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(Talking Points Memo)   Good news for the GOP: "Establishment" candidates are beating Tea Party candidates in primaries. Bad news for the GOP: The "establishment" candidates had to adopt a lot of Tea Party rhetoric and policies to pull that off   (talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 107
    More: Interesting, Tea Party candidate, tea party, GOP, humans, primaries, North Carolina Republicans, Kay Hagan, National Right to Life  
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714 clicks; posted to Politics » on 07 May 2014 at 1:13 PM (29 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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vpb [TotalFark]
2014-05-07 11:03:55 AM  
The really scary thing is that GOP voters are even crazier than their politicians.
 
2014-05-07 11:14:10 AM  
when you lie down with tea baggers, you get up with racist, misogynistic fleas.
 
2014-05-07 12:18:12 PM  
Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.
 
2014-05-07 12:49:56 PM  
Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.
 
2014-05-07 01:16:11 PM  

nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.


That's the point - they haven't died, they've been absorbed into the GOP.

Just like everyone with half a brain predicted they would, way back in 2009.
 
2014-05-07 01:16:16 PM  
I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.
 
2014-05-07 01:19:55 PM  
Does Subby think that what politicians say when campaigning actually means anything?
 
2014-05-07 01:20:06 PM  
The further to the right these guys get pulled, the less chance they will have when the actual election occurs (as opposed to the primaries).  In the two party system we have now, the road to success is to drive right down the middle.  Obama was very effective at poaching votes from less extreme conservatives and the undecided.  If you lean too hard in one direction or the other you'd better hope your base has enough votes in it to carry the election.
 
2014-05-07 01:20:13 PM  

UncomfortableSilence: I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.


The current group of R's, regardless of what end of the crazy scale they are on, aren't moderates.
 
2014-05-07 01:20:57 PM  

PainInTheASP: Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.


They always have to worry about that. Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?
 
2014-05-07 01:24:57 PM  
FTFA:

Yes, Brannon is one of those conservatives who thinks the federal government should be confined to its original minimalist role;

*closes window*

Who believes this bull sh*t talking point? Ban gay marriage, ban abortion, forced Christian religion, destroy lives over drugs. They love love love big government.
 
2014-05-07 01:25:08 PM  

Dr Dreidel: nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.

That's the point - they haven't died, they've been absorbed into the GOP.

Just like everyone with half a brain predicted they would, way back in 2009.


What you describe is difficult to accept. I was assured that the Tea Party was a nonpartisan grassroots organization made up of Patriotic citizens of all political affiliations who all suddenly realised on January 20, 2009 that they were being excessively taxed by the federal government.
 
2014-05-07 01:25:09 PM  

Riothamus: PainInTheASP: Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.

They always have to worry about that. Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?


Not really.  No one actually believed Romney was a conservative before the first debate.... well complete and udder morans maybe.
 
2014-05-07 01:28:21 PM  

Saiga410: Riothamus: PainInTheASP: Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.

They always have to worry about that. Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?

Not really.  No one actually believed Romney was a conservative before the first debate.... well complete and udder morans maybe.


He just claimed to be conservative to cow the naysayers.
 
2014-05-07 01:28:51 PM  

Triple Oak: UncomfortableSilence: I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.

The current group of R's, regardless of what end of the crazy scale they are on, aren't moderates.


Meant it as a verb, they aren't moderate at all but I'll at least be a smidge happier if they move back from the derp end after the primaries.
 
2014-05-07 01:30:13 PM  

Dr Dreidel: That's the point - they haven't died, they've been absorbed into the GOP.

Just like everyone with half a brain predicted they would, way back in 2009.


Progress, not resolution. And, unlike in homeopathy, dilution does not make you stronger in politics. I'll take a diluted group of Tea Partiers in the GOP than full on Tea Party candidates any day.
 
2014-05-07 01:30:51 PM  

UncomfortableSilence: I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.


Run to the right; govern to the left.

Both parties.

It's a thing.
 
2014-05-07 01:30:53 PM  

Riothamus: PainInTheASP: Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.

They always have to worry about that. Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?


They still voted for him.
 
2014-05-07 01:32:41 PM  

busy chillin': Who believes this bull sh*t talking point? Ban gay marriage, ban abortion, forced Christian religion, destroy lives over drugs. They love love love big government.


