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(Reason Magazine)   Poll: Millennials think government is inefficient, abusive and cronytastic, plan to vote for more inefficiency, abuse and cronyism this fall and in 2016. This is great news for Democrats and Republicans   (reason.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, Sen. Elizabeth Warren, social liberalism, online gambling, Sen. Rand Paul, Vice President Joe Biden  
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579 clicks; posted to Politics » on 10 Jul 2014 at 1:42 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



100 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2014-07-10 10:54:28 AM  
They haven't seen anything yet. Just wait until they finally get jobs in corporate America.
 
2014-07-10 11:07:07 AM  
I sure would love to see the survey, but I don't seem to be able to find it. Here's some interesting contradictory findings FTA:

64 percent of millennials say cutting government spending by 5 percent would help the economy

Neat. What else?

63 percent say spending more on job training would help the economy
58 percent say the government should spend more on assistance to the poor even it means higher taxes
57 percent favor spending more money on infrastructure
54 percent favor a larger government that provides more services, when taxes are not mentioned
53 percent want government to guarantee everyone a college education



Boy, that's interesting. What else ya got, Reason-Rupe?

59 percent say cutting taxes would help the economy

Ok.

66 percent say raising taxes on the wealthy would help the economy

Wat?

Oh, Reason, you crazy buggers. You tried to get the results you wanted and all you got was a mess. Better luck next time.
 
2014-07-10 11:40:44 AM  
I like how the Republicans are only trusted to promote entrepreneurialship.

/did I just make up a word?
 
2014-07-10 12:31:25 PM  

Rev.K: I sure would love to see the survey, but I don't seem to be able to find it.


The report and topline are linked near the bottom of TFA.
 
2014-07-10 12:42:44 PM  

abb3w: The report and topline are linked near the bottom of TFA.


Ah. There it is. I'm very curious as to how some of the questions were worded.
 
2014-07-10 01:43:21 PM  
I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.
 
2014-07-10 01:44:21 PM  
Yes Reason, because libertarianism would totally fix our system, make millenials more secure in their jobs, and mitigate economic inequality.

I mean, the Koch brothers are libertarians, so it must be a great philosophy for average Joes like us.
 
2014-07-10 01:45:09 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.



It would look like the late 1800s gilded age.  In other words, awesome if you're already ultra-wealthy, but shiatty for everyone else.
 
2014-07-10 01:47:09 PM  
What I got from that is that young people think government should do more and that we need to cut taxes on the poorer masses and raise taxes on the rich and businesses in order to cover everything.

Rational, reasonable and logical.  I'd agree with all of it.
 
2014-07-10 01:47:29 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.



Pretty much Somalia.
 
2014-07-10 01:48:15 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


cdn3.thomhartmann.com

Click to enlarge.
 
2014-07-10 01:50:21 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


img.4plebs.org

Something like this, I'd presume.
 
2014-07-10 01:51:05 PM  

Chummer45: DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


It would look like the late 1800s gilded age.  In other words, awesome if you're already ultra-wealthy, but shiatty for everyone else.


So, pretty much the same thing, then?

Ha ha, I kid, poor people are doing great now, with their refrigerators and cell phones.
 
2014-07-10 01:51:07 PM  

Chummer45: DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


It would look like the late 1800s gilded age.  In other words, awesome if you're already ultra-wealthy, but shiatty for everyone else.


And then those meddling grangers, unions and trust busters ruined it all.
 
2014-07-10 01:51:29 PM  

Chummer45: DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


It would look like the late 1800s gilded age.  In other words, awesome if you're already ultra-wealthy, but shiatty for everyone else.


The late 1800s weren't that bad because there was free land available to anyone thanks to government genocide.  If you run a libertarian paradise now, when all the property has already been claimed and terrible expensive, it would be much worse.
 
2014-07-10 01:53:03 PM  
oh I see reason.com's lying was exposed in the boobies. I guess we're done here
 
2014-07-10 01:53:24 PM  
The gap is much narrower on economic issues, with 49 percent of millennials identifying themselves as economic liberals and 36 percent labeling themselves as economic conservatives.

