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(C|Net)   Microsoft, at the forefront of innovation, to preview Windows 9(5) and its amazing start menu. Start me up, baby   (cnet.com) divider line 142
    More: Spiffy  
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6786 clicks; posted to Geek » on 22 Aug 2014 at 10:53 AM (34 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-08-22 07:56:16 AM  
There's a joke from about then around "Why can't protestants use Windows 95? They won't use icons" But it's faded from the catalog of tasteless jokes.
 
2014-08-22 08:36:51 AM  
That looks like a steaming pile of rip off.

I wonder who the innovative genius was that decided to roll out a PC screen that only mimics what the competition was killing them with 5 years ago?
 
2014-08-22 09:11:37 AM  
winsupersite.com

I can live with this.
 
2014-08-22 10:42:21 AM  
Can I have control over the size / color / arrangement of the Metro tiles?  Cause that shiat looks like Walt Disney threw up.
 
2014-08-22 10:48:39 AM  
i.chzbgr.com

/haters
 
2014-08-22 10:57:05 AM  
What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.
 
2014-08-22 11:17:56 AM  
I'd settle for metro apps that work when a windows 8 pc is joined to a domain.
(probably a domain policy that dates back to Win2k that our folks are too lazy to do anything about)
 
2014-08-22 11:19:58 AM  
That start looks like it would take 10 seconds to come up and refresh on a slow computer.

I guess the 'Start 8' cash cow is rapidly coming to a close.
 
2014-08-22 11:25:21 AM  
ooo... virtual desktops. Innovation from the late 80s.
 
2014-08-22 11:30:19 AM  
Oh this time they'll get it right, I'm sure.
 
2014-08-22 11:35:30 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.


Because design is important, and flat design styles when done right are good design. Apple has completely mopped the floor with their shiny toys, and whether it's a good idea technically or not, Microsoft has to respond.
 
2014-08-22 11:43:42 AM  

illegal.tender: Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.

Because design is important, and flat design styles when done right are good design. Apple has completely mopped the floor with their shiny toys, and whether it's a good idea technically or not, Microsoft has to respond.


Apple still only holds a very small share of the computer market. I'm not sure why MS would need to respond to anything Apple is doing. As far as tablets go, yes Apple has a nice chunk of the market, but it's not like you can get a lot of productivity out of an iPad (I have an iPad Air that I like, so I'm not an Apple hater).
 
2014-08-22 11:44:17 AM  

illegal.tender: Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.

Because design is important, and flat design styles when done right are good design. Apple has completely mopped the floor with their shiny toys, and whether it's a good idea technically or not, Microsoft has to respond.


The thing is, the way to compete with Apple, it seems to me, is  don't do what they're doing. I think a lot of the success Android has had came from offering things and giving options iOS doesn't.  People who want the Apple Experience will buy Apple products.  So looking like an imitation of that is a loser.
 
2014-08-22 11:46:55 AM  

TheGreatGazoo: That start looks like it would take 10 seconds to come up and refresh on a slow computer.

I guess the 'Start 8' cash cow is rapidly coming to a close.


Yeah, if your computer is ten years old.
 
2014-08-22 11:51:24 AM  

jake_lex: illegal.tender: Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.

Because design is important, and flat design styles when done right are good design. Apple has completely mopped the floor with their shiny toys, and whether it's a good idea technically or not, Microsoft has to respond.

The thing is, the way to compete with Apple, it seems to me, is  don't do what they're doing. I think a lot of the success Android has had came from offering things and giving options iOS doesn't.  People who want the Apple Experience will buy Apple products.  So looking like an imitation of that is a loser.


You don't design for end users. You design for tech mags/blogs, and wall street analysts.

World - Windows (pick a version) is fine leave it alone
mouthbreathers - Apple has just done XYZ, Microsoft must follow or cease to exist!!!!
Microsoft - no
World - Windows (pick a version) is fine leave it alone
mouthbreathers - Apple has just done XYZ, Microsoft must follow or cease to exist!!!!
Microsoft - no
World - Windows (pick a version) is fine leave it alone
mouthbreathers - Apple has just done XYZ, Microsoft must follow or cease to exist!!!!
Microsoft - fine - here is a new version of windows doing XYZ
World - THIS SUX
mouthbreathers HA HA WE TROLL U. New WinDoze SUX

fast forward 5 years, repeat above cycle.
 
