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(NBC News)   St. Louis City Police Chief Sam Dotson sadly gives a lesson in how to handle an officer involved shooting with a direct detailed account of another shooting   (nbcnews.com) divider line 582
    More: Scary  
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12409 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Aug 2014 at 9:16 PM (45 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-08-19 10:02:46 PM  

jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

What the f*ck is wrong with these cops? Is there an interest on the part of some cops to CREATE a riot? Are they completely stupid, or should we be investigating a conspiracy?


I am going to have to disagree. This guy wanted to die, and got his wish.
 
2014-08-19 10:02:53 PM  

Yogimus: http://mjm.luckygunner.com/2010/09/14/interview-with-jurors-at-your-m u rder-trial-after-they-convict-you/comment-page-1/

Just a knife.

Slightly graphic, but if you can take a knife (like a boss) you should be fine.


/thank you for your post, this shows that 1. you dont let a crazed asshole like this within 20 feet of you, shooting him in the leg, using a taser, or mace, or even more stupid, a nightstick is pure retardation.  You shoot the prick.   Knives can do much more damage and you can die much quicker from blood loss and shock.  i would rather take a round than get slashed with a knife.
 
2014-08-19 10:03:18 PM  

Yogimus: Slightly graphic.


i.imgur.com

i.imgur.com
 
2014-08-19 10:03:40 PM  

HeathenHealer: Wouldn't the best possible outcome of this and the Michael Brown situation to be that the cops were totally justified in their actions? That they did their jobs correctly and used good judgement, their lethal force was justified?

It's crazy that there are people who seem to be passionately hoping for the exact opposite and would almost never accept, despite any facts presented to them, that maybe these cops did the right thing.

And I say that knowing full well that there are horrible, a-hole, badge wearing muthafarkers out there who have no business doing the job. I've met a few in my days.


I said this to a co-worker the other day.  If the Brown shooting was found 100% justified would then all the Fergason cops get found guilty for over reaching since then.
 
2014-08-19 10:03:44 PM  

NickelP: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

I got shot at for cutting in line in front of a cop at McDonalds this morning, then when I complained the departments military handyman down TANK raped my cat.  This shiat is just getting ridiculous.

Lets do this thing buddy. Do you have a catchy chant we can use?  We will both go scream it out the window for 5 minutes and then we will see real change.


Robotussin is a helluva drug.
 
2014-08-19 10:04:13 PM  
Hah, CNN giving a live shot right now, and the guy is trying to say how it is peaceful, and the guy literally right behind him is holding a molotov cocktail.
 
2014-08-19 10:05:16 PM  
Typical response. Kill because they fear they might get a boo-boo from a kid. The job actually isn't very dangerous but they get this "us versus them" mentality that makes it easy to put "others" (aka civilians) down.
 
2014-08-19 10:06:15 PM  
I have played Double Dragon enough to know the cops really only needed to do a jump kick on the suspect. Such an attack is enough to cause said suspect to drop his weapon...the officer will land in a crouching position, but he will be able to stand before the suspect does and thus be the first to retrieve the weapon.

Just saying...
 
2014-08-19 10:06:16 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless

Yeah, how do people train for combat?  Gee I guess no Marine has ever learned to kill with his hands.  No martial artist in history has ever been capable of taking a blade from a punk.


Nobody gets mad when a marine kills somebody
 
2014-08-19 10:06:41 PM  

Elegy: Yogimus: Slightly graphic.

[i.imgur.com image 750x360]

[i.imgur.com image 750x487]


No, really. That is slightly graphic. Only slightly. Try being a 1st responder to a knife attack, and you will see significantly less "slightly".  (did you know cheeks are orange on the inside?)

Pull a knife, you get shot. Fail to drop the knife on your way down? fark you, I am not approaching you for 1st aid. Good luck, hope you make it, and if not, hope you're insured.
 
