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(Business Insider)   Who knew Instagram geo-tagged every selfie you uploaded? OK, apart from this Russian Buk missile technician   (businessinsider.my) divider line 109
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11324 clicks; posted to Main » on 31 Jul 2014 at 8:24 AM (17 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-31 07:53:44 AM  
Pro-tip:  If you are somewhere you aren't supposed to be, don't take along something that reports your location.

I'm willing to bet that the NSA can track the location of individual Russian units based solely upon the cell phone pings of members of that unit, at least once they leave Russian networks.  Here is how it would work:

Say Ivan, Yuri, and Vlad are all soldiers of the 69th Guards Division based in Nyekulturny, Russia.  The US knows the 69th is based there.  If it can somehow get access to a record of those "pings" (ie., the periodic transmissions cell phones make so that the cell network knows which tower to route calls to), it can see when they move.  Any one individual soldier moving doesn't mean much.  But when the  три комические партнеры  all show up outside of Russian territory at the same time in the same location, it's a pretty good indication that the unit has deployed.
 
2014-07-31 08:15:54 AM  
Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?
 
2014-07-31 08:18:49 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


Wouldn't a US Navy sailor properly trained on their missile systems be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?

shiat like that happens in war zones because it's a farkin' war zone.  Which is why it's smart to avoid war zones.

/War zone.
 
2014-07-31 08:27:59 AM  
dittybopper:
Wouldn't a US Navy sailor properly trained on their missile systems be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?

Good point.
 
2014-07-31 08:30:00 AM  
Why do you guys keep calling the Gadfly a "buk"?
 
2014-07-31 08:30:52 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


ADS-B doesn't work like that. This also isn't really IFF, civilian aircraft transponders are different however from military beacons
 
2014-07-31 08:31:50 AM  

dittybopper: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Wouldn't a US Navy sailor properly trained on their missile systems be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?

shiat like that happens in war zones because it's a farkin' war zone.  Which is why it's smart to avoid war zones.

/War zone.


No one knew the Russians were deploying that kind of hardware. It was considered safe at that altitude.
 
2014-07-31 08:33:46 AM  
This guy is probably less of a Buk technician and more of a missing person by now.
 
2014-07-31 08:34:05 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


Back when I was going through Aaarrrrrmy Training Sir! there was a big push for aircraft identification.  Internal rumors were that this was because of a big field exercise where the ADA folks "shot down" a number of friendlies, so they beefed up the training and reran the exercise.

Turns out the ADA folks were good at aircraft identification- they passed all the tests, so hopes were high for the repeat exercise.

They shot them down again.
 
2014-07-31 08:36:59 AM  

rebelyell2006: Why do you guys keep calling the Gadfly a "buk"?


If you knew enough to go by the NATO reporting name, you should also know enough that GADFLY should be in all caps.
 
2014-07-31 08:38:25 AM  
apart from , or definitely not?
Headline gave my brain a case of the Mondays.
 
2014-07-31 08:40:06 AM  

Glockenspiel Hero: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Back when I was going through Aaarrrrrmy Training Sir! there was a big push for aircraft identification.  Internal rumors were that this was because of a big field exercise where the ADA folks "shot down" a number of friendlies, so they beefed up the training and reran the exercise.

Turns out the ADA folks were good at aircraft identification- they passed all the tests, so hopes were high for the repeat exercise.

They shot them down again.


rule7mediallc.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-07-31 08:41:20 AM  
there is always the possibility Sotkin "spoofed" his GPS signal

Why would he spoof it to show him somewhere he's not supposed to be? Enjoy the gulag
 
2014-07-31 08:42:29 AM  
In Ukraine, selfie take YOUUUU!
 
2014-07-31 08:44:14 AM  
Over at BuzzFeed, reporter Max Seddon has the scoop on a 24-year-old soldier named Alexander Sotkin

I'm guessing Alexander Sotkin is about to have a few bad days weeks months years decades.
 
2014-07-31 08:44:39 AM  
I thought as of now almost every digital camera does that. You can strip that info out, but it takes a little bit of work. And most people know this generation isn't known for "work."
 
