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(Marketwatch)   There may not be a pot of gold at the end of a rainbow, but the Odyssey just found $1.3 million of it in an old shipwreck   (blogs.marketwatch.com) divider line 32
    More: Spiffy, odyssey, gold bar  
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4760 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 May 2014 at 1:51 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



32 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2014-05-06 12:15:50 AM  
The legal scrap over this one will be interesting.
 
2014-05-06 01:56:02 AM  
Yeah how does that work? Finders keepers?
 
2014-05-06 01:59:59 AM  

Marcus Aurelius: The legal scrap over this one will be interesting.


The legal battle was all but decided 18 years ago.

Insurance companies that paid claims on the original wreck get 8% (something over 230 exiting companies), 92% goes to the discoverers.
 
2014-05-06 02:00:16 AM  
Spends 2 million to find 1.3 million.
/Sounds like a gub'mnt operation.
 
2014-05-06 02:06:50 AM  

audiblesmile: Yeah how does that work? Finders keepers?


"A pure or merit salvage award will seldom exceed 50 percent of the value of the property salved. The exception to that rule is in the case of treasure salvage. Because sunken treasure has generally been lost for hundreds of years, while the original owner (or insurer, if the vessel was insured) continues to have an interest in it, the salvor or finder will generally get the majority of the value of the property."

Generally, the relevant courts decide the split between owners of the cargo and treasure hunters, if no prior agreement was achieved with original owner or his inheritors. Treasure hunters usually get the bulk of it.
 
2014-05-06 02:07:25 AM  
The SS Central America was a sidewheel steamship that got caught in a hurricane and sank on Sept. 12, 1857, off the South Carolina coast.

The US government has a nasty habit of laying claim to sunken treasure.
 
2014-05-06 02:07:53 AM  

itsaidwhat: Spends 2 million to find 1.3 million.



READ tfa:

Odyssey has said that based on certain assumptions, including that the remaining items are in the form of Double Eagle coins, there may still be $86 million of gold at the site
 
2014-05-06 02:12:30 AM  
A friend of mine brokered the first deal of gold recovered, the legal issues have been dealt with, now it's just a matter of bringing it all to the surface, and selling it. Much of this is worth a lot more than just the gold value, the gold ingots are a collectible in their own right, as are the coins.
 
2014-05-06 02:15:24 AM  
I thought they got all that gold years ago and were already selling the coins.

I guess there's more.
 
2014-05-06 02:17:31 AM  

Baz744: itsaidwhat: Spends 2 million to find 1.3 million.


READ tfa:

Odyssey has said that based on certain assumptions, including that the remaining items are in the form of Double Eagle coins, there may still be $86 million of gold at the site

According to Wikipedia, there was apparently 30,000 pounds of gold on the ship.

Pound of gold today's price: 20,944

x30,000=628,320,000

Take the Wiki estimate for what it's worth.
 
2014-05-06 02:23:05 AM  

Enemabag Jones: The SS Central America was a sidewheel steamship that got caught in a hurricane and sank on Sept. 12, 1857, off the South Carolina coast.

The US government has a nasty habit of laying claim to sunken treasure.


That's really weird, because a federal law called the Abandoned Shipwreck Act gives title to most shipwrecks found in US waters to the state in whose waters they are found.

Your post makes me think there must be something fishy going on here (pun sort of intended). Can you link me to some stories involving shipwrecks the US government has laid claim to?
 
2014-05-06 02:25:29 AM  

Baz744: Enemabag Jones: The SS Central America was a sidewheel steamship that got caught in a hurricane and sank on Sept. 12, 1857, off the South Carolina coast.

The US government has a nasty habit of laying claim to sunken treasure.

That's really weird, because a federal law called the Abandoned Shipwreck Act gives title to most shipwrecks found in US waters to the state in whose waters they are found.

Your post makes me think there must be something fishy going on here (pun sort of intended). Can you link me to some stories involving shipwrecks the US government has laid claim to?


I should really say "sunken treasure," and not so much shipwrecks.
 
2014-05-06 02:31:04 AM  

Baz744: itsaidwhat: Spends 2 million to find 1.3 million.


READ tfa:

Odyssey has said that based on certain assumptions, including that the remaining items are in the form of Double Eagle coins, there may still be $86 million of gold at the site


Said the person that wants others to buy stock in Odyssey Marine Exploration.

/you couldn't be more transparent

/should probably add a safe harbor statement to your posts

/no pun intended
 
2014-05-06 02:41:21 AM  
Odyssey isn't in this for the small stuff, but they'll take what they can get. I remember when Discovery was looking over their shoulder they found a load of 150 year old lead. For varoius nukee reasons, old lead has fewer alpha emitters. The cargo was therefore worth $50 a pound, and represented many tons of profit.
 
2014-05-06 02:41:45 AM  

tripleseven: Pound of gold today's price: 20,944


nope.jpg

there are not 16 ounces in a pound of gold. there are only 12 ounces in a Troy pound, and a Troy ounce is heavier than a standard ounce in any case.

tl,dr; a "pound" of gold is not worth 16x the Troy ounce spot price, and they are not even the same ounces.
 
