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(Washington Post)   Germany expels CIA station chief after NSA spying. Also finds out he was rooting for Argentina in World Cup final   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 127
    More: Cool, U.S. News, station chief, Steffen Seibert, dispute, unlawful combatants  
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2342 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Jul 2014 at 10:30 AM (24 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-10 10:34:59 AM  
Ich bin unimpressed
 
2014-07-10 10:36:22 AM  
HaHA!.jpg
 
2014-07-10 10:38:43 AM  
Interesting tag choice considering the rate we've been burning bridges with Germany lately.
 
2014-07-10 10:40:59 AM  
Honestly who did not see this coming?
 
2014-07-10 10:41:27 AM  
blogs.r.ftdata.co.uk
 
2014-07-10 10:42:02 AM  

selrah: Honestly who did not see this coming?


The NSA?
 
2014-07-10 10:43:48 AM  

mcreadyblue:


"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?
 
2014-07-10 10:44:46 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?


If they could compare him to Hitler they would, but I think it's illegal.
 
2014-07-10 10:46:26 AM  
Was rooting?  So they can also see the future?  NSA better step up.

/like Germany isn't doing it too
 
2014-07-10 10:46:51 AM  

strangeluck: HaHA!.jpg


x 2
 
2014-07-10 10:49:09 AM  

mcreadyblue:


If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?
 
2014-07-10 10:50:43 AM  
Münchenghazi
 
2014-07-10 10:51:16 AM  

The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?


That's the thing, our intelligence gathering abilities are too big to fail at this point.
 
2014-07-10 10:52:10 AM  
That was funny.
 
2014-07-10 10:52:56 AM  
Consider the old world charm of Vienna, much more of a spy friendly town.

img.fark.net
 
2014-07-10 10:53:53 AM  
PNG'd.
 
2014-07-10 10:55:13 AM  
Can we get a little more Israeli with our spies please?  What's this "Hi, I'm a station chief! Oh you want me to leave?" sh*t?
 
2014-07-10 10:55:26 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?


They're secret police that occasionally make people disappear and engage in mass domestic surveillance. Pretty apt comparison.
 
2014-07-10 10:56:01 AM  
I have absolutely no problem with the US spying on other countries (even alleged allies) and their citizens. It is the getting caught doing it that I have a problem with. We use to be better at this stuff.
 
2014-07-10 10:56:30 AM  
Why would the CIA station chief be spying for the NSA? Wouldn't he be spying for the CIA?
 
2014-07-10 10:57:07 AM  
A simple no from the US should suffice as spying on Germany seems par for the course.
 
2014-07-10 10:57:20 AM  

Giltric: HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?

If they could compare him to Hitler they would, but I think it's illegal.


You miss the point of the comparison.

The Stasi failed. They did not notice their government was about to be overthrown. They were too busy tapping phones, reading mail, following dissidents, keeping track of who slept with who, etc.

At their high point, 1/10 East Germans were informants. Yet the Stasi failed their primary mission.

The NSA is closely following in their footsteps.
 
2014-07-10 10:57:27 AM  

The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?


Anti-NSA politicans from both parties like Rand Paul, Justin Amash, Ron Wyden, and Jared Polis?

If they aren't available, vote third party. If anti-rights candidates' volunteers come to your door, tell them exactly why they won't be getting your support.
 
2014-07-10 10:59:57 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?

They're secret police that occasionally make people disappear and engage in mass domestic surveillance. Pretty apt comparison.


Yeah but it hurts my feelings if you say MY country is the bad guy!

So obviously its just a horde of over eager interns committing isolated incidents.
 
2014-07-10 11:00:13 AM  
That puts the US in the same boat as Iran and North Korea, again.

Of course this means nothing to US politicians but it is a huge deal to Germany and the EU and is only a first step towards a growing divide if not between the governments but certainly between the people. The divide started with Bush and, unfortunately, Obama has squandered any goodwill and made the situation only worse.
 
2014-07-10 11:00:59 AM  

DubtodaIll: The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?

That's the thing, our intelligence gathering abilities are too big to fail at this point.


so "both sides are bad" correct?
 
2014-07-10 11:01:34 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?

They're secret police that occasionally make people disappear and engage in mass domestic surveillance. Pretty apt comparison.


Sure, if you have brain damage.
 
