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(The Raw Story)   "The moral panic du jour for my lifetime has been video games, and that panic has been just as stupid and fact-deprived as the rest of them. It started with pinball arcades and, boy, does it offer some perspective on the current panics"   (rawstory.com) divider line 123
    More: Interesting, moral panics, video arcades, video games, video game panics  
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5385 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 May 2014 at 1:30 PM (28 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-05-10 02:32:55 PM  

Dafatone: frepnog: Don't Troll Me Bro!: That used to crack me up so bad

as a die hard metal head and child of the 80's it didn't crack me up.  It pissed me off, to the point that to this day I can't bring myself to vote for a democrat.

Well, that's dumb.


nope.  it's always the same shiat from them, and fark the government.
 
2014-05-10 02:33:06 PM  
Hey step up and play each machine seemed to say,as I walked round and round the penny arcade
Just ring the bell on the big bagatelle and you'll make all those colored lights get gay



See, games make you gay.
 
2014-05-10 02:34:00 PM  

DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.


So, what do you do to let loose?  Write and submit papers about set theory to peer-reviewed journals?
 
2014-05-10 02:34:10 PM  
This link is to an aggregator (Rawstory) that's to another aggregator that lifted a bunch of stuff from the original story in Reason. Nice.
 
2014-05-10 02:35:22 PM  

GirlScoutSniper: On a Saturday night and that's trouble,
Yes you got lots and lots of trouble.
I'm thinkin' of the kids in the knickerbockers, 
Shirt-tail young ones, peekin' in the pool 
Hall window after school, ya got trouble, folks! 
Right here in River City. 
Trouble with a capital "T"
And that rhymes with "P" and that stands for pool!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LI_Oe-jtgdI


I used to like to play pool, but then my mother made me take up the clarinet and join the local boy's band.
 
2014-05-10 02:35:30 PM  
While I thought all these video game panics were nonsense at the time, the truth is games have gotten increasingly violent and realistic.  During the same period, school shootings and other kid on kid violence have grown more intense.  I'm not saying they've grown more prevalent -- kids have always been terrible to other kids -- but the level of violence we've seen has ratcheted up.

Do I have proof that this isn't a correlation without causation?  No.

Do I have statistics?  No.

Do I think it's possible that at least some of the moral failures that people thought would come about because of these violent games have now come about?  Yes, I do.
 
2014-05-10 02:36:24 PM  

Jake Havechek: I was not allowed to go to video arcades as a kid because "drugs were sold there".

My reply was,"so what, they're sold in school, too".

Parents do not like the truth.


Hah, what'd they have to say then?
 
2014-05-10 02:39:19 PM  

Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

So, what do you do to let loose?  Write and submit papers about set theory to peer-reviewed journals?


I am not speaking of the people who require leisure to continue their already admirable endeavors. I am thinking of the individuals who by their own talents would be able to contribute to the the advance of humanity but do not because of their preoccupation with entertainment.
 
2014-05-10 02:42:10 PM  
The games aren't making kids stabby, just fat.
 
2014-05-10 02:46:43 PM  

DubtodaIll: Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

So, what do you do to let loose?  Write and submit papers about set theory to peer-reviewed journals?

I am not speaking of the people who require leisure to continue their already admirable endeavors. I am thinking of the individuals who by their own talents would be able to contribute to the the advance of humanity but do not because of their preoccupation with entertainment.


If they made the decision to waste their talent, they'd find some other way if video games weren't around.
 
2014-05-10 02:47:19 PM  

frepnog: Dafatone: frepnog: Don't Troll Me Bro!: That used to crack me up so bad

as a die hard metal head and child of the 80's it didn't crack me up.  It pissed me off, to the point that to this day I can't bring myself to vote for a democrat.

Well, that's dumb.

nope.  it's always the same shiat from them, and fark the government.


Vote for who you want.  But don't point to something from 30 years ago as if it's relevant today.

20 years ago, Republicans pushed the healthcare plan that they're currently up in arms about.  By your logic, none of their supporters from 20 years ago should vote for them.

/which is actually pretty solid logic, but...
 
2014-05-10 02:52:09 PM  

Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

So, what do you do to let loose?  Write and submit papers about set theory to peer-reviewed journals?

I am not speaking of the people who require leisure to continue their already admirable endeavors. I am thinking of the individuals who by their own talents would be able to contribute to the the advance of humanity but do not because of their preoccupation with entertainment.

If they made the decision to waste their talent, they'd find some other way if video games weren't around.


100% of those affected?
 
2014-05-10 02:54:13 PM  

Warthog: Do I think it's possible that at least some of the moral failures that people thought would come about because of these violent games have now come about? Yes, I do.


you are wrong.  school shootings happen because of the "fame", and it has NOTHING to do with video games.

