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(Outside Online)   Man illegally tries to fly camera drone over Yellowstone Park's Grand Prismatic Spring, winds up in hot water   (outsideonline.com) divider line 53
    More: Dumbass  
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7466 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Aug 2014 at 11:44 PM (11 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2014-08-08 12:56:00 AM  
4 votes:

Ow! That was my feelings!: Fiction Fan: Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.

They are a nuisance. You are not the only trying to enjoy the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left. Completely support the ban and it should be extended to all Federally administered wilderness areas as well.


I am with you on banning them over national parks... but here in Arapaho National Forest, there are plenty of good uses for them, from mapping to getting neat shots for backcountry skiing/snowboarding. Though I expect quiet time in the national parks, here in the national forest, where there's hunting, camping, highways, snowboarding, mountain biking, etc, I don't really have the same expectations.
2014-08-08 12:24:38 AM  
4 votes:

Lsherm: Well, I should hope a 1lb plastic toy can't make that much of a difference. That's a fair amount of water and energy and a very small interruption. I'd think a strong rainstorm would have a greater effect on it.


Yes, and throwing out the litter from your trip to McDonald's won't matter either, but if everyone does it then it becomes a problem.

Don't fark with national parks.
2014-08-08 12:12:05 AM  
4 votes:

Fiction Fan: Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.


It would probably become very apparent to you if one were flying over your head and some knucklehead with $500 spare bucks decided that owning a DJI Phantom seemed like a great first 'copter.

Also, the LiPo batteries that power most UAVs ("drones") have a nasty habit of becoming miniature firebombs when they crash.  Just what a place like Yosemite or Yellowstone needs during fire season.  See a small example:  http://youtu.be/RwXpYLHyNf4?t=1m46s
2014-08-08 12:01:40 AM  
4 votes:

Fiction Fan: Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.


They are a nuisance. You are not the only trying to enjoy the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left. Completely support the ban and it should be extended to all Federally administered wilderness areas as well.
2014-08-07 11:47:26 PM  
4 votes:
What an asshole.
2014-08-08 01:09:23 AM  
3 votes:

wildcardjack: IWhat about a balloon + GoPro + string? Box kites? That'll be safe but still allow you to find where the park rangers are growing the pot that makes up for the lousy pay.


Can't grow any pot around Yellowstone. The season is too short, it's rocky as hell, and the soil sucks. Farm country it's not.

And besides, you know those park rangers are high on life, not drugs. Simple people who enjoy simple pleasures--hiking, watching nature, waiting for tourist season to be over. Sticking firecrackers up bison's butts.

/JK about that last one
2014-08-08 12:12:41 AM  
3 votes:

styckx: drjekel_mrhyde: These people feel that they can fly these things any and everywhere they want.
/Read the comments on The Verge if you don't believe me

I wonder why? Before the "drone" craze hobbiest RC copter pilots respected other peoples properities, privacy and flew their birds in parks and remote fields away from people.. Now people feel they can just launch one of these drones in a crowded public place with cameras attached and don't understand why people look annoyed as shiat.


The cameras have made all the difference.

The reason the RC pilots flew in open fields is so they could watch the craft fly. Line of sight was the only means of navigation and control.

Now, the video/photo is the goal, and also the navigation -- watching them take off and return is boring compared to monitoring them on your display.
2014-08-08 09:12:35 AM  
2 votes:

RexTalionis: fiddlehead: I go to YNP fairly frequently, and nothing pisses me off more than seeing how people have drawn their names and other shiat into the bacterial mats of Grand Prismatic next to the boardwalk. Or seeing coins in some of the hot springs. Fark those people, and fark this guy.

They should get Forest Rangers who do nothing but monitor the boardwalks and hand out $1000 citations to people doing that shiat.


I wish they did, but rangers are seriously understaffed. They probably spend most of their time trying to handle all the tourists that get too close to bison/elk/bears. Bear jams are particularly insane.

