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(National Post)   In an interesting twist, a heterosexual man files human rights complaint to get the same benefits afforded to homosexuals   (news.nationalpost.com) divider line 98
    More: Interesting, gay parents, paid parental leave, heterosexuals, gays and lesbians, complaints, British Columbia Human Rights Tribunal  
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11061 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 May 2014 at 4:51 AM (16 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-05-09 12:24:00 AM
img.fark.net
 
2014-05-09 01:50:58 AM
Good.  Either parent should be able to claim "primary caregiver" rights to an infant and get the benefits that come from that.  It shouldn't be based on the parents' sex or sexual orientation.

/heterosexual who has no plans to have kids and, therefore, doesn't benefit from this in any fashion
 
2014-05-09 02:56:12 AM

timujin: Good.  Either parent should be able to claim "primary caregiver" rights to an infant and get the benefits that come from that.  It shouldn't be based on the parents' sex or sexual orientation.

/heterosexual who has no plans to have kids and, therefore, doesn't benefit from this in any fashion


And you're also not Canadian.

Or are you?
 
2014-05-09 02:58:18 AM
They don't already?
 
2014-05-09 04:54:07 AM
I agree with him.

Mothers are not more important than fathers, and the guy said HE was going to be the primary caregiver.

If a company will give the extra leave to a gay man, then they are clearly discriminating against him based on his sexual orientation, which is illegal.
 
2014-05-09 05:04:12 AM
The HR director's argument that he can't give birth applies to gay men, too. I don't know how they thought fighting him was a good idea.
 
2014-05-09 05:05:40 AM
So this is the slippery slope I was hearing about.


WHAT A DAMNED FOOL I WAS! I should've realized that by wanting the same rights as heterosexuals I was advocating greater equality between the sexes!

/brb, joining WBC.
 
2014-05-09 05:06:21 AM

The more you eat the more you fart: I agree with him.

Mothers are not more important than fathers, and the guy said HE was going to be the primary caregiver.

If a company will give the extra leave to a gay man, then they are clearly discriminating against him based on his sexual orientation, which is illegal.


More like discriminating against lifestyle choice/circumstance.  Not that I'm calling gay a lifestyle choice, but whether a surrogate is used or adoption, and whether a single gay man or part of a couple, parental leave should be just that; I'm just saying that sexual orientation is kind of irrelevant to the leave, or should be anyway.  To give maternity leave and not paternity leave is discrimination based on gender, or such could be argued.
 
2014-05-09 05:14:23 AM
What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?
 
2014-05-09 05:16:19 AM

moothemagiccow: The HR director's argument that he can't give birth applies to gay men, too. I don't know how they thought fighting him was a good idea.


It also applies to non-fertile women that adopt.

And what about single parents? Maybe they need 2 shares of leave since they are carrying the burden of two parents.
 
2014-05-09 05:18:05 AM
Hey, if you can't suck the penefits, you can't get the benefits.
 
2014-05-09 05:19:17 AM
What does he want, a reach-around?
 
2014-05-09 05:33:41 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


Sucks to be you, forever alone guy.
 
2014-05-09 05:36:23 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


Its not a new parent's fault that you cant get someone to fark you.
 
2014-05-09 05:41:41 AM

We're beginning to see some signs of progress: What does he want, a reach-around?


And lube.
 
2014-05-09 05:55:10 AM

The more you eat the more you fart: Its not a new parent's fault that you cant get someone to fark you.


BumpInTheNight: Sucks to be you, forever alone guy.


Someone should get them a straw so they can suck it up.
 
2014-05-09 06:06:18 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


Who cares about really ugly people anyway? Get back to work.
 
2014-05-09 06:06:50 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


Who's forcing you to put in longer hours?
Seems like more money, split one
way = Good Thing
 
2014-05-09 06:15:12 AM
I expect this is more like an oversight in how the benefits were written. I'm pretty sure there are federal "paternity" benefits in addition to the more traditional maternity benefits (though I think it works out that the total eligible benefit is 1 year for both parents combined; that is, the father could take 4 and the mother 8). The city's local union has additional benefits over the federal mandate, which include a clause respecting same-sex couples with children, but neglected to update the clause to respect heterosexual fathers.

.

Actually, reading more on it, there are two federal benefits:

What are EI maternity benefits?
EI maternity benefits are offered to biological mothers, including surrogate mothers, who cannot work because they are pregnant or have recently given birth. A maximum of 15 weeks of EI maternity benefits is available. The 15 weeks can start as early as eight weeks before the expected date of birth, and can end as late as 17 weeks after the actual date of birth.