2014-08-19 10:06:52 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless

Yeah, how do people train for combat?  Gee I guess no Marine has ever learned to kill with his hands.  No martial artist in history has ever been capable of taking a blade from a punk.


1.) Marines have significantly more MA training than police, and 2.) a Marine is only going to use hand to hand when he is out of ammo, can't get anymore, or you are way too close, and 3.) the Marine's training is for lethal use of martial arts. Your comparison is bullshiat.
 
2014-08-19 10:07:04 PM  

moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: Sadly there is no money left in their budget for tasers. Those tanks, cool camo, body armor, and endless supply of tear gas/smoke grenades are not cheap. Besides who signs up to use non lethal force when you got this cool gun?

Yeah I remember everyone farking loved it when cops started being armed with tasers. We watched that shiat on youtube and laughed and laughed. "Don't tase me bro." No one got upset about that shiat at all. We didn't freak out even a little when some kid with a heart condition bit it.

And now everyone loves tasers. Is the desire to biatch online or just to eliminate every police force? Seriously, what the fark is the gun for? If you wanna question one farking thing, fark the farking tanks. No one's been killed with a tank or a tear gas grenade yet. You wanna get mad about something? Get mad at the thing that actually kills people, the thing that every cop on duty wears. I'm sure you'll probably get pissed at the patrol car before you even think of questioning that every farking beat cop has a gun.

great speech but only one problem. Police in the rest of the country are trained on matching appropriate force with force with most never having to fire a weapon one time on duty in their careers. You have nightsticks, pepper spray, mace, flash grenades, rubber bullets, bean bags, LRAD, extensive hand to hand training to disarm a knife, or wait for it...talking down the situation using all four years of the criminal justice degree you earned. The rest of the police across the country somehow are able to do this and excel at their job protecting the country.

Hahahahaha you think this is an isolated incident? This is just the newest one you heard about. I'm sorry I couldn't get you to be a better advocate. I could really give a shiat that cops wear guns and occasionally use them.


Maybe not isolated but definitely rare and unusual. Most people will put the knife down when cops draw their guns.

Does anyone really think that most cops are ninjaing knives out of people's hands on a daily basis?
 
2014-08-19 10:07:40 PM  

PanicMan: Litterbox: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

What the f*ck is wrong with these cops? Is there an interest on the part of some cops to CREATE a riot? Are they completely stupid, or should we be investigating a conspiracy.

Wielding a knife is deadly force.  Tasers are not used when the officer is facing deadly force.  Thats when the gun comes out.  Didn't they cover that on "CSI" or whatever cop show you were watching?

On Cops I saw them take down a guy with a samurai sword with an aluminum ladder.  They used it to pin him against the wall and then walk up and take his shiat.

Not saying that would work here, but sometimes you don't need to shoot people, even when they're armed.


Cops don't usually carry ladders.


If someone comes at me with a knife, I am shooting.


In self defense and police training, we were taught that a guy with a knife is far more dangerous than a guy with a gun.


Knives create far more dangerous wounds than guns do. Also a far slower and horrible death.

Tasers were not meant to replace guns, they were meant to replace clubs.
 
2014-08-19 10:07:51 PM  

WhyKnot: I have played Double Dragon enough to know the cops really only needed to do a jump kick on the suspect. Such an attack is enough to cause said suspect to drop his weapon...the officer will land in a crouching position, but he will be able to stand before the suspect does and thus be the first to retrieve the weapon.

Just saying...


That kind of tactic is uncalled for. Society did not give the protesters the advantage of the "B" button, let alone the Nintendo Max pad that the cops received from the US Government.
 
ecl
2014-08-19 10:07:53 PM  
I didn't think anyone would show up the last couple nights.  Maybe tonight will be different?
 
2014-08-19 10:08:14 PM  
Marches on the KARG livestream now.
 
2014-08-19 10:08:36 PM  

mediablitz: ginandbacon: Jaysus.

It has to be every good cop's nightmare to have an encounter like this. Poor everybody involved.

