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(Boston Globe)   Idiots sue school system to force daily Pledge Of Allegiance   (boston.com) divider line 155
    More: Asinine  
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3432 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Dec 2001 at 1:18 AM (12 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2001-12-22 01:21:40 AM  
Newton sued over lack of flags at schools

That is the single most moronic thing I have ever read in my life.
 
2001-12-22 01:22:03 AM  
=-/

Ummmm.....Aren't there more important things in this world to be worried about then dumb situations like this?
 
2001-12-22 01:24:28 AM  
Idiotic maybe, but the whole point of a free country is not having to do something if you don't want to. As long as you are not infringing on someone else liberties or breaking the law. "Forcing" students to pledge allegiance to the flag may be patriotic, but its un-American in a some respects.
 
2001-12-22 01:26:31 AM  
What's the HTML tag to post pictures? I tried to in a Photoshop article, but all I saw were the farking X-Boxes...
 
2001-12-22 01:26:35 AM  
In 1977, the state Supreme Judicial Court ruled that making recitation of the pledge mandatory was unconstitutional. However, the state Legislature later voted to require daily pledges. Former Gov. Michael Dukakis vetoed the bill, but the Legislature overrode his veto.

"I've said it before people and I'll say it again, democracy just doesn't work." - K. Brockman

"No one is safe while Congress is in session." - M. Twain
 
2001-12-22 01:27:28 AM  
I sense one of those endless threads coming on.
 
2001-12-22 01:28:45 AM  
I just love it when an supposedly news oriented article like this ends with something like:

"They do everything in their power to be un-American," Morrissey said.

Shouldn't this article then belong in the opinions/editorial section? Help me out here. It seems like the whole piece is slanted a bit.
 
2001-12-22 01:30:25 AM  
subtract the offending n from above, thanks.
 
2001-12-22 01:31:38 AM  
Good to see fellow Americans getting back our normal idiotic selves.
 
2001-12-22 01:34:34 AM  
"But that's not enough, according to a lawsuit that claims the Newton school system is violating a state law requiring a flag in every classroom and a daily recitation of the Pledge of Allegiance. "

how dare they hang flags in classrooms! whats next? a flag hanging over the capitol building or the white house?
 
2001-12-22 01:38:43 AM  
Brainwashing is sooo patriotic.
 
2001-12-22 01:43:28 AM  
Respect for your country and way of life and those who died to allow it must be brainwashing, too?
 
2001-12-22 01:45:31 AM  
If I have to say the pledge of allegiance, the terrorists have already won.

Why don't I ever get tired of that?

On a serious note, my earliest pledge of allegiance memory was sometime in elementary, they used to make us say it. As far back as I can remember, I quietly omitted the word "god". It bothered me and I wasn't sure why. What a surprise that today I'm Agnostic.

In closing, I would like to say Boobies.
 
2001-12-22 01:45:32 AM  

Although this is way off topic Pee Nut,

<img src="HTTP://YOURDOMAIN.COM/IMAGES/PIC.JPG">



That should be how you do it...

This lawsuit, is ideally a nice little idea, but it doesn't have a chance. Too many lobbyists.
Plus, it's unrealistic to think that they would win.
 
2001-12-22 01:46:19 AM  
LOL, I copied that pic.jpg into my address bar thinking that you just linked it wrong before I realized... hahaha
 
2001-12-22 01:52:52 AM  
The teachers have to stand in front of the class and "lead" the class in saying the pledge, but nowhere does it say the children MUST say it.
 
2001-12-22 02:05:28 AM  
This is already a law in Oregon, and I believe Washington too, although I'm not sure, but we have to say it every single day at my school. I used to omit the "under God" part, now I just don't even say the Pledge. America is vastly overrated.
 
2001-12-22 02:07:11 AM  
By virginia state law, we are required in Public school to havea 60 second moment of silence, and say the pledge. Our teacher told us, that as long as we wrote her a physical note saying why we didnt want to say it, be it ANY reason, we would not have to say it. Personaly, I don't like how the pledge is worded. it could be revamped much better, along with the fact that we should not have to say a pledge, let alone there be one in the first placce in my opinion.None of us in homeroom say it, and noone has yet to hand her a note.
 
