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(International Business Times)   Scientists have come up with yet another reason why children are obese which isn't 'they eat too much food'   (ibtimes.co.uk) divider line 133
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12376 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Jun 2014 at 7:08 PM (26 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-06-26 12:02:28 AM  

baconbeard: People are fat because they eat too much and don't get enough exercise. It really *is* as simple as that.

/"genetically" obese for the first 45 years of my life
//have lost 75 lbs since Dec 21, 2013 by counting calories and getting regular exercise
///no longer diagnosed with sleep apnia, metabolic syndrome, or pre-diabeetus


Been there, done that.

However, the harder challenge is maintaining the weight. Will the weight come creeping back when the central focus of your life is not diet and exercise?

Lost 70 in 2012/ Was down to slightly below 20 BMI. Now I gained back 20 in 2013-2014.
 
2014-06-26 12:08:10 AM  

syrynxx: It's no different than being an adult.  If you have a sedentary desk job, you'll get fat vs. an active job.  My fitness app on my phone says I burned 650 calories walking today to/at/from work, vs. my old job where I walked 30 feet to work. That's a pound a week; 50 lbs a year difference with no other changes.


You walk about 7 miles to and from work? That would be around 2 hours of walking.
 
2014-06-26 12:19:38 AM  

Likwit: The rest of the world is laughing at us also getting fat.


hell, lab mice are getting fatter.

http://news.discovery.com/animals/fat-pets-obesity-weight.htm 

It's more than just people not putting the fork down.
 
2014-06-26 12:19:58 AM  

JesseL: poodebunker: JesseL: This is one small area of parenting I haven't farked up too badly.

Awwwww! If that lil wader is yours, double awwwwww!

Thanks :) All mine.


/he thought the water was a bit chilly


Oh! I love that! I just adore kids romping in water. At the earliest age my dad had us kids swimming, water skiing, fishing and water rafting. So many wonderful memories come to me seeing your son enjoying that. Thanks for sharing those pictures.
 
2014-06-26 01:20:21 AM  
I bought them each a pair of roller skates and pads.
Now, even before breakfast, they have these things strapped to their feet.

Let's hope it makes a difference leading up to the new school year, because any words of encouragement/positive feedback they hear then will keep them motivated.
 
2014-06-26 01:38:48 AM  

poodebunker: JesseL: poodebunker: JesseL: This is one small area of parenting I haven't farked up too badly.

Awwwww! If that lil wader is yours, double awwwwww!

Thanks :) All mine.


/he thought the water was a bit chilly

Oh! I love that! I just adore kids romping in water. At the earliest age my dad had us kids swimming, water skiing, fishing and water rafting. So many wonderful memories come to me seeing your son enjoying that. Thanks for sharing those pictures.


I remember my Dad teaching me to swim.

Getting the knots untied was the hardest part.
 
2014-06-26 02:16:33 AM  

Ninja Otter: Likwit: The rest of the world is laughing at us also getting fat.

hell, lab mice are getting fatter.

http://news.discovery.com/animals/fat-pets-obesity-weight.htm 

It's more than just people not putting the fork down.


It does seem worth looking into why people aren't just satisfied from what they've eaten.

Personally I think it's mostly that people aren't consuming enough protein in their diets.

I mean a fairly normal meal for a kid may be something like PB&J, but there's almost no protein in that, and it is mostly sugar and fat. So it isn't much wonder when a kid eats things like that and still is hungry (in my mind). Or you have some spaghetti for a meal with just some tomato sauce, it's just carbs and sugar.

The reason for it all seems to be because it's just cheap, rather than healthy. But you end up with people that just think about having some carbs and sugar as a meal (cereal, chips, candy, pretzels, whatever), which doesn't satisfy their appetite, but still will at least make them feel full.

I think if you included more meats in all the kids diets (in school lunches at least) you'd find them having their waistlines getting a bit more reasonable fairly quickly. The only reason that this doesn't seem to be done already is because it would mean revamping school lunches to such a degree that you'd have to infuse millions of dollars into the system to be able to actually afford more than all the bread, potatoes, and noodles currently done.

