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(CNBC)   The GOP's newest "healthcare" plan is out, and it does reflect some major changes - that make it even worse than the first one   ( cnbc.com) divider line
    More: Asinine, Freedom Caucus, Affordable Health Care for America Act, community rating rules, House Freedom Caucus, Freedom Caucus source, 111th United States Congress, Freedom Caucus chairman, Bill Clinton  
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2662 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Apr 2017 at 1:09 PM (26 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2017-04-20 12:13:23 PM  
1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*
 
2017-04-20 12:23:22 PM  
Which first one?  The "20some million people lose healthcare within 10 years" plan or the compromise that doubled that number?

Article doesn't say, I guess we'll have to wait for the CBO report, assuming republicans even allow them to make one.
 
2017-04-20 12:23:24 PM  
I honestly think a more effective and useful plan could be put together by writing down the flatulence emitted by the outgassing of a decaying bucket of rotting fish assholes.

/queue image link of can of said
//no, I mean actual, honest to god, outright fish assholes.
 
2017-04-20 12:27:03 PM  
The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.
 
2017-04-20 12:31:14 PM  

Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*


Wow, spoken like a true lib. I guess I'm supposed to foot the bill when you need to see a doctor after hitting your own head on your own desk, too?

The fact of the matter is, this is how the free market is supposed to work as The Framers intended. Making your state an unsurvivable hellscape is what this country was founded on. If you don't like it, you have the freedom to move. And don't give me any of that "oh, waaahhhh, it costs money to move... wahhhh.... family and friends support structure... wahhhh" liberal nonsense. As long as you have one limb left the crawl your way across the ground, you can move to another state.
 
2017-04-20 12:40:09 PM  
Yeah but is it worse enough to get the freedom caucus on board?  Because freedom, ya know.
 
2017-04-20 12:41:07 PM  
Tax cuts for the wealthy?
Whar?

WHERE ARE THE FARKING TAX CUTS?
 
2017-04-20 12:48:23 PM  

Action Replay Nick: Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*

Wow, spoken like a true lib. I guess I'm supposed to foot the bill when you need to see a doctor after hitting your own head on your own desk, too?

The fact of the matter is, this is how the free market is supposed to work as The Framers intended. Making your state an unsurvivable hellscape is what this country was founded on. If you don't like it, you have the freedom to move. And don't give me any of that "oh, waaahhhh, it costs money to move... wahhhh.... family and friends support structure... wahhhh" liberal nonsense. As long as you have one limb left the crawl your way across the ground, you can move to another state.


Please tell me you're joking here. Please.
 
2017-04-20 12:50:10 PM  

Ambivalence: Action Replay Nick: Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*

Wow, spoken like a true lib. I guess I'm supposed to foot the bill when you need to see a doctor after hitting your own head on your own desk, too?

The fact of the matter is, this is how the free market is supposed to work as The Framers intended. Making your state an unsurvivable hellscape is what this country was founded on. If you don't like it, you have the freedom to move. And don't give me any of that "oh, waaahhhh, it costs money to move... wahhhh.... family and friends support structure... wahhhh" liberal nonsense. As long as you have one limb left the crawl your way across the ground, you can move to another state.

Please tell me you're joking here. Please.


Surprisingly hard to tell, isn't it?


//(he is)
 
2017-04-20 12:58:08 PM  
The new version of trumpcare is an attempt to raise costs  for Americans and profit for insurance companies.  Add for profit health insurance companies that receive any government funding have a max gross  profit rate of 8% on gross earnings. Any excess is returned to the Treasury.
 
2017-04-20 01:11:35 PM  
Establish standards.
Permit states to be exempted from standards provided they promise it's because. Really really promise.

And thus, states will issue insurance that doesn't include reproductive health care because those girly parts are complicated and expensive to maintain and you shouldn't be using them unless you're married to a member of the GOP employed by the government where they do have reproductive benefits. Got it.
 
2017-04-20 01:11:49 PM  
The last version left the third, and most important part, blank.  So really my first question is, is this version actually complete?
 
2017-04-20 01:12:28 PM  
There are two reasons they keep coming back to this:

1) It shows that the 'free market' cannot even remotely solve the problem of health care, but they have to prove it can.

2) They need the tax 'savings' from repeal to then move on to tax 'reform'. They should just do whatever tax cut nonsense they want straightaway.
 