Not every GOP member is against gay marriage, abortion, etc.  Not every Democrat is against the 2nd Amendment, religion, etc.

it's almost as if within the parties there are various flavors.
 
2014-05-07 01:32:56 PM  
I love how the poster boy for Republican policies and ideals "isn't really a conservative"...

The GOP has gone off into deep right field. Nothing but reactionary outliers, fundamentalists and proudly ignorant ideologues, as far as I can see.
 
2014-05-07 01:33:28 PM  

vpb: The really scary thing is that GOP voters are even crazier than their politicians.


No argument there, but this is not exclusive to the Republican Party.
 
2014-05-07 01:33:59 PM  

vpb: The really scary thing is that GOP voters are even crazier dumber than their politicians.


FTFY

Actually, not really fixed; more like additional information.
 
2014-05-07 01:34:05 PM  
Look, which brand name of hyper-conservative, Austrian-economics-supporting, theocrat do you want, America?  There's clearly no other question to settle in our primaries.
 
2014-05-07 01:34:06 PM  

UncomfortableSilence: Triple Oak: UncomfortableSilence: I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.

The current group of R's, regardless of what end of the crazy scale they are on, aren't moderates.

Meant it as a verb, they aren't moderate at all but I'll at least be a smidge happier if they move back from the derp end after the primaries.


There's a part of me that hopes they go all in with the craziest far right sh*t they can think of for the next two years. It'd cement the irrelevant dinosaur image of the GOP for the few people in my generation not yet fully convinced.
 
2014-05-07 01:34:28 PM  

Dr Dreidel: nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.

That's the point - they haven't died, they've been absorbed back into the GOP.

Just like everyone with half a brain predicted they would, way back in 2009.


Fixed that. It's like waves being absorbed back into the ocean from whence they came.

Riothamus: Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?


Actually, no. I just remember everyone shouting how "terrible" Obama performed, because it's impossible to fight back against a shadow.
 
2014-05-07 01:35:27 PM  

Kit Fister: busy chillin': Who believes this bull sh*t talking point? Ban gay marriage, ban abortion, forced Christian religion, destroy lives over drugs. They love love love big government.

Not every GOP member is against gay marriage, abortion, etc.  Not every Democrat is against the 2nd Amendment, religion, etc.

it's almost as if within the parties there are various flavors.


We're talking about party platforms, not pet issues.
 
2014-05-07 01:38:32 PM  

BMFPitt: Does Subby think that what politicians say when campaigning actually means anything?



                                            dreamdogsart.typepad.com

                                                                   "That, right there. "
 
2014-05-07 01:38:50 PM  
Ultimately, a politician's rhetoric doesn't matter.  What matters is how they act and vote when in power.

The current crop of Repubs, especially in the House but during Senate filibusters too, have toed the Tea Party line.  They vote to repeal Obamacare over and over.  They support the endless Benghazi investigations.  They don't allow for any compromise with the Administration.

The Republican Party is poisoned to the core, and it's because they allowed the John Birch Society/Moral Majority/States Rights/Tea Party/Rush Listening FOX Fans to take over.  The Establishment thought they were using these values voters, but it turns out once they let them in the door, the values voters aren't leaving.  The Establishment may be sane, but they've lost control of the party, and the guests at this party are going to rock all night long, despite the havok they are causing.

/mixed metaphors are the best kind of metaphor
 
2014-05-07 01:40:12 PM  
...and the idea that the GOP will "Moderate" their farked up policies and goals once elected is laughable.
 
2014-05-07 01:42:29 PM  

UncomfortableSilence: Triple Oak: UncomfortableSilence: I don't care what they say to get there if they moderate once they do.

/Not going to hold my breath.

The current group of R's, regardless of what end of the crazy scale they are on, aren't moderates.

Meant it as a verb, they aren't moderate at all but I'll at least be a smidge happier if they move back from the derp end after the primaries.


Problem is everyone on the right has taken a giant step further right. The centrists did not call the teaparty's ideas stupid, they adopted them. They will not be moving back to center. The teaparty has not been beaten, they have been assimilated. This has also required that the democrats take a step to the right. They occupy what used to be the middle  (on a national stage). True left wing groups have to take public transportation or ride their granola powered organic bicycles the width of 100 rainbow gatherings just to get a glimpse of the debate.
 
2014-05-07 01:43:03 PM  

Car_Ramrod: Dr Dreidel: nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.

That's the point - they haven't died, they've been absorbed back into the GOP.