30 or so cops. Tazers and mace. NO OTHER OPTION but to shoot to kill a man with a KNIFE. And nothing but apologists.

This is what America has become and why other countries look at us like we are crazy.


/yes, how dare they defend their lives from a crazed asshole charging at them with a knife.  What were they thinking? They should have totally just wrestled around with him and let him carve them up.
 
2014-08-19 10:08:48 PM  

LoneWolf343: Smeggy Smurf: moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless

Yeah, how do people train for combat?  Gee I guess no Marine has ever learned to kill with his hands.  No martial artist in history has ever been capable of taking a blade from a punk.

1.) Marines have significantly more MA training than police, and 2.) a Marine is only going to use hand to hand when he is out of ammo, can't get anymore, or you are way too close, and 3.) the Marine's training is for lethal use of martial arts. Your comparison is bullshiat.


Oh, and the big thing worthy of note, even with all of their expert training, Marines still manage to get killed anyway!
 
2014-08-19 10:08:55 PM  

mediablitz: ginandbacon: Jaysus.

It has to be every good cop's nightmare to have an encounter like this. Poor everybody involved.

30 or so cops. Tazers and mace. NO OTHER OPTION but to shoot to kill a man with a KNIFE. And nothing but apologists.

This is what America has become and why other countries look at us like we are crazy.


For values of 30 equal to 2. 2 cops on the scene.  From available information, they first engaged without weapons drawn despite the fact that they suspect was identified as brandishing a knife. He wanted them to shoot him. It's sad as he's pretty clearly mentally-ill but they had no way of knowing ahead of time that he was going to force their hand. And they have no way of knowing, if they simply retreated back into their squad car, would he force the situation by attacking somebody on the street. He put them in a no-win situation.

\Kobayashi Maru
 
2014-08-19 10:09:19 PM  

Yogimus: http://mjm.luckygunner.com/2010/09/14/interview-with-jurors-at-your-m u rder-trial-after-they-convict-you/comment-page-1/

Just a knife.

Slightly graphic, but if you can take a knife (like a boss) you should be fine.


Holy fark. That just shows in the right hands you can bring a knife to a gun fight.
 
2014-08-19 10:10:15 PM  

AngryDragon: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

WTF?  The guy charge a cop armed with a knife.  Is there any question that lethal force was justified?  Are you people really so disconnected from reality?


Some of the dumbest people on the internet are on fark.
 
2014-08-19 10:11:07 PM  

dstrick44: What happened to tasers? Do they only use those on handcuffed autistic children? A wacko with a knife is the reason tasers were invented.
Or so we were told.


The same folks who whine about cops using guns on perps...are the same ones who also complain when cops use tasers on perps

Folks also have died being tased, so the liability with tasers is nearly as bad as a gun
 
2014-08-19 10:11:13 PM  
Unfortunately, it could very well have been justified in this case, and I can't exactly blame the St. Louis cops (who it should be noted have not been involved in anything regarding Ferguson so far, as St. Louis City and St. Louis County are two distinctly different locations). A less-than-lethal alternative may have been possible, but I could buy there not being one. At the very least, they had an obviously different situation than in Ferguson.

But holy crap, the optics of it are just awful and I think they know it.
 
2014-08-19 10:11:17 PM  
That knife was a small one, a 2 inch blade if I recall correctly.
 
2014-08-19 10:11:24 PM  

Ctrl-Alt-Del: Delay: If I were the cops I would set up a containment perimeter, call for immediate reinforcement, sit in the car and begin writing my report. So what if the delusional suspect steps away? How far can a delusional person go in 5 minutes that killing him is the best police response?

I dunno - seems like he only has to go down one or two houses to find an innocent bystander to kill. But yeah, cops should just wait it out in the car. That lady two doors down is a biatch anyway


Why would he do that? All his actions targeted the police. And, anyway, if that lady two doors down were blah, wouldn't she deserve to be killed?
 