2017-04-20 01:14:30 PM  

LowbrowDeluxe: The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.


While interesting, I have a feeling there might be some legitimate constitutional repercussions for withholding tax dollars to the federal government.  They are already trying to bend the consitution with threats of withholding money from sanctuary cities.  I have no doubt they would try and fark any state trying to pull that with as little lube as possible.
 
2017-04-20 01:14:58 PM  

Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*


So, what the hell does it actually do that the AHCA does, besides a new name?

I seriously missed anything
 
2017-04-20 01:16:33 PM  

BeesNuts: LowbrowDeluxe: The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.

While interesting, I have a feeling there might be some legitimate constitutional repercussions for withholding tax dollars to the federal government.  They are already trying to bend the consitution with threats of withholding money from sanctuary cities.  I have no doubt they would try and fark any state trying to pull that with as little lube as possible.


There is also fact that states don't pay any taxes to the federal government that they can withhold.
 
2017-04-20 01:16:54 PM  
States must attest that the purpose of their requested waiver is to reduce premium costs, increase the number of persons with healthcare coverage, or advance another benefit to the public interest in the state, including the guarantee of coverage for persons with pre-existing medical conditions. The Secretary shall approve applications within 90 days of determining that an application is complete.

No requirement to show how your waiver would improve anything, no requirement to prove that it actually did after you get it, and no requirement that your application be correct, just a rubberstamp three months affter you fill in the last box.
 
2017-04-20 01:16:55 PM  
So the "I'm not gonna get re-elected if I sign this" squad won't sign it this time either, just more theater to make it look like they're working.
 
2017-04-20 01:17:53 PM  

max_pooper: BeesNuts: LowbrowDeluxe: The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.

While interesting, I have a feeling there might be some legitimate constitutional repercussions for withholding tax dollars to the federal government.  They are already trying to bend the consitution with threats of withholding money from sanctuary cities.  I have no doubt they would try and fark any state trying to pull that with as little lube as possible.

There is also fact that states don't pay any taxes to the federal government that they can withhold.


Not gonna pretend that I actually understand how my state taxes wind up in federal coffers, I'll take your word for that.
 
2017-04-20 01:18:15 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: There are two reasons they keep coming back to this:

1) It shows that the 'free market' cannot even remotely solve the problem of health care, but they have to prove it can.

2) They need the tax 'savings' from repeal to then move on to tax 'reform'. They should just do whatever tax cut nonsense they want straightaway.


It smells like the 100 Day thingie is gonna cost somebody a $Brazillion or 2 if delivery is late on the TAX.
 
2017-04-20 01:19:55 PM  
Single payer or GTFO, GOP.

In fact, just GTFO, you scumbags. Modern "conservatism" represents the worst aspects of America, and humanity in general.
 
2017-04-20 01:20:04 PM  
It's pretty obvious that anything that gets Freedom Caucus votes is going to be a "f*ck you" to a substantial number of people

/That's why they exist
//duh
 
2017-04-20 01:20:17 PM  

BeesNuts: max_pooper: BeesNuts: LowbrowDeluxe: The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.

While interesting, I have a feeling there might be some legitimate constitutional repercussions for withholding tax dollars to the federal government.  They are already trying to bend the consitution with threats of withholding money from sanctuary cities.  I have no doubt they would try and fark any state trying to pull that with as little lube as possible.

There is also fact that states don't pay any taxes to the federal government that they can withhold.

Not gonna pretend that I actually understand how my state taxes wind up in federal coffers, I'll take your word for that.


Your state taxes end up in your state's coffers
 
2017-04-20 01:21:12 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: 1) It shows that the 'free market' cannot even remotely solve the problem of health care, but they have to prove it can.


Anyone with half a brain knows that the free market is not a viable solution for health care, but the Republicans don't care about actually providing health care to everyone, they only care about providing immense profits to rich people.  They are perfectly happy with a system in which only those who can afford health care can get it.  They are not trying to prove anything.  They are merely trying to transfer more wealth to the top at the expense of everyone else.
 
2017-04-20 01:21:16 PM  
The issue wasn't that people with preexisting conditions couldn't get insurance, it was that it was priced exorbitantly high.  Nice try, though...
 
2017-04-20 01:21:24 PM  
The plan to destroy Medicaid didn't need to be discussed in this update, I guess.
 
2017-04-20 01:22:50 PM  
"VOUCHERS!"