2014-07-10 11:01:40 AM  
also, this thread reminds me that I need to watch this again

tangente.mpglu.de
 
2014-07-10 11:02:46 AM  

inner ted: DubtodaIll: The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?

That's the thing, our intelligence gathering abilities are too big to fail at this point.

so "both sides are bad" correct?


That's the thing, it isn't even true in this case (it is in most). There is a group within both major parties that opposes this stuff. There are two sides, both with members that hold serious offices, they just aren't divided along Team Red vs Team Blue.
 
2014-07-10 11:02:49 AM  

The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?


We could try to go full tea party inside 6 years in house, senate and whitehouse

After the fallout clears and LP fuel for generators stops flowing we'd probably be clear of the surveillance state.

But I'm not sure if trading it for roaming bands of marauders and smallpox/polio pandemics is really a good trade.

Honestly I see no good way out of our mess. One of those 'things going to get worse before they get better' types of deals. We need a large increase in public knowledge and a simultaneous decrease in apathy.
 
2014-07-10 11:05:42 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?


Those ain't Germans, they're the regular kind of roaches.
 
2014-07-10 11:06:21 AM  

YixilTesiphon: inner ted: DubtodaIll: The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?

That's the thing, our intelligence gathering abilities are too big to fail at this point.

so "both sides are bad" correct?

That's the thing, it isn't even true in this case (it is in most). There is a group within both major parties that opposes this stuff. There are two sides, both with members that hold serious offices, they just aren't divided along Team Red vs Team Blue.


I don't see either side having the political bravery to de-fund the NSA or CIA or even get close to touching the Patriot Act.  If anything intelligence budgets will continue to swell.
 
TWX
2014-07-10 11:08:38 AM  

mcreadyblue:
You miss the point of the comparison.

The Stasi failed. They did not notice their government was about to be overthrown. They were too busy tapping phones, reading mail, following dissidents, keeping track of who slept with who, etc.

At their high point, 1/10 East Germans were informants. Yet the Stasi failed their primary mission.

The NSA is closely following in their footsteps.


East Germany fell because of opportunity rather than conspiracy. As soon as their government ineptly announced an ease on travel restrictions, immediately, without having a plan, the fairly repressed populace tested it and the border guards didn't have the resolve to stop them.

The NSA might be following in the footsteps of the Stasi, but there isn't an oppressive government preventing one from travelling, from speaking one's mind, from assembling in private groups, from seeking to live and work where one can find opportunity, etc. So while one aspect of the apparatus might be there, the rest currently is not.
 
2014-07-10 11:09:00 AM  
As we all know, Germany would never, ever spy on us.
 
2014-07-10 11:09:47 AM  

mcreadyblue: Giltric: HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?

If they could compare him to Hitler they would, but I think it's illegal.

You miss the point of the comparison.

The Stasi failed. They did not notice their government was about to be overthrown. They were too busy tapping phones, reading mail, following dissidents, keeping track of who slept with who, etc.

At their high point, 1/10 East Germans were informants. Yet the Stasi failed their primary mission.

The NSA is closely following in their footsteps.


To be fair, in this instance, they were spying on Germany. As much as I don't approve of the NSA spying on US citizens, I fully endorse their efforts abroad. And it's good to see a US agency being good at their job, and hacking the German Chancellor's phone is pretty awesome.

Hey Germany, don't want us to hack your leader's phone? Then maybe you should look at securing it better. It isn't our job to do that for you.
 
2014-07-10 11:10:31 AM  

DubtodaIll: YixilTesiphon: inner ted: DubtodaIll: The Homer Tax: mcreadyblue:

If I think the NSA and most of the government agencies are going too far with their intellegence actions in the name of security, who should I vote for in these midterms and the following presidential election?

That's the thing, our intelligence gathering abilities are too big to fail at this point.

so "both sides are bad" correct?

That's the thing, it isn't even true in this case (it is in most). There is a group within both major parties that opposes this stuff. There are two sides, both with members that hold serious offices, they just aren't divided along Team Red vs Team Blue.

I don't see either side having the political bravery to de-fund the NSA or CIA or even get close to touching the Patriot Act.  If anything intelligence budgets will continue to swell.