Instead of really looking at kids' diets and trying to improve them, the conversation seems to just be redirected at "kids are just lazy shiats that won't get up and do anything", or that they're just stuffing their faces with crap, instead of examining why. It doesn't seem like rocket science to figure out that people fed a poor diet are going to be unhealthy in comparison to if you fed something of better quality.
 
2014-06-26 07:08:05 AM  

Demiglace: I mean a fairly normal meal for a kid may be something like PB&J, but there's almost no protein in that, and it is mostly sugar and fat. So it isn't much wonder when a kid eats things like that and still is hungry (in my mind). Or you have some spaghetti for a meal with just some tomato sauce, it's just carbs and sugar.


Peanuts have lots of protein. The wheat gluten in spaghetti is also protein. PB&J has 10g of protein for 100g of PB&J and spaghetti has 8g per 140g.
 
2014-06-26 07:10:08 AM  

Ninja Otter: hell, lab mice are getting fatter.

http://news.discovery.com/animals/fat-pets-obesity-weight.htm

It's more than just people not putting the fork down.


And cats and dogs.
And I suspect also squirrels, especially the brown ones. There are some lard-ass squirrels running around our neighborhood.
 
2014-06-26 07:48:09 AM  

mr0x: Demiglace: I mean a fairly normal meal for a kid may be something like PB&J, but there's almost no protein in that, and it is mostly sugar and fat. So it isn't much wonder when a kid eats things like that and still is hungry (in my mind). Or you have some spaghetti for a meal with just some tomato sauce, it's just carbs and sugar.

Peanuts have lots of protein. The wheat gluten in spaghetti is also protein. PB&J has 10g of protein for 100g of PB&J and spaghetti has 8g per 140g.


That's barely any protein.
 
2014-06-26 07:57:04 AM  

freetomato: You, my fair lady, are more fark-organized than I. I can say you've been a lovely shade of green for a while, since we had a pleasurable exchange way back when. I forget what/ when. "Smart, cool chick"


great minds think alike.
 
2014-06-26 08:00:56 AM  
Yay, you can stave off the ravaging effects of processed sugars, starches, and carbs with exercise and make it so kids appear to be healthy when they aren't, simply by letting them outside to run and play.
 
2014-06-26 08:07:06 AM  

vudukungfu: freetomato: You, my fair lady, are more fark-organized than I. I can say you've been a lovely shade of green for a while, since we had a pleasurable exchange way back when. I forget what/ when. "Smart, cool chick"

great minds think alike.


Ha!  Just checked.  You are on my list too.
 
2014-06-26 08:27:11 AM  

JesseL: This is one small area of parenting I haven't farked up too badly.


But you conveniently edited out the water moccasin about to strike....

/i keed
 
2014-06-26 08:28:52 AM  

Shakin_Haitian: mr0x: Demiglace: I mean a fairly normal meal for a kid may be something like PB&J, but there's almost no protein in that, and it is mostly sugar and fat. So it isn't much wonder when a kid eats things like that and still is hungry (in my mind). Or you have some spaghetti for a meal with just some tomato sauce, it's just carbs and sugar.

Peanuts have lots of protein. The wheat gluten in spaghetti is also protein. PB&J has 10g of protein for 100g of PB&J and spaghetti has 8g per 140g.

That's barely any protein.


You don't need much.  Unless you're body-building, in which case you can modify your diet to eat a lot more nuts.  But literally every vegetable, fruit, and grain has protein, so you can get it from lots of different sources in your diet.