2014-08-22 11:53:24 AM  

RexTalionis: [winsupersite.com image 348x493]

I can live with this.


Just what I need, to accidentally click an ad when trying to shut down.

/Which will then force 20 minutes of updates.
 
2014-08-22 11:58:03 AM  
I've seen Threshold....

img2u.info
 
2014-08-22 12:01:35 PM  
Windows 8 almost made the various Linux GUIs look good in comparison. Cellpnone interfaces are proof that people can and will learn how to use new interfaces but W8 is not that good.
 
2014-08-22 12:02:49 PM  
Good, hurry up. I'm starting to notice little bits of weirdness in my computer, and rather than reinstall windows 7 I would prefer an excuse to just build a new one. Windows 8 is shiat though, so I have to wait for the "every other" release, windows 9.
 
2014-08-22 12:06:44 PM  
That Guy Jeff:Windows 8 is shiat though, so I have to wait for the "every other" release, windows 9.

Yeah, I recently inherited a small business network (8 computers and a server), and six of the computers are still running XP. I hate to buy 7 at this point, and no one wants 8, so right now I'm crossing my fingers and hoping 9 comes out soon.
 
2014-08-22 12:11:53 PM  

skinink: Windows 8 almost made the various Linux GUIs look good in comparison. Cellpnone interfaces are proof that people can and will learn how to use new interfaces but W8 is not that good.


Are you kidding? Unity is great. I prefer it over Windows 7 and OSX. It took me a little while to get used to, but now I love.
 
2014-08-22 12:12:05 PM  

skinink: Windows 8 almost made the various Linux GUIs look good in comparison. Cellpnone interfaces are proof that people can and will learn how to use new interfaces but W8 is not that good.


Excatly.
 
2014-08-22 12:16:29 PM  

skinink: Windows 8 almost made the various Linux GUIs look good in comparison. Cellpnone interfaces are proof that people can and will learn how to use new interfaces but W8 is not that good.


I would kill to use a Linux GUI on a Windows OS.  I mean, the only, and I mean ONLY, reason I run Windows (8.1 currently) is to play games that won't run on Linux (I don't use Wine).  I use Classic Shell, but I'd rather have something like XFCE, or since this is Windows, whatever the interface that Windows 2000 used.  I like the old 2K no frills, let's get down to business interface.



jake_lex: The thing is, the way to compete with Apple, it seems to me, is  don't do what they're doing. I think a lot of the success Android has had came from offering things and giving options iOS doesn't.  People who want the Apple Experience will buy Apple products.  So looking like an imitation of that is a loser.


And that's why I use Android. If it doesn't have "feature X", somebody will write an app or make a rom that does have "feature X". As well, iOS and WP don't have the same level of open, shared development that Android has, which is a driving factor as to why geeks run Android and why they'll recommend Android to friends and family -- it does more, maybe not the best, but it does do more and will do more and usually first (Also, if I'm gonna have to fix your crap when you use it improperly, I'd rather fix something I'm familiar with and like).
 
2014-08-22 12:21:58 PM  

jake_lex: illegal.tender: Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.

Because design is important, and flat design styles when done right are good design. Apple has completely mopped the floor with their shiny toys, and whether it's a good idea technically or not, Microsoft has to respond.

The thing is, the way to compete with Apple, it seems to me, is  don't do what they're doing. I think a lot of the success Android has had came from offering things and giving options iOS doesn't.  People who want the Apple Experience will buy Apple products.  So looking like an imitation of that is a loser.


And then Samsung & Google went and did their best to copy Apple and the result is just awful. Remember when the web browser was called Browser and the store was called Market? Now it's Chrome and "Play Store," whatever that means
 
2014-08-22 12:25:12 PM  

That Guy Jeff: Good, hurry up. I'm starting to notice little bits of weirdness in my computer, and rather than reinstall windows 7 I would prefer an excuse to just build a new one. Windows 8 is shiat though, so I have to wait for the "every other" release, windows 9.


W8 is actually a great os. Fast, stable, small footprint and runs on low spec machines. I upgraded my pc from XP and with the exact same hardware 8 runs far quicker. I then installed 8 on an old Compaq netbook that had XP and a Atom cpu and 1gb RAM and it ran great.
Of course I installed Classic Shell to put back the Start button and menu. I just bought a Surface RT and though the metro touch gestures are fine on a tablet they suck balls on a desk pc.

