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(Mashable)   Netflix subscriber revunue surpasses HBO's. Funny considering HBO charges so much more   (mashable.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, Netflix CEO, Netflix, HBO, CEO, SNL Kagan, Orange Is the New Black, milestone  
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1410 clicks; posted to Geek » on 07 Aug 2014 at 6:21 AM (1 year ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-08-07 03:33:11 AM  
It's about time, in a way.  You need cable or satellite as a prerequisite to get HBO.  You need broadband to do Netflix streaming.  If someone had to choose between one or the other, most people would probably keep broadband/Netflix, and ditch cable/HBO. And then either pirate the HBO stuff using their broadband, or wait for the HBO content to hit Netflix.
 
2014-08-07 06:42:22 AM  

RodneyToady: It's about time, in a way.  You need cable or satellite as a prerequisite to get HBO.  You need broadband to do Netflix streaming.  If someone had to choose between one or the other, most people would probably keep broadband/Netflix, and ditch cable/HBO. And then either pirate the HBO stuff using their broadband, or wait for the HBO content to hit Netflix.


HBO doesn't put its shows on Netflix. Although if you're willing to deal with a ~10 year delay between original airing and online availability you can see some of its shows on Amazon.

I've been saying for the last few years that breaking out HBOGo as a standalone makes zero economic sense for them despite the cries of "I'd pay $5 for just an HBO subscription, way to lose money!" from everyone who cares more about what they want than what the consequences of providing it to them would actually be for the business.

That said, I'm coming around to the idea that we've finally reached the tipping point where they may be able to make up the deficit they'd incur by pissing off the cable companies that are actually the ones paying them right now by offering an online only subscription.

I think that "HBO subscription bundled with your internet" deal may be the first step in breaking HBO out as a standalone content provider rather than a cable extra. I'd now be mildly surprised if it doesn't happen in the next five years.
 
2014-08-07 07:10:53 AM  
"They still kick our ass in profits and Emmy's, but we are making progress," he added. "HBO rocks, and we are honored to be in the same league."

I like this guy.

I'm a late comer to Netflix but I've really enjoyed it. It's too bad HBO (and Showtime) hasn't changed it's business model because I can't drop HBO or Showtime. Those three networks are all putting out too much quality content.

OTOH, if HBO spews out one or two more 'Leftovers' I could seriously walk away.
 
2014-08-07 07:11:39 AM  
Netflix has to find a way to fix the "that title is unavailable to stream" problem before they can really kick ass. You still need the dvd subscription to see most of the newer movies, and quite a few older ones as well.
 
2014-08-07 07:35:03 AM  

Delta1212: RodneyToady: It's about time, in a way.  You need cable or satellite as a prerequisite to get HBO.  You need broadband to do Netflix streaming.  If someone had to choose between one or the other, most people would probably keep broadband/Netflix, and ditch cable/HBO. And then either pirate the HBO stuff using their broadband, or wait for the HBO content to hit Netflix.

HBO doesn't put its shows on Netflix. Although if you're willing to deal with a ~10 year delay between original airing and online availability you can see some of its shows on Amazon.

I've been saying for the last few years that breaking out HBOGo as a standalone makes zero economic sense for them despite the cries of "I'd pay $5 for just an HBO subscription, way to lose money!" from everyone who cares more about what they want than what the consequences of providing it to them would actually be for the business.

That said, I'm coming around to the idea that we've finally reached the tipping point where they may be able to make up the deficit they'd incur by pissing off the cable companies that are actually the ones paying them right now by offering an online only subscription.

I think that "HBO subscription bundled with your internet" deal may be the first step in breaking HBO out as a standalone content provider rather than a cable extra. I'd now be mildly surprised if it doesn't happen in the next five years.


I get Boardwalk Empire from Netflix, but then I get the bluray discs because I want actual HD video and lossless audio.
 
2014-08-07 07:35:50 AM  
I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream
 
2014-08-07 07:46:48 AM  

tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream


I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).
 
2014-08-07 07:49:09 AM  

Basily Gourt: Netflix has to find a way to fix the "that title is unavailable to stream" problem before they can really kick ass. You still need the dvd subscription to see most of the newer movies, and quite a few older ones as well.


I don't think it's a matter of Netflix not wanting them. I remember them saying they would prefer to go all streaming if they could. It's the content providers being stingy with shows and/or asking for a king's ransom for the streaming rights.

IamKaiserSoze!!!: OTOH, if HBO spews out one or two more 'Leftovers' I could seriously walk away.


Holy Christ, this.
 
2014-08-07 07:49:49 AM  

tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream


I'm assuming that you don't have cable then?  HBO costs $20 a month, but you can often get it for $10 under a promotion and an HBO subscription includes HBOgo.
 
2014-08-07 07:50:06 AM  

mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).