2001-12-22 02:10:56 AM  
Give me a break.

How can we convince our children that free will exists in a country that forces it's students to recite a pledge?
 
2001-12-22 02:11:08 AM  
Respect for your country and way of life and those who died to allow it must be brainwashing, too?

Of course if someone tells you must do these things while you can't make rational decisions on your own (IE children) that is brainwashing, yes.
 
2001-12-22 02:11:24 AM  
education is free + don't look a gift horse in the mouth =
don't biatch if they want you to say the damn pledge
 
2001-12-22 02:12:16 AM  
The law required there to be a flag in each classroom and that those who wish to be able to say the pledge of allegiance each day. This lawsuit isn't about forcing any individual to do anything, it's about forcing the government to obey its own laws. Lovers of freedom should have no problem with that.
 
2001-12-22 02:13:59 AM  
Being forced to have a flag in a classroom doesn't sound bad to me at all, simply because we're talking about a patriotic show of support to your nation. I mean, you live here, you're a citizen (right?), and hence a flag.

The forced pledge blows, and entirely because of the "under God" part. I too used to omit it or say "under Darwin" or something just to piss people off. If that statement were removed, I wouldn't mind a forced pledge, either, and vice versa, if there were a religious symbol on the flag, I'd be against it in classrooms.

It all comes down to the separation of church and state issue, and the fact that religious folks live one giant lie for a life.
 
fb-
2001-12-22 02:16:09 AM  
Even I don't support this.
 
2001-12-22 02:20:39 AM  
Dude, Fb-, seriously... Is that REALLY you in that photoshop?
 
2001-12-22 02:26:29 AM  
Ah, I never did the pledge of allegiance in school. They told everybody to stand up, but I never did. Surprisingly I was the only one, and the teachers couldn't do anything about it. Don't think it is mandatory in California, or I would have got detention.

And please don't call me a terrorist...
 
2001-12-22 02:26:39 AM  
Even I don't support this.

Well whoopty shiat.
 
2001-12-22 02:30:43 AM  
but nowhere does it say the children MUST say it

Quite the opposite. The Supreme Court itself has ruled that while saying the PoA can be part of a school's daily routine, students must not be punished if they quietly refuse to say it. Same for the national anthem.

To bring up a different point, I personally clearly remember the daily PoA recitals in elementary school. But at the time, I (and more than likely most others who were doing it) didn't really understand the impact of it or even why we were saying it. I started to gain this understanding later on of course, but it didn't come through reciting the PoA ~2160 times. It came much more through studying history, watching current events, etc. Obviously, 9/11 will probably have some degree of impact on this with today's children, but still, a great many of them probably still have no idea what they're saying as far as the impact of it. To them, the PoA was/maybe still is just a few lines of nonsensical mumbo-jumbo they have to recite on a daily basis, and nothing more.

In one of my history classes, we actually discussed the origins of the PoA and why schoolchildren were to recite it. This class was a few years ago, so the details are fuzzy, but what basically caused the PoA in the first place was a wartime attempt to both foster patriotism and prevent political betrayal, particularly in children. Is it realistic to think that nowadays, excluding 9/11, forcing schoolchildren to recite the PoA will continue to achieve that? So it *might* spark a small amount of patriotism. But the impact of this will be exactly jack squat compared to what their educations will be offering them, both in the classroom and in real life.

Not that the PoA is a bad thing -- it isn't -- but anyone who thinks that they will make a significant impact on schoolchildren in their area by SUING to make them recite it needs to have their head examined.
 
2001-12-22 02:34:39 AM  
In Europe it is considered fascist to recite such a pledge, let alone force people to recite it.
 
