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(CNN)   If you attend a Christian university and decide to marry your lesbian partner, you best believe you will be expelled from school lickety split   (cnn.com) divider line 154
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5904 clicks; posted to Main » on 13 Jul 2014 at 2:47 PM (22 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-13 11:01:34 AM  
But now people notice her.
 
2014-07-13 11:22:13 AM  
Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.
 
2014-07-13 11:35:11 AM  
Jeez. Christian schools have done exactly this since ever. It's part of the conditions for admission. A Christian University near me has student volunteers that prowl liquor store parking lots and the nude bars (which are distinctly outside the city limits) looking for University parking stickers on vehicles so they can rat out their fellow students and get them kicked. When they find one, they do rat them out. And they do get kicked.
 
2014-07-13 11:37:53 AM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.
 
2014-07-13 11:41:27 AM  
Meh, you're in a christian school (not a great one at that) living in the buckle of the bible belt.  If you didn't know this would happen, that education was more worthless than I thought.

/you couldn't wait until after college to get married?
 
2014-07-13 11:59:41 AM  
If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?
 
2014-07-13 11:59:52 AM  
This is why I don't support Christian colleges, because they're really not Christian.

They are just advertised that way.
 
2014-07-13 12:00:53 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


Who pissed on your corn flakes this morning?
 
2014-07-13 12:02:15 PM  
If you attend a Christian university and decide to marry your lesbian partner, you best believe you will be expelled from school lickety split for licking slit
 
2014-07-13 12:08:10 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


img.fark.net
 
2014-07-13 12:20:04 PM  

nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.


Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?
 
2014-07-13 12:23:03 PM  
I'm just gonna stick with the lesbian lickety split.
 
2014-07-13 12:40:51 PM  
This isn't attention whoring at all.
 
2014-07-13 12:42:20 PM  
So she signs a "contract" with regards to morality & therefore discrimination is an acceptable outcome if the terms of this "contract" are violated in some manner?

Yeah, that doesn't sound right...
 
2014-07-13 12:48:01 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

Schools and businesses do have some leeway over their students' and employees' lives, but there should be limits.  Drugs are still technically illegal even where they're legal at the state level so I can kind of see businesses having the right there, but what about businesses that fire people for using tobacco outside of work, should that be legal?

There need to be more protections for individuals against institutional repercussion for what they do in their private lives.
 
2014-07-13 01:07:56 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.

Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?


At the major medical schools grants is pretty much what keeps the lights on.

As for other universities, loans are generally federally backed. Without that it's unlikely that the same number of students would attend.
 
2014-07-13 01:13:00 PM  

enry: At the major medical schools grants is pretty much what keeps the lights on.


So the government gets something of value for its money, meaning that it's not money simply given to the school to use as they see fit.

enry: As for other universities, loans are generally federally backed. Without that it's unlikely that the same number of students would attend.


Given that the student is held responsible for their own loans after they are through with school, I don't consider this federal funding.

When I think of federal funding I think of money that goes to schools without conditions, like subsidies for campus expansion or for students in majors the government decides to promote.
 
2014-07-13 01:19:08 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?


It depends on what the student signs. This looks like a girl who found a way to get on CNN.
 
2014-07-13 01:22:13 PM  

AirForceVet: This is why I don't support Christian colleges, because they're really not Christian.

They are just advertised that way.


The Jesus factor allows them to discriminate and gives them a tax breal.

/good headline subby!
 
2014-07-13 01:31:41 PM  

enry: Adolf Oliver Nipples: nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.

Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?

At the major medical schools grants is pretty much what keeps the lights on.

As for other universities, loans are generally federally backed. Without that it's unlikely that the same number of students would attend.


Plus Pell grants.
 
2014-07-13 01:36:25 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: enry: At the major medical schools grants is pretty much what keeps the lights on.

So the government gets something of value for its money, meaning that it's not money simply given to the school to use as they see fit.

enry: As for other universities, loans are generally federally backed. Without that it's unlikely that the same number of students would attend.

Given that the student is held responsible for their own loans after they are through with school, I don't consider this federal funding.

When I think of federal funding I think of money that goes to schools without conditions, like subsidies for campus expansion or for students in majors the government decides to promote.


The government does get something for it, but anywhere up to 66% of a researcher's grant gets taken by the university as overhead. IT, buildings and grounds, school administration, etc. all come out of that overhead. The school is generally able to use it as they see fit. Same with the researcher once they get their money. They may put in the grant budget that they're going to buy one microscope from a manufacturer and instead buy a different model from another vendor. Or hire more staff is the money is unrestricted.

There's no guarantee the researcher will find anything, that's the nature of basic research. So there's a good possibility the government gets nothing out of it. It does mean that researcher may have a harder time securing grants in Tue future so it's in their interest to get some kind if results.
 
2014-07-13 01:38:10 PM  

cmunic8r99: enry: Adolf Oliver Nipples: nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.

Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?

At the major medical schools grants is pretty much what keeps the lights on.

As for other universities, loans are generally federally backed. Without that it's unlikely that the same number of students would attend.

Plus Pell grants.


That too. Maybe work study? I've worked in research schools for the past 12 years so I rarely interacted with students.
 
2014-07-13 02:23:36 PM  

basemetal: Meh, you're in a christian school (not a great one at that) living in the buckle of the bible belt.  If you didn't know this would happen, that education was more worthless than I thought.

/you couldn't wait until after college to get married?


Pretty much this.  Play by their rules, graduate, get married and do a hot lesbian sex video wearing school attire...
 
2014-07-13 02:51:33 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).
 
2014-07-13 02:52:40 PM  
If you go to an Episcopal university or a Congregationalist university or a non weird Lutheran university or a Methodist university or even a mainstream Catholic university, nah. But if you go to a university containing any permutation of Pentecost or holiness or baptist in the name and they make you sign a catch all lifestyle pledge, you might want to make sure you're not gay or that you're ok hiding it until graduation.
 
2014-07-13 02:54:23 PM  
http://notalllikethat.org/

Just gonna leave that here. 'Cause we're Not All Like That.
 
2014-07-13 02:56:01 PM  
If you attend a Christian university and decide to marry your lesbian partner, you best believe you will be expelled from school lickety split


emotibot.net
 
2014-07-13 02:56:19 PM  

slayer199: basemetal: Meh, you're in a christian school (not a great one at that) living in the buckle of the bible belt.  If you didn't know this would happen, that education was more worthless than I thought.

/you couldn't wait until after college to get married?

Pretty much this.  Play by their rules, graduate, get married and do a hot lesbian sex video wearing school attire...


encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com
 
2014-07-13 02:56:36 PM  

indylaw: If you go to an Episcopal university or a Congregationalist university or a non weird Lutheran university or a Methodist university or even a mainstream Catholic university, nah. But if you go to a university containing any permutation of Pentecost or holiness or baptist in the name and they make you sign a catch all lifestyle pledge, you might want to make sure you're not gay or that you're ok hiding it until graduation.


Whole lotta this.
 
2014-07-13 02:57:08 PM  
As long as her partner ain't BLACK.

Right?
 
2014-07-13 02:57:43 PM  
"As an American and a Christian, I do respect your choice," the administrator wrote. "(But) I have to uphold the Lifestyle Covenant at SCU and confront you with our position.

As an judgmental moralistic finger pointer, i have to say that your lifestyle makes me want to vomit, and you are definitely going to burn in hell because God loves you. So get the fark out. Now.

//Seriously, how can you call yourself a "Christian", who is not supposed to judge, lest you be judged, and yet, you expel someone who has found love, be it a kind you don't understand or agree with? Seems like you :"Christians" like to use what parts of the bible fit your liking, and the others you just ignore. Wasn't one of "Jesus" teachings to accept and tolerate those who are different from you? Guess you kinda forgot that part in your moralistic ravings.didn't ya?

///Dumbass tag should be for the lesbian woman who was a member, and expected them to accept her and her partner. That was stupid. She should have known better.
 
