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(SacBee)   Remember when business groups were screaming that California's tax increases would hurt small businesses and kill jobs? Yeah, about that   (sacbee.com) divider line 80
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2356 clicks; posted to Business » on 20 Jul 2014 at 1:46 PM (27 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-20 12:07:40 PM  
California raises taxes, experiences 2.8% job growth. Kansas cuts taxes, experiences 1.8% job growth. You can't explain that.
 
2014-07-20 12:14:22 PM  
img.pandawhale.com
 
2014-07-20 01:04:55 PM  
Do the extremely big tech companies that can eat it are hiring. Big surprise. Meanwhile medium and small business continues to move to Texas.
 
2014-07-20 01:31:15 PM  

RobertBruce: Do the extremely big tech companies that can eat it are hiring. Big surprise. Meanwhile medium and small business continues to move to Texas.


You continue to be the perfect spokesperson for your beliefs.
 
2014-07-20 01:31:47 PM  

RobertBruce: Do the extremely big tech companies that can eat it are hiring. Big surprise. Meanwhile medium and small business continues to move to Texas.


Small businesses are blowing up here!
 
2014-07-20 01:36:47 PM  
"You must spend money to make money."
-Titus Maccius Plautus
 
2014-07-20 01:39:26 PM  
California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.
 
2014-07-20 01:41:19 PM  
You mean the people who hide their money overseas to dodge taxes are a bunch of liars? Ya don't say!
 
2014-07-20 01:49:18 PM  
A republican prediction turned out to be wrong??? Inconceivable!

/GOP - continuing their unbroken record of being wrong about everything for 10 years now.
 
2014-07-20 01:54:54 PM  
Oh look, it's real world economics not fitting into neat sound bites for proposed economic policy. It's almost as if different problems and circumstances require different solutions.
 
2014-07-20 01:59:20 PM  
One might almost think that the siren call of earning money with goods and services might still have some call to folks who live and work within the state, even if they see a small jump in their tax rates. Almost as if there are other factors than taxes alone, like quality of life, worker availability and skill, and customer base. Whuddathunkit?

Oh, that's right, folks who do nothing but worry about investing and are decoupled from the actual production of real goods and services...
 
2014-07-20 02:02:04 PM  
Businesses pay taxes on what's left after they pay their bills. So every dollar they spend is a dollar they're not getting taxed on. If taxes are high may as well spend the money on your business.
 
2014-07-20 02:05:07 PM  

Peter von Nostrand: RobertBruce: Do the extremely big tech companies that can eat it are hiring. Big surprise. Meanwhile medium and small business continues to move to Texas.

Small businesses are blowing up here!


How can they afford all the registration fees, business taxes, bribes to the police/health inspector/dog catcher, etc.?
 
2014-07-20 02:13:35 PM  

RobertBruce: Do the extremely big tech companies that can eat it are hiring. Big surprise. Meanwhile medium and small business continues to move to Texas.


"Must.... cling... to.... dogma....", says the follower in the face of reality...
 
2014-07-20 02:16:01 PM  

SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

Nevada has no state income tax and yet has one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation.

I think we've finally found a solution to our energy woes - the hot air and bullshiat that comes out of you could free us from oil forever.
 
2014-07-20 02:27:22 PM  

WhyteRaven74: Businesses pay taxes on what's left after they pay their bills. So every dollar they spend is a dollar they're not getting taxed on. If taxes are high may as well spend the money on your business.


Friggin' law of intended consequences.  How dare they invest in their company?  They should be bleeding it dry and then moving on to the next host.
 
2014-07-20 02:30:38 PM  

Dinki: A republican prediction turned out to be wrong??? Inconceivable!

/GOP - continuing their unbroken record of being wrong about everything for 10 years now.


I think it's more like 20
 
2014-07-20 02:47:55 PM  

SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.


And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.
 
2014-07-20 02:48:33 PM  
Throw the red flag and everyone starts wrecking. That's special.
 
2014-07-20 02:50:16 PM  
Whoops, wrong thread.
 
2014-07-20 02:52:09 PM  

jso2897: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.


Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.
 
2014-07-20 02:54:52 PM  

Jensaarai: Whoops, wrong thread.


I don't know....

/considering some if the posts in this thread, it's kind of appropriate
 
2014-07-20 02:54:54 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: jso2897: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.

Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.


I know the fact that they go around courting America's shiattiest citizens (the ones who don't want to obey rules, or pay taxes) sure makes ME want to move there.
Not.
 
2014-07-20 02:56:06 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Jensaarai: Whoops, wrong thread.

I don't know....

/considering some if the posts in this thread, it's kind of appropriate


Cross-thread posts almost always are weirdly appropriate, for some unknown reason.
 
2014-07-20 03:02:59 PM  

jso2897: MaudlinMutantMollusk: Jensaarai: Whoops, wrong thread.

I don't know....

/considering some if the posts in this thread, it's kind of appropriate

Cross-thread posts almost always are weirdly appropriate, for some unknown reason.


Can't explain that...
 