2001-12-22 02:37:53 AM  
I refuse to recite the pledge of allegiance in class, and I've had teachers threaten to kick my sorry arse out of class. Even the name bugs me, 'pledge of allegiance', my problem is: I won't pledge allegiance to the flag or to America.

I may live here, but I don't want too, sure California is one of the best places to live, but I've been petitioning for years to have the state suscede from the union (I know it won't actually happen, but I want to see how many people are behind me on this one).

If California could suscede we'd do pretty well for ourselves, we're already the economic backbone of the country and we would be the 6 most powerful nation on Earth if we werent part of the US; this is due to the fact that we can produce all the food/products/weapons of war/ect that we could ever need.

Anyways, I don't see how forcing someone to recite the pledge is patriotic... or represents freedom.
 
2001-12-22 02:41:01 AM  
Buckshot: Wow, that's mean. Anyway, how can you be offended by something you don't believe in?
 
2001-12-22 02:44:36 AM  
I may live here, but I don't want too...

Later d00d. Don't let the Statue of Liberty hit you on the ass on the way out.
 
2001-12-22 02:50:54 AM  
I had to do it every day through elementary school,but I really don't care if they force the district or not.

Tech-Knowing California,you guys will try to annex Oregon also,after secession.Well,tough,the Beaver State does not bow down to the imperialistic actions of the California Nation,and never will!

Take Nevada.
 
2001-12-22 02:59:16 AM  
Tech:
I think California should break off from the Union too - but only if you get cut off from foreign aid when the earthquakes level the farkin' place.

LA specifically is a nice tourist place, but in all reality, it's also a circus for pretentiousness, shallow people and all-around wierdness.

Most entertainment industries would probably move to state to avoid unnecessary expense through international labour restrictions. Say buh-bye to Cally's money... then you'd just have a bunch of face-lifted "Let's do lunchers" with nothing to do but biatch all the time about the status quo.

Oh wait. That's already happening....
 
2001-12-22 03:13:10 AM  
Let Florida secede. Then they can have whatever voting system they want to have. They can even have an unlimited number of recounts! (Limiting them to the 154 recounts they got during the Bush/Gore election was a bit mean, don't you think?)
 
2001-12-22 03:14:16 AM  
Botsu: Thats a quote form a participant. if the writer had said that, it would be an opinion/editorial. A direct quote is not.
 
2001-12-22 03:15:10 AM  
If you tree hugging, limp wristed hippies don't want to pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, then get the hell out of my country.
 
2001-12-22 03:16:27 AM  
California surrenders.
 
2001-12-22 03:20:16 AM  
Berklee:LA specifically is a nice tourist place, but in all reality, it's also a circus for pretentiousness, shallow people and all-around wierdness.

Stop with your stereotypes, or shall I just start calling you a hippie?

Berklee:Say buh-bye to Cally's money...

Yes the entertainment industry brings in a lot of money, and the tourist industry alone brings in 75 billion a year (more than all the industries in some states), we would still be a very rich state without the entertainment industry. Without the entertainment industry, the tourist industry would also take a hit, but it would still stay reasonably high (and still more than all the industries in some states).

On top of that, we make a lot from out farming/food production industry, our industrial industry, and just our all around production abilities.
 
2001-12-22 03:31:04 AM  
Pay attention. This isn't about forcing individuals to recite the pledge of allegiance. It's about requiring schools to comply with the law, which (quite reasonably) requires that those who wish to be allowed to say the pledge of allegiance daily.

There's nothing wrong with a law that requires a flag to be in each classroom. And if the law is there and it's an okay law, it shouldn't be blatantly ignored. There's nothing wrong with a law that requires that those who wish to state the pledge be allowed to do so, and if such a law exists, it should be enforced and not ignored.

Nobody's trying to force any individual student to do anything at all. This is about forcing schools themselves to comply with the law.

Please think critically.
 
2001-12-22 03:47:20 AM  
if that idiot win the suit, would she get the money?
 
2001-12-22 03:53:36 AM  
Berklee:LA specifically is a nice tourist place, but in all reality, it's also a circus for pretentiousness, shallow people and all-around wierdness.