What are EI parental benefits?
EI parental benefits are offered to parents who are caring for a newborn or newly adopted child. A maximum of 35 weeks of parental benefits is available to biological, adoptive, or legally recognized parents. The two parents can share these 35 weeks of benefits. A person recognized as the child's legal parent on the provincial or territorial birth certificate may be eligible to receive parental benefits.

So a father is eligible for parental benefits in caring for a newborn, while a mother is eligible for both maternal (when she is expecting or recently given birth) and parental benefits. In this way a mother is eligible for up to 50 weeks, (though 35 weeks might be shared with the father), while the father is eligible for up to 35 weeks only. I expect several employers offer further benefits in addition to that offered by federal Employment Insurance.

The SEIB is described in the article as "meant to top-up federal maternity leave benefits." In this way, the guy doesn't really have an argument to make because, as the HR director said, men can't give birth. A male gay couple would also not be eligible for this since the maternity benefit only applies to women giving birth. A female gay couple would be eligible, though only for the individual actually giving birth (the other would only be eligible for parental benefits). Maybe if he was trans but still had female equipment, though I'm not sure if a "heterosexual" label would apply in that case.

In any case, presuming the article is accurate, I don't see a problem here.
 
2014-05-09 06:20:18 AM
Herk, forget all of that. I see my error now.
 
2014-05-09 06:23:02 AM
It doesn't stop there. Keep fighting until true equality is achieved. Those of you heterosexuals who would join the military, make it clear that being segregated from the opposite sex in the barracks is a clear and indefensible denial of equal rights.
 
2014-05-09 06:28:22 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


Since you've chosen to forego your evolutionary duty and not produce offspring, your role in society as a sterile worker is to produce additional resources for the benefit of breeding pairs and thus improve the prospects of the community's young.
 
2014-05-09 06:42:10 AM

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

Since you've chosen to forego your evolutionary duty and not produce offspring, your role in society as a sterile worker is to produce additional resources for the benefit of breeding pairs and thus improve the prospects of the community's young.


No it's not. It's to have more fun than mostly miserable people who run around chasing their 2.5 smelly kids.
 
2014-05-09 06:42:11 AM

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

Since you've chosen to forego your evolutionary duty and not produce offspring, your role in society as a sterile worker is to produce additional resources for the benefit of breeding pairs and thus improve the prospects of the community's young.


I'd argue that with current population, not breeding is actually doing a service  to our species in and of itself. Besides, breeding should only be done with those whose genes stand to benefit the whole in the longterm. Only way to get rid of bad genes (genetic illness, etc) is to prevent said genes from being bred forward.
 
2014-05-09 06:50:45 AM
This guy will win without a fight. If there even IS a rule that says he can't be designated caregiver - he is basing his protest on hs own reading of the rules. But you can tell by what the official said that if he's right, they are going to change the rule. That would just be stupid. Assuming we are talking about the parental benefits.
On the other hand, neither partner in a gay male marriage is going to get maternity benefits, and he shouldn't either.
 
2014-05-09 06:52:08 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


You fertilize them BEFORE they become crotch fruit. If you do that after, the police will probably want a word with you.
 
2014-05-09 06:53:55 AM

Ruiizu: Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

Since you've chosen to forego your evolutionary duty and not produce offspring, your role in society as a sterile worker is to produce additional resources for the benefit of breeding pairs and thus improve the prospects of the community's young.

I'd argue that with current population, not breeding is actually doing a service  to our species in and of itself. Besides, breeding should only be done with those whose genes stand to benefit the whole in the longterm. Only way to get rid of bad genes (genetic illness, etc) is to prevent said genes from being bred forward.


You know who else advocated for eugenics?
 
2014-05-09 06:56:12 AM
If you are a feminist and you support equalizing wages for women, and you do not support men being given paternity leave rights, then you are biting off your nose to spite your face. You can try all the wage-shoehorning you like, but the free market will get around it until we stop addressing the symptoms and start addressing the underlying causes. Women are at risk to take long leaves from work, while men are not. If men suddenly are seen as having the same risk, then employers will have to factor that completely out of the equation, and the relative value of women will increase, along with their compensation.
 