The problem with self-describing yourself in prescribed terms is that the terms mean different things to different people.
 
2014-07-10 01:56:46 PM  
We tried to vote for change that we could believe in.

Lesson learned.
 
2014-07-10 02:01:30 PM  

sendtodave: We tried to vote for change that we could believe in.

Lesson learned.


weeklyscoops.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-07-10 02:02:03 PM  

Rapmaster2000: The gap is much narrower on economic issues, with 49 percent of millennials identifying themselves as economic liberals and 36 percent labeling themselves as economic conservatives.

The problem with self-describing yourself in prescribed terms is that the terms mean different things to different people.


...that are still tethered to the local national scale.  Our "liberal" certainly isn't the standard for western society's "liberal".
 
2014-07-10 02:03:27 PM  
57 percent want a society where wealth is distributed according to achievement

I love how Republicans think they are for this and Democrats are against it.

Yes Republican who think wealth should be passed on from generation to generation without working for it and think going to college should most be based on if you can pay for it like to think they are achievement based.

It's a laugh.
 
2014-07-10 02:05:09 PM  

Corvus: 57 percent want a society where wealth is distributed according to achievement

I love how Republicans think they are for this and Democrats are against it.

Yes Republican who think wealth should be passed on from generation to generation without working for it and think going to college should most be based on if you can pay for it like to think they are achievement based.

It's a laugh.


In fairness, they don't say it should be your personal achievements. If your great-grandfather achieved it, then it's good enough!
 
2014-07-10 02:09:00 PM  

qorkfiend: Corvus: 57 percent want a society where wealth is distributed according to achievement

I love how Republicans think they are for this and Democrats are against it.

Yes Republican who think wealth should be passed on from generation to generation without working for it and think going to college should most be based on if you can pay for it like to think they are achievement based.

It's a laugh.

In fairness, they don't say it should be your personal achievements. If your great-grandfather achieved it, then it's good enough!


Yep, and if the way your great-grandfather or grandfather got rich was through slavery or collaborating with Nazis then oh well, the past is past, right? No use crying over long-spilt milk- the system is totally fair!
 
2014-07-10 02:09:04 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


24.media.tumblr.com
 
2014-07-10 02:10:06 PM  

sendtodave: We tried to vote for change that we could believe in.

Lesson learned.


We got some positive change. A lot more than if we had voted for the alternative candidates imo.
 
2014-07-10 02:11:20 PM  

DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.


Like rapture before they all went crazy from freebasing deep sea slug poop.
 
2014-07-10 02:14:43 PM  

sendtodave: We tried to vote for change that we could believe in.

Lesson learned.


Is that lesson that the GOP would throw a butthurt fit and try to stop everything Obama did. And even though they did the Obama got our economy back in shape, wound down two wars and took out Osama Bin Laden, gave us a universal healthcare system and bought us farking donuts!!!
 
2014-07-10 02:17:59 PM  

UrukHaiGuyz: qorkfiend: Corvus: 57 percent want a society where wealth is distributed according to achievement

I love how Republicans think they are for this and Democrats are against it.

Yes Republican who think wealth should be passed on from generation to generation without working for it and think going to college should most be based on if you can pay for it like to think they are achievement based.

It's a laugh.

In fairness, they don't say it should be your personal achievements. If your great-grandfather achieved it, then it's good enough!

Yep, and if the way your great-grandfather or grandfather got rich was through slavery or collaborating with Nazis then oh well, the past is past, right? No use crying over long-spilt milk- the system is totally fair!


Grandpappy Bush agrees.
bioguide.congress.gov
 
2014-07-10 02:18:42 PM  

Corvus: sendtodave: We tried to vote for change that we could believe in.

Lesson learned.

Is that lesson that the GOP would throw a butthurt fit and try to stop everything Obama did. And even though they did the Obama got our economy back in shape, wound down two wars and took out Osama Bin Laden, gave us a universal healthcare system and bought us farking donuts!!!


I forgot about the donuts.

Lesson learned.
 
2014-07-10 02:19:05 PM  
Government sucks but give me free stuff?  Sounds about right.
 