The colombine kids didn't really even PLAY the damn things.  They just tried to use Doom (and then Marilyn Manson) as scapegoats.

Troubled people do troubled things. Overall, violence is DOWN.
 
2014-05-10 02:59:28 PM  

Dafatone: frepnog: Dafatone: frepnog: Don't Troll Me Bro!: That used to crack me up so bad

as a die hard metal head and child of the 80's it didn't crack me up.  It pissed me off, to the point that to this day I can't bring myself to vote for a democrat.

Well, that's dumb.

nope.  it's always the same shiat from them, and fark the government.

Vote for who you want.  But don't point to something from 30 years ago as if it's relevant today.

20 years ago, Republicans pushed the healthcare plan that they're currently up in arms about.  By your logic, none of their supporters from 20 years ago should vote for them.

/which is actually pretty solid logic, but...


democrats supported and STILL farking support censorship.  I can not.  So they will not get my vote.  Ever.
 
2014-05-10 03:00:43 PM  

DubtodaIll: Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: Don't Troll Me Bro!: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

So, what do you do to let loose?  Write and submit papers about set theory to peer-reviewed journals?

I am not speaking of the people who require leisure to continue their already admirable endeavors. I am thinking of the individuals who by their own talents would be able to contribute to the the advance of humanity but do not because of their preoccupation with entertainment.

If they made the decision to waste their talent, they'd find some other way if video games weren't around.

100% of those affected?


You can say the same thing about fishing, sex, shooting pool, bowling, or just about any other leisure activity.  Maybe if _____ didn't exist some of the people that are completely wrapped up in it would have ended up the next Bernoulli or Bach, but most of them would simply find another way to spend their time.
 
2014-05-10 03:02:01 PM  

DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.


Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!
 
2014-05-10 03:04:37 PM  

Warthog: While I thought all these video game panics were nonsense at the time, the truth is games have gotten increasingly violent and realistic.  During the same period, school shootings and other kid on kid violence have grown more intense.  I'm not saying they've grown more prevalent -- kids have always been terrible to other kids -- but the level of violence we've seen has ratcheted up.

Do I have proof that this isn't a correlation without causation?  No.

Do I have statistics?  No.

Do I think it's possible that at least some of the moral failures that people thought would come about because of these violent games have now come about?  Yes, I do.


cdn.thedailybeast.com
 
2014-05-10 03:05:37 PM  

gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!


The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.
 
2014-05-10 03:06:00 PM  

DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.


It's acceptable because it's necessary for our sanity.

A constantly wound spring will break from the strain. You have to let it loose occasionally to get any work out of it.

What I don't get is wasting huge amounts of resources on "professional" sports and athletes. We'd all be better off if we spent those resources to play sports instead of watch them. And no professional athlete is more valuable or should be celebrated more than the multitudes of professions that make society work, like teachers, soldiers, doctors, firemen, etc. Hell, even a garbage collector is more valuable to society than a professional athlete.
 
2014-05-10 03:15:35 PM  

DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.


What exactly do you think pushes the development of faster/smarter/smaller computers, or 3D modeling/CGI?
 
2014-05-10 03:18:45 PM  

Boudyro: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

It's acceptable because it's necessary for our sanity.

A constantly wound spring will break from the strain. You have to let it loose occasionally to get any work out of it.

What I don't get is wasting huge amounts of resources on "professional" sports and athletes. We'd all be better off if we spent those resources to play sports instead of watch them. And no professional athlete is more valuable or should be celebrated more than the multitudes of professions that make society work, like teachers, soldiers, doctors, firemen, etc. Hell, even a garbage collector is more valuable to society than a professional athlete.


Now,now that athlete would make a wonderful garbage collector, even without the steroids.
 
2014-05-10 03:21:16 PM  

stonelotus: "du jour for my lifetime"?


He's lived a very short life.

/+1 funny from me, very subtle. :)
 
2014-05-10 03:22:19 PM  

Boudyro: DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.

What exactly do you think pushes the development of faster/smarter/smaller computers, or 3D modeling/CGI?


People who aren't playing games all day though filling a demand of the market.
 
2014-05-10 03:22:44 PM  
My parents let me go see Alice Cooper with friends at age 13 in 1969, albeit with much discussion and trepidation.

Second concert. First was a week or so before, Sly and the Family Stone. Same thing, different reasons. They weren't racist, it was the times and the recent racial riots.
 
2014-05-10 03:28:40 PM  

JasonOfOrillia: I played D&D as a kid.  I've murdered hardly anyone.


Exactly!
What about all those people I didn't murder?
 
2014-05-10 03:28:58 PM  

DubtodaIll: Boudyro: DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.

What exactly do you think pushes the development of faster/smarter/smaller computers, or 3D modeling/CGI?

People who aren't playing games all day though filling a demand of the market.


And who created that demand they are filling?
 