2014-05-06 03:06:00 AM  

Ivan the Tolerable: tripleseven: Pound of gold today's price: 20,944

nope.jpg

there are not 16 ounces in a pound of gold. there are only 12 ounces in a Troy pound, and a Troy ounce is heavier than a standard ounce in any case.

tl,dr; a "pound" of gold is not worth 16x the Troy ounce spot price, and they are not even the same ounces.


Sorry, I'm new to this who weighing gold thig.

So, according to this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy_ounce

At 480 grains, the troy ounce is heavier than the avoirdupois ounce, which weighs 450 grains (g) (exact by definition), about 10 percent more than the avoirdupois ounce, which is 28.349523125 g (exact).[1]


I've done the maff.  it's ~14.58 troy ounces to the pound.

So, I'll recalculate for you.

14.58x1309=19058
x30000=572,556,600
 
2014-05-06 03:09:23 AM  
You know what I'd do with a million dollars? Two chicks at the same time.

thechive.files.wordpress.com

thechive.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-05-06 03:10:57 AM  
I was thinking another guy actually located the ship in the '80s and then went to another wreck in the Pacific and salvaged something like $52 million but stiffed the crew out of $2 million and has been on the lam every since. It would be interesting if he were to re-appear for some of the loot.
 
2014-05-06 03:12:28 AM  

tripleseven: Ivan the Tolerable: tripleseven: Pound of gold today's price: 20,944

nope.jpg

there are not 16 ounces in a pound of gold. there are only 12 ounces in a Troy pound, and a Troy ounce is heavier than a standard ounce in any case.

tl,dr; a "pound" of gold is not worth 16x the Troy ounce spot price, and they are not even the same ounces.

Sorry, I'm new to this who weighing gold thig.

So, according to this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy_ounce

At 480 grains, the troy ounce is heavier than the avoirdupois ounce, which weighs 450 grains (g) (exact by definition), about 10 percent more than the avoirdupois ounce, which is 28.349523125 g (exact).[1]


I've done the maff.  it's ~14.58 troy ounces to the pound.

So, I'll recalculate for you.

14.58x1309=19058
x30000=572,556,600


And I'll reiterate to assume the wiki pound estimate was in "regular pounds"  But we'll make the calulations in troy weights as well.

So, if an ounce of gold (spot price, I will assume it's troy weight) 1,309 at todays price.

So, back to maff.

1,309x12=15,78
x30,000=471,240,000

On a couple million investment, assuming the weight estimate from wiki is correct.

Perhaps not, cause, well, wiki, and also back then, I'd question the lading methods.

But hey, thanks for letting me know that gold is measured in troy ounces.  Since I'm not an end of the world shut in who buys gold from Glenn Beck, I was not aware.
 
2014-05-06 03:22:43 AM  

Dadoody: You know what I'd do with a million dollars? Two chicks at the same time.

[thechive.files.wordpress.com image 550x810]

[thechive.files.wordpress.com image 550x780]


Although nice pictures, you would be a moron. With a million bucks you could have that every night for two years if you run in the right circles. The rest of your life if you really knew what you were doing.

(I know you were kidding)
 
2014-05-06 03:25:16 AM  

99.998er: Dadoody: You know what I'd do with a million dollars? Two chicks at the same time.

[thechive.files.wordpress.com image 550x810]

[thechive.files.wordpress.com image 550x780]

Although nice pictures, you would be a moron. With a million bucks you could have that every night for two years if you run in the right circles. The rest of your life if you really knew what you were doing.

(I know you were kidding)


There's nothing nice about fake breasts.
 
2014-05-06 03:54:43 AM  
Clive Cussler rushes to the scene...
 
2014-05-06 04:32:01 AM  
i.imgur.com
 
2014-05-06 07:28:03 AM  
Odyssey can certainly use this after that huge debacle a few years back with Spain. I work for a treasure salving company myself, and the legal issues really do suck sometimes. Everybody wants to get their hands in the pot, whether they contributed anything or not, and whether they had a contract or not. Of course, Odyssey is a public company, and ours is private, so things work a tad differently as a general rule. Best of luck to them though, and I hope they don't part with shipwreck artifacts just for their weight value.

/sells sunken treasure e'er day
 
2014-05-06 08:01:20 AM  
Arrrrr matey!
 
2014-05-06 08:52:57 AM  
Christ on a broken skateboard, the derp in the comments section of the article is astounding.
 
2014-05-06 09:00:56 AM  
Fun historical fact: The sinking of the Central America helped cause an economic panic in the US in 1857. Enough gold was onboard that the loss of said gold sent a shock to the American dollar. In particular northeastern banks that NEEDED that gold. Remember that the dollar was directly backed by gold/silver in those days. Losing such a large amount of gold/silver meant that the dollar was literally worth less in exchange.

Of course some fraudulent actions by insurance companies and companies over-extending in investment in a booming new market (at that point the western expansion) were the main drivers of the panic of 1857.The loss of the gold propping up the value of the dollar was the sort of tipping point/panic point (in my opinion).

