net
 
2017-07-16 12:02:09 AM  

ScottRiqui: Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.

Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.


Then it's not black powder, it's smokeless.  Black powder dissolves in water.  It's just Potassium Nitrate, Sulfur, and charcoal.  And black powder was the only kind of powder available during the mid-18th Century.
 
2017-07-16 12:04:44 AM  

cgraves67: Pretty sure that's the war dittybopper served in, judging by him preference in weaponry.


Heh.  No, I served in the frontlines of the Cold War, in the Aether.
 
2017-07-16 12:19:18 AM  

dittybopper: ScottRiqui: Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.

Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.

Then it's not black powder, it's smokeless.  Black powder dissolves in water.  It's just Potassium Nitrate, Sulfur, and charcoal.  And black powder was the only kind of powder available during the mid-18th Century.


I know the potassium nitrate is water-soluble, even though the sulfur and charcoal aren't.  But unless you actually wash away the dissolved potassium nitrate, it would still be there when the mixture dried again.  I'm just saying that I wouldn't feel particularly confident that soaking a cannonball in water for ten minutes is going to render it permanently safe.

Regardless, you're right - the fact that Alliant has had a sample of Unique under water for 100+ years is neither here nor there.
 
2017-07-16 12:24:19 AM  

dittybopper: ScottRiqui: Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.

Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.

Then it's not black powder, it's smokeless.  Black powder dissolves in water.  It's just Potassium Nitrate, Sulfur, and charcoal.  And black powder was the only kind of powder available during the mid-18th Century.


http://www.castpics.net/subsite2/GeneralReference/L&R-Smokeless.pdf

Page 19 (page number 13 on the document itself).
 
2017-07-16 12:46:05 AM  

Mock26: dittybopper: ScottRiqui: Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.

Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.

Then it's not black powder, it's smokeless.  Black powder dissolves in water.  It's just Potassium Nitrate, Sulfur, and charcoal.  And black powder was the only kind of powder available during the mid-18th Century.

http://www.castpics.net/subsite2/GeneralReference/L&R-Smokeless.pdf

Page 19 (page number 13 on the document itself).


That's the same powder sample I was talking about.  Like dittybopper said, though - it's not really useful to compare smokeless powder to black powder in that respect.
 
2017-07-16 01:08:39 AM  
Got to visit ft.sumter in charleston, i was fascinated with all the different artillery peices to the point that i spent the whole time in the museum. Furtherly fascinating was the huge mortars stationed along the battery onshore a couple miles from sumter and aimed at sumter. Boy would i pay to see these peices fired with a full load...
 
2017-07-16 02:27:42 AM  

cgraves67: Pretty sure that's the war dittybopper served in, judging by him preference in weaponry.


HA! 😆
 
2017-07-16 03:46:37 AM  

leevis: Mock26: I think it is cool that there are still places in Europe where you can see cannonballs embedded in buildings.

Quebec is in Canada.


*woosh*
 
2017-07-16 07:42:37 AM  

ScottRiqui: dittybopper: ScottRiqui: Therion: The cannonball is now at a safe site and will either be disarmed or destroyed if necessary, CBC says.

Ten minutes in a bucket of water will render it perfectly safe, ya morons.

Alliant (a gunpowder manufacturer) has a sample of their gunpowder that's been stored in a jar of distilled water since 1899.  They periodically dry out a portion of the sample and test it, and it's still performing almost to original specifications.

Then it's not black powder, it's smokeless.  Black powder dissolves in water.  It's just Potassium Nitrate, Sulfur, and charcoal.  And black powder was the only kind of powder available during the mid-18th Century.

I know the potassium nitrate is water-soluble, even though the sulfur and charcoal aren't.  But unless you actually wash away the dissolved potassium nitrate, it would still be there when the mixture dried again.  I'm just saying that I wouldn't feel particularly confident that soaking a cannonball in water for ten minutes is going to render it permanently safe.

Regardless, you're right - the fact that Alliant has had a sample of Unique under water for 100+ years is neither here nor there.


The charcoal is also water soluble.  Trust me, all you have to to to make black powder safe is to get it good and wet.  Remember that old saying about keeping your powder dry?  That's because BP is quite literally destroyed by water.

In fact, I'd give even odds it's already inert.  The fuses used on these things were wooden plugs with a small hole drilled through them, which was packed with alcohol-dampened powder which subsequently dried.  That made a solid grain that would burn at a predictable rate.  Gunners could trim them based on expected time of flight with a knife.

My guess is that water has already entered that shell through the fuse or fuse hole.  It's been well over 250 years in an area that gets plenty of rain.

But even if not and all the powder is hermetically sealed and still good, they still don't need to destroy it.  Just remove the plug fuse and empty it.  Same the powder for testing (an interesting thing as very few samples of powder from that era survive).  Check it for grain size, composition, if it's glazed or not, etc.  Could tell us more about how powder was made back then.

It would be safe to do that because unlike more modern explosives that that can become more sensitive and dangerous over the years, BP at best remains only as sensitive as it was when first made.  And it's a safe thing to handle as long as you don't have any open flames or high heat around it.  Use non-sparking tools made out of, say, copper to remove the fuse and scape out any caked powder, and rinse the shell out with distilled water.  Problem solved, and you don't have to destroy a valuable artifact.
 
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