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(Yahoo)   If do right, horse no can defense   (news.yahoo.com ) divider line
    More: Dumbass, mounted police, Old Town, bass drums  
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5793 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Jul 2014 at 8:12 PM (1 year ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-10 04:51:58 PM  
This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid. Mr. Miyagi clearly tells Daniel-San that the Crane Technique cannot be defended against, if done correctly. This knowledge and the proper application of the Crane Technique is what then allows Daniel-San to go on and win the tournament.

However, in the sequel, we see Daniel-San travel to Mr. Miyagi's native homeland of Okinawa, which is an island near Japan. On that island, Daniel-San has a series of misadventures and ends up in mortal combat with Chozen, son of Sato, an old enemy of Miyagi. Early in their fight, Daniel-San sets out to end the combat decisively with his Crane Technique. However, Chozen easily captures his leg and throws him to the ground. Daniel-San is then treated to a brutal beating that ends only through his successful application of a new non-defensible move, the Drum Technique.

So...does the initial failure of the Crane Technique against Chozen represent the fact that the Crane Technique is not actually a technique that has no defense? If so, that can only lead us to two possible interpretations (assuming that Daniel-San applied the Crane Technique correctly; side-by-side comparison of the two fights does appear to show that he delivered both Crane Strikes similarly, and so we must assume that the error was not his). One interpretation is that Miyagi was incorrect in asserting that the Crane Technique has no defense. This would imply that Miyagi is not as formidable a martial artist as he apparently wants Daniel-San to think, which in turn taints the entire thrust of the movie.

The other possibility, though, is even more sinister. In this scenario, Miyagi *knows* that the Crane Technique actually can be defended against, but he chooses to not give Daniel-San this information. Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to eliminate him for some reason? Perhaps he was trying to prevent the events that would make Karate Kid III possible from taking place?

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.
 
2014-07-10 05:29:36 PM  
Pocket Ninja, you rock.

My theory is that Daniel-san did not do the crane technique correctly either time. The fact that it succeeded against Johnny was just pure luck. Feel better now?
 
2014-07-10 05:36:36 PM  
cdn.gunaxin.com
 
2014-07-10 05:41:42 PM  
Horses don't know karate, but they do know ka-razy...


mojoimage.com
 
2014-07-10 05:51:03 PM  

MattyBlast: Pocket Ninja, you rock.

My theory is that Daniel-san did not do the crane technique correctly either time. The fact that it succeeded against Johnny was just pure luck. Feel better now?


Thank you. I had considered this possibility, and in fact found it to be a source of some comfort for a while. But further consideration led me to understand that this possibility, in fact, plays equally, and perhaps even more sinisterly, into the two scenarios I already described. Because we must consider the fact that, at the tournament, Mr. Miyagi was right there, at ringside, watching as Daniel-San employed the Crane Technique. As Daniel-San's teacher, it must have fallen on him to correct Daniel-San on the improper application of the technique. I am very proud of you, Daniel-San, he might have said. But I must correct your Crane Technique. You were fortunate in the fight against Johnny, but you cannot always count on being fortunate in life.

I understand that the movie ended after Daniel-San's victory, of course. But when we're talking about as critical as the Crane Technique and its non-defenseability, we would have had to have seen some instruction taking place. Perhaps it would have been an early scene in the second movie, Miyagi instructing Daniel-San before their flight.

But that never happens. Which means that *if* Daniel-San improperly used the Crane Technique, Miyagi either:

A) Did not know that he misapplied (feeds into scenario 1)
B) Knew that he misapplied it, and chose to not correct it (feeds into scenario 2)

What's disturbing about either option is that it adds to Mr. Miyagi's actions an even deeper level of either incompetence or intent, so you can see why I try to avoid thinking along those lines.
 
2014-07-10 08:16:54 PM  

Pocket Ninja:

The other possibility, though, is even more sinister. In this scenario, Miyagi *knows* that the Crane Technique actually can be defended against, but he chooses to not give Daniel-San this information. Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to ...


www.quickmeme.com
 
2014-07-10 08:22:53 PM  
Well, Miyagi was a closet drunk and still felt disgraced after running from Sato, so he may have just been full of sh't the entire time. He did get a bunch of free labor in exchange for teaching Daniel San like, three moves. The only three he knew? Probably not. Conclusion: Miyagi learned more from Daniel than Daniel learned from Miyagi. Relevant to the thread since Hillary 'oats' Swank was a Karate Kid as well, IIRC
 
2014-07-10 08:24:28 PM  

Pocket Ninja: This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid. Mr. Miyagi clearly tells Daniel-San that the Crane Technique cannot be defended against, if done correctly. This knowledge and the proper application of the Crane Technique is what then allows Daniel-San to go on and win the tournament.

