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(WSFA)   AL Police Chief to Ferguson Commander: "Bullshiat"   (wsfa.com) divider line 624
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21781 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Aug 2014 at 9:31 AM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-08-20 06:21:54 AM  
no1curr
 
2014-08-20 07:24:02 AM  
Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?
 
2014-08-20 08:01:25 AM  

enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?


Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.
 
2014-08-20 08:23:52 AM  

doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.


Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.
 
2014-08-20 08:49:44 AM  
This will make things better for sure.
 
2014-08-20 08:52:16 AM  
I had no idea that the American League had a police force.
 
2014-08-20 08:59:30 AM  

enry: But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No.


Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal. So What he's say makes a lot of sense and the situations are analogous, even if the crimes are not. But why he brings up the point is because he's calling BS on the story.

Also, this 18 year old was bigger than me. Meanwhile, I don't know Ted Bundy's stats off hand, but he looked like I could take him in the photos I've seen.
 
2014-08-20 09:04:50 AM  

doglover: enry: But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No.

Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal. So What he's say makes a lot of sense and the situations are analogous, even if the crimes are not. But why he brings up the point is because he's calling BS on the story.

Also, this 18 year old was bigger than me. Meanwhile, I don't know Ted Bundy's stats off hand, but he looked like I could take him in the photos I've seen.


"I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?

Meanwhile, Wilson looks very grievously injured in those videos.  He's pretty brave to have not accepted any kind of medical assistance.
 
2014-08-20 09:08:25 AM  

enry: doglover: enry: But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No.

Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal. So What he's say makes a lot of sense and the situations are analogous, even if the crimes are not. But why he brings up the point is because he's calling BS on the story.

Also, this 18 year old was bigger than me. Meanwhile, I don't know Ted Bundy's stats off hand, but he looked like I could take him in the photos I've seen.

"I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?

Meanwhile, Wilson looks very grievously injured in those videos.  He's pretty brave to have not accepted any kind of medical assistance.


Be kind, he's deeply traumatized about what he had to do in the line of duty, and the public hatred directed towards his bravery.
 
2014-08-20 09:17:54 AM  

enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him". That's the justification now?


No, that's BULLshiat. That's the whole point behind the riots that have been going on for far too long now.

How 'bout you get a hot dog and catch up already?
 
2014-08-20 09:21:49 AM  

doglover: enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him". That's the justification now?

No, that's BULLshiat. That's the whole point behind the riots that have been going on for far too long now.

How 'bout you get a hot dog and catch up already?


Keep digging that hole.
 
2014-08-20 09:24:34 AM  

enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?


Actually, it always has been.  It's called "disparity of force".

For your edification:
http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/16/massad-ayoob-fist-vs-gun-disparity -o f-force-and-the-law/

Disparity of force was a key element here. It means when an ostensibly unarmed man is so likely to kill or cripple you, his physical advantage becomes the equivalent of a deadly weapon, and warrants your recourse to a gun or knife or whatever in self-defense.
 
2014-08-20 09:26:18 AM  

dittybopper: enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?

Actually, it always has been.  It's called "disparity of force".

For your edification:
http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/16/massad-ayoob-fist-vs-gun-disparity -o f-force-and-the-law/

Disparity of force was a key element here. It means when an ostensibly unarmed man is so likely to kill or cripple you, his physical advantage becomes the equivalent of a deadly weapon, and warrants your recourse to a gun or knife or whatever in self-defense.


You're digging too?  Well you two have fun together with that.

/citing the Daily Caller?  Nice touch.
 
2014-08-20 09:35:29 AM  
Never in the history of human events has so much discussion and action occurred over so little information.
 
2014-08-20 09:35:31 AM  

doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.


Give the gentle giant a break. Who among us hasn't strong armed a small Pakistani man for a handful of cheap cigars?
 
2014-08-20 09:37:06 AM  

enry: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.


No. You are seeing what you want to see.

What is the reason for the clerk to come around the counter to try and lock the door to prevent MB from leaving the store?

He wanted to make sure MB received his change?

Was MB insisting on the clerk keeping his change? Is that why he put hands on the clerk and then tried intimidating him with his size?

What was the reason for Dorian Johnson to admit MB stole the cigars?

Ive seen some pretty stupid truthers in my time, but the he didnt rob the store truthers really take the cake.
 
2014-08-20 09:38:55 AM  

enry: Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.


i.imgur.com
 
2014-08-20 09:39:10 AM  

enry: doglover: enry: But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No.

Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal. So What he's say makes a lot of sense and the situations are analogous, even if the crimes are not. But why he brings up the point is because he's calling BS on the story.

