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(New York Daily News)   North Carolina eleven year-old gets into an argument with his grandfather at their mobile home, then gets a loaded shotgun and puts an end to the discussion   (nydailynews.com ) divider line
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8302 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Jul 2014 at 11:05 PM (1 year ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-08 09:30:58 PM  
The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.
 
2014-07-08 09:34:55 PM  

RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.


I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that
 
2014-07-08 09:49:53 PM  
Well, an unloaded shotgun is just a club.
 
2014-07-08 09:55:30 PM  
upload.wikimedia.org

R.I.P. LIEGE AND LIEF

/at least it wasn't a "Matty Groves" situation...
 
2014-07-08 10:09:05 PM  
Subby is one of them ILLiterut's, that's whut.
 
2014-07-08 10:35:51 PM  
Firearms, mobile home, a family argument, I'm guessing there was booze or meth involved, I think I smell a good Aristocrats joke here.

Or it could be the clogged shiatter in the mobile home.
 
2014-07-08 11:07:15 PM  
I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.
 
2014-07-08 11:08:03 PM  
2nd amendment solutions!
 
2014-07-08 11:08:13 PM  
It's not even Thanksgiving yet.
 
2014-07-08 11:08:16 PM  
The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?
 
2014-07-08 11:09:57 PM  
"Lloyd Woodlief, 84, had wounded his 49-year-old son Lloyd Peyton Woodlief with a .22-caliber gun before the unidentified boy fired a 12-gauge shotgun at his grandfather"

An armed society is a polite society.
 
2014-07-08 11:10:29 PM  
rememnber, guns are good!
 
2014-07-08 11:10:47 PM  
Way to tilt the story with a leading headline, Daily News... Grandfather shot the kid's dad first, prompting the defensive shot by the kid.
 
2014-07-08 11:10:51 PM  
iamjackofalltrades.com
 
2014-07-08 11:10:54 PM  
Responsible gun owners strike again!
 
2014-07-08 11:11:56 PM  

The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!


So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.
 
2014-07-08 11:12:17 PM  

The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!


Seems like a solved problem.
 
2014-07-08 11:12:58 PM  

LoneVVolf: Way to tilt the story with a leading headline, Daily News... Grandfather shot the kid's dad first, prompting the defensive shot by the kid.


To be fair, if my grandpa shot my dad, I'd get into an argument with him.
 
2014-07-08 11:13:52 PM  
I'm betting French fries, tater tots or some other fried potato product was involved.
 
2014-07-08 11:14:00 PM  

RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.


Indeed. Don't mess with the dynamics of an 'Murican family.
 
2014-07-08 11:16:09 PM  
FTFA: Lloyd Peyton Woodlief is being treated at Duke Medical Center in Durham.

Well, that sucks.
 
2014-07-08 11:16:28 PM  

jaytkay: An armed society is a polite society.


I've never met a rude corpse.
 
2014-07-08 11:18:28 PM  
So, who is at fault here?
 
2014-07-08 11:20:23 PM  

John Buck 41: Well, an unloaded shotgun is just a club.


That's a feature.
 
2014-07-08 11:21:42 PM  

RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know). His grandfather shot his dad. Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.


Yup, this looks like a justified shoot to me.
 
2014-07-08 11:23:31 PM  
Bonus: They were ALL drunk!

Okay, yeah, yeah, that's just implied, like the mobile home.
 
2014-07-08 11:26:36 PM  
It's a good thing all those guns were lying around so responsible owners could stand their ground and stop the bad man with the gun.
 
2014-07-08 11:28:52 PM  

Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.


Which makes no sense whatsoever. But hey. Whatever. Rock on pale refuse.
 
2014-07-08 11:32:18 PM  
Lloyd Woodlief, 84, had wounded his 49-year-old son Lloyd Peyton Woodlief with a .22-caliber gun before the unidentified boy fired a 12-gauge shotgun at his grandfather, the Vance County Sheriff's Office said.

So nothing of value was lost.

S:"Here is a wide."
C:"Ooooo, hmmm, not really wha..."
S:"And here's a double-wide."
C:"Holy shiat, son!  Now that's exac..."
S:"And here's a 5th dimensional portal."
C:"..., ..."
 