Just like everyone with half a brain predicted they would, way back in 2009.

Fixed that. It's like waves being absorbed back into the ocean from whence they came.


As soon as I submitted, I hoped someone would do that. Thanks!

nmrsnr: I'll take a diluted group of Tea Partiers in the GOP than full on Tea Party candidates any day.


The problem is that there's no "dilution". It's just getting rid of a toxic brand name.

Think of it like this: I have an established product in the market (call it "derp"), and I introduce a "competing" product (call it "potato") that looks, smells, tastes, and functions almost identically to "derp" while maintaining a difference from and innovation on "derp". When I eventually announce that "potato" will cease as a brand and existing stores converted to "derp" packaging, I wouldn't say I'm "diluting" the market for "derp", just that I've converted half-sales of derp + half-sales of potato into whole-sales of derp.

// derp
 
2014-05-07 01:43:05 PM  

Car_Ramrod: We're talking about party platforms, not pet issues.


But...you can't...fine. If we're going to base this ENTIRE discussion around the stereotype of the ENTIRE party, and NOT the politics of the person getting elected...
 
2014-05-07 01:43:10 PM  
Good God, there's no distinction between the GOP and the teatards. They are the same thing and always have been. The Republicans have been this insane for the past 35 years, and all the teatards represent is a rejection of even appearing to be moderate. Pretending the two are different just plays into the hands of the baggers who can pretend they're "outsiders" because of this language.
 
2014-05-07 01:43:15 PM  

Riothamus: PainInTheASP: Meh, it's primary season.  Of course they're playing up the wingnut angle.  Things will drift back a bit once they don't have to worry about getting eaten by their own kind.

They always have to worry about that. Remember the right-wing backlash against Romney after he changed literally all of his positions for the first debate?


I note that 538 had Mitt at a 12% chance of winning the day before the first debate and 40% a week after.  Then again, Obama was caught completely flatfoot by Mitt 2.0.5.4 (and was expecting the previous release Mittbot).  I'm sure every R is deathly afraid of a "backlash" involving a surge in the polls like Mitt got.

Why, why, why does anyone care about the noises coming out of a politician's mouth anyway?  What is his record.  Who bought him, and for how much?  Those are important.  Spin isn't.
 
2014-05-07 01:45:00 PM  
Bad news for the GOP: The "establishment" candidates had to adopt a lot of Tea Party rhetoric and policies to pull that off

To be fair, Obama adopted a lot of progressive rhetoric and policies, too.  And he's still not a progressive.
 
2014-05-07 01:47:56 PM  
You can't call Brannon a "constitutional conservative", when he goes on WPTF and advocates for nullification and claims we were better off under the Articles of Confederation:

http://billlumaye.blogspot.com/2012/09/dr-greg-brannon-on-articles-of _ 17.html?m=1
 
2014-05-07 01:48:07 PM  

bhcompy: Bad news for the GOP: The "establishment" candidates had to adopt a lot of Tea Party rhetoric and policies to pull that off

To be fair, Obama adopted a lot of progressive rhetoric and policies, too.  And he's still not a progressive.


So vote Republican.
 
2014-05-07 01:48:21 PM  

Deftoons: vpb: The really scary thing is that GOP voters are even crazier than their politicians.

No argument there, but this is not exclusive to the Republican Party.


Looks totes fair and balanced there.
 
2014-05-07 01:50:46 PM  
I don't like the policies teabagger stand for but they were brilliant at pushing their agenda, as far as political savviness goes they are a cut above the political leftists.
 
2014-05-07 01:53:36 PM  

Headso: I don't like the policies teabagger stand for but they were brilliant at pushing their agenda, as far as political savviness goes they are a cut above the political leftists.


Is it savvy, or is it massive corporate backing?

It's pretty easy to get your ideas out there when you have a "news" channel pushing your views 24/7.
 
2014-05-07 01:54:06 PM  

Tripp Johnston Private Eye: Good God, there's no distinction between the GOP and the teatards. They are the same thing and always have been.


Much like how Fanta and Fresca are different beverages but they're both owned by Coke.
 
2014-05-07 01:54:12 PM  

nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.


Not if the policies they advocated are enacted into law...
 