2014-05-09 06:57:18 AM

Niveras: I expect this is more like an oversight in how the benefits were written. I'm pretty sure there are federal "paternity" benefits in addition to the more traditional maternity benefits (though I think it works out that the total eligible benefit is 1 year for both parents combined; that is, the father could take 4 and the mother 8). The city's local union has additional benefits over the federal mandate, which include a clause respecting same-sex couples with children, but neglected to update the clause to respect heterosexual fathers.

.

Actually, reading more on it, there are two federal benefits:

What are EI maternity benefits?
EI maternity benefits are offered to biological mothers, including surrogate mothers, who cannot work because they are pregnant or have recently given birth. A maximum of 15 weeks of EI maternity benefits is available. The 15 weeks can start as early as eight weeks before the expected date of birth, and can end as late as 17 weeks after the actual date of birth.

What are EI parental benefits?
EI parental benefits are offered to parents who are caring for a newborn or newly adopted child. A maximum of 35 weeks of parental benefits is available to biological, adoptive, or legally recognized parents. The two parents can share these 35 weeks of benefits. A person recognized as the child's legal parent on the provincial or territorial birth certificate may be eligible to receive parental benefits.

So a father is eligible for parental benefits in caring for a newborn, while a mother is eligible for both maternal (when she is expecting or recently given birth) and parental benefits. In this way a mother is eligible for up to 50 weeks, (though 35 weeks might be shared with the father), while the father is eligible for up to 35 weeks only. I expect several employers offer further benefits in addition to that offered by federal Employment Insurance.

The SEIB is described in the article as "meant to top-up federal maternity leave benefits." In th ...


Well, there probably isn't any problem here. And I'm sure that when that's explained to this gentleman , he'll accept it reasonably - because there is no way he could have an agenda.
 
2014-05-09 06:57:26 AM

The more you eat the more you fart: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

Its not a new parent's fault that you cant get someone to fark you.


Paying for your kids also isn't his problem.
 
2014-05-09 07:00:15 AM

Tommy Moo: If you are a feminist and you support equalizing wages for women, and you do not support men being given paternity leave rights, then you are biting off your nose to spite your face. You can try all the wage-shoehorning you like, but the free market will get around it until we stop addressing the symptoms and start addressing the underlying causes. Women are at risk to take long leaves from work, while men are not. If men suddenly are seen as having the same risk, then employers will have to factor that completely out of the equation, and the relative value of women will increase, along with their compensation.


True - but it doesn't appear that there is any actual inequality here - gay and straight men can get parental benefits. Neither gay nor straight men can get maternal benefits. They don't have babies.
 
2014-05-09 07:01:44 AM

Tommy Moo: The more you eat the more you fart: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

Its not a new parent's fault that you cant get someone to fark you.

Paying for your kids also isn't his problem.


But it takes a village to raise an idiot.
 
2014-05-09 07:04:29 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


I remained parasite free and was able to retire at 42. Have no qualms whatsoever about throwing a bit more into the kitty, to ensure when I am in the nursing home there is someone around who speaks English to tell the foreign workers to wipe my arse front to back, and not the other way around.
 
2014-05-09 07:08:20 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


They should get maternity/paternity leave too.

Paternity benefits, the key to wage equality for women.

If a guy has just as much chance of taking 6 months off every 2-3 years for the next couple of decades then you`ll pay them less too.

What? You didn`t think they would raise womens pay to create equality did you?
 
2014-05-09 07:08:48 AM

Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?


You're getting farked by your employer, not the breeders.
 
2014-05-09 07:10:07 AM

dready zim: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

They should get maternity/paternity leave too.

Paternity benefits, the key to wage equality for women.

If a guy has just as much chance of taking 6 months off every 2-3 years for the next couple of decades then you`ll pay them less too.

What? You didn`t think they would raise womens pay to create equality did you?


Six months? What do you think this is, France? You're lucky to get six weeks.
 
2014-05-09 07:10:50 AM
This guy needs to check his privilege.
 
2014-05-09 07:11:33 AM

zzrhardy: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

I remained parasite free and was able to retire at 42. Have no qualms whatsoever about throwing a bit more into the kitty, to ensure when I am in the nursing home there is someone around who speaks English to tell the foreign workers to wipe my arse front to back, and not the other way around.


Yeah, I'm sure that the drug addicted ghetto thug that is making minimum wage to take care of you will have all kinds of respect for the fact that you paid some money a long time ago. If there is nobody there who cares to look out for you, they can and will do whatever they want to you - and the richer and whiter you used to be, the harder they will laugh at you. Hell is the place where people go who put their faith in money.
 