*cough*Boardwalk Empire*cough*

Treme was awfully good too yet never got the widespread appeal.

I would also suggest that their last great critically acclaimed series was The Wire.

and True Detectives
 
2014-08-07 07:56:18 AM  

IamKaiserSoze!!!: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

*cough*Boardwalk Empire*cough*

Treme was awfully good too yet never got the widespread appeal.

I would also suggest that their last great critically acclaimed series was The Wire.

and True Detectives


I loved The Wire, and I thought Boardwalk Empire was decent (not great though), but none of those shows really captured the attention of the TV audience like the Sopranos. I mean even people who didn't watch the show knew what the Bada Bing was and knew about Tony and Carmela.

I mean to put it in perspective, The Sopranos was so popular that in Canada, CTV got the broadcast rights to the show and aired it on network TV, uncut in prime time (at 10am). I haven't seen them do that with any other HBO show, ever.
 
2014-08-07 07:59:33 AM  

mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).


Game of Thrones passed Sopranos in viewership this season, and that's with a smaller subscriber base and not counting the people who download it illegally. It also broke records for the most torrented TV show and most people seeding and downloading a single torrent at once: records which it set last season.

It's literally the most watched show in HBO's history by their own admission and gets referenced quite a lot on other shows. I'm not sure what it is you want exactly to qualify a show as a success or an audience as "non-specific."
 
2014-08-07 08:01:59 AM  

mechgreg: IamKaiserSoze!!!: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

*cough*Boardwalk Empire*cough*

Treme was awfully good too yet never got the widespread appeal.

I would also suggest that their last great critically acclaimed series was The Wire.

and True Detectives

I loved The Wire, and I thought Boardwalk Empire was decent (not great though), but none of those shows really captured the attention of the TV audience like the Sopranos. I mean even people who didn't watch the show knew what the Bada Bing was and knew about Tony and Carmela.

I mean to put it in perspective, The Sopranos was so popular that in Canada, CTV got the broadcast rights to the show and aired it on network TV, uncut in prime time (at 10am). I haven't seen them do that with any other HBO show, ever.


In fairness, having seen both The Sopranos and the vast majority of other HBO series, it's pretty much the only one you could get away with doing that for. I suppose The Wire, but it was never popular enough while it was airing and it's not going to happen now.

Game of Thrones, True Blood, Rome, Deadwood: These are not shows that lens themselves to being broadcast on network television unedited.
 
2014-08-07 08:05:06 AM  

Delta1212: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

Game of Thrones passed Sopranos in viewership this season, and that's with a smaller subscriber base and not counting the people who download it illegally. It also broke records for the most torrented TV show and most people seeding and downloading a single torrent at once: records which it set last season.

It's literally the most watched show in HBO's history by their own admission and gets referenced quite a lot on other shows. I'm not sure what it is you want exactly to qualify a show as a success or an audience as "non-specific."


Game of Thrones may get better numbers, but I think the fact that it is a fantasy show means it doesn't get the kind of acceptance with the general public that the sopranos did. I mean for a lot of people I think it is looked as as a show for nerds.
 
2014-08-07 08:07:16 AM  
With Comcast, you can get HBOGo without buying the full cable. I get their 30 MBPs internet plus HBOGo for $40 / month.
 
2014-08-07 08:10:54 AM  

IamKaiserSoze!!!: "They still kick our ass in profits and Emmy's, but we are making progress," he added. "HBO rocks, and we are honored to be in the same league."

I like this guy.

I'm a late comer to Netflix but I've really enjoyed it. It's too bad HBO (and Showtime) hasn't changed it's business model because I can't drop HBO or Showtime. Those three networks are all putting out too much quality content.

OTOH, if HBO spews out one or two more 'Leftovers' I could seriously walk away.


HBO's strength is that they're willing to take chances when it comes to new programming.  The networks are all too afraid to step out of the focus-group approved formulas, and most free cable networks don't have the budget HBO has to work with.

That does mean that sometimes they'll release a flop, but they seem to hit far more than they miss.  I can accept some misses if it means that they keep pushing the envelope.
 
2014-08-07 08:12:28 AM  

mechgreg: Delta1212: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

Game of Thrones passed Sopranos in viewership this season, and that's with a smaller subscriber base and not counting the people who download it illegally. It also broke records for the most torrented TV show and most people seeding and downloading a single torrent at once: records which it set last season.

It's literally the most watched show in HBO's history by their own admission and gets referenced quite a lot on other shows. I'm not sure what it is you want exactly to qualify a show as a success or an audience as "non-specific."

Game of Thrones may get better numbers, but I think the fact that it is a fantasy show means it doesn't get the kind of acceptance with the general public that the sopranos did. I mean for a lot of people I think it is looked as as a show for nerds.


