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(Think Progress)   Cops reading your email, recess appointments, protesting abortion clinics, unions and your boss's religion are all on the chopping block today as we quickly come down to the final countdown for SCOTUS   (thinkprogress.org) divider line 82
    More: Interesting, Justice Elena Kagan, nuclear option, acid attacks, Massachusetts law, pro-life, Justice Kennedy, reproductive healths  
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1507 clicks; posted to Politics » on 25 Jun 2014 at 1:32 PM (35 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-06-25 10:55:03 AM  
I see that Cable now has complete free reign since Aereo lost its case.

/Can't get a good antenna signal in the house
 
2014-06-25 11:49:12 AM  
Yeah, they already decided 9-0 that cops can't go into your cell phone without a warrant. The NSA is still free to do anything it wants though.
 
2014-06-25 01:11:36 PM  
If pro-lifers can protest at the doorstep of abortion clinics, then that ends "free-speech zones" isolated away from Republican events.

I want to stand in front of the next Southern Baptist Convention, protesting they hijacked Jesus, holding Him hostage under the baptism bathtub.
 
2014-06-25 01:31:43 PM  
Cops reading your email, recess appointments, protesting abortion clinics, unions and your boss's religion are all on the chopping block today as we quickly come down to the final countdown for SCOTUS

"Did someone call for an encore??"

media11.break.com
 
2014-06-25 01:36:53 PM  
I was reading an article about the cellphone decision and though the Court made a great decision it seems they still struggle with understanding tech. No matter, they understand it enough.
 
2014-06-25 01:41:13 PM  
Somebody was telling me that Scalia is the swing vote on the Hobby Lobby case
 
2014-06-25 01:42:52 PM  

Aar1012: I see that Cable now has complete free reign since Aereo lost its case.

/Can't get a good antenna signal in the house


The Aereo case looked (to me) like a textbook case of "unauthorized rebroadcast and redistribution".  This ruling shouldn't really surprise anyone.
 
2014-06-25 01:43:56 PM  
Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...
 
2014-06-25 01:43:57 PM  
So is the Hobby Lobby decision today or Thursday?
 
2014-06-25 01:46:06 PM  
SCOTUS might get enough work done in three working days to trump everything that Congress has done in this entire session.

And they could really screw up a lot in doing so, too.
 
2014-06-25 01:47:49 PM  

meat0918: So is the Hobby Lobby decision today or Thursday?


There are four decisions left: Hobby Lobby, recess appointments, abortion clinic speech, and public sector union dues. We don't know if they'll all come out tomorrow or if any will be on Monday.
 
2014-06-25 01:48:00 PM  

Aar1012: I see that Cable now has complete free reign since Aereo lost its case.

/Can't get a good antenna signal in the house


Put up your ad blockers and get to surfing, if you want it on TV it's also on the internet.

/was a logical decision based on distribution
 
2014-06-25 01:49:58 PM  
whatever comes itty tomorrow will be released starting at 10 am eastern. If we don't get all four, we'll know the rest are coming Monday at 10.
 
2014-06-25 01:50:15 PM  

dartben: meat0918: So is the Hobby Lobby decision today or Thursday?

There are four decisions left: Hobby Lobby, recess appointments, abortion clinic speech, and public sector union dues. We don't know if they'll all come out tomorrow or if any will be on Monday.


I'm most interested in the first 3- recess appointments is a big one.
 
2014-06-25 01:50:17 PM  

Triple Oak: SCOTUS might get enough work done in three working days to trump everything that Congress has done in this entire session.

And they could really screw up a lot in doing so, too.


Do you think they just started writing the decision when they came into work this morning?
 
2014-06-25 01:50:29 PM  

Walker: Yeah, they already decided 9-0 that cops can't go into your cell phone without a warrant. The NSA is still free to do anything it wants though.


Yeah. That's not bullshiat hyperbole at all. Stop lying.
 
2014-06-25 01:50:36 PM  

dartben: whatever comes itty tomorrow will be released starting at 10 am eastern. If we don't get all four, we'll know the rest are coming Monday at 10.


Comes out, not itty. Stupid auto swipe on the phone.
 
2014-06-25 01:50:48 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-06-25 01:51:55 PM  

Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...


I actually agreed with Aereo.  As a consumer, I can buy all of the parts they have and set up my own system to legally do what they do.  With theirs, as I understand it, I still own everything, but they are simply handling the setup.  If they owned the parts, it would be a different story, but as long as it's my antenna, then the law isn't being broken.
 