The real problem with PB&J is the sugar.  Let's look at what goes into a typical PB&J:

Jif Peanut Butter (the most popular): "MADE FROM ROASTED PEANUTS AND SUGAR, CONTAINS 2% OR LESS OF: MOLASSES, FULLY HYDROGENATED VEGETABLE OILS (RAPESEED AND SOYBEAN), MONO AND DIGLYCERIDES, SALT."  3g added sugar per 32g serving.
Smuckers Grape Jelly (highest seller on Amazon): "CONCORD GRAPE JUICE, HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP, CORN SYRUP, FRUIT PECTIN, CITRIC ACID, SODIUM CITRATE."  12g sugar per 20g serving.  Since grape juice is one of the most processed forms of sugar, we can count all of it as added sugar.  For strawberry, we might have a harder time, since it's unknown how much is strawberry and how much is other sweetener (in this case: HFCS, Corn Syrup, and Fruit Pectin are all added sugar).
Bimbo Soft White Bread (It's really hard to find info on the most popular bread brands, for some reason): "ENRICHED WHEAT FLOUR [FLOUR, MALTED BARLEY FLOUR, REDUCED IRON, NIACIN, THIAMIN MONONITRATE (VITAMIN B1), RIBOFLAVIN (VITAMIN B2), FOLIC ACID], WATER, SUGAR, YEAST, SALT, SOYBEAN AND/OR CANOLA OIL, ENRICHMENT (CALCIUM SULFATE, VITAMIN E ACETATE, VITAMIN A PALMITATE, VITAMIN D3), CALCIUM PROPIONATE (PRESERVATIVE), CALCIUM SULFATE, DATEM, MONO- AND DIGLYCERIDES, CITRIC ACID, SOY LECITHIN , SODIUM STEAROYL LACTYLATE, WHEAT GLUTEN, ETHOXYLATED MONO- AND DIGLYCERIDES."  2g added sugar per 47g serving, but also 20g of highly processed flour, which is as quickly broken down in the body as sugar.

Result: In a 99g sandwich, you have 17g of sugar and 20g of sugar-like flour, or effectively 37g of sugar.

Now, here's how I do PB&J:
Smucker's Natural Peanut Butter: PEANUTS, CONTAINS 1% OR LESS OF SALT.  0g added sugar.
St. Dalfour's Red Raspberry Jam: Raspberries 55%, Grape Juice Concentrate, Fruit Pectin.  Still contains 11g sugar/20g serving, but 2g of that comes from the Red Raspberry, and is still locked away inside the raspberry, making it harder to access.  Added sugar: 9g/20g serving.
Mrs. Baird's Sugar Free Whole Grain Wheat: WHOLE WHEAT FLOUR, WATER, YEAST, WHEAT GLUTEN, WHEAT BRAN. CONTAINS 2% OR LESS OF EACH OF THE FOLLOWING: SOYBEAN OIL, MALT EXTRACT (CORN AND BARLEY), CRUSHED WHEAT, SALT, OAT FIBER, CALCIUM SULFATE, DATEM, CALCIUM PROPIONATE (PRESERVATIVE), GRAIN VINEGAR, MONOGLYCERIDES, ACESULFAME POTASSIUM, CITRIC ACID, POTASSIUM IODATE, SOY FLOUR, SOY LECITHIN. Contains 0g added sugar, 0g refined flour.

Result: In a 108g sandwich (The whole wheat is heavier), I get 9g of sugar.  Period.
 
2014-06-26 09:02:58 AM  

ikanreed: Dear god, stupid people:

not everything is about "trying to dodge responsibility"

Sometimes, and this is crazy, I know, we like to actually understand what changed in society to allow for the changes we see in individuals.  Tools to help us shape future policy.  It's not "common sense" because it's actually trying to understand aggregate problems rather than engage in reductionist dismissals.


Shut up, nerd. Stupid scientists, trying to use "evidence" and "data" to come to conclusions. Just use common sense. Kids get fat because they're lazier now than when I was a kid, and parents have uniquely, for the first time in history, begun pampering them.
 
2014-06-26 09:07:25 AM  
Depends on how you define "food." I would say that kids eat too much garbage.
 