2014-05-10 03:30:28 PM  
screw d&d
Star Frontiers for the win!

/yeah...where even D&D players called you a nerd.
 
2014-05-10 03:35:51 PM  

dstrick44: JasonOfOrillia: I played D&D as a kid.  I've murdered hardly anyone.

Exactly!
What about all those people I didn't murder?


Right?! Why don't we ever get any credit for that?
 
2014-05-10 03:38:14 PM  
My sister explained it pretty well to me.  Nobody (well nobody smart, anyway) really thinks that violent video games are going to turn a normal person into a violent person.  What they're worried about is whether it would negatively affect a child who, from the moment they could hold a game controller, was given violent video games as their primary form of entertainment.

Would it make it harder for them to tell the difference between "joking around" violence and real violence?
Would it make it so that whenever they get very angry, they get violently angry?
Would it desensitize them to violence, to the point where they see street crime and bloody wars as "normal", and turn them off trying to prevent violence?

Personally, I would say "no" to every one of these questions.  But they are a whole lot more sane than "Would playing GTA make a kid want to go on a hooker-killing, car-stealing, pedestrian-trampling rampage?"
 
2014-05-10 03:38:53 PM  

Random Internet Persona: dstrick44: JasonOfOrillia: I played D&D as a kid.  I've murdered hardly anyone.

Exactly!
What about all those people I didn't murder?

Right?! Why don't we ever get any credit for that?



What about those that needed killing?

Today's generation is just plain lazy. Back in my day, we would take out bad people, their neighbors, and innocent pedestrians. We may have been unhinged and dangerous, but we were go-getters.
 
2014-05-10 03:39:10 PM  
I see TFAuthor is just ignoring the dozens of studies (correlational, experimental, and longitudinal) that have found playing violent video games to be associated with increases in aggressive behavior.

(On phone, so no links, but about ten seconds with http://scholar.google.com should get one going. Also try Craig Anderson, one of the top researchers in the field: http://www.psychology.iastate.edu/~caa / )
 
2014-05-10 03:43:09 PM  

Son of Thunder: I see TFAuthor is just ignoring the dozens of studies (correlational, experimental, and longitudinal) that have found playing violent video games to be associated with increases in aggressive behavior.

(On phone, so no links, but about ten seconds with http://scholar.google.com should get one going. Also try Craig Anderson, one of the top researchers in the field: http://www.psychology.iastate.edu/~caa / )


I see you are just ignoring the dozens of studies that have found playing violent video games has absolutely no correlation with aggressive behaviour.
 
2014-05-10 03:43:44 PM  

Boudyro: DubtodaIll: Boudyro: DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.

What exactly do you think pushes the development of faster/smarter/smaller computers, or 3D modeling/CGI?

People who aren't playing games all day though filling a demand of the market.

And who created that demand they are filling?


People who had a dream and followed it.
 
2014-05-10 03:47:51 PM  

star_topology: I remember when my parents got me Final Fantasy 3 (6) for the NES for Christmas. I think I was 11 or 12 and distinctly remember my dad telling me "If that game tells you to kill your parents, you can't play it."


Stop it, Final Fantasy 3 never came out on the NES
 
2014-05-10 03:50:07 PM  

Snarfangel: Random Internet Persona: dstrick44: JasonOfOrillia: I played D&D as a kid.  I've murdered hardly anyone.

Exactly!
What about all those people I didn't murder?

Right?! Why don't we ever get any credit for that?


What about those that needed killing?

Today's generation is just plain lazy. Back in my day, we would take out bad people, their neighbors, and innocent pedestrians. We may have been unhinged and dangerous, but we were go-getters.


I blame Assassin's Creed. Used to we'd take out those that needed killing. Now we can do it virtually from the comfort of our living rooms, and all of the bad guys and innocent bystanders roam free.

Damn you video games!
 
2014-05-10 03:52:37 PM  

moeburn: Son of Thunder: I see TFAuthor is just ignoring the dozens of studies (correlational, experimental, and longitudinal) that have found playing violent video games to be associated with increases in aggressive behavior.

(On phone, so no links, but about ten seconds with http://scholar.google.com should get one going. Also try Craig Anderson, one of the top researchers in the field: http://www.psychology.iastate.edu/~caa / )

I see you are just ignoring the dozens of studies that have found playing violent video games has absolutely no correlation with aggressive behaviour.


Actually, if you look at the graphs (and not all of the underlying factors, like how many teenaged guys are running around -- and as a former teenaged guy, I can say that), it appears there is a negative correlation:
filipspagnoli.files.wordpress.com
So much for Grand Theft Auto, and apparently, Internet porn is good for you.
 
2014-05-10 03:57:31 PM  

moeburn: Son of Thunder: I see TFAuthor is just ignoring the dozens of studies (correlational, experimental, and longitudinal) that have found playing violent video games to be associated with increases in aggressive behavior.