2014-08-19 10:12:06 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless

Yeah, how do people train for combat?  Gee I guess no Marine has ever learned to kill with his hands.  No martial artist in history has ever been capable of taking a blade from a punk.


Weren't you complaining about he over militization of the police? Now you are going to say they were 'marine' enough.

Oh, okay.
 
2014-08-19 10:12:11 PM  

FloridaFarkTag: Folks also have died being tased, so the liability with tasers is nearly as bad as a gun


This is a lie.
 
2014-08-19 10:12:34 PM  
FTA: The chief said that the officers repeatedly ordered the 23-year-old man to drop the knife and drew their weapons after he refused. The chief said the man told the police: "Shoot me now. Kill me now."

i1182.photobucket.com
 
2014-08-19 10:12:56 PM  

moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: Sadly there is no money left in their budget for tasers. Those tanks, cool camo, body armor, and endless supply of tear gas/smoke grenades are not cheap. Besides who signs up to use non lethal force when you got this cool gun?

Yeah I remember everyone farking loved it when cops started being armed with tasers. We watched that shiat on youtube and laughed and laughed. "Don't tase me bro." No one got upset about that shiat at all. We didn't freak out even a little when some kid with a heart condition bit it.

And now everyone loves tasers. Is the desire to biatch online or just to eliminate every police force? Seriously, what the fark is the gun for? If you wanna question one farking thing, fark the farking tanks. No one's been killed with a tank or a tear gas grenade yet. You wanna get mad about something? Get mad at the thing that actually kills people, the thing that every cop on duty wears. I'm sure you'll probably get pissed at the patrol car before you even think of questioning that every farking beat cop has a gun.

great speech but only one problem. Police in the rest of the country are trained on matching appropriate force with force with most never having to fire a weapon one time on duty in their careers. You have nightsticks, pepper spray, mace, flash grenades, rubber bullets, bean bags, LRAD, extensive hand to hand training to disarm a knife, or wait for it...talking down the situation using all four years of the criminal justice degree you earned. The rest of the police across the country somehow are able to do this and excel at their job protecting the country.

Hahahahaha you think this is an isolated incident? This is just the newest one you heard about. I'm sorry I couldn't get you to be a better advocate. I could really give a shiat that cops wear guns and occasionally use them.


No these occurrences happen all day but yet not all of them result in police shooting them. Mental illness or on drugs calls don't all end in police shootings. I come from a family of cops (grandfather, great grandfather, mom, brother, uncles, and cousins) so I hear about these types of calls but oddly they don't all end in shooting but protecting them from themselves and getting the help they need.
 
2014-08-19 10:13:26 PM  
of course the obvious option of putting a car between the officers and the perp - or even backing away refusing to be agents of suicide until a third party could tase him..

well lets just say the whole donut-meme got a big boost out of this. I understand being charged by a guy with a knife - i really do - but the way the cops tell it, they had lots of time to figure out something just by getting in their cop car and locking the door. Kid was obviously mentally distressed and the cops did exactly what the guy wanted.

I dont call that winning, no matter their reasons.. i would have been very impressed to hear our boys in blue had gloves to go with their body armor (or does that just make too much sense?)
 
2014-08-19 10:13:53 PM  

Yogimus: That knife was a small one, a 2 inch blade if I recall correctly.


Jesus, you're not secretly Chuck Palahniuk, are you? Your posts are like reading one of his novels.
 
2014-08-19 10:14:07 PM  

Yogimus: FloridaFarkTag: Folks also have died being tased, so the liability with tasers is nearly as bad as a gun

This is a lie.


Tasers can and do kill. Just because their risk of lethality is lower does not make them non-lethal in every case.
 
2014-08-19 10:14:30 PM  
I was skeptical at the beginning but now I'm certain of it. Charles Manson is the maestro of this entire operation.
 
2014-08-19 10:14:51 PM  

Private_Citizen: Transparency goes a long way to helping calm things down.