2014-07-08 11:32:56 PM  

whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?


Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....
 
2014-07-08 11:33:35 PM  

LoneVVolf: Way to tilt the story with a leading headline, Daily News... Grandfather shot the kid's dad first, prompting the defensive shot by the kid.


Yeah. It's not that a kid shot his grandpa. It's that the 84 year old shot his son, THEN the 11 year old shot his grandpa!
See, it's totally reasonable now.
 
2014-07-08 11:35:43 PM  
oregoncommentator.com
 
2014-07-08 11:37:37 PM  

farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?


Obama.
 
2014-07-08 11:40:55 PM  
Idiot just failed the "I wanna be a cop test".  You club them real good first (make sure the bruises are evenly applied for aesthetic reasons) and then you shoot them!
 
2014-07-08 11:44:58 PM  

whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?


The second amendment is misinterpreted.  It's not the right to bear arms, it's the right to arm bears.  A little transcription error and Thomas Jefferson's dream of an ursine army disappeared forever.

s30.postimg.org
 
2014-07-08 11:44:59 PM  

Prof. Frink: farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?

Obama.


That's ALWAYS the answer.
 
2014-07-08 11:45:08 PM  

LoneVVolf: Way to tilt the story with a leading headline, Daily News... Grandfather shot the kid's dad first, prompting the defensive shot by the kid.


Yes, that makes the whole thing much better. It's practically a non-story now.

/headline extry-sensationalizes it, I'll agree, but I don't think it "tilts" anything
 
2014-07-08 11:46:05 PM  

rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.


Keep phrasing it that way and he might take this story as an illustrative model.
 
2014-07-08 11:48:19 PM  
The family that slays together, stays together.

/at least the surviving members
 
2014-07-08 11:53:13 PM  

itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....


The wad gets wrapped around the ball or preceeds it depending on the type. No wonder you couldn't hit the broadside of gramps on a sober day. YER BALL DONE FALL'D OUT.
 
2014-07-08 11:54:39 PM  

brimed03: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

Keep phrasing it that way and he might take this story as an illustrative model.


You assume he can read.
 
2014-07-08 11:56:10 PM  

rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.


Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.

An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.
 
2014-07-08 11:56:59 PM  

LoneVVolf: Way to tilt the story with a leading headline, Daily News... Grandfather shot the kid's dad first, prompting the defensive shot by the kid.


If you are arguing that it implicates the child unfairly, fair enough, but if you are making a pro-gun argument, well, the headline leaves out one whole family shooting family part of the story.  I think it's still fair to say that there would have probably been fewer fatalities in the trailer park today if that particular trailer hadn't had any guns in it.
 
2014-07-09 12:00:29 AM  

rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.


So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?
 
2014-07-09 12:01:46 AM  

macross87: At least he's not his own grandpa


That would be terrible.  I mean, that would make this a suicide, and surely someone would go to hell for that.  No, this was much better.  The grandfather didn't kill anyone (the Bible says 'thou shalt not kill, but it's fine to maim') and the boy will have time to repent, (although I'm pretty sure the Constitution overrides the Bible here and you don't go to hell if you kill someone with a gun.)

So yes, it's good that he is not his own grandpa.
 
2014-07-09 12:01:50 AM  
Is the boy still around? I've heard that if you kill your own grandfather, you cease to exist.
 
2014-07-09 12:02:10 AM  

farkbot42: Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.

Which makes no sense whatsoever. But hey. Whatever. Rock on pale refuse.


Well, I dunno. It's all about where you choose to spend your money. They could build a four-bedroom split-level with two-car garage, and not have money for the pool and extra vehicle. Some people might consider what they do a good trade-off.

Remember the "upper-middle-class" guy in the commercial: "How do I do it? I'm in debt up to my eyeballs!" Now *that* makes no sense whatsoever.
 
2014-07-09 12:03:54 AM  

strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?


Prolly unloads the kid several times a night.
 
2014-07-09 12:04:30 AM  
cretinbob:

Nothing homoerotic about that group at all.