And this guy didn't even get a citation! Even with obvious proof that he put something in a hot spring! Sigh.
2014-08-08 08:51:38 AM  
2 votes:
The Grand Prismatic Spring is a hot spring with pigmented microbial mats living in it that have been there for hundreds of thousands of years.

straylighteffect.com
Even if you think it's no big deal, the lithium in the battery can explode and contaminate the microbial mats. It can kill this thing that's been alive since way before human civilization. Just because some jerk felt that he didn't need to abide by the rules.
2014-08-08 06:49:37 AM  
2 votes:

Hermione_Granger: I'm still trying to figure out when any and  every remote controlled flying toy became a "drone" the way every brown person who's name ends in "ad, ed, or al" became a potential terrorist.

Some guys used to fly them in the park behind our house and almost the whole neighborhood would turn out. Seems to me Yellowstone would be a great place to do this.


It's the damn fear mongering media. "Drone" plays on fears of Predator drones that people think can fly anywhere in the world autonomously in a moments notice and wipe out an entire city indiscriminately. Where as "RC Helicopter" sounds like a children's toy. "People flying RC Helicopters in New York City", who cares. "People flying drones in New York City", OMG EVERYBODY PANIC! INVASION OF PRIVACY!!!!

It is like how the media turned the meaning of "Hacker" from "ingeniously resourceful engineers and programmers" into "basement-dwelling criminals who steal credit-card numbers and try to take down power grids."

/I stopped watching the news a long time ago.
\\I get all my news from Fark and The Onion, Americas finest news source!
pla
2014-08-08 06:34:16 AM  
2 votes:
duffblue : Why are citizens allowed to own these?

Well, because we as a society have decided to treat the air as a "collective commons". The alternative (in any society that respects private property rights) would require airlines to negotiate a right-of-way for every parcel of land they fly over.

As a "side effect" of the FAA and the police and the military getting to fly over your house, you get to fly things too, as long as you follow some basic rules.


They should only be for police and military.

How's that cop-dick taste today?

Amusingly, you have that exactly backward.  Although they can fly according to those same rules that apply to us all, the military can't operate domestically in the airspace drones occupy (below 1000ft AGL), and the police can't just go looking in your windows to casually snoop for crimes, whether they do it in person or via remote control.


What kind of small-dicked loser even thinks this is cool?

I have mine on order from Amazon. $300, and you control it with your iPhone. "Just who do you plan to please with that tiny thing?" "Me!".
2014-08-08 06:20:11 AM  
2 votes:

styckx: drjekel_mrhyde: These people feel that they can fly these things any and everywhere they want.
/Read the comments on The Verge if you don't believe me

I wonder why? Before the "drone" craze hobbiest RC copter pilots respected other peoples properities, privacy and flew their birds in parks and remote fields away from people.. Now people feel they can just launch one of these drones in a crowded public place with cameras attached and don't understand why people look annoyed as shiat.


I'm still trying to figure out when any and  every remote controlled flying toy became a "drone" the way every brown person who's name ends in "ad, ed, or al" became a potential terrorist.

Some guys used to fly them in the park behind our house and almost the whole neighborhood would turn out. Seems to me Yellowstone would be a great place to do this.
2014-08-08 03:11:11 AM  
2 votes:

Kenny B: What a farking moron. It is a great toy but use common sense.


Like flying from one air tempreture and immediately into a vast swath of extremely hot and less dense air?

Used to be flying any remote control vehicle required some basic understanding of flight.. As you said though.. These things are considered affordable toys now and any moron can just pick one up.
2014-08-08 12:13:34 AM  
2 votes:
I can see this. You lose a drone in the farking woods and never find it, it becomes litter. Even if it's a nice one.

What about a balloon + GoPro + string? Box kites? That'll be safe but still allow you to find where the park rangers are growing the pot that makes up for the lousy pay.
2014-08-08 12:08:13 AM  
2 votes:

Ow! That was my feelings!: Fiction Fan: Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.

They are a nuisance. You are not the only trying to enjoy the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left. Completely support the ban and it should be extended to all Federally administered wilderness areas as well.

2014-08-08 12:00:55 AM  
2 votes:
Too bad the ranger didn't throw him in the hot spring.
2014-08-07 11:52:47 PM  
2 votes:
If he wants his drone back, give him a mask and a snorkel. No fins though.
2014-08-07 11:48:06 PM  
2 votes:

Lsherm: Well, I should hope a 1lb plastic toy can't make that much of a difference.