I would love it if they treated police like pilots. Oh, you had a lethal use of force incident? First things first, lets run a full toxicology on you to make sure you weren't policing while impaired. Then, let's have an outside, impartial body investigate the incident (having your force investigate you is like American Air investigating an American Air crash). And finally, issue an open report that explains what went wrong, and if any improvements can be made (FAA/NTSB style).

Transparency and accountability. Not much to ask from people who are entrusted with lethal weapons by the state.

/All indications are this was justified, but an open report could help confirm it.


Wow??? Is someone sounding sensible? ...you must leave fark, NOW!.... BUT SAY SOMETHING MYSOGINISTIC FIRST!!!!
 
2014-08-19 10:15:04 PM  

NickelP: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

I got shot at for cutting in line in front of a cop at McDonalds this morning, then when I complained the departments military handyman down TANK raped my cat.  This shiat is just getting ridiculous.

Lets do this thing buddy. Do you have a catchy chant we can use?  We will both go scream it out the window for 5 minutes and then we will see real change.


thelifeofjwo.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-08-19 10:15:54 PM  

sobriquet by any other name: of course the obvious option of putting a car between the officers and the perp - or even backing away refusing to be agents of suicide until a third party could tase him..

well lets just say the whole donut-meme got a big boost out of this. I understand being charged by a guy with a knife - i really do - but the way the cops tell it, they had lots of time to figure out something just by getting in their cop car and locking the door. Kid was obviously mentally distressed and the cops did exactly what the guy wanted.

I dont call that winning, no matter their reasons.. i would have been very impressed to hear our boys in blue had gloves to go with their body armor (or does that just make too much sense?)


no, the obvious solution is to send him away with more holes than he came with. You are considering out of the box solutions.  Ask yourself this: What did society LOSE by the removal of this particular bag of crazy? What did it gain?


/Who gets to choose?
//The guy you threatened to knife. He gets to choose.
///His decision is final in this matter.
 
2014-08-19 10:16:40 PM  

Yogimus: No, really. That is slightly graphic. Only slightly.


Fark off. And fark your argument. I could give a shiat less about your farking point.

Slightly graphic is grainy surveillance footage of 3 robbers jumping a shop owner in a blur of shiatty frame rate and resolution. Slightly graphic is three people carrying a fight out of frame, and two people coming back in frame. Slighly graphic is a body lying in a street 30 feet away.

Slightly graphic is not well lit medical shots of people farking flayed open from a knife fight.

Tag your farking links appropriately. I don't mind gore per say but I want to know it's its gore before I farking click on it - the same way I don't like clicking links that say "artistic nudes" and getting "the best of bestiality anal prolapse 7."
 
2014-08-19 10:16:57 PM  

Cyclometh: Yogimus: FloridaFarkTag: Folks also have died being tased, so the liability with tasers is nearly as bad as a gun

This is a lie.

Tasers can and do kill. Just because their risk of lethality is lower does not make them non-lethal in every case.


HARDLY makes them nearly as bad as a gun.

THEY ARE JUST LIKE HITLER! level of stupid in that statement.
 
2014-08-19 10:17:19 PM  

LoneWolf343: Smeggy Smurf: moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless

Yeah, how do people train for combat?  Gee I guess no Marine has ever learned to kill with his hands.  No martial artist in history has ever been capable of taking a blade from a punk.

1.) Marines have significantly more MA training than police, and 2.) a Marine is only going to use hand to hand when he is out of ammo, can't get anymore, or you are way too close, and 3.) the Marine's training is for lethal use of martial arts. Your comparison is bullshiat.


MCMAP is also focused mostly on using your weapon as well. Training is using fists are only a last resort measure, and the field manual recommends against it but understands it is a natural instinctual reaction. Elbows and legs are to augment knife or rifle being used as a club/spear.

Very unlikely to catch a Marine without their rifle or their knife, unless they have EASed.

