If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Globe and Mail)   "Liberal arts is the future of work. In the 21st century knowledge economy, communication, collaboration, and creativity are the most valuable commodities - precisely those skills a liberal arts education provides"   (theglobeandmail.com) divider line 104
    More: Unlikely, knowledge economy, arts, Conference Board Of Canada, grade inflation, economic malaise, degree programs, National University of Singapore, Chinese University of Hong Kong  
•       •       •

527 clicks; posted to Business » on 12 May 2014 at 12:18 PM (18 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



104 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-05-12 10:44:19 AM
I always get a kick out of liberal arts majors bragging about how they meet all the basic core competency requirements that are, in fact, expected of all college graduates.

Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!
 
2014-05-12 10:53:22 AM

Xcott: Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!



The skill of writing cannot be understated. One of the first things you learn when you leave post-secondary and start a career is that writing is probably the most critical skill you can have.

There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that English 3363 (technical writing) was the single most important class of my entire university education.
 
2014-05-12 11:29:26 AM

Rev.K: The skill of writing cannot be understated. One of the first things you learn when you leave post-secondary and start a career is that writing is probably the most critical skill you can have.


Yes, absolutely.  That is why all college students, not just liberal arts majors, have to satisfy Gen-Ed and core competency requirements in composition, and take Gen-Ed courses that require written assignments.

The issue is not the importance of the coursework, but the assumption that this is some specialty only found among liberal arts majors---rather than a basic university-wide requirement.
 
2014-05-12 12:21:12 PM
Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none
 
2014-05-12 12:21:59 PM
I always chuckle when Fark College threads turn into a bunch of people talking about how everyone should study engineering, and every other degree is useless.

That's what people said 15 years ago about going to law school.
 
2014-05-12 12:23:16 PM
The point of the article has eluded some people... Probably because they spent too much time in STEM classes.
 
2014-05-12 12:25:21 PM

Brontes: Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none


confoundedinterest.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-05-12 12:26:20 PM

Psylence: The point of the article has eluded some people... Probably because they spent too much time in STEM classes.


Project Management as a profession exists for this reason.
 
2014-05-12 12:26:27 PM

Xcott: Yes, absolutely.  That is why all college students, not just liberal arts majors, have to satisfy Gen-Ed and core competency requirements in composition, and take Gen-Ed courses that require written assignments.

The issue is not the importance of the coursework, but the assumption that this is some specialty only found among liberal arts majors---rather than a basic university-wide requirement.


Liberal Arts students don't just take the required intro jerkoff course and quit (we took advance jerk-off courses).   I had to TA during grad school and even the people that pass the core competency requirements could barely farking write.

/Philosophy and Poli Sci major, Comparative Politics MA
//Do quite well in a field that has nothing to do with my major, but it did help me with communications skills which are far more valuable than technical skills.
 
2014-05-12 12:27:26 PM
Liberal arts college != liberal arts major.
I went to a liberal arts college. Everyone there also made fun of the liberal arts majors.
 
2014-05-12 12:28:44 PM

Xarian0: Liberal arts college != liberal arts major.
I went to a liberal arts college. Everyone there also made fun of the liberal arts majors.


I guess people paying out the ass for private school for an undergradute degree need someone to vent on..
 
2014-05-12 12:34:00 PM
It will really helpful when you can communicate and collaborate the shiat out of all that stuff that you don't farking understand.

We'll have a seat ready for you.
i1.ytimg.com
 
2014-05-12 12:36:58 PM

Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: It will really helpful when you can communicate and collaborate the shiat out of all that stuff that you don't farking understand.


Fortunately very few of the engineers and IT monkeys have figured out how to bathe, groom and appropriately dress themselves, let alone how to communicate to other human beings effectively - thus creating plenty of lucrative, often better paying, and lower stress jobs than the people who went to technical degrees so that they could support their betters.
 
2014-05-12 12:38:04 PM

Brontes: Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none


Most people who run things in Washington DC have Liberal Arts degrees.
 
2014-05-12 12:42:32 PM
O Romeo, Romeo! wherefore art thou Romeo? Thine grande double espresso awaiteth thee!
 
2014-05-12 12:45:47 PM
Recognizing there is at least some limit to how much you can expect a 4 or 5-yr engineering or science undergraduate degree to cover, I'm generally ok with the limited emphasis placed on communication.  I just wish the professors would make it clear that communication is an important component of most people's careers and that it is a skill that should continually be worked on.  Poorly written reports are aggrevating, but nothing pisses me off more than handing back a report with edits and having the author respond, "I'm not a writer".
 