Probably not, then again, the batteries might poison the bacterial mat (also probably not).
2014-08-07 11:13:55 PM  
2 votes:
Park spokesperson Al Nash addressed concerns that the downed aircraft, which sank into the 370-foot-wide and 121-foot-deep "boiling lake," could potentially damage the famous natural landmark.
"What we have to determine is whether the presence of this radio-controlled recreational aircraft poses a threat to that unique resource," Nash said.
"We are trying to determine if we can locate it, and if we locate it, if we'll be able to remove it. Our concern is about any potential impacts to the iconic Yellowstone thermal feature."


Well, I should hope a 1lb plastic toy can't make that much of a difference. That's a fair amount of water and energy and a very small interruption. I'd think a strong rainstorm would have a greater effect on it.
2014-08-08 05:00:45 PM  
1 votes:

wiredroach: JDJoeE: This is the same group trying to limit access to public parks. They don't seem to understand less visitors to the parks = less funding.

The National Park Service issued the restriction. They aren't trying to limit access to the parks, and they're keenly aware of how little funding they have. From their memo:

"We embrace many activities in national parks because they enhance visitor experiences with the iconic natural, historic and cultural landscapes in our care," Jarvis said. "However, we have serious concerns about the negative impact that flying unmanned aircraft is having in parks, so we are prohibiting their use until we can determine the most appropriate policy that will protect park resources and provide all visitors with a rich experience."


Yes, one of the reasons why rangers are wary of giving fines to tourists for dumb activities is that the tourists would then complain about the park and people who read the complaints would be less likely to visit. Easier to give a verbal warning and leave it at that. Frankly, I wouldn't miss the type of people who would avoid the park because dumb activities are penalized. But funding for national parks is always an issue.
2014-08-08 04:23:54 PM  
1 votes:

JDJoeE: This is the same group trying to limit access to public parks. They don't seem to understand less visitors to the parks = less funding.


The National Park Service issued the restriction. They aren't trying to limit access to the parks, and they're keenly aware of how little funding they have. From their memo:

"We embrace many activities in national parks because they enhance visitor experiences with the iconic natural, historic and cultural landscapes in our care," Jarvis said. "However, we have serious concerns about the negative impact that flying unmanned aircraft is having in parks, so we are prohibiting their use until we can determine the most appropriate policy that will protect park resources and provide all visitors with a rich experience."
2014-08-08 12:12:26 PM  
1 votes:

jshine: .I.e., "peeing in the ocean"
Look, if you want to be angry about something, go ahead. I won't try to stop you with any more science.

Need some more laws, do you? Funny, I've had you farkied as that kind of guy for quite a while already. But that's how it usually is with engineers--you all can figure out how to build a city on the bottom of the ocean, but you never figure in how to dispose of the waste. The only goal is to demonstrate how superior your brains are, never 'why would we want to do that in the first place, and what might be the consequences of doing it?'
2014-08-08 12:04:46 PM  
1 votes:

jshine: Ok, so for the sake of argument, let's actually do the math...  According to Wikipedia, the spring in question is about 250' x 300' x 160' deep -- assuming it's a simple cuboid, that gives a volume of 12000000 cubic feet or about 9 million gallons.  It discharges 560 gallons/minute, so the volume will be completely flushed every 11 days or so.

Now, lets say we introduce a 6 ounce (170g) lithium battery (and, for the sake of argument, we'll assume it's made of pure lithium -- because hey, why not?).  That's about 24.5 moles of lithium, diluted into 9 million gallons or 34068706 liters, for a concentration of 7.2 micromolar.  For reference, salt in seawater (i.e., sodium ion) is about 200,000x more concentrated than that.  Also, even in our calculation here, that represents an initial concentration.  Since this is a hot-spring, the water is constantly being flushed, so after a month or so, it'll be down to essentially zero.

