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(CNN)   UN Secretary General to Hamas and Israeli forces: "This is wrong. You must stop fighting." Of course both sides lay down their weapons and hug each other   (cnn.com ) divider line
    More: Unlikely, Gaza, dispute, Ben-Gurion, Israeli Security Forces, United Nations Relief, FAA, cease-fire  
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898 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Jul 2014 at 6:07 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-25 07:25:11 PM  

unlikely: But then someone from Gaza threw a pencil at Bibi and the IDF shouted SELF DEFENSE while pouring white phosphorous on a completely unrelated family who were tied to the chair while the rest of the UN nodded in assent and sympathy.


LOL, when has the UN ever approved of anything Israel does?
 
2014-07-25 07:27:15 PM  

Daedalus27: unlikely: But then someone from Gaza threw a pencil at Bibi and the IDF shouted SELF DEFENSE while pouring white phosphorous on a completely unrelated family who were tied to the chair while the rest of the UN nodded in assent and sympathy.

LOL, when has the UN ever approved of anything Israel does?


They're pretty consistent in their opposition to melting humans.
 
2014-07-25 07:29:26 PM  
"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
-Golda Meir
 
2014-07-25 07:36:35 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: RedPhoenix122: vernonFL: Charge both Netanyahu and Meshaal with war crimes.

Arrest them

This...isn't a bad idea.

/i can see the leader of Hamas getting arrested for lobbing rockets into civilian areas, and they are coming out of civilian areas as well.  What do you suggest the Israelis do? They have to shoot back at something.  So they shoot back at where the rockets come from.  Then the derpers in hamas film the casualties in Gaza, and say "omg....look at how bad Israel is...they are bombing CHILDREN".  When it was Hamas that started it by firing weapons out of Gaza neighborhoods.   Propaganda...look it up.


I've got an idea. Quit carrying water for religious extremists!
 
2014-07-25 07:38:02 PM  

Moopy Mac: Bit'O'Gristle: RedPhoenix122: vernonFL: Charge both Netanyahu and Meshaal with war crimes.

Arrest them

This...isn't a bad idea.

/i can see the leader of Hamas getting arrested for lobbing rockets into civilian areas, and they are coming out of civilian areas as well.  What do you suggest the Israelis do? They have to shoot back at something.  So they shoot back at where the rockets come from.  Then the derpers in hamas film the casualties in Gaza, and say "omg....look at how bad Israel is...they are bombing CHILDREN".  When it was Hamas that started it by firing weapons out of Gaza neighborhoods.   Propaganda...look it up.

I've got an idea. Quit carrying water for religious extremists!




/Sense, your post makes none.
 
2014-07-25 07:38:04 PM  

Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.


Doesn't help that Israel knows the building still have civies in them, but bombs them anyways.  That makes it a war crime as far as i'm concerned.
 
2014-07-25 07:38:18 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Daedalus27: unlikely: But then someone from Gaza threw a pencil at Bibi and the IDF shouted SELF DEFENSE while pouring white phosphorous on a completely unrelated family who were tied to the chair while the rest of the UN nodded in assent and sympathy.

LOL, when has the UN ever approved of anything Israel does?

They're pretty consistent in their opposition to melting humans.


If they were, where have the hundreds of declarations against Hamas, Hezbollah, the PLO, or other organizations that have attacked Israel over the years with unguided rockets and bombings.  I am fine with giving Israel shiat for all the horrors of their policy (settlements, collective punishment, etc.)  if they would at least cast their gaze somewhat equally.  It is kinda hard to take the criticism seriously when Israel when trying to target military forces is getting lambasted in the media and UN, yet the Hamas firing rockets indiscriminantly at civilian targets which thankfully are largely protected by defensive measures like Iron Dome.  Would there be less criticism if there was a thousand Israeli deaths if Hamas was more competent in their attacks in the present round of the conflict?
 
2014-07-25 07:39:59 PM  

wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: 
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.


No, it's your fault for trying to appear more clever than you are. But sticking with the ad hominem is a nice touch.
 
2014-07-25 07:43:27 PM  

Eshkar: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
-Golda Meir


Why? Because the Israeli government is perfectly willing to kill Palestinian children?
Is there a better example of a lose/lose scenario?

static.giantbomb.com
 
2014-07-25 07:46:14 PM  

Antimatter: Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.

Doesn't help that Israel knows the building still have civies in them, but bombs them anyways.  That makes it a war crime as far as i'm concerned ...


/Its not Israels fault the terrorists use Gaza residents as human meat shields / victims for propaganda.  What would you suggest Israel do?  Just lay back and suck up the rockets and do nothing?  fark that, fire back, i would, you would, and so does Israel.  The terrorists using Gaza civilians as shields, and their subsequent deaths are nobody's fault but Hamas and others of their ilk.  If you can't see that, I'm sorry, i have explained it as clearly as i could.
 
