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(New York Daily News)   North Carolina eleven year-old gets into an argument with his grandfather at their mobile home, then gets a loaded shotgun and puts an end to the discussion   (nydailynews.com) divider line 125
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8244 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Jul 2014 at 11:05 PM (19 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-09 12:03:54 AM  

strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?


Prolly unloads the kid several times a night.
 
2014-07-09 12:04:30 AM  

cretinbob:


Nothing homoerotic about that group at all.

/nttawwt... just that they'd shoot anyone for suggesting it
 
2014-07-09 12:06:13 AM  

ultraholland: The family that slays together, stays together.

/at least the surviving members


Well they'd probably all be buried together, so survival isn't really an issue.
 
2014-07-09 12:08:12 AM  

itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....


Tap load 4 rounds the minute
 
2014-07-09 12:09:37 AM  

rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.


North Carolina? 11? Probably.
 
2014-07-09 12:09:45 AM  
You're never too young to stand your ground
 
2014-07-09 12:09:47 AM  

doofusgumby: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

The wad gets wrapped around the ball or preceeds it depending on the type. No wonder you couldn't hit the broadside of gramps on a sober day. YER BALL DONE FALL'D OUT.


Plus ya fergot t'take th' ramrod outta th' barrel afore ya pulled th' danged trigger, so now yer rod's 150 feet away stickin' outta a very surprised Johnny Reb's chest. You gonna go ask 'im fer it back now?
 
2014-07-09 12:10:33 AM  

rkiller1: brimed03: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

Keep phrasing it that way and he might take this story as an illustrative model.

You assume he can read.


Ah, hadn't thought of that.

Carry on.
 
2014-07-09 12:11:22 AM  
I thought they said Oklahoma and Texas were most like living in a country song.
 
2014-07-09 12:13:28 AM  

strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?


Oh no, he keeps the liquor cabinet locked.

Guns are out, but the hard stuff's secure.

/marker line on the bottle showing the current level too.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:05 AM  

brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.

An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


Oh you done it now....  cue all the Rednecks... "I was shootin' when I was 6.... nothin' wrong with a kid having access to a gun...." etc....

Saw all these comments with the article about the little girl taking the gun to the pool story.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:14 AM  

Somacandra: [upload.wikimedia.org image 300x300]

R.I.P. LIEGE AND LIEF

/at least it wasn't a "Matty Groves" situation...


Was just listening to Tam Lin the other day.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:16 AM  
I bet the kid was all hopped up on Mt. Dew.......

Seems like the kid made Chip his biatch...
 
2014-07-09 12:15:49 AM  

doofusgumby: strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?

Prolly unloads the kid several times a night.


Okay. sick enough to make me laugh.
 
2014-07-09 12:19:02 AM  
neotera.gr
 
2014-07-09 12:20:00 AM  

Brother Head: brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.

An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.

Oh you done it now....  cue all the Rednecks... "I was shootin' when I was 6.... nothin' wrong with a kid having access to a gun...." etc....

Saw all these comments with the article about the little girl taking the gun to the pool story.


And you know, I get that too. I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

But the gun stays locked in the gun safe when the kid's not out hunting or practicing... which I'd also argue should only be happening with a responsible adult.
 
2014-07-09 12:22:03 AM  

brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.  An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


Yes, thanks for getting the joke!
 
2014-07-09 12:23:53 AM  
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good little boy with a gun.
 
2014-07-09 12:41:58 AM  
Surprisingly this guy wasn't involved.

img.fark.net
 
2014-07-09 12:43:20 AM  
Just think of the tragedy that could have been averted had this happened at Waco.
 
2014-07-09 12:55:29 AM  

brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible


He was under the supervision of his father.
 
2014-07-09 01:04:03 AM  

brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.


Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.
 
2014-07-09 01:07:55 AM  

rkiller1: brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.  An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.

Yes, thanks for getting the joke!


That was a joke?

What a terrible joke. I hope your 11-year-old shoots you with a shotgun.

/now *that* was a terrible joke
 
2014-07-09 01:12:12 AM  

Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.


In the scheme of things, it was probably a little more irresponsible for his grandfather to be shooting at his father.
 
2014-07-09 01:18:35 AM  

Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.


Who himself was under the supervision of *his* father. And we all see how *that* worked out.

Kidding. But seriously, you're not really arguing that, are you? Because mere presence != supervision. As I recall, the most recent major school shooting was done by a kid who took the family guns while mom and dad were both home.

Unless he was teaching the kid how to clean the weapons, the guns needed to be locked up. That's teaching gun safety, as well as securing the weapons in the presence of a minor.

Gun rights come with gun responsibilities. The NRA *used* to teach that. I know because *I* was taught by a guy certified by the old NRA.
 
2014-07-09 01:25:10 AM  

OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.


That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.
 
2014-07-09 01:34:05 AM  

lewismarktwo: Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


I thought the thing that goes up is illegal now. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME PEOPLE ARE WALKING AROUND CARRYING THE THING THAT GOES UP?!?!?!?!!?
 
2014-07-09 01:34:43 AM  

OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.


This.

My dad had a WWII rifle and pistol in the house. They were securely locked up *even though* there was no ammo in the house. And boy howdy were you in for a switchin' if you so much as *tried* to pick the lock to look at them. (I speak from experience.) They're sold off now and I probably only ever saw a half-dozen times in my life.

My first day on a range I never fired a weapon at all. The whole first day was dedicated to learning weapon safety, range safety, and caring for your weapon. If my instructor didn't trust you by day's end, you got your money back along with a suggestion that you come back when you were a little older.