2014-05-09 07:11:37 AM

Tommy Moo: If you are a feminist and you support equalizing wages for women, and you do not support men being given paternity leave rights, then you are biting off your nose to spite your face. You can try all the wage-shoehorning you like, but the free market will get around it until we stop addressing the symptoms and start addressing the underlying causes. Women are at risk to take long leaves from work, while men are not. If men suddenly are seen as having the same risk, then employers will have to factor that completely out of the equation, and the relative value of women will increase, along with their compensation.


Sort of. The value of men will decrease and so they will get paid less, leading to wage equality.

Apart from that you are spot on.
 
2014-05-09 07:12:17 AM

moothemagiccow: dready zim: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

They should get maternity/paternity leave too.

Paternity benefits, the key to wage equality for women.

If a guy has just as much chance of taking 6 months off every 2-3 years for the next couple of decades then you`ll pay them less too.

What? You didn`t think they would raise womens pay to create equality did you?

Six months? What do you think this is, France? You're lucky to get six weeks.


Sorry, I live in the UK where we get decent amounts of time with the newborn.
 
2014-05-09 07:16:33 AM

dready zim: moothemagiccow: dready zim: Luven: What about the single person who's paying higher rates and working longer hours so you can go fertilize your crotch fruit ?

They should get maternity/paternity leave too.

Paternity benefits, the key to wage equality for women.

If a guy has just as much chance of taking 6 months off every 2-3 years for the next couple of decades then you`ll pay them less too.

What? You didn`t think they would raise womens pay to create equality did you?

Six months? What do you think this is, France? You're lucky to get six weeks.

Sorry, I live in the UK where we get decent amounts of time with the newborn.


Pffft. Nanny state.
 
2014-05-09 07:25:59 AM

jso2897: True - but it doesn't appear that there is any actual inequality here - gay and straight men can get parental benefits. Neither gay nor straight men can get maternal benefits. They don't have babies.


You still don't get it do you? For example, I am a true blue mysogynist, and not one of those half arsed ones that still wants to screw women either.

I would like nothing more than to hear that women were given a gazzillion hours maternity leave, or could level and entire company with a single founded/unfounded accusation of sexism. Because that means that women are a greater risk to employers than males.

Us males don't do so well at school, or network and such, so all we can really count on is for women to price themselves out of the market and win cockroach style -- last man standing. And I might add, they are doing a fine job of it so far.
 
2014-05-09 07:44:31 AM
Lawsuits for everyone!!
 
2014-05-09 08:08:26 AM
Parental/maternity leave is stupid. If you cannot afford to take the time off to commit parenthood (for the most part a voluntary decision) why should others, tax payers and/or employers, have to assume the financial burden of that decision?
 
2014-05-09 08:21:50 AM
It's bullshiat.
Yeah, I don't see why *adopting* parents of any sort need a leave. Take some farking vacation time and get over it.

They already have the benefit of choosing when it's going to happen so they can plan a time for it that won't be too disruptive. They don't need to stay home to recover from an exhausting hospital stay, a ruined cooch, and several hours a day of breastfeeding.
 
2014-05-09 08:26:08 AM
img.fark.net
 
2014-05-09 08:27:37 AM
Okay. Equal rights for everyone. Good.
 
2014-05-09 08:30:14 AM
Good.
 
2014-05-09 08:42:14 AM

Syrrh: They already have the benefit of choosing when it's going to happen so they can plan a time for it that won't be too disruptive. They don't need to stay home to recover from an exhausting hospital stay, a ruined cooch, and several hours a day of breastfeeding.


You pretty obviously know nothing about the adoption process.

I'll give you a hint: there isn't a big silo full of babies where you can drop by whenever you want.
 
2014-05-09 08:44:17 AM
Here: according to the Male Privilege Checklist:

10. If I have children but do not provide primary care for them, my masculinity will not be called into question.
11. If I have children and provide primary care for them, I'll be praised for extraordinary parenting if I'm even marginally competent. (
12. If I have children and a career, no one will think I'm selfish for not staying at home.
...
39. If I have children with my girlfriend or wife, I can expect her to do most of the basic childcare such as changing diapers and feeding.
40. If I have children with my wife or girlfriend, and it turns out that one of us needs to make career sacrifices to raise the kids, chances are we'll both assume the career sacrificed should be hers.



Because  any perceived gender inequality always favors men.
 
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