2014-07-25 07:48:02 PM  

Antimatter: Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.

Doesn't help that Israel knows the building still have civies in them, but bombs them anyways.  That makes it a war crime as far as i'm concerned ...


Well I am glad you don't get to decide war crimes... Hamas is using that location to fire on Israel; according to international law Hamas is responsible for the loss of civilian lives in such a situation.  They have committed the war crime not Israel.  Also Israel doesn't usually know civilians are present.  When Israeli Pilots see evidence of Civilians... like when Hamas parades them on roof tops the Pilots will call off the attack.  Israel is acting under the assumption that once proper notification is given the premises are no longer occupied.

The war crimes are digging terror tunnels into Israel with the plan to use them to attack and kill innocent Israelis during Rosh Hashanah.
 
2014-07-25 07:48:34 PM  

drjekel_mrhyde: If there was a God/Allah/Yahweh he/she would've sent a radioactive meteor to the Middle East 5000 years ago.


moviebyte.com

I think he did.

worldnewspress.net
 
2014-07-25 07:50:07 PM  

Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: 
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.

No, it's your fault for trying to appear more clever than you are. But sticking with the ad hominem is a nice touch.


Speaking of hypocrisy, do you realize that your retort is pure ad hominem? In contrast, I provided an exposition that corrected your strained interpretation of my post. I admit I insult you after providing a actual argument about why your were wrong. In contrast, you merely insult me. So in a game of intellectual limbo, you win. I cannot bend my spine enough to go lower than you.
 
2014-07-25 07:54:15 PM  

wademh: Eshkar: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
-Golda Meir

Why? Because the Israeli government is perfectly willing to kill Palestinian children?
Is there a better example of a lose/lose scenario?

[static.giantbomb.com image 246x319]


No, Hamas is more than willing to make their Children martyrs to destroy Israel.  They teach them from a young age that there is nothing more important than destroying Israel and there is nothing more glorious than sacrificing themselves to do so.  What Prime Minister Golda Meir was saying is that once the Arabs love their children enough to not teach them to kill themselves in the pursuit of destroying Israel then... and only then can there truly be peace.

Don't twist Golda Meir's words...
 
2014-07-25 07:56:12 PM  

wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh:
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.


Wow. You just turned the bullshiat up to 11 with that one. Keep digging that hole...
 
2014-07-25 08:00:05 PM  

wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: 
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.

No, it's your fault for trying to appear more clever than you are. But sticking with the ad hominem is a nice touch.

Speaking of hypocrisy, do you realize that your retort is pure ad hominem? In contrast, I provided an exposition that corrected your strained interpretation of my post. I admit I insult you after providing a actual argument about why your were wrong. In contrast, you merely insult me. So in a game of intellectual limbo, you win. I cannot bend my spine enough to go lower than you.


.... I see you have.
 
2014-07-25 08:00:29 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)


8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you never ever lose your shiat when one of your own dies. COIN ops 101. Israel has not and does not want to do the right thing, so why are we still supporting them?
 
2014-07-25 08:04:19 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: /Its not Israels fault the terrorists use Gaza residents as human meat shields / victims for propaganda.  What would you suggest Israel do?  Just lay back and suck up the rockets and do nothing?  fark that, fire back, i would, you would, and so does Israel.  The terrorists using Gaza civilians as shields, and their subsequent deaths are nobody's fault but Hamas and others of their ilk.  If you can't see that, I'm sorry, i have explained it as clearly as i could.


You are correct that Hamas is all too willing, perhaps even anxious, to use innocent human shields for their attacks on Israel. In fact, the "value" of their attacks are probably more in the retaliatory casualties (as a propaganda tool) than in any damage they do to Israel or Israelis. It's a painful cynicism.

But you ask, "what do you suggest Israel do? "

Well I suggest they not continue to add and support settlements in the occupied territories. I suggest they back off the economic oppression of the territories. I suggest they stop aggressively supplying motivation for Hamas to attack Israel.

Both sides are so hell bent self-justified that they apparently think that they can engage in immoral activity that will induce "worse" immoral activity in their foes. The whole of the conflict has devolved into self-justified moralizing that their actions are worse than mine.

It's long past time to quit buying what either side is selling. "He hit me first" is not legitimate.
 
2014-07-25 08:05:40 PM  

nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you never ever lose your shiat w ...


/Why are you defending terrorists? Who's side are you on? If you love them so much, go join up.  You might look good in a towel for a hat.
 
2014-07-25 08:07:18 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: Antimatter: Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.

