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(This is Devon)   British doctors to earn £100 for every patient they don't send to hospital   (thisisdevon.co.uk) divider line 90
    More: Asinine  
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3861 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 May 2004 at 9:39 AM (11 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2004-05-19 09:25:26 AM  
[image from powayusd.sdcoe.k12.ca.us too old to be available]
"I've had worse"
 
2004-05-19 09:42:34 AM  
no way will this get abused
 
2004-05-19 09:43:20 AM  
And this surprises who exactly?
 
2004-05-19 09:44:05 AM  
"100 quid if you only bruise 'em a little..."
 
2004-05-19 09:46:07 AM  
We do that here in the US, it's called HMO plans
 
2004-05-19 09:46:35 AM  
I'll make a deal. Give me Jose Lima's wife and all the coke I'm able to sniff off her butt, and I'll avoid hospitals for the rest of my life.
 
2004-05-19 09:46:44 AM  
Extra bonus if the patient dies at home!
 
2004-05-19 09:48:12 AM  
Wow, why don't we socialize our medicine too, so we can have a farked up system like this.
 
2004-05-19 09:48:53 AM  
sigh.
THE hospital.
When will you English people get around to learning English?
 
2004-05-19 09:49:01 AM  
Doctor to a terminally injured person:
SHa-ching...

I'm sorry sir, I think I would advice you to leave that open wound as is. Alternatively you can still try an make it by foot to the nearest hospital.
 
2004-05-19 09:49:49 AM  
Not a bad idea. At the moment doctors in public healthcare systems have incentives to make work, and no-one likes being poked about more than is really needed.

Ontario is a case in point: $30bn and rising to provide healthcare for about 11 million people. Cut of out 10% by stomping on the make-work schemes, and the provincial deficit would be wiped out.
 
2004-05-19 09:49:57 AM  
Insurance companies do that here in the good 'ol USA. At least they use real doctors...
 
2004-05-19 09:58:09 AM  
What could possibly go wrong with a plan like this?
 
2004-05-19 10:03:30 AM  
All hail Hillary care!


The US will be like that in 20 years. I'm trying to get all my sickness in now.
 
2004-05-19 10:05:21 AM  
patient - 'doctor, i seem to have a large lump growing on the side of my neck and i'm worried it could be cancer'

doctor - 'you're probably right, but how does this sound, if you don't go to hospital i'll split the 100 with you?!'
 
2004-05-19 10:06:51 AM  
Why can everybody get it through their heads???

Socialized medicine sucks.

The cost of health care in the US sucks, but socialized medicine isn't the answer.


They need to first stop all the ridiculous lawsuits. Many hostpitals have stopped delivering babies entirely because of lawsuits involved. 25% of OBGYN's have retired early because of rising insurance costs. A neurosurgeon needs to pay $300,000/year just for insurance. People all over the place are getting awarded multi-million-dollar settlements for things that were a known risk.

But yeah, socialized medicine isn't the answer. The US government is trying to get socialized medicine working (i.e. Medicare), and that leads to people being sent home without half their skull.
 
2004-05-19 10:09:19 AM  
Ooooh. He said it in bold, it must be true.
 
2004-05-19 10:09:22 AM  
Hillary Clinton call your office!
 
2004-05-19 10:09:57 AM  
Err, why can't...
 
2004-05-19 10:12:14 AM  
As a liberal, I'd just like to say that, yes, we are evil, and we plan to kill everybody within the next 10-20 years.

/flame on
 
2004-05-19 10:14:50 AM  
Socialized medicine sucks.

errr,no. the people who administer it suck.

the Dutch do it just fine - unless of course they have it wrong ....?
 
2004-05-19 10:20:23 AM  
Hey, farmers get paid to not grow crops, so why not pay doctors to not cure people?

/Topsy-turveydom is here!
 
2004-05-19 10:20:32 AM  
This does sound crazy at first glance, but the case appears to be that a doctor can receive 75 for providing a 'detailed care plan' for a patient with a chronic illness, and an extra 25 if that patient is not admitted to hospital. So as long as the care plans are well vetted, this need not be a problem; the plans should lead to home care for applicable patients who do not necessary need to be in hospital.

It's a shame that financial incentives have to be involved, but presumably it's more work for the doctors to work on the care plans.

To be honest, if you imagine that your doctor is liable to abuse this system, it sounds like you should get a different doctor, or else pay for your health plan, which you're able to do in the UK if you choose. The NHS is still there for anyone who needs it and it's a lifesaver for thousands of people every day. There's certainly room for improvement, but I'm glad it's there.
 
2004-05-19 10:21:14 AM  
This is why I wholeheartedly support the doctors who refuse insurance now and just take cash. They charge less than other doctors, but get to pocket more.

Cheaper medical care + ( doctors who make more = doctors who are happier ) = better medical care

/And yes, that is a valid mathematical expression, the middle section in parenthesis reduces down to either side of the = sign
 
2004-05-19 10:21:31 AM  
W3WT, go socialism!
 
2004-05-19 10:21:38 AM  
As a liberal, I'd just like to say that, yes, we are evil, and we plan to kill everybody within the next 10-20 years.

