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(AP) NewsFlash Martha Stewart found guilty of obstructing justice and lying to the government. Residency in federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison thought not to be a good thing   (story.news.yahoo.com) divider line 464
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19271 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Mar 2004 at 3:06 PM (11 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»


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2004-03-05 04:48:04 PM  
You take a risk when you are buying stock that it might tank.
 
2004-03-05 04:48:05 PM  
What the fark does this have to do with my point that the crimes she was convicted of don't usually get prosecuted?

Do you think robberies should be prosecuted? What Martha Stewart did was robbery. There is no difference, except she stole much more money than most robbers do. You appear to think that everybody should be nice to her. Why, because she's rich? Famous? I just don't get people like you.
 
2004-03-05 04:48:28 PM  
[image from images.chron.com too old to be available]

Let's see...

Marth Stewart - $40,000 personal stock sale - x years in prison

Lea Fastow - Millions stolen from hard working folks' pensions - 6 months plea agreement.

WHAT THE FARK!?!
 
2004-03-05 04:49:20 PM  
Ken Lay's Collateral

This fall, as Enron was going down, Chairman Ken Lay was desperately trying to raise cash.

In a meeting with top bankers, Lay presented a list of all the collateral the company had for a new loan. There were pipelines, contracts, receivables, a half-built plant in India -- quite a list.

But the bankers told him it wasn't enough: "Isn't there ANYTHING else you own that is fully paid for, that you can put up?"

And no one has seen Dick Cheney since.
 
2004-03-05 04:49:29 PM  
2004-03-05 04:43:07 PM aquigley


Question:

What would Martha Stewart's prison name be?


How 'bout "Doily Muncher"?
 
2004-03-05 04:49:38 PM  
What's with the Haiku's?
Is that the new Fark Cliche?
You can count me in!
 
2004-03-05 04:50:20 PM  
WillyPete

Way to break it down.
 
2004-03-05 04:50:59 PM  
maffick - That's what I thought. You got nothin'.
 
2004-03-05 04:51:11 PM  
[image from images4.fotki.com too old to be available]
 
2004-03-05 04:51:29 PM  
 
2004-03-05 04:51:48 PM  
"Hold your head up you silly girl look what you've done
When you find yourself in the thick of it
Help yourself to a bit of what is all around you
Silly girl"
 
2004-03-05 04:52:00 PM  
WillyPete: And by the way caliban, the very existance of the SEC and these Federal laws owes to the fact that the privately held exchanges couldn't or wouldn't police the very people who pay them to be listed. While all sorts of arguments can be made that we have too many laws, please don't try to tell me there should be none at all.


Not just that...when the privately held exchanges couldn't police their own members, it set off a worldwide Depression.
 
2004-03-05 04:52:17 PM  
Roy, you can be an apologist all you want. The writing is on the wall.
 
2004-03-05 04:52:56 PM  
2004-03-05 04:49:29 PM aquigley

Next on Martha Stewart Living.

Why you should always use a doily when eating pie.
 
2004-03-05 04:53:51 PM  
Fish! Fish! Fish! Fish!
 
2004-03-05 04:53:52 PM  
Cut the crap, Martha humpers. "But they did it first!" is not now, nor will it ever be, valid a defense. The biatch deserves to go to jail.
 
2004-03-05 04:53:54 PM  
How can she be guilty on 4 of 5 counts if she is guilty on them all?
 
2004-03-05 04:53:57 PM  
We all like haikus
because they're short and easy
unlike SherKhan's gems.

:-D Have a nice weekend.
 
2004-03-05 04:55:11 PM  
Doilies in prison cells here we come!
 
2004-03-05 04:55:31 PM  
You take a risk when you are buying stock that it might tank.

Of course. But anyone selling a stock which they know, from non-public knowledge, is about to tank is committing fraud.
 
2004-03-05 04:55:41 PM  
I'll never be rich,
But I can stay out of jail,
And that's a good thing.
 
2004-03-05 04:55:49 PM  
maffick - When you hold an energy policy meeting, you usually invite people in the energy industry. Lay was the largest energy trader in the world at the time.

When Enron got in trouble, they called the White House for help and Bush hung up on them. It was a Democrat (gasp) who tried to intervene for them with the banks.

Stupid Asshat.
 
2004-03-05 04:58:44 PM  
GGILF in the hizzy!!
 
2004-03-05 04:58:56 PM  
Lea Fastow - Millions stolen from hard working folks' pensions - 6 months plea agreement

That plea agreement bought what was needed to nail Ken Lay. All those farkers will see the inside of a jail, some longer than others...
 