However, in the sequel, we see Daniel-San travel to Mr. Miyagi's native homeland of Okinawa, which is an island near Japan. On that island, Daniel-San has a series of misadventures and ends up in mortal combat with Chozen, son of Sato, an old enemy of Miyagi. Early in their fight, Daniel-San sets out to end the combat decisively with his Crane Technique. However, Chozen easily captures his leg and throws him to the ground. Daniel-San is then treated to a brutal beating that ends only through his successful application of a new non-defensible move, the Drum Technique.

So...does the initial failure of the Crane Technique against Chozen represent the fact that the Crane Technique is not actually a technique that has no defense? If so, that can only lead us to two possible interpretations (assuming that Daniel-San applied the Crane Technique correctly; side-by-side comparison of the two fights does appear to show that he delivered both Crane Strikes similarly, and so we must assume that the error was not his). One interpretation is that Miyagi was incorrect in asserting that the Crane Technique has no defense. This would imply that Miyagi is not as formidable a martial artist as he apparently wants Daniel-San to think, which in turn taints the entire thrust of the movie.

The other possibility, though, is even more sinister. In this scenario, Miyagi *knows* that the Crane Technique actually can be defended against, but he chooses to not give Daniel-San this information. Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to ...


Another possibility,

The crane technique could not be defended against when Miyagi made that statement. But the martial arts arms race developed new techniques that rendered that statement false.

Then before you know it, Karate nukes.
 
2014-07-10 08:26:40 PM  

iron de havilland: [cdn.gunaxin.com image 392x251]


Came for this, leaving satisfied
 
2014-07-10 08:27:20 PM  
Sweep the leg.
 
2014-07-10 08:27:28 PM  

Pocket Ninja: B) Knew that he misapplied it, and chose to not correct it (feeds into scenario 2)


that's it. just end it there. throw your tinfoil hat away. sure daniel misapplied the kick, but he had just won the tournament. johnny was a scrub and lost to a broken technique. however, mr. miyagi was happy enough and decided not to go the jewish mother (or so i have heard) and correct him despite everything turning out for the best. besides, mr miyagi never specifically trained daniel in the crane kick (unlike wax on wax off, paint the fence, etc.) it was just something daniel tried to imitate after watching miyagi do it at the beach. mr. miyagi probably had no idea that he would try to use it in the tournament. during the fight with chozen, daniel was once again outmatched and figured, 'uh, i guess i can try the crane kick' and we all saw how that worked out. mr. miyagi was a good man, and i have had enough of you trying to sully his honor with conspiracy theories.

/good day sir :P
 
2014-07-10 08:37:03 PM  

Pocket Ninja: Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to eliminate him for some reason? Perhaps he was trying to prevent the events that would make Karate Kid III possible from taking place?


Mr. Miyagi was still pissed about Daniel-San catching the fly with the chopsticks on the first try.

Revenge is a dish best served cold.
 
2014-07-10 08:43:31 PM  

Pocket Ninja: This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid.


What about the fact that they say in the rules "NO kicks to the face or head" and Daniel wins by kicking Johnny in the face?!
 
2014-07-10 08:43:31 PM  
the original karate kid is now the same age as mr. miyagi

you are old and getting older
 
2014-07-10 08:45:29 PM  
www.zacparsons.com
 
2014-07-10 08:46:46 PM  
Why in gods name would you attack a police horse? I mean, maybe if you and the horse were hanging out and it was being a dick, but otherwise....
 
2014-07-10 08:52:03 PM  
Olin and his human partner

thebentangle.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-07-10 08:52:32 PM  
Horse just pawn in game of life.
 
2014-07-10 08:57:55 PM  
Better get a body bag!
 
2014-07-10 09:03:22 PM  
Was Subby trying to for this as a reference?

popdoctor.com
 
2014-07-10 09:04:41 PM  
Fair is fair.  Now Olin gets a penalty kick.
 
2014-07-10 09:06:20 PM  
Another fine thread brought to us all by pocket ninja


Bravo sir
 
2014-07-10 09:07:36 PM  
Pocket Ninja:

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.

Or you know, attacking a target that outweighs you by a 1,000+ pounds is royally stupid and the horse could have bit his arm off or stomped him with little effort. He basically tried kicking a brick wall.
 
2014-07-10 09:11:42 PM  

PaulieattheTap: Was Subby trying to for this as a reference?


Maybe Subby ice cream radio caught sayof.
 