/Wonder if they'll upgrade RT?
 
2014-08-22 12:30:30 PM  
Under the hood, Win8 is a really solid OS.    It's just Metro that ruins it.

Hoping Win9 continues on the improvements of Win8.   Just with a saner UI for a desktop.
 
2014-08-22 12:34:31 PM  
I've used the hell out of Windows 8 (lots of playing, some development). Technically it's a good operating system with significant improvements over previous versions of Windows.

Aesthetically it's even nice if you're using a touch pad (I loved my surface pro 2 - had to give it back to work when I left them a couple of months ago).

Anyway, as a desktop environment it's garbage. The reason why "Windows" is useful is precisely why it's called "Windows". I want my apps in windows on my screen, not partitioned as tiles or grabbing full screen control when I click on them and I don't want backwards menu selections on simple tasks or having to flip through multiple screens to side by side compare documents or different applications.

Don't get me wrong - I know that pretty much everything I want to do is there, and while learning all of the new keyboard short cuts has made it slightly easier than when I first started using it, it's still a pain in the ass.
 
2014-08-22 12:38:56 PM  

Flint Ironstag: /Wonder if they'll upgrade RT?


Rumor is that RT and Windows Phone will get combined into a touch-centric OS for phones and tablets (Windows Mobile?), basically removing the desktop and the other legacy stuff that made RT confusing for customers. My hope is that they take the best ideas from both platforms and create something like iOS or Android that can scale well between phone, phablet, and tablet form factors well without the discontinuity you get going from a 6" phone to an 8" tablet like you do now.
 
2014-08-22 12:39:05 PM  
What they really need to do is allow you to pull up a list of favorites in a column on the left and then a view of files/folder on the right with adjustable views for various tasks.

Or as Mac users call it Finder...
 
2014-08-22 12:40:00 PM  
Microsoft follows the Star Trek movie idea where ever other one is good.  I think 9 is supposed to be the good one.
 
2014-08-22 12:56:24 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: What I want to know is why it has to be so frigging UGLY.


MS only hires programmers?
no artists ?
 
2014-08-22 12:56:33 PM  

Flint Ironstag: W8 is actually a great os. Fast, stable, small footprint and runs on low spec machines. I upgraded my pc from XP and with the exact same hardware 8 runs far quicker. I then installed 8 on an old Compaq netbook that had XP and a Atom cpu and 1gb RAM and it ran great.


I'd agree that if your basis for comparison is XP it's a "great" OS, but that's like saying your 2014 Civic is a great car because it's better than the 2000 Civic it replaced. It's not so much that the new one's a great car, it's that the old one's just really old.

Compared to 7 it's not so great. There are a few improvements, but I certainly wouldn't use the word "great" to describe them. I'd say it's not even worth the upgrade, frankly. From XP to 8, absolutely. From 7 to 8? Eeehhhhh... not so much.
 
2014-08-22 01:06:33 PM  
If they don't bring the start button back and a classic style desktop they will never sell in huge numbers like XP and Win 7.  Corporate end users are too stupid to figure it out.
 
2014-08-22 01:10:47 PM  

fang06554: RexTalionis: [winsupersite.com image 348x493]

I can live with this.

Just what I need, to accidentally click an ad when trying to shut down.

/Which will then force 20 minutes of updates.


Way to gloss over the biggest thing:
Why is there an ad in the Start Menu?!
 
2014-08-22 01:15:37 PM  

Red_Fox: If they don't bring the start button back and a classic style desktop they will never sell in huge numbers like XP and Win 7.  Corporate end users are too stupid to figure it out.


Some of use just like minimalistic desktops that don't have a lot of unnecessary background crap running or that's tied to the internet and always updating some feed or some kind for some news or information or social network status that if we really cared enough to know, we'd run our web browser of choice and go to a news or info or social site.
 
2014-08-22 01:17:40 PM  

Tobin_Lam: Way to gloss over the biggest thing:
Why is there an ad in the Start Menu?!


There aren't any ads, that is just the way the Start Screen style apps look, which is kind of their downfall. Instead of being a nice predicable icon, you have things like new and featured apps popping up on the Store tile, so after a while it all gets really cluttered and it is hard to tell what is what because every tile has some sort of little image in it that may or may not give a hint to what app the tile goes with. You can turn all that off if you want, but the tiles look a little boring if they are just icons because they are so minimalist. Microsoft went a little too far with the whole flat thing, and it wound up looking very AOL circa 1994.
 