2014-07-10 02:19:34 PM  
Is it just me, or do some of those things stand at odds with each other. 

One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

Example
64 percent of millennials say cutting government spending by 5 percent would help the economy
57 percent prefer a smaller government providing fewer services with low taxes, while 41 percent prefer a larger government providing more services with high taxes
55 percent say reducing regulations would help the economy

Compared with

74 percent of millennials say government has a responsibility to guarantee every citizen has a place to sleep and enough to eat
71 percent favor raising the federal minimum wage to $10.10 an hour
69 percent say it is government's responsibility to provide everyone with health care insurance and 51 percent have a favorable view of the Affordable Care Act
68 percent say government should ensure everyone makes a living wage
66 percent say raising taxes on the wealthy would help the economy
63 percent say spending more on job training would help the economy
58 percent say the government should spend more on assistance to the poor even it means higher taxes
57 percent favor spending more money on infrastructure
54 percent favor a larger government that provides more services, when taxes are not mentioned
53 percent want government to guarantee everyone a college education
 
2014-07-10 02:20:59 PM  

meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.


That's exactly the point I was driving at.


The study smells of trying to lure the respondents down a path, but having them provide the opposite answers of what you were looking for.
 
2014-07-10 02:26:15 PM  
I'm going to vote for the candidate who promises to get rid of waste and pork
 
2014-07-10 02:28:53 PM  

paygun: Government sucks but give me free stuff?  Sounds about right.


Well.  Only government can demand equality between people, be it social, financial, whatever.

So, really, the government sucks because it doesn't give me free stuff, but it gives rich farks free stuff.
 
2014-07-10 02:29:21 PM  

Notabunny: I'm going to vote for the candidate who promises to get rid of waste and pork


Better known as "infrastructure".

Not sure if you're trolling.
 
2014-07-10 02:31:29 PM  
73 percent of millennials favor allowing private accounts for Social Security

If you can't even be bothered to save for your own retirement why do you think you are going to do any better managing your own Social Security?
 
2014-07-10 02:31:33 PM  
Butthurt libertarian tears are the most refreshing.
 
2014-07-10 02:33:54 PM  

meat0918: Is it just me, or do some of those things stand at odds with each other. 

One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

Example
64 percent of millennials say cutting government spending by 5 percent would help the economy
57 percent prefer a smaller government providing fewer services with low taxes, while 41 percent prefer a larger government providing more services with high taxes
55 percent say reducing regulations would help the economy

Compared with

74 percent of millennials say government has a responsibility to guarantee every citizen has a place to sleep and enough to eat
71 percent favor raising the federal minimum wage to $10.10 an hour
69 percent say it is government's responsibility to provide everyone with health care insurance and 51 percent have a favorable view of the Affordable Care Act
68 percent say government should ensure everyone makes a living wage
66 percent say raising taxes on the wealthy would help the economy
63 percent say spending more on job training would help the economy
58 percent say the government should spend more on assistance to the poor even it means higher taxes
57 percent favor spending more money on infrastructure
54 percent favor a larger government that provides more services, when taxes are not mentioned
53 percent want government to guarantee everyone a college education


Probably because those people feel that government spending on bullshiat like wars and defense contracts needs to be cut while government spending on things like taking care of the people needs to be increased.

Nuance and context are important and 'government spending' covers a farkton of often contradictory stuff.
 
2014-07-10 02:34:08 PM  

Pincy: 73 percent of millennials favor allowing private accounts for Social Security

If you can't even be bothered to save for your own retirement why do you think you are going to do any better managing your own Social Security?


They have these things called "investors."  They handle investment accounts.

themoreyouknow.jpg

We could mandate that the people have to use these private investors, like we did with healthcare.

Amerisocialism.
 
2014-07-10 02:35:25 PM  

Rev.K: meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

That's exactly the point I was driving at.


The study smells of trying to lure the respondents down a path, but having them provide the opposite answers of what you were looking for.


Yeah, I commented before reading the thread.

There's lies, damn lies, statistics, and Reason's pants on head retarded attempt at statistics.
 