Two points: "Nerd entertainment" is currently mainstream. And every job I've had since the show started airing, 90% of people at the office have been watching, which includes men and women aged 20-50ish.

Obama requests advance copies of the show on DVD from HBO for crying out loud.

Where exactly do you live that Game of Thrones isn't considered mainstream entertainment?
 
2014-08-07 08:16:52 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: IamKaiserSoze!!!: "They still kick our ass in profits and Emmy's, but we are making progress," he added. "HBO rocks, and we are honored to be in the same league."

I like this guy.

I'm a late comer to Netflix but I've really enjoyed it. It's too bad HBO (and Showtime) hasn't changed it's business model because I can't drop HBO or Showtime. Those three networks are all putting out too much quality content.

OTOH, if HBO spews out one or two more 'Leftovers' I could seriously walk away.

HBO's strength is that they're willing to take chances when it comes to new programming.  The networks are all too afraid to step out of the focus-group approved formulas, and most free cable networks don't have the budget HBO has to work with.

That does mean that sometimes they'll release a flop, but they seem to hit far more than they miss.  I can accept some misses if it means that they keep pushing the envelope.


Exactly this. This past year, they've had GoT, True Blood, Boardwalk Empire, Veep, Girls, True Detective, Silicon Valley, and The Newsroom. They put it a lot of stuff, put a lot of money into it. Some works, some doesn't.
 
2014-08-07 08:19:16 AM  

mechgreg: Delta1212: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

Game of Thrones passed Sopranos in viewership this season, and that's with a smaller subscriber base and not counting the people who download it illegally. It also broke records for the most torrented TV show and most people seeding and downloading a single torrent at once: records which it set last season.

It's literally the most watched show in HBO's history by their own admission and gets referenced quite a lot on other shows. I'm not sure what it is you want exactly to qualify a show as a success or an audience as "non-specific."

Game of Thrones may get better numbers, but I think the fact that it is a fantasy show means it doesn't get the kind of acceptance with the general public that the sopranos did. I mean for a lot of people I think it is looked as as a show for nerds.


It's funny to me that people still feel like they're somehow superior to "nerds" when geeky culture has become rather dominant in our society.
 
2014-08-07 08:33:09 AM  
meanmutton:

It's funny to me that people still feel like they're somehow superior to "nerds" when geeky culture has become rather dominant in our society.


Not talking about any kind of superiority. And I am not sure if you remember it  but the amount of media attention that the sopranos got when it was on was insane, and I don't see it at that level for any show HBO has playing right now (breaking bad last year had it, and the first few years of Mad Men had it). I didn't start watching until I think season but even before then I knew who most of the characters were. I mean have any of the actors in Game of Thrones been made as famous as The Sopranos made James Gandolfini? Has Game of Thrones cleaned up at awards (like the Emmys) the way The Sopranos did. And that is not even talking about how the Sopranos being a hit totally changed the TV business and made original programming on premium cable a viable thing for those channels to have.
 
2014-08-07 08:42:57 AM  

mechgreg: I mean even people who didn't watch the show knew what the Bada Bing was and knew about Tony and Carmela.


You might be surprised.  I've heard of Tony Soprano, but I don't know who Carmela was or what Bada Bing was.  I saw a few episodes when it was in syndication on some other cable channel, but I decided I wanted to watch from the beginning and I wanted to watch the full episodes so I'm still fairly clueless about it.

I also saw the spoilers for the final episode (and it wasn't even a Sopranos thread)  and heard a lot of folks were disappointed with the ending.  Now I've got to wait until I forget the spoilers to watch it.

So I don't have cable anymore (and Comcast can still go fark themselves) and I've only seen season 1 of GoT.

HBO could probably sell me a standalone HBOGo subscription for $20 at least while certain shows were airing.
 
2014-08-07 08:45:18 AM  

mechgreg: Delta1212: mechgreg: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I think HBO just needs to develop another really kick ass show to get back on top. I mean I know they have a few shows that are popular but those are more genre shows with very specific audiences like Game of Thrones or True Blood. A hit on the same level as the Sopranos (which had its finale 7 years ago) that really captures the attention of the entertainment media and the general public would surely change things for them. Unfortunately for some reason they seem to missing out on getting the really good shows to other networks (Mad Men and Breaking Bad are on AMC, Homeland is on Showtime).

Game of Thrones passed Sopranos in viewership this season, and that's with a smaller subscriber base and not counting the people who download it illegally. It also broke records for the most torrented TV show and most people seeding and downloading a single torrent at once: records which it set last season.

It's literally the most watched show in HBO's history by their own admission and gets referenced quite a lot on other shows. I'm not sure what it is you want exactly to qualify a show as a success or an audience as "non-specific."

