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(WTOP)   Lee Boyd Malvo, the DC sniper, believes that he's learned some important lessons about not using human beings as target practice and would like to be let out of prison now, please   (wtop.com) divider line 233
    More: Stupid  
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6300 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Jul 2014 at 10:38 AM (11 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-07-03 02:16:06 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: But when I was a gun owner, before I moved to Canada, I was informed by members of the Revolutionary War Veterans, a couple militia types and some really odd guys at the range that if I ever wanted a suppressor or silencer, they weren't hard to come by.  You can get them at the gun show, if you know the right guy.  Certainly from a home sale.


Really? You're going with the "I know a dude who said X?"

That's bullshiat, and the people who told you were BSing you. There's no shortage of that crap. Gun shows aren't a DMZ where everything goes. It's not Vietnam. There are rules. There are people who make their living by following the rules. You're sure as hell not going to see the guy at the table who is a class 3 SOT FFL (a legal dealer in NFA items) turn a blind eye from the dude over on the other side of the jerky seller who is selling suppressors made on a home lathe and isn't doing any paperwork whatsoever.

Not. Gonna. Happen.

No doubt that there's some jackasses out there making and selling things on the sly, but I've never met one (I'd drop the dime on them myself if I ever did) and doing it at a gun show would be utter insanity- they'd be busted before lunch on the first day.
 
2014-07-03 02:17:06 PM

teenytinycornteeth: You know, this line might make you seem less creepy if the "task" you were trying to accomplish was "how to transport water" with nothing but a roll of paper or "how to create a shelter out of acorns". That would be "fun". But your "task" is how to instill panic in the populace and kill large numbers of innocent civilians. I guess I'm missing where the "fun" comes in.


LOL.

"In a little over two hours, somebody's going to pour water on the rug in the front hallway! We've got to figure out who. THERE'S NO TIME!!!"

Face it, nobody would pay to see a movie about a guy conspiring to tote water in a paper roll.
 
2014-07-03 02:20:03 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: Ummm... human nature?


So, you are going with just guessing and third hand anecdotes?  Hardly substantial data.

To answer your question, no, I haven't been to a gun show in Georgia.  Nor do I own a suppressor.  However, as a FFL I am required to have some first hand knowledge of the penalties involved in the unauthorized dealing in NFA items, and by using your own yardstick (human nature) I would have to say that there is going to be little - to - no illegal NFA sales at any gun show.  Too many eyeballs and too high of a penalty.

Why would you do that anyway?  There is no upside to it.  Someone who really didn't give a sh** about breaking the law can build a suppressor with minimal experience using the standard power tools found in almost any homeowners garage and about $60.00 worth of materials.  Again, the reason people don't goes back to human nature.  Too much risk (10 years PMITA ) vs. a *slight* reduction in the weapons volume and the chance to show off a "silencer".
 
2014-07-03 02:21:29 PM

dittybopper: DrBenway: I'm pretty sure the point is how much ditty appears to relish such exercises ("fun" he himself noted) that triggers the "that's a little creepy, hoss" reaction in some people. And it's not like his comments in this one thread are seen in any sort of a vacuum here either. The people you're wanting us to compare him to do it for a living, not as some pleasurable fantasy activity pursued in generic public forums online.

I was offered a position doing pretty much this sort of thing, or, perhaps more accurately, I was informed that there was a Beltway Bandit who was looking for someone like me, and the person offered to put me in touch.

Difficulty:  I would have had to move.  And I hate moving.  I like living in my little podunk town.  I've got roots there.  I coach Little League, I'm a Cub Scout leader, I have family reasonably nearby, so does the distaffbopper.  I've got a decent job that I like, and that will provide the littlebopper free college tuition.

Plus, I'd probably be under some NDA, so I couldn't talk about it publicly.  And that kind of rubs me the wrong way too.  One way that we learn more is by discussing things.  When you limit the amount of discussion, or limit the discussion to just a few people, you don't learn anywhere near as much.

Also, make no mistake about it:  The people getting paid to do it also enjoy it, or they wouldn't be doing it.  Just because they are paid to do it doesn't make them any less "creepy".

Bottom line, though, I don't see anything wrong with essentially wargaming in a very public manner what the other side might do.


So... professionals brainstorming with other professionals brings poorer results than some guy wanking it for fun with, at best, a handful of amateurs in the middle of non-specific online forums? Okay, you go with that rationale.

As far as not seeing anything wrong about it? There's a saying I see from time to time here: "This is not your personal pornography... er, WARGAMING site."
 
2014-07-03 02:28:58 PM
OK, I admit I was working on off-hand information - but then, these things aren't advertised in standard outlets.