2014-06-26 09:09:34 AM  

Hermione_Granger: A lot of Farkers seem to have missed the part where parents have been arrested, charged with child neglect  or had their kids brought home by the cops for the terrible crimes of:

 -  Letting kids play in the yard alone
 -  Letting kids walk to the store alone
 -  Letting a kids walk a mile to a sports practice
 -  And worst of all: Walking with a child while male. Especially if the child is female

Farkers who think parents just aren't letting their kids outside need to spend some time reading Free Range Kids and some of the stories who have been cited for negligence for letting their kids out of their sight. Or had their child escorted home by the cops merely because they were walking alone.

If parents are paranoid, it's for good reason.


Your kids sound fat.
 
2014-06-26 09:46:48 AM  

Guest: I went for a walk and I past three play parks with no one in them. Should I send my daughter out to play by herself.


Kids today have lost spontaneity. They don't just go down to the park to see who is there. But they will make park dates. Which is weird to me but works for them, I guess. Mine are all old enough to do this completely on their own, but when they were younger, we'd walk down together, then I would go for a walk and give them a little space while they played.
 
2014-06-26 09:49:59 AM  

reillan: Shakin_Haitian: mr0x: Demiglace: I mean a fairly normal meal for a kid may be something like PB&J, but there's almost no protein in that, and it is mostly sugar and fat. So it isn't much wonder when a kid eats things like that and still is hungry (in my mind). Or you have some spaghetti for a meal with just some tomato sauce, it's just carbs and sugar.

Peanuts have lots of protein. The wheat gluten in spaghetti is also protein. PB&J has 10g of protein for 100g of PB&J and spaghetti has 8g per 140g.

That's barely any protein.

You don't need much.  Unless you're body-building, in which case you can modify your diet to eat a lot more nuts.  But literally every vegetable, fruit, and grain has protein, so you can get it from lots of different sources in your diet.

The real problem with PB&J is the sugar.  Let's look at what goes into a typical PB&J:

Jif Peanut Butter (the most popular): "MADE FROM ROASTED PEANUTS AND SUGAR, CONTAINS 2% OR LESS OF: MOLASSES, FULLY HYDROGENATED VEGETABLE OILS (RAPESEED AND SOYBEAN), MONO AND DIGLYCERIDES, SALT."  3g added sugar per 32g serving.
Smuckers Grape Jelly (highest seller on Amazon): "CONCORD GRAPE JUICE, HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP, CORN SYRUP, FRUIT PECTIN, CITRIC ACID, SODIUM CITRATE."  12g sugar per 20g serving.  Since grape juice is one of the most processed forms of sugar, we can count all of it as added sugar.  For strawberry, we might have a harder time, since it's unknown how much is strawberry and how much is other sweetener (in this case: HFCS, Corn Syrup, and Fruit Pectin are all added sugar).
Bimbo Soft White Bread (It's really hard to find info on the most popular bread brands, for some reason): "ENRICHED WHEAT FLOUR [FLOUR, MALTED BARLEY FLOUR, REDUCED IRON, NIACIN, THIAMIN MONONITRATE (VITAMIN B1), RIBOFLAVIN (VITAMIN B2), FOLIC ACID], WATER, SUGAR, YEAST, SALT, SOYBEAN AND/OR CANOLA OIL, ENRICHMENT (CALCIUM SULFATE, VITAMIN E ACETATE, VITAMIN A PALMITATE, VITAMIN D3), CALCIUM PROPIONATE (PRESERVATIVE), CALCIUM S ...


Well, you don't need a lot of things to stay alive, but they're necessary for a healthy body.
 
2014-06-26 09:55:36 AM  

NakedDrummer: Hmm.. Would be interesting to see results of like 3 kid families.

The usual is:
First kid: over protective. Clueless parents doing their best to keep kid safe. Ends Up Economics Major or something.
Second: parents getting the hang of it. Some what moderate.
Third kid: ok these rats are anything but fragile. Go mountain biking and play tackle football in the middle if the street. Good luck with your music major.