2004-03-05 05:00:01 PM  
Paulson: "Do you think robberies should be prosecuted?"

Me: Yes.

Paulson: "What Martha Stewart did was robbery."

Me: Well, actually, the charges were conspiracy to obstruct justice, make false statements, and commit perjury. Look, I don't write the law, I work with what we got.

Paulson: "You appear to think that everybody should be nice to her. Why, because she's rich? Famous?"

Me: ?????????

How old are you, 2?

I make the points that a) her crimes rarely actually get prosecuted, and 2) people are absolutely giddy over the verdict -- not just "that seems fair" but "Wahoo! Die biatch!" -- and you claim that I think "everybody should be nice to her" because she's rich and famous. Even my three-year-old uses more logic than that.
 
2004-03-05 05:00:14 PM  
I just want to see how many days she gets in jail--so we can then figure how the 51k she saved averages out in a daily cost.
 
2004-03-05 05:00:44 PM  
CapnWacky
why are there laws against fraud in general instead of just contractual clauses?

Fraud laws are the enforcement of contractual clauses. What's your point? I don't think there should be laws against inaccurate advertising either, except that if your contract to purchase said product makes claims about its effectiveness.

WillyPete
And by the way caliban, the very existance of the SEC and these Federal laws owes to the fact that the privately held exchanges couldn't or wouldn't police the very people who pay them to be listed.

Ah, so you think the government took over regulatory control of the Stock Exchange to ensure fairness for all? Wow. Do you also believe that we imprisoned thousands of Japanese in camps to protect us from their spying? Do you think the government should take over control of any community or exchange that doesn't operate in the best interests of society?

JohnBigBootay
I was harmed. I own stock and participate daily in the stock market. Bullschiat like she and her brokers pulled undermine the faith that 'regular people' like me have in the stock market. If regular people don't participate, we don't have a stock market. So, the answer to your question is, Yes I can, ME.

So you're saying Martha's action destroyed your faith in the stock market? You don't note any inconsistencies in that statement? Why should you have faith in the stock market? Should we prosecute anyone else who destroys your faith in an institution? I'm sorry, I can see how a private exchange should have rules as to conduct, but I don't see how the government should be involved. If someone cheats at baseball, they should be fined and booted from the game, and whatever earnings they got taken. Why should they go to jail?
 
2004-03-05 05:01:07 PM  
GGILF in the hizzy!!
 
2004-03-05 05:01:20 PM  
Well, that was five minutes I'll never get back. Goodbye.
 
2004-03-05 05:02:36 PM  
Lay was the largest energy trader in the world at the time.

Yeah, except they were faking most of that trading so that "Kenny boy" and friends could siphon off the cash into their own pockets.

Roy_D_Mercer, if you think there wasn't any funny business going on, you're the one who's a "Stupid Asshat".
 
2004-03-05 05:04:09 PM  
Iwantmymommy

How old are you, 2? ... Even my three-year-old uses more logic than that.

Do you teach her that it's logical to insult those you're having a discussion with? I pity your poor child.

Furthermore, you are insinuating that just because the crime is rarely prosecuted, it should not be prosecuted at all. That is one of the least logical things I have ever heard. Then what's the point of the law?

People should be giddy over this verdict. It is GOOD when criminals are punished. This is GOOD for America because other corporate criminals will see that their crimes do not pay and they can no longer go on hurting others through their greed.
 
2004-03-05 05:06:27 PM  
[image from news.bbc.co.uk too old to be available]
Found guilty...
[image from peele.net too old to be available]
Got off...
[image from i-magin-ation.com too old to be available]
Not even charged...
Anyone else see something wrong here?
 
2004-03-05 05:06:50 PM  
caliban_02Fraud laws are the enforcement of contractual clauses. What's your point?

I'm sorry, I can see how a private exchange should have rules as to conduct, but I don't see how the government should be involved.



Enforcement of contractual clauses : ) You answered your own question... you're so smart!
 
2004-03-05 05:07:42 PM  
At risk of it being said already: At least she'll learn how to cover her ass better.
 
2004-03-05 05:08:07 PM  
I repeat: Cut the crap. Ken Lay has NOTHING to do with Martha Stewart. She is guilty of a crime. Stop humping her leg and open your eyes to the facts.
 
2004-03-05 05:10:03 PM  
Beefaroni
Not just that...when the privately held exchanges couldn't police their own members, it set off a worldwide Depression.

