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(Washington Post)   Predictably, since Cannabis legalization, Colorado highway fatalities have soared. Wait...what? They haven't and are near historic lows? I just don't which propaganja to believe anymore   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 92
    More: Interesting, Colorado, colorado law, recreational drugs, legalization, legalization of marijuana, highway fatalities  
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5384 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Aug 2014 at 11:13 PM (20 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-08-07 07:49:37 PM  
"I just don't which propaganja to believe anymore"

???

don't which what, subby?
 
2014-08-07 07:56:35 PM  
 
2014-08-07 08:24:24 PM  
Here's the text of an e-mail I sent recently to an author of one of these "studies":

I have some questions about the recent study on marijuana and auto accidents.

1) The linked article emphasizes the proportion of drivers who are impaired. Has the actual number of accidents changed?

2) How is impairment measured? Some states, including Colorado, use a scientifically dubious standard of 5 nanograms of THC per milliliter of blood as the legal limit. (This is roughly 30 micrograms per person; an effective dose of THC is about 30 milligrams.) How does the implementation of this law correlate to the increased proportion of accidents involving marijuana?

3) Has the number of drivers who were actually at fault in accidents increased?

Thank you for your time.

===

Here's her reply:

Thank you for your interest in our article, Trends in fatal motor vehicle crashes before and after marijuana commercialization in Colorado".  All of your questions can be answered in the full-text version of the manuscript, which is available online at http://www.journals.elsevier.com/drug-and-alcohol-dependence/.  If you have any questions after reading the manuscript, then please let me know.


===

If you follow the link, it's an abstract hiding the actual paper behind a paywall.
 
2014-08-07 08:47:18 PM  
These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.
 
2014-08-07 09:06:25 PM  
People can't find their car keys.
 
2014-08-07 09:38:36 PM  
Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...
 
2014-08-07 09:51:01 PM  

Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...


To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.
 
2014-08-07 10:15:39 PM  
Meanwhile, incidences of drivers waiting for stop signs to turn green have increased 10000%.
 
2014-08-07 10:37:38 PM  
 
2014-08-07 11:19:07 PM  
imgs.xkcd.com
 
2014-08-07 11:19:27 PM  

fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.


You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.
 
2014-08-07 11:20:33 PM  

UNC_Samurai: fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.

You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.


And a radioman.
 
2014-08-07 11:22:01 PM  
There was astudy done before the internet Where they had people drive a closed corse, then drive it high and then drunk. bThey found that when high, people drove better than "normal"
 
2014-08-07 11:22:33 PM  

Mugato: People can't find their car keys.


Pffft... No motivation to get off the couch.
 
2014-08-07 11:22:59 PM  

Bondith: UNC_Samurai: fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.

You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.

And a radioman.


With today's computer controlled communications the commander can handle that.
 
2014-08-07 11:27:34 PM  

Lsherm: These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.


Yeah, but regardless of all that, the fatalities aren't going UP are they?  No cats and dogs living together.  No mass hysteria.

Well, maybe some mass hysteria, but that's not pot's fault.
 
2014-08-07 11:28:24 PM  

fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.


i296.photobucket.com

"Slow down, I'll just shoot Hitler out the window."
 
2014-08-07 11:28:27 PM  
img.fark.net
"Interstate 25 was the scene of a freak accident today as six freaks in a camper crashed into three freaks in a van."
 
2014-08-07 11:30:10 PM  
drugged divers? like Greg Louganis?
 
2014-08-07 11:31:45 PM  
People who get drunk think they are invincible.  People who smoke pot tend to get paranoid or giggly.  Either way, the pot smoker usually remembers that driving high is a bad idea.  The drunk decides "it's worth the risk" and kill a van full of kids.
 
2014-08-07 11:33:39 PM  

cretinbob: There was astudy done before the internet Where they had people drive a closed corse, then drive it high and then drunk. bThey found that when high, people drove better than "normal"


I always wanted to do that. Get paid to smoke a fat joint and then drop the clutch on whatever crap can hoopty they gave you and try to drift the course.
 
