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(Drudge)   King Bush shuts down Congress   (dailynews.yahoo.com) divider line 229
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10735 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Dec 2001 at 2:23 PM (13 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2001-12-13 04:01:07 PM  
"Some barely relevant information is being kept from Congress."

If it's so barely relevant, then why is Bush supressing it, making it worse for himself?
 
2001-12-13 04:01:29 PM  
"12-13-01 03:59:13 PM Philo
Now if Bush would just sign an executive order ordering Strom Thurmon to die."

You Mean........He's still......ALIVE ???!!!

THAT'S Spooky !!!

-Drac
 
2001-12-13 04:01:58 PM  
Hell, why don't we just blame the media and call it a day. (But at least the media were allowed to freely report at the front in the good ol' days, even, shockingly enough, about American casualties.)

No the media in world war two were required to join the army as grunts go into basic training and carry weapons. Then when they were done fighting they could file reports directly to their commanding officer who would then censor whatever he pleased. Hello jackass ever read a history book?!?

The media in the korean war requested to the president that they be censored because they did not want to leak any info...yes they requested it themselfs. Boy some of you liberal dirtbags are stupid as shiat.

Try to think more than 5 days ahead and you'll see the NMD makes some sense.

NMD is a joke. If someone fires five missles at the united states 1 might slip past it. So what if it blocks four missles spareing the lives of millions of americans 1 missle is really bad and just as bad as the other four combined!!

Hey at the end of the day it really does not bother me I live on the North East and chinese and korean missles can't reach this far. It will be the liberal leftcost that gets hit in the ass not us.
 
2001-12-13 04:04:35 PM  
Man, I'm glad you're an American 3MK, too bad it was only conservatives that were killed in the WTC & Pentagon...It's a good thing that liberals only live on the West Coast.

3Horn
 
2001-12-13 04:09:08 PM  
Lasher99
If Clinton had tried something like this, this thread would already be full.


Clinton did pull something like this.

I always knew Clintonistas had short memories or were historical rivisionists.

Go to northernlight.com and search on "Executive Privilege" +clinton and see what you come up with.
 
2001-12-13 04:09:17 PM  
Farking Hypocrites. Ashcroft OKs violating Attorney-Client privilege and rejects the claim that it will discourage "candor" between a defendent and his lawyer. The next month Dubya invokes Executive Priv, and has the cajones to put in writing, "would inhibit the candor necessary"...blah, blah, blah. This is criminal. They do this crap because they know that the vast majority of American people are Morons incapable of taking care of themselves. As long as they have food, sex, and TV; they won't give a rats butt what goes on in Washington, unless Rush Limbaugh telss them it's Ungodly. In either case, they won't understand what's happening. The people who do understand confine their protests to anonymous posts on internet message boards. I just don't see Johnny A. sitting down to read Fark at night and being brought to his humble knees after reading stinging criticism. There are legal avenues that exist precisely to check the power of the president, and I've been extremely worried that there has been such limited reaction by the Judiciary and Congress so far. We need challenges to be mounted in the courts to block the complete erosion of liberty in American society.

I don't like the buttheads in Congress, or the righteous 9 in the Supreme court. Our system is designed to protect from the corruption of each by separating their powers and then giving them the power to moderate each other. (Feel the power of the mod!) The idea here is that they will all be so power hungry that they will block each others attempts to sieze power, if for no other reason than it is contradictory to their own selfish aim.

Something needs to be done, and quick; or else we'll soon be no better then Canada.
 
2001-12-13 04:09:22 PM  
ImDracula, well, 'alive' is a relative term. They could just bury Thurmond, and I'd be satisfied. Strom would probably welcome a little lie down as well.
 
2001-12-13 04:12:23 PM  
I hope he gets tied in with dirty Enron deals and gets brought down, hard. He's an idiot cockhead. Admit it. He's a yes man. Everything he has done in office has been to please wealthy businessmen and campaign contributors. He's a farking leech. And whoever says they voted for him because he's seemed more "honest", is a farking idiot. And whoever said they voted for him because he was "more like me" is a bigger farking idiot (yeah, did you used to own a major league baseball team?)
 
