If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Rolling Stone)   The Flaming Lips respond to their drummer's claims of racism, abuse, and the greatest crime of all, collaborating with Miley Cyrus   (rollingstone.com) divider line 66
    More: Followup, Flaming Lips, Wayne Coyne, Kliph Scurlock, Scurlock, drummers, racists, insults, multi-instrumentalist  
•       •       •

2286 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 03 May 2014 at 8:54 PM (33 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



66 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-05-03 07:43:52 PM  
www.brooklynvegan.com

Culturally insensitive or not?

Wait... is that Moby?
 
2014-05-03 07:46:31 PM  
That drummer sounds like a douche. Find something important to get upset about.
 
2014-05-03 07:57:53 PM  

Confabulat: That drummer sounds like a douche. Find something important to get upset about.


If you read his account, it sounds like the last straw out of years of dealing with a real insufferable and abusive cock in the form of Wayne Coyne.

And lately it sounds like Wayne has gone a bit off the deep end.
 
2014-05-03 08:02:41 PM  

gilgigamesh: Confabulat: That drummer sounds like a douche. Find something important to get upset about.

If you read his account, it sounds like the last straw out of years of dealing with a real insufferable and abusive cock in the form of Wayne Coyne.

And lately it sounds like Wayne has gone a bit off the deep end.


I'd be abusive to some guy who was making a big fuss about one of my friends daring to wear an Indian headdress. Oh the humanity of it all!
 
2014-05-03 08:34:54 PM  
I didn't read the article, but is the new rule that we somehow shun this guy?  Like the RIAA is supposed to take all of his band equipment and prohibit him from playing music publicly?  That's what we do now, right?
 
2014-05-03 08:45:48 PM  

netizencain: I didn't read the article, but is the new rule that we somehow shun this guy?  Like the RIAA is supposed to take all of his band equipment and prohibit him from playing music publicly?  That's what we do now, right?


Are you trying to make some political point and underscoring what a terrible attempt it is by admitting you can't be bothered to actually read the situation involved?

Do you vote Republican?
 
2014-05-03 09:31:58 PM  
Oh My Gawd!!! Who the hell cares!
 
2014-05-03 09:34:18 PM  
Miley Cyrus? She uses vaaaaaaaaseline.
 
2014-05-03 09:43:37 PM  

gilgigamesh: And lately it sounds like Wayne has gone a bit off the deep end.


That seems to be the only certain thing in this whole mess, and that's saying something as Wayne's livedhis entire adult life off of what most people would consider the "deep end."
 
2014-05-03 09:44:06 PM  

Confabulat: gilgigamesh: Confabulat: That drummer sounds like a douche. Find something important to get upset about.

If you read his account, it sounds like the last straw out of years of dealing with a real insufferable and abusive cock in the form of Wayne Coyne.

And lately it sounds like Wayne has gone a bit off the deep end.

I'd be abusive to some guy who was making a big fuss about one of my friends daring to wear an Indian headdress. Oh the humanity of it all!


In Oklahoma, the governor's oh-so-edgy daughter flouncing around in a war bonnet, who could possibly think that's lame or be offended by that? Only a douche, that's who.
 
2014-05-03 09:53:49 PM  
The part about Pink Pony doing a tribal dance on stage is utterly fabricated.

As far as mocking protestors, that wasn't even covered in an interview over the situation with the girl.  You'd think they'd mention it as hard as they were trying to ride her over everything else.

She wore a hat of a very iconic style.  It's not like christians get up set when someone makes an actual joke over the Pope Hat.  Most of them even laugh, because even they admit it's ridiculous.  Monty Python made an art of mockery, country rubes to the Spanish Inquisition.

Millions of people see others wear hats that are not "theirs"...culturally speaking...every day.  and aside from thinking someone looks good/bad/utterly ridiculous, they shrug and go about their day.

This former drummer is a cocksplash for trying to fabricate a racist villain.
/from the evidence I've seen

As I posted in the other thread, it's no different than hating on gays or outlawing gay marriage.  As long as there was informed consent between her and the hat, no one in their right minds really should give that much of a fark.

If you think that's marginalizing, it's no different than our marginalization of Westboro Baptists, Black Panthers, Creationists, KKK members or hipsters in general.
 
433 [TotalFark]
2014-05-03 10:05:10 PM  
omeganuepsilong, you make some points.  I think that some may hold some water, and there's a lot of things you post that remind me of putting a trot line out full of treble hooks.

I think that appropriating culture and cultural objects is a very sensitive matter, and one should be very, very careful when doing so.

It is certainly in poor taste for the daughter of the OK governor to wear an Indian headdress, and to then further the slight to perceived insult as she and her friends did.  That's not cool, she was without forethought or wisdom.