Game of Thrones may get better numbers, but I think the fact that it is a fantasy show means it doesn't get the kind of acceptance with the general public that the sopranos did. I mean for a lot of people I think it is looked as as a show for nerds.


The number one movie in the country (and the world for that matter) is a superhero film set in outer space staring among others: a professional wrestler, an anthropomorphic raccoon and a talking tree.  Some people need to get over themselves.
 
2014-08-07 08:48:54 AM  

gfid: HBO could probably sell me a standalone HBOGo subscription for $20 at least while certain shows were airing.


I suspect that every content provider is watching the WWE Network and Netflix very closely to see just how viable the direct-to-consumer market really is.
 
2014-08-07 08:52:17 AM  

mechgreg: meanmutton:

It's funny to me that people still feel like they're somehow superior to "nerds" when geeky culture has become rather dominant in our society.


Not talking about any kind of superiority. And I am not sure if you remember it  but the amount of media attention that the sopranos got when it was on was insane, and I don't see it at that level for any show HBO has playing right now (breaking bad last year had it, and the first few years of Mad Men had it). I didn't start watching until I think season but even before then I knew who most of the characters were. I mean have any of the actors in Game of Thrones been made as famous as The Sopranos made James Gandolfini? Has Game of Thrones cleaned up at awards (like the Emmys) the way The Sopranos did. And that is not even talking about how the Sopranos being a hit totally changed the TV business and made original programming on premium cable a viable thing for those channels to have.


I know GoT has won a lot of Emmys, and the media buzz seems to be just as big as it was for The Sopranos back when it aired.  As far as breakout stars go, it's really brought popular appreciation to Peter Dinklage.  He was somewhat known before, but GoT has made him a much bigger name and likely led to a lot of the major roles he's had since.

/By the way, the show with the most Emmys ever?  Frasier (well, tied with SNL).
 
2014-08-07 08:58:41 AM  

mechgreg: meanmutton:

It's funny to me that people still feel like they're somehow superior to "nerds" when geeky culture has become rather dominant in our society.


Not talking about any kind of superiority. And I am not sure if you remember it  but the amount of media attention that the sopranos got when it was on was insane, and I don't see it at that level for any show HBO has playing right now (breaking bad last year had it, and the first few years of Mad Men had it). I didn't start watching until I think season but even before then I knew who most of the characters were. I mean have any of the actors in Game of Thrones been made as famous as The Sopranos made James Gandolfini? Has Game of Thrones cleaned up at awards (like the Emmys) the way The Sopranos did. And that is not even talking about how the Sopranos being a hit totally changed the TV business and made original programming on premium cable a viable thing for those channels to have.


Sopranos was eligible for 7 Emmy periods. In that time, it was nominated for 111 and won 21. That's just under 16 nominations and 3 wins per "season."

Game of Thrones, for its first three seasons, was nominated 42 times with 10 wins, for an average of 14 nominations and 3.3 wins per season. And unlike Sopranos, the numbers have been increasing year over year (the fourth season was nominated for 19 Emmys, the most of any program this year. We'll see how they do in terms of actual wins).

Right now, Game of Thrones has a higher win rate than Sopranos both overall and at this point in both their runs (it averaged 3 wins per season after three seasons), but Sopranos got nominated for more stuff.

If Game of Thrones gets 4 or more wins this year, it will increase its win lead. If it gets three, Sopranos and Game of Thrones will be tied with an average of 3.25 Emmys per season after 4 seasons. If GoT gets 2 or fewer, it will be behind in both nominations and wins.

Catching up to Sopranos in total nominations seems unlikely unless GoT's number keeps rising. Sopranos lost some momentum after season 3, but it still has quite a lead at this point and the producers have been making noises that they may call it quits after 7 seasons as well (I put it at 8 tops). Game of Thrones is still on the rise after four seasons, which is actually a bit unusual (although Breaking Bad managed the same thing, if under very different circumstances), but whether that momentum keeps up is still to be seen.
 
2014-08-07 09:04:51 AM  

No Line For Beer: gfid: HBO could probably sell me a standalone HBOGo subscription for $20 at least while certain shows were airing.

I suspect that every content provider is watching the WWE Network and Netflix very closely to see just how viable the direct-to-consumer market really is.


When Netflix has more subscribers than any single cable or dish provider... exactly why are they still waiting? Amazon instant, Google Play movies, iTunes, Crynchyroll, Amazon Fire TV, Chromecast, Roku, Apple TV... I'm pretty sure the verdict is in. Streaming video is revenue.