2001-12-13 04:12:58 PM  
Hope this comes out readable. Timely and appropriate. If you can't read it go to www.thismodernworld.com
 
2001-12-13 04:14:15 PM  
SHINOLA!! Retry

 
Rei
2001-12-13 04:15:27 PM  
I read this article to state that certain information relating to certain matters is being privileged (to verb a noun). It seems pretty specific, to me anyway.

I read it differently, because of statements like:

More importantly, it sets a new policy in the works for months in which the administration will resist lawmakers' requests to view prosecutorial decision-making
documents that have been routinely turned over to Congress in years past.


Of course, nara.gov hasn't updated to include this latest order yet, so I can't read it word-for-word. But, 13233 lets the sitting president pick-and-choose what not to release from *former* presidents, so I'd picture that this one is during the same for the sitting president.
 
2001-12-13 04:19:50 PM  
Didn't Strom Thurman run for President in 1948?????
that dude is OLD
 
2001-12-13 04:21:55 PM  
""``Disclosure to Congress of confidential advice to the attorney general regarding the appointment of a special counsel and confidential recommendations to Department of Justice officials regarding whether to bring criminal charges would inhibit the candor necessary to the effectiveness of the deliberative process by which the department makes prosecutorial decisions,'' Bush wrote. ""

Hmmm. Let's chew on this a bit. "Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor." "Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor." "Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor." "Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor." "Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor."

No, it still makes no sense.

Farking dictator.
 
2001-12-13 04:22:42 PM  
It's good to be the King!
 
2001-12-13 04:22:52 PM  
actually this is very disturbing.....
 
2001-12-13 04:26:47 PM  
MrTuffPaws
Your mistake is saying that the missile defense shield will replace the ABM treaty. The ABM treaty does nothing for you right now. The ABM is worth as much as the paper it's written on. It does not protect you from anything.

I bet you wish you had a missile defense shield back during the cold war. You probably would have felt a bit safer.


The missile defense shield is not the answer. It is part of it.

 
2001-12-13 04:30:04 PM  
Congress... Buncha damn whiners...
 
2001-12-13 04:31:09 PM  
What is truly is the fact that this does not surprise me at all.
 
2001-12-13 04:33:26 PM  
The executive branch has been getting stronger at the expense of the legislative for a long time now. This is nothing new.

Democrats? Republicans? Come on, people... who are they looking out for? You?

The dystopic future is here.

enjoy,

mh
 
2001-12-13 04:34:20 PM  
The ABM is worth as much as the paper it's written on. It does not protect you from anything.

Or it's the cornerstone of world security. It's one of those.
 
2001-12-13 04:34:22 PM  
Bush needs to go to jail as soon as possible. What a dickhole. Traitorous POS.
 
2001-12-13 04:35:59 PM  
We pretty much have a one party system anyways. The system keeps itself alive by switching between the two offering only slightly different angles of the same problems and solutions Oor lack thereof as the case may be).

Now we have the "Bush" family though. Aint life grand?
 
2001-12-13 04:39:12 PM  
This can actually be good if our spineless congressman decide to persue this to the supreme court. I'd love to see Asscroft help in contempt and jailed, or better yet have is license to practice law revoked :)
 
2001-12-13 04:39:56 PM  
Rei:
This exercise of EP does not expand the traditional scope of EP -- it has never been limited to documents relating solely to the executive invoking the privilege. I'm not quite sure what to make of the excerpt (it's not the model of clarity), but whether certain things have "traditionally" (whatever that is suppposed to mean here) been surrendered or not, in these instances, W is invoking a recognized right to privilege them.
We've gone a bit far afield -- I engaged you on your statement that "Um, *no* presidents have tried to use executive privilage to declare that they get to pick and choose what gets turned over to congress." Which statement I still believe is indefensible.
 
2001-12-13 04:40:51 PM  
Da9ve:
I think it makes sense. EP is used so that especially sensitive behind-the-scenes deliberations and information within the Executive Branch can be protected from disclosure to the Congress. This way, Executive Branch decision-makers can operate with some comfort that their sources won't be compromised and they won't be personally pilloried for administration decisions -- which results in more candor in making decisions and (hopefully) less concern with ass-covering. Invoking EP doesn't make W a dictator -- unless you think most prior presidents are farking dicatators, b/c it's a time-honored tool they've used.
Add: why "Da9ve"?
 
2001-12-13 04:41:51 PM  
FarkRavingMad:
Something needs to be done, and quick; or else we'll soon be no better then Canada.