History doesn't really repeat itself. But it does rhyme. This economic crash framework of overextension, fraudulent dealings by major banks and a loss of capitol or credit happens over and over and over.
 
2014-05-06 10:28:05 AM  

Ruiizu: Odyssey can certainly use this after that huge debacle a few years back with Spain. I work for a treasure salving company myself, and the legal issues really do suck sometimes. Everybody wants to get their hands in the pot, whether they contributed anything or not, and whether they had a contract or not. Of course, Odyssey is a public company, and ours is private, so things work a tad differently as a general rule. Best of luck to them though, and I hope they don't part with shipwreck artifacts just for their weight value.

/sells sunken treasure e'er day


I think that gold should have been returned to whatever country the native populations inhabited at the time Spain stole it from them.
 
2014-05-06 01:15:27 PM  

decloaked lurker: Ruiizu: Odyssey can certainly use this after that huge debacle a few years back with Spain. I work for a treasure salving company myself, and the legal issues really do suck sometimes. Everybody wants to get their hands in the pot, whether they contributed anything or not, and whether they had a contract or not. Of course, Odyssey is a public company, and ours is private, so things work a tad differently as a general rule. Best of luck to them though, and I hope they don't part with shipwreck artifacts just for their weight value.

/sells sunken treasure e'er day

I think that gold should have been returned to whatever country the native populations inhabited at the time Spain stole it from them.


Salvage is a massively costly operation. Unless one of those countries plans to pay for the operation, that cargo has been abandoned a long time. I'm a tad biased being part of the business, but it isn't risk free work. A lot of lost cargo will eventually rot if not restored, and no one is going to hunt it if there's nothing in it for them.
 
2014-05-06 01:54:29 PM  

Ruiizu: decloaked lurker: Ruiizu: Odyssey can certainly use this after that huge debacle a few years back with Spain. I work for a treasure salving company myself, and the legal issues really do suck sometimes. Everybody wants to get their hands in the pot, whether they contributed anything or not, and whether they had a contract or not. Of course, Odyssey is a public company, and ours is private, so things work a tad differently as a general rule. Best of luck to them though, and I hope they don't part with shipwreck artifacts just for their weight value.

/sells sunken treasure e'er day

I think that gold should have been returned to whatever country the native populations inhabited at the time Spain stole it from them.

Salvage is a massively costly operation. Unless one of those countries plans to pay for the operation, that cargo has been abandoned a long time. I'm a tad biased being part of the business, but it isn't risk free work. A lot of lost cargo will eventually rot if not restored, and no one is going to hunt it if there's nothing in it for them.


Courts forced Odyssey to return gold coins they'd recovered to Spain. I'd preferred they had stayed with Odyssey, given their efforts allowed the coins to be recovered in the first place.

Since the courts took them to return them to the "lawful owners", I'd prefer to see them go to the original owners of the material which was Peru.

Odyssey was unfairly screwed by the courts imo.
 
2014-05-06 02:03:22 PM  
Spain hasn't claimed it yet?
 
2014-05-06 05:27:41 PM  

decloaked lurker: Ruiizu: decloaked lurker: Ruiizu: Odyssey can certainly use this after that huge debacle a few years back with Spain. I work for a treasure salving company myself, and the legal issues really do suck sometimes. Everybody wants to get their hands in the pot, whether they contributed anything or not, and whether they had a contract or not. Of course, Odyssey is a public company, and ours is private, so things work a tad differently as a general rule. Best of luck to them though, and I hope they don't part with shipwreck artifacts just for their weight value.

/sells sunken treasure e'er day

I think that gold should have been returned to whatever country the native populations inhabited at the time Spain stole it from them.

Salvage is a massively costly operation. Unless one of those countries plans to pay for the operation, that cargo has been abandoned a long time. I'm a tad biased being part of the business, but it isn't risk free work. A lot of lost cargo will eventually rot if not restored, and no one is going to hunt it if there's nothing in it for them.

Courts forced Odyssey to return gold coins they'd recovered to Spain. I'd preferred they had stayed with Odyssey, given their efforts allowed the coins to be recovered in the first place.

Since the courts took them to return them to the "lawful owners", I'd prefer to see them go to the original owners of the material which was Peru.

Odyssey was unfairly screwed by the courts imo.


Technically Bolivia, for a large amount of the treasure. Bolivia was once part of a larger "Peru Minor" and "Peru Major," with the mints being in Potosi and Lima. But I agree, if they're going to steal them and give them back to some country, it should definitely be the country they originated in; Spain has absolutely no legitimate claim on the treasure being found today.

Odyssey was basically screwed by the US though---we signed some bogus treaty and then our courts decided to enforce the treaty in a twisted way. For whatever bizarre reason, the state absolutely deplores treasure hunters and wrecked ship salvors. They've been trying to shut down treasure hunting in our area forever, which is a huge part of why tourists visit the area, but they just have it out for these guys. Probably because of the case they lost in the 80s (FL and the Fed ended up with nothing, in fact owing money for legal fees).

/sorry for the late response, was at work
 
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