I cannot believe it makes fiscal sense for HBO not to have a direct to consumer option without cable subscription. I'd love to see some projection numbers, but seriously, it isn't like offering that will have their cable revenue drop to zero. That's going to be a slow taper. There is only upshot and additional revenue available from those currently pirating... unless the cable providers claim they'll drop HBO. But given the number of people who only have cable because of needing it to get HBO... I have a feeling HBO is holding all the cards in that negotiation. And being the only provider without HBO would be disastrous to the revenue of any of the providers, so HBO can definitely play harder ball there than any single provider. So unless they illegally collude to extort HBO to keep requiring cable subscription... there's just no reason not to.
 
2014-08-07 09:08:36 AM  
Quantumbunny:
I cannot believe it makes fiscal sense for HBO not to have a direct to consumer option without cable subscription. I'd love to see some projection numbers, but seriously, it isn't like offering that will have their cable revenue drop to zero. That's going to be a slow taper. There is only upshot and additional revenue available from those currently pirating... unless the cable providers claim they'll drop HBO. But given the number of people who only have cable because of needing it to get HBO... I have a feeling HBO is holding all the cards in that negotiation. And being the only provider without HBO would be disastrous to the revenue of any of the providers, so HBO can definitely play harder ball there than any single provider. So unless they illegally collude to extort HBO to keep requiring cable subscription... there's just no reason not to.

The problem is there is a ton of other factors at play. HBO is owned by time warner. They also own Cinemax, Cartoon Network, CNN, TBS, TNT and Turner Classic movies. The middle man for all of those is of course the cable companies. If they decide to cut out the middle man for HBO then I can totally see the cable companies being super pissed which could be a problem since Time Warner needs those companies so that people can watch all of those other channels they own.
 
2014-08-07 09:18:10 AM  
vr-zone.com
 
2014-08-07 09:22:32 AM  

debug: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I'm assuming that you don't have cable then?  HBO costs $20 a month, but you can often get it for $10 under a promotion and an HBO subscription includes HBOgo.


I'm assuming that you have a decent cable provider then? HBO costs me $13 and some change a month, but I don't get HBOgo because my cable company sucks. Actually, I don't get ANY service like HBOgo, AMC's online option, or any online streaming solution that requires the cable company to actually do something. So given the option, I'd rather pay HBO directly and be able to watch their shows on my time versus just pirating it like I do now.

If one pays for something and can't access it due to corporate BS, minimal showings, etc; piracy is a legitimate solution. These days, the only things I pirate are the TV shows I'm unable to watch because my cable company refuses to do their end of the deal(s) making me unable to legally stream the shows I already pay for and that the content makers made available for paying customers.
 
2014-08-07 09:25:47 AM  

mechgreg: Quantumbunny:
I cannot believe it makes fiscal sense for HBO not to have a direct to consumer option without cable subscription. I'd love to see some projection numbers, but seriously, it isn't like offering that will have their cable revenue drop to zero. That's going to be a slow taper. There is only upshot and additional revenue available from those currently pirating... unless the cable providers claim they'll drop HBO. But given the number of people who only have cable because of needing it to get HBO... I have a feeling HBO is holding all the cards in that negotiation. And being the only provider without HBO would be disastrous to the revenue of any of the providers, so HBO can definitely play harder ball there than any single provider. So unless they illegally collude to extort HBO to keep requiring cable subscription... there's just no reason not to.

The problem is there is a ton of other factors at play. HBO is owned by time warner. They also own Cinemax, Cartoon Network, CNN, TBS, TNT and Turner Classic movies. The middle man for all of those is of course the cable companies. If they decide to cut out the middle man for HBO then I can totally see the cable companies being super pissed which could be a problem since Time Warner needs those companies so that people can watch all of those other channels they own.


This is, essentially, the problem. HBO might be able to go it alone, but how well HBO does isn't the sole concern of the people who own HBO, and HBO isn't the only point of retaliation the cable companies have open if they decide to go that route.

I do suspect we're reaching a tipping point where the amount of leverage the cable companies can bring to bear just isn't what it used to be, but there are sound reasons HBO hasn't just switched over to direct-to-consumer yet.
 
2014-08-07 09:56:32 AM  
Had Netflix....  for a little while, at least... then we ran out of crap to rent and the backlog on there is a mess.  There's only so many obscure C-level direct to video titles we could stomach.
 
2014-08-07 10:00:18 AM  

MassD: Had Netflix....  for a little while, at least... then we ran out of crap to rent and the backlog on there is a mess.  There's only so many obscure C-level direct to video titles we could stomach.


I've yet to find a movie I really want to watch on Netflix when I want to watch it.

It's great for TV shows, though.
 
2014-08-07 10:16:46 AM  

IamKaiserSoze!!!: OTOH, if HBO spews out one or two more 'Leftovers' I could seriously walk away.


The first couple of episodes were a little rough, but feel the show has been getting better and better and things have been coming together. It seems stronger when the focus is more of the secondary characters, like this last week's episode that focused on Nora and her really farked-up life. I have zero expectation of there ever being an explanation for the "Rapture", but I think the show has had some interesting character drama. I've honestly seen way more pointless clunker episodes in recent seasons of Boardwalk Empire.
 