/nttawwt... just that they'd shoot anyone for suggesting it
 
2014-07-09 12:06:13 AM  

ultraholland: The family that slays together, stays together.

/at least the surviving members


Well they'd probably all be buried together, so survival isn't really an issue.
 
2014-07-09 12:08:12 AM  

itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....


Tap load 4 rounds the minute
 
2014-07-09 12:09:37 AM  

rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.


North Carolina? 11? Probably.
 
2014-07-09 12:09:45 AM  
You're never too young to stand your ground
 
2014-07-09 12:09:47 AM  

doofusgumby: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

The wad gets wrapped around the ball or preceeds it depending on the type. No wonder you couldn't hit the broadside of gramps on a sober day. YER BALL DONE FALL'D OUT.


Plus ya fergot t'take th' ramrod outta th' barrel afore ya pulled th' danged trigger, so now yer rod's 150 feet away stickin' outta a very surprised Johnny Reb's chest. You gonna go ask 'im fer it back now?
 
2014-07-09 12:10:33 AM  

rkiller1: brimed03: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

Keep phrasing it that way and he might take this story as an illustrative model.

You assume he can read.


Ah, hadn't thought of that.

Carry on.
 
2014-07-09 12:11:22 AM  
I thought they said Oklahoma and Texas were most like living in a country song.
 
2014-07-09 12:13:28 AM  

strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?


Oh no, he keeps the liquor cabinet locked.

Guns are out, but the hard stuff's secure.

/marker line on the bottle showing the current level too.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:05 AM  

brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.

An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


Oh you done it now....  cue all the Rednecks... "I was shootin' when I was 6.... nothin' wrong with a kid having access to a gun...." etc....

Saw all these comments with the article about the little girl taking the gun to the pool story.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:14 AM  

Somacandra: [upload.wikimedia.org image 300x300]

R.I.P. LIEGE AND LIEF

/at least it wasn't a "Matty Groves" situation...


Was just listening to Tam Lin the other day.
 
2014-07-09 12:14:16 AM  
I bet the kid was all hopped up on Mt. Dew.......

Seems like the kid made Chip his biatch...
 
2014-07-09 12:15:49 AM  

doofusgumby: strangeluck: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.

So, do you keep your eleven-year-old boy loaded, or unloaded?

Prolly unloads the kid several times a night.


Okay. sick enough to make me laugh.
 
2014-07-09 12:19:02 AM  
neotera.gr
 
2014-07-09 12:20:00 AM  

Brother Head: brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.

An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.

Oh you done it now....  cue all the Rednecks... "I was shootin' when I was 6.... nothin' wrong with a kid having access to a gun...." etc....

Saw all these comments with the article about the little girl taking the gun to the pool story.


And you know, I get that too. I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

But the gun stays locked in the gun safe when the kid's not out hunting or practicing... which I'd also argue should only be happening with a responsible adult.
 
2014-07-09 12:22:03 AM  

brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.  An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


Yes, thanks for getting the joke!
 
2014-07-09 12:23:53 AM  
The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good little boy with a gun.
 
2014-07-09 12:41:58 AM  
Surprisingly this guy wasn't involved.

img.fark.net
 
2014-07-09 12:43:20 AM  
Just think of the tragedy that could have been averted had this happened at Waco.
 
2014-07-09 12:55:29 AM  

brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible


He was under the supervision of his father.
 
2014-07-09 01:04:03 AM  

brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.


Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.
 
2014-07-09 01:07:55 AM  

rkiller1: brimed03: rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.

Probably not, but he had access to it. Generally speaking, I'd call that "owner irresponsibility."

Seriously? I get advocating for gun rights, I do. But that doesn't mean everything involving guns should be free of criticism.

The fact is, you didn't choose to contest his criticism of an 11-year-old having access to a gun. You simply argued a semantic ambiguity in ownership attribution. To me, that's telling. Whatever tack you take next, that's where you started.  An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.

Yes, thanks for getting the joke!


That was a joke?

What a terrible joke. I hope your 11-year-old shoots you with a shotgun.

/now *that* was a terrible joke
 
2014-07-09 01:12:12 AM  

Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.