Tech:Stop with your stereotypes, or shall I just start calling you a hippie?

Dude, just 'cause it's a circus doesn't mean you have to be in the show... and btw, 'hippie' isn't an entirely bad thing. Hell, if free love wasn't so dangerous these days, I'd be out somewhere tearin' off a piece right now...

I'm not saying by any means that California couldn't get on by itself. In fact, I'm in Ontario, Canada... we're in the same boat provincially when it comes to Canada.

But the point that I'm trying to make is that California leaving the American Union would be like your rich asshole uncle disowning the family. Everyone would be pissed off, but feel better in the long run.
 
2001-12-22 04:06:26 AM  
BerkleeBut the point that I'm trying to make is that California leaving the American Union would be like your rich asshole uncle disowning the family. Everyone would be pissed off, but feel better in the long run.

It actually wouldn't be the same, as Bush and his cronies have been driving the state into the ground. Our power problem... well... there is no real power problem. We have plenty of power, but his budies (several of which were going to be prosocuted) have bought most the power plants for dirt cheap... charged too much for power, ran the plants with no upkeep until they had to be shut down and then moved on to buy more power plants.

Their making an estimated several billion per plant before it fails.

Getting back to what I said before, it's not the same because their harming us, not because we just don't want anything to do with you. Plus, some federal laws hold back the state in terms of certain industries and other things that we would like to do.
 
2001-12-22 04:10:59 AM  
Change 'you' to 'the rest of the US'... and don't forget, it's not really California, it's the Republic of California. At least that's what the full name is...
 
2001-12-22 04:19:18 AM  
I'll sing the pledge of allegiance as long as they let me burn the flag afterwards.
 
2001-12-22 04:31:00 AM  
Tech

"...Bush and his cronies have been driving the state into the ground. Our power problem... well... there is no real power problem. We have plenty of power, but his budies (several of which were going to be prosocuted) have bought most the power plants for dirt cheap... charged too much for power, ran the plants with no upkeep until they had to be shut down and then moved on to buy more power plants."

Again... I know what you mean. Ontario's got half of Niagara Falls...

"...it's not the same because their harming us, not because we just don't want anything to do with you. Plus, some federal laws hold back the state in terms of certain industries and other things that we would like to do."

Uh.... Tech.... this is what I believe you mean:
ex·ploi·ta·tion (ksploi-tshn)
n.
The act of employing to the greatest possible advantage: exploitation of copper deposits.
Utilization of another person or group for selfish purposes: exploitation of unwary consumers.
An advertising or a publicity program.

This has been going on since America was founded, dude(can you say negro slave?)...

And if you think the 'Republic of California' is without fault, morally-speaking.... well...

Shall we start with washed-up child actors who overdose, rob stores and drive over people? Or how about the film companies that profit from the making of serial-killer based movies?
 
2001-12-22 04:33:39 AM  
Don't most classrooms already have TV's? Can't they just play a video of Britney Spears wearing a stars & bars swim suit and singing the pledge? Kids might pay attention......
 
2001-12-22 04:35:52 AM  
We should turn hollywood into a prison city. John Carpenter can be the warden.
 
2001-12-22 04:47:21 AM  
Tech: Judging how California could do if it seperated from the Union is no different than any of the others, including Texas which was a Republic that joined the Union. California does not have he same hstory of independence. Either way, Neither of them can declare success on their own if they were outside the union. San Francisco would have been dead after 1906 without union help, and LA would never have grown.
 
2001-12-22 04:56:44 AM  
Either way, suing your schools to get a flag put up in the classroom seems a waste of money for the district. Recitation of the pledge of allegiance every day does not make people patriots. I did it everyday and I bet my detractors will call me a commie. I am disturbed by nations that worship their leader and post his picture everywhere and demand that people worship it, as do most americans. I am also troubled by americans that worship the american flag as a symbol that creates irrational reactions to it not being worshiped by people. When the flag is reduced to that, it is no more than a picture of Mao.
 
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