Though Police get some good martial arts experience, at least where I am from. Friend of mine is a Karate Black Belt, and he helps train police classes. Heard some really neat stories from him. Sounds fun playing belligerent suspect. Situations varied from bar brawl to domestic abuse. They were trained to de-escalate or subdue physically. Normally, they didn't have an oppurtunity to reach for a simulated taser or service gun.
 
2014-08-19 10:17:30 PM  

MadeInDetroit: moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: moothemagiccow: MadeInDetroit: Sadly there is no money left in their budget for tasers. Those tanks, cool camo, body armor, and endless supply of tear gas/smoke grenades are not cheap. Besides who signs up to use non lethal force when you got this cool gun?

Yeah I remember everyone farking loved it when cops started being armed with tasers. We watched that shiat on youtube and laughed and laughed. "Don't tase me bro." No one got upset about that shiat at all. We didn't freak out even a little when some kid with a heart condition bit it.

And now everyone loves tasers. Is the desire to biatch online or just to eliminate every police force? Seriously, what the fark is the gun for? If you wanna question one farking thing, fark the farking tanks. No one's been killed with a tank or a tear gas grenade yet. You wanna get mad about something? Get mad at the thing that actually kills people, the thing that every cop on duty wears. I'm sure you'll probably get pissed at the patrol car before you even think of questioning that every farking beat cop has a gun.

great speech but only one problem. Police in the rest of the country are trained on matching appropriate force with force with most never having to fire a weapon one time on duty in their careers. You have nightsticks, pepper spray, mace, flash grenades, rubber bullets, bean bags, LRAD, extensive hand to hand training to disarm a knife, or wait for it...talking down the situation using all four years of the criminal justice degree you earned. The rest of the police across the country somehow are able to do this and excel at their job protecting the country.

Hahahahaha you think this is an isolated incident? This is just the newest one you heard about. I'm sorry I couldn't get you to be a better advocate. I could really give a shiat that cops wear guns and occasionally use them.

No these occurrences happen all day but yet not all of them result in police shooting them. Mental illness or ...


There's nothing special about the STL metro police. They're not any more shooty than any other region's cops, believe it or not. You seriously haven't heard of "suicide by cop?"
 
2014-08-19 10:17:38 PM  

uncle soondead: I said this to a co-worker the other day.  If the Brown shooting was found 100% justified would then all the Fergason cops get found guilty for over reaching since then.


Well you tell me. Compare this guys press conference with how Ferguson PD handled the situation. You don't see Dotson pulling a "bring it on" sort of mentality here, do you? We still don't even have an official accounting of what the police say happened when Wilson shot Brown. If this rumor mill account of an charge back into gunfire was the story day 1, why has it been withheld? Beyond a desire to generate lots and lots of overtime.
 
2014-08-19 10:17:40 PM  
They didn't even need tasers in this case. Just back off and stop trying to project their authoritah like the trained monkeys that they are.
 
2014-08-19 10:18:21 PM  

vodka: They didn't even need tasers in this case. Just back off and stop trying to project their authoritah like the trained monkeys that they are.


here that everyone, from now on, if you question a cop, they have to lock themselves in their car until you go away.
 
2014-08-19 10:18:36 PM  

moothemagiccow: Smeggy Smurf: El_Perro: jasonvatch: cretinbob: jasonvatch: Don't they have tasers?

I don't know about there, but here, generally no. You'll have one officer/deputy who carries one and the rest just have regular sidearms

Nightsticks? Flashlights?

I admit that I wouldn't want to take on a knife-wielding idiot with a nightstick. But two cops? I suspect they received some training in the past - and the baton has enough reach and mass to break the arm holding the knife.

We use drones to kill 'suspects' in other countries. 'Lethal response' seems to be OK here, since nobody biatched when we did it there.

The next red light you run could be a death sentence.

If you are close enough to "break the arm holding the knife," the guy holding the knife is close enough to kill you  with the knife.