2014-07-31 08:47:11 AM  

Glockenspiel Hero: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Back when I was going through Aaarrrrrmy Training Sir! there was a big push for aircraft identification.  Internal rumors were that this was because of a big field exercise where the ADA folks "shot down" a number of friendlies, so they beefed up the training and reran the exercise.

Turns out the ADA folks were good at aircraft identification- they passed all the tests, so hopes were high for the repeat exercise.

They shot them down again.


This is why anti-aircraft facilities shouldn't be wheelchair accessible.
 
2014-07-31 08:49:58 AM  

rebelyell2006: Why do you guys keep calling the Gadfly a "buk"?


Because Fat Albert, that's why
 
2014-07-31 08:50:30 AM  
Well, SOMEONE is now on a one-way trip to Siberia.
 
2014-07-31 08:51:32 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


Well, that, or he was too busy playing Angry Birds. :/
 
2014-07-31 08:52:13 AM  

Ex-Texan: I thought as of now almost every digital camera does that. You can strip that info out, but it takes a little bit of work. And most people know this generation isn't known for "work."


You don't have to strip it out. You just turn it off. And as TFA said, instagram asks if you want to include location data. All you have to do is say 'No'.
 
2014-07-31 08:52:32 AM  
Well, we know where the Buk stops, now.
 
2014-07-31 08:55:16 AM  

dittybopper: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Wouldn't a US Navy sailor properly trained on their missile systems be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?

shiat like that happens in war zones because it's a farkin' war zone.  Which is why it's smart to avoid war zones.

/War zone.


This. Also, from what I have read, the rebels were only given the missile launcher and target acquisition vehicles, and the IFF stuff is conveniently located in the command vehicle. Nice air defense work there, Yuri.
 
2014-07-31 08:56:18 AM  
I am sure the same thing works for those Snapchat selfies everyone thinks are going to self-destruct and not haunt them forever.
 
2014-07-31 08:57:28 AM  

This text is now purple: This is why anti-aircraft facilities shouldn't be wheelchair accessible.


I'll have you know my dog was highly trained by his online correspondence teachers to be an expert at aircraft identification and it is illegal for you to question his credentials or my right to have him in this missile battery. Sir.
 
2014-07-31 08:58:39 AM  

Baradium: No one knew the Russians were deploying that kind of hardware. It was considered safe at that altitude.


Well, separatists have posted on social networks "now we have Buks! We have captured them yadda yadda"... Nobody have believed them, though. :)

And then, of course, they wished they didn't, huh.
 
2014-07-31 08:59:17 AM  

abhorrent1: Ex-Texan: I thought as of now almost every digital camera does that. You can strip that info out, but it takes a little bit of work. And most people know this generation isn't known for "work."

You don't have to strip it out. You just turn it off. And as TFA said, instagram asks if you want to include location data. All you have to do is say 'No'.


Maybe. I suspect they're more Facebook about it in reality.
 
2014-07-31 09:01:42 AM  

This text is now purple: Glockenspiel Hero: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Back when I was going through Aaarrrrrmy Training Sir! there was a big push for aircraft identification.  Internal rumors were that this was because of a big field exercise where the ADA folks "shot down" a number of friendlies, so they beefed up the training and reran the exercise.

Turns out the ADA folks were good at aircraft identification- they passed all the tests, so hopes were high for the repeat exercise.

They shot them down again.

This is why anti-aircraft facilities shouldn't be wheelchair accessible.


Hey, quit hating on the ADA!!  We've got missiles and there's shiat up in the air, what do you think is going to happen?

C Battery, 5/67 Ft Bliss 1970-72  "The First and the Worst"
 
2014-07-31 09:01:42 AM  
When the airstrikes start hitting Russian battalions in Ukraine, are the Russians going to mourn their dead? Or write them off as defectors and traitors who decided unilaterally to cross the border?
 
2014-07-31 09:06:02 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


The missile system alone is unable of making that distinction. To identify the aircraft, it needs to be connected to a larger information network that knows where civilian/friendly aircraft are and can check the tracked object against that database.
=Smidge=
 
2014-07-31 09:06:03 AM  

rebelyell2006: Why do you guys keep calling the Gadfly a "buk"?