Doesn't help that Israel knows the building still have civies in them, but bombs them anyways.  That makes it a war crime as far as i'm concerned ...

/Its not Israels fault the terrorists use Gaza residents as human meat shields / victims for propaganda.  What would you suggest Israel do?  Just lay back and suck up the rockets and do nothing?  fark that, fire back, i would, you would, and so does Israel.  The terrorists using Gaza civilians as shields, and their subsequent deaths are nobody's fault but Hamas and others of their ilk.  If you can't see that, I'm sorry, i have explained it as clearly as i could.


See my previous post. I would not blindly bomb. And the fact you think everyone else would speaks volumes about yourself. No, I would do the right thing which means getting in there and fixing the problem, not throwing high explosives at it and hope it stops.
 
2014-07-25 08:09:12 PM  

spacelord321: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh:
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.

Wow. You just turned the bullshiat up to 11 with that one. Keep digging that hole...


You don't seem able to actually address his logic, and that is presumably the essence of your response.
 
2014-07-25 08:12:30 PM  

J Noble Daggett: spacelord321: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh: Stone Meadow: wademh:
Get down off your high horse. If you want to weasel out of my point by attacking my supposed lack of reading comprehension then consider that I ended the sentence with an interrogative, implying an open question. I'm just sick and tired of "glass parking lot" replies, and your veiled reference happened to be the one I chose to respond to.

Then, you have chosen __poorly__. As it was clear I dismissed the "glass parking lot" option by saying that would make me as bad as the people who I am so frustrated with. So I repeat my comment about reading comprehension.

Not hardly. You wrote, "I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack."

It's acknowledging it's suicidal nature, but says NOTHING about it making you as bad as those with whom you are so frustrated with.

Well then, I guess if you are OK with suicide attacks that might be true. It is my fault for presuming that suicide attacks are self-evidently evil, and further that there is an added hypocrisy alluded to in hating people who are consumed with hate so much that you kill them. I did not spell that out for you. Apologies for over-estimating my audience.

Wow. You just turned the bullshiat up to 11 with that one. Keep digging that hole...

You don't seem able to actually address his logic, and that is presumably the essence of your response.


I saw no logic. I saw someone performing mental gymnastics to convince him/herself that they were right.
 
2014-07-25 08:17:15 PM  

Eshkar: wademh: Eshkar: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
-Golda Meir

Why? Because the Israeli government is perfectly willing to kill Palestinian children?
Is there a better example of a lose/lose scenario?

[static.giantbomb.com image 246x319]

No, Hamas is more than willing to make their Children martyrs to destroy Israel.  They teach them from a young age that there is nothing more important than destroying Israel and there is nothing more glorious than sacrificing themselves to do so.  What Prime Minister Golda Meir was saying is that once the Arabs love their children enough to not teach them to kill themselves in the pursuit of destroying Israel then... and only then can there truly be peace.

Don't twist Golda Meir's words...


Please explain where I twisted her words. You have asserted this generic about how effectively all Palestinians train all their children to be suicide bombers. Sorry, but that's superficial bullpuckey. At the same time, there is a significant minority that do so. There is also a significant minority of Israelis that are uber-zionists who think Jews should take over all of Palestine. Extremes exist.

I object to the attitude that it is all up to "them". It is not completely one sided and attitudes that it is all up to the 'other side' are the essence of the conflict. And that is the essence of her words.
 
2014-07-25 08:17:57 PM  
Nubserz, I never said, EVERYONE should blindly bomb...tyvm. I said...HAMAS fires unguided rockets into civilian areas.  Israel uses guided munitions, AND they actually warn people beforehand.  Try reading my post before you assume to know my personality.  And your "fix it" of "getting in there and fixing the problem" is crap.  That "plan" lacks..well..plan. "Get in there and fix it" is pretty vague dude. Try again, you could always fall back to insulting me again if you have no valid plan / argument.  Seems to be working for you so far.
 
2014-07-25 08:18:26 PM  

nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you never ever lose your shiat w ...


Number 1.... Israel has not committed war crimes.

Number 2. Israel has tried the whole lets be friends shtick... it didn't work, they destroyed anything we gave them to help them economically... because the Jews gave it to them, they crossed the borders with bombs strapped to themselves and blew up buses full of civilians, coffee shops, and etc.

Number 3. Fighting a war in a foreign country is much different than fighting one an hour or two from your own HOUSE.

Number 4.  Something evidently you don't grasp nor does most the rest of world who isn't living it, Israel is under constant attack... and giving up settlements and doing the whole "Two State" "solution" isn't going to solve the problem... these people's mandate is to literally  wipe Israel off the map.  You could give them the West Bank and Jerusalem and next week they would be attacking Tel Aviv.