In the scheme of things, it was probably a little more irresponsible for his grandfather to be shooting at his father.
 
2014-07-09 01:18:35 AM  

Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.


Who himself was under the supervision of *his* father. And we all see how *that* worked out.

Kidding. But seriously, you're not really arguing that, are you? Because mere presence != supervision. As I recall, the most recent major school shooting was done by a kid who took the family guns while mom and dad were both home.

Unless he was teaching the kid how to clean the weapons, the guns needed to be locked up. That's teaching gun safety, as well as securing the weapons in the presence of a minor.

Gun rights come with gun responsibilities. The NRA *used* to teach that. I know because *I* was taught by a guy certified by the old NRA.
 
2014-07-09 01:25:10 AM  

OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.


That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.
 
2014-07-09 01:34:05 AM  

lewismarktwo: Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


I thought the thing that goes up is illegal now. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME PEOPLE ARE WALKING AROUND CARRYING THE THING THAT GOES UP?!?!?!?!!?
 
2014-07-09 01:34:43 AM  

OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.


This.

My dad had a WWII rifle and pistol in the house. They were securely locked up *even though* there was no ammo in the house. And boy howdy were you in for a switchin' if you so much as *tried* to pick the lock to look at them. (I speak from experience.) They're sold off now and I probably only ever saw a half-dozen times in my life.

My first day on a range I never fired a weapon at all. The whole first day was dedicated to learning weapon safety, range safety, and caring for your weapon. If my instructor didn't trust you by day's end, you got your money back along with a suggestion that you come back when you were a little older.

I earned my NRA "Sharpshooter" badge by age 14, but I wasn't half as proud as when my instructor suggested that I'd make a good NRA instructor.

When I joined my high school rifle team, I learned the difference between an adult supervising and an adult merely being present. I nearly quit over the unsafe practices I saw. Fortunately the coach tightened things up.

Cops, btw, are some of the most unsafe people you'll ever see on a firing range. We used to practice right after them and they'd leave all sorts of bullet-pocked shiat downrange, much of it with high ricochet potential.
 
2014-07-09 01:38:18 AM  

Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.


Just because you can doesn't mean you should.
 
2014-07-09 01:45:10 AM  

The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: Rivetman1.0: brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible

He was under the supervision of his father.

In the scheme of things, it was probably a little more irresponsible for his grandfather to be shooting at his father.


Agreed. But now we're talking in generalities, not merely to this specific case.

In this *specific* case, possibly it was good that the kid had the shotgun at hand. Possibly. He still has to figure out how to live with the fact of killing his own grandfather. But then, he also has to live with watching gramps shoot his pop.

But anyway, even in this *specific* case, maybe if they were more strict about securing guns in the house, grandpa wouldn't have been able to express his hot-tempered displeasure in terms of caliber. That's another good thing about secured weapons with ammo in another, secured location: the time it takes to get them out gives you a few minutes to cool down. It also gives the other person a good head start on clearing out in case you don't.
 
2014-07-09 01:47:44 AM  

OregonVet: lewismarktwo: Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

I thought the thing that goes up is illegal now. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME PEOPLE ARE WALKING AROUND CARRYING THE THING THAT GOES UP?!?!?!?!!?


Only if you show it in public.
 
2014-07-09 01:48:39 AM  

brimed03: This.


Cheers.
 
2014-07-09 01:58:23 AM  

lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.


Dad was military police. I never touched a firearm until the Army per his wishes. Haven't touched one since. 

Never understood the joy. It is a tool. That is all. I don't go around swinging a farking hammer at nothing or hitting concrete for practice. Firearms are a tool to accomplish a purpose. Anything more is masturbatory.
 
2014-07-09 02:14:58 AM  

rkiller1: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

So the boy owned the shotgun?  I didn't read that in TFA.


If whoever owned the gun (either dad or granddad) would have been a responsible gun owner, the kid wouldn't have gotten his hands on the shotgun.
 
2014-07-09 02:28:13 AM  

thehobbes: lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

lewismarktwo: OregonVet: brimed03: I'm actually fine with giving a kid a .22 and teaching him how to shoot, especially when they're young enough to be highly impressionable about gun safety.