2014-08-07 11:33:53 PM  
MARIHUANA IS THE DEVIL'S WEED. WAKE UP SHEEPLE.
 
2014-08-07 11:36:56 PM  

Bondith: UNC_Samurai: fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.

You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.

And a radioman.


You'll probably want some infantry too. Nothing special. Just a group to throw down some suppressing fire if your aim from a moving vehicle needs some improvement (and let's face it, whose doesn't?).

Depending on the punk-ass suckas you're rolling up on, you shouldn't need more than five or six.
 
2014-08-07 11:39:35 PM  

UNC_Samurai: fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.

You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.


Like the A Team?
 
2014-08-07 11:41:14 PM  

cretinbob: There was astudy done before the internet Where they had people drive a closed corse, then drive it high and then drunk. bThey found that when high, people drove better than "normal"


Funny because I seen a police video (one of those 1990s police videos where the Sgt has a mullet) - anyhow the 6 detectives were all given a mixture of Beers/Liquor and marijuana. It had to be some kind of educational video; I don't know - anyhow each test was done in a controlled environment.
One officer would drink 6 beers in the course of.... few hours; then take the driving course; next one at Noon would drink a few shots of liquor and try the driving test; last was an officer on Marijuana. They redid the test with all the officers switching; one that drink liquor now smokes pot; blah blah.

From what it shown in the end; NONE of the drivers were doing 100% well; hell the toker was more busy laughing and not even attempting to park his car; which he hit a cone - not saying he didn't fail; the liquored up cop actually did alright, the beer drinker (being he got noon time on the 2nd test) really crushed the test; ended up hitting just about every damn cone.

None of the cops were passing the simple driving test; Parking - avoiding cones; pedestrians - the "Toker" could drive; it looked somewhat normal but he didn't do anything "Better" then the drunk drivers. At the end of the video all 6 officers (after being cleared medically first) All drove the same course sober; and did so in style flying around the course without hitting a cone, etc.

Problem with this test is one of the officers readily admitted he did better drinking drunk because he was a weekly drinker; vs all of them haven't smoked weed before; naturally they probably were high as a kite from one hit.
 
2014-08-07 11:41:31 PM  

UNC_Samurai: fusillade762: Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

To be fair you really shouldn't shoot and drive, either. Get a buddy to do the shooting for you safely from the passenger seat.  A designated shooter, if you will.

You want a four-person crew - a driver, a gunner, a loader, and a commander.


Muscle, looks, brains, and wildcard biatches!
 
2014-08-07 11:41:59 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: People who get drunk think they are invincible.  People who smoke pot tend to get paranoid or giggly.  Either way, the pot smoker usually remembers that driving high is a bad idea.  The drunk decides "it's worth the risk" and kill a van full of kids.


If you're too stoned to drive you have no inclination to drive.  It's really that simple.  Sure, there are some schizos who shouldn't have a cup of coffee let alone a nug of the dankdank that might try, but those people are rare.

Being a little toasty, though, doesn't affect your driving more than a long day of work, and it makes going the speed limit and slowing down for school zones and blind curves a joy.
 
2014-08-07 11:42:27 PM  

Livingroom: Sounds just like anti-gun propeganda...

Unrelated issue to zing the libs -4 credits.

 
2014-08-07 11:44:31 PM  

Misconduc: cretinbob: There was astudy done before the internet Where they had people drive a closed corse, then drive it high and then drunk. bThey found that when high, people drove better than "normal"

Funny because I seen a police video (one of those 1990s police videos where the Sgt has a mullet) - anyhow the 6 detectives were all given a mixture of Beers/Liquor and marijuana. It had to be some kind of educational video; I don't know - anyhow each test was done in a controlled environment.
One officer would drink 6 beers in the course of.... few hours; then take the driving course; next one at Noon would drink a few shots of liquor and try the driving test; last was an officer on Marijuana. They redid the test with all the officers switching; one that drink liquor now smokes pot; blah blah.