2014-07-20 03:04:19 PM  

SDRR: Dinki: A republican prediction turned out to be wrong??? Inconceivable!

/GOP - continuing their unbroken record of being wrong about everything for 10 years now.

I think it's more like 20


34

/ Old enough to have been appalled at Reagan's election
 
2014-07-20 03:06:15 PM  
What's that? You mean, a state that's on solid financial footing is more likely to attract economic interest? And has the capacity to construct an infrastructure favorable to business expansion and sustainable economics, including building roads, distributing resources, and raising an educated, balanced workforce, as opposed to being a resource-poor welfare state occupied by God-bothering ignoramuses working for minimum wage and blaming Obama for the fact that they're not millionaires? You don't farking say...
 
2014-07-20 03:18:36 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: jso2897: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.

Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.


Wat?
 
2014-07-20 03:31:40 PM  

Peter von Nostrand: Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: jso2897: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.

Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.

Wat?


BrokenSarcasmMeter.jpg
 
2014-07-20 03:40:18 PM  

SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.


You know what? You're right. Kansas is a great place to live, and California sucks ass. That explains why California is growing faster than Kansas in population (18th to 31st) and economic growth (6th to 35th), and it also explains why Jerry Brown is beating his competition 52-32 in the polls while Sam Brownback is down 41-47. Oh, wait, it does the exact opposite!
 
2014-07-20 04:10:45 PM  
The richest people do not spend money they save it to get richer. If you want to boost the economy take more from the rich and give it to the poorest who will immediately spend it in local stores.
 
2014-07-20 04:19:18 PM  

jamspoon: The richest people do not spend money they save it to get richer. If you want to boost the economy take more from the rich and give it to the poorest who will immediately spend it in local stores.


Exactly. 

Or, to put it in economics terms, the lower someone's net worth, the higher their Marginal Propensity to Spend (rather than save) is.
 
2014-07-20 04:20:09 PM  

jamspoon: The richest people do not spend money they save it to get richer. If you want to boost the economy take more from the rich and give it to the poorest who will immediately spend it in local stores.


Two words: Class Warfare

If Obama hadn't wrecked this economy so completely, up wouldn't be down and left wouldn't be right. The only reason an increase in taxes is working is because Obama has created a bizarro United States and Jesus is coming soon.
 
2014-07-20 04:23:40 PM  

Serious Black: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

You know what? You're right. Kansas is a great place to live, and California sucks ass. That explains why California is growing faster than Kansas in population (18th to 31st) and economic growth (6th to 35th), and it also explains why Jerry Brown is beating his competition 52-32 in the polls while Sam Brownback is down 41-47. Oh, wait, it does the exact opposite!


The population is growing because of all the illegals and Jerry Brown is winning because of all those illegals voting for the Dems.
 
2014-07-20 04:30:35 PM  

WhyteRaven74: Businesses pay taxes on what's left after they pay their bills. So every dollar they spend is a dollar they're not getting taxed on. If taxes are high may as well spend the money on your business.


Raise corporate taxes to 99%.
 
2014-07-20 04:34:22 PM  
Aren't the gays there?
 
2014-07-20 04:42:46 PM  
The numbers are simply a result of Jerry Brown throwing everyone's uncool nieces in re-education camps, which artificially created millions of new openings.
 
2014-07-20 04:45:29 PM  

Mad_Radhu: The numbers are simply a result of Jerry Brown throwing everyone's uncool nieces in re-education camps, which artificially created millions of new openings.


The Suede Denim Secret Police are always hiring.
 
2014-07-20 04:45:37 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: jso2897: SkinnyHead: California has high taxes and one of the highest unemployment rates in the nation. Kansas has lower taxes and a much lower unemployment rate.  You can't explain that.

And yet, California's economy continues to make Kansas' look like a Girl Scout Cookie Drive.
You can't explain, that, either, apparently.

Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.


We do??

News to me!
 
2014-07-20 04:51:54 PM  
http://www.bls.gov/web/laus/laumstrk.htm

Oh yeah California is doing great.  Tied for 44th in unemployment and 0.1% from 48th.  Watch out Michigan here we come!
 
2014-07-20 05:10:41 PM  

drjekel_mrhyde: Aren't the gays there?


The gays are EVERYWHERE today. Possibly even in your own home town. Plotting, planning, mostly to throw some amazing parties, with immaculate place settings, but there are certainly there nonetheless...
 
2014-07-20 05:15:27 PM  

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.


I suspect most of the people in California don't know where Kansas is except "Where Clark Kent is from" and "nowhere important."
 
2014-07-20 05:17:08 PM  

MisterMook: Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: Everyone in California dreams of living in Kansas.

I suspect most of the people in California don't know where Kansas is except "Where Clark Kent is from" and "nowhere important."


Waitwaitwait... Krypton is in Kansas?
 
