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(Gawker)   Occupy Wall Street protester sentenced to seven years for elbowing a police officer after he grabbed her boob, therefore left wing activists are just as violent as right wing activists and Darren Huff is automatically president   (gawker.com) divider line 270
    More: Strange, Occupy Wall Street, objections, Wall Street, activists, Zuccotti Park, right-wing  
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3568 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 May 2014 at 11:47 PM (29 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-05-07 08:34:26 PM  

Lenny_da_Hog: whidbey: Well then all I can say is that your absolute insistence on the progressive movement as a "brainless collective" is going to earn you a lot of well-earned hostility here. You do have some amazing contradictions.

I do apologize however, for rudely bringing that thread up in an unrelated fashion. For what it's worth.

It would mean more if you actually learned something from it going forth.

By the way, the progressive movement isn't the brainless collective I was talking about. It was the brainless Fark collective -- the ones who can't understand that disagreeing with one nuance of a larger event doesn't make all aspects of the Tea Party attributable to whomever is disagreeing.

I think it's funny, from a sociological vantage, just how many Pol-Tab Farkers think I'm a conservative, only because idiots like you will spend so much time putting words in my mouth after seeing those tiny nuances disputed, even when we agree on the larger issues.


I got called a 'well known conservative troll' the other day myself.

I guess being well known is nice?
 
2014-05-07 09:54:49 PM  

liam76: They "basically" robbed them by having cows do what they have done for 15+ years. As I said above, I am fine with feds escalating it if they are threatening them with guns. I think he is a complete asshat and if he was put down whiel threatening people stopping him from stealing I would probably have a laugh over it.


Ah, no.  "The government" seized cattle which were wandering around on public property.  Thanks to Bundy's own court testimony he couldn't be sure those cows were his despite having his brand, but everybody knew they were his and that the government had legal right and court order to claim them, which they did.  The Bundy Crew showed up with guns and "took them back" by threatening the unarmed government employees and stole what was no longer theirs.

If I showed up at the IRS with a gun and demanded my money back, I'd just be committing armed robbery.  But different rules apply for different political animals

And really?  Bringing "Obama's a leftist" into it?  Even though he's
A: Right-of-center?
B: Not indicative of which political class is privileged and which political class is abused?
 
2014-05-07 10:09:18 PM  

Fenstery: rewind2846: Smackledorfer: Ranting about THE POWERS (two can play at unnecessary capitalizing) is a little silly to begin with, but I suspect you don't even know what you mean when you use a nebulous term like "the system" the way you do.

The system that infuses politics will billions (with a B) of dollars before a single vote is even cast. That in itself skews the result.
The system that has engineered the increase of wealth in a segment of the population unseen since the gilded age.
The system that takes what few rights the people have to privacy, to self determination, and to personhood and hands them over to corporations.
The system that actually gives legal rights to those same corporations.
The system that will try a person under 18 as an adult, but will not give that same person the rights as an adult.

I could go on all day, but I know exactly what I mean by "the system" and so did the OWS people I still communicate with. It's a shame that you don't.
The opportunities, faith and promise in this nation most of their parents and their parents parents enjoyed are goner, shipped away, bought up or sold off by people who now own more and more of everything, from the media to food production to water to medical care.

This is the most educated generation that has ever been here, people who followed the paradigms this society and their parents prompted them to, yet still they find themselves at 30 worse off than those parents were when they started in the workforce. I can hear it in my niece and her late 20-something friends... they are scared. None owns a house. Only one that I know of has a child. Just a few have 401(k) accounts, others don't bother or can't get them. My parents bought their first house at 22 in 1964, my brother bought his first at 26 in 1990, with neither of them having attended college.

And it's not that they don't want to settle down, it's that they know they can't. Any day now the job they have will dry up, and they will have to move - no h ...


Actually several of them engages in unethical/illegal activities while moving to the top.  Outsourcing, lobbying for lax H1 Visa applicants and environmental regulations, legal bullying, tax evasion/manipulation, monopolies, third-world slave labor, and trademark trolling.

That isn't all of them, of course, and now that they are on top they are admittedly better global citizens. But to get on top, they had to climb upon stories of corpses.
 
2014-05-07 11:50:02 PM  

Lenny_da_Hog: It would mean more if you actually learned something from it going forth.


Oh fark off.

*favorited!*

You arrogant fark.
 
2014-05-07 11:50:55 PM  

liam76: It's whidbey, it is all he has got.


*favorited!*
 
2014-05-07 11:52:58 PM  
Oh I see. Another trolling fark Filter.

Both of you are no longer worthy of discussion anymore as far as I'm concerned. I hope that's a lot clearer.
 
2014-05-07 11:54:24 PM  
Wow. Never mind.
 
2014-05-08 12:38:19 AM  

MFAWG: I just can't make a judgement without a picture of the boob in question.


www.popularresistance.org
 
2014-05-08 04:15:55 AM  

whidbey: hurr durr derp derp derp.  I shiat on the threads by linking to other threads and then get mad when people complain about my threadshiatting.