NOPE

First kid gets coddled until second kid comes along, then first kid gets treated as your second step.
Second kid gets coddled until the Baby is born, then First kid gets bumped to third step, and second kit gets bumped to second step.
Baby gets coddled until college.

First Kid also has higher discipline standards because: You're the oldest! You should know better! What sort of example are you giving your younger siblings!?!?

Second Kid gets mediocre discipline, hence their feeling constantly forgotten. Middle children= either highest acheivers or attention whores in some other respect: Class clown.

Youngest Kid hardly gets any discipline, but when they do get it, it tends to be more severe, because of the abundance of resources that can now be stripped from the kid.

/First kid.
// God help you if there's a fourth kid in the mix.
 
2014-06-26 10:33:37 AM  

Shakin_Haitian: Well, you don't need a lot of things to stay alive, but they're necessary for a healthy body.


True, but protein isn't like you're thinking... the amount you need for a healthy body is relatively tiny - 56g/day for a man.   In the case of that sandwich I created for myself, I get 13g protein in a single sandwich, and I'll eat two sandwiches in a meal.  That means 26g in a single meal.  If I do that 3x a day (I won't, but the other foods I eat will still have plenty of protein on their own), I'll get 56g easily.

Just about everything you eat, except fruit, has enough protein that regular eating of it will give you all you need.  Fruit is lower in protein but still contains a tiny bit.

What's funny is that protein is also bad for us in a few ways.  One of the key ways has to do with a process called "cell death".  Cells have a fuse, basically, like a stick of dynamite.  When that fuse runs out, the cell dies.  Protein causes this fuse to burn faster, killing cells faster and leading to premature aging.
 
2014-06-26 10:37:03 AM  
And for one more point before you say it - we used to believe that you couldn't get all of your essential proteins from plants... that there were proteins your body couldn't synthesize that you could only get from animal protein.  Well, it's true that your body can't synthesize those, but it's not true that they're not found in plants - in fact, every plant contains every protein, although obviously some plants contain less protein than others.

Still, it's important to eat animal products (I prefer cheese, fish, eggs, and milk) to get Vitamin B12, which *is* only found in animal products.
 
2014-06-26 10:40:32 AM  

Demiglace: Ninja Otter:
It's more than just people not putting the fork down.

It does seem worth looking into why people aren't just satisfied from what they've eaten.


Agreed. I suspect that medical science will make significant progress in lower side-effect appetite suppressants (amphetamines work, but they tend to boost blood pressure, etc.) in the next couple of decades, but it would be nice to understand why it became more of an issue in the first place.
 
2014-06-26 10:56:03 AM  

mr0x: baconbeard: People are fat because they eat too much and don't get enough exercise. It really *is* as simple as that.

/"genetically" obese for the first 45 years of my life
//have lost 75 lbs since Dec 21, 2013 by counting calories and getting regular exercise
///no longer diagnosed with sleep apnia, metabolic syndrome, or pre-diabeetus

Been there, done that.

However, the harder challenge is maintaining the weight. Will the weight come creeping back when the central focus of your life is not diet and exercise?

Lost 70 in 2012/ Was down to slightly below 20 BMI. Now I gained back 20 in 2013-2014.


I saw a paper recently: a meta-analysis of which kinds of weight loss interventions work best to keep weight off long-term.

Result: None - because approximately nobody ever loses weight and keeps it off for more than a couple years.

Saying "all you have to do is eat less" explains nothing - the much more interesting and relevant question is "what's making people want to eat too much?" And the usual pat answer to that question ("people just suck These Days") also explains nothing.
 
2014-06-26 11:00:01 AM  

Ninja Otter: Demiglace: Ninja Otter:
It's more than just people not putting the fork down.

It does seem worth looking into why people aren't just satisfied from what they've eaten.

Agreed. I suspect that medical science will make significant progress in lower side-effect appetite suppressants (amphetamines work, but they tend to boost blood pressure, etc.) in the next couple of decades, but it would be nice to understand why it became more of an issue in the first place.