2014-07-20 05:24:43 PM  

peasandcarrots: What's that? You mean, a state that's on solid financial footing is more likely to attract economic interest? And has the capacity to construct an infrastructure favorable to business expansion and sustainable economics, including building roads, distributing resources, and raising an educated, balanced workforce, as opposed to being a resource-poor welfare state occupied by God-bothering ignoramuses working for minimum wage and blaming Obama for the fact that they're not millionaires? You don't farking say...


Let's not go overboard and start praising California for wise money management. They're not financial saints and it's certainly not been the poster child for good policy at all times. But it  is a good indicator that there's more to running a government well than endlessly repeating "less taxes" and "spend less." Not that I think that the folks who endlessly repeat those sorts of things will let miserly things like facts stand in the way of their opinions. 100% taxes and 0% taxes are both definitely bad, for everyone else it's all about finding the sweet spot where you're pulling in enough revenue to maintain and develop infrastructure for grow and not having your taxes so very high that folks look to moving across the street and paying taxes  there. It's not about dogmatically following a single secret recipe for making it all work, which is why the very best governments are usually fiscally moderate to some large degree.
 
2014-07-20 05:26:44 PM  
Seeing right-wing attempts at ripping on blue states, I'm starting to think there may be at least some merit to their claim that Muslims hate America because they're jealous.  Within the US, the right-wingers are doing the same thing--being the backwards people who can't stand seeing their way not working.

Red states can see that blue states are where everything that matters happens.  The only example that even remotely works in their favor is Texas, but that's like holding up Saudi Arabia or Dubai as some ideal to aspire to.  So they conveniently ignore that California is still a global economic powerhouse and point to its problems, claiming it's going down the tubes just because it was hit harder by the crisis than their flyover state.  Which is like a third-worlder gloating over first-world recession even though we're still light years ahead of their shiathole.  Just like the fundamentalist Muslim they'll claim all day that that their way of life is superior, and they'd rather stay where they are, and that any day now they'll be vindicated.  And they may even truly believe it.  But it's not happening, and that eats them up inside.
 
2014-07-20 05:43:58 PM  

Dinki: A republican prediction turned out to be wrong??? Inconceivable!

/GOP - continuing their unbroken record of being wrong about everything for 10 years now.


They also predicted ... insured ... an economic disaster following Clinton's 93 budget/tax hike.

People who presume to have honest, rational economics would have changed their ways after that.  Dead wrong and all that.
 
2014-07-20 05:49:29 PM  

yakmans_dad: Dinki: A republican prediction turned out to be wrong??? Inconceivable!

/GOP - continuing their unbroken record of being wrong about everything for 10 years now.

They also predicted ... insured ... an economic disaster following Clinton's 93 budget/tax hike.

People who presume to have honest, rational economics would have changed their ways after that.  Dead wrong and all that.


Yeah, the Laffer Curve they are obsessed with may be accurate, but we're probably on the left side of the hump.
 
2014-07-20 06:21:15 PM  

Mad_Radhu: Yeah, the Laffer Curve they are obsessed with may be accurate, but we're probably on the left side of the hump.


The Laffer curve is correct. The problem is it is dynamic and unknowable where max rev is at any given point in time.
 
KIA
2014-07-20 06:35:54 PM  

MisterMook: But it  is a good indicator that there's more to running a government well than endlessly repeating "less taxes" and "spend less." Not that I think that the folks who endlessly repeat those sorts of things will let miserly things like facts stand in the way of their opinions. 100% taxes and 0% taxes are both definitely bad, for everyone else it's all about finding the sweet spot where you're pulling in enough revenue to maintain and develop infrastructure for grow and not having your taxes so very high that folks look to moving across the street and paying taxes  there. It's not about dogmatically following a single secret recipe for making it all work, which is why the very best governments are usually fiscally moderate to some large degree.



That would all be a helluva lot more convincing if the last monthly job report hadn't shown that voluntary part-time employment rose by a whopping 840,000 and involuntary part-time employment rose by 275,000.  So, sure, people have part time work now at a higher wage for less hours.  Yippee.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/07/nonfarm-payrolls- 28 8000-unemployment.html
 
2014-07-20 06:49:57 PM  

KIA: MisterMook: But it  is a good indicator that there's more to running a government well than endlessly repeating "less taxes" and "spend less." Not that I think that the folks who endlessly repeat those sorts of things will let miserly things like facts stand in the way of their opinions. 100% taxes and 0% taxes are both definitely bad, for everyone else it's all about finding the sweet spot where you're pulling in enough revenue to maintain and develop infrastructure for grow and not having your taxes so very high that folks look to moving across the street and paying taxes  there. It's not about dogmatically following a single secret recipe for making it all work, which is why the very best governments are usually fiscally moderate to some large degree.


That would all be a helluva lot more convincing if the last monthly job report hadn't shown that voluntary part-time employment rose by a whopping 840,000 and involuntary part-time employment rose by 275,000.  So, sure, people have part time work now at a higher wage for less hours.  Yippee.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/07/nonfarm-payrolls- 28 8000-unemployment.html


*waves hand* ...Ignore the goalposts being moved. Part-time jobs are the problem.

/ Conservative projections are best projections.
 
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