2014-06-25 01:52:03 PM  

max_pooper: Triple Oak: SCOTUS might get enough work done in three working days to trump everything that Congress has done in this entire session.

And they could really screw up a lot in doing so, too.

Do you think they just started writing the decision when they came into work this morning?


Just this morning?  No, I'm sure they were up all night drinking instant coffee and popping NoDoz
 
2014-06-25 01:52:14 PM  
The plaintiffs in this case offer three different theories challenging the recess appointments. One argues that such appointments can only be made if a vacancy arises during a brief window that may only last for a few seconds a year. Another argues that recess appointments are invalid unless they are made during this brief window.

OK, I'm confused...

Aren't "can only be done during a certain time" and "invalid unless made during that same certain time" the same farking thing?
 
2014-06-25 01:52:46 PM  

Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...


I agree Aereo should have lost. It was a good ruling too. Their argument was ridiculously tortured. And it's good that SCOTUS said that ruling doesn't set precedent over things like people's cloud storage of their personal files. That was really smart of them.
 
2014-06-25 01:53:09 PM  
In "blind squirrel finds a nut repeat" news, the Supreme Court decides 9-0 that cell phones are "effects" and you kinda need a warrant before searching them
 
2014-06-25 01:55:30 PM  

Mikey1969: The plaintiffs in this case offer three different theories challenging the recess appointments. One argues that such appointments can only be made if a vacancy arises during a brief window that may only last for a few seconds a year. Another argues that recess appointments are invalid unless they are made during this brief window.

OK, I'm confused...

Aren't "can only be done during a certain time" and "invalid unless made during that same certain time" the same farking thing?


The former is saying you can only make it if the vacancy happens during the recess. The latter is saying only the replacement need be appointed during the recess, it doesn't matter when the vacancy occurs.
 
2014-06-25 01:56:05 PM  

Mikey1969: The plaintiffs in this case offer three different theories challenging the recess appointments. One argues that such appointments can only be made if a vacancy arises during a brief window that may only last for a few seconds a year. Another argues that recess appointments are invalid unless they are made during this brief window.

OK, I'm confused...

Aren't "can only be done during a certain time" and "invalid unless made during that same certain time" the same farking thing?


I read the first one as: Recess appointments can only be made if the spot opens up during a recess. So if they're not in recess, the spot opens up, and then they go into recess, there can't be a recess appointment.
 
2014-06-25 01:57:04 PM  

timujin: Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...

I actually agreed with Aereo.  As a consumer, I can buy all of the parts they have and set up my own system to legally do what they do.  With theirs, as I understand it, I still own everything, but they are simply handling the setup.  If they owned the parts, it would be a different story, but as long as it's my antenna, then the law isn't being broken.


The fact that they provide equipment does not mean that they don't also transmit copyrighted material.

Here's the majority opinion in the Aereo case (PDF).
 
2014-06-25 01:58:21 PM  

max_pooper: Triple Oak: SCOTUS might get enough work done in three working days to trump everything that Congress has done in this entire session.

And they could really screw up a lot in doing so, too.

Do you think they just started writing the decision when they came into work this morning?


It's possible. I mean, they could have been thinking about the decisions a long time before writing out a conclusion, but I don't have a ton of hope for the current SCOTUS setup.
 
2014-06-25 01:58:27 PM  
The only one that I am curious about is the recess appts.
 
2014-06-25 01:59:19 PM  

Walker: Yeah, they already decided 9-0 that cops can't go into your cell phone without a warrant. The NSA is still free to do anything it wants though.


And after this ruling, I guarantee that cops will continue to bully street photographers, seize their telephones, and delete their data.

It's already been state case law in all 50 states that says citizens have the right to photograph/video police doing their jobs in public places, but that hasn't stopped them from arresting people for "resisting arrest" or "interfering with an investigation" in order to seize their phones.
 
2014-06-25 01:59:56 PM  
Poor elementary school kids.  I remember being an school and getting recess twice a day at a scheduled time same time, every school day.

These poor kids these days apparently need to make appointments for it now.

/ They probably have to fight an automated voice phone answering system to make the appointments too.
 
2014-06-25 02:00:01 PM  
Here is what I think about free speech and "buffer zones":

"Free speech" - lets you send your message our to other people who also want to hear your message. The government can't block you from saying things and letting other hear what you say. -- HOWEVER how you say it and where you say it can be regulated.