Ummmm. yah. Put that stuff in your malleable kids' mind early often, and safely. Too many people are afraid of educating their children these days. My opinion is that early education prevents issues later. You don't want to have a gun in your home, fine. Take your kid to a range and let an instructor give a proper class and take the curiosity out of the equation. Go back to the 'gunsrbad brainwashing' when you get back home, if that's your thing. But some people could look at how much they spend on crap in lieu of educating their children because if it isn't offered in public schools it isn't worth knowing.

That won't happen much.  People who actually know something about firearms have have had the occasion to shoot them usually really enjoy the activity (especially if they get to shoot reactive targets such as unopened soda cans).  Then they wonder what all the fuss is about when no one gets shot 100 times a second with a 30 caliber magazine clip thing that goes up.

Dad was military police. I never touched a firearm until the Army per his wishes. Haven't touched one since. 

Never understood the joy. It is a tool. That is all. I don't go around swinging a farking hammer at nothing or hitting concrete for practice. Firearms are a tool to accomplish a purpose. Anything more is masturbatory.


Some people are amazing with a hammer. Sometimes they're good enough to pass into folklore. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Henry_(folklore)
Also?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelangelo

But I understand you don't mean this sort of thing. John Henry turned his accuracy into an art form, but it was still work. Michelangelo wasn't merely practicing accuracy, he was creating art.

Still, there are some similarities. As with most activities, target shooting is about the joy of being able to perform a complicated set of actions to a high level of skill. Precision shooting is a difficult task. Mastering difficult tasks is something humans enjoy. It's that simple.

Now, humans differ in what forms, what particular activities, they may enjoy mastering. But the basic drive should be fairly relatable.
 
2014-07-09 02:31:00 AM  
I am pretty sure if my Grandpa would have shot my dad and I had the means I would have blasted gramps. This coming from somebody who did not even particularly care for dad.
 
2014-07-09 02:42:09 AM  
Other articles say the kid was arrested.
Maybe grampa was just standing his ground.
 
2014-07-09 03:05:34 AM  

Prof. Frink: farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?

Obama.


And we're done here.
 
2014-07-09 03:31:16 AM  
All I can think of is Ricky Bobby's kids cussing out their grandfather at dinner.
 
2014-07-09 03:57:39 AM  

Loren: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know). His grandfather shot his dad. Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

Yup, this looks like a justified shoot to me.


But....GUNS!!!
 
2014-07-09 05:08:08 AM  

brimed03: An 11-year-old having access to a shotgun is irresponsible.


you sound like some kind of leftist hippie.
 
2014-07-09 05:54:54 AM  

farkbot42: So, who is at fault here?


the NRA, obviously
 
2014-07-09 07:11:06 AM  

rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.


They're not so useful. You should have saved up and gotten a 16 year old instead. They can pretty much do all the shiat around your house you don't want to do anymore.
 
2014-07-09 07:16:50 AM  

itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....


My compliments!  That's actually the first time I've ever heard someone discuss the difference between guns of that time vs the guns of today.

BTW - I am a gun enthusiast, but in Canada we have a whole different set of rules, and completely different view of what they are, how to use them, and how to store them.  Very few Canadians have guns lying around in ready-to-use condition (that is a felony).  Even my gun club forbids wearing camo and human silouette targets are not allowed.
 
2014-07-09 07:17:49 AM  
So what did he score on the FCAT?
 
2014-07-09 07:22:36 AM  
Guns don't kill people.

*I* kill people.

- 11 year old, NC
 
2014-07-09 07:32:03 AM  
Must have gotten tired of living with that old person smell
 
2014-07-09 07:49:34 AM  

Loren: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know). His grandfather shot his dad. Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

Yup, this looks like a justified shoot to me.


I was actually thinking it sounded like a Justified plot to me.
 
2014-07-09 07:52:42 AM  
It's nice to see three generations sharing a common hobby.
 
2014-07-09 08:14:53 AM  
Guns are never the answer. Unless the question is "What's snug spelled backwards?"
 
2014-07-09 08:23:32 AM  

Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.