2014-08-07 10:34:29 AM  

tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream


You should call your internet provider.  There's a good chance they have an internet package with HBO only (and maybe local channels) for not much more than you're currently paying for internet.  I just found out that my ISP has this offer and, for the first twelve months, it's actually cheaper than what I'm currently paying.  I'm sure there's a catch of some kind but I'm definitely going to explore it.
 
2014-08-07 10:38:48 AM  

skeevy420: debug: tbhouston: I'd pay at least $20 a month for HBO to go, they have new movies, and some of the best tv series out there.. Ohh to dream

I'm assuming that you don't have cable then?  HBO costs $20 a month, but you can often get it for $10 under a promotion and an HBO subscription includes HBOgo.

I'm assuming that you have a decent cable provider then? HBO costs me $13 and some change a month, but I don't get HBOgo because my cable company sucks. Actually, I don't get ANY service like HBOgo, AMC's online option, or any online streaming solution that requires the cable company to actually do something. So given the option, I'd rather pay HBO directly and be able to watch their shows on my time versus just pirating it like I do now.

If one pays for something and can't access it due to corporate BS, minimal showings, etc; piracy is a legitimate solution. These days, the only things I pirate are the TV shows I'm unable to watch because my cable company refuses to do their end of the deal(s) making me unable to legally stream the shows I already pay for and that the content makers made available for paying customers.


Who the hell is your service provider?
 
2014-08-07 10:41:32 AM  
It's no small milestone, but Netflix subscribers hardly sign up strictly for Netflix created content. So that's something to consider.

Sure,Netflix has it's own shows, and HBO shows movies it hasn't created, but I think a study would show most people sign up for HBO for their original programming, not movies, while original programming is only one reason (if it is at all) for people signing up to Netflix.

The model is still far superior however. The limp-wristed rollout of on demand services by our nation's cable companies certainly was never going to compete in any real way with a netflix or amazon like service.

And movies are certainly not to be ignored. Which is why if HBO wants their GO to be anything more than an *extra service* with casual viewers (the ones who could give a shiat about their original programming entirely) who prefer Amazon or Netflix, it needs to be able to stand alone/apart from a subscription to the cable channel; and it needs to make serious inroads in the movie dept.
 
2014-08-07 10:45:26 AM  

MurphyMurphy: It's no small milestone, but Netflix subscribers hardly sign up strictly for Netflix created content. So that's something to consider.

Sure,Netflix has it's own shows, and HBO shows movies it hasn't created, but I think a study would show most people sign up for HBO for their original programming, not movies, while original programming is only one reason (if it is at all) for people signing up to Netflix.

The model is still far superior however. The limp-wristed rollout of on demand services by our nation's cable companies certainly was never going to compete in any real way with a netflix or amazon like service.

And movies are certainly not to be ignored. Which is why if HBO wants their GO to be anything more than an *extra service* with casual viewers (the ones who could give a shiat about their original programming entirely) who prefer Amazon or Netflix, it needs to be able to stand alone/apart from a subscription to the cable channel; and it needs to make serious inroads in the movie dept.


You mean like this giant list.<a data-cke-saved-href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Don%27t_Know_Jac k_(film)" title="You Don't Know Jack (film)" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(11, 0, 128); background: none;" >you="" don't="" know="" jack (2010)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HBO_Films
 
2014-08-07 10:45:33 AM  

Delta1212: This is, essentially, the problem. HBO might be able to go it alone, but how well HBO does isn't the sole concern of the people who own HBO, and HBO isn't the only point of retaliation the cable companies have open if they decide to go that route.

I do suspect we're reaching a tipping point where the amount of leverage the cable companies can bring to bear just isn't what it used to be, but there are sound reasons HBO hasn't just switched over to direct-to-consumer yet.


Exactly Time Warner is a gigantic company, and HBO is just one part of that company. If they tell the cable companies that they are going to cut them out of the HBO money pile, assuming the cable companies don't want to make less money, they will have to find a way to make the same amount of money using the other Time Warner products. Which means lowered subscription fees to TW, moving TW channels into higher cable packages or raising cable rates. All of those mean less money for TW. But you are right there has to be some breaking point where the money they could gain from online offerings would make up for the money they would lose, but considering that the majority of people still watch TV on a TV I don't think they are there yet.
 
2014-08-07 10:49:32 AM  

Quantumbunny: No Line For Beer: gfid: HBO could probably sell me a standalone HBOGo subscription for $20 at least while certain shows were airing.

I suspect that every content provider is watching the WWE Network and Netflix very closely to see just how viable the direct-to-consumer market really is.