You ARE the braintrust of the mindless collective.  Congratulations! Are you hall monitor of the special needs home this week?
 
2014-05-08 05:07:19 AM  

Frank N Stein: udhq: Frank N Stein: Seems to me that being beaten and sexually assaults is being pushed the fark over pretty hard. Meanwhile, rightist protestors carry around guns openly and the police are scared to fark with them

It's only "being pushed over" if you let it silence the protest.  Any cursory reading of history shows that liberals are willing to make sacrifices to bring to moral depravity of their oppressors under the microscope.

Meanwhile, conservatives are not even willing to endure mild discomfort for what they believe in.  There were no lawn chairs at Kent State or Birmingham or Delhi.


Any cursory look into history will show that conservatives, or "the right" if you will, have also fraught and died for their beliefs. Especially in Europe. But at the risk of sounding like I'm moving goalposts, I'd like to clarify that I meant liberals in this country in contemporary times are too beholden to pacifism, and thus have essentially made themselves pushovers.


They are only pushovers if they don't get up after being pushed over. And then do it again and again. The OWS needs to regroup and try again.
 
2014-05-08 05:29:48 AM  

whidbey: Wow. Never mind.


Your ego won't allow it.

I'll bet you'll be refreshing with the option checked and trying to get another "zinger" on an imaginary enemy before the end of the month.
 
2014-05-08 06:50:49 AM  

TheBigJerk: Ah, no. "The government" seized cattle which were wandering around on public property.


And why were they seized? Because he was stealing the use of govt land.

TheBigJerk: If I showed up at the IRS with a gun and demanded my money back, I'd just be committing armed robbery. But different rules apply for different political animals


No. This woudl be the IRS taking your car and then deciding not to if you had a hundred or so nuts with gubns talking abotu how you theyw ere readyt o die defending yoru car, and willing to put the women up front to get shot and make the govt look bad.

Lets be clear here, I hate Bundy and clowns with him, and woudl have absolutley no problem if they were shot for their BS, I am just adult enough to admit that most politicians aren't going to want a mess that is likely to turn that violent on their hands.


TheBigJerk: And really? Bringing "Obama's a leftist" into it? Even though he's
A: Right-of-center?
B: Not indicative of which political class is privileged and which political class is abused


In the context of this conversation (american politics) he is "leftist".
When somebody is says that the govt treats right wing nuts with kid gloves and only uses force with left wingers, they are bringing up what our leaders think of these groups.

tbeatty: whidbey: hurr durr derp derp derp.  I shiat on the threads by linking to other threads and then get mad when people complain about my threadshiatting.

You ARE the braintrust of the mindless collective.  Congratulations! Are you hall monitor of the special needs home this week?


It isn't just the threadshiatting, it is the linking other threads and lying about what is in them.
 
2014-05-08 07:25:18 AM  

Fenstery: Wendy's Chili: Fenstery: Pick your billionaire. Gates, Ellison, Zuckerberg, Bezos, Page, Buffet, Oprah, Geffen, Koch, Bloomberg, Lucas. They didn't get there by removing rungs for others to advance. In fact, many created new ladders or higher rungs in their industries.

Bezos made his fortune on the backs of poorly compensated warehouse employees, and Bloomberg by extracting rents on Wall Street.

And the Kochs... I don't know the details of their business operations, but removing rungs on the economic ladder seems to be their favorite pastime.

Yes. It is clear that you don't know anything about their business operations if you think that is their favorite pastime.


What do their business operations have to do with their pastime? Do you know what pastime means?

You also don't seem to know how bloomberg made his money

At Salomon Brothers... on Wall Street. Exactly as I said.

As for bezos, meh. Based on what you wrote I bet you never bought anything from amazon or any other online retailer.

Aside from Instant Video, which, correct me if I'm wrong, does not come from a warehouse, no, I have never bought anything from Amazon. Nice attempt at deflection though.

Also, they're not going to sleep with you.

...ok, maybe Bloomberg will.
 
2014-05-08 07:29:03 AM  

Smackledorfer: And also:

BeesNuts: Sort of, "Loud Noises Everyone Agrees With!"
"This will never work!  Stop."
*stops.  doesn't work.*
"WHY DID YOU LISTEN TO US!?"

Case in point, this is NOT what the first group you described said. They never said stop, they said 'you need clearer messages, better media handling, and better organizing".  I don't know how my taking time to talk to them would have changed this in any way. Who was them? Where was I supposed to speak with them? Who was I supposed to support for a legislative position that backed their ideas?

Don't get me wrong, if I cared more about the topic I guess I might have done more. But that is life. People have lives to live and mortgages to pay, and we cannot all get on the back of the bus in protest. The people who do feel strongly enough to do so and get in that situation need to understand this and work with our lazy asses, or they may as well stay home too. Is that sad? Sure. Is it reality? Yea. Even the tea party understood that. Sure it wasn't as grassroots, but neither did it turn away politicians who wished to join the movement.