Also, this 18 year old was bigger than me. Meanwhile, I don't know Ted Bundy's stats off hand, but he looked like I could take him in the photos I've seen.

"I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?

Meanwhile, Wilson looks very grievously injured in those videos.  He's pretty brave to have not accepted any kind of medical assistance.


It's been a fascinating exercise in misinformation to watch that morph from 'An altercation in or around the patrol car' to 'Michael Brown administered a savage beating to Officer Wilson'.
 
2014-08-20 09:39:17 AM  
static.giantbomb.com
 
2014-08-20 09:39:17 AM  

doglover: Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal


lol wut?
 
2014-08-20 09:39:19 AM  

dittybopper: Actually, it always has been. It's called "disparity of force".

For your edification:
http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/16/massad-ayoob-fist-vs-gun-disparity -o f-force-and-the-law/

Disparity of force was a key element here. It means when an ostensibly unarmed man is so likely to kill or cripple you, his physical advantage becomes the equivalent of a deadly weapon, and warrants your recourse to a gun or knife or whatever in self-defense.


Should be noted that this "disparity of force" idea isn't a legal doctrine.
 
2014-08-20 09:39:45 AM  

Erebus1954: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Give the gentle giant a break. Who among us hasn't strong armed a small Pakistani man for a handful of cheap cigars?



I'm sure none of the stoners and cop haters on Fark have ever stolen anything. And if they did, it was certainly just a case of boys being boys. No harm, no foul.
 
2014-08-20 09:40:13 AM  
That entire letter essentially boils down to the idea that cops should be excused for having itchy trigger fingers because everybody is a violent criminal until proven otherwise.

First of all, the "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality of cops in some neighborhoods is exactly what people in Ferguson are so pissed off about right now.

Second, you don't exactly do your own men and women any favors by attempting to FURTHER spread the notion that cops should be feared because one wrong move might be interpreted as an attempt to flee or fight by a dangerous criminal who just committed a violent crime. Maybe instead try NOT encouraging that sort of confrontational attitude between the public and cops, huh? Can we maybe test out that one for once? Or should I continue to assume that if I need to pull my registration card out of the center console that I'll get a bullet in the back of my head because I could also be going for a gun since, gee, I might just be the next Ted farking Bundy?

So, in summation, your letter was bad and you should feel bad.

/ I don't fear the bullet in the back of the head
// I don't have to, I'm white
 
2014-08-20 09:41:25 AM  

Giltric: enry: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.

No. You are seeing what you want to see.

What is the reason for the clerk to come around the counter to try and lock the door to prevent MB from leaving the store?

He wanted to make sure MB received his change?

Was MB insisting on the clerk keeping his change? Is that why he put hands on the clerk and then tried intimidating him with his size?

What was the reason for Dorian Johnson to admit MB stole the cigars?

Ive seen some pretty stupid truthers in my time, but the he didnt rob the store truthers really take the cake.


Meh. Your attempt to change the narrative is noted.

Now, back to the unarmed man being killed by the police. You know, the thing that caused the unrest.
 
2014-08-20 09:41:31 AM  
I saw that letter already.. it's not helping.
 
2014-08-20 09:42:03 AM  

enry: dittybopper: enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him".  That's the justification now?

Actually, it always has been.  It's called "disparity of force".

For your edification:
http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/16/massad-ayoob-fist-vs-gun-disparity -o f-force-and-the-law/

Disparity of force was a key element here. It means when an ostensibly unarmed man is so likely to kill or cripple you, his physical advantage becomes the equivalent of a deadly weapon, and warrants your recourse to a gun or knife or whatever in self-defense.

You're digging too?  Well you two have fun together with that.

/citing the Daily Caller?  Nice touch.


He's right.

It was cited in my case against the armed guy who attacked me at a club.

I was between him and the exit, and I'm a 6' 3" 300lb hoss .. so... Not guilty. He was afraid of me and ergo justified in using whatever force he deemed needed.

/Crazy ass world we live in
 
2014-08-20 09:42:19 AM  
I am glad this has been going on long enough that it has provided everyone with enough details so they can twist them to fit their own agenda.

- MSM liberal bias
- All cops are evil
- What about the nth shooting in Chicago this weekend?
- It was/wasnt armed robbery
- Where is Obama?
- Why is Obama talking about this?
- Stupid protesters "shiatting where they eat"
- All the violent protesters are from out of state

Lost lost lost in the details.
 