I.e., "peeing in the ocean"


That still doesn't address the hunk of man-made materials inside the spring.
2014-08-08 11:40:36 AM  
1 votes:
The likelihood of any one piece of garbage thrown in the spring significantly altering its chemical composition is pretty small. But lots of crap winds up in there every year, accidentally or on purpose, and there's the potential that it could add up.

Plus, it's aesthetic vandalism, akin to littering or carving your name into rocks or trees. The idea is to preserve some sense of the natural world while allowing people access to it. The park is already filled with roads, stores, hotels, porta potties, etc. to make it possible to let people see the sights. Don't make it worse by trashing the actual sights these other compromises make possible.
2014-08-08 11:32:01 AM  
1 votes:

kyrg: Fiction Fan: Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.

Because some people have a crazy idea that Nature should be enjoyed in it's natural state, that it is not a narcissist  playground for personel assholery by thinking only of themselves and not the 3 million other people who come to enjoy the place without the need for a drone to take the same picture you can find online or in a dozen giftshops inside the park.
They tend to be the same people who hold conversations infront of busy doorways, stop their car in the middle of a busy road preventing passing them on the right when they are turning left and talk on a blue tooth loud enough to hear an echo.


Also, there's a real danger in some areas of the park that you could crash the drone and hit someone.  Especially in a place like Yellowstone where people congregate around the more spectacular geysers and springs, it'd be easy to loose control of your drone and send it into a crowd of bystanders.
2014-08-08 11:28:21 AM  
1 votes:

jshine: 2) There is not sufficient lithium in the battery to threaten the existence of any species of bacteria in the hot spring. Could it kill a few individual bacterial cells near where it lands? Yes. Will all the various species of bacteria still be in the spring next week, next month, and next year (absent any other disaster)? Also, yes. I.e., no long-term threat.


It's damage that shouldn't be there. I can gouge out a 1 cubic centimeter piece of flesh from your chest. It's small and it'll heal, but it's still damage that shouldn't be there.
2014-08-08 11:26:02 AM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: jshine: ...so, you think that the amount of lithium in the drone is equivalent to 1/10 of the sodium content in that spring's water?

Granted, I haven't done the math, but as a chemical engineer that estimate seems pretty high...

As a chemical engineer, you also know that lithium batteries tend to explode when exposed to high temperatures.

Can you give assurances that the lithium battery isn't toxic to the bacterial mat? Specifically, to the areas immediately surrounding the drone. Since you're such a big, bad chemical engineer and all that.


I can absolutely assure you that:

1) The lithium battery is incapable of exploding with sufficient force to sterilize the hot spring or physically destroy it.

2) There is not sufficient lithium in the battery to threaten the existence of any species of bacteria in the hot spring.  Could it kill a few individual bacterial cells near where it lands?  Yes.  Will all the various species of bacteria still be in the spring next week, next month, and next year (absent any other disaster)?  Also, yes.  I.e., no long-term threat.

I'd be willing to bet any amount of money or either of my degrees on those points.
2014-08-08 11:25:19 AM  
1 votes:

jshine: Ok, so for the sake of argument, let's actually do the math... According to Wikipedia, the spring in question is about 250' x 300' x 160' deep -- assuming it's a simple cuboid, that gives a volume of 12000000 cubic feet or about 9 million gallons. It discharges 560 gallons/minute, so the volume will be completely flushed every 11 days or so.

Now, lets say we introduce a 6 ounce (170g) lithium battery (and, for the sake of argument, we'll assume it's made of pure lithium -- because hey, why not?). That's about 24.5 moles of lithium, diluted into 9 million gallons or 34068706 liters, for a concentration of 7.2 micromolar. For reference, salt in seawater (i.e., sodium ion) is about 200,000x more concentrated than that. Also, even in our calculation here, that represents an initial concentration. Since this is a hot-spring, the water is constantly being flushed, so after a month or so, it'll be down to essentially zero.