2014-08-22 01:18:08 PM  

skeevy420: And that's why I use Android. If it doesn't have "feature X", somebody will write an app or make a rom that does have "feature X". As well, iOS and WP don't have the same level of open, shared development that Android has, which is a driving factor as to why geeks run Android and why they'll recommend Android to friends and family -- it does more, maybe not the best, but it does do more and will do more and usually first (Also, if I'm gonna have to fix your crap when you use it improperly, I'd rather fix something I'm familiar with and like).


Every geek I know has a iPhone.  Every non-geek I know (at least the straight ones) have Android devices.  For the exact reasons you pretend to think Android is better.  It does more and it just works.  The whole notion that Android "does do more ... and usually first" has been debunked a thousand times.
 
2014-08-22 01:22:10 PM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: Apple still only holds a very small share of the computer market. I'm not sure why MS would need to respond to anything Apple is doing. As far as tablets go, yes Apple has a nice chunk of the market, but it's not like you can get a lot of productivity out of an iPad (I have an iPad Air that I like, so I'm not an Apple hater).


There's absolutely no reason to ape Apple in the desktop space.
 
2014-08-22 01:22:39 PM  
If you start me up, I'll never stop, never stop, never never never stop....you'll make a strong man cry.
 
2014-08-22 01:22:51 PM  

Nogrhi: Can I have control over the size / color / arrangement of the Metro tiles?  Cause that shiat looks like Walt Disney threw up.


Size - yes, choices are listed as small, medium and wide.  Large tiles are twice the width and height of small.  Wide is double the height of a small tile and 4 times the width.
Color - no
Arrangement - limited.  You can reorder the tiles to a limited degree.  It seems to force fill the space to a size of a wide tile before stacking vertically.
 
2014-08-22 01:23:54 PM  

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: skinink: Windows 8 almost made the various Linux GUIs look good in comparison. Cellpnone interfaces are proof that people can and will learn how to use new interfaces but W8 is not that good.

Are you kidding? Unity is great. I prefer it over Windows 7 and OSX. It took me a little while to get used to, but now I love.


They are getting better than they used to be. I think Gnome 3 is turning out pretty good, and XFCE looks a'ight for lower end machines. I'm not an Ubuntu user, so I can't really comment on Unity.

I also think Win 8.1 gets a lot of undue hate. But, I'm fairly agnostic towards the OS, the current versions of OSX, Windows and Linux based systems (I'm using Fedora 20) are all nice looking and perfectly usable IMO.
 
2014-08-22 01:24:18 PM  
Also, the tiles only show up for things pinned to the start menu.  Remove them and the tiles vanish.
 
2014-08-22 01:26:22 PM  
I think what pissed me off about Windows 8 more than the UI farkup was the inability to use Windows Media Center in any verion lower than Pro.  I use Windows 7 Home Premium and I use Windows Media Center as my DVR (and yes, I like it).  I don't need any of the feature differences between Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro, nor have I needed any of the differences between Windows 7 Home Premium and any higher edition.  I never have understood their logic behind making WMC unavailable for what is for all intents and purposes the same Windows edition "level" in 8.

I hope, but doubt, this problem will be resolved in 9, so I'll probably end up at some point just having to shell out for a version of Windows with a bunch of features I had to pay for but don't need or want.  (Yeah, I could use different DVR software, but I actually do really like WMC and it's one of very few options that work with the decryption in my tuner.)
 
2014-08-22 01:26:32 PM  

gingerjet: skeevy420: And that's why I use Android. If it doesn't have "feature X", somebody will write an app or make a rom that does have "feature X". As well, iOS and WP don't have the same level of open, shared development that Android has, which is a driving factor as to why geeks run Android and why they'll recommend Android to friends and family -- it does more, maybe not the best, but it does do more and will do more and usually first (Also, if I'm gonna have to fix your crap when you use it improperly, I'd rather fix something I'm familiar with and like).

Every geek I know has a iPhone.  Every non-geek I know (at least the straight ones) have Android devices.  For the exact reasons you pretend to think Android is better.  It does more and it just works.  The whole notion that Android "does do more ... and usually first" has been debunked a thousand times.