The media is to blame too of course, but without pushing the names of a few leaders of the movement to get out there and run for office or show up for interviews, even a sympathetic media would be hard pressed to do a whole lot different. Had they picked random people out of the crowds they may have made OWS look even worse.


Will it make you feel better if I say I wasn't talking about people being apathetic as the problem, but people claiming to support the message while actively undermining it?

I really just ran out of farks to give about how people feel about my perception of why they weren't more successful.
 
2014-05-08 07:53:08 AM  

liam76: TheBigJerk: Ah, no. "The government" seized cattle which were wandering around on public property.

And why were they seized? Because he was stealing the use of govt land.


And who told you that?
Just think on that for a moment...
 
2014-05-08 09:28:39 AM  
She says he sexually assaulted her and has photographic evidence of her massive hand shaped tit-bruise from the encounter.  I don't really see why there's a problem with her trying to throw all the force she could handle into elbowing him in the face if that's true.

Haven't seen the video but frankly police tell the most self-serving lies in their sworn statements that I think we should give more credence to the accused than police.  They don't have an institution coaching them on lying and cheating, and protecting them from the consequences of their own criminal actions.
 
2014-05-08 10:58:32 AM  

BeesNuts: Smackledorfer: And also:

BeesNuts: Sort of, "Loud Noises Everyone Agrees With!"
"This will never work!  Stop."
*stops.  doesn't work.*
"WHY DID YOU LISTEN TO US!?"

Case in point, this is NOT what the first group you described said. They never said stop, they said 'you need clearer messages, better media handling, and better organizing".  I don't know how my taking time to talk to them would have changed this in any way. Who was them? Where was I supposed to speak with them? Who was I supposed to support for a legislative position that backed their ideas?

Don't get me wrong, if I cared more about the topic I guess I might have done more. But that is life. People have lives to live and mortgages to pay, and we cannot all get on the back of the bus in protest. The people who do feel strongly enough to do so and get in that situation need to understand this and work with our lazy asses, or they may as well stay home too. Is that sad? Sure. Is it reality? Yea. Even the tea party understood that. Sure it wasn't as grassroots, but neither did it turn away politicians who wished to join the movement.


The media is to blame too of course, but without pushing the names of a few leaders of the movement to get out there and run for office or show up for interviews, even a sympathetic media would be hard pressed to do a whole lot different. Had they picked random people out of the crowds they may have made OWS look even worse.

Will it make you feel better if I say I wasn't talking about people being apathetic as the problem, but people claiming to support the message while actively undermining it?

I really just ran out of farks to give about how people feel about my perception of why they weren't more successful.


Fair enough.
 
2014-05-08 11:01:27 AM  

Super_pope: She says he sexually assaulted her and has photographic evidence of her massive hand shaped tit-bruise from the encounter.  I don't really see why there's a problem with her trying to throw all the force she could handle into elbowing him in the face if that's true.

Haven't seen the video but frankly police tell the most self-serving lies in their sworn statements that I think we should give more credence to the accused than police.  They don't have an institution coaching them on lying and cheating, and protecting them from the consequences of their own criminal actions.


1. Watch the video.
2. What kind of boob fondler leaves a hand shaped bruise? That is like me accusing the neighbor of breaking down my door and supplying a front door that has a cartoonish neighbor-shaped hole cut out.
 
2014-05-08 11:21:45 AM  

Smackledorfer: What kind of boob fondler leaves a hand shaped bruise?


I dunno, but cops beat their wives at twice the rate of other Americans, and have a host of other incredibly damning statistics about raping/hurting/killing people at DRAMATICALLY higher rates per-capita than anyone else.

When someone says they did something violent and inappropriate the default position should probably be that they did.
 
2014-05-08 11:48:39 AM  

Super_pope: I dunno, but cops beat their wives at twice the rate of other Americans, and have a host of other incredibly damning statistics about raping/hurting/killing people at DRAMATICALLY higher rates per-capita than anyone else.

When someone says they did something violent and inappropriate the default position should probably be that they did.


That was pretty stupid.  Even if cops were saints, criminals aren't, so you would always see a large amount of complaints against them relative to the amount of bad things the cop actually do (fwiw I agree, due to the nature of the job position attracting authoritarians is quite likely to mean they have double the normal rate of domestic violence). So no, it does not become "probable" that any complaint against a cop is accurate.  That is absurd on its face. In this particular case we have a woman who also has shown willingness to lie about why she was there in the first place: first in an interview saying she was there to protest, then later saying she was just walking along minding her own business. She is exactly the type of person who would lie about what the cop did.


That said, all claims against police should be investigated. I am not in any way saying complaints against them should be dismissed.  Not only should they not be above the law in any case, they should be held to a greater level of investigate inquiry than others.

Read Lenny's posts in this thread. Better yet, watch the actual video.
 
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