For example- I can't bust into your house at 2am at night and scream in your ear and say I can't be arrested because of "free speech".

This should include allowing others do the things they want to do. Block or interfering with people doing something is NOT free speech, even if your holding signs and shouting things while you do it. So you CAN have laws allowing people access to areas and not allow people their to interfere.

Interfering with others is interfering with others, just because they are saying things or holding signs doesn't change what it is.

Am I saying then conventions should be able to ban protestors interfering with the people entering? YES. These people have rights to not to be interfered with, even if you have something to say and disagree with them.
 
2014-06-25 02:02:02 PM  

timujin: Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...

I actually agreed with Aereo.  As a consumer, I can buy all of the parts they have and set up my own system to legally do what they do.  With theirs, as I understand it, I still own everything, but they are simply handling the setup.  If they owned the parts, it would be a different story, but as long as it's my antenna, then the law isn't being broken.


It's not your equipment. It's theirs.  You're not even renting equipment.  You're renting access to an array of antennas and a network of servers.  None of the equipment is yours nor marked specifically as yours.

Aereo tried to argue that their particular technological setup allowed them to violate the spirit of the law without violating the letter of the law and the Supreme Court said, "Nope, your setup is a process and the law covers processes too."

Even Scalia was saying that Aereo violated the Copyright Act even while he was saying they didn't violate the Copyright Act in the one specific way that was presented before the Court.
 
2014-06-25 02:03:19 PM  

timujin: Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...

I actually agreed with Aereo.  As a consumer, I can buy all of the parts they have and set up my own system to legally do what they do.  With theirs, as I understand it, I still own everything, but they are simply handling the setup.  If they owned the parts, it would be a different story, but as long as it's my antenna, then the law isn't being broken.


As I understand it, Aereo does own all the parts.  They rent access to them dynamically.  If they were, say, to sell/rent an antenna+DVR setup to you such that no other person ever used it when you weren't using it, they might have had a better argument.  Then it would be more akin to how a Slingbox works.

Under their current setup, Aereo is (or was) basically a cable company hiding behind legal technicalities, and the Court called them on their bullshiat.  Even Scalia, in dissenting, said they were breaking the law in spirit, just not technically, and only dissented because he believes it is Congress's role to close the loophole rather than the Court's.
 
2014-06-25 02:05:38 PM  

Corvus: Here is what I think about free speech and "buffer zones":

"Free speech" - lets you send your message our to other people who also want to hear your message. The government can't block you from saying things and letting other hear what you say. -- HOWEVER how you say it and where you say it can be regulated.

For example- I can't bust into your house at 2am at night and scream in your ear and say I can't be arrested because of "free speech".

This should include allowing others do the things they want to do. Block or interfering with people doing something is NOT free speech, even if your holding signs and shouting things while you do it. So you CAN have laws allowing people access to areas and not allow people their to interfere.

Interfering with others is interfering with others, just because they are saying things or holding signs doesn't change what it is.

Am I saying then conventions should be able to ban protestors interfering with the people entering? YES. These people have rights to not to be interfered with, even if you have something to say and disagree with them.



Even if SCOTUS fudges this one, blocking a public entrance or exit to a business is still a violation of fire codes in pretty much everyjurisdiction.

/Or is that their plan since they like torching the places?
 
2014-06-25 02:07:15 PM  
the Supreme Court calendar is bullshiat.  every other federal court runs 24/7/365, these 9 regard the ass end of June through "the first monday in october" as some kind of birthright.  and, since they hear so few cases all things considered, they have perhaps the lightest caseload in the entirety of the federal system.   there's no reason they can't work through summer instead of taking is the proverbial birthright to have those 3 - 3.5 months off.
 
2014-06-25 02:08:12 PM  

dartben: meat0918: So is the Hobby Lobby decision today or Thursday?

There are four decisions left: Hobby Lobby, recess appointments, abortion clinic speech, and public sector union dues. We don't know if they'll all come out tomorrow or if any will be on Monday.


The union one is why I think our teacher's union is getting farked when they agreed to drop a proposed tax increase to fund education if the anti-union people dropped their proposal to basically do what I figure SCOTUS will do and gut union dues.
 