I will change my statement to "a suppressor (not hard to get hold of, especially for someone who isn't too worried about legalities)".
 
2014-07-03 02:31:50 PM

Skyd1v: I would have to say that there is going to be little - to - no illegal NFA sales at any gun show


Of the shows I've been to, I don't even think there's many legal NFA sales at a gun show. Reason being, it's NOT cash and carry. The Class 3 SOT FFLs I've seen usually just have stuff on display and will discuss the process with you and invite you to come by to get things rolling.

The process (for the benefit of others):
1) Find item you want and is available for sale. Pay dealer for item, dealer fills out an ATF Form 4.
1a) If item you want has to be ordered, you'll have to wait for it to come in before you can start filling out that Form 4... the serial number of the item needs to be on that form.
2) Get fingerprints on FBI cards (2 sets) and two passport photos made. Affix photos to forms.
2a) If not using a trust, have your local chief law enforcement officer sign off on the forms.
3) Send forms to ATF with fingerprint cards and funds for the tax required on the item.
4) Wait.
5) Wait.
6) Wait some more. Again, Form 4 approval times right now are at 9 months. If you were to start this process right now you're looking at April (at least) before the forms are done. Yes, you'll likely file taxes before your Form 4 comes back.
7) When your Form 4 comes in to your dealer, you will go to the dealer, fill out a 4473, and take the item home with you.

That's not happening at a gun show.
 
2014-07-03 02:34:03 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: OK, I admit I was working on off-hand information - but then, these things aren't advertised in standard outlets.

I will change my statement to "a suppressor (not hard to get hold of, especially for someone who isn't too worried about legalities)".


Yeah, there's a lot of BS out there, even in the firearm community. You are correct that if legality means dark-all then you can get one, but more likely you'll be making your own. The info for that isn't hard to find, but for my own reasons I won't point anybody towards it.

Getting busted with an NFA item that you shouldn't have usually means an immediate 10 years in Club Fed. Personally, I want nothing to do with such things and I advise others to steer clear of crap that's been bubba'd up in violation of the 1934 National Firearms Act. That's bad news... and can even be outright dangerous if somebody did it improperly.
 
hej
2014-07-03 02:35:33 PM
I guess we've become a country where it's OK to persecute children.
 
2014-07-03 02:44:21 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: OK, I admit I was working on off-hand information - but then, these things aren't advertised in standard outlets.

I will change my statement to "a suppressor (not hard to get hold of, especially for someone who isn't too worried about legalities)".


The fact that you would admit you were working off of bad/incorrect information and post a retraction means you have a higher level of integrity than I have come to expect in some of these threads.

I'm going to have to go ahead and favorite you with a "Rational" tag.  What color do you want?

/except green.  I saves that for the trolls
 
2014-07-03 02:53:10 PM
Gee, I am soooo sorry. But, you know, you shot people to death, so no.
 
2014-07-03 03:00:31 PM
I do feel bad for the kid because of what John Muhammed did to him. He took him in as a son and brainwashed him to kill those people.

That being said, he can stay in prison for life.
 
2014-07-03 03:01:46 PM

cryinoutloud: is this the kid or the old guy? I might have a small amount of sympathy for the kid. Not enough to let him out of prison yet, mind you, but maybe someday.

I don't actually care enough to check, though.


I believe the old guy was death penaltied amazingly quickly, because he wanted it. So it's just the young one left in prison.
 
2014-07-03 03:22:06 PM
akula:

Of the shows I've been to, I don't even think there's many legal NFA sales at a gun show. Reason being, it's NOT cash and carry. The Class 3 SOT FFLs I've seen usually just have stuff on display and will discuss the process with you and invite you to come by to get things rolling.


4) Wait.
5) Wait.


That's not happening at a gun show.


This is why I never bothered with the SOT stamp.  Between that sheit clogging up your safe, and the customers getting all antsy in the panntsy about getting their new semi verboten today, it's just not worth the hassle.
 
2014-07-03 03:23:23 PM

DrBenway: So... professionals brainstorming with other professionals brings poorer results than some guy wanking it for fun with, at best, a handful of amateurs in the middle of non-specific online forums? Okay, you go with that rationale.


Quite often, yes, in fact it does.

Not always, of course, but consider this:  I've posted this idea in several different Fark threads over at least the last 5 years (earliest I know of from a quick google is 2009).  I'm guessing that hundreds of people have seen it.  People from very different walks of life, different experiences, and different talents.

Contrast that to the exposure it would get from half a dozen or perhaps a dozen "professionals" who could very well likely suffer from group-think, because they are a more cohesive unit.  If your co-worker Bob comes up with a stupid idea, are you likely to critique it mercilessly?