I.e., "peeing in the ocean"


How toxic is it within, say, 1 cubic feet around the battery?
2014-08-08 11:19:40 AM  
1 votes:

cryinoutloud: This. There is good no good reason that people need to invade, mark, walk over, take pictures of, piss on, or carve their farking initials in every square inch of nature, just because they have the mentality of a three-year-old. If you don't have the sense to control yourself, maybe we need more laws to control YOU. How'd you like that, instead? "But I WANT TOOOOOOOOOOO!"


sigh. I make a lot of typos anymore.....
2014-08-08 11:17:49 AM  
1 votes:

fiddlehead: I go to YNP fairly frequently, and nothing pisses me off more than seeing how people have drawn their names and other shiat into the bacterial mats of Grand Prismatic next to the boardwalk. Or seeing coins in some of the hot springs. Fark those people, and fark this guy.


This. There is good no reason that people need to invade, mark, walk over, take pictures of, piss on, or carve their farking initials in every square inch of nature, just because they have the mentality of a three-year-old. If you don't have the sense to control yourself, maybe we need more laws to control YOU. How'd you like that, instead? "But I WANT TOOOOOOOOOOO!"
2014-08-08 11:02:51 AM  
1 votes:

jshine: RexTalionis: jshine: Those volcanic springs are already so full of all kinds of nasty chemicals, it's like peeing in the ocean.

They're full of chemicals that the microbial mats are adapted to live in.

They aren't adapted to live in lithium polymer.

...and how much lithium is actually in a battery?  What is the volume of water in that hot spring that the lithium will dilute into?  That's the point of the 'peeing in the ocean' metaphor.

Also, we're talking lithium here -- not cyanide.  It's a close chemical analog of sodium (i.e., an alkali / group 1 metal), which is something that any microbes in that spring will absolutely be used to seeing.


Why don't we replace 1/10th of your salt intake with lithium chloride instead of sodium chloride? After all, it's a close chemical analog of sodium chloride, something you're used to seeing.

upload.wikimedia.org
2014-08-08 10:55:29 AM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: jshine: Those volcanic springs are already so full of all kinds of nasty chemicals, it's like peeing in the ocean.

They're full of chemicals that the microbial mats are adapted to live in.

They aren't adapted to live in lithium polymer.


...and how much lithium is actually in a battery?  What is the volume of water in that hot spring that the lithium will dilute into?  That's the point of the 'peeing in the ocean' metaphor.

Also, we're talking lithium here -- not cyanide.  It's a close chemical analog of sodium (i.e., an alkali / group 1 metal), which is something that any microbes in that spring will absolutely be used to seeing.
2014-08-08 10:51:20 AM  
1 votes:

jshine: Those volcanic springs are already so full of all kinds of nasty chemicals, it's like peeing in the ocean.


They're full of chemicals that the microbial mats are adapted to live in.

They aren't adapted to live in lithium polymer.
2014-08-08 10:47:55 AM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: jshine: Man, I sure am worried that a pound of plastic could damage the boiling sulfurous hell-scape that it sank into.

[www.brookstone.com image 700x700]


Your point?

Those volcanic springs are already so full of all kinds of nasty chemicals, it's like peeing in the ocean.
2014-08-08 10:40:18 AM  
1 votes:

jshine: Man, I sure am worried that a pound of plastic could damage the boiling sulfurous hell-scape that it sank into.


www.brookstone.com
2014-08-08 09:04:07 AM  
1 votes:

fiddlehead: I go to YNP fairly frequently, and nothing pisses me off more than seeing how people have drawn their names and other shiat into the bacterial mats of Grand Prismatic next to the boardwalk. Or seeing coins in some of the hot springs. Fark those people, and fark this guy.


They should get Forest Rangers who do nothing but monitor the boardwalks and hand out $1000 citations to people doing that shiat.
2014-08-08 08:59:52 AM  
1 votes:
I go to YNP fairly frequently, and nothing pisses me off more than seeing how people have drawn their names and other shiat into the bacterial mats of Grand Prismatic next to the boardwalk. Or seeing coins in some of the hot springs. Fark those people, and fark this guy.
2014-08-08 08:58:16 AM  
1 votes:
It's not a drone. It's just a radio controlled aircraft. Stop calling them drones. The government uses drones, for the rest of us they're just a fun toy.