Israel is fighting for survival... not for oil, not as revenge for terrorist attacks... nope they are actually fighting for their very existence.  Within the vast terror tunnels Hamas built plans have been found for a massive attack on Israel during Rosh Hashanah... using terror tunnels to attack Israeli citizens... the plan was for mass slaughter.  Hamas being backed by Iran and Qatar (and who knows who else) are trying to wipe Israel off the map.  So call me when you are fighting an hour from your house for the very survival of your Homeland.  When your neighbors house had a rocket fall through the roof, when your cousin was sitting in a coffee shop enjoying his morning coffee and a suicide bomber detonated himself,  when your parents and grandparents have 20 - 30 seconds to make it to a bomb shelter before a rocket hits.
 
2014-07-25 08:21:43 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you never ever lose your shiat w ...

/Why are you defending terrorists? Who's side are you on? If you love them so much, go join up.  You might look good in a towel for a hat.


Oh I get it, your trolling. Either that or stupid. So let me break this down Barney style for you:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-insurgency

That's a decent overview of what counter insurgency operations are. Now, tell me, where in the hell does it say "blow up civilians." Don't pass the buck and say hamas does it. Everyone knows that. They are terrorists. But the Israeli government has the resources and backing to pull off a successful counter insurgency if they wanted to. But instead they just bomb. That doesn't solve anything. It makes the problem worse. If you don't believe that, look up the battle for Britain.

I know this because I was an infantryman in the marines for five years. I led patrols in Afghanistan, worked with the locals, and had friends get blown up. So kindly explain to me exactly what the fark have you done to improve the situation and what is your expertise? None? Then be quiet while the adults are talking.
 
2014-07-25 08:21:59 PM  

wademh: Eshkar: wademh: Eshkar: "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us."
-Golda Meir

Why? Because the Israeli government is perfectly willing to kill Palestinian children?
Is there a better example of a lose/lose scenario?

[static.giantbomb.com image 246x319]

No, Hamas is more than willing to make their Children martyrs to destroy Israel.  They teach them from a young age that there is nothing more important than destroying Israel and there is nothing more glorious than sacrificing themselves to do so.  What Prime Minister Golda Meir was saying is that once the Arabs love their children enough to not teach them to kill themselves in the pursuit of destroying Israel then... and only then can there truly be peace.

Don't twist Golda Meir's words...

Please explain where I twisted her words. You have asserted this generic about how effectively all Palestinians train all their children to be suicide bombers. Sorry, but that's superficial bullpuckey. At the same time, there is a significant minority that do so. There is also a significant minority of Israelis that are uber-zionists who think Jews should take over all of Palestine. Extremes exist.

I object to the attitude that it is all up to "them". It is not completely one sided and attitudes that it is all up to the 'other side' are the essence of the conflict. And that is the essence of her words.


I didn't say Palestinians... I said Hamas.  And it really is up to them.  As I have stated previously even if we did give them the West Bank and Jerusalem... they would be attacking Tel Aviv tomorrow. Their goal is to eradicate Israel.
 
2014-07-25 08:22:27 PM  

spacelord321: J Noble Daggett: spacelord321:
You don't seem able to actually address his logic, and that is presumably the essence of your response.

I saw no logic. I saw someone performing mental gymnastics to convince him/herself that they were right.


Consult your medical insurance and see if it cover optometry. Have then test for extreme perceptional bias.
 
2014-07-25 08:30:56 PM  
Nubzers,
First of all, if you WERE a marine, then thank you for your service. Second...bombs blow up terrorists. True, they also blow up civilians, but it's not Israels fault that the terrorists hide behind them. So if i get your post (without the crappy shiatty insults) you would advise that every time a rocket is fired from Gaza into Israel they should mount a counter-insurgency operation into Gaza? LOL. Man, that's not gonna happen. Those farkers are firing hundreds of rockets a day from all over Gaza. The only way YOUR idea would work, is to occupy Gaza forever, and that's not going to happen either. You would suggest that every time a rocket is fired, they send in men. Men who would likely die. I was in the Army long ago, and i have to say, I'm glad your ass wasn't my Sgt. You would have gotten us all fragged with your derpy laden plan of SOP.
 
2014-07-25 08:38:02 PM  

nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you neve ...


You don't intentionally blow up civilians,  however when civilians are occupying a military site or actively run into an area that has been warned an attack is imminent, can you really consider them civilians at that point?  You can absolutely kill civilians in attacks if the military value of an attack outweighs the collateral damage.   If there is a rocket launch site and munitions storage facility capable of supplying an attack on an area that is also occupied by a family or two, you can be military justified in destroying that facility even with civilians present.  Heck, you are almost obligated to do so since if you don't hit that target, you are allowing the enemy to use human shields to commit harm on your own people.