2014-06-25 02:11:39 PM  

qorkfiend: timujin: Cyclometh: Everything I've heard  so far seems to be pretty logical- Aereo should have lost, because even if the law sucks they weren't arguing against the law, only that they weren't breaking it, which is laughably untrue.

And good on the cellphone issue. Still waiting to hear about the rest...

I actually agreed with Aereo.  As a consumer, I can buy all of the parts they have and set up my own system to legally do what they do.  With theirs, as I understand it, I still own everything, but they are simply handling the setup.  If they owned the parts, it would be a different story, but as long as it's my antenna, then the law isn't being broken.

The fact that they provide equipment does not mean that they don't also transmit copyrighted material.

Here's the majority opinion in the Aereo case (PDF).


Right, but that's my point.  I could buy the same equipment and transmit it to myself legally, right?  If not, slingbox would be illegal.
 
2014-06-25 02:12:13 PM  
If the Court kills the recess appointments power the Senate will have the unilateral power to suspend workers' rights that stretch back to the Franklin Roosevelt Administration simply by refusing to confirm anyone to the NLRB.


i.imgur.com
 
2014-06-25 02:13:05 PM  

wxboy: Under their current setup, Aereo is (or was) basically a cable company hiding behind legal technicalities, and the Court called them on their bullshiat.


I wonder what Aereo does now... do they just call a meeting and say, "Well folks, it's been nice, here's a number you can give to prospective employers if they ask for a reference. Please, last one out hit the lights." Do they have a backup plan or is this it for them?
 
2014-06-25 02:13:51 PM  

qorkfiend: The fact that they provide equipment does not mean that they don't also transmit copyrighted material.

Here's the majority opinion in the Aereo case (PDF).



Vox article on why it is not as clear cut as you state.
http://www.vox.com/2014/6/25/5841820/the-supreme-courts-aereo-decisi on -could-endanger-cloud-storage


Cable company Cablevision had developed a "remote storage DVR," a system located in Cablevision's server room that allowed customers to record and play back content. Content companies sued, arguing that the system infringed its copyright.
In 2008, the Second Circuit disagreed. The court ruled that because customers, not Cablevision, decided which programs to record or play back, the customer was responsible for copyright issues.



Today's ruling essentially nullifies the 2008 ruling, and their rationale is essentially "because reasons".
 
2014-06-25 02:14:52 PM  

Aar1012: I see that Cable now has complete free reign since Aereo lost its case.

/Can't get a good antenna signal in the house


I'm pretty far away from Orlando/Daytona transmitters  (call it ~50 mines over flat Florida terrine.
Trigger by a comment on Fark, I decided to buy a Mohu Leaf 50 antenna, and I was surprised at the number of channels I could get.  Over 30.

Sure most of the are languages I don't speak, or religions I don't care about (or shopping channel), still there was more that enough to justify a $60 one time payment over the monthly satellite TV ransom.

Someday I'll ignore my kid's addiction to Cartoon Network, and my Wife's to Animal Planet and just ditch the DirecTv.

/Oddly it had looked like they did the $5 bumb thing this year during the rates-raising season.  But it seems to have silently returned to the previous rate (without direct warnings form me)

Maybe my absolute refusal to lease new equipment (free with 2 year contract) to resolve a technical issue worried them enough.  But because that would take reading between the lines, I sort of doubt it.

/Had a set top box going bad that affected the LNB in the dish.   Swapping equipment between two systems around proved it was the box.   Bought new-in-box exact model replacement (15 years obsolete) off Amazon for $20.  Problem solved.
 
2014-06-25 02:15:46 PM  

meat0918: dartben: meat0918: So is the Hobby Lobby decision today or Thursday?

There are four decisions left: Hobby Lobby, recess appointments, abortion clinic speech, and public sector union dues. We don't know if they'll all come out tomorrow or if any will be on Monday.

The union one is why I think our teacher's union is getting farked when they agreed to drop a proposed tax increase to fund education if the anti-union people dropped their proposal to basically do what I figure SCOTUS will do and gut union dues.


I wouldn't count on scotus gutting it. There's three left from January, and the presumption is Roberts is writing the recess appointments one. Alito and Breyer don't have opinions from January. Presuming Alito gets the free speech one, Breyer would then have the union one.

Of course that's just reading tea leaves, and who knows what will really happen.
 
2014-06-25 02:16:56 PM  

incendi: wxboy: Under their current setup, Aereo is (or was) basically a cable company hiding behind legal technicalities, and the Court called them on their bullshiat.

