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(CBS Sacramento)   In "Not Helping" news, Ca Rep. Barbara Lee says she thinks the minimum wage should actually be raised to $26/hr and that such a hike wouldn't hurt small businesses at all   (sacramento.cbslocal.com) divider line 536
    More: Dumbass, Rep. Barbara Lee, minimum wages, small-business owners, tags, Sen. Tom Coburn  
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1058 clicks; posted to Politics » on 05 May 2014 at 11:49 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-05-05 10:37:37 AM  
No, that is helping. Let's farking negotiate. Don't start with a number you think the other side will agree on, start with the number you WANT and find a middle ground from there once it's on the table. Enough of this bullshiat>
 
2014-05-05 10:41:41 AM  
Again, wouldn't that be about right had minum wage wage kept up with inflation?
 
2014-05-05 10:42:45 AM  
$52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.
 
2014-05-05 10:44:01 AM  

Bloody William: No, that is helping. Let's farking negotiate. Don't start with a number you think the other side will agree on, start with the number you WANT and find a middle ground from there once it's on the table. Enough of this bullshiat>


It works for boiling frogs, and it works for boiling people. Thank goodness we have such strong employment in this country that we can get rid of the jobs in the low-paying sectors like Taco Bell Taco Design Specialist and Subway Sandwich Artist.
 
2014-05-05 10:45:24 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


Or you flip burgers because there are no jobs available and you don't want your family to starve.
 
2014-05-05 10:46:23 AM  

Vitamin Pb: Bloody William: No, that is helping. Let's farking negotiate. Don't start with a number you think the other side will agree on, start with the number you WANT and find a middle ground from there once it's on the table. Enough of this bullshiat>

It works for boiling frogs, and it works for boiling people. Thank goodness we have such strong employment in this country that we can get rid of the jobs in the low-paying sectors like Taco Bell Taco Design Specialist and Subway Sandwich Artist.


1: What are you talking about?

2: Do you think we would lose the demand for fast food workers?

3: Do you think if we reduced the minimum wage, more fast food workers would be employed?
 
2014-05-05 10:46:56 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?
 
2014-05-05 10:47:16 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


Nothing like dehumanizing people to ignore the fact that they are also human beings with bills to pay and mouths to feed, whether or not you think them serving you food makes them worthwhile as individuals.
 
2014-05-05 10:48:01 AM  

ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?


Living wage is for closers.
 
2014-05-05 10:48:34 AM  

verbal_jizm: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

Or you flip burgers because there are no jobs available and you don't want your family to starve.


GOP economic theory says those people don't exist.
 
2014-05-05 10:49:35 AM  

Bloody William: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Living wage is for closers.


LOL
 
2014-05-05 10:56:46 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


Yeah, that's right. Poor people are poor because they  deserve to be poor!
 
2014-05-05 11:02:21 AM  

Rincewind53: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

Yeah, that's right. Poor people are poor because they  deserve to be poor!


A cynic is someone who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing.

A conservative is someone who knows the price of everyone and the value of no one.
 
2014-05-05 11:04:21 AM  
Ah well. It does little to counter-balance the GOP's demand to re-introduce slavery.
 
2014-05-05 11:05:33 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


You are the reason why welfare and food stamps are so expensive. You want people off welfare? Support a farking living wage.
 
2014-05-05 11:35:46 AM  

ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?


Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link
 
2014-05-05 11:45:45 AM  
Low skill workers should be paid what the market says they should make. And the market should be allowed to conspire to keep wages down so the workers don't make that much. Capitalism has spoken. Amen.
 
2014-05-05 11:48:25 AM  

Nabb1: Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link


No matter how many times you guys say this, it doesn't start being any more true. Bureau of Labor Statistics, well, statistics, say that of people making at or below federal minimum wage, it's about 25% 16-19, 25% 20-24, 50% 25+.
 
2014-05-05 11:48:48 AM  

Nabb1: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link


How many people make just above minimum wage who would see a boost in their wage if the minimum was increased?
 
2014-05-05 11:51:51 AM  

RminusQ: Nabb1: Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link

No matter how many times you guys say this, it doesn't start being any more true. Bureau of Labor Statistics, well, statistics, say that of people making at or below federal minimum wage, it's about 25% 16-19, 25% 20-24, 50% 25+.


Okay, so most of them aren't teenagers. BFD. 2.7 percent of hourly wage workers over 25 years of age make federal minimum wage or less. That's a pretty small fraction. I'm not opposed to raising the federal minimum wage, but not to $15. Maybe $10.
 
2014-05-05 11:52:52 AM  

Nabb1: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link


What about the percentage only slightly above the minimum wage?  Someone earning $9/hour still isn't in a very good position.

I don't know if $26/hour is workable ot not, it may be in certain areas of the country, but it's good to have the discussion.  If we start at $26/hour it makes $15/hour look downright reasonable, and $10.10/hour paltry.
 
2014-05-05 11:53:13 AM  

Bloody William: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Living wage is for closers.


You wanna living wage?  Close!!
 
2014-05-05 11:53:44 AM  

Nabb1: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link


What percent worked between minimum wage and the proposed level of... let's say $10.10?
 