From what it shown in the end; NONE of the drivers were doing 100% well; hell the toker was more busy laughing and not even attempting to park his car; which he hit a cone - not saying he didn't fail; the liquored up cop actually did alright, the beer drinker (being he got noon time on the 2nd test) really crushed the test; ended up hitting just about every damn cone.

None of the cops were passing the simple driving test; Parking - avoiding cones; pedestrians - the "Toker" could drive; it looked somewhat normal but he didn't do anything "Better" then the drunk drivers. At the end of the video all 6 officers (after being cleared medically first) All drove the same course sober; and did so in style flying around the course without hitting a cone, etc.

Problem with this test is one of the officers readily admitted he did better drinking drunk because he was a weekly drinker; vs all of them haven't smoked weed before; naturally they probably were high as a kite from one hit.


Amateurs.
www.league-links.com
 
2014-08-07 11:47:12 PM  

Lsherm: These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.


If only the author included statements like this in the article: "Of course, the continuing drop in roadway fatalities, in Colorado and elsewhere, is due to a variety of factors, such as better-built cars and trucks, improved safety features and better road engineering. These figures in and of themselves only indicate that the roads are getting safer; they don't suggest that pot had anything to do with it."
 
2014-08-07 11:51:21 PM  
That was actually the one statistic I was expecting to go up.  Since alcohol fatalities alone are acceptable risks to allowing adults to drink, I wasn't expecting it to be a compelling argument for recriminalization.
 
2014-08-07 11:51:24 PM  
Yeah, I don't think the person to whom you are responding actually read the whole article.
 
2014-08-07 11:53:13 PM  

cepson: Lsherm: These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.

If only the author included statements like this in the article: "Of course, the continuing drop in roadway fatalities, in Colorado and elsewhere, is due to a variety of factors, such as better-built cars and trucks, improved safety features and better road engineering. These figures in and of themselves only indicate that the roads are getting safer; they don't suggest that pot had anything to do with it."


let's try this again...

Yeah, I don't think the person to whom you are responding actually read the whole article.
 
2014-08-08 12:02:49 AM  
Fatalities, people. It's hard to die when you are going 5mph and have the safety assistance of a seven-layer burrito to minimize the ease of the gas burns from your airbag.

I also don't know anyone who gets really stoned and drives while talking/texting on the phone. Marijuana puts just enough paranoia in people to pay VERY close attention, so they don't get pulled over.

I guess the war on drugs is over...
 
2014-08-08 12:08:13 AM  

The Angry Hand of God: Fatalities, people. It's hard to die when you are going 5mph and have the safety assistance of a seven-layer burrito to minimize the ease of the gas burns from your airbag.

I also don't know anyone who gets really stoned and drives while talking/texting on the phone. Marijuana puts just enough paranoia in people to pay VERY close attention, so they don't get pulled over.

I guess the war on drugs is over...


Let me take you to the Checkers in my town from between 1am to 4am.  Every stoned person in town is there.  The drunks hit the Waffle Houses and Dennys.
 
2014-08-08 12:13:36 AM  
I agree with the poster above: the drunk will decide he really needs that 6-pack to tie off the night, so he goes out and kills a van-load of people.  Toker will figure out he still has a bunch of munchies in the cabinet he didn't open, stay home and keep his high on until he passes out.

/I was the drunk in the above example, minus the killing a van-load of people
 
2014-08-08 12:16:18 AM  
Sounds a lot like folks who claim homicides will soar upon legalization of open carry or concealed carry, etc.
 
2014-08-08 12:28:25 AM  
I thought it was that stoners got stoned at home. If you eliminated bars there'd be fewer drunk drivers because everyone would be drinking at home.
 
2014-08-08 12:30:03 AM  

shanrick: don't you try to equate liquor to marajuana, Mister, not with me.


About all I got out of that is "LSD is the bomb".

/actually was kinda surprised that the "gateway drug" theory apparently reached that far back.....
 