Is that the updated plan?  That's typically what the GOP tries to cram down our throats.
 
2017-04-20 01:23:50 PM  
If the bill gets too close to passing the HFC will change their position to demand that people with pre-existing conditions be ground up for use as fertilizer for wealthy people's lawns.
 
2017-04-20 01:24:46 PM  

bigfatbuddhist: The issue wasn't that people with preexisting conditions couldn't get insurance, it was that it was priced exorbitantly high.  Nice try, though...


You sure about that?

1 in 7 people were denied coverage due to preexisting conditions prior to the passage of the ACA.
 
2017-04-20 01:25:03 PM  

Pincy: Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: 1) It shows that the 'free market' cannot even remotely solve the problem of health care, but they have to prove it can.

Anyone with half a brain knows that the free market is not a viable solution for health care, but the Republicans don't care about actually providing health care to everyone, they only care about providing immense profits to rich people.  They are perfectly happy with a system in which only those who can afford health care can get it.  They are not trying to prove anything.  They are merely trying to transfer more wealth to the top at the expense of everyone else.


That's the Republican philosophy in a nutshell. Fark the poor, rich assholes need more money. They're the lordship, we're the serfs.
 
2017-04-20 01:25:17 PM  

LowbrowDeluxe: The second they pass any of these bullshiat attempts any state that truly cares should immediately withold all federal taxes and use that money to set up a single-payer system with any other states that agree.  The absolute first second they pass any bullshiat like this and try to leave the burden in the laps of the states that want to opt in while letting prices shoot up for states that want to let their welfare queen ranchers opt out of mandatory coverage should be the last second any of them bother to try to work with the system.


That's not how things work.
 
2017-04-20 01:28:10 PM  
So, instead of a zillion empty symbolic votes to repeal, will it now be a zillion empty symbolic repeal bills that have no chance of actually passing?
 
2017-04-20 01:28:18 PM  

snocone: Tax cuts for the wealthy?
Whar?

WHERE ARE THE FARKING TAX CUTS?


In the original bill. This just amends that bill.
 
2017-04-20 01:29:09 PM  

snocone: Tax cuts for the wealthy?
Whar?

WHERE ARE THE FARKING TAX CUTS?


After health care. They need to cut a huge amount of spending (on healthcare)( on paper) that will allow them to make huge tax cuts w/o a sunset provision. No healthcare "savings" = no mega tax cuts.
 
2017-04-20 01:29:15 PM  
So since defenders of ObamaCare think this new healthcare plan is bad, and by virtue of the fact that defending ObamaCare demonstrates you want precisely the opposite of what would actually help people, we can conclude that this new healthcare bill is a dramatic improvement and will do a world of good.
 
2017-04-20 01:31:26 PM  

randomjsa: So since defenders of ObamaCare think this new healthcare plan is bad, and by virtue of the fact that defending ObamaCare demonstrates you want precisely the opposite of what would actually help people, we can conclude that this new healthcare bill is a dramatic improvement and will do a world of good.


A stunning revelation from the derposphere!
 
2017-04-20 01:31:48 PM  
WTF is wrong with these assholes? The people they are trying to cater to, the extreme right, don't want any sort of healthcare plan. They just want to repeal the ACA and cackle with glee.

Even if you come up with such a plan they'd approve of, the moderates in the GOP won't vote for it, and you'll still be short the votes you need to pass it.

It's far too important to mess up, and nobody except the assholes who want to can government involvement in health care completely is holding a gun to anybody's head over this.  Ignore the "Freedom Caucus" and come up with something reasonable that a majority of Americans can live with.
 
2017-04-20 01:33:05 PM  

Estimated spike in premiums if you have...
Lung cancer: $73k
Breast cancer: $28k
Diabetes: $5k
Autism: $5k
Asthma: $4k
A pregnancy(!): $17k https://t.co/62b2I7RHEH

- Jon Favreau (@jonfavs) April 20, 2017
 
2017-04-20 01:33:11 PM  
Surely Ryan learned his lesson last time about being bullied by Trump, but then again he did just whip up the populace in Wisconsin. 

Quick check- yup, that rally at Kenosha's snap-on facility was in Ryan's district.
 
2017-04-20 01:33:59 PM  
We are going to go one better than what Obamatard promised but failed to deliver: keeping your own doctor. See, now you will have to BE your own doctor.