Everyone has pet theories, mine:

- "Superstimulus" foods
- Some hormonal feedback system being disrupted by some yet-unknown environmental factor
- Rampant economic insecurity (triggering an evolved response of "eat a lot, while you still can")

I'm skeptical of scientific progress in this area, because of the near-universal view of obesity as a pure moral failing.
 
2014-06-26 11:24:42 AM  
When I was a kid in the early 60s, you got a soda pop maybe once a week, and you split a 10 oz bottle with a sibling.
You got a candy bar maybe once a week IF you were lucky.
A trip to the candy store meant maybe getting candy, but a cap gun or a roll of caps would last much longer.
In order to fend off boredom, you could walk anywhere, unattended.
Be home by dark, don't get hurt.

No body got shot in school.
We all were slim.

Fat kids just weren't around.
When the carnival came to town, you could pay a quarter to see real, live freaks in a tent.
There were people covered with tattoos, and women with facial hair, and morbidly obese people.
They were FREAKS of nature.

Now, they are in line eating deep fried oreos at the fair.
 
2014-06-26 11:38:51 AM  
You can chain kids to your radiator to keep them from running off, but they won't get fat unless you allow them to stuff their gaping pieholes with, well, pie. And chips. And hot dogs. And pizza. And candy. And Hot Pockets. etc.

Eating too much is what causes people to be overweight. Yeah, inactivity is a factor, but it's a fairly small one.

The stuff I see people loading up their grocery carts with is probably a clue as to what's making us fat.
 
2014-06-26 12:10:12 PM  

Gyrfalcon: NakedDrummer: Hmm.. Would be interesting to see results of like 3 kid families.

The usual is:
First kid: over protective. Clueless parents doing their best to keep kid safe. Ends Up Economics Major or something.
Second: parents getting the hang of it. Some what moderate.
Third kid: ok these rats are anything but fragile. Go mountain biking and play tackle football in the middle if the street. Good luck with your music major.

Fifth kid (my sister): Just make sure Kennan doesn't eat anything sharp!


Nth kid, we find ourselves saying things like, "Don't carry the baby by its neck."

I have to try really hard not to be super protective. I literally turn around when they're wrestling so I don't see the odd contortionist stuff their necks can do.

/so many kids, only one trip to the ER so far
 
2014-06-26 01:13:24 PM  

Smelly Pirate Hooker: And Hot Pockets. etc.


Yeah,
I try not to eat any food that didn't exist when I was a kid.
58 years old with a 34 inch waist.
 
2014-06-26 02:06:08 PM  

Gaseous Anomaly: I'm skeptical of scientific progress in this area, because of the near-universal view of obesity as a pure moral failing.


While this is true, if you lose weight -- regardless of the method, be it diet+exercise or gastric banding -- you're viewed as no longer having that moral failing.
 
2014-06-26 02:08:16 PM  

Gaseous Anomaly: Ninja Otter: Demiglace: Ninja Otter:
It's more than just people not putting the fork down.

It does seem worth looking into why people aren't just satisfied from what they've eaten.

Agreed. I suspect that medical science will make significant progress in lower side-effect appetite suppressants (amphetamines work, but they tend to boost blood pressure, etc.) in the next couple of decades, but it would be nice to understand why it became more of an issue in the first place.

Everyone has pet theories, mine:

- "Superstimulus" foods
- Some hormonal feedback system being disrupted by some yet-unknown environmental factor
- Rampant economic insecurity (triggering an evolved response of "eat a lot, while you still can")

I'm skeptical of scientific progress in this area, because of the near-universal view of obesity as a pure moral failing.


Very interesting thoughts. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
 
2014-06-26 03:01:56 PM  
It's shame we don't feel our streets are safe enough to let our children play unsupervised.

Here's a story on how the play ranges of children have shrunk in three generations.

i.dailymail.co.uk

source
(yes, it's the daily mail, but ...)
 
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