Ultimately, few people want civilians to die in war.  It is counterproductive to the objectives of a campaign. The fact that civilians die is horrible, but that doesn't make it a war crime.  Screaming it as such fails to understand the nature and laws of war.  Furthermore it tends to overlook the actual war crimes being committed by those targeted by Israel of utilizing human shields, launching indiscriminate rocket attacks on civilian areas, and other associated crimes.

I am not suggesting that Israel is innocent or that the Palestinians don't have legitimate grievances against Israeli policy.  Economic blockades, collective punishment on society as well as individual families with the destruction of "terrorist houses", increased settlement building, etc., these are horribly unproductive actions harming the Palestinians.  They certainly fuel the resentment and frustration that allow for hostilities to commence.  However, this negative conduct by Israel does not excuse the actual war crimes being committed by Hamas nor does it render that Israeli military action is inappropriate in response.
 
2014-07-25 08:45:18 PM  

nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you neve ...


Let me spell this out for you Marine... you don't understand the situation on the ground.  What you experienced in Afghanistan is different from what is occurring in Israel.  In Iraq and Afghanistan the US bombed the crap out of both theaters before boots touched the ground... how many innocent civilians died?  Israel did the same, we weren't sending soldiers in to conduct a proper counter insurgency until Hamas was drove to ground... well for them underground. Israeli Pilots have standing orders that they can call off attacks if they see or suspect civilians are present... and they have many many times.  The problem is a lot of the time a rocket is fired the jet goes in and the pilot sees heat signature in the building.. .but since they just launched a terrorist rocket at his house or neighbors house he is going to fire unless he sees proof something that makes him believe there are civilians in that house.  If Hamas is making civilians stay in that house it isn't the pilots or Israel's fault... it is Hamas' fault.  Sadly bad shiat happens in war, but hopefully these poor people will soon be freed from Hamas and allowed to live a full life free of oppression.
 
2014-07-25 08:49:21 PM  
Eshkar, Favorited. FINALLY a voice of clear reason and logic.

/jesus.
 
2014-07-25 08:50:38 PM  

MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.


Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?
 
2014-07-25 08:53:32 PM  

Eshkar: Let me spell this out for you Marine... you don't understand the situation on the ground. What you experienced in Afghanistan is different from what is occurring in Israel. In Iraq and Afghanistan the US bombed the crap out of both theaters before boots touched the ground... how many innocent civilians died? Israel did the same, we weren't sending soldiers in to conduct a proper counter insurgency until Hamas was drove to ground... well for them underground. Israeli Pilots have standing orders that they can call off attacks if they see or suspect civilians are present... and they have many many times. The problem is a lot of the time a rocket is fired the jet goes in and the pilot sees heat signature in the building.. .but since they just launched a terrorist rocket at his house or neighbors house he is going to fire unless he sees proof something that makes him believe there are civilians in that house. If Hamas is making civilians stay in that house it isn't the pilots or Israel's fault... it is Hamas' fault. Sadly bad shiat happens in war, but hopefully these poor people will soon be freed from Hamas and allowed to live a full life free of oppression.


BS BS BS.
Israel is in complete denial of the fact that it is illegally occupying the territories and subjugating the Palestinian people. Yes, there exists an element of self-defense in their actions but that does not matter one wit to most of the individuals who now live in the occupied territories. The individuals who were born in the occupied territories deserve better than they get under the Israeli occupation.

Israel is under threat from multiple powers in the region. That does not change anything for a person living in the occupied territories. They are under threat from Israel. The situation requires transcendence. Tit for tat, eye or an eye 'justice' resolves nothing.
 
2014-07-25 09:01:23 PM  

Born_Again_Bavarian: MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.

Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?


Actually the US didn't buy Israel shiat.  Israel perfected the US anti-ballistic missile tech the US has never been able to get to work... Israel made it work so well it can take small rockets out (compared to a nuke).  The US paid for it... but what they paid for was Israeli tech know how.
 
2014-07-25 09:12:07 PM  

J Noble Daggett: spacelord321: J Noble Daggett: spacelord321:
You don't seem able to actually address his logic, and that is presumably the essence of your response.

I saw no logic. I saw someone performing mental gymnastics to convince him/herself that they were right.

Consult your medical insurance proctologist and see if it covers optometry butt-hurt.


FTFY
 
2014-07-25 09:12:11 PM  
Stop!  Or I shall say, "Stop!" again.
 
2014-07-25 09:13:50 PM  

Born_Again_Bavarian: MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.

Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?

Or Hamas can stop firing missiles into Isreal and using the poor people of gaza as human shields. Why would we give one of the most dangerous terrorist organizations a missile system? Because the arming of Isis is working out so well in Syria. Maybe a better solution would be Arabs turning on Hamas and saying hell no you are not putting your missiles in our homes, schools, or hospitals.
 
