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(Stuff.co.nz)   Foreign government accused of meddling in domestic politics. Why yes this is a repeat from 1951 and the CIA is involved   ( stuff.co.nz) divider line
    More: Awkward, New Zealand, CIA files, new CIA files, New Zealand Government, waterfront dispute, Kiwi mission, CIA report states, Wellington waterfront dispute  
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1045 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Mar 2017 at 6:20 AM (34 weeks ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



17 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2017-03-20 04:19:12 AM  
That's interesting. The 1951 waterfront lockout/strike is an event of quite some significance in New Zealand's history and the emergency regulations passed by the government were draconian:

"The government issued drastic emergency regulations, giving it the power to seize union funds, use the armed forces to replace strikers, and prohibit strike meetings or publications. Supporters of the wharfies [stevedores] were even forbidden to write favourably about the strike or give food to strikers' children. Other unions came out on strike in protest at these regulations. Soon 22,000 watersiders, freezing workers, miners, hydro-electricity workers and drivers had stopped work." Source.

This happened all in the context of the Red Scare and of course, NZ was busy sending food, timber and wool to a Europe still rebuilding after WW2 and with Korea going on there was a lot of demand for wool for blankets and uniforms. Quite aside from internal trade routes. After this the nationwide union was split into smaller unions for each port.
 
2017-03-20 06:32:10 AM  
Bah, small potatoes. Here in Australia the CIA was allegedly front and centre in the dismissal of the Whitlam Labor government in 1975. Allegedly because Whitlam publicly denied it, as if he'd have actually known, but we're too nice to the big fella to tell him he was wrong.
 
2017-03-20 06:35:53 AM  
But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy
 
2017-03-20 06:44:57 AM  

if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy


When a man's an empty kettle he should be on his mettle, and yet I'm torn apart.  Just because I'm presumin' that I could be kinda human, if I only had heart...
 
2017-03-20 06:51:50 AM  
Most shot at airline, indeed.

Apparently  not the best kept secret airline in the world.

At some point that CAT got out of the bag, man.
 
2017-03-20 06:56:45 AM  
~It's the American way~
 
2017-03-20 07:34:26 AM  

if_i_really_have_to: //The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy


The left, maybe, but the CIA can claim something approaching sole responsibility for western democracy still being a thing instead of everyone having been communist for half a century.

The reason we put up with all the playing dirty is that it works.
 
2017-03-20 07:58:49 AM  

if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy


You right. As a damn dirty lefty, I don't expect them to be best buddies with the left or other nation's democracies. However, if there is one thing we typically can count on the CIA for is, it's institutional animosity and mistrust of the Kremlin. If any American institution exemplifies the idea that the ends justify the means, its the CIA, and despite all the absurd crap they've pulled over the years, most who do work for Langley do like to think of themselves as patriots. So when the CIA says the Kremlin did something, there's probably a very good chance that what they're telling us is close to the truth.
 
2017-03-20 08:21:28 AM  

Jim_Callahan: if_i_really_have_to: //The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

The left, maybe, but the CIA can claim something approaching sole responsibility for western democracy still being a thing instead of everyone having been communist for half a century.

The reason we put up with all the playing dirty is that it works.



The CIA helped overthrow more democracies than communist regimes.  And then helped them stay in power.  Just look at South and Central America, especially Chile 1973.  There's a reason why those regions have shunned the US for trade and security deals.  They don't trust us.

The US recently helped overthrow a democratic leader in Honduras, and that place has descended pretty far since.  Before that it was the unsuccessful Chavez coup.
 
2017-03-20 08:49:13 AM  
I bet the timing of this article had nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with the ejection of a US diplomat from New Zealand.
 
2017-03-20 09:24:57 AM  

jethroe: Jim_Callahan: if_i_really_have_to: //The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

The left, maybe, but the CIA can claim something approaching sole responsibility for western democracy still being a thing instead of everyone having been communist for half a century.

The reason we put up with all the playing dirty is that it works.


The CIA helped overthrow more democracies than communist regimes.  And then helped them stay in power.  Just look at South and Central America, especially Chile 1973.  There's a reason why those regions have shunned the US for trade and security deals.  They don't trust us.

The US recently helped overthrow a democratic leader in Honduras, and that place has descended pretty far since.  Before that it was the unsuccessful Chavez coup.