2014-07-13 02:58:08 PM  
So stop believing stupid shiat that isn't even real. Problem solved.
Then go to a real college, and get a real degree.
 
2014-07-13 03:02:20 PM  

AirForceVet: Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?

Who pissed on your corn flakes this morning?


Dawkins didn't give him a hand jibber last night.
 
2014-07-13 03:03:15 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).


So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?
 
2014-07-13 03:04:37 PM  

indylaw: If you go to an Episcopal university or a Congregationalist university or a non weird Lutheran university or a Methodist university or even a mainstream Catholic university, nah. But if you go to a university containing any permutation of Pentecost or holiness or baptist in the name and they make you sign a catch all lifestyle pledge, you might want to make sure you're not gay or that you're ok hiding it until graduation.


Yep.  There's a big difference between mainline protestant/catholic higher education and the derpier denominations/schools.  There are some outstanding colleges and universities out there that are affiliated (to various degrees) with different religions, but as you point out, those are generally associated with mainline protestantism/catholicism.  It also seems that the good christian universities are generally located in the northeast and midwest, which I'm sure isn't a coincidence.

But here we have 1) an evangelical school located in 2) Oklahoma.  Being not gay or being happy about staying in the closet until graduation are really the only options in that kind of environment.
 
2014-07-13 03:06:31 PM  

Ctrl-Alt-Del: If you attend a Christian university and decide to marry your lesbian partner, you best believe you will be expelled from school lickety split for licking slit


That's the joke.
 
2014-07-13 03:08:40 PM  

Mugato: TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

It depends on what the student signs. This looks like a girl who found a way to get on CNN.


She acknowledged understanding and signing the contract. Her complaint is that she is aware of other students also breaking the conduct code - in different ways - but not being punished by full expulsion.
 
2014-07-13 03:09:10 PM  
Hey, it was a lot of fun when we were oppressing *other* people, but *now* they're oppressing *me*!
 
2014-07-13 03:09:18 PM  

Bit'O'Gristle: "As an American and a Christian, I do respect your choice," the administrator wrote. "(But) I have to uphold the Lifestyle Covenant at SCU and confront you with our position.

As an judgmental moralistic finger pointer, i have to say that your lifestyle makes me want to vomit, and you are definitely going to burn in hell because God loves you. So get the fark out. Now.

//Seriously, how can you call yourself a "Christian", who is not supposed to judge, lest you be judged, and yet, you expel someone who has found love, be it a kind you don't understand or agree with? Seems like you :"Christians" like to use what parts of the bible fit your liking, and the others you just ignore. Wasn't one of "Jesus" teachings to accept and tolerate those who are different from you? Guess you kinda forgot that part in your moralistic ravings.didn't ya?

///Dumbass tag should be for the lesbian woman who was a member, and expected them to accept her and her partner. That was stupid. She should have known better.


They genuinely believe that God will take it out on them if they allow it.  Hurricanes, tornados, other natural disasters are all caused by God being pissed about something.
 
2014-07-13 03:09:51 PM  
I'm sure there are some "Christian" universities that aren't complete assholes.  She should look into one of those.
 
2014-07-13 03:11:46 PM  
The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.
 
2014-07-13 03:13:46 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?


Yes. I don't have to like it but barring a law it's their right to associate with whomever they want to.
 
2014-07-13 03:14:08 PM  
Was it Oral Roberts?
 
2014-07-13 03:16:15 PM  
Step 1: Go to Christian university
Step 2: Marry lesbian partner
Step 3: Share expulsion letter with CNN
Step 4:
img.fark.net
 
2014-07-13 03:16:35 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).

So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?


is the golf course defined as a religious organization according to US Tax Code and the CRA 1964? Like the university you are comparing it to? Yes? Sure, they can tell Jews to piss off all they want.

No? Then it's an irrelevant comparison.
 
2014-07-13 03:23:00 PM  
 
2014-07-13 03:23:04 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: So she signs a "contract" with regards to morality


gs1.wac.edgecastcdn.net
 
2014-07-13 03:24:25 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-07-13 03:24:54 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).

So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?


Doesn't Augusta still not allow women?  I'm not saying I agree with it, but I'm pretty sure that they're still allowed to be exclusive.  And if a golf course did that, I certainly wouldn't want to golf there (not that I golf anyway, but I'd especially avoid THAT golf course).

Besides, I think there's a slight distinction.  All universities and colleges have rules for students to follow, and students face consequences if they break them.  She wasn't denied entrance for being gay, she was kicked  out for breaking a contract she'd signed by getting married to another woman.  I think the analogy you're looking for would be closer to a golf club that made people sign contracts saying they wouldn't wear a yarmulke on the golf course.  If the member signs that contract saying they agree not to wear a yarmulke, then breaking that contract by actively doing something that's against the rule would be grounds for some kind of consequence.  But simply  being Jewish wouldn't be a reason not to let someone join the club in the first place.

Similarly, this woman was gay before she attended the university, but she nonetheless signed (as an adult) a contract saying she wouldn't be gay (and I'm sure a lot of other BS as well) as a condition of attending the school.  She broke a contract that she signed.  I don't like the rule, and I don't like the contract, but she signed it.  She had the chance to go to one of many, MANY other colleges that wouldn't have made her sign any "covenant."  And even then, she had a chance to put off getting married until after graduation.

I don't think "don't be gay" is a good rule, but if the university isn't public, and if the students are voluntarily signing these contracts, then there's not much to be done about it.  There was a derpy evangelical university near my home when I grew up that included "no sex" rules as part of the signing requirements for students---so even consenting adults (straight or gay) caught having sex could be expelled.  It's stupid, but people kept signing the document and going to school there.

As long as no civil rights law is being broken, then the university in question is free to do as it pleases.
 
2014-07-13 03:27:38 PM  

indylaw: If you go to an Episcopal university or a Congregationalist university or a non weird Lutheran university or a Methodist university or even a mainstream Catholic university, nah. But if you go to a university containing any permutation of Pentecost or holiness or baptist in the name and they make you sign a catch all lifestyle pledge, you might want to make sure you're not gay or that you're ok hiding it until graduation.


One day, someone, less lazy than me, will write the Broadway musical which sets Heaven in a gay bar, and follows the adventures of the newly arrived from a college bus wreck on its way to a compassionate conservate rally.  There'll be black and white movie flashbacks where the crowd at the bar hoot at the arrivals loving thoughts and actions. One of the college boys will want to go back and change the word Christian to Not-Gay in all the outfits that hijacked the name.
 
2014-07-13 03:29:16 PM  

Mugato: TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

It depends on what the student signs. This looks like a girl who found a way to get on CNN.


Not all contracts are enforceable.  Landlords can't enforce contracts that preclude the ability to use service animals, pre-nups that state 'you get nothing and like it' are routinely overturned, and employers can't require employees sign away certain rights in employment contracts.

Just because she signed it doesn't make it right.
 
2014-07-13 03:30:10 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Given that the student is held responsible for their own loans after they are through with school, I don't consider this federal funding.


You would be the only one.  While the student is the one responsible for paying it back, they don't actually give the money to the student.  The money is given to the university, who takes out the student's tuition and other fees.  If anything is left over, the student gets that back - but many universities put stipulations on even that.  for instance, some universities say that if you get financial aid, you have to buy your books from the university bookstore with the money (it is not uncommon to put the money in an account associated with the student that can only practically be used on campus).  If the government sent the individual student a check and said "We want receipts to show this was used for educational purposes", you might have a point.  But the university gets the money, and then gets to dictate the use of that money, pretty much as they wish.  And for that consideration, they have to agree to the rules the government sets, which includes that they can't be massive assholes for shiats and giggles.
 
2014-07-13 03:39:32 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: Similarly, this woman was gay before she attended the university, but she nonetheless signed (as an adult) a contract saying she wouldn't be gay (and I'm sure a lot of other BS as well) as a condition of attending the school.  She broke a contract that she signed.  I don't like the rule, and I don't like the contract, but she signed it.  She had the chance to go to one of many, MANY other colleges that wouldn't have made her sign any "covenant."  And even then, she had a chance to put off getting married until after graduation.