2014-05-05 11:54:24 AM  
subby thinks the overton window should only be moved to the right, how about fark off subby?
 
2014-05-05 11:54:52 AM  
That would be an awesome experiment, and since I don't live in California, I am all for it.
 
2014-05-05 11:55:29 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: Nabb1: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link

What about the percentage only slightly above the minimum wage?  Someone earning $9/hour still isn't in a very good position.

I don't know if $26/hour is workable ot not, it may be in certain areas of the country, but it's good to have the discussion.  If we start at $26/hour it makes $15/hour look downright reasonable, and $10.10/hour paltry.


$10.10 IS paltry.

Nabb1: Okay, so most of them aren't teenagers. BFD. 2.7 percent of hourly wage workers over 25 years of age make federal minimum wage or less. That's a pretty small fraction. I'm not opposed to raising the federal minimum wage, but not to $15. Maybe $10.


$10.10 IS paltry. $21,800 a year based on a 40-hour work week. How is that a living wage anywhere besides the poorest counties in the deep south?
 
2014-05-05 11:55:31 AM  

TuteTibiImperes: Nabb1: ginandbacon: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

That's what they used to make--are today's burger flippers less worthy of making a living wage?

Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link

What about the percentage only slightly above the minimum wage?  Someone earning $9/hour still isn't in a very good position.

I don't know if $26/hour is workable ot not, it may be in certain areas of the country, but it's good to have the discussion.  If we start at $26/hour it makes $15/hour look downright reasonable, and $10.10/hour paltry.


$26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous. If you want to earn $26 per hour, step up your game. Dropping fries is not a career.
 
2014-05-05 11:56:21 AM  
Burger flippers getting this makes every business nervous.

If you can ditch your cube for a better offer at McDonald's, this scheme we call an economy blows up.
 
2014-05-05 11:56:22 AM  

Nabb1: $26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous. If you want to earn $26 per hour, step up your game. Dropping fries is not a career.


It is, however, work. And work deserves a living wage. I'm fine with starting with $26 and stepping down to meet in the middle. I'm NOT fine with starting at the barest living wage and then shaving it down from there.
 
2014-05-05 11:56:57 AM  

RminusQ: Nabb1: Most of them are teenagers. And very few workers in this country are paid only minimum wage, roughly two percent. Link If you look solely at hourly wage earners, it was 4.6 percent in 2012 according to the BLS. Link

No matter how many times you guys say this, it doesn't start being any more true. Bureau of Labor Statistics, well, statistics, say that of people making at or below federal minimum wage, it's about 25% 16-19, 25% 20-24, 50% 25+.


You would be, well, wrong.  Totally, completely wrong.  Total, 16 yrs +, at or below Min wage, 4.3 percent.  Repeated over and over in most of the tables.  Your breakouts are the percentages for those age groups of the total group of min wage workers.  Way to read statistical tables, you maroon.
 
2014-05-05 11:56:59 AM  

Bloody William: No, that is helping. Let's farking negotiate. Don't start with a number you think the other side will agree on, start with the number you WANT and find a middle ground from there once it's on the table. Enough of this bullshiat>


Somebody should have told Obama that some time in 09.

I cannot fault someone for highballing an initial negotiation point.  Though going too highball does run the risk of having the opposing side to laugh and walk away from the table.  And $20 is my break point to walk away.
 
2014-05-05 11:57:03 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: Burger flippers getting this makes every business nervous.

If you can ditch your cube for a better offer at McDonald's, this scheme we call an economy blows up.


Which has been the claim every single time the minimum wage has been raised. And every single time it doesn't happen.
 
2014-05-05 11:57:20 AM  

Bloody William: Nabb1: Okay, so most of them aren't teenagers. BFD. 2.7 percent of hourly wage workers over 25 years of age make federal minimum wage or less. That's a pretty small fraction. I'm not opposed to raising the federal minimum wage, but not to $15. Maybe $10.


$10.10 IS paltry. $21,800 a year based on a 40-hour work week. How is that a living wage anywhere besides the poorest counties in the deep south?


I wasn't aware "living wage" was supposed to mean "comfortable." It's the minimum. A base. A starting point.
 
2014-05-05 11:57:30 AM  

verbal_jizm: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

Or you flip burgers because there are no jobs available and you don't want your family to starve.


This.
 
2014-05-05 11:57:31 AM  

Nabb1: $26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous.


but yet it's much more reasonable than no minimum wage which is seriously discussed as an option, weird how that works.
 
2014-05-05 11:57:52 AM  

Vitamin Pb: It works for boiling frogs, and it works for boiling people.


Using an urban legend doesn't help your case.
 
2014-05-05 11:58:33 AM  
Fark the minimum wage.  We need a living wage.  The person flipping burgers and actually creating a product produces more wealth than the CEO of any fast food company.
 