2014-07-10 09:17:51 PM  

Pocket Ninja: This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid. Mr. Miyagi clearly tells Daniel-San that the Crane Technique cannot be defended against, if done correctly. This knowledge and the proper application of the Crane Technique is what then allows Daniel-San to go on and win the tournament.

However, in the sequel, we see Daniel-San travel to Mr. Miyagi's native homeland of Okinawa, which is an island near Japan. On that island, Daniel-San has a series of misadventures and ends up in mortal combat with Chozen, son of Sato, an old enemy of Miyagi. Early in their fight, Daniel-San sets out to end the combat decisively with his Crane Technique. However, Chozen easily captures his leg and throws him to the ground. Daniel-San is then treated to a brutal beating that ends only through his successful application of a new non-defensible move, the Drum Technique.

So...does the initial failure of the Crane Technique against Chozen represent the fact that the Crane Technique is not actually a technique that has no defense? If so, that can only lead us to two possible interpretations (assuming that Daniel-San applied the Crane Technique correctly; side-by-side comparison of the two fights does appear to show that he delivered both Crane Strikes similarly, and so we must assume that the error was not his). One interpretation is that Miyagi was incorrect in asserting that the Crane Technique has no defense. This would imply that Miyagi is not as formidable a martial artist as he apparently wants Daniel-San to think, which in turn taints the entire thrust of the movie.

The other possibility, though, is even more sinister. In this scenario, Miyagi *knows* that the Crane Technique actually can be defended against, but he chooses to not give Daniel-San this information. Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to eliminate him for some reason? Perhaps he was trying to prevent the events that would make Karate Kid III possible from taking place?

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.


Daniel-san was a errand boy, sent by grocery clerks, to collect a bill.

Like Luke Skywalker. Search your feelings, you know it to be true.
 
2014-07-10 09:19:05 PM  
No, sir, I didn't like it.
 
2014-07-10 09:20:13 PM  

buntz: Pocket Ninja: This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid.

What about the fact that they say in the rules "NO kicks to the face or head" and Daniel wins by kicking Johnny in the face?!


That's one of those great mysteries, like Indy attaching himself to the sub for 500 miles, that never occurredr to anyone prior to the internet scrutiny of everything. You were so caught up in it your brain never registered the "hey...wait a minute..."
 
2014-07-10 09:20:34 PM  
All these years later and Fark still gets a laugh out of me. Very well done subby!
 
2014-07-10 09:21:58 PM  
If it weren't for that police horse I wouldn't have spent that year in jail.
 
2014-07-10 09:22:47 PM  

strangeluck: Pocket Ninja:

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.

Or you know, attacking a target that outweighs you by a 1,000+ pounds is royally stupid and the horse could have bit his arm off or stomped him with little effort. He basically tried kicking a brick wall.


What happened here?
 
2014-07-10 09:25:19 PM  
24.media.tumblr.com

Dim mak
 
2014-07-10 09:25:31 PM  
Stop with the Karate Kid references.  You'll get Bill Simmons in here and then we're all hosed.
 
2014-07-10 09:26:47 PM  

ReverendJynxed: [24.media.tumblr.com image 500x270]

Dim mak


FUNYUNS!
 
2014-07-10 09:29:58 PM  

BeesNuts: strangeluck: Pocket Ninja:

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.

Or you know, attacking a target that outweighs you by a 1,000+ pounds is royally stupid and the horse could have bit his arm off or stomped him with little effort. He basically tried kicking a brick wall.

What happened here?


I've been drinking, lost my train of thought and started rambling about two different stories that may or may not be connected?

/it's more likely than you think.
 
2014-07-10 09:32:39 PM  

Pocket Ninja: MattyBlast: Pocket Ninja, you rock.

My theory is that Daniel-san did not do the crane technique correctly either time. The fact that it succeeded against Johnny was just pure luck. Feel better now?

Thank you. I had considered this possibility, and in fact found it to be a source of some comfort for a while. But further consideration led me to understand that this possibility, in fact, plays equally, and perhaps even more sinisterly, into the two scenarios I already described. Because we must consider the fact that, at the tournament, Mr. Miyagi was right there, at ringside, watching as Daniel-San employed the Crane Technique. As Daniel-San's teacher, it must have fallen on him to correct Daniel-San on the improper application of the technique. I am very proud of you, Daniel-San, he might have said. But I must correct your Crane Technique. You were fortunate in the fight against Johnny, but you cannot always count on being fortunate in life.