2014-07-25 09:14:31 PM  

Eshkar: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local leaders, and you neve ...

Let me spell this out for you Marine... you don't understand the situation on the ground.  What you experienced in Afghanistan is different from what is occurring in Israel.  In Iraq and Afghanistan the US bombed the crap out of both theaters before boots touched the ground... how many innocent civilians died?  Israel did the same, we weren't sending soldiers in to conduct a proper counter insurgency until Hamas was drove to ground... well for them underground. Israeli Pilots have standing orders that they can call off attacks if they see or suspect civilians are present... and they have many many times.  The problem is a lot of the time a rocket is fired the jet goes in and the pilot sees heat signature in the building.. .but since they just launched a terrorist rocket at his house or neighbors house he is going to fire unless he sees proof something that makes him believe there are civilians in that house.  If Hamas is making civilians stay in that house it isn't the pilots or Israel's fault... it is Hamas' fault.  Sadly bad shiat happens in war, but hopefully these poor people will soon be freed from Hamas and allowed to live a full life free of oppression.


I understand this. I was briefed time and time again on the law of ground warfare and when we were cleared to fire. If they fire from a hospital or mosque, you are allowed to fire back as they were the ones who violated the law. You are legally absolved as long as you use a proportionate response I.e they fire a rifle, return fire with your rifle, not a JDAM. Now, that's legally speaking of course, but when you start racking up a civilian body count while doing that, that's when you need to change your SOP. It doesn't comfort the family by saying "well, legally, we aren't wrong for killing your kid, he was just collateral." Yes, bad shiat happens in war, but if you aren't doing your best to prevent it, then you are complicit. And the war crimes I'm referring to are using white phosphorus in heavily populated areas with the intent of using it's incendiary effects to harm and kill. That is a war crime. As for occupying indefinitely, I don't think that would be a problem considering they are, as you say, only an hour from home and it directly threatens them. Counter insurgency is hard work. It is. The situation is complicated and difficult, but if all you want to do is repeat the same shiat as before, you get no sympathy. Bombings without a follow up on the ground is worse than useless, it's counter productive.
 
2014-07-25 09:16:56 PM  

Eshkar: Born_Again_Bavarian: MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.

Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?

Actually the US didn't buy Israel shiat.  Israel perfected the US anti-ballistic missile tech the US has never been able to get to work... Israel made it work so well it can take small rockets out (compared to a nuke).  The US paid for it... but what they paid for was Israeli tech know how.


Israel can't make anything on their own.

The IAF's air defense layout was initially equipped with two batteries funded by Israel, and was later upgraded to an additional two batteries that were funded by the US (so far, the US has funded construction for four Iron Dome batteries). The US Congress recently began the process to approve an additional grant of $600 million to fund four supplementary batteries and a substantial quantity of interception missiles.

Under the assumption that the special budget will be approved, the IDF is preparing to operate a total of ten Iron Dome batteries.


http://www.israeldefense.com/?CategoryID=411&ArticleID=1351

It should bother me that we are so blatantly taking sides in this conflict, but I can't help but chuckle at the idea that the IDF is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars ever time someone fires a $500 rocket out of Gaza (Even if it is US taxpayer money).  Someone in the US is getting really rich off of this.
 
2014-07-25 09:17:53 PM  
Don't make me flick the lights on and off.
 
2014-07-25 09:18:58 PM  

Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.



you are so good, I'm not even going to ask you for a citation.
Now do these ones:
newsjunkiepost.com
I understand that Israel is defending against the rockets coming from Gaza.
I just found it interesting when I looked up how many people have died from these rocket attacks, the answer shocked me.
Since 2001: 28.

How many people died in Gaza yesterday?


/really we can do this all day
//just GIS israeli+brutality+children and start explaining why those kids keep hitting themselves
 
2014-07-25 09:20:47 PM  

J Noble Daggett: Eshkar: Let me spell this out for you Marine... you don't understand the situation on the ground. What you experienced in Afghanistan is different from what is occurring in Israel. In Iraq and Afghanistan the US bombed the crap out of both theaters before boots touched the ground... how many innocent civilians died? Israel did the same, we weren't sending soldiers in to conduct a proper counter insurgency until Hamas was drove to ground... well for them underground. Israeli Pilots have standing orders that they can call off attacks if they see or suspect civilians are present... and they have many many times. The problem is a lot of the time a rocket is fired the jet goes in and the pilot sees heat signature in the building.. .but since they just launched a terrorist rocket at his house or neighbors house he is going to fire unless he sees proof something that makes him believe there are civilians in that house. If Hamas is making civilians stay in that house it isn't the pilots or Israel's fault... it is Hamas' fault. Sadly bad shiat happens in war, but hopefully these poor people will soon be freed from Hamas and allowed to live a full life free of oppression.