People are confusing manufactured housing with trailers. Double-wides are only mobile until they get installed at the job site; they're not designed to be hitched up and driven away the way single-wides are. Looking at TFA, you can see that guy's house is just a standard rural shiatbox that happened to have been built in a factory rather than on-site; it's not a trailer.
 
2014-07-09 08:30:20 AM  

doofusgumby: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

The wad gets wrapped around the ball or preceeds it depending on the type. No wonder you couldn't hit the broadside of gramps on a sober day. YER BALL DONE FALL'D OUT.


You haz a confuse. The patch is wrapped around a ball only in a rifle using round balls (as opposed to self-expanding, conical minie bullets). Then you ram the bullet home, engaging the rifling with the patch.

In a smoothbore musket, the ball is dropped in loose after the powder, and the remains of the paper cartridge is rammed in on top of the ball to keep it from moving before it's fired. In a fowling piece, using shot rather than a single bullet, you use two wads: one to provide the powder something solid to push, and another on top of the shot to keep it from falling out.
 
2014-07-09 08:34:04 AM  

Duke_leto_Atredes: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

Tap load 4 rounds the minute


Now, you an' I boath know y' can fire three roaunds a minnit. But can y' stand?
 
2014-07-09 08:42:42 AM  

brimed03: But anyway, even in this *specific* case, maybe if they were more strict about securing guns in the house, grandpa wouldn't have been able to express his hot-tempered displeasure in terms of caliber. That's another good thing about secured weapons with ammo in another, secured location: the time it takes to get them out gives you a few minutes to cool down. It also gives the other person a good head start on clearing out in case you don't.


But-but-but WHEN SECONDS COUNT!!!
 
2014-07-09 09:02:08 AM  

LazyMedia: Waldo Pepper: MaudlinMutantMollusk: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

I thought mentioning the mobile home was redundant, too

/you just kind of assume that

a mobile home in carolina doesn't always indicate the stereotype that comes to mind. down here one can have a doublewide sitting on 10 acres of land with a swimming pool, two bmw's and a $60,000 ford dually in the driveway and both husband/wife both working white collar well paying jobs.

People are confusing manufactured housing with trailers. Double-wides are only mobile until they get installed at the job site; they're not designed to be hitched up and driven away the way single-wides are. Looking at TFA, you can see that guy's house is just a standard rural shiatbox that happened to have been built in a factory rather than on-site; it's not a trailer.


O_o Double wides and single wides are made the same crappy way out of the same crappy material.  The axels being removed doesn't mean it wasn't a trailer.  The axels can be put back on, split the structure and be moved again.  However, once a redneck takes the wheels off of a car and puts it on blocks, it'll never move again.
 
2014-07-09 09:23:19 AM  

doofusgumby: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

The wad gets wrapped around the ball or preceeds it depending on the type. No wonder you couldn't hit the broadside of gramps on a sober day. YER BALL DONE FALL'D OUT.


Thanks for the info. I appreciate the correction from an expert ball/wad cupper. Hehehe
 
2014-07-09 09:29:04 AM  

Duke_leto_Atredes: itsaidwhat: whatshisname: The Second Amendment never anticipated that 50% of the population are below average intelligence, did it?

Back then you had 10-20 seconds to run away while the shooter dropped powder, ball, wadding then ram, ram, ram....heck, you had time to cut them.

But these days, nobody gives you a "black powder" headstart.....

Tap load 4 rounds the minute


Ok, so it's 10 secs to load, 5 to shoot, then repeat X 3. That's 4 loads per minute. One shooter is 11 and other is 111, I added a few seconds for age and of course you have to let the smoke clear when shooting powder in a manufactured home (single wide assumption in play...)

/dnrtfa
 
2014-07-09 10:18:16 AM  

The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!


Actually, the responsible gun owners are the millions of other gun owners who managed to not shoot each other.
 
2014-07-09 10:44:28 AM  

doofusss: So what did he score on the FCAT?


He got a zero, but that's because he shot the procter...
 
2014-07-09 12:07:19 PM  

The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!


Absolutely.  Grandpa was apparently trying to murder his son by shooting him, so the grandson shot grandpa to prevent that.