That happens here on Fark.

And that's a feature, not a bug, and one that cuts both ways:  Because if someone tells you your idea is stupid, and can show you a good reason why, that enables you to either drop the idea, or improve it by taking into account something you haven't actually thought of, but someone else has.

Plus, the semi-anonymous nature of a forum like this allows you to engage in speech you probably wouldn't otherwise:  When I come up with ideas like the sniper thing, or the cheap-ass cruise missile, etc., it's not like I walk around telling all my friends about it.  Some are like you:  They'd find it kind of "creepy".  And some quite honestly don't have the intellectual horsepower to understand the implications, both technical and policy-wise.  There are just one or two people I discuss stuff like this in person, unless there is a reason, and they do the same thing also.

But here, I can outline my concepts (and that's what they will always be, just concepts) and see what stands up to scrutiny.

And maybe, just maybe, someone from one of those groups might read one of these threads and say "You know, we didn't really think about that", because they were focused on preventing what had been done before, not what could be done in the future.
 
2014-07-03 03:24:46 PM

Cdr.Murdock: akula:

Of the shows I've been to, I don't even think there's many legal NFA sales at a gun show. Reason being, it's NOT cash and carry. The Class 3 SOT FFLs I've seen usually just have stuff on display and will discuss the process with you and invite you to come by to get things rolling.


4) Wait.
5) Wait.


That's not happening at a gun show.

This is why I never bothered with the SOT stamp.  Between that sheit clogging up your safe, and the customers getting all antsy in the panntsy about getting their new semi verboten today, it's just not worth the hassle.


I understand the e-file stuff is moving faster. Not sure how an e-file works though; none of mine have been.

It seems to me that those who get into the NFA stuff are in it not so much for the money but because they're enthusiasts. I don't mean they get it for their own fun toys, but that they enjoy them and it's more about the enjoyment of inducting people into that part of shooting than it is about making lots of cash. Sure, there's less competition (most cans I've seen have gone for close to MSRP, so there isn't much of a price competition going on) so there is profit in it, but I just doubt that for most SOTs it's about the money they can make.
 
2014-07-03 03:24:57 PM

hej: I guess we've become a country where it's OK to persecute children.


Oh, come on, you can do better than that.  It's like you weren't even trying.
 
2014-07-03 03:30:32 PM
I'd like to get a few more suppressors, but I don't want to lay out the money and then wait forever for them to come in.

Of course, the way things have been lately I could probably go through the process and have the suppressor before my back-order on .22LR gets filled.
 
2014-07-03 03:39:09 PM

hej: I guess we've become a country where it's OK to persecute children.


When they go around killing adults, it becomes us verses them.  I don't have sympathy for teens anymore.

/the dark side of old is creeping up.
 
2014-07-03 03:43:08 PM

dittybopper: This text is now purple: dittybopper: You know what a pro-gun rights advocate I am, and I'm just not seeing how being armed can help against a random single sniper shot.

And I've *TRIED* to think about ways it might help. And I can't think of any possible way it could help outside of the sniper team making a serious operational mistake.

Like Whitman?
[dambreaker.files.wordpress.com image 244x183]

Whitman wasn't really a sniper attack in the sense of a single shot followed by a tactical retreat, like the DC Sniper attacks.  That was more akin to a typical mass shooting, though at longer ranges than most.


Oswald?

He might have gotten away with it for a time if:
a) he hadn't been a loon
b) he hadn't immediately followed it up by shooting a cop (see a)
c) he hadn't camped out in a theater in the vicinity (see a)
 
2014-07-03 03:46:59 PM
i.ytimg.com

Did he mention that he was VERY sorry that he did it?
 
2014-07-03 03:47:07 PM

ZAZ: Let his head out today.

Let his body out next week.


You wouldn't happen to have a newsletter that I could subscribe to, by any chance?

Another fitting punishment for him: execution by firing squad.
 
2014-07-03 03:59:08 PM

Skyd1v: Benevolent Misanthrope: OK, I admit I was working on off-hand information - but then, these things aren't advertised in standard outlets.

I will change my statement to "a suppressor (not hard to get hold of, especially for someone who isn't too worried about legalities)".

The fact that you would admit you were working off of bad/incorrect information and post a retraction means you have a higher level of integrity than I have come to expect in some of these threads.

I'm going to have to go ahead and favorite you with a "Rational" tag.  What color do you want?