BS BS BS.
Israel is in complete denial of the fact that it is illegally occupying the territories and subjugating the Palestinian people. Yes, there exists an element of self-defense in their actions but that does not matter one wit to most of the individuals who now live in the occupied territories. The individuals who were born in the occupied territories deserve better than they get under the Israeli occupation.

Israel is under threat from multiple powers in the region. That does not change anything for a person living in the occupied territories. They are under threat from Israel. The situation requires transcendence. Tit for tat, eye or an eye 'justice' resolves nothing.


Really... Jordan gave Israel the West Bank as part of their treaty after we kicked their asses.  Egypt lost Gaza as a result of taking part in that same ass kicking.  The people living there were Jordanian Citizens in the West Bank and Egyptian Citizens in Gaza... both countries then stripped them of their respective citizenship's... There has never been a Palestine as a country... just territories named such because that is what Rome named Israel after the Great Rebellion ending in the year 70 CE.  All of the sudden you want Israel to take responsibility for a hostile people that wish for it's demise in lands where the actual correct action would have been for Jordan and Egypt to evacuate their citizens the second they handed those lands over to Israel after the war.  The land is not illegally occupied.  Unfortunately what Jordan and Egypt wanted to occur has occurred,  Israel is stuck with their citizens... who hate us.  So I really think we should just do what the US did with the Dominican Republic, make it a demilitarized territory, give it a non-voting representative in the Knesset and allow it some symbalence of self governance, while controlling border security and helping to setup economic systems and a police force made up of Palestinians.  After a decade of non-violence take down the walls and allow more free flow between it and Israel.

But none of that can occur until Hamas is destroyed and the people are freed from their oppression.
 
2014-07-25 09:21:25 PM  

MadeInDetroit: Born_Again_Bavarian: MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.

Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?
Or Hamas can stop firing missiles into Isreal and using the poor people of gaza as human shields. Why would we give one of the most dangerous terrorist organizations a missile system? Because the arming of Isis is working out so well in Syria. Maybe a better solution would be Arabs turning on Hamas and saying hell no you are not putting your missiles in our homes, schools, or hospitals.


The Palestinians that choose to join Hamas do it not out of religious fervor, but out of a thirst for revenge, out of desperation, out of starvation.  They merely use religion as a moral shield.

Their behaviour is abhorrent, but it is to be expected.  Israel is the only one with the power to end this cycle, by giving the Palestinians the power to sustain themselves, to feed themselves, to give them the freedom to come and go as they please, to eliminate curfews and border checkpoints and walls and roaming gangs of bloodthirsty Israeli police .
 
2014-07-25 09:23:15 PM  
Eshkar: But none of that can occur until Hamas is destroyed and the people are freed from their oppression.

I hope you understand that the oppressors, in this case, are the Israelis, and not Hamas...
 
2014-07-25 09:28:30 PM  

Born_Again_Bavarian: Eshkar: Born_Again_Bavarian: MadeInDetroit: Israel uses missiles to shield its people. Hamas uses people to shield its missiles.

Maybe we can buy Hamas an iron dome like we did the Israelis?  You know, to even things out?

Actually the US didn't buy Israel shiat.  Israel perfected the US anti-ballistic missile tech the US has never been able to get to work... Israel made it work so well it can take small rockets out (compared to a nuke).  The US paid for it... but what they paid for was Israeli tech know how.

Israel can't make anything on their own.

The IAF's air defense layout was initially equipped with two batteries funded by Israel, and was later upgraded to an additional two batteries that were funded by the US (so far, the US has funded construction for four Iron Dome batteries). The US Congress recently began the process to approve an additional grant of $600 million to fund four supplementary batteries and a substantial quantity of interception missiles.

Under the assumption that the special budget will be approved, the IDF is preparing to operate a total of ten Iron Dome batteries.

http://www.israeldefense.com/?CategoryID=411&ArticleID=1351

It should bother me that we are so blatantly taking sides in this conflict, but I can't help but chuckle at the idea that the IDF is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars ever time someone fires a $500 rocket out of Gaza (Even if it is US taxpayer money).  Someone in the US is getting really rich off of this.


Because the hamas terrorist cannot afford anything more then a $500 unguided missile; imagine if the snackbar's could buy improved weapons? Pretty sure they would nuke Israel if they could; just like the rest of Israel's neighbors. Either way I support Israel, the hamas will continue to fight; and continue to lob unguided rockets into israel even after this conflict is over. I'm sorry so many Palestine's are getting killed; but your own neighbors are assholes by shooting rockets at civilians themselves.