When Netflix has more subscribers than any single cable or dish provider... exactly why are they still waiting? Amazon instant, Google Play movies, iTunes, Crynchyroll, Amazon Fire TV, Chromecast, Roku, Apple TV... I'm pretty sure the verdict is in. Streaming video is revenue.

I cannot believe it makes fiscal sense for HBO not to have a direct to consumer option without cable subscription. I'd love to see some projection numbers, but seriously, it isn't like offering that will have their cable revenue drop to zero. That's going to be a slow taper. There is only upshot and additional revenue available from those currently pirating... unless the cable providers claim they'll drop HBO. But given the number of people who only have cable because of needing it to get HBO... I have a feeling HBO is holding all the cards in that negotiation. And being the only provider without HBO would be disastrous to the revenue of any of the providers, so HBO can definitely play harder ball there than any single provider. So unless they illegally collude to extort HBO to keep requiring cable subscription... there's just no reason not to.


FTFA:  "HBO's owner, Time Warner, reported that the network produced $548 million in operating profit and $1.42 billion in revenue during the three-month period ended June 30. By comparison, in that same period, Netflix reported $129.6 million in operating income and $1.43 billion in sales."

HBO's current model has them out-profiting Netflix to the tune of $1.5 billion per year.  I'd say they're doing something right.

It does appear, however, that HBO is starting to make deals with internet providers to offer what is essentially standalone HBO.  You're still going through your cable/internet provider (HBO still doesn't want to do the money-handling), but most of these deals are offering HBO on top of internet for $15-20/mo.

It's extremely unlikely that HBO will go completely solo, but they are working to reach people with broadband and no pay television right now.
 
2014-08-07 10:49:45 AM  

MurphyMurphy: It's no small milestone, but Netflix subscribers hardly sign up strictly for Netflix created content. So that's something to consider.

Sure,Netflix has it's own shows, and HBO shows movies it hasn't created, but I think a study would show most people sign up for HBO for their original programming, not movies, while original programming is only one reason (if it is at all) for people signing up to Netflix.

The model is still far superior however. The limp-wristed rollout of on demand services by our nation's cable companies certainly was never going to compete in any real way with a netflix or amazon like service.

And movies are certainly not to be ignored. Which is why if HBO wants their GO to be anything more than an *extra service* with casual viewers (the ones who could give a shiat about their original programming entirely) who prefer Amazon or Netflix, it needs to be able to stand alone/apart from a subscription to the cable channel; and it needs to make serious inroads in the movie dept.


HBO does keep their entire back catalog of original series o Go (well, everything recent, I think some of the real early stuff is missing).

When I my DVR was running low on space and I noticed that I had two seasons of True Blood recorded that I hadn't watched yet I figured it was safe to delete them because I could just catch them back on HBO Go.  Of course, I haven't actually gotten around to doing that yet...
 
2014-08-07 10:58:50 AM  

meanmutton: With Comcast, you can get HBOGo without buying the full cable. I get their 30 MBPs internet plus HBOGo for $40 / month.


Uh what? $40 a month? Are you are new subscriber? I am paying almost $100/month for basic cable + SyFy/Comedy Central channels and HBO. No sports package, no other premium channels. That is AFTER renegotiating when we were at almost $140/mo. Where do you live?
 
2014-08-07 11:06:04 AM  

mechgreg: Game of Thrones may get better numbers, but I think the fact that it is a fantasy show means it doesn't get the kind of acceptance with the general public that the sopranos did. I mean for a lot of people I think it is looked as as a show for nerds.


Except that the data shows this isn't true. It has higher viewership period. First the Sopranos is also a "genre" show, it just so happens that that genre tends to have a broader viewership and more general appeal. But Game of Thrones is also one of a handful of Fantasy properties that has broken the stereotype of being just a show for nerds and clearly has a extremely broad appeal among general audiences. Keep in mind that we have a whole generation of young adults now that grew up with things like Harry Potter as a general cultural phenomenon, as well as their parents.

mechgreg: Not talking about any kind of superiority. And I am not sure if you remember it  but the amount of media attention that the sopranos got when it was on was insane, and I don't see it at that level for any show HBO has playing right now (breaking bad last year had it, and the first few years of Mad Men had it). I didn't start watching until I think season but even before then I knew who most of the characters were. I mean have any of the actors in Game of Thrones been made as famous as The Sopranos made James Gandolfini? Has Game of Thrones cleaned up at awards (like the Emmys) the way The Sopranos did. And that is not even talking about how the Sopranos being a hit totally changed the TV business and made original programming on premium cable a viable thing for those channels to have.