/except green.  I saves that for the trolls


Whatever you like, I'm not picky. :)
 
2014-07-03 04:25:56 PM

mongbiohazard: FLMountainMan: FLMountainMan: Shaggy_C: Random people get shot in drive-by's in the hood on a daily basis; you only ever hear about it when it becomes excessive (like 40+ people killed on any given Chicago weekend).

Soon as it happens to rich white people at gas stations, though...watch out, national headlines.

Except none of the victims were rich white people.

I mean seriously, this is how ignorant you are.  The victims on the first day were a landscaper, a part-time taxi driver named Premkumar Walekar, a Latina babysitter/maid, a woman vacuuming a Dodge Caravan, and a 72 year old retired carpenter named Pascal.

You're forgetting the guy shot the evening before - the first person shot in Montgomery County - was a 55 year old, well-off white guy. And they shot a few well-off white folks in VA after they left MoCo. So it really was a mix of people. Well-to-do white folks among them.

That said, I don't have any doubt that if all the victims had been working class folks - like the poor taxi and bus drivers that got shot - that the reaction would have been the same. The problem that scared folks was just the mysterious nature of the shootings - totally random times, totally random targets, totally random places, totally anonymous shooter, no known motivation...


Oooooooo.........................well-off

Oo
 
2014-07-03 06:09:31 PM
I suggest we tattoo "Fark Allah" on one side of his face, and "Death to Muslims" on the other side of his face, then turn him lose in Iran to fend for himself.

/Yes, I would love to see the results on Pay Per View.
 
2014-07-03 07:19:11 PM
Malvo killed ten people.

I know that in this day and age of forgiveness and feelings and society-is-to-blame political correctness that some people get one murder as a freebie, but that just means he's got nine more murders to work off the hard way.

Or the easy way: execution
 
2014-07-03 07:33:04 PM

dittybopper: LavenderWolf: dittybopper: LavenderWolf: If the DC sniper/Al Qaeda synthesis happens, it'll be the Republicans with a worthwhile solution, for once.

Arm f*cking EVERYONE.

Wouldn't help:  We're talking a single shot from, well, could be *ANYWHERE*.  Arming everyone isn't going to help in that situation, because even if everyone is open carrying an AR-15 like those OCTards*, what are they going to shoot at?  Each other?

The whole idea of a sniper attack like that isn't like shooting up a mall or school, where you go down in a blaze of glory and take as many as you can with you.  It's a single shot from some hidden place that could in theory be hundreds of yards away (or maybe only 50), and because the sniper is hidden and there is only a single shot, you have no idea where the shot came from.

Who would you shoot back at?

*That's going to be my new name for them.

It's not really a "this will stop the attacks" solution so much as "this makes these types of attack much more risky" solution. Like how vaccines work. A vaccine doesn't kill a raging viral infection, but, it can prevent infections from really taking root.

You know what a pro-gun rights advocate I am, and I'm just not seeing how being armed can help against a random single sniper shot.

And I've *TRIED* to think about ways it might help.  And I can't think of any possible way it could help outside of the sniper team making a serious operational mistake.


It's not for the target to defend against the sniper. The target is assumed dead.
 
hej
2014-07-03 08:43:29 PM

dittybopper: hej: I guess we've become a country where it's OK to persecute children.

Oh, come on, you can do better than that.  It's like you weren't even trying.


It's not worth too much effort when you show up that late to a thread.
 
2014-07-03 08:46:58 PM
I do think that he was manipulated in a way that someone in his position would not have had the capacity to refuse.    He had no real parents... The killer guy was a surrogate father and probaly didnt have to try very hard to convince the youngster that white people are evil.   Its an easy sell to an impressionable mind.

so, i feel for him, but hey.... he still killed folks... Its unfortunate that he got caught up in the other guy's plans, but he did, and now his future path is irreparably harmed.
 
2014-07-04 12:05:48 AM
cdn.pjmedia.com
 
2014-07-04 02:52:29 AM
Couldn't they wait until he's super old and sick and release him right before he dies? Then that's not actually "life in prison" then yes?
 
2014-07-04 07:27:34 AM
I won money in the pool because he was a muzzy
nice to hear about him every so often, just like to know he's rotting behind bars
 
2014-07-04 08:24:19 AM

vernonFL: IF he was just a kid who was brainwashed, then I would consider it.

Has he been checked out by mental heath experts?


How the hell do  you get "brainwashed" to the point you forget "murder is bad" and if such a stupid creature actually existed, why the fugg would you want it loose in the public again, idiot?
 
2014-07-04 10:53:21 AM

natas6.0: I won money in the pool because he was a muzzy
nice to hear about him every so often, just like to know he's rotting behind bars


www.foodplots.com

What a Muzzy might look like.
 
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