I'll give you the killing part. It's when you lefties try to SAVE everybody that your evilness shows.
 
2004-05-19 10:21:40 AM  
Yeah, the people who administer everything suck.

You do realize that communism would be the ultimate utopia if it weren't for the fact that there will always be people who will corrupt anything you let them get their hands in, right? That's why there needs to be more accountability, i.e. let people be responsible for choosing the best health care.

The problem here is taking the choice away from people. "Sorry, you don't want to go to the hospital." Just like the problem with HMO's is taking away people's choice. Just like the problem with health care being ridiciulously expensive in the US is that it takes away people's choice by limiting what they can afford.

I'm just saying it all sucks.
 
2004-05-19 10:22:41 AM  
BadBatsuMaru
"Why can everybody get it through their heads???

Socialized medicine sucks.

The cost of health care in the US sucks, but socialized medicine isn't the answer."


Great. And now because we don't have socialized medicine, the $1,000 medical bill that I just got (and that I can't afford being uninsured) will go unpaid. Do unpaid medical bills affect the cost of everyone else's care ? No matter, I need to pay rent and eat, and the bill can wait for all I care.


I wish the U.S. would at least try some form of Universal care, because what we have now is barely passable.

 
2004-05-19 10:24:02 AM  
Socialized medicine and/or wisespread health insurance make matters unsustainable. They separate the buyer from the cost, so the buyer has little to no incentive not to go to the doctor for every bump, bruise, scratch or cough.

Health insurance should cover serious or catastrophic circumstances only. Everything else should be out-of-pocket. If non-catastrophic health insurance were banned, healthcare prices would plummet back to the range of affordability.
 
2004-05-19 10:24:25 AM  
How about giving me 100 for not getting sick?
 
2004-05-19 10:24:48 AM  
Oh, and I know for a fact that there is at least one hospital in New Orleans who will provide free medical care in the emergency room. You do get less priority in line than those who are paying, unless you would possibly die from your medical condition.

Contrast this with a hospital in NYC, where my highschool chamber orchestra teacher had to take a student on a field trip once. While they were in the emergency room, someone came in with a friend who had his arm ripped off in a shredder and the hospital refused to take him because he didn't have health insurance.

Socialized medicine isn't such a bad thing.
 
2004-05-19 10:25:53 AM  
LoveInAction

Maybe we can turn this into another thread about zombies.
 
2004-05-19 10:29:07 AM  
Anyone see The Barbarian Invasions? Great independent film which skewers the Canadian socialized medicine system. One of the funny lines from the film is when the old guy with cancer is stretched out in the hallway of the obviously understaffed hospital amidst several other patients. His son wants him to come to America for better care, but he says:

"Leave me here. I voted for socialized medicine, and I accept the consequences!"
 
2004-05-19 10:30:06 AM  
DrZombie --
"While they were in the emergency room, someone came in with a friend who had his arm ripped off in a shredder and the hospital refused to take him because he didn't have health insurance."


So, how is the armless kid doing with his millions? That's a go directly to settlement case. They can't turn an injury like that away. They're required to treat it.
 
2004-05-19 10:30:26 AM  
Maybe we can turn this into another thread about zombies

That's GOLD, Jerry... GOLD!

More untreated people = more potential zombie material.

I'm still in a quandary about slow versus fast zombies thought.
 
2004-05-19 10:32:34 AM  
"While they were in the emergency room, someone came in with a friend who had his arm ripped off in a shredder and the hospital refused to take him because he didn't have health insurance."

They should have at least given him a hand.

Now the settlement is going to cost them an arm and a leg.
 
2004-05-19 10:33:12 AM  
Omega Ohm

I have no follow-up to that story. This took place in the early 90's, and I was too young to be familiar with the current state of medical malpractice suits at the time.
 
2004-05-19 10:37:35 AM  
Rev. Skarekroe

THE hospital.
When will you English people get around to learning English?


Well unfortunetly, it's us Americans who are wrong about this one. For instance, when you attend college do you say "I go to the college." or "I go to college."?
 
2004-05-19 10:39:09 AM  
Unfortunately, I mean.
 
2004-05-19 10:40:17 AM  
Nice one, LoveInAction....

And people who say "see, socialized medicine doesn't work" have no idea how it does work, and even less of an idea how HMO's do.

It's the same thing as socialized medicine with a smaller risk pool and every bit as much overhead. By getting a larger segment of the population basic care you actually reduce the chance of serious illness and high cost medical expense. See, people going to the doctor for every cut or cough is not necessarily a bad thing. Better a hundred $75 check ups than a $10,000 hospital stay for an infection or pneumonia down the road.
 
2004-05-19 10:41:50 AM  
Nice post UndecidableComputation. I always thought Medical Savings Accounts sounded like a good idea. You get about $3,000 in the account a year, designate $1000 give or take for the catastrophic insurance and have the remaining $2000 to use for the occassional illness and accident. People have incentive not to be hypochondriacs because once your account is spent that's it for the year and since you are in charge of a block of money for medical care you shop around for the best prices, forcing doctors to be competitive in pricing.