She may not have known she was gay when she signed and enrolled.  A lot of people, especially those who grow up in religious households, suppress those feelings and get pretty good at lying to themselves until they're out living on their own and suddenly the walls fall down.

The big issue is whether or not a school should have the right to require students to sign contracts that essentially deny homosexual students equal rights.
If the school had a blanket 'no marriage' policy it would be one thing, but a policy that discriminates only against homosexual marriage is different.

Using your golf course example if the course had a 'no hats' policy that was enforced equally towards all members that would probably be OK.  Specifically targeting yarmulkes would step over the line.
 
2014-07-13 03:39:38 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: Doesn't Augusta still not allow women?


Condi Rice is a member.
 
2014-07-13 03:40:36 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: Mugato: TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

It depends on what the student signs. This looks like a girl who found a way to get on CNN.

Not all contracts are enforceable.  Landlords can't enforce contracts that preclude the ability to use service animals, pre-nups that state 'you get nothing and like it' are routinely overturned, and employers can't require employees sign away certain rights in employment contracts.

Just because she signed it doesn't make it right.


I don't think it's right (morally), but the contract is probably valid (IANAL though).  Loads of religiously-affiliated colleges exist, and they virtually all have "morality" rules like this, which can vary in terms of how silly they are.  Wheaton College in Illinois, for example, had rules against co-ed dancing up until about 2005 (I think).  I heard it wasn't really enforced there, but it was never challenged in any court that I know of, even though it could be said to have constrained students 1st amendment rights (dancing as a form of self-expression).  It seems that when you have adults who consent to these rules (and given that these adults have other educational options that don't include these rules), the rules turn out to be valid.
 
2014-07-13 03:41:55 PM  

Saborlas: If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!


Holy shiat, I thought Kittypie had somehow posted outside the friendly green glow for a minute there.
 
2014-07-13 03:50:27 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


Reminds me of an LBJ story:

Once Johnson landed at an Air Force base and a young officer directed the President over to a helicopter while saying, "Sir, your helicopter is over here." Johnson replied, "Son, they're all my helicopters."
 
2014-07-13 03:50:56 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


You're right, those degrees from Duke, Wake, Notre Dame, Georgetown, etc. are like Cracker Jack prizes
 
2014-07-13 03:53:24 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: HMS_Blinkin: Similarly, this woman was gay before she attended the university, but she nonetheless signed (as an adult) a contract saying she wouldn't be gay (and I'm sure a lot of other BS as well) as a condition of attending the school.  She broke a contract that she signed.  I don't like the rule, and I don't like the contract, but she signed it.  She had the chance to go to one of many, MANY other colleges that wouldn't have made her sign any "covenant."  And even then, she had a chance to put off getting married until after graduation.

She may not have known she was gay when she signed and enrolled.  A lot of people, especially those who grow up in religious households, suppress those feelings and get pretty good at lying to themselves until they're out living on their own and suddenly the walls fall down.

The big issue is whether or not a school should have the right to require students to sign contracts that essentially deny homosexual students equal rights.
If the school had a blanket 'no marriage' policy it would be one thing, but a policy that discriminates only against homosexual marriage is different.

Using your golf course example if the course had a 'no hats' policy that was enforced equally towards all members that would probably be OK.  Specifically targeting yarmulkes would step over the line.


As somebody else mentioned above (and I didn't think of it), the golf course/university comparison isn't valid -- the university is a religious institution and plays by different rules than a business.

And yes, you're right that many students don't realize they're gay, of course.  But simply  being gay wasn't what got her in trouble; it appears that getting married to a woman did.  And while I agree with you that the contract in question denies equal rights to gay students, religious universities have rights too (annoying as they may be).  Specifically, they're allowed more latitude to create rules that they feel conform to their religious beliefs.  They can make students attend chapel services --- does that discriminate against students who aren't religious?  They can bar students from drinking alcohol or having sex --- does that discriminate against students who want to get drunk and fark (i.e. the vast majority of college students)?

Those examples aren't precisely the same thing, but the fact that religious universities are allowed to impose (often draconian) rules on their students is pretty damn well established by now.
 
2014-07-13 03:56:19 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).


They take federal money.

She may be able to turn this into a Title IX case.  Since she married a woman, it could be claimed that she's "not conforming to gender stereotypes" which is protected from discrimination by Title IX.

The school has clearly discriminated against her because of this, and that's a violation.

If the school doesn't like it, they can refuse federal student aid (and hopefully if they pull that, go monetarily bankrupt - they're already morally bankrupt.)
 
2014-07-13 04:04:56 PM  
Yeah, if you agree to go to a private, fundamentalist, Dark Ages "college", don't be surprised when they act like a fundamentalist, Dark Ages "college".
 
2014-07-13 04:08:07 PM  

DarkVader: HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).

They take federal money.

She may be able to turn this into a Title IX case.  Since she married a woman, it could be claimed that she's "not conforming to gender stereotypes" which is protected from discrimination by Title IX.

The school has clearly discriminated against her because of this, and that's a violation.

If the school doesn't like it, they can refuse federal student aid (and hopefully if they pull that, go monetarily bankrupt - they're already morally bankrupt.)


But there's a difference between "discrimination" and "breaking a contract."  I'd agree with you except that the student in question signed a document saying she agreed not to marry a woman.  If people who sign non-disclosure agreements can have their 1st amendment rights limited by the contract they signed, then students who sign "morality covenants" probably give up many of their protections.

Maybe you're right and maybe the school didn't cover its own ass properly, but I doubt it.  I don't think there will be a case here, because so many christian schools have had rules like this (and even worse ones in some cases) for so long.  I'm assuming the reason these rules still exist is because their lawyers wrote ironclad contracts.

Now, whether or not schools should have a right to make students sign contracts like this is a different matter, but it's enforceable for now.
 
2014-07-13 04:08:32 PM  

DarkVader: They take federal money.

She may be able to turn this into a Title IX case.  Since she married a woman, it could be claimed that she's "not conforming to gender stereotypes" which is protected from discrimination by Title IX.

The school has clearly discriminated against her because of this, and that's a violation.

If the school doesn't like it, they can refuse federal student aid (and hopefully if they pull that, go monetarily bankrupt - they're already morally bankrupt.)


If they take federal money.  That said, I'd argue that morality clauses that are amoral should be unenforceable.  You shouldn't be able, for instance, to sign a nondisclosure agreement to cover up child abuse (I know the law was actually changed on this one) or corporate criminal action.  It's a little trickier when they are asking you not to take a legal action.  She could have waited until after she graduated to get married, or transferred.  I think her best argument (if the university doesn't take public money) is to argue that the morality clause isn't uniformly enforced, and therefore she is being singled out.
 
2014-07-13 04:08:54 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


This is not the freedom you think it is.
 
2014-07-13 04:11:55 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: As somebody else mentioned above (and I didn't think of it), the golf course/university comparison isn't valid -- the university is a religious institution and plays by different rules than a business.

And yes, you're right that many students don't realize they're gay, of course.  But simply  being gay wasn't what got her in trouble; it appears that getting married to a woman did.  And while I agree with you that the contract in question denies equal rights to gay students, religious universities have rights too (annoying as they may be).  Specifically, they're allowed more latitude to create rules that they feel conform to their religious beliefs.  They can make students attend chapel services --- does that discriminate against students who aren't religious?  They can bar students from drinking alcohol or having sex --- does that discriminate against students who want to get drunk and fark (i.e. the vast majority of college students)?

Those examples aren't precisely the same thing, but the fact that religious universities are allowed to impose (often draconian) rules on their students is pretty damn well established by now.


There's a difference between a religious institution (church, monastery, etc) and a school run by a religious organization, or at least there should be in the eyes of the law.