I understand that the movie ended after Daniel-San's victory, of course. But when we're talking about as critical as the Crane Technique and its non-defenseability, we would have had to have seen some instruction taking place. Perhaps it would have been an early scene in the second movie, Miyagi instructing Daniel-San before their flight.

But that never happens. Which means that *if* Daniel-San improperly used the Crane Technique, Miyagi either:

A) Did not know that he misapplied (feeds into scenario 1)
B) Knew that he misapplied it, and chose to not correct it (feeds into scenario 2)

What's disturbing about either option is that it adds to Mr. Miyagi's actions an even deeper level of either incompetence or intent, so you can see why I try to avoid thinking along those lines.


Maybe Miyagi  told him there was no defense to it even though there is. You know, in case he needed to use it against Daniel-San in the future....
 
2014-07-10 09:35:34 PM  

ReverendJynxed: [24.media.tumblr.com image 500x270]

Dim mak


i738.photobucket.com
 
2014-07-10 09:37:38 PM  

Starfire: Maybe Miyagi told him there was no defense to it even though there is. You know, in case he needed to use it against Daniel-San in the future....


I read that good armorers always designed a flaw in their pieces...just in case.
 
2014-07-10 09:44:35 PM  

thamike: ReverendJynxed: [24.media.tumblr.com image 500x270]

Dim mak

FUNYUNS!


I love butternuts!

Cup!
 
GBB
2014-07-10 09:47:47 PM  

lordargent: Another possibility,

The crane technique could not be defended against when Miyagi made that statement. But the martial arts arms race developed new techniques that rendered that statement false.

Then before you know it, Karate nukes.



----or---

www.i-mockery.com
 
2014-07-10 09:51:07 PM  

strangeluck: BeesNuts: strangeluck: Pocket Ninja:

We may never know, but I've thought about this for a very long time.

Or you know, attacking a target that outweighs you by a 1,000+ pounds is royally stupid and the horse could have bit his arm off or stomped him with little effort. He basically tried kicking a brick wall.

What happened here?

I've been drinking, lost my train of thought and started rambling about two different stories that may or may not be connected?

/it's more likely than you think.


Also been drinking.  Just wondering which one of us had our wires crossed.  Carry on.
 
2014-07-10 09:53:12 PM  
This thread so much, love I.

threadsofatattinggoddess.blogspot.com
 
2014-07-10 09:56:25 PM  

Starfire: Pocket Ninja: MattyBlast: Pocket Ninja, you rock.

My theory is that Daniel-san did not do the crane technique correctly either time. The fact that it succeeded against Johnny was just pure luck. Feel better now?

Thank you. I had considered this possibility, and in fact found it to be a source of some comfort for a while. But further consideration led me to understand that this possibility, in fact, plays equally, and perhaps even more sinisterly, into the two scenarios I already described. Because we must consider the fact that, at the tournament, Mr. Miyagi was right there, at ringside, watching as Daniel-San employed the Crane Technique. As Daniel-San's teacher, it must have fallen on him to correct Daniel-San on the improper application of the technique. I am very proud of you, Daniel-San, he might have said. But I must correct your Crane Technique. You were fortunate in the fight against Johnny, but you cannot always count on being fortunate in life.

I understand that the movie ended after Daniel-San's victory, of course. But when we're talking about as critical as the Crane Technique and its non-defenseability, we would have had to have seen some instruction taking place. Perhaps it would have been an early scene in the second movie, Miyagi instructing Daniel-San before their flight.

But that never happens. Which means that *if* Daniel-San improperly used the Crane Technique, Miyagi either:

A) Did not know that he misapplied (feeds into scenario 1)
B) Knew that he misapplied it, and chose to not correct it (feeds into scenario 2)

What's disturbing about either option is that it adds to Mr. Miyagi's actions an even deeper level of either incompetence or intent, so you can see why I try to avoid thinking along those lines.

Maybe Miyagi  told him there was no defense to it even though there is. You know, in case he needed to use it against Daniel-San in the future....


Isn't that part of the plot in Jade Empire?
 
2014-07-10 10:13:08 PM  
It looks like they have shaved the forequarters of the horse in the article's pic. Odd thing to do.
 
2014-07-10 10:20:03 PM  

Boojum2k: Starfire: Pocket Ninja: MattyBlast: Pocket Ninja, you rock.

My theory is that Daniel-san did not do the crane technique correctly either time. The fact that it succeeded against Johnny was just pure luck. Feel better now?