Course, the people administrating that would probably find a way to fark that up too.
 
2004-05-19 10:48:49 AM  
In Russian, the medicine socializes YOU!
 
2004-05-19 10:51:18 AM  
The only problem with MSA's is the current legislation that makes you "use it or lose it". I guess it's written up this way since the dollars going into your account aren't taxed, and they wouldn't want people using it as a tax free savings account. This can actually cause over-utilization when the end of the year is approaching and people have over-estimated their spending requirements.

Also, they do nothing to cover catastrophic health situations...
 
2004-05-19 10:58:20 AM  
I have the solution.

Euthanise everyone over 80.

//quite serious, actually
 
2004-05-19 10:58:25 AM  
Snake Plissken

I always thought Medical Savings Accounts sounded like a good idea. You get about $3,000 in the account a year, designate $1000 give or take for the catastrophic insurance and have the remaining $2000 to use for the occassional illness and accident. People have incentive not to be hypochondriacs because once your account is spent that's it for the year and since you are in charge of a block of money for medical care you shop around for the best prices, forcing doctors to be competitive in pricing.


Yeah, medical savings accounts do sound like an interesting idea. In general, I'm for plans that make the patient feel the cost of care. This encourages quality and price competition among doctors and it discourages hypochondriacs from driving costs up.

It'd be amazing if people actually researched doctors based on quality/price and then made a decision. My wife and I can't afford health insurance right now, and the result is that we take much better care of ourselves, and we do careful research before consulting doctors.

I read in the Wall Street Journal that some docs are so fed up about dealing with insurance companies that a few are opening up practices where you have to pay out-of-pocket. I wish one of those would open up in Atlanta.
 
2004-05-19 11:02:55 AM  
UndecidableComputation, It shouldn't just be catastrophic circumstances only, when a few simple tests and a doctors visit, say for lime disease can cost you $600+. I have a decent PPO, So that would only cost me around $25. A few bills like that a year would definitely hurt me financially, and if I didn't have a solid income and health insurance, I don't know what I would do. I have a friend who was in a minor car accident, but they thought he may have a head injury (ended up being a concussion), so he was life flighted out and spent a night in the hospital, cost $8000+. How can the avg person afford that without insurance? In a country where we have tens of millions uninsured, many of them children; and we spend over $400 billion on defense, $150 billion+ in corporate welfare. There has to be a better solution than what we have now. At the very least slice of a few billion and help the people who need it.
 
2004-05-19 11:03:33 AM  
This might sound like empty bravado, but it's my intention that, should I ever require extended medical care, I hope I retain the courage and presence of mind to "off" myself, rather than spend a lifetime of savings for two or three less-than-pleasant years of extended life.

Of course, one never knows how one will react in the exact instance, but that's my plan.
 
2004-05-19 11:04:20 AM  
While they were in the emergency room, someone came in with a friend who had his arm ripped off in a shredder and the hospital refused to take him because he didn't have health insurance.

I'm calling shenanigans. Anyone got the number?
 
2004-05-19 11:11:15 AM  
Here we go with the socialized medicine paranoia again. Weeeeee!

Anybody read about the American woman who had half of her skull removed due to an injury, and the skull sat in a freezer while she argued with her HMO over who was going to pay for putting it back? Yeah. Private medicine sounds great!

I'm not kicking this poor dead horse today. You guys are welcome to your system. The corporations who are raking it in will be laughing all the way to the bank while you guys defend their privilage to rob you when you are sick.
 
2004-05-19 11:21:03 AM  
justanotherfarkinfarker
UndecidableComputation, It shouldn't just be catastrophic circumstances only, when a few simple tests and a doctors visit, say for lime disease can cost you $600+. I have a decent PPO, So that would only cost me around $25. A few bills like that a year would definitely hurt me financially, and if I didn't have a solid income and health insurance, I don't know what I would do. I have a friend who was in a minor car accident, but they thought he may have a head injury (ended up being a concussion), so he was life flighted out and spent a night in the hospital, cost $8000+. How can the avg person afford that without insurance? In a country where we have tens of millions uninsured, many of them children; and we spend over $400 billion on defense, $150 billion+ in corporate welfare. There has to be a better solution than what we have now. At the very least slice of a few billion and help the people who need it.

Testing for lime disease would not cost $600+ if everyone had to pay that. When the supplier knows an insurer is paying, they'll jack up the "cost" as high as they can because they know they can pay it. If a hospital told you they were going to charge you $600 for a lime disease test, would you (a) say ok, or (b) consider finding another doctor first?

Though this evidence is anecdotal, I think it's illustrative. When my mom took the car into the shop after an accident, they raised the price estimate to $1400 (from $400) once they found out insurance was covering it. My mom reported them for it, but I don't think anything ever came of it.

My point is that because hardly anyone has to pay for their healthcare, which hugely inflates demand, and so now everything has become "catastrophic" due to its price. And remember, ultimately, you /still/ have to pay somehow. The money your employer spends on your insurance could have been given directly to you. Even if the government pays, the money still had to come from somewhere.

And, a car accident with a possible life- or ability-threatening counts as "catastrophic" in my book.
 
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