The pure hatred and subsequent attack on the US Embassy in Tehran can be easily tied to CIA operations ran out of that building to silence (imprisonment, torture and some death) pro-democracy agitants in the early 70s. For some reason this was not mentioned in Argo.

It is also a handy tool used by the Ayatollah to rally center and center right Iranians in opposition to the USA.
 
2017-03-20 09:40:31 AM  

Moopy Mac: jethroe: Jim_Callahan: if_i_really_have_to: //The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

The left, maybe, but the CIA can claim something approaching sole responsibility for western democracy still being a thing instead of everyone having been communist for half a century.

The reason we put up with all the playing dirty is that it works.


The CIA helped overthrow more democracies than communist regimes.  And then helped them stay in power.  Just look at South and Central America, especially Chile 1973.  There's a reason why those regions have shunned the US for trade and security deals.  They don't trust us.

The US recently helped overthrow a democratic leader in Honduras, and that place has descended pretty far since.  Before that it was the unsuccessful Chavez coup.

The pure hatred and subsequent attack on the US Embassy in Tehran can be easily tied to CIA operations ran out of that building to silence (imprisonment, torture and some death) pro-democracy agitants in the early 70s. For some reason this was not mentioned in Argo.

It is also a handy tool used by the Ayatollah to rally center and center right Iranians in opposition to the USA.



Same handy tool for the Chavezes and Castros and Maduros to rally their supporters, too.  The CIA has a truly sordid history.
 
2017-03-20 09:52:20 AM  

jethroe: Moopy Mac: jethroe: Jim_Callahan: if_i_really_have_to: //The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

The left, maybe, but the CIA can claim something approaching sole responsibility for western democracy still being a thing instead of everyone having been communist for half a century.

The reason we put up with all the playing dirty is that it works.


The CIA helped overthrow more democracies than communist regimes.  And then helped them stay in power.  Just look at South and Central America, especially Chile 1973.  There's a reason why those regions have shunned the US for trade and security deals.  They don't trust us.

The US recently helped overthrow a democratic leader in Honduras, and that place has descended pretty far since.  Before that it was the unsuccessful Chavez coup.

The pure hatred and subsequent attack on the US Embassy in Tehran can be easily tied to CIA operations ran out of that building to silence (imprisonment, torture and some death) pro-democracy agitants in the early 70s. For some reason this was not mentioned in Argo.

It is also a handy tool used by the Ayatollah to rally center and center right Iranians in opposition to the USA.


Same handy tool for the Chavezes and Castros and Maduros to rally their supporters, too.  The CIA has a truly sordid history.


There was a report a few years back that showed the CIA interventions of the 20th century had a worse democracy-success rate than just leaving countries alone.

There's also more than on illustrating that the USSR ended more due to their own internal economic failures than anything the 'west' did.
 
2017-03-20 10:30:59 AM  

Gaddiel: if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

You right. As a damn dirty lefty, I don't expect them to be best buddies with the left or other nation's democracies. However, if there is one thing we typically can count on the CIA for is, it's institutional animosity and mistrust of the Kremlin. If any American institution exemplifies the idea that the ends justify the means, its the CIA, and despite all the absurd crap they've pulled over the years, most who do work for Langley do like to think of themselves as patriots. So when the CIA says the Kremlin did something, there's probably a very good chance that what they're telling us is close to the truth.


Or you could understand they have a habit of lying to suit their desires and interests and can trust jack shiat they say. But sure yea why not.
 
2017-03-20 11:05:44 AM  

Heywood Jublowme: Gaddiel: if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

You right. As a damn dirty lefty, I don't expect them to be best buddies with the left or other nation's democracies. However, if there is one thing we typically can count on the CIA for is, it's institutional animosity and mistrust of the Kremlin. If any American institution exemplifies the idea that the ends justify the means, its the CIA, and despite all the absurd crap they've pulled over the years, most who do work for Langley do like to think of themselves as patriots. So when the CIA says the Kremlin did something, there's probably a very good chance that what they're telling us is close to the truth.

Or you could understand they have a habit of lying to suit their desires and interests and can trust jack shiat they say. But sure yea why not.


But what would be their interests in this? And I'm asking honestly. With all the times they've overthrown foreign governments, the aim was to make the government more susceptible to US control. How would them lying about Russian intervention and making the White House look week in any way play into what have historically been the CIA's motivating drivers? Do you think the good-ol-boys at Langley were huge Hillary supporters or Bernie Bros? I'm at a loss for another explanation.