I earned my NRA "Sharpshooter" badge by age 14, but I wasn't half as proud as when my instructor suggested that I'd make a good NRA instructor.

When I joined my high school rifle team, I learned the difference between an adult supervising and an adult merely being present. I nearly quit over the unsafe practices I saw. Fortunately the coach tightened things up.

Cops, btw, are some of the most unsafe people you'll ever see on a firing range. We used to practice right after them and they'd leave all sorts of bullet-pocked shiat downrange, much of it with high ricochet potential.
 
2014-07-09 01:38:18 AM  

Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.


Just because you can doesn't mean you should.
 
2014-07-09 01:45:10 AM  

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.

In the scheme of things, it was probably a little more irresponsible for his grandfather to be shooting at his father.


Agreed. But now we're talking in generalities, not merely to this specific case.

In this *specific* case, possibly it was good that the kid had the shotgun at hand. Possibly. He still has to figure out how to live with the fact of killing his own grandfather. But then, he also has to live with watching gramps shoot his pop.

But anyway, even in this *specific* case, maybe if they were more strict about securing guns in the house, grandpa wouldn't have been able to express his hot-tempered displeasure in terms of caliber. That's another good thing about secured weapons with ammo in another, secured location: the time it takes to get them out gives you a few minutes to cool down. It also gives the other person a good head start on clearing out in case you don't.
 
2014-07-09 01:47:44 AM  

OregonVet: lewismarktwo: Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

I thought the thing that goes up is illegal now. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME PEOPLE ARE WALKING AROUND CARRYING THE THING THAT GOES UP?!?!?!?!!?


Only if you show it in public.
 
2014-07-09 01:48:39 AM  

brimed03: This.


Cheers.
 
2014-07-09 01:58:23 AM  

lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


Dad was military police. I never touched a firearm until the Army per his wishes. Haven't touched one since. 

Never understood the joy. It is a tool. That is all. I don't go around swinging a farking hammer at nothing or hitting concrete for practice. Firearms are a tool to accomplish a purpose. Anything more is masturbatory.
 
2014-07-09 02:14:58 AM  

rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.


If whoever owned the gun (either dad or granddad) would have been a responsible gun owner, the kid wouldn't have gotten his hands on the shotgun.
 
2014-07-09 02:28:13 AM  

thehobbes: lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

Dad was military police. I never touched a firearm until the Army per his wishes. Haven't touched one since. 

Never understood the joy. It is a tool. That is all. I don't go around swinging a farking hammer at nothing or hitting concrete for practice. Firearms are a tool to accomplish a purpose. Anything more is masturbatory.


Some people are amazing with a hammer. Sometimes they're good enough to pass into folklore. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_(folklore)
Also?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelangelo

But I understand you don't mean this sort of thing. John Henry turned his accuracy into an art form, but it was still work. Michelangelo wasn't merely practicing accuracy, he was creating art.

Still, there are some similarities. As with most activities, target shooting is about the joy of being able to perform a complicated set of actions to a high level of skill. Precision shooting is a difficult task. Mastering difficult tasks is something humans enjoy. It's that simple.

Now, humans differ in what forms, what particular activities, they may enjoy mastering. But the basic drive should be fairly relatable.
 
2014-07-09 02:31:00 AM  
I am pretty sure if my Grandpa would have shot my dad and I had the means I would have blasted gramps. This coming from somebody who did not even particularly care for dad.
 
2014-07-09 02:42:09 AM  
Other articles say the kid was arrested.
Maybe grampa was just standing his ground.
 
2014-07-09 03:05:34 AM  

Prof. Frink: farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?

Obama.


And we're done here.
 
2014-07-09 03:31:16 AM  
All I can think of is Ricky Bobby's kids cussing out their grandfather at dinner.
 
2014-07-09 03:57:39 AM  

Loren: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know). His grandfather shot his dad. Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

Yup, this looks like a justified shoot to me.


But....GUNS!!!
 
2014-07-09 05:08:08 AM  

brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


you sound like some kind of leftist hippie.
 
2014-07-09 05:54:54 AM  

farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?


the NRA, obviously
 
2014-07-09 07:11:06 AM  

rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.


They're not so useful. You should have saved up and gotten a 16 year old instead. They can pretty much do all the shiat around your house you don't want to do anymore.
 
2014-07-09 07:16:50 AM  

itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....


My compliments!  That's actually the first time I've ever heard someone discuss the difference between guns of that time vs the guns of today.

BTW - I am a gun enthusiast, but in Canada we have a whole different set of rules, and completely different view of what they are, how to use them, and how to store them.  Very few Canadians have guns lying around in ready-to-use condition (that is a felony).  Even my gun club forbids wearing camo and human silouette targets are not allowed.
 
2014-07-09 07:17:49 AM  
So what did he score on the FCAT?
 
2014-07-09 07:22:36 AM  
Guns don't kill people.

*I* kill people.

- 11 year old, NC
 
2014-07-09 07:32:03 AM  
Must have gotten tired of living with that old person smell
 
2014-07-09 07:49:34 AM  

Loren: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know). His grandfather shot his dad. Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

Yup, this looks like a justified shoot to me.


I was actually thinking it sounded like a Justified plot to me.
 
2014-07-09 07:52:42 AM  
It's nice to see three generations sharing a common hobby.
 
2014-07-09 08:14:53 AM  
Guns are never the answer. Unless the question is "What's snug spelled backwards?"
 
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