Thank you. I had considered this possibility, and in fact found it to be a source of some comfort for a while. But further consideration led me to understand that this possibility, in fact, plays equally, and perhaps even more sinisterly, into the two scenarios I already described. Because we must consider the fact that, at the tournament, Mr. Miyagi was right there, at ringside, watching as Daniel-San employed the Crane Technique. As Daniel-San's teacher, it must have fallen on him to correct Daniel-San on the improper application of the technique. I am very proud of you, Daniel-San, he might have said. But I must correct your Crane Technique. You were fortunate in the fight against Johnny, but you cannot always count on being fortunate in life.

I understand that the movie ended after Daniel-San's victory, of course. But when we're talking about as critical as the Crane Technique and its non-defenseability, we would have had to have seen some instruction taking place. Perhaps it would have been an early scene in the second movie, Miyagi instructing Daniel-San before their flight.

But that never happens. Which means that *if* Daniel-San improperly used the Crane Technique, Miyagi either:

A) Did not know that he misapplied (feeds into scenario 1)
B) Knew that he misapplied it, and chose to not correct it (feeds into scenario 2)

What's disturbing about either option is that it adds to Mr. Miyagi's actions an even deeper level of either incompetence or intent, so you can see why I try to avoid thinking along those lines.

Maybe Miyagi  told him there was no defense to it even though there is. You know, in case he needed to use it against Daniel-San in the future....

Isn't that part of the plot in Jade Empire?


No idea what "Jade Empire" is. So, sorry if it is the plot?
 
2014-07-10 10:23:44 PM  

Starfire: No idea what "Jade Empire" is. So, sorry if it is the plot?


Seriously?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_empire

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/VideoGame/JadeEmpire

Awesome game.
 
2014-07-10 10:27:28 PM  
Did you ever consider that Mr. Miyagi's claim for the crane technique might have been hyperbole?  Nobody's going to spend months learning a technique that's "pretty good."
 
2014-07-10 10:30:12 PM  
 These Mr. Miyagi theories are mind-blowing. Probably planning the whole thing since he owned Arnold's.
 
2014-07-10 10:41:48 PM  

Boojum2k: Starfire: No idea what "Jade Empire" is. So, sorry if it is the plot?

Seriously?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jade_empire

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/VideoGame/JadeEmpire

Awesome game.


It does look like an awesome game. I don't recall it when it first came out, so thanks for enlightening me. Now I need to get my hands on a copy...
 
2014-07-10 10:53:35 PM  

Starfire: Now I need to get my hands on a copy...


GOG.com has it for about $15
 
2014-07-10 10:55:03 PM  

Pocket Ninja: This was always a point of great confusion for me in the Karate Kid. Mr. Miyagi clearly tells Daniel-San that the Crane Technique cannot be defended against, if done correctly. This knowledge and the proper application of the Crane Technique is what then allows Daniel-San to go on and win the tournament.

However, in the sequel, we see Daniel-San travel to Mr. Miyagi's native homeland of Okinawa, which is an island near Japan. On that island, Daniel-San has a series of misadventures and ends up in mortal combat with Chozen, son of Sato, an old enemy of Miyagi. Early in their fight, Daniel-San sets out to end the combat decisively with his Crane Technique. However, Chozen easily captures his leg and throws him to the ground. Daniel-San is then treated to a brutal beating that ends only through his successful application of a new non-defensible move, the Drum Technique.

So...does the initial failure of the Crane Technique against Chozen represent the fact that the Crane Technique is not actually a technique that has no defense? If so, that can only lead us to two possible interpretations (assuming that Daniel-San applied the Crane Technique correctly; side-by-side comparison of the two fights does appear to show that he delivered both Crane Strikes similarly, and so we must assume that the error was not his). One interpretation is that Miyagi was incorrect in asserting that the Crane Technique has no defense. This would imply that Miyagi is not as formidable a martial artist as he apparently wants Daniel-San to think, which in turn taints the entire thrust of the movie.

The other possibility, though, is even more sinister. In this scenario, Miyagi *knows* that the Crane Technique actually can be defended against, but he chooses to not give Daniel-San this information. Which can only mean that, on some level, he is setting Daniel-San up for failure and defeat. What might his motivations be? Could Miyagi's entire purpose of bringing Daniel-San to Okinawa have been to ...


"Can no defense" was given in the context of an adjudicated karate tournament, in which the opposition would not expect nor be required to defend against a kick to the head. He would automatically block the legal torso attack that could also come out of that position and leave himself open to eating a mouth full of foot. Basically, Miyagi said, "If you're getting your ass kicked in a tournament because of dirty play, trick him into letting you kick him in the face."

Against Chozen, however, Daniel-san was in a street fight. Chozen looked at that silly wind up, defended against the obvious attack, and then gave Daniel-san the righteous beatdown he deserved.
 
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