I don't recall Canada's government being as bad as, let alone worse than, the US's. Chretien is a bit corrupt, but he doesn't go around acting like he's the goddamn prince of the universe. Also, his IQ dwarf's Bush's.
 
2001-12-13 04:42:26 PM  
I AM LAUGHING MY A$$ OFF. For months all I have heard is "Bush is so stupid", "Boy is Bush a moron" and now he is successfully overthrowing our democracy and building a dictatorship and the vast majority of Americans are to stupid to see through his crafty plan. Make up your minds guys. Is he Joseph Stalin or Jethroe from the Beverly Hillbillies?

Da9ve- ""Disclosure. . . would inhibit candor." No, it still makes no sense."

I think that means that disclosure of information to Congress, who has proven they can't keep their mouths shut, basically means disclosing that info to the public. Disclosing that info to the public may inhibit the candor of the sources of that information in the future.
 
2001-12-13 04:42:53 PM  
"Enron is Whitewater in spades"

http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=scheer&s=20011211
 
2001-12-13 04:44:11 PM  
Ok, here's the thing. Sure, Russia is a friend now. So, theoretically, we're not worried about them. But, if we withdraw from the treaty and then don't offer up another more current treaty (if that's their argument), then aren't we just undermining and thus daring China to build up and modernise their nukes. So now, our defense sheild makes everyone else say, "fark this, we need more nukes. They've got a sheild." Think about it, China has like 20 nukes that could make it to the U.S. Right now, they have to be thinking about building up their nuclear capabilities and why not? If we don't have to follow international treaties, why should they?
 
2001-12-13 04:47:50 PM  
this has MadMax future written all over it

HERO?!?!?!...huh?
 
2001-12-13 04:49:16 PM  
Ok, there's too many liberals on this thread right now. No one to argue with.
 
2001-12-13 04:52:10 PM  
These anti-Bush liberals have a serious lack of reality. They seem to think that someday mankind will become enlightened and discard all its guns and nuclear warheads. STUPID liberals, you can't put the jeanie back in the bottle. Go pet some baby seals or at least try to do something usefull.
 
2001-12-13 04:53:08 PM  
Playa Hatah:

I wasn't criticizing the Canadian government. I just don't like Canada. It's too cold.
 
2001-12-13 04:54:27 PM  
Freddiemiles1,

Hey, what about me. I am conservative, at least on some issues. I'll admit I can't devote to much time to arguing because I am pretty busy at work but I'll argue with you all I can.
 
2001-12-13 04:58:44 PM  
Capigula:

I, for one, am not giving credit to Bush for "Masterminding" this. He just surrounded himself (with Daddy's help) with like-minded elitests willing to get it done for him. In three years, or seven years they will push him aside and fight for the number one spot.
 
2001-12-13 04:59:16 PM  
FarkRavingMad:
What you said. I'm willing to accept that sometimes communication needs to be private. *I* certainly don't want everything I say to be public knowledge. Without knowing what was actually in the documents I can't really judge if they should be withheld from Congress or not. But (and I'm paraphrasing) when they say,
"As it applies to us, communication needs to be private to preserve necessary candor" at the same time as they say, "As it applies to prisoners/inmates, communication doesn't need to be private, they can preserve candor while we listen to what they say," I have a big problem.
Hypocrites.
 
2001-12-13 05:00:10 PM  
hero?
 
Rei
2001-12-13 05:02:27 PM  
I just saw this on a link that someone posted, and thought it was interesting.

"We might take a lesson, as should he, from Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld's recommendation that the B-1 bomber be dropped from Air Force inventory. The B-1 was a $100 Billion program that was the star of Reagan's defense build-up, after Carter had dropped the plane. Plagued by problems, the B-1 has spent almost all of its service life grounded - and not just individual planes, the entire 100 plane fleet. It has been used exactly once, a couple of years ago in the Balkans. Now Rumsfeld wants to scrap it. $100 Billion dollars down the drain. Ya know, $100 Billion there, $100
Billion here, pretty soon you're talking about real money. Which suggests the lesson Rumsfeld should learn here; the administration's missile defense system will probably cost at least this much, if not two or three times the amount. And as every test of the elementary technology of the system has so far failed or been rigged, we have every reason to expect the B-1 will seem like a paragon of reliability in contrast. More hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars cycling through the major GOP donor defense contractors, without adding an iota to the country's security and defense. But given the example of the B-1, maybe we can assume that's not the point." --Kent, 6/24/01

Overpaid Slacker:

True, I think my sentance was probably as unclear as the article was. :)
 
2001-12-13 05:02:46 PM  
Being in touch with reality means agreeing that millions should be spend on a missile defense system that probably won't work? that pisses off Russia? that will create a false sense of security? that wont stop biological attacks? or suitcase nukes? Thats pork for some military industrial complex big wigs who have Bush in his pocket?
Well, I'm off to save some seals in my deluded state.
 