The issue isn't about the school's ability to dictate broad rules regarding student life, but rather about how the rules are enforced.  If all students are required to attend church service, and the rule is applied equally across the board, that's OK.  If all students are forbidden from having pre-marital sex, and it's applied equally across the board - that's OK.  If, however, they don't expel students for heterosexual sex but do for homosexual sex, that becomes a problem.  It's treating the same act differently based on a who the students are.

Homosexuality unfortunately isn't a protected class everywhere, but IMO it should be.  As far as the ability of these schools to impose these rules - how much of that is because they haven't been challenged in court recently?

I'm not sure if I'd want to take the case potentially all the way to this supreme court, as they showed with the Hobby Lobby case that they're all too willing to let religious folks impose their will on those beneath them, but once the balance shifts I could see regulations specifically targeting homosexual students being ruled as illegal.
 
2014-07-13 04:14:22 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


I agree with you.

Not sure why everyone thinks you should calm down. Only one way to deal with this kind of outright bullshiat, call it out, tell everyone involved in it to fark off. Nuke it from orbit, only way to be sure.
 
2014-07-13 04:16:38 PM  
I went to a (fully accredited) Christian university so I'm getting a kick etc.

We signed a social contract when we enrolled. When I violated the contract (no homo), I was punished and I didn't complain because I knew the rules and I knew the consequences. Doing the crime/doing the time and all that.

One of my friends came out after she graduated, married a chick, and magically had babby. AFTER graduating, of course.
 
2014-07-13 04:21:15 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?



If you know that you're violating a core principle going in, you shouldn't go in.  Example:  If you go to a vegan cooking school set up by PeTA and sign a contract agreeing to live by their rules, but they catch you raising a baby cow in inhumane conditions, killing it, cooking it, and then eating a thick, juicy piece of oh-so-tender veal at a school function, you need to understand that the school's administration is likely to be just a little bit pissed about it.  No matter how much I may hypothetically support animal cruelty and eating meat, I can't really bring forth all that much rage at your expulsion.  The "sin" itself doesn't really matter.  What matters is that there were  very simple rules that you knew about up-front, but you broke them anyway.
 
2014-07-13 04:24:00 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: But there's a difference between "discrimination" and "breaking a contract." I'd agree with you except that the student in question signed a document saying she agreed not to marry a woman. If people who sign non-disclosure agreements can have their 1st amendment rights limited by the contract they signed, then students who sign "morality covenants" probably give up many of their protections.

Maybe you're right and maybe the school didn't cover its own ass properly, but I doubt it. I don't think there will be a case here, because so many christian schools have had rules like this (and even worse ones in some cases) for so long. I'm assuming the reason these rules still exist is because their lawyers wrote ironclad contracts.

Now, whether or not schools should have a right to make students sign contracts like this is a different matter, but it's enforceable for now.


Sorry, Title IX does not work that way.

The school, in accepting federal funds, agreed to a contract that says they will not discriminate based on sex.  They're breaking their contract with the federal government by having a student sign a contract that purports to remove the student's right to not be discriminated against.

The first contract with the federal government takes precedence.  The school's ass is on the line, the student's contract is, to the extent that it purports to allow the school to violate federal law, invalid.
 
2014-07-13 04:26:54 PM  

HoratioGates: DarkVader: They take federal money.

She may be able to turn this into a Title IX case.  Since she married a woman, it could be claimed that she's "not conforming to gender stereotypes" which is protected from discrimination by Title IX.

The school has clearly discriminated against her because of this, and that's a violation.

If the school doesn't like it, they can refuse federal student aid (and hopefully if they pull that, go monetarily bankrupt - they're already morally bankrupt.)

If they take federal money.  That said, I'd argue that morality clauses that are amoral should be unenforceable.  You shouldn't be able, for instance, to sign a nondisclosure agreement to cover up child abuse (I know the law was actually changed on this one) or corporate criminal action.  It's a little trickier when they are asking you not to take a legal action.  She could have waited until after she graduated to get married, or transferred.  I think her best argument (if the university doesn't take public money) is to argue that the morality clause isn't uniformly enforced, and therefore she is being singled out.


Note the first thing I said up there:

They take federal money.

There's no "if" in that sentence.  I checked the school's website before I posted, they've got very clear financial aid info, and a convenient link to the FAFSA.

They take federal money.
 
2014-07-13 04:27:12 PM  
Trying to bring attention to the shiatty behavior of a group of people is attention whoring now. Just accept that they are terrible people and let them do whatever they want to whoever they want without any social shaming, I guess. Wouldn't want to offend the internet.

"lickety split"

I lol'ed.
 
2014-07-13 04:27:32 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


Me for one, though I don't support pseudo university's off the false faith divergent from the one true Catholic Church.
 
2014-07-13 04:27:41 PM  
I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike you, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.
 
2014-07-13 04:27:42 PM  

Cheesus: Bit'O'Gristle: "As an American and a Christian, I do respect your choice," the administrator wrote. "(But) I have to uphold the Lifestyle Covenant at SCU and confront you with our position.

As an judgmental moralistic finger pointer, i have to say that your lifestyle makes me want to vomit, and you are definitely going to burn in hell because God loves you. So get the fark out. Now.

//Seriously, how can you call yourself a "Christian", who is not supposed to judge, lest you be judged, and yet, you expel someone who has found love, be it a kind you don't understand or agree with? Seems like you :"Christians" like to use what parts of the bible fit your liking, and the others you just ignore. Wasn't one of "Jesus" teachings to accept and tolerate those who are different from you? Guess you kinda forgot that part in your moralistic ravings.didn't ya?

///Dumbass tag should be for the lesbian woman who was a member, and expected them to accept her and her partner. That was stupid. She should have known better.

They genuinely believe that God will take it out on them if they allow it.  Hurricanes, tornados, other natural disasters are all caused by God being pissed about something.


Basically, the stubborn old farts that run these organizations have this innate need to control women's sex lives - it's just an ingrained part of their mental makeup. Since their own sex lives are far behind them due to age, then this is the only way they can get their jollies.

People continue to make the mistake that age equates to wisdom.
 
2014-07-13 04:29:58 PM  

Tr0mBoNe: But now people notice her.


Pretty much, she looked at the job market then decided this would be an easy way to make an easy living.

You decided to attend a religious university so don't biatch when they hold you to those standards.
 
2014-07-13 04:31:48 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.

Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?


Why should research grants be immune from rules. If you receive so much as a penny from the government then the gov has the right to set rules
 
2014-07-13 04:32:25 PM  

Cheesus: Bit'O'Gristle: "As an American and a Christian, I do respect your choice," the administrator wrote. "(But) I have to uphold the Lifestyle Covenant at SCU and confront you with our position.

As an judgmental moralistic finger pointer, i have to say that your lifestyle makes me want to vomit, and you are definitely going to burn in hell because God loves you. So get the fark out. Now.

//Seriously, how can you call yourself a "Christian", who is not supposed to judge, lest you be judged, and yet, you expel someone who has found love, be it a kind you don't understand or agree with? Seems like you :"Christians" like to use what parts of the bible fit your liking, and the others you just ignore. Wasn't one of "Jesus" teachings to accept and tolerate those who are different from you? Guess you kinda forgot that part in your moralistic ravings.didn't ya?

///Dumbass tag should be for the lesbian woman who was a member, and expected them to accept her and her partner. That was stupid. She should have known better.

They genuinely believe that God will take it out on them if they allow it.  Hurricanes, tornados, other natural disasters are all caused by God being pissed about something.


No, just no
 
2014-07-13 04:38:02 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

Schools and businesses do have some leeway over their students' and employees' lives, but there should be limits.  Drugs are still technically illegal even where they're legal at the state level so I can kind of see businesses having the right there, but what about businesses that fire people for using tobacco outside of work, should that be legal?

There need to be more protections for individuals against institutional repercussion for what they do in their private lives.


You want the GOVERNMENT to come in and tell a corporation not to dictate its employees or even customers private lives? WHY DO YOU HATE FREEDOM YOU COMMUNIST?!?!?!