2014-05-05 11:58:38 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


There's a local burger chain in my town which starts it's employees at, I think, $11 an hour (it may have gone up since I last noticed) but also provides 100% employer-paid health insurance, child care assistance, paid vacation, college tuition assistance, and paid time off for volunteer work in the community. Their prices are competitive with other fast food places. They've been in business for over half a century, but I'm sure that the crushing expense of treating their employees decently will lead them into bankruptcy any day now.
 
2014-05-05 11:58:51 AM  

Nabb1: Okay, so most of them aren't teenagers. BFD. 2.7 percent of hourly wage workers over 25 years of age make federal minimum wage or less. That's a pretty small fraction.


That's 1.6 million people.
=Smidge=
 
2014-05-05 11:59:04 AM  

R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.


How much is flipping burgers worth? Please be as precise as possible.
 
2014-05-05 11:59:05 AM  

Nabb1: $26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous. If you want to earn $26 per hour, step up your game. Dropping fries is not a career.


Once upon a time we had a prosperous manufacturing sector.
 
2014-05-05 11:59:58 AM  

Nabb1: I wasn't aware "living wage" was supposed to mean "comfortable." It's the minimum. A base. A starting point.


And that that starting point isn't enough to let you pay for a roof over your head and food in your fridge is a farking travesty. If you work 40 hours a week, you should be able to pay your modest bills, buy groceries, and make rent.

Saiga410: Somebody should have told Obama that some time in 09.

I cannot fault someone for highballing an initial negotiation point.  Though going too highball does run the risk of having the opposing side to laugh and walk away from the table.  And $20 is my break point to walk away.


No minimum wage is a good point to walk away, and yet that's been a fairly common bit of rhetoric floating among some of the more extreme Republican politicians on a national level. Let's give the voice to the left's extreme and balance it out so we don't farking settle with a wage that doesn't qualify as subsistence.
 
2014-05-05 12:00:17 PM  

Bloody William: Nabb1: $26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous. If you want to earn $26 per hour, step up your game. Dropping fries is not a career.

It is, however, work. And work deserves a living wage. I'm fine with starting with $26 and stepping down to meet in the middle. I'm NOT fine with starting at the barest living wage and then shaving it down from there.


$26 per hour is not a "good starting point." It's preposterous, indefensible, and an absolute ludicrous number. Try to come up with something arguably defensible as a starting point, not some pie-in-the-sky nonsense. There is no goddamned way anyone can argue with any sanity that dropping fries is worth over $50k per year. Those better be some tasty farking frites.
 
2014-05-05 12:00:50 PM  
Honestly, the more this drags out, the more I see the reason to a prolonged roll out. Since the one big criticism is the shock that a much higher minimum wage would hurt business, raise it to $10 the first year then a dollar each year after. This gives businesses time to restructure their pay scales and if we start seeing unexpected consequences, we can reattack.

Then again, that requires both sides coming to the table and negotiating for the better of everyone.
 
2014-05-05 12:01:01 PM  

cameroncrazy1984: R.A.Danny: $52,000 a year for flipping burgers? No, burger flippers aren't worth that much. They're not worth $15 an hour either. You flip burgers because you aren't worth all that much.

You are the reason why welfare and food stamps are so expensive. You want people off welfare? Support a farking living wage.


That; you want the economy to get a jump start that everybody benefits from?  Start paying people a better salary.

More money in their pockets = more consumer spending.
 
2014-05-05 12:01:05 PM  
Everyone who makes that much or near it right now is saying "Fark you, you condescending douchebag".
 
2014-05-05 12:01:44 PM  

Fart_Machine: Nabb1: $26 per hour for unskilled labor is preposterous. If you want to earn $26 per hour, step up your game. Dropping fries is not a career.

Once upon a time we had a prosperous manufacturing sector.


Go bomb the rest of the industrialized world to the edge of the Bronze Age and let them spend the next two decades rebuilding. Those halcyon days for the US will no doubt return.
 
2014-05-05 12:02:07 PM  

FarkedOver: Fark the minimum wage.  We need a living wage.  The person flipping burgers and actually creating a product produces more wealth than the CEO of any fast food company.


I agree with that, CEO's these days have become nothing more than glorified baseball managers.
 
2014-05-05 12:02:11 PM  

Nabb1: $26 per hour is not a "good starting point." It's preposterous, indefensible, and an absolute ludicrous number.


SO IS ELIMINATING MINIMUM WAGE.

This is Barbara Lee, one of the more liberal members of Congress. She's very much on the left in our spectrum. If the GOP gives any sort of national attention, like credible shots at the Republican nomination for president, to people who say the minimum wage should be abolished as an idea, I'm completely farking fine with starting at preposterous from the other end.
 
2014-05-05 12:02:21 PM  

Bloody William: HotWingConspiracy: Burger flippers getting this makes every business nervous.

If you can ditch your cube for a better offer at McDonald's, this scheme we call an economy blows up.

Which has been the claim every single time the minimum wage has been raised. And every single time it doesn't happen.


Oh I don't mean in a bad way. I think pretty much everything would be fine. It blows up this inherently absurd model we've been suffering under for a few decades now.

As this thread demonstrates, it's mostly an issue for people that get nervous about their own worth when faced with people they consider sub-human earning more than they do.
 
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