Because that's what it's called. "Buk" is thrown around the news because they probably haven't even heard of NATO reporting names. A Bear was discovered flying (how can this be?!) in Britain's airspace a few months ago and the BBC and a couple other news sites I've seen it on reported it as either a Tu-95 or "a Tupolev bomber. I'm just surprised it wasn't called a MiG.
 
2014-07-31 09:06:09 AM  
In related news, a Russian soldier has been boosting about shelling Ukraine on social media.
 
2014-07-31 09:08:44 AM  

dittybopper: Say Ivan, Yuri, and Vlad are all soldiers of the 69th Guards Division based in Nyekulturny, Russia. The US knows the 69th is based there. If it can somehow get access to a record of those "pings" (ie., the periodic transmissions cell phones make so that the cell network knows which tower to route calls to), it can see when they move. Any one individual soldier moving doesn't mean much. But when the три комические партнеры all show up outside of Russian territory at the same time in the same location, it's a pretty good indication that the unit has deployed.


Would one ping only, be enough?
 
2014-07-31 09:11:55 AM  

Shaggy_C: When the airstrikes start hitting Russian battalions in Ukraine, are the Russians going to mourn their dead? Or write them off as defectors and traitors who decided unilaterally to cross the border?


Write them off. Not "defectors or traitors", but as volunteers, who went there by their own private decision and got what's coming to them.

General public in Russia is not interested much in those Russians who are inside Ukraine fighting (I would guess at least 300 or 400 dead bodies of Russian citizens have been already returned to Russia). It's their own choice; it's their own bodybags; nobody cares much.
 
2014-07-31 09:14:31 AM  

Archie Goodwin: Would one ping only, be enough?


img.fark.net

/  Give me a ping, Archiey. One ping, only.
 
2014-07-31 09:14:41 AM  

This text is now purple: abhorrent1: Ex-Texan: I thought as of now almost every digital camera does that. You can strip that info out, but it takes a little bit of work. And most people know this generation isn't known for "work."

You don't have to strip it out. You just turn it off. And as TFA said, instagram asks if you want to include location data. All you have to do is say 'No'.

Maybe. I suspect they're more Facebook about it in reality.


I suppose. Doesn't the device, iphone, ipad, whatever typically also put location data in the exif unless you turn it off?  I suspect most people don't even know that happens or that there's an option to turn it off.
 
2014-07-31 09:15:24 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


Heat of the moment, incompetence, being over ruled by an idiot commander, take your pick.
 
2014-07-31 09:17:31 AM  
He's an out of work Russian actor. Saw him on a Russian Roulette game show.
 
2014-07-31 09:20:05 AM  

dittybopper: nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?

Wouldn't a US Navy sailor properly trained on their missile systems be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?

shiat like that happens in war zones because it's a farkin' war zone.  Which is why it's smart to avoid war zones.

/War zone.


Individual soldiers and sailors generally do not make the decisions to launch a missile anyway (except at the smaller manpads ie stinger level).  You have a whole command and control network  that can extend up to theater level not just  battery or ship level, with an officer making the shoot, don't shoot  decisions.

  So at least in the case of the USS  Vincennes an officer , the Captain of the ship IIRC, gave the order. . Obviously nobody is saying who gave the shoot order in the Ukraine.
 
2014-07-31 09:22:05 AM  

generallyso: In related news, a Russian soldier has been boosting about shelling Ukraine on social media.


We know. We've known for some time. We hoped that the EU would be the ones to take action, because our credibility is hosed thanks to Dubya's Debacle. We've pushed evidence that, clearly, Russia has declared war on and invaded Ukraine - what else would you call it?

Putin's a lying asshole. We know this. Unmarked Russian troops were present, supporting Crimean rebels, when Crimea was taken. We knew it then. The question here is not "is Putin fighting a covert war," because, well, of course he's trying to - the question here is "how many people will die before the EU takes action?" Economic sanctions aren't going to be enough at this point, and the EU seems content with trying to bankrupt Putin's supporters instead of stopping the land grab and fatalities. We're still trying to tie off a futile, decade-plus mess, thanks to the Bush administration, so our efforts and credibility are stretched at this point.