Sounds like a righteous shoot, unless other facts come to light we haven't heard about.
 
2014-07-09 12:09:25 PM  
This is going to be a delicious time paradox.
 
2014-07-09 12:15:10 PM  

RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.


And we're done. Grandfather shot father, son shot grandfather. Kid was protecting his father. Unless new info comes to light, the only thing left to do is ensure that the father stays alive and help the kid deal with the resulting trauma from the situation.
 
2014-07-09 12:20:50 PM  

rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.



Great another "responsible kid owner"


I bet you will just walk right into starbucks with that thing and demand you be served.
 
2014-07-09 12:24:26 PM  

brimed03: When I joined my high school rifle team, I learned the difference between an adult supervising and an adult merely being present. I nearly quit over the unsafe practices I saw. Fortunately the coach tightened things up.

Cops, btw, are some of the most unsafe people you'll ever see on a firing range. We used to practice right after them and they'd leave all sorts of bullet-pocked shiat downrange, much of it with ...



I refuse to go to public ranges anymore because of all the idiots that show up now.

Last two times I was there: 1 guy had a "misfire" across the firing line that went through the roof over my head (and he was 8ish benches down??) and the last time some kids fired a high powered rifle at a swinging metal pistol target meant for small bore pistols from 30 feet away and hit a guy with the ricochet (sp?)
 
2014-07-09 12:28:35 PM  

FormlessOne: RodneyToady: The story doesn't exactly match the headline (welcome to Fark, I know).  His grandfather shot his dad.  Sounds like a reasonable case of self-defense.

And we're done. Grandfather shot father, son shot grandfather. Kid was protecting his father. Unless new info comes to light, the only thing left to do is ensure that the father stays alive and help the kid deal with the resulting trauma from the situation.


I think a medal would do nicely, perhaps given at some kind of public ceremony, assuming that there isn't some information about the incident that doesn't point to him defending his own father from his grandfather.
 
2014-07-09 12:30:19 PM  

HalfOffOffer: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

Actually, the responsible gun owners are the millions of other gun owners who managed to not shoot each other.


Not necessarily.  Some percentage of the gun owners who intentionally shoot other people are responsible.

Unless, of course, you believe self-defense = bad.
 
2014-07-09 12:39:49 PM  

HalfOffOffer: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

Actually, the responsible gun owners are the millions of other gun owners who managed to not shoot each other.


Does that include those who shoot at each other, but miss ?
 
2014-07-09 12:56:18 PM  
Guns need to be totally outlawed...just like drugs are.
That's the only solution that will work...

Do *you* see any drugs being sold in the US?
Whazat? Colorado...AND Washington? Really?...errrm...
 
2014-07-09 01:08:34 PM  
Boy:  You call that a gun?
 
2014-07-09 02:23:08 PM  

capt.hollister: HalfOffOffer: The Martian Manhandler: Responsible gun owners strike again!

Actually, the responsible gun owners are the millions of other gun owners who managed to not shoot each other.

Does that include those who shoot at each other, but miss ?


It's a fuzzy line. Though, what I can tell you is this... if your name is Billy Bob Joe Bob and you just shot your brother because he wanted to watch football and you wanted to watch Storage Wars... chances are you are falling more on the irresponsible side of the spectrum.
 
2014-07-09 03:42:11 PM  

2KanZam: rkiller1: I own an eleven-year-old boy, so I'm getting a kick.


Great another "responsible kid owner"  I bet you will just walk right into starbucks with that thing and demand you be served.


Only when I put him in the stroller.
 
2014-07-09 03:55:01 PM  
[OBVIOUS] tag out sodomizing its second cousin?
 
2014-07-09 05:08:18 PM  

sunnewswebguy: Guns need to be totally outlawed...just like drugs are.
That's the only solution that will work...

Do *you* see any drugs being sold in the US?
Whazat? Colorado...AND Washington? Really?...errrm...


Right, because somebody can be killed by having a joint smoked at them. Now, if you're saying that prohibition won't work, well, I agree with that, at least.
 
2014-07-10 12:12:59 AM  
OMG totally take my guns and quick, before this guy kills again!
 
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