/why should the rights of a "human being" trump those of a corporation?
//expelling this girl is what Jesus would want, he said so in The Old Testament
 
2014-07-13 04:40:42 PM  
fark religion. Come at me BroGod
 
2014-07-13 04:42:58 PM  

Witness99: fark religion. Come at me BroGod


img.fark.net
 
2014-07-13 04:43:07 PM  

Warlordtrooper: Why should research grants be immune from rules. If you receive so much as a penny from the government then the gov has the right to set rules


Because if the government receives fair exchange for its funds it's a business transaction. I don't get to dictate policy to GM because I buy one of their cars.
 
2014-07-13 04:45:27 PM  
I'm waiting.

*whistling and twiddling thumbs*

This planet is so incredibly primitive and stupid. I would ruminate on this more, but I need to make a Greek salad with grilled shrimp now. Bye you religious farktard haters.
 
2014-07-13 04:47:15 PM  

Bane of Broone: Witness99: fark religion. Come at me BroGod


What? NO!!! No M'Ladys, oh good god.
 
2014-07-13 04:49:17 PM  

ElLoco: Jeez. Christian schools have done exactly this since ever. It's part of the conditions for admission. A Christian University near me has student volunteers that prowl liquor store parking lots and the nude bars (which are distinctly outside the city limits) looking for University parking stickers on vehicles so they can rat out their fellow students and get them kicked. When they find one, they do rat them out. And they do get kicked.


Yeah.  Usually I have a lot of sympathy for the victims but she chose herself as a victim by going to a fundie school.

basemetal: Meh, you're in a christian school (not a great one at that) living in the buckle of the bible belt. If you didn't know this would happen, that education was more worthless than I thought.

/you couldn't wait until after college to get married?


Exactly.  She wasn't in a position she had to marry.  Just wait.
 
2014-07-13 04:50:56 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Warlordtrooper: Why should research grants be immune from rules. If you receive so much as a penny from the government then the gov has the right to set rules

Because if the government receives fair exchange for its funds it's a business transaction. I don't get to dictate policy to GM because I buy one of their cars.


Sure you do.  If you make an agreement with GM that you will buy one of their cars if they agree to also sell their cars to gay people, then GM better sell their cars to gay people, and you can sue them if they start refusing to sell their cars to gay people.

And that's essentially what the feds are doing.  They're setting contractual conditions on those funds.

GM could say to you "We don't care if you don't buy our car.  Go away."  But if they agree to your condition, then you can take legal action against them if they don't follow it, assuming that your condition doesn't violate the law.
 
2014-07-13 04:56:07 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.


FTA - Did Minard sign the school's morality covenant? Yes, she concedes.

Done
 
2014-07-13 04:57:56 PM  

Clemkadidlefark: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

FTA - Did Minard sign the school's morality covenant? Yes, she concedes.

Done


Does the school accept federal funds, and therefore agree to accept the Title IX conditions?  From their website, yes, they concede.

Not so done.
 
2014-07-13 05:00:01 PM  
eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled. 

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.
 
2014-07-13 05:06:13 PM  

Waldo Pepper: eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled. 

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.


You're not paying attention.

THIS SCHOOL ACCEPTS FEDERAL MONEY.

The school agreed to certain conditions to get that money, one of which is that there will be no sex discrimination.
 
2014-07-13 05:08:21 PM  
If you attend a Christian university and decide to marry your lesbian partner, you best believe you will be expelled from school lickety split you are either an idiot or an attention whore.

FTFY
 
2014-07-13 05:10:29 PM  

Waldo Pepper: she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no. do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled.


She was expelled for being a lesbian. That isn't a behavior.
 
2014-07-13 05:13:05 PM  

DarkVader: Waldo Pepper: eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled. 

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.

You're not paying attention.

THIS SCHOOL ACCEPTS FEDERAL MONEY.

The school agreed to certain conditions to get that money, one of which is that there will be no sex discrimination.


and is the feds allow to interfere with the religious aspects of the school and their code?  If there any part of accepting the federal grants that says the school must give up it's religious beliefs? please not what is your opinion but what is the law?
 
2014-07-13 05:14:39 PM  

DarkVader: Waldo Pepper: eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled. 

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.

You're not paying attention.

THIS SCHOOL ACCEPTS FEDERAL MONEY.

The school agreed to certain conditions to get that money, one of which is that there will be no sex discrimination.


I believe I'm supposed to say, this wasn't sex discrimination, she could have married a man just like any other woman can .
 
2014-07-13 05:24:31 PM  
Boo hoo, I didn't get the special treatment I think I deserve despite admitting I broke the conduct agreement I voluntarily signed.
 
2014-07-13 05:32:47 PM  

DarkVader: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Warlordtrooper: Why should research grants be immune from rules. If you receive so much as a penny from the government then the gov has the right to set rules

Because if the government receives fair exchange for its funds it's a business transaction. I don't get to dictate policy to GM because I buy one of their cars.

Sure you do.  If you make an agreement with GM that you will buy one of their cars if they agree to also sell their cars to gay people, then GM better sell their cars to gay people, and you can sue them if they start refusing to sell their cars to gay people.

And that's essentially what the feds are doing.  They're setting contractual conditions on those funds.

GM could say to you "We don't care if you don't buy our car.  Go away."  But if they agree to your condition, then you can take legal action against them if they don't follow it, assuming that your condition doesn't violate the law.


Except you buy your PoS GM car from a dealer which is not GM, but a separate legal entity.
 
2014-07-13 06:35:41 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them


I don't think we should tolerate that either. So while I agree that those two things should be handled consistently, I don't think either should be allowed employers or schools, absent some bona fide safety concern.

It's nice to say "businesses should be free to choose" but history is full of examples demonstrating why that is practically unworkable for things meant to be available to the public -- if the grocery store in your town decides that the won't sell food to people with a penis it effectively means single men can't live there, or must become beholden to a female provider in order to do so. You can argue about where the line should be drawn, but understand the harms people suffer through discrimination aren't merely imaginary or emotional, they're economic and physical as well, and we need to keep that in mind when deciding what sort of discrimination we will and won't tolerate.
 
2014-07-13 06:41:04 PM  
Facebook strikes again.  A private religious school.  She must have figured something like this could happen.  So why not wait until after graduation.
 
2014-07-13 06:41:12 PM  

DarkVader: HMS_Blinkin: But there's a difference between "discrimination" and "breaking a contract." I'd agree with you except that the student in question signed a document saying she agreed not to marry a woman. If people who sign non-disclosure agreements can have their 1st amendment rights limited by the contract they signed, then students who sign "morality covenants" probably give up many of their protections.

Maybe you're right and maybe the school didn't cover its own ass properly, but I doubt it. I don't think there will be a case here, because so many christian schools have had rules like this (and even worse ones in some cases) for so long. I'm assuming the reason these rules still exist is because their lawyers wrote ironclad contracts.

Now, whether or not schools should have a right to make students sign contracts like this is a different matter, but it's enforceable for now.

Sorry, Title IX does not work that way.

The school, in accepting federal funds, agreed to a contract that says they will not discriminate based on sex.  They're breaking their contract with the federal government by having a student sign a contract that purports to remove the student's right to not be discriminated against.

The first contract with the federal government takes precedence.  The school's ass is on the line, the student's contract is, to the extent that it purports to allow the school to violate federal law, invalid.


You're correct that Title IX forbids discrimination, but I disagree with your interpretation here.  I think it's a stretch to say she was discriminated against on the basis of gender.  Sexual orientation?  Absolutely, and that should absolutely be a protected class.  But it's not, and at the end of the day, she got in trouble for marrying a woman, not for being a woman.
 
2014-07-13 06:44:31 PM  

nekom: As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.


Are there any colleges or universities that don't receive government funding?  Grants, student loans, GI Bill--they all get something from the government.
 