Is cheaper oil really worth letting an airliner full of civilians die unchallenged?
 
2014-07-31 09:24:18 AM  

abhorrent1: there is always the possibility Sotkin "spoofed" his GPS signal

Why would he spoof it to show him somewhere he's not supposed to be? Enjoy the gulag polonium

.
 
2014-07-31 09:26:17 AM  

Shaggy_C: When the airstrikes start hitting Russian battalions in Ukraine, are the Russians going to mourn their dead? Or write them off as defectors and traitors who decided unilaterally to cross the border?


They write them off as "volunteers", and quietly ship the pieces they can find back to Russia.
 
2014-07-31 09:31:35 AM  

FormlessOne: generallyso: In related news, a Russian soldier has been boosting about shelling Ukraine on social media.

We know. We've known for some time. We hoped that the EU would be the ones to take action, because our credibility is hosed thanks to Dubya's Debacle. We've pushed evidence that, clearly, Russia has declared war on and invaded Ukraine - what else would you call it?

Putin's a lying asshole. We know this. Unmarked Russian troops were present, supporting Crimean rebels, when Crimea was taken. We knew it then. The question here is not "is Putin fighting a covert war," because, well, of course he's trying to - the question here is "how many people will die before the EU takes action?" Economic sanctions aren't going to be enough at this point, and the EU seems content with trying to bankrupt Putin's supporters instead of stopping the land grab and fatalities. We're still trying to tie off a futile, decade-plus mess, thanks to the Bush administration, so our efforts and credibility are stretched at this point.

Is cheaper oil really worth letting an airliner full of civilians die unchallenged?


So how long do these things last? Has the warranty expired on Gulf of Tonkin or Bay of Pigs? Is Spain still cheesed about The Maine?
 
2014-07-31 09:31:48 AM  
Over at BuzzFeed, reporter Max Seddon has the scoop on a 24-year-old soldier named Alexander Sotkin who has been posting some very interesting photos of his military service, and the locations of the photos are rather telling. disappeared under mysterious circumstanses. He was last seen having sushi with President Putin.
 
2014-07-31 09:32:09 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


That system is not capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner on its own. I'm sure it can spot IFF, to avoid friendly fire against own forces, but it's a tactical system that doesn't show a lot of info about the blips on its screen. If it's networked into a centralized system, it will be told what are civilian aircraft, but as a stand-alone (as it would be operated by the separatists), it can't tell.
 
2014-07-31 09:32:38 AM  

gfid: rebelyell2006: Why do you guys keep calling the Gadfly a "buk"?

Because Fat Albert, that's why


MH-17 was the baddest Buck Buck breaker in the world...
 
2014-07-31 09:33:59 AM  
They're making missiles out of bukake? That's just gross.
 
2014-07-31 09:35:48 AM  

FormlessOne: Economic sanctions aren't going to be enough at this point, and the EU seems content with trying to bankrupt Putin's supporters instead of stopping the land grab and fatalities


Yes they are. Economic sanctions are the only sensible way to deal with this. There is no upside to the EU, UN or NATO trying to muscle Russia militarily on their border with Ukraine. It's militarily unfeasible, and diplomatically stupid, not to mention something the Ukrainians would oppose (nobody wants open war with Russia). Fortunately, no sensible person is proposing military action against Russia, just Internet armchair generals.
 
2014-07-31 09:36:01 AM  

nekom: Wouldn't a Russian soldier properly trained on that missile system be capable of distinguishing a civilian airliner from a military jet?  Or is that system not capable of ADS-B or IFF?


The BUK is supposed ot be deployed in conjuction witht he Russian equivalent of an AWACS plane which is what handles the Target ID and selection ideally, the BUK, being 1979 Russian tech (so figure equivalent to 1960's era US stuff)   doesn't have that capability on board
 
2014-07-31 09:37:19 AM  
img.fark.net

The selfie in question...
 
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