2014-05-12 12:49:17 PM

Brontes: Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none

fun

FTFY

Rev.K: There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that English 3363 (technical writing) was the single most important class of my entire university education.


agreed. The story we were always told was that our engineers were such terrible writers coming out of college that the University made it mandatory that all engineers had to take Tech. Comm. (ENL 266 for me).

I honestly enjoyed that class. Lots of writing but all on interesting stuff. Plus, my professor was an awesome guy. Really made me think about what I was writing and how to argue effectively, which I've probably forgotten since I've been on Fark for so long :D

/wrote a paper on the likelihood of nuclear power returning to America
//this was the summer before Fukishima....
 
2014-05-12 12:51:43 PM

Xcott: I always get a kick out of liberal arts majors bragging about how they meet all the basic core competency requirements that are, in fact, expected of all college graduates.

Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!


Other majors have GPA requirements?
 
2014-05-12 12:51:54 PM

AngryDragon: O Romeo, Romeo! wherefore art thou Romeo? Thine grande double espresso awaiteth thee!


The third person archaic singular of "to await" is "awaitest". You're using the second-person singular.

Also, "wherefore" means "why", so it makes no sense to offer the person a coffee in the context of this statement.
 
2014-05-12 12:52:20 PM
Given that we are moving more and more into a service economy I agree with subby that a lib arts degree will be more helpful for the growing amount of jobs that need to be able to ask "want fries with that" in 2 maybe 3 different languages.
 
2014-05-12 12:53:31 PM

lilplatinum: Fortunately very few of the engineers and IT monkeys have figured out how to bathe, groom and appropriately dress themselves, let alone how to communicate to other human beings effectively


BURRRRNNNNNN!!!!

mcreadyblue: Most people who run things in Washington DC have Liberal Arts degrees.


BURRRRRRNNNNNNNNN!!!!!1!
 
2014-05-12 12:53:48 PM

Xcott: I always get a kick out of liberal arts majors bragging about how they meet all the basic core competency requirements that are, in fact, expected of all college graduates.

Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!


In other words, four more years of high school.
 
2014-05-12 12:54:07 PM

lilplatinum: Nonrepeating Rotating Binary: It will really helpful when you can communicate and collaborate the shiat out of all that stuff that you don't farking understand.

Fortunately very few of the engineers and IT monkeys have figured out how to bathe, groom and appropriately dress themselves, let alone how to communicate to other human beings effectively - thus creating plenty of lucrative, often better paying, and lower stress jobs than the people who went to technical degrees so that they could support their betters.


Speaking as a Communication major-cum-Support Manager-cum-Tech Writer, I'm getting a kick. Geeks being bad at writing/speaking to non-Geeks means twice the employment opportunities for me!
 
2014-05-12 12:59:15 PM

Nuclear Monk: Recognizing there is at least some limit to how much you can expect a 4 or 5-yr engineering or science undergraduate degree to cover, I'm generally ok with the limited emphasis placed on communication.  I just wish the professors would make it clear that communication is an important component of most people's careers and that it is a skill that should continually be worked on.  Poorly written reports are aggrevating, but nothing pisses me off more than handing back a report with edits and having the author respond, "I'm not a writer".


Communication is a vital skill in engineering. The guy who can't string together a coherent sentence will never win a contract for his company, much less be able to successfully negotiate an extra or defend a controversial decision in a client meeting.

Or even really have a clue what he's doing beyond blindly applying the design formulas he looks up in a book.

I mean, I guess it's okay for most engineers to spend their entire lives as overpaid, disposable, glorified technicians working from redline markups, but at least a few of them need to know how to write persuasively and effectively.
 
2014-05-12 01:00:47 PM

Suckmaster Burstingfoam: I mean, I guess it's okay for most engineers to spend their entire lives as overpaid, disposable, glorified technicians working from redline markups, but at least a few of them need to know how to write persuasively and effectively.


Those are the ones that can actually bank.
 
2014-05-12 01:02:23 PM
And the skilled tradesmen are sitting on their 6-figure salaries and no-college-debt laughing at all of us idiots.
 
2014-05-12 01:10:48 PM

Saiga410: Given that we are moving more and more into a service economy I agree with subby that a lib arts degree will be more helpful for the growing amount of jobs that need to be able to ask "want fries with that" in 2 maybe 3 different languages.


I find no hubris sadder than a farker/engineer thinking they've got it made, and laughing at the non-engineers who got different degrees.

Then those same farkers are on the job threads complaining about training their H1-B replacement.