2014-07-13 06:53:43 PM  
so if she decided to start worshipping satan would the school be required to keep her enrolled so not to violate her freedom of religion. 

At some point we need to put a stop to this whining. You sign up for something, follow the rules or get out. She wasn't forced to go to a Christian college. If she signed the morals agreement knowing she was currently violating parts of the agreement isn't that fraud?

this a better story and one where outrage is justified 
http://news.msn.com/in-depth/small-sc-town-rallies-for-fired-gay-pol ic e-chief#tscptmf
 
2014-07-13 07:07:21 PM  

macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.


Maybe.  But it is pretty quiet about lesbians getting it on.  It only talks about men laying with men as with a woman.  Doesn't say a thing about women laying with women as with a woman (or a man for that matter).  So if we're gonna take it literally, then only male gay sex is bad.  Hot girl on girl sex, since it specifically isn't mentioned, must be okay.
 
2014-07-13 07:18:48 PM  
In order to fully-formulate my opinion, I would need to see a picture of the two ladies in question, engaged in a full-body-hug with their arms tightly wrapped around each other, while pressing 75% of the circumference of their mouths together.  The remaining 25% slightly open so that I could zoom in on the picture and clearly see saliva from each girl passing into the other girl's mouth due to the high level of surface area of each woman's tongue that is being caressed and rubbed intensely by the other. And their hands should be either on each other's breasts or rear-end. I will then contribute to the discussion.
 
2014-07-13 07:19:48 PM  

dali's perspective: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

Maybe.  But it is pretty quiet about lesbians getting it on.  It only talks about men laying with men as with a woman.  Doesn't say a thing about women laying with women as with a woman (or a man for that matter).  So if we're gonna take it literally, then only male gay sex is bad.  Hot girl on girl sex, since it specifically isn't mentioned, must be okay.


I knew a lesbian couple who attended an orthodox synagogue.  Apparently some of the more traditional members were uncomfortable with it, but as you say, there was nothing in the rules against it.
 
2014-07-13 07:42:29 PM  

Saborlas: If you attend a Christian university of your own volition, you deserve every bad thing they do to you. I'm fairly certain that many are not accredited by any reasonable organization (some are only accredited by organizations created specifically to accredit BS schools) and a degree from such a place is worthless. We're talking people who say that Pi is equal to three because the bible says so (I Kings 7:23-26, do the math). I wouldn't walk on a bridge designed by someone using the biblical value of Pi.

If your parents force you to attend a Christian university out of some wrong-headed delusion that it will "fix" a part of you that isn't actually broken, they're sh*theads and they deserve to lose contact with you forever... at least up until the point where you put them in a retirement home and import some rats.

If you are a member of the faculty at some fake-accredited Christian university, you are part of the problem and I automatically assume your degree is equivalent to a Cracker Jack prize. I will not trust your word on anything. You could say the sun rises in the east and I'd still hit up Snopes.

If you are the class pet at some Christian university, I pity you because they probably get the crappiest pet food from some bible-thumping pet store that cares more about the appearance of being christian than poor Mittens' well being.

If you are the rich billionaire creating these whack-ass Christian universities, GO SH*T GLASS SHARDS, YOU SOCIAL SABOTEUR!

Did I leave anyone out?


Yep.  Yourself.
With this rant/list you've proven that a)you're less educated than they are, or b)public institutions of higher learning have aways to go themselves.
Either way...isn't you're mommy calling you?
 
2014-07-13 07:48:20 PM  

dali's perspective: Hot girl on girl sex, since it specifically isn't mentioned, must be okay.


Well yeah.
 
2014-07-13 08:17:42 PM  
3.bp.blogspot.com
Lickety Split!
 
2014-07-13 08:25:40 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

Schools and businesses do have some leeway over their students' and employees' lives, but there should be limits.  Drugs are still technically illegal even where they're legal at the state level so I can kind of see businesses having the right there, but what about businesses that fire people for using tobacco outside of work, should that be legal?

There need to be more protections for individuals against institutional repercussion for what they do in their private lives.


One, there is a company called Weyco, Inc that has fired employees for smoking tobacco.  They went through the trouble of testing them for nicotine, and it is legal.

Second, there is a long list of stuff on that same contract that could've gotten the girl kicked out of school besides marrying a woman.  Any sex outside of marriage, anal sex even with spouse, and not meeting dress code are all listed as ways to get expelled.  If they found out about the pre-marriage sex, she'd still be gone, and you can't declare discrimination because it would've been the same if she was caught with a guy.

/dad had attended one of these schools
//one of his classmates got booted, partly for showing cleavage while playing pool in the students' lounge.
///I knew a few students who delayed marriage because they couldn't afford to move out of the dorms.  Of course the spouse couldn't stay in the dorm room, but they specifically stated married students had to either move to a married students' rentals on the edge of campus (which was usually full) or move off campus.
 
2014-07-13 08:26:43 PM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules.


No.  Just.... no.
 
2014-07-13 08:31:38 PM  

macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.


No, it's not.
 
2014-07-13 08:33:06 PM  

LewDux: Link
 Link


Are you posting that in the wrong thread, or is there some connection you'd like to explain?
 
2014-07-13 08:36:30 PM  
God damn it I went through three pages of comments and where the hell are the lesbians??
 
2014-07-13 08:37:31 PM  

runwiz: Facebook strikes again.  A private religious school.  She must have figured something like this could happen.  So why not wait until after graduation.


Sweet sweet monies.
 
2014-07-13 08:54:55 PM  

TuteTibiImperes: HMS_Blinkin: Similarly, this woman was gay before she attended the university, but she nonetheless signed (as an adult) a contract saying she wouldn't be gay (and I'm sure a lot of other BS as well) as a condition of attending the school.  She broke a contract that she signed.  I don't like the rule, and I don't like the contract, but she signed it.  She had the chance to go to one of many, MANY other colleges that wouldn't have made her sign any "covenant."  And even then, she had a chance to put off getting married until after graduation.

She may not have known she was gay when she signed and enrolled.  A lot of people, especially those who grow up in religious households, suppress those feelings and get pretty good at lying to themselves until they're out living on their own and suddenly the walls fall down.

The big issue is whether or not a school should have the right to require students to sign contracts that essentially deny homosexual students equal rights.
If the school had a blanket 'no marriage' policy it would be one thing, but a policy that discriminates only against homosexual marriage is different.

Using your golf course example if the course had a 'no hats' policy that was enforced equally towards all members that would probably be OK.  Specifically targeting yarmulkes would step over the line.


I think a better analogy might be made with home owner's associations. Those whackos make all kinds of ridiculous rules, but they are generally enforceable because members agree to abide by them. This is a whacko religious school. They believe that homosexuality is EVIL. There are too many other colleges and universities out there. Don't go to this one if you don't agree with their insanity.
 
2014-07-13 08:57:34 PM  
There was a strip club in Portsmouth , VA near the shipyard named "Lickety Splits".

/good times, good times
 
2014-07-13 09:07:07 PM  
Some some sexual bigot from a few thousand years ago writes about how god hates the gays, now all these years later ignorant people can use what he said as a valid excuse for their own prejudice today?  Using the bible as authority to suppress people runs counter to what people say their religion is about, but not counter to what the bible actually says.

The problem is really that long ago before minorities were organized enough to represent themselves christian doctrine was made part of our legal code and now that religious organizations find people have a legal right to access what was a christian tradition they must choose between either excluding gay people through legislation, which isn't legal, or removing their christian tradition from the legal code("destroying marriage").  You can't have it both ways and I think even they are starting to realize it.
 
2014-07-13 09:33:33 PM  
I am gay. You'd think that would make me support this young lady but I also come from an evangelical background so I know that this lady knew exactly what would happen. I was sent home from Christian HS for having my hair too long. You know they damn well are not going to let a practicing lesbian attend school if thye know of it. And for all you guys who think Jesus was so lovey-dovey he also said he is the only way to Heaven, everyone else will burn in Hell. And when he told people not cast the first stone? It was because he was pointing out to them that Judgment is for God (in the afterlife), not because he was alright with sinning. He told that prostitute they were gonna kill, "Go, and sin no more." That is not validating her choice, that is saying "Change your ways or burn."