2014-08-20 09:42:20 AM  

Erebus1954: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Give the gentle giant a break. Who among us hasn't strong armed a small Pakistani man for a handful of cheap cigars?


Nobody in this case, anyway. Watch the whole video, not just the police-edited one.
 
2014-08-20 09:42:39 AM  

enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?


I'm pretty sure if you grab a guy half your size and shove him that's assault.  Doesn't help when he's half your size, far older, and then you double back to march at him and exert your dominance.  Let's not pretend the assault didn't happen.
 
2014-08-20 09:42:41 AM  

doglover: enry: But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No.

Any crime that sends you to prison is the same to the criminal. So What he's say makes a lot of sense and the situations are analogous, even if the crimes are not. But why he brings up the point is because he's calling BS on the story.

Also, this 18 year old was bigger than me. Meanwhile, I don't know Ted Bundy's stats off hand, but he looked like I could take him in the photos I've seen.


John Wayne Gacy could kick your ass. So could Timothy McVeigh. Maybe Eric Rudolph too. Interesting how those mass murderers were apprehended alive while a black kid who allegedly stole some cigars was shot and killed in the street.
 
2014-08-20 09:42:42 AM  
I'm very confused, because the examples he provides to demonstrate how scary mindset can be all begin with the officer not knowing the person's mindset and end with the person safely in custody.

I think he might have better served his point by selecting examples where the officer did not know the person's mindset and ended up dead in a ditch or run over or decapitated with his own service revolver.
 
2014-08-20 09:43:17 AM  
Hoodies for Trayvon!
 
2014-08-20 09:43:39 AM  

doglover: enry: "I couldn't take him, so I shot him". That's the justification now?

No, that's BULLshiat. That's the whole point behind the riots that have been going on for far too long now.

How 'bout you get a hot dog and catch up already?


Maybe calling the protests 'the riots' isn't exactly an accurate term.  Do you think it is?
 
2014-08-20 09:43:59 AM  
Sounds like this guy has some scores he wants to settle with his former employer.

Timothy McVeigh? fark you
 
2014-08-20 09:44:27 AM  

Elegy: enry: Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.

[i.imgur.com image 700x372]


The cigars weren't stolen.  Ferguson PD selectively edited the video.
 
2014-08-20 09:45:01 AM  
The chief called Captain Johnson's notion that criminal events, known to the suspect but not to the responding officer, "Bull---t".

Watch the actual interview with the Ferguson police chief where this comes out.  My read of the interview is that the situation is a bit more nuanced than "Wilson had no idea about the robbery and that Brown wasn't a suspect"

He says (around 2:45), when as asked about whether the officer knew Brown was a suspect: "I can only go up to a certain point and then its unreleased information in the investigation and that certain point is the initial contact between the officer and Mr Brown was not related to the robbery"

Chief Delmore accused Captain Johnson of "play[ing] to the cameras" and becoming a "media darling

Not from the interviews I've seen.  Watch the interview above, hes losing a pound a minute from flop sweat.
 
2014-08-20 09:45:08 AM  
I was expecting a critique on his poor control over the community due to overbearing police work.

Instead, I read a racist tirade criticizing Johnson for not condemning Mike Brown based on partial evidence. It was almost farcical by the end. And, more importantly, NOT Johnson's problem, since he is assigned to calm the community, not investigate the shooting.
 
2014-08-20 09:45:43 AM  

sleeps in trees: Alphax: I saw that letter already.. it's not helping.

THIS.

Don't they have a handler or something.  Maybe a parent or friend that just says shut the fark up already this isn't doing you any good?


To be fair, who would have expected somebody in Alabama to be literate?
 
2014-08-20 09:45:49 AM  
I like the cut of the chief's jib.

Michael Brown was (more than likely) pretty sure he was about to go down for a box of Swisher Sweet's. And he acted accordingly, meaning he wasn't gonna let that happen. He took Wilson by complete surprise, who wasn't thinking he was looking at a robbery suspect.

Like the chief says, it is all about mindset.

Bare in mind - I have no idea Brown deserved 6 shots, including 2 to the head. I'm thinking that the LEO was pushed back into his car and that a struggle ensued. Now you gotta consider his mindset too.
 
2014-08-20 09:45:59 AM  

Giltric: Ive seen some pretty stupid truthers in my time, but the he didnt rob the store truthers really take the cake.


Why didn't the owner report a robbery or even call police?
 
2014-08-20 09:46:23 AM  

Alphax: I saw that letter already.. it's not helping.