But your right. I'm sure if Russia Today says everything is above board we can put our minds at ease.
 
2017-03-20 01:36:23 PM  

Gaddiel: Heywood Jublowme: Gaddiel: if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

You right. As a damn dirty lefty, I don't expect them to be best buddies with the left or other nation's democracies. However, if there is one thing we typically can count on the CIA for is, it's institutional animosity and mistrust of the Kremlin. If any American institution exemplifies the idea that the ends justify the means, its the CIA, and despite all the absurd crap they've pulled over the years, most who do work for Langley do like to think of themselves as patriots. So when the CIA says the Kremlin did something, there's probably a very good chance that what they're telling us is close to the truth.

Or you could understand they have a habit of lying to suit their desires and interests and can trust jack shiat they say. But sure yea why not.

But what would be their interests in this? And I'm asking honestly. With all the times they've overthrown foreign governments, the aim was to make the government more susceptible to US control. How would them lying about Russian intervention and making the White House look week in any way play into what have historically been the CIA's motivating drivers? Do you think the good-ol-boys at Langley were huge Hillary supporters or Bernie Bros? I'm at a loss for another explanation.

But your right. I'm sure if Russia Today says everything is above board we can put our minds at ease.


Trump is an outsider. He questioned intelligence community and they responded with a display of power. O you say we are idiots? Spend the next 3 months answering bs about Russia. They are letting him know they can make life difficult or potentially end him.
 
2017-03-20 03:01:29 PM  

Heywood Jublowme: Gaddiel: Heywood Jublowme: Gaddiel: if_i_really_have_to: But don't worry, the CIA is totally telling you the truth about Russia, because they care so much about honest government and the strength of the American republic.  People power!

/Fark all you American "lefties" who suddenly love the CIA
//The CIA has never been a friend of the left or democracy

You right. As a damn dirty lefty, I don't expect them to be best buddies with the left or other nation's democracies. However, if there is one thing we typically can count on the CIA for is, it's institutional animosity and mistrust of the Kremlin. If any American institution exemplifies the idea that the ends justify the means, its the CIA, and despite all the absurd crap they've pulled over the years, most who do work for Langley do like to think of themselves as patriots. So when the CIA says the Kremlin did something, there's probably a very good chance that what they're telling us is close to the truth.

Or you could understand they have a habit of lying to suit their desires and interests and can trust jack shiat they say. But sure yea why not.

But what would be their interests in this? And I'm asking honestly. With all the times they've overthrown foreign governments, the aim was to make the government more susceptible to US control. How would them lying about Russian intervention and making the White House look week in any way play into what have historically been the CIA's motivating drivers? Do you think the good-ol-boys at Langley were huge Hillary supporters or Bernie Bros? I'm at a loss for another explanation.

But your right. I'm sure if Russia Today says everything is above board we can put our minds at ease.

Trump is an outsider. He questioned intelligence community and they responded with a display of power. O you say we are idiots? Spend the next 3 months answering bs about Russia. They are letting him know they can make life difficult or potentially end him.


Does that actually strike you as more likely than the current narrative developing?
Option 1: The CIA hates Trump because he criticized him and waits til AFTER the election to act. Instead of just pulling a Kennedy they.... what? Hack Podesta before the election masking their tracks to make it look like the FSB. Release the hacked emails, helping Trump, who according to you they hate. Then they help leak more information and then right before the election drop some muted concerns that the Kremlin may be helping Trump. So, because they hate Trump so much they help get him elected?

Option 2: That after numerous bankruptcies, no American financial institutions were still willing to work with Trump. This forces Trump to turn to foreign investors, who as his son at one point admitted, were made of disproportionately Russian interests. The Kremlin then uses this leverage to surround Trump with others who have financial stakes with Russia and possibly generate other black mail material (the alleged pee-pee tapes.)  Then come election time, they use FSB resources to leak damaging material on Trump's political opponent in exchange for Trump & Co. forcing pro-Russian policies into the official GOP platform. Now all of this is slowly coming out and when the CIA is asked if they can corroborate the ridiculous nonsense spewing from the white house, they're stuck with the same dear-in-the-headlights look the rest of us have from sheer torrent of stupid that regular gets tweeted by the President at 3 a.m.
 
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