Even seven years ago the number of venues for media attention was much smaller than it is now given the sheer explosion of online media over that time frame. I'm almost certain that if you did a comparison of media commentary Game of Thrones would be vastly ahead of The Sopranos. Most of the big stars of Game of Thrones, until recently, were already quite well known (Sean Bean, Lean Headley, etc). Others were already HBO regulars. And of course a whole slew of them are all kids or just in their 20's. Some (Kitt Harrington) appear to be starting to break out in to other movies. James Gandolfini was well known and identifiable (as are many of the actors in Game of Thrones now) but outside of the Sopranos that didn't exactly translate into mega stardom or anything in the movies. Filming an HBO show is gruelling and long, it doesn't leave a lot of room for other major projects.
 
2014-08-07 11:09:41 AM  

the money is in the banana stand: meanmutton: With Comcast, you can get HBOGo without buying the full cable. I get their 30 MBPs internet plus HBOGo for $40 / month.

Uh what? $40 a month? Are you are new subscriber? I am paying almost $100/month for basic cable + SyFy/Comedy Central channels and HBO. No sports package, no other premium channels. That is AFTER renegotiating when we were at almost $140/mo. Where do you live?


He doesn't have cable at all, just internet and HBOgo.  I would imagine that would be quite a bit cheaper.
 
2014-08-07 11:18:18 AM  
Until sports go direct to consumer, cable will exist and be huge.  I personally think there is a big opportunity for soccer to go direct to consumer.  PL coverage has been great, and I doubt cable is going to be giving that up anytime soon, but would I pay 20 bucks a month for MLS, Bundesliga, La Liga, and Serie A, along with access to past matches?  Heck yeah.
 
2014-08-07 11:20:46 AM  

debug: the money is in the banana stand: meanmutton: With Comcast, you can get HBOGo without buying the full cable. I get their 30 MBPs internet plus HBOGo for $40 / month.

Uh what? $40 a month? Are you are new subscriber? I am paying almost $100/month for basic cable + SyFy/Comedy Central channels and HBO. No sports package, no other premium channels. That is AFTER renegotiating when we were at almost $140/mo. Where do you live?

He doesn't have cable at all, just internet and HBOgo.  I would imagine that would be quite a bit cheaper.


They give you basic cable and HBO to Go.

http://www.comcast.com/shop/xfinity-internetplus-dp-central3?CMP=KNC -I Q_ID_62325602-VQ2-g-VQ3--VQ6-39934580026-VQ16-c-pkw-%2Bcomcast%20%2Bhb o-pmt-b&iq_id=62325602&NUM=2
 
2014-08-07 11:29:22 AM  

MattStafford: Until sports go direct to consumer, cable will exist and be huge.  I personally think there is a big opportunity for soccer to go direct to consumer.  PL coverage has been great, and I doubt cable is going to be giving that up anytime soon, but would I pay 20 bucks a month for MLS, Bundesliga, La Liga, and Serie A, along with access to past matches?  Heck yeah.


Roku has all that for MLS, I think it is like 60 bucks.
 
2014-08-07 11:33:21 AM  

theflatline: debug: the money is in the banana stand: meanmutton: With Comcast, you can get HBOGo without buying the full cable. I get their 30 MBPs internet plus HBOGo for $40 / month.

Uh what? $40 a month? Are you are new subscriber? I am paying almost $100/month for basic cable + SyFy/Comedy Central channels and HBO. No sports package, no other premium channels. That is AFTER renegotiating when we were at almost $140/mo. Where do you live?

He doesn't have cable at all, just internet and HBOgo.  I would imagine that would be quite a bit cheaper.

They give you basic cable and HBO to Go.

http://www.comcast.com/shop/xfinity-internetplus-dp-central3?CMP=KNC -I Q_ID_62325602-VQ2-g-VQ3--VQ6-39934580026-VQ16-c-pkw-%2Bcomcast%20%2Bhb o-pmt-b&iq_id=62325602&NUM=2


Holy crap, can't believe Comcast is now being sensible and logical about including HBOGO with Internet-only packages. I thought the other poster was trolling.
 
2014-08-07 11:36:10 AM  
All HBO has to do to rectify this is allow non-cable subscribers, direct to HBO, for $10-$15/mo.
Same with you, ESPN. Want more money? This is how you do it.
 
2014-08-07 11:59:59 AM  
i would pay $5 a month for hbo (to get it online and be able to hbo go).

that's only $2 less than netflix, which is a much more substantial offering.

/ however, this would set forth a terrible precedent.  i don't want to buy channels peicemeal.  but, hbo is special.  it's better than all other channels combined.
 
2014-08-07 12:03:55 PM  

dj_spanmaster: All HBO has to do to rectify this is allow non-cable subscribers, direct to HBO, for $10-$15/mo.
Same with you, ESPN. Want more money? This is how you do it.


not for espn.  ESPN is the single reason cable is expensive.  the lion's share of your cable bill goes to ESPN.  they make a killing off of every single cable subscriber, regardless of viewership.
 
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