Are you aware there are these things called instructors that can teach you how to disarm somebody?  If not, please refer to your nearest source of internet, go to the Google search engine and in the little box for searching input the words "Krav Maga".  Click on the links, read the information, watch the videos and then return to this thread with an informed opinion.  Otherwise you will lack the necessary words to at least appear slightly more than a moron.

/This message brought to you by the council to mock and ridicule the silly

Do the instructors train on real crackheads with real knives? Otherwise it's farking useless


Crackheads never follow the script.
 
2014-08-19 10:18:42 PM  

Elegy: Yogimus: No, really. That is slightly graphic. Only slightly.

Fark off. And fark your argument. I could give a shiat less about your farking point.

Slightly graphic is grainy surveillance footage of 3 robbers jumping a shop owner in a blur of shiatty frame rate and resolution. Slightly graphic is three people carrying a fight out of frame, and two people coming back in frame. Slighly graphic is a body lying in a street 30 feet away.

Slightly graphic is not well lit medical shots of people farking flayed open from a knife fight.

Tag your farking links appropriately. I don't mind gore per say but I want to know it's its gore before I farking click on it - the same way I don't like clicking links that say "artistic nudes" and getting "the best of bestiality anal prolapse 7."


Seriously... that is only slightly graphic. Want me to post some real shiat? I would prefer not to. Not much need to see what happens during puncture wounds, or when intestines vacate through un-natural holes. You're a big boy. control your mouse.
 
2014-08-19 10:20:17 PM  

Yogimus: HARDLY makes them nearly as bad as a gun.

THEY ARE JUST LIKE HITLER! level of stupid in that statement.


Jesus Christ, settle down, Francis. You're gonna give yourself a coronary.

Yes, they are nearly as bad as a gun, because they're still a deadly weapon and should not be used unless it's really necessary because there's no good reason to risk someone's life just because a cop needs a midol.
 
2014-08-19 10:20:21 PM  

Delay: Ctrl-Alt-Del: Delay: If I were the cops I would set up a containment perimeter, call for immediate reinforcement, sit in the car and begin writing my report. So what if the delusional suspect steps away? How far can a delusional person go in 5 minutes that killing him is the best police response?

I dunno - seems like he only has to go down one or two houses to find an innocent bystander to kill. But yeah, cops should just wait it out in the car. That lady two doors down is a biatch anyway

Why would he do that? All his actions targeted the police.


Because a delusional person would never mistake Ms. Finch in 13B with a CIA agent broadcasting painwaves into his skull. All his actions up to that point  targeted the police, so it's clear he would do nothing but target the police from that point forward, because if there's one thing we know about delusional people, they are extremely  predictable
 
2014-08-19 10:20:36 PM  

Elegy: Yogimus: No, really. That is slightly graphic. Only slightly.

Fark off. And fark your argument. I could give a shiat less about your farking point.

Slightly graphic is grainy surveillance footage of 3 robbers jumping a shop owner in a blur of shiatty frame rate and resolution. Slightly graphic is three people carrying a fight out of frame, and two people coming back in frame. Slighly graphic is a body lying in a street 30 feet away.

Slightly graphic is not well lit medical shots of people farking flayed open from a knife fight.

Tag your farking links appropriately. I don't mind gore per say but I want to know it's its gore before I farking click on it - the same way I don't like clicking links that say "artistic nudes" and getting "the best of bestiality anal prolapse 7."


Everyone in this thread who acts like a knife isn't a big deal should take a long hard look at those picture.

If you are lucky/unlucky enough to survive a knife fight, thats usually how you end up looking.

It definately is not fun helping to hold a guys guts in on the way to the hospital.
 
2014-08-19 10:21:06 PM  
So I don't have a good frame of reference yet tonight.  Where is KARG in relation to yesterday, and where are the police?
 
2014-08-19 10:21:09 PM  

Elegy: "the best of bestiality anal prolapse 7."


Do you have a link for that?
 
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