Only way I can see the Hama's are getting weapons; is from the Iranians through Egypt.
 
2014-07-25 09:28:43 PM  

nubzers: Eshkar: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: nubzers: Bit'O'Gristle: 1. Hamas wants Israel for its "holy" areas.
2. Hamas lobs unguided rockets into Israel blowing up random buildings and injuring and killing civilians.
3. Hamas uses civilian buildings for cover to fire their derp rockets.
4. Israel gets tired of being bombed, so they fire back at the area the rockets are coming from, or, when they get pissed enough, invade Gaza and do a house to house trying to root out the religious nut jobs who are trying to kill them.
5. Everyone gets pissed at Israel for killing civilians, even though they use guided munitions, where Hamas uses unguided "hope this kills someone" rockets."
6. Hamas posts vids of dead kids, wailing mothers, and distraught fathers gnashing their teeth over a shredded body, and tout how the Israel government are all monsters who murder children.
7. Everyone flames Israel.

(feel free to add more if i missed anything, I'm sure i have.)

8. Israel flames schools with white phosphorus.

9. Israel kills mostly children and "woops we thought it was empty since no one answered at 3 am"

Israel has committed war crimes. Hamas is a terrorist organization. And you pea brained idiots think since they are terrorists it means no holds barred. You are the same retards who think it's ok to torture people or flatten civilian towns because "they hate us for our freedoms." Get out. No seriously, get out. I didn't fight for five years to protect people like you. People who literally made everything far more difficult then it should have been over there in Iraq and Afghanistan with the bullshiat you spew. Israel has completely and utterly shiat the bed when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians. You know how you show them your not monsters? By not behaving like monsters and hiding behind legal technicalities for the law of ground warfare. You want to stop the rockets? Get in there on the ground, you stay there, you maintain peace, improve their lives, work with the local lead ...


Well... we do have boots on the ground now.  We are currently running an anti-insurgency operation... As I said the bombing were used to drive them to the ground.  Israeli soldiers have been in Gaza for the past week performing anti-insurgency efforts and tracking mile and miles of terror tunnels.
 
2014-07-25 09:29:29 PM  

Resident Muslim: Eshkar: Resident Muslim: wademh: Hamas is evil in that they are so very willing to encourage civilian casualties as a side-effect of their belligerent activity against Israel and Israel is evil because they are so very very willing to oblige Hamas in this respect, and even encourage continued mutual belligerence.

I almost wish I could engineer a pox that attacked people who are so full of hate, except I guess that actually wanting to do so would be a bit of a suicide attack.

what Hamas using human shields looks like:
[www.imemc.org image 340x264]

Or how about some hot girls and the IDF:
[algerienetwork.com image 620x349]

/am I doing this wrong?
//look up Breaking the Silence by a group of Israeli Veterans.

Well something you evidently missed... the kid on the hood was arrested during violent 'protest' or in truth riots... as was the kid handcuffed (throwing stones... not rocks and Molotov cocktails at soldiers is frowned upon...).  None of them are being used as shields.  The blonde girl has been detained during several west bank 'protest' (riots).  Her parents take her there and then the girl physically assaults the soldiers while mommy and daddy take pictures... Even here in the US if a girl of 10 attacks a police officer they will be taken into custody.  The girl is trying to run away from the officer she was just attacking.  The girl is released into her parents custody shortly thereafter.

Your attempt at using pictures taken out of context is pathetic.  Israel doesn't hold weapons up to people and force them to stay in a house that is about to be bombed... nope Israel calls ahead and tells the people to get out... Hamas on the other hand wants international support by making their civilians die, while they hide in tunnels that were built using relief aid that was meant for the people... who never saw any of it.


you are so good, I'm not even going to ask you for a citation.
Now do these ones:
[newsjunkiepost.com image 500x595]
I understand that Israel is ...


In case you are wondering where I got the number of rockets casualties and ask for a citation:
http://mondoweiss.net/2014/07/rocket-deaths-israel.html

theredphoenix.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-07-25 09:32:56 PM  

moeburn: Eshkar: But none of that can occur until Hamas is destroyed and the people are freed from their oppression.

I hope you understand that the oppressors, in this case, are the Israelis, and not Hamas...


No they are oppressed by Hamas... every dime of Foreign aid that has entered Gaza has either gone to Hamas Leaders Swiss bank accounts or to their war machine.  Israel is dealing with a bad situation as well as any country could.  I know Palestinian Israeli citizens within Israel that asked if they would go live under the PA and they quickly tell me that they would never give up their Israeli citizenship... because they have freedoms... compared to the rest of the Middle East.
 
2014-07-25 09:33:48 PM  
 
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