And yet, there's at least one other letter/ editorial:  http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if -you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z6">http://www.was hingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/19/im-a-cop-if -you-dont-want-to-get-hurt-dont-challenge-me/?hpid=z6
 
2014-08-20 09:46:42 AM  

loaba: Michael Brown was (more than likely) pretty sure he was about to go down for a box of Swisher Sweet's. And he acted accordingly, meaning he wasn't gonna let that happen. He took Wilson by complete surprise, who wasn't thinking he was looking at a robbery suspect.


Hol-ee shiat, boys, we got ourselves a goddamn precog here. Somebody ring up Tom Cruise.
 
2014-08-20 09:46:42 AM  

Lana Ebul: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

I'm pretty sure if you grab a guy half your size and shove him that's assault.  Doesn't help when he's half your size, far older, and then you double back to march at him and exert your dominance.  Let's not pretend the assault didn't happen.


Then why didn't he press charges? There was no call about a robbery or an assault.
 
2014-08-20 09:46:47 AM  
I see the day drunks and cop fellaters have this thread under control. Keep up the good work guys!
 
2014-08-20 09:47:12 AM  
Well said and to the governor of MO... Hey asshole, ever heard of the concept of being innocent until proven guilty? Geeze, why even have a trial, let's just toss him in jail now or even better, take him into custody and turn him over to the crowd. Governor... you're nothing but a fricken tard who ought to be runned out of office.
 
2014-08-20 09:47:47 AM  

Giltric: enry: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.

No. You are seeing what you want to see.

What is the reason for the clerk to come around the counter to try and lock the door to prevent MB from leaving the store?

He wanted to make sure MB received his change?

Was MB insisting on the clerk keeping his change? Is that why he put hands on the clerk and then tried intimidating him with his size?

What was the reason for Dorian Johnson to admit MB stole the cigars?

Ive seen some pretty stupid truthers in my time, but the he didnt rob the store truthers really take the cake.


Current events.  You should be up on them.
 
2014-08-20 09:47:55 AM  

loaba: I like the cut of the chief's jib.

Michael Brown was (more than likely) pretty sure he was about to go down for a box of Swisher Sweet's. And he acted accordingly, meaning he wasn't gonna let that happen. He took Wilson by complete surprise, who wasn't thinking he was looking at a robbery suspect.

Like the chief says, it is all about mindset.

Bare in mind - I have no idea Brown deserved 6 shots, including 2 to the head. I'm thinking that the LEO was pushed back into his car and that a struggle ensued. Now you gotta consider his mindset too.


No, he wasn't. He paid for the swisher sweets. It's on video. There was no robbery reported. Quit lying.
 
2014-08-20 09:48:22 AM  

DROxINxTHExWIND: Giltric: enry: doglover: enry: Stealing cigars (assuming they were stolen) is a major crime?

Strong arm robbery is a major crime, even if you don't actually walk away with any money.

Don't believe me, try looking up the penalties for it in your local area. It will probably not mention a dollar amount in defining the infraction.

Given the evidence is showing no crime took place this seems to be a moot point. But still, stealing cigars is as major a crime as a serial murderer or bombing a federal building? No. And yet somehow those criminals were apprehended without being shot in the head.

No. You are seeing what you want to see.

What is the reason for the clerk to come around the counter to try and lock the door to prevent MB from leaving the store?

He wanted to make sure MB received his change?

Was MB insisting on the clerk keeping his change? Is that why he put hands on the clerk and then tried intimidating him with his size?

What was the reason for Dorian Johnson to admit MB stole the cigars?

Ive seen some pretty stupid truthers in my time, but the he didnt rob the store truthers really take the cake.

Meh. Your attempt to change the narrative is noted.


Now, back to the unarmed man being killed by the police. You know, the thing that caused the unrest.

Still waiting in more info on that interaction.

If MB did put hands on the officer he opened himself up to a violent response from the officer and most places would consider that a good shoot.

Unarmed people kill more people every year than people with assault weapons unarmed does not mean nonthreatening.

If MB did not put hands on the officer and it shows that the officer did not sustain injuries then the officer should fry.

Whats so hard to understand about that?

Just because the officer is white doesnt mean I will back him up 100% of the time. We do not have solidarity with eachother.
 
2014-08-20 09:48:39 AM  

enry: The cigars weren't stolen. Ferguson PD selectively edited the video.


Yes they were.

You can watch the entire surveillance video here.

You may also watch the interview with Dorian Johnsons attorney where he comes right out and says they stole the merchandise
 
2014-08-20 09:48:53 AM  
A white police chief from as southern Alabama as you can get dresses down a black police officer in public. Color me shocked.
 
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