/starts up the grill on the Escalade
//googles "vascular medicine" on Obamaphone
///I've got this
 
2017-04-20 01:35:37 PM  
Link

For these reasons, America's Essential Hospitals cannot support the legislation to be considered by the committee. While we will continue to work in good faith with members of the committee to improve the legislation, we urge you to withdraw it. We ask that you refrain from further action until you have received a score and coverage estimates from the Congressional Budget Office. Further, we ask that you work with us and other stakeholders to draft legislation that meets the principles we outlined above and honors commitments by congressional leaders to ensure all people have access to affordable health care.

Wiki:
America's Essential Hospitals (formerly the National Association of Public Hospitals and Health Systems) is an industry trade group that represents nearly 275 hospitals that fill a safety net role in their communities.
 
2017-04-20 01:35:52 PM  
As intended. LOL

Republicans are idiots. The politicians and the voters. At best, they're idiots.
 
2017-04-20 01:37:42 PM  

loonatic112358: Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*

So, what the hell does it actually do that the AHCA does, besides a new name?

I seriously missed anything


The main point is that it permits individual states to avoid standards for what is in your health care policy if you argue that dropping standards is necessary to make insurance cheaper, and to get more people insured. This opens the door for very minimal policies, as proposed by local insurance companies. Historically, these have screwed people over by making them think they are insured but then finding out that their insurance doesn't cover much. Thus we go back to people who had insurance still going bankrupt if they have a healthcare crisis.

The problem is and remains cost. Healthcare in the US is too expensive. The ACA didn't fix that. No insurance scheme will. Even Medicare for all won't fix that. And it's not just Big Pharma charging too much. It's Big Pharma and other parts of the Health Care Free Enterprise developing "solutions" that free people from their money. They don't work on cost effective health care because ... there's not much profit there.

We really need to have a variant of the NIH dedicated toward developing cheaper ways to provide good care. The free market system just doesn't have an incentive to do that. But that offends the GOP bible.
 
2017-04-20 01:37:59 PM  

loonatic112358: Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*

So, what the hell does it actually do that the AHCA does, besides a new name?

I seriously missed anything


Notice the failure to mention subsidies.....Also  "Reinstate Essential Health Benefits" sounds damn suspicious.
 
2017-04-20 01:39:00 PM  

Action Replay Nick: Grand_Moff_Joseph: 1. Restore mandatory coverage rules that everyone likes
2. Let states opt out of everything in #1

*headdesk*

Wow, spoken like a true lib. I guess I'm supposed to foot the bill when you need to see a doctor after hitting your own head on your own desk, too?

The fact of the matter is, this is how the free market is supposed to work as The Framers intended. Making your state an unsurvivable hellscape is what this country was founded on. If you don't like it, you have the freedom to move. And don't give me any of that "oh, waaahhhh, it costs money to move... wahhhh.... family and friends support structure... wahhhh" liberal nonsense. As long as you have one limb left the crawl your way across the ground, you can move to another state.


You have died of dysentery.
 
2017-04-20 01:39:55 PM  

snocone: Tax cuts for the wealthy?
Whar?

WHERE ARE THE FARKING TAX CUTS?


The new bill is just an amended portion of the original, don't worry, the tax cuts are still in there.  After all, that's the whole purpose of this legislation.
 
2017-04-20 01:40:34 PM  
He's going to try to oust ryan as the speaker.
 
2017-04-20 01:42:11 PM  
They could make everything free for everyone and people would have a problem with it.
 
2017-04-20 01:42:50 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: There are two reasons they keep coming back to this:

1) It shows that the 'free market' cannot even remotely solve the problem of health care, but they have to prove it can.

2) They need the tax 'savings' from repeal to then move on to tax 'reform'. They should just do whatever tax cut nonsense they want straightaway.


They want to use the tax savings from cutting healthcare funding to pay for more military. Isn't that great?
 
2017-04-20 01:43:08 PM  

J Noble Daggett: We really need to have a variant of the NIH dedicated toward developing cheaper ways to provide good care. The free market system just doesn't have an incentive to do that. But that offends the GOP bible.


That needle is moving in the right direction. Half of Americans want to replace O-care with a single-payer system, including 41% of Republicans and Republican-leaning independents.

img.fark.net

Poll: Most Americans want to replace Obamacare with single-payer - including many Republicans
 
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