2014-05-07 01:54:49 PM  

Dr Dreidel: Think of it like this: I have an established product in the market (call it "derp"), and I introduce a "competing" product (call it "potato") that looks, smells, tastes, and functions almost identically to "derp" while maintaining a difference from and innovation on "derp". When I eventually announce that "potato" will cease as a brand and existing stores converted to "derp" packaging, I wouldn't say I'm "diluting" the market for "derp", just that I've converted half-sales of derp + half-sales of potato into whole-sales of derp.

// derp


Except that's not really true. The reason the GOP has had their backlash against Tea Party candidates is that they are tired of losing very winnable races. Christine O'Donnell, Todd Akin, What's His Name Miller in Alaska, they all lost races the Republicans should have won. Not to mention the Tea Party Caucus causing all sorts of headaches for Boehner, and the fact that everybody hates Ted Cruz. The Republicans just want them under heel again. If they just rebranded them, they know they'd lose the same races in the same way. They want their votes, without their general election poison and habit of saying incredibly stupid things, that's why they are spending so much to crush Tea Party candidates this year.

I see this as a good thing.
 
2014-05-07 01:54:58 PM  

Riothamus: Headso: I don't like the policies teabagger stand for but they were brilliant at pushing their agenda, as far as political savviness goes they are a cut above the political leftists.

Is it savvy, or is it massive corporate backing?

It's pretty easy to get your ideas out there when you have a "news" channel pushing your views 24/7.


Yeah, this. And not just a news channel, but an entire media complex.
 
2014-05-07 01:55:29 PM  

Kit Fister: Car_Ramrod: We're talking about party platforms, not pet issues.

But...you can't...fine. If we're going to base this ENTIRE discussion around the stereotype of the ENTIRE party, and NOT the politics of the person getting elected...


Fine, let's talk about Brannon's politics:

Gay marriage: As a Christian, I believe marriage is between one man and one woman.  I believe that North Carolinians ought to be the ones deciding North Carolina values.  It's why I supported and voted for the Marriage Amendment.

Abortion: As your Senator, I will support legislation that brings an end to any and all government funding of human abortion. I will also support a support a Sanctity of Life Amendment, which would establish in law, as a scientific statement, that life begins at conception.

I couldn't find anything about the drug war or religion in quickish Google.

The point is, those ARE his politics. Anyone that thinks these TEA Party candidates are rogue agents that will go against the party platform and be logically consistent are fooling themselves.
 
2014-05-07 01:55:48 PM  

Fart_Machine: Tripp Johnston Private Eye: Good God, there's no distinction between the GOP and the teatards. They are the same thing and always have been.

Much like how Fanta and Fresca are different beverages but they're both owned by Coke.


And comically the GOP and the tea party are both owned by Koch.
 
2014-05-07 01:57:54 PM  

busy chillin': FTFA:

Yes, Brannon is one of those conservatives who thinks the federal government should be confined to its original minimalist role;

*closes window*


Also, I haven't really heard anything about this dude until I just Googled him, and he's awesome. He is a "Constitutional" conservative, but doesn't actually believe in the Constitution.

"Just because nine people in black robes, seven of them voted that abortion is in the Constitution, it does not make that law," Brannon said.
 
2014-05-07 01:57:57 PM  

Riothamus: Headso: I don't like the policies teabagger stand for but they were brilliant at pushing their agenda, as far as political savviness goes they are a cut above the political leftists.

Is it savvy, or is it massive corporate backing?

It's pretty easy to get your ideas out there when you have a "news" channel pushing your views 24/7.


it wasn't just the message manipulation and agenda pushing it was the decision to work as a unit to primary other "conservatives" who were not pure enough in the  eyes of theteabagger .
 
2014-05-07 01:58:28 PM  

GoldSpider: bhcompy: Bad news for the GOP: The "establishment" candidates had to adopt a lot of Tea Party rhetoric and policies to pull that off

To be fair, Obama adopted a lot of progressive rhetoric and policies, too.  And he's still not a progressive.

So vote Republican.


Not at all, Mr Herperderper.  Rather, politicians adopt a ton of rhetoric to get votes, yet they still remain the same politician afterwards.  I was providing a current example.  Now back to your regularly scheduled circlejerk
 
2014-05-07 02:00:49 PM  

qorkfiend: nmrsnr: Lying to get elected is possibly the oldest political decision. As long as the Tea Party dies, we have made progress.

Not if the policies they advocated are enacted into law...


How many policies have they enacted into law in 4 years?
 
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