You need to find a better set of geeks to hang out with.
 
2014-08-22 01:27:32 PM  

RexTalionis: [winsupersite.com image 348x493]

I can live with this.


Can someone PhotoShop this into the start menu of that(without the cell shiat at the top) img.fark.net
 
2014-08-22 01:30:51 PM  

gingerjet: Every geek I know has a iPhone. Every non-geek I know (at least the straight ones) have Android devices. For the exact reasons you pretend to think Android is better. It does more and it just works. The whole notion that Android "does do more ... and usually first" has been debunked a thousand times.


I work in an IT shop.  It is probably a 60/40 split in favor of Android.  IOS does some things well.  Android does some things well.  Both have items that have been stolen from the other.  I've had both, and have both Android and Apple tablets.  Both have pluses and minuses.  My wife can't get used to the android UI on a tablet and sticks to the Applesphere, but my kids actually use Blackberry OS the most in the tablet space.

There are apps in the Play store that aren't available in the App store and vice versa.  However a year old Android tablet can be purchased for a song.  A year old iPad still costs more than most current gen tablets with better specs.  The only thing Apple kills the competition in (in the tablet space) is battery life.
 
2014-08-22 01:33:07 PM  

gingerjet: skeevy420: And that's why I use Android. If it doesn't have "feature X", somebody will write an app or make a rom that does have "feature X". As well, iOS and WP don't have the same level of open, shared development that Android has, which is a driving factor as to why geeks run Android and why they'll recommend Android to friends and family -- it does more, maybe not the best, but it does do more and will do more and usually first (Also, if I'm gonna have to fix your crap when you use it improperly, I'd rather fix something I'm familiar with and like).

Every geek I know has a iPhone.  Every non-geek I know (at least the straight ones) have Android devices.  For the exact reasons you pretend to think Android is better.  It does more and it just works.  The whole notion that Android "does do more ... and usually first" has been debunked a thousand times.


And the opposite is true for my friends. They are just tools.
 
2014-08-22 01:34:57 PM  

Radak: I think what pissed me off about Windows 8 more than the UI farkup was the inability to use Windows Media Center in any verion lower than Pro.  I use Windows 7 Home Premium and I use Windows Media Center as my DVR (and yes, I like it).  I don't need any of the feature differences between Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro, nor have I needed any of the differences between Windows 7 Home Premium and any higher edition.  I never have understood their logic behind making WMC unavailable for what is for all intents and purposes the same Windows edition "level" in 8.

I hope, but doubt, this problem will be resolved in 9, so I'll probably end up at some point just having to shell out for a version of Windows with a bunch of features I had to pay for but don't need or want.  (Yeah, I could use different DVR software, but I actually do really like WMC and it's one of very few options that work with the decryption in my tuner.)


The term for this behaviour is 'Fark you, Pay Me'. It helps explain the high numbers of Win7 installations still in use.
 
2014-08-22 01:35:05 PM  

drjekel_mrhyde: RexTalionis: [winsupersite.com image 348x493]

I can live with this.

Can someone PhotoShop this into the start menu of that(without the cell shiat at the top) [img.fark.net image 768x1280]


img.fark.net

I'm almost afraid to ask for the original.
 
2014-08-22 01:37:27 PM  

gingerjet: skeevy420: And that's why I use Android. If it doesn't have "feature X", somebody will write an app or make a rom that does have "feature X". As well, iOS and WP don't have the same level of open, shared development that Android has, which is a driving factor as to why geeks run Android and why they'll recommend Android to friends and family -- it does more, maybe not the best, but it does do more and will do more and usually first (Also, if I'm gonna have to fix your crap when you use it improperly, I'd rather fix something I'm familiar with and like).

Every geek I know has a iPhone.  Every non-geek I know (at least the straight ones) have Android devices.  For the exact reasons you pretend to think Android is better.  It does more and it just works.  The whole notion that Android "does do more ... and usually first" has been debunked a thousand times.


IOS does more than Android? Really, what things do you use your Apple phone for? I bet I can do similar things on Android. I don't get this "my smartphone does more than yours" bit. Both platforms can do a lot of things and I don't think either is worse or better than the other. Both are so advanced in abilities at this point choosing a smartphone just seems to come down to personal preference.
 
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