Any gay people who believes that Christianity is compatible with the life they live are fooling themselves.
 
2014-07-13 09:55:45 PM  
If what you value is not compatible with where you want to go to school, choose another. Done.
 
2014-07-13 09:59:57 PM  

Abracapocalypse: I am gay. You'd think that would make me support this young lady but I also come from an evangelical background so I know that this lady knew exactly what would happen. I was sent home from Christian HS for having my hair too long. You know they damn well are not going to let a practicing lesbian attend school if thye know of it. And for all you guys who think Jesus was so lovey-dovey he also said he is the only way to Heaven, everyone else will burn in Hell. And when he told people not cast the first stone? It was because he was pointing out to them that Judgment is for God (in the afterlife), not because he was alright with sinning. He told that prostitute they were gonna kill, "Go, and sin no more." That is not validating her choice, that is saying "Change your ways or burn."

Any gay people who believes that Christianity is compatible with the life they live are fooling themselves.


well said. I'm Christian and yet also American so I feel gays have the right to marry and people generally have the right to live how they so choose. These rights also extend to religious beliefs that others may not agree with and that includes private christians/muslim/jewish or any other school. Students choose what schools they want to attend and a lot of that choice is what does the school offer in studies, culture and ideology.

One of the things that annoys me with my own Christian folk is the "America is a Christian nation" well yes we have a foundation to a certain degree but a good portion of our setup is based on the Romans (if iirc) and during I don't recall Christ taking on the Roman empire and telling them how to run their country.
 
2014-07-13 10:26:57 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: And yes, you're right that many students don't realize they're gay, of course.  But simply  being gay wasn't what got her in trouble; it appears that getting married to a woman did.


So she should have lived in sin and lied instead?  That would be more moral?
 
2014-07-13 10:44:52 PM  
I know a transman who got a full scholarship to a Christian college (he didn't transition until long after graduation).

Yeah...his old school still doesn't know.  I find it kind of funny now.
 
2014-07-13 10:57:51 PM  
She chose... poorly. If you go to a religious post-secondary institution, this is the sort of shiat you're signing up for.
 
2014-07-13 11:15:31 PM  

ciberido: HMS_Blinkin: And yes, you're right that many students don't realize they're gay, of course.  But simply  being gay wasn't what got her in trouble; it appears that getting married to a woman did.

So she should have lived in sin and lied instead?  That would be more moral?


What the fark do I care about "moral?" Who cares about "living in sin?" These are artificial constructs.

She signed a legal document promising not to engage in certain behavior as a condition of her education. She then knowingly broke that contract. Now she's facing the consequences. I was merely suggesting one of several possible ways she could have avoided the situation entirely.
 
2014-07-13 11:18:45 PM  

Uchiha_Cycliste: DarkVader: Waldo Pepper: eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled.

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.

You're not paying attention.

THIS SCHOOL ACCEPTS FEDERAL MONEY.

The school agreed to certain conditions to get that money, one of which is that there will be no sex discrimination.

I believe I'm supposed to say, this wasn't sex discrimination, she could have married a man just like any other woman can .



"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." ---  Anatole France
 
2014-07-13 11:19:42 PM  

HMS_Blinkin: ciberido: HMS_Blinkin: And yes, you're right that many students don't realize they're gay, of course.  But simply  being gay wasn't what got her in trouble; it appears that getting married to a woman did.

So she should have lived in sin and lied instead?  That would be more moral?

What the fark do I care about "moral?" Who cares about "living in sin?" These are artificial constructs.


Then you really have nothing to contribute to this discussion.
 
2014-07-13 11:48:00 PM  
How is this any different than things that have happened at BYU time and time again?
 
2014-07-14 12:16:42 AM  
The solution is simple: Don't do business with bigoted scumbags. Be they a university, a restaurant, or any other asshole organization who thinks it is a moral imperative to tell you what you can do in the privacy of your own bedroom.

Eventually they will tire of losing money by being on the wrong side of history or they will go out of business. Either way the mission is accomplished.
 
2014-07-14 12:21:48 AM  

Adolf Oliver Nipples: nekom: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

As long as they aren't receiving any government funding, this.

Do any private universities receive government funds aside from things like research grants?


Brief answer: No.

Real answer: I taught at a Catholic university. At that university in Ohio, there is an entire floor of offices in a large, expensive new building devoted to the pursuit of nothing but government grants.
 
2014-07-14 12:34:43 AM  

Farking Canuck: The solution is simple: Don't do business with bigoted scumbags. Be they a university, a restaurant, or any other asshole organization who thinks it is a moral imperative to tell you what you can do in the privacy of your own bedroom.

Eventually they will tire of losing money by being on the wrong side of history or they will go out of business. Either way the mission is accomplished.


OK - but let's say these two women weren't just having sex in the privacy of their own bedroom.  Let's say for example, they were in a hot tub at my apartment.  I mean, honestly, I never thought anything like this would happen to me.  I got home from work on Saturday and decided to go unwind in the hot tub.  It was late and the pool was officially closed, so I thought what the hell.  I went down and realized I had forgotten my swim trunks.  No big deal I thought, it was late and I was all alone - or so I thought.  I turned the corner and these two hot babes were in the hot tub kissing!  One of them had her top off.  I tried to back away, but too late - they saw me.  To my surprise the one with no top motioned me over.  I said good evening and they said hi and asked me what I was doing at the pool so late.  I told them I worked for the power company and just got off shift.  The other girl slipped her top off and said "looks like you brought your power pole with you".  They both giggled and asked me to come in the pool.
 
2014-07-14 01:09:02 AM  

ciberido: Uchiha_Cycliste: DarkVader: Waldo Pepper: eshalis: I am gay and went to a liberal arts loosely Christian affiliated college.  If a GLBTQ person or anyone else wants to go to a crazy wacko right wing Christian college and is shocked that they actually dislike youhave rules against your behaviour, do not be surprised and complain.  Also from what this article said the credits are hard to transfer which makes me wonder if this is even a real college.

ftfy.

she would have been expelled if she had a job as a stripper, if she was caught smoking pot or any of the other behaviours the school says is a no.  do not secular colleges also have rules that if violated a student can be expelled.

She agreed to the rules when she agreed to go there. nobody forced her to go to a christian college and even if this was the only college her parents would pay for then she could have chosen a different option on for herself.

You're not paying attention.

THIS SCHOOL ACCEPTS FEDERAL MONEY.

The school agreed to certain conditions to get that money, one of which is that there will be no sex discrimination.

I believe I'm supposed to say, this wasn't sex discrimination, she could have married a man just like any other woman can .


"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." ---  Anatole France


great comeback!
 
2014-07-14 02:10:21 AM  

BrassArt: With this rant/list you've proven that a)you're less educated than they are, or b)public institutions of higher learning have aways to go themselves.


He is right that organizations exist specifically to accredit religious colleges that would never meet the requirements of any mainstream accreditation association.  One such is called American Accrediting Association of Theological Institutions, responsible for accrediting Patriot Bible University
, a notorious diploma mill in Del Norte, Colorado.
 
2014-07-14 07:11:15 AM  

ElLoco: Jeez. Christian schools have done exactly this since ever. It's part of the conditions for admission. A Christian University near me has student volunteers that prowl liquor store parking lots and the nude bars (which are distinctly outside the city limits) looking for University parking stickers on vehicles so they can rat out their fellow students and get them kicked. When they find one, they do rat them out. And they do get kicked.


I am surprised their degrees are worth anything more than the paper they are printed on, esp. when it comes to applying for post graduate studies at real universities.  Surely such places science degrees are the equivalent of the ones you get from online 'universities' which just take your money send you your doctorate in philosophy.
 
2014-07-14 07:29:46 AM  
"lickety split" PUN INTENDED?!?
 