2014-07-10 02:35:26 PM  

meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.


That looks like the Americans I know.  Spend more money, but don't tax me any more.  Make me safe, but don't limit my freedom.
 
2014-07-10 02:36:41 PM  

meat0918: 64 percent of millennials say cutting government spending by 5 percent would help the economy
57 percent prefer a smaller government providing fewer services with low taxes, while 41 percent prefer a larger government providing more services with high taxes
55 percent say reducing regulations would help the economy


What these people are is the Political commenters you see on facebook(or fark sometimes).

They don't have a cohesive theory of economics(and many that do don't have good ones).

They just incorporate things they see people claiming as good for the economy into their idea of what's good for the economy.  The problem reason has, is they want people take the awful libertarian perspective on what's good for an economy, and it's just not going to happen.
 
2014-07-10 02:36:43 PM  

Chummer45: Yes Reason, because libertarianism would totally fix our system, make millenials more secure in their jobs, and mitigate economic inequality.

I mean, the Koch brothers are libertarians, so it must be a great philosophy for average Joes like us.


But dude... *pot*! You know, pot!
 
2014-07-10 02:42:04 PM  

Riothamus: Notabunny: I'm going to vote for the candidate who promises to get rid of waste and pork

Better known as "infrastructure".

Not sure if you're trolling.


I had my Jokey Smurf hat on
 
2014-07-10 02:46:34 PM  

paygun: meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

That looks like the Americans I know.  Spend more money, but don't tax me any more.  Make me safe, but don't limit my freedom.


You're right.  We should pay more taxes, and accept limitations on our freedoms in order to ensure equality.
 
2014-07-10 02:48:26 PM  

paygun: meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

That looks like the Americans I know.  Spend more money, but don't tax me any more.  Make me safe, but don't limit my freedom.


Pretty farking easy - stop paying people to prepare to blow up countries we're not even planning on fighting
 
2014-07-10 02:51:12 PM  

meat0918: Is it just me, or do some of those things stand at odds with each other. 

One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

Example
64 percent of millennials say cutting government spending by 5 percent would help the economy
57 percent prefer a smaller government providing fewer services with low taxes, while 41 percent prefer a larger government providing more services with high taxes
55 percent say reducing regulations would help the economy

Compared with

74 percent of millennials say government has a responsibility to guarantee every citizen has a place to sleep and enough to eat
71 percent favor raising the federal minimum wage to $10.10 an hour
69 percent say it is government's responsibility to provide everyone with health care insurance and 51 percent have a favorable view of the Affordable Care Act
68 percent say government should ensure everyone makes a living wage
66 percent say raising taxes on the wealthy would help the economy
63 percent say spending more on job training would help the economy
58 percent say the government should spend more on assistance to the poor even it means higher taxes
57 percent favor spending more money on infrastructure
54 percent favor a larger government that provides more services, when taxes are not mentioned
53 percent want government to guarantee everyone a college education


img1.fark.net
 
2014-07-10 02:54:09 PM  

paygun: meat0918: One wonders how the questions were asked, because that shiat seems all over the map.

That looks like the Americans I know.  Spend more money, but don't tax me any more.  Make me safe, but don't limit my freedom.


You 'are' aware that we can cut out huge chunks of the bloated Defense budget and cover 'everything' this country needs in the way of infrastructure repair and other necessities without raising taxes on a single person, right?  And it's perfectly possible to be safe without limiting freedom.

Pretending like these are 'either/or' situations is disingenuous at best and outright deceitful at worst.
 
2014-07-10 02:57:07 PM  

nijika: DarkLancelot: I've been doing a thought experiment of how a libertarian society would actually end up working, and I always come up with Cyberpunk without the cool tech.  Does anyone know of any other well put-together visions of what such a society would look like?  This is apropos to the thread because of the source I believe.

[24.media.tumblr.com image 500x282]


I'm sorry, I don't recognize the reference.
 
2014-07-10 03:01:20 PM  
This would be like a person saying,

Our family needs to stop spending, we are not made out of money.
So let's go get a new car and let mom go shopping...
We don't have enough.
 
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