2014-08-08 12:32:11 AM  
www.kingsroadmerch.com
 
2014-08-08 12:35:24 AM  
Who says? The State? The ones enjoying a boom in tax revenue?

Hahahahaha ...
 
2014-08-08 12:35:46 AM  

TwowheelinTim: cepson: Lsherm: These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.

If only the author included statements like this in the article: "Of course, the continuing drop in roadway fatalities, in Colorado and elsewhere, is due to a variety of factors, such as better-built cars and trucks, improved safety features and better road engineering. These figures in and of themselves only indicate that the roads are getting safer; they don't suggest that pot had anything to do with it."

let's try this again...

Yeah, I don't think the person to whom you are responding actually read the whole article.


Yeah, it's almost like it didn't include this:

It seems to me that the best way to gauge the effect legalization has had on the roadways is to look at what has happened on the roads since legalization took effect. Here's a month-by-month comparison of highway fatalities in Colorado through the first seven months of this year and last year. For a more thorough comparison, I've also included the highest fatality figures for each month since 2002, the lowest for each month since 2002 and the average for each month since 2002.
 
2014-08-08 12:35:59 AM  

wildcardjack: I thought it was that stoners got stoned at home. If you eliminated bars there'd be fewer drunk drivers because everyone would be drinking at home.


I have burned on and off for 30 years.

Most "stoners" I have known over that period of time have one of this in the car.  Which is used on the lunch break, the ride home from work, on the way to the grocery store, and on the way home from the bar.

thediggeronehitter.com

www.water-bongs-glass-pipes.com

i154.photobucket.com
 
2014-08-08 12:39:16 AM  

OOBE Juan Kenobi: Mugato: People can't find their car keys.

Pffft... No motivation to get off the couch.


Someone has got the giggles.
 
2014-08-08 12:41:31 AM  
lol at propa ganja
 
2014-08-08 12:43:03 AM  
oi57.tinypic.com
 
2014-08-08 12:44:46 AM  
I've smoked and drove for 7 years now.  With weed, you either feel like you can, and you're right, or you feel like you can't, and you're right.  Which is very confusing, seeing as how with alcohol, if you feel like you can, you're probably wrong.
 
2014-08-08 12:46:11 AM  
Duh, they're all still sitting behind the wheel in a parking lot with their hand on the keys, zoning out into the great beyond.
 
2014-08-08 12:54:26 AM  

Lsherm: TwowheelinTim: cepson: Lsherm: These are measurements of total traffic fatalities, which have other external factors pushing the numbers down, including ever-increasing safety measures in newer cars and improvements in emergency medical care. These aren't even a comparison of fatalities involving under the influence drivers, nor a comparison of what influence.

Author is a farking idiot.

If only the author included statements like this in the article: "Of course, the continuing drop in roadway fatalities, in Colorado and elsewhere, is due to a variety of factors, such as better-built cars and trucks, improved safety features and better road engineering. These figures in and of themselves only indicate that the roads are getting safer; they don't suggest that pot had anything to do with it."

let's try this again...

Yeah, I don't think the person to whom you are responding actually read the whole article.

Yeah, it's almost like it didn't include this:

It seems to me that the best way to gauge the effect legalization has had on the roadways is to look at what has happened on the roads since legalization took effect. Here's a month-by-month comparison of highway fatalities in Colorado through the first seven months of this year and last year. For a more thorough comparison, I've also included the highest fatality figures for each month since 2002, the lowest for each month since 2002 and the average for each month since 2002.


Yeah, I didn't say he wasn't confusing the issue, but by your comment, it seemed you didn't bother to read the entire article. Feel free to tell me I'm wrong and that you just chose to ignore his disclaimer at the end.
 
2014-08-08 12:58:13 AM  
Yes, traffic fatalities go down when the ice melts in Colorado.

I am all for legal weed, and I voted for it here in Washington state. This might prove that the weed didn't make the fatality rate go up, but mostly this information is pure bullsh*t.
 
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