2001-12-13 05:02:59 PM  
I think we need to bow our heads and hope the knife is sharp.

I also think we need a slippery slope tag.
 
2001-12-13 05:07:53 PM  
"Rep. Henry Waxman, the top Democrat on the committee, who frequently sparred with Burton during Clinton era investigations, agreed with his sometimes nemesis.

``An imperial presidency or an imperial justice department conflicts with the democratic principles of our nation,'' Waxman said."

this is by far the most hilarious thing i have read in a LONG time. he enabled klinton to supress information and "lose" files for 8 years and he has the gall to say this? i can't stop laughing.
 
2001-12-13 05:08:36 PM  
Rei:
You obsolete something when it outlives its intended use. There is no longer a need for a bomber that flys at low altitude to avoid enemy radar. Radars have improved since 1980 and there are now cruise missiles that do the same thing.

Are you saying that ICBM's will soon be obsolete??? What replaces them, a lazer doomsday canon????
 
Rei
2001-12-13 05:09:12 PM  
Another take on missile defense. My roomate, Rachel, worked for years doing intelligence work for the army. She saw a number of proposals go by for missile defense. One of the best evaluated, unused proposals for missile defense was amazingly simple. You have another ICBM, filled with a payload of quartz sand. When you detect an incoming ICBM, you launch, and have it accelerate towards the incoming missile(s) as quickly as possible. It then releases the sand into orbit in the direction of the incoming missiles, spreading outward. At the speeds that the two are approaching each other, maneuvering out of way of the sand is not really an option. Likewise, at the collision speeds, mere sand would shred through almost anything that you could throw at it.

Of course, such an idea, while deemed a likely prospect at working, never made it far. Missile defense is about public opinion. It needs to be dramatic. That's one of the main reasons we're shooting a bullet with a bullet here ;)
 
2001-12-13 05:10:37 PM  
This isn't about Bush wanting to be king. This is about Cheaney directing Bush to do so many stupid things that he gets canned and then the VP gets a promotion. I betcha
 
2001-12-13 05:11:31 PM  
Hey good for him, keep those biatches in check!
 
2001-12-13 05:13:39 PM  
Rei:
Ever hear of the Sprint and Spartan Missile, it was actually deployed.
http://www.srmsc.org/
 
2001-12-13 05:14:04 PM  
Uh, in case you are 12 and haven't noticed, most every president asserts the exact same executive privilege Bush did. They didn't just make it up, it is an executive right consistently upheld in the courts.
 
2001-12-13 05:18:01 PM  
the funny thing is most of this bedwetters on this thread have no clue what the article is about or what executive privledge is. any excuse to bash bush is fine with them. they let their emotions get in the way of rational thought. oh well, at least they FEEL better. how nice.
 
Rei
2001-12-13 05:26:19 PM  
Hoosier:

C'mon, the B1 was a joke. It's entire service was "dumb" bombing Kosovo, and only minorly. We once lost one to a pelican. It's not exactly the best aircraft we've ever built, by the remotest standards ;)

Ever hear of the Sprint and Spartan Missile

Actually, no, I'll have to read that article :)

Hmm, sounds like a pretty good concept... far more feasable than our current concept ;) You still have to get close, but measured in miles, not feet ;)
 
2001-12-13 05:27:56 PM  
One of the thingees in the article mentioned a case from the 1960s, why?

This was a time when J. Edger Hoover ran the country, much as Dick Cheney does today. J. Edger is dead, isn't he?

Does anyone in the shadow government ever, ever die?
The bodies buried form a shield that keep us from knowing.


And now I lay me down to sleep
and dream I will of freedom creep
should I die and play a harp
I still should wish the knife was sharp.
 
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