What are you talking about? A bill to end funding for some of the most objectionable NSA stuff sponsored by Justin Amash was barely defeated in the House by establishment politicians. The balance really isn't that far off, you just have to trash people like Nancy Pelosi and my representative, Charlie Dent.
 
2014-07-10 11:11:54 AM  

hasty ambush: I have absolutely no problem with the US spying on other countries (even alleged allies) and their citizens. It is the getting caught doing it that I have a problem with. We use to be better at this stuff.


You have no idea how much I hate completely agreeing with you.

thamike: Can we get a little more Israeli with our spies please?  What's this "Hi, I'm a station chief! Oh you want me to leave?" sh*t?


Our CIA station chiefs are pretty much openly declared to the host govts. It's always been this way.

mcreadyblue: The NSA is closely following in their footsteps.


Yeah, no. You seem to have a misunderstanding of how the NSA dragnet activities work. They probably HAVE your emails, etc, and yes, this is bad/wrong, but they're not actively reading it.

hinten: The divide started with Bush and, unfortunately, Obama has squandered any goodwill and made the situation only worse.


*eyeroll*
 
2014-07-10 11:15:14 AM  

thamike: HotWingConspiracy: HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?

They're secret police that occasionally make people disappear and engage in mass domestic surveillance. Pretty apt comparison.

Sure, if you have brain damage.


Go ahead and tell me where I'm wrong.
 
2014-07-10 11:16:25 AM  
img.fark.net

Had to do it.

No, I don't think Obama is like Hitler.
 
2014-07-10 11:25:25 AM  
Abe Vigoda's Ghost:
No, I don't think Obama is like Hitler.

I don't either, but I don't think Obama is like this guy either....

img.fark.net
[2008 acceptance speech Obama]
 
2014-07-10 11:30:18 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?


Sadly, no. The NSA's data collection methods are arguably more extensive and comprehensive than what the Stasi accomplished at the height of their success.
 
2014-07-10 11:31:11 AM  

The Bestest: *eyeroll*


Why? Or is this one of those inexplicable eye-rolls that I sometimes get from my teenage daughter?
 
2014-07-10 11:31:24 AM  

TedDalton: Abe Vigoda's Ghost:
No, I don't think Obama is like Hitler.

I don't either, but I don't think Obama is like this guy either....



media.townhall.com
 
2014-07-10 11:33:23 AM  

HMS_Blinkin: mcreadyblue:

"Stasi 2.0"

Hyperbole much, Germans?


If anyone should be granted the Godwin, it's the Germans.
 
2014-07-10 11:33:50 AM  

MurphyMurphy: Honestly I see no good way out of our mess.


1. No more secret courts. All warrants must be public.
2. Spying without a warrant within the US is to be prosecuted as treason.

Done.
 
2014-07-10 11:35:22 AM  

TWX: East Germany fell because of opportunity rather than conspiracy. As soon as their government ineptly announced an ease on travel restrictions, immediately, without having a plan, the fairly repressed populace tested it and the border guards didn't have the resolve to stop them.


The other thing that happened is a horde stormed the main Stasi building and dared the workers inside to try to stop them. Smartly, they chose to live and stood aside.
 
2014-07-10 11:40:43 AM  

MurphyMurphy: We need a large increase in public knowledge and a simultaneous decrease in apathy.


Or fairies and unicorns, that'd work too.

/and be about as likely
 
2014-07-10 11:43:27 AM  

hinten: Why?


What actions, at the direction of the administration, do you believe to have squandered goodwill and "made things worse"?

This text is now purple: 1. No more secret courts. All warrants must be public.
2. Spying without a warrant within the US is to be prosecuted as treason.

Done.


Secret courts will never go away entirely.. not for some things, but yes, there can certainly be greater transparency in most areas. The treason thing is a bit much, but yes, there needs to be criminality and accountability involved.

In general I'm seeing a lot of over-reaction to the NSA thing. Yes, part of the problem is the indifference most Americans have towards it, but on the other side of the coin, knee-jerk, fear-based reactions can be even more harmful. Such reactions is how we got here in the first place.
 
2014-07-10 11:47:26 AM  
Like we need anymore hours of Merkel having phone sex.
 
2014-07-10 11:59:00 AM  

flynn80: Like we need anymore hours of Merkel having phone sex.


He'll get as much as he can:

www.bettybowers.com
 
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