You believe that? You believe that evil free market forces focusing on greed and self-interest destroyed the economy, and the benevolent government under the Hero FDR rode in, enacted all this legislation that granted the government unprecedented power to control the economy and people, that may have violated the constitution, but saved the economic day? Wow.

You don't think the government's poor fiscal policies or protectionist tariffs had just a little bit to do with it?
You didn't notice that the economy didn't pick up appreciably until the war started? You don't think the enactment of the income tax only a few years earlier had anything to do with it? Read a real history book on the subject. You can tell which ones are real, because they don't treat John Maynard Keynes like Jesus.

Man, it's almost like the government wrote the history books where you learned all this..... wait....

It's amazing how people say "look at this crap the government's trying to sell us" without examining all the crap you've bought in the past.
 
2004-03-05 05:10:09 PM  
some n00b

Why should you have faith in the stock market?

If you are unaware of the link between consumer confidence and economic health then you probably also think...

Fraud laws are the enforcement of contractual clauses.

So they are not. Usually fraud is used to void contracts not enforce them.
 
2004-03-05 05:10:20 PM  
[image from i-magin-ation.com too old to be available]
Not even charged...


Yet...

He'll be charged. They're just taking their time building their case. They're not going to "let him go". The Justice Department has a serious hard on to nail this guy.
 
2004-03-05 05:11:42 PM  
rel-yo

I must have missed when the government decided they're not going after Ken Lay. Got a link?
 
2004-03-05 05:13:10 PM  
"That plea agreement bought what was needed to nail Ken Lay. All those farkers will see the inside of a jail, some longer than others..."

Assuming Bush does not get another four more years, this may well in fact come true.
 
2004-03-05 05:15:01 PM  
Roy_D_Mercer "When Enron got in trouble, they called the White House for help and Bush hung up on them. It was a Democrat (gasp) who tried to intervene for them with the banks."

Can you prove this with some link? Anything?

/skeptical
 
2004-03-05 05:16:31 PM  
It'll be interesting watching her shoot her show behind bars. But I guess they can just digitally edit those out.
 
2004-03-05 05:16:42 PM  
So, caliban_02, you don't think selling a stock that is known to be worthless by non-public information is a type of fraud?

How about the other people you trust to take care of your investments? Should financial planners go to jail for not doing their job as defined contractually, or should they just lose their CPA for disobeying the rules of the association?

This is not a case of over-regulation by the government; this is law enforcement.
 
2004-03-05 05:17:19 PM  
I knew the six degrees of Bush fit in here somewhere. It always does on Fark.
 
2004-03-05 05:18:23 PM  
any takers on that she won't see day one behind bars.
 
2004-03-05 05:18:30 PM  
Enforcement of contractual clauses : ) You answered your own question... you're so smart!


I'm still unclear on what you're thinking here. If what I'm saying were the case, and we had private exchanges, Martha Stewart would be fined for violating the rules (assuming she actually did). If she didn't pay, then she'd be sent to jail.

You're saying she should be sent to jail regardless. That's the point of my contention.


So they are not. Usually fraud is used to void contracts not enforce them.

That is the silliest thing I've ever seen. How do you define fraud outside of "violating an agreement beteween us"?
 
2004-03-05 05:18:55 PM  
Assuming Bush does not get another four more years, this may well in fact come true.


Bush won't get involved whether he wins the election or not. Lay is toxic waste. It's in the hands of the Justice Department and they want to own this guy. All these pleas we keep seeing are just buying the necessary information to build a tight case against Lay. They'll nail him and he'll go to "pound-me-in-the-ass" prison for a term measured in years.
 
2004-03-05 05:19:23 PM  
caliban_02

The Stock Market crash of 1929 did mark the beginning of a worldwide Depression. I said nothing about the actions of the Roosevelt administations after that. I simply pointed out the obvious.
 
2004-03-05 05:20:12 PM  
Photshop Contest: Photshop Matha Stuarts prison cell...
 
2004-03-05 05:20:25 PM  
So, caliban_02, you don't think selling a stock that is known to be worthless by non-public information is a type of fraud?

No, you misunderstand. I think that doing that, if it violates the contract you signed with a private exchange commission, should be a violation of a rule there -- and subject to fines. If you don't pay, then it's time for law enforcement.

Should financial planners go to jail for not doing their job as defined contractually, or should they just lose their CPA for disobeying the rules of the association?


They should be punished according to whatever is specified in the contract between you and them.
 
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