An engineer is always one bad quarter away from having their job shipped to India. Never forget that.
 
2014-05-12 01:11:05 PM
Liberal arts degrees are absolutely vital to our society. If we did not have them, where would we get the waitstaff from?
 
2014-05-12 01:13:43 PM
Or maybe society just needs a well educated and diverse population in order to have a robust and competetive economy, and having highly qualified people in all sorts of disciplines is a good thing?
 
2014-05-12 01:15:43 PM

GoldSpider: And the skilled tradesmen are sitting on their 6-figure salaries and no-college-debt laughing at all of us idiots.


Ah yes, the tradesmen who are always one injury away from appying for an EBT and SSI.

/I just don't think the people who crow about STEM and trade schools understand how bad the owner class has everyone by the balls.
//That's the real problem here, not the type of degree or license you get.
 
2014-05-12 01:17:02 PM
24.media.tumblr.com
 
2014-05-12 01:17:53 PM
Valuable =/= remunerative.
 
2014-05-12 01:29:40 PM
verbal toxin: /I just don't think the people who crow about STEM and trade schools understand how bad the owner class has everyone by the balls.
//That's the real problem here, not the type of degree or license you get.


It still beats the impotent rage of living as an unemployable liberal arts major.
 
2014-05-12 01:30:30 PM

somedude210: Rev.K: There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that English 3363 (technical writing) was the single most important class of my entire university education.

agreed. The story we were always told was that our engineers were such terrible writers coming out of college that the University made it mandatory that all engineers had to take Tech. Comm. (ENL 266 for me).


I agree.  Graduates have to be good writers and communicators; they should know how to dig up information, write clear informative sentences and well-organized essays, make a compelling argument, and analyze the written work of other people.  It was absolutely vital that I took all those writing courses in grades 9-12.
 
2014-05-12 01:33:44 PM
Gud communicasion is over-rated; (BSEE)
 
2014-05-12 01:34:00 PM
Is this the thread where STEM majors complain about the idiots at their companies who make more money than they do just because they can use corporate buzzwords?

/math major
//from a liberal arts college
///took many humanities courses
////humanities courses have made me much better at communication
 
2014-05-12 01:35:23 PM

mcreadyblue: Brontes: Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none

Most people who run things in Washington DC have Liberal Arts degrees.


Pro Tip - Pointing out the most corrupt and dysfuntional city and the people who get the lowest approval ratings as a shining example of a LA degree isn't helping.
 
2014-05-12 01:39:59 PM

Rev.K: Xcott: Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!


The skill of writing cannot be understated. One of the first things you learn when you leave post-secondary and start a career is that writing is probably the most critical skill you can have.

There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that English 3363 (technical writing) was the single most important class of my entire university education.


Writing is overrated.  Engineers are all Indian or Chinese now, anyway.
 
2014-05-12 01:43:23 PM

RumsfeldsReplacement: ////humanities courses have made me much better at communication


humanities may make you a better human being too

/at least those ethics classes
 
2014-05-12 01:50:38 PM

jaybeezey: mcreadyblue: Brontes: Liberal arts majors are a jack-of-no-trades, master of none

Most people who run things in Washington DC have Liberal Arts degrees.

Pro Tip - Pointing out the most corrupt and dysfuntional city and the people who get the lowest approval ratings as a shining example of a LA degree isn't helping.


Pro? So you have a liberal arts degree?
 
2014-05-12 01:51:01 PM

listernine: Liberal arts degrees are absolutely vital to our society. If we did not have them, where would we get the waitstaff from?


Actors waiting on that first big break.
 
2014-05-12 02:07:55 PM

Xcott: somedude210: Rev.K: There's absolutely no doubt in my mind that English 3363 (technical writing) was the single most important class of my entire university education.

agreed. The story we were always told was that our engineers were such terrible writers coming out of college that the University made it mandatory that all engineers had to take Tech. Comm. (ENL 266 for me).

I agree.  Graduates have to be good writers and communicators; they should know how to dig up information, write clear informative sentences and well-organized essays, make a compelling argument, and analyze the written work of other people.  It was absolutely vital that I took all those writing courses in grades 9-12.


Earlier today, you were in a thread where several people were arguing with you because your original post wasn't precise enough.  Just passing high school doesn't automatically make you an expert communicator.
 
2014-05-12 02:09:06 PM

somedude210: RumsfeldsReplacement: ////humanities courses have made me much better at communication

humanities may make you a better human being too

/at least those ethics classes


"Better human beings" tend to suffer financially.  Probably because they learn things like ethics.