Charles.
2014-08-08 07:31:37 AM  
1 votes:
OOOO Scary Drone crash!!! Better get my drone hunting permit, and load up the shotgun.....


Seriously... It's a battery powered RC toy that you can  attach a camera to, and take pictures with...I doubt it will become Self-aware and start World War 3.
2014-08-08 06:46:13 AM  
1 votes:

Hermione_Granger: styckx: drjekel_mrhyde: These people feel that they can fly these things any and everywhere they want.
/Read the comments on The Verge if you don't believe me

I wonder why? Before the "drone" craze hobbiest RC copter pilots respected other peoples properities, privacy and flew their birds in parks and remote fields away from people.. Now people feel they can just launch one of these drones in a crowded public place with cameras attached and don't understand why people look annoyed as shiat.

I'm still trying to figure out when any and  every remote controlled flying toy became a "drone" the way every brown person who's name ends in "ad, ed, or al" became a potential terrorist.

Some guys used to fly them in the park behind our house and almost the whole neighborhood would turn out. Seems to me Yellowstone would be a great place to do this.



Obviously you're not real smart. And have never spent any time in Yellowstone. There's few things that have less business being there.
2014-08-08 03:52:14 AM  
1 votes:

BalugaJoe: Let it go man cuz its gone.


This is the only right answer. I went to Yellowstone not long ago and saw the occasional hat or trinket by the springs and pools... If someone had wandered down and fallen in, they would have died. Years ago a guy kept in after a dog. He was cooked and died a day later.
2014-08-08 03:13:39 AM  
1 votes:
Oh man, as much as Google Glass gets tempers boiling, I can't wait to see the epic teeth gnashing when they develop an autonomous companion drone that just flits around the user like a high tech hummingbird.
2014-08-08 02:00:10 AM  
1 votes:
There is a certain point in the USA where you can commit a crime and get away with it.
http://www.vox.com/2014/5/22/5738756/you-can-kill-someone-in-a-secti on -of-yellowstone-and-get-away-scot
2014-08-08 01:18:28 AM  
1 votes:
Protip:  Blame gopro, even if no gopro equipment was used.

/gobro
2014-08-08 12:47:12 AM  
1 votes:
I dunno about you, but I still haven't put a camera on my Walkera QR X-350. Weighs a lot more than a pound, most of it battery. Have a nice flight program for it, just hook the USB to it, program altitude, heading, bearing, speed, etc,  and it'll take off by itself, fly a circuit, and land wherever you want. Not bad for under 400 bucks.
2014-08-08 12:34:42 AM  
1 votes:
Throw the guy in to retrieve it.
2014-08-08 12:24:19 AM  
1 votes:

lordargent: Lsherm: Well, I should hope a 1lb plastic toy can't make that much of a difference.

Probably not, then again, the batteries might poison the bacterial mat (also probably not).


That's what I was thinking. That could be someone's future.
1.bp.blogspot.com
2014-08-08 12:08:38 AM  
1 votes:

drjekel_mrhyde: These people feel that they can fly these things any and everywhere they want.
/Read the comments on The Verge if you don't believe me


I wonder why? Before the "drone" craze hobbiest RC copter pilots respected other peoples properities, privacy and flew their birds in parks and remote fields away from people.. Now people feel they can just launch one of these drones in a crowded public place with cameras attached and don't understand why people look annoyed as shiat.
2014-08-08 12:05:13 AM  
1 votes:
These people feel that they can fly these things any and everywhere they want.
/Read the comments on The Verge if you don't believe me
2014-08-07 11:58:54 PM  
1 votes:
Bullshiat that a drone can't be flown over some of the most beautiful and pristine land our country has left.
What was the thinking? That it would disturb the mosquitos? Maybe camping nudists?
I really would want to know the reasoning.
2014-08-07 11:53:22 PM  
1 votes:

SirGeorgeBurkelwitzIII: What an asshole.


I came in to say exactly those three words.  You beat me to it.
2014-08-07 11:50:10 PM  
1 votes:
Let it go man cuz its gone.
2014-08-07 11:48:17 PM  
1 votes:
Well, that's thermal air currents for 'ya.
 
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