(On phone, so no links, but about ten seconds with http://scholar.google.com should get one going. Also try Craig Anderson, one of the top researchers in the field: http://www.psychology.iastate.edu/~caa / )

I see you are just ignoring the dozens of studies that have found playing violent video games has absolutely no correlation with aggressive behaviour.


Such as?
 
2014-05-10 03:58:41 PM  

DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.


Look up how Craig Venter came up with his ideas that changed DNA sequencing and allowed the Human Genome Project to be finished about 20 years ahead of time.
 
2014-05-10 04:12:04 PM  

Irregardless: The games aren't making kids stabby, just fat.


Not much mortal panic.
 
2014-05-10 04:15:20 PM  
i1.ytimg.com
What pinball arcades may look like
 
2014-05-10 04:34:29 PM  

Fano: DubtodaIll: gnosis301: DubtodaIll: If all the hours spent by competent people playing video games in the past 20 years had spent spent in endeavors beneficial to humanity we would have 90% less problems we have today, would have people on Mars, people on the Moon, and advancements beyond our comprehension. The amount of progress we lose in the name of fun is incalculable and apparently completely acceptable.

Pffff AH HA HA HA HA HA!!!

The voracity of anti-opinion to my positions leads me to believe that I am completely correct. Fishing or shooting pool or bowling simply does not attract the level of intelligence that video games do.

Look up how Craig Venter came up with his ideas that changed DNA sequencing and allowed the Human Genome Project to be finished about 20 years ahead of time.


Psychadelic drugs have no doubt had an influence on the progression of society.
 
2014-05-10 04:37:35 PM  

Warthog: but the level of violence we've seen has ratcheted up.

Do I have proof that this isn't a correlation without causation? No.

Do I have statistics? No.

Do I think it's possible that at least some of the moral failures that people thought would co


And there you have it, folks: has no evidence to support his position, but he thinks it's possible, so it must true.

Just go ahead and ignore these:

farm6.staticflickr.com

img.fark.net

img.fark.net
 
2014-05-10 04:38:41 PM  
It's too late. You've awakened the gazebo. It catches you and eats you.
 
2014-05-10 05:04:57 PM  
Kids are still playing video games. There's still murders. You can't refute that.
Can't explain it either.
 
2014-05-10 05:22:38 PM  

frepnog: star_topology: remember when my parents got me Final Fantasy 3 (6)

oh just stop it.  as a kid you had no idea that FF3 was actually FF6 in japan.

and I'd bet you never finished it.  Hell, I'd bet you didn't put more than 5 hours into it.


I didn't say I knew it was FF6 at the time.

And actually, it's my favorite RPG of all time. Played it through and beaten it twice.

Who pissed in your Cheerios?
 
2014-05-10 05:24:37 PM  

anuran: Eighty years ago it was Reefer Madness.
Sixty years ago it was comic books (cf. Seduction of the Innocent) and pinball
Thirty years ago it was Dungeons and Dragons
Today it's video games.

There's always a moral panic


Also:
Waltzing
Pool Halls
TV
and of course, Playboy etc
 
2014-05-10 05:24:41 PM  

Nowhereman: star_topology: I remember when my parents got me Final Fantasy 3 (6) for the NES for Christmas. I think I was 11 or 12 and distinctly remember my dad telling me "If that game tells you to kill your parents, you can't play it."

Stop it, Final Fantasy 3 never came out on the NES


Typo. My bad.
 
2014-05-10 05:31:02 PM  

Snarfangel: stonelotus: "du jour for my lifetime"?

He's lived a very short life.

/+1 funny from me, very subtle. :)


i58.tinypic.com
 
2014-05-10 05:33:24 PM  
My parents loved when my brother and I got into D&D. Even when the weather was crappy for weeks at a time we'd be happily out of their hair. One summer it POURED on most of our beach vacation, which would have sucked hard had we not found a group of kids to game with. We didn't whine about the rain at all.
 
2014-05-10 05:36:21 PM  

Warthog: While I thought all these video game panics were nonsense at the time, the truth is games have gotten increasingly violent and realistic.  During the same period, school shootings and other kid on kid violence have grown more intense.  I'm not saying they've grown more prevalent -- kids have always been terrible to other kids -- but the level of violence we've seen has ratcheted up.

Do I have proof that this isn't a correlation without causation?  No.

Do I have statistics?  No.

Do I think it's possible that at least some of the moral failures that people thought would come about because of these violent games have now come about?  Yes, I do.


There is a  basic flaw in the correlation = causation proposition.

If .001% of gamers commit a violent crime, why don't the vast majority (if vid games are so bad)?

Or reverse the correlation - 99.9% of gamers don't commit school shootings therefore the games are pacifying the gamers
 
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