It reminds me of a Chinese kid who came to the US for college, went back thinking that he would run a clean business, no bribes, no graft...  He failed miserably.  The US school taught him precisely the wrong lessons for success in business.

He finally realized, after a few years, that "A fish cannot change the water that he swims in.  If the water is dirty, he still must swim."

Does that sound like the kind of place for a good human being?
 
2014-05-12 02:10:08 PM
If you can't write a coherent sentence, I also wonder if you can think clearly. Can you put together the different measurements and formulas necessary to making sure that whatever you're engineering will work as planned, and not accidentally kill anybody?
 
2014-05-12 02:11:23 PM

sendtodave: He finally realized, after a few years, that "A fish cannot change the water that he swims in.  If the water is dirty, he still must swim."


He probably should have realized that people are not fish and left China...
 
2014-05-12 02:15:03 PM

lilplatinum: sendtodave: He finally realized, after a few years, that "A fish cannot change the water that he swims in.  If the water is dirty, he still must swim."

He probably should have realized that people are not fish and left China...


We are about as helpless as fish.
 
2014-05-12 02:17:06 PM

sendtodave: lilplatinum: sendtodave: He finally realized, after a few years, that "A fish cannot change the water that he swims in.  If the water is dirty, he still must swim."

He probably should have realized that people are not fish and left China...

We are about as helpless as fish.


As farked as things can be in our country, I can testify firsthand that going from China to the west would be a pretty serious change of water.
 
2014-05-12 02:27:47 PM

lilplatinum: sendtodave: lilplatinum: sendtodave: He finally realized, after a few years, that "A fish cannot change the water that he swims in.  If the water is dirty, he still must swim."

He probably should have realized that people are not fish and left China...

We are about as helpless as fish.

As farked as things can be in our country, I can testify firsthand that going from China to the west would be a pretty serious change of water.


And then going back?

I mean, I'm pretty sure he was sent to school in the US to be able to compete favorably against other Chinese. To make money...  Not to acquire morals.

His problem was he actually listened to his liberal teachers, instead of just getting the sheepskin, and going back and acting like a big shot.

I think the same could be said of American students.  You will have a harder time competing if you care overly much about other people.
 
2014-05-12 02:36:07 PM

Xcott: I always get a kick out of liberal arts majors bragging about how they meet all the basic core competency requirements that are, in fact, expected of all college graduates.

Liberal arts majors are well-rounded!  They have to take courses in math, science, history, humanities, aesthetics, even gym!  They learn how to read and write and think!  They spend a whole four years in college, and have to meet a grueling 2.0 GPA requirement!  Some of their classes have attendance policies!


I HATE "liberal arts" as a "major". I hate it with a purple passion. I want to force-feed it upon its own genitals, cut out with a rusty spoon, washed down by boiling vinegar. That would just be the attention-grabber. I despise it to the core of my very being. Why have I this difficulty with the "liberal arts major"? I went to a school that did not have a "liberal arts major". It was (and is) a competitive, difficult, and respectable liberal arts college. It's hard to get into and hard to finish. It awards a "Bachelor of Arts" in all its majors, regardless of the subject, because that's what it's awarded for centuries. I had to do actual laboratory research, write papers, and present to get my little BA in biology--a lot more than what's expected from state-run diploma factories that call themselves "universities".* Nevertheless, because I went to a school that bills itself as "liberal arts" and I got a BA, there are idiots who think that it means there's no way I could understand science, NEVER MIND that I've got more professional lab research papers published than those idiots have ever READ their entire lives, NEVER MIND that I've been part of writing (successful) NIH projects. Never mind any of that. Why? Because of the God-damned "liberal arts major", which is a sucky little major created for sucky little people who couldn't handle a real academic challenge to save their own lives.
 
2014-05-12 02:41:36 PM
sendtodave:
His problem was he actually listened to his liberal teachers, instead of just getting the sheepskin, and going back and acting like a big shot.

I think the same could be said of American students.  You will have a harder time competing if you care overly much about other people.


You can be an ethical employer and human being in America and still be successful in business, I know of many individuals who do it.  Hell, in international shipping we deal with shady motherfarkers from various third world shiatholes on a daily basis, and yet most of us don't play on their level and are still employed.  shiat, my dad's been doing business in Shanghai for 8 years ore or less on the up and up.

He'd likely have a hard time being on the up and up consistantly in China as a Chinese citizen, but if you are wealthy enough to come to America for school you are generally able to get out of the country if you need to.
 
Displayed 50 of 104 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report