I wonder what Aereo does now... do they just call a meeting and say, "Well folks, it's been nice, here's a number you can give to prospective employers if they ask for a reference. Please, last one out hit the lights." Do they have a backup plan or is this it for them?


Presumably they can still make licensing or content deals with the content providers. Whether or not the content providers will be willing to play ball is another matter entirely.
 
2014-06-25 02:17:21 PM  

Cubicle Jockey: In 2008, the Second Circuit disagreed. The court ruled that because customers, not Cablevision, decided which programs to record or play back, the customer was responsible for copyright issues.


No that's very different.
 
2014-06-25 02:18:16 PM  

Cubicle Jockey: qorkfiend: The fact that they provide equipment does not mean that they don't also transmit copyrighted material.

Here's the majority opinion in the Aereo case (PDF).


Vox article on why it is not as clear cut as you state.
http://www.vox.com/2014/6/25/5841820/the-supreme-courts-aereo-decisi on -could-endanger-cloud-storage


Cable company Cablevision had developed a "remote storage DVR," a system located in Cablevision's server room that allowed customers to record and play back content. Content companies sued, arguing that the system infringed its copyright.
In 2008, the Second Circuit disagreed. The court ruled that because customers, not Cablevision, decided which programs to record or play back, the customer was responsible for copyright issues.


Today's ruling essentially nullifies the 2008 ruling, and their rationale is essentially "because reasons".


Yes yes, we've been hearing ever since the beginning that ruling against Aereo will mean that cloud storage is illegal.
 
2014-06-25 02:25:28 PM  

qorkfiend: Yes yes, we've been hearing ever since the beginning that ruling against Aereo will mean that cloud storage is illegal.


and SCOTUS specifically said that's not true. This is not cloud storage. They were taking all the content then dolling it out to others. People were not hosting their data on their systems.
 
2014-06-25 02:31:36 PM  

dartben: Mikey1969: The plaintiffs in this case offer three different theories challenging the recess appointments. One argues that such appointments can only be made if a vacancy arises during a brief window that may only last for a few seconds a year. Another argues that recess appointments are invalid unless they are made during this brief window.

OK, I'm confused...

Aren't "can only be done during a certain time" and "invalid unless made during that same certain time" the same farking thing?

The former is saying you can only make it if the vacancy happens during the recess. The latter is saying only the replacement need be appointed during the recess, it doesn't matter when the vacancy occurs.


TheSopwithTurtle: Mikey1969: The plaintiffs in this case offer three different theories challenging the recess appointments. One argues that such appointments can only be made if a vacancy arises during a brief window that may only last for a few seconds a year. Another argues that recess appointments are invalid unless they are made during this brief window.

OK, I'm confused...

Aren't "can only be done during a certain time" and "invalid unless made during that same certain time" the same farking thing?

I read the first one as: Recess appointments can only be made if the spot opens up during a recess. So if they're not in recess, the spot opens up, and then they go into recess, there can't be a recess appointment.


OK, that makes more sense... Thanks!
 
2014-06-25 02:35:40 PM  

incendi: I wonder what Aereo does now... do they just call a meeting and say, "Well folks, it's been nice, here's a number you can give to prospective employers if they ask for a reference. Please, last one out hit the lights." Do they have a backup plan or is this it for them?


From their  blog:

"We are disappointed in the outcome, but our work is not done.  We will continue to fight for our consumers and fight to create innovative technologies that have a meaningful and positive impact on our world."

Sounds like they don't know yet.
 
2014-06-25 02:42:52 PM  

Frozboz: incendi: I wonder what Aereo does now... do they just call a meeting and say, "Well folks, it's been nice, here's a number you can give to prospective employers if they ask for a reference. Please, last one out hit the lights." Do they have a backup plan or is this it for them?

From their  blog:

"We are disappointed in the outcome, but our work is not done.  We will continue to fight for our consumers and fight to create innovative technologies that have a meaningful and positive impact on our world."

Sounds like they don't know yet.


I find it funny that they call "Taking other peoples copyrighted works, distributing it to paying customers, but not paying those who own the copyright"  innovative.
 
2014-06-25 02:46:00 PM  

jst3p: I find it funny that they call "Taking other peoples copyrighted works, distributing it to paying customers, but not paying those who own the copyright" innovative.


Like UPS should pay a copy license fee when it delivers a DVD sold from Amazon?
 
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