2014-07-14 07:31:20 AM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).

So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?


I might not, but there are probably 5 Supreme Court Justices who think it's perfectly fine.
 
2014-07-14 07:45:01 AM  

ciberido: LewDux: Link
 Link

Are you posting that in the wrong thread, or is there some connection you'd like to explain?


I thought you atheists are good at thinking for yourselves. Apparently knot
 
2014-07-14 07:45:37 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?


Because it is a man and a women?  Just guessing.
 
2014-07-14 09:16:32 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: I think it's an issue worth debating. Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage? How is this any different?


To what extent can a school still get away with that?  Even Bob Jones University caved eventually.
 
2014-07-14 09:26:02 AM  

Langdon_777: I am surprised their degrees are worth anything more than the paper they are printed on, esp. when it comes to applying for post graduate studies at real universities. Surely such places science degrees are the equivalent of the ones you get from online 'universities' which just take your money send you your doctorate in philosophy.


There are "accreditation mills" that exist only to give worthless accreditations to religious diploma mills.  Other religious institutions have somehow managed to become accredited in fields they shouldn't have, and it does worry me.  Liberty University teaches biology.  BYU will expel faculty for teaching anything that does not agree with the doctrines of the LDS church, and yet allegedly has legitimate archeaology and anthropology courses.  (The issue here being not creationism, but rather the doctrine that Native Americans are descended from refugees from the middle east who built an entire civilization complete with roads, wheeled vehicles, and horses.  Twice.)  Are the faculty in these departments allowed to publish freely?  If not, it would be career suicide to accept a position there, and you would expect to find only the worst people in the field teaching there.
 
2014-07-14 10:08:29 AM  
While I don't agree with the schools position they have a right to it. Christian universities are so weird. I have seen ones that still expel you for next to nothing and others that are the lesbian capital of the world. While the universities actions are worthy of contempt in this case they aren't exactly surprising.
 
2014-07-14 10:50:06 AM  

Abracapocalypse: And for all you guys who think Jesus was so lovey-dovey he also said he is the only way to Heaven, everyone else will burn in Hell. And when he told people not cast the first stone? It was because he was pointing out to them that Judgment is for God (in the afterlife), not because he was alright with sinning. He told that prostitute they were gonna kill, "Go, and sin no more." That is not validating her choice, that is saying "Change your ways or burn."


Funny you should mention that.  You know who Jesus never said "Go, and sin no more"  to?  A gay man who asked Jesus to heal his gay lover.

And if judgement is for God, then it isn't for the university, now is it?
 
2014-07-14 10:51:48 AM  

LewDux: ciberido: LewDux: Link
 Link

Are you posting that in the wrong thread, or is there some connection you'd like to explain?

I thought you atheists are good at thinking for yourselves. Apparently knot


That insult would be a lot less lame if I actually were an atheist.
 
2014-07-14 10:52:02 AM  

LewDux: ciberido: LewDux: Link
 Link

Are you posting that in the wrong thread, or is there some connection you'd like to explain?

I thought you atheists are good at thinking for yourselves. Apparently knot


Um, I'm pretty sure that ciberido is a Christian (and one who actually tends to follow Christ's teachings, unlike most), not an atheist...
 
2014-07-14 10:53:15 AM  

Cold_Sassy: TuteTibiImperes: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

I think it's an issue worth debating.  Would you feel the school is within its rights to expel a student for entering into an interracial marriage?  How is this any different?

Because it is a man and a women?  Just guessing.


Try again.
 
2014-07-14 12:17:07 PM  
Sorta like signing a Homeowners Association contract stipulating certain rules such as not installing flag poles or flying flags.  Be an asshole, break the rules, cry to the press, and attempt to break the contract through public pressure.  Contracts aren't worth the paper they're written on.  I hope she wins.
 
2014-07-14 12:59:56 PM  

macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.


If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".
 
2014-07-14 01:20:56 PM  

shortymac: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".


?

1 Cor 6:9,10
"Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God's Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God's Kingdom."

Lesbianism is immoral...
 
2014-07-14 02:28:14 PM  

HowiPepper: Step 1: Go to Christian university
Step 2: Marry lesbian partner
Step 3: Share expulsion letter with CNN
Step 4:
[img.fark.net image 468x666]


That's pretty much it in a nutshell.  You just earned yourself a [Smart] vote.
 
2014-07-14 02:29:07 PM  

macross87: shortymac: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".

?

1 Cor 6:9,10
"Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God's Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God's Kingdom."

Lesbianism is immoral...


That is St. Paul talking. Not Christ Himself. To attribute divinity to St. Paul's writings is blasphemous.
 
2014-07-14 02:43:25 PM  

macross87: shortymac: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".

?

1 Cor 6:9,10
"Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God's Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God's Kingdom."

Lesbianism is immoral...


LOL.

;) like your snark,
 
2014-07-14 02:54:45 PM  

shortymac: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".


Then, there's the story of Ruth and Naomi, which pretty much glorifies and celebrates a lesbian relationship...
 
2014-07-14 03:31:49 PM  

macross87: shortymac: macross87: The bible is against homosexuality. That part is clear.

If you follow a strict interpretation of the bible, lesbianism is never expressly forbidden.

It says "man shall not lie with man", there is never a "woman shall not lie with woman". Granted, it's in the same chapter that bans pork, shellfish, etc but your average Jebus lover ignores that bc his pastor says so.

There's a romans verse floating around that people now claim talks about lesbianism doesn't actually mention lesbianism.  It could easily mean "the girls became sluts".

?

1 Cor 6:9,10
"Or do you not know that unrighteous people will not inherit God's Kingdom? Do not be misled. Those who are sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, men who submit to homosexual acts, men who practice homosexuality, thieves, greedy people, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners will not inherit God's Kingdom."

Lesbianism is immoral...


Still doesn't mention Lesbianism, mentions MEN and homosexual acts, but not women.
 
2014-07-14 03:50:43 PM  

shortymac: Still doesn't mention Lesbianism, mentions MEN and homosexual acts, but not women.


Even the most evil, bigoted male recognizes that girl on girl action is awesome.

/sorry, don't make the rules just abide by them
 
2014-07-14 04:56:31 PM  

Straight Outta Wells Branch: HMS_Blinkin: Adolf Oliver Nipples: Their university, their rules. Just like if someone makes you take a drug test to work for them, it doesn't matter if you think it's harmless, it's their rules. But that makes too much sense, so when it all goes wrong they should call CNN and complain.

Yeah.  I'm a rabid supporter of LGBT rights and equality, but it's a private university.  They can make up whatever damn rules they want.  Go to ANY public university in the country and this wouldn't be a problem (or at the very least you could sue someone's face off if it was a problem).

So if a private golf course founded by evangelicals said "No Jews because they killed our Lord" will you really just say that it's their right to do so?


Yes it is their right to do so but federal law may intervene. Also this is a dishonest analogy. Being a Jew or black etc is not by choice.

Remember she got expelled NOT because she is gay. She got expelled because she got married! For some strange reason people like you can't comprehend the differences.
Two very different things.

She also signed the pledge and I'm sure she knows darn well gay marriage would be a HUGE problem at her school. To deliberately do it a few weeks before her graduation and creating a shiatstorm sounds like AW to me.
 
2014-07-14 04:58:43 PM  
I want to know why she had to go all butch looking, because she was kind of cute in that picture they showed and now she looks harsh.

I am Bi and I have no problem with the action this school has taken. She should have been smart enough to realize that her marriage would create issues with the school's policy. A delay in getting married would have been in her best interest. Now I think she is playing the victim card for her own mistakes in the hope of making some kind of statement for gay rights.
 
2014-07-14 10:22:37 PM  

Mugato: shortymac: Still doesn't mention Lesbianism, mentions MEN and homosexual acts, but not women.

Even the most evil, bigoted male recognizes that girl on girl action is awesome.

/sorry, don't make the rules just abide by them


Not always

www1.pictures.zimbio.com
 
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