Unfortunately, this was blown out of proportion by social media, which is detrimental to the maintenance of actual relationships.  For these adults to try and address matters of personal import over the internet, and not between each other as adults - that's a joke.

I've been hearing Wayne to be a bit of a TOTAL FARKING JERK for about a decade, now.  Wayne's out there.  I don't know about the rest of his band members all that much, but given the intensity of professional musical relationships, I am not surprised that cracks widened and a chunk fell off, or was pushed out.
 
2014-05-03 10:20:00 PM  

gilgigamesh: Confabulat: That drummer sounds like a douche. Find something important to get upset about.

If you read his account, it sounds like the last straw out of years of dealing with a real insufferable and abusive cock in the form of Wayne Coyne.

And lately it sounds like Wayne has gone a bit off the deep end.


Wayne Coyne has been a real insufferable and abusive cock since the 90s.  He is usually fine with fans, but having to work with him is intolerable.
 
2014-05-03 10:26:08 PM  
Wayne Coyne is an epic douchenozzle
 
2014-05-03 10:40:10 PM  
Yoshimi is still an all time classic album.
 
2014-05-03 11:06:17 PM  

omeganuepsilon: The part about Pink Pony doing a tribal dance on stage is utterly fabricated.

As far as mocking protestors, that wasn't even covered in an interview over the situation with the girl.  You'd think they'd mention it as hard as they were trying to ride her over everything else.

She wore a hat of a very iconic style.  It's not like christians get up set when someone makes an actual joke over the Pope Hat.  Most of them even laugh, because even they admit it's ridiculous.  Monty Python made an art of mockery, country rubes to the Spanish Inquisition.

Millions of people see others wear hats that are not "theirs"...culturally speaking...every day.  and aside from thinking someone looks good/bad/utterly ridiculous, they shrug and go about their day.

This former drummer is a cocksplash for trying to fabricate a racist villain.
/from the evidence I've seen

As I posted in the other thread, it's no different than hating on gays or outlawing gay marriage.  As long as there was informed consent between her and the hat, no one in their right minds really should give that much of a fark.

If you think that's marginalizing, it's no different than our marginalization of Westboro Baptists, Black Panthers, Creationists, KKK members or hipsters in general.


Okay, I can see that you are trying to be reasonable in your post and you actually make some good points about evidence, especially since Rolling Stone is a publication that has a tendency to go light on facts when their speculation is juicy enough.

However, it appears that you are putting Native Americans into a pretty undesirable list of groups there. You are referring to other threads, so perhaps some context or elaboration of your point is in order.
 
2014-05-03 11:16:54 PM  
Whatever, the Lips jumped the shark a long time ago.
 
2014-05-03 11:21:14 PM  
Wayne Coyne is worse than a mean 12 year old girl....check out his ultra douchey twitter posts.
 
2014-05-03 11:26:59 PM  

433: It is certainly in poor taste for the daughter of the OK governor to wear an Indian headdress


Poor taste?

How so?  Just stating it doesn't make it so.
Challenge:  Must be objective.  Is that too much to ask.
What does it matter who's daughter she is?

salvador.hardin: However, it appears that you are putting Native Americans into a pretty undesirable list of groups there. You are referring to other threads, so perhaps some context or elaboration of your point is in order.


If you're(collective) placing that much cultural value, and hence outrage, over a hat, I don't think there needs to be much more context.

No more sane than the manufactured outrage from all those other groups, which is to say not at all.  This is the proverbial witch-hunt.

This is what creationists do to teachers of evolution.  This is why Westboro Baptists protest funerals. etc.

An irrational sense of oppression.  It was a picture of a girl in a hat.  She wasn't defecating on it.  She wasn't making any sort of superiority statement on behalf of her race, or denigrating another race.  She wore a hat because it looked pretty.

It was treated with outrage because she is white.  But the Fark Social Justice Warrior Brigade is blind to that sort of racism.

img.photobucket.com
Apparently, all christians think that's fine, because reasons.  The sane ones do at any rate.

But some feathers in a headband, ooohhh, that's so much bigotry, because... reasons.

People the world over borrow styles from other cultures, and almost never is a stink made about it, aside from thinking someone looks ridiculous.

But it's a Native American issue, and there's still enough white guilt to choke a horse.  We openly mock conservatives and deeply religious and applaud when it's clever.

Hell, we live in a country where it's permissible to burn the national flag(as long as you're not violating any local fire codes).  That even makes many patriot's happy, because doing so in a different country could land you in jail or a nice old fashioned beheading, filmed of course, and sent to news networks.

But a girl takes a pretty picture with a hat.  WTFBBQ WHARGARBLE!!!!!
 
2014-05-03 11:34:04 PM  
Pink pony sucks anyway. Don't know why anyone would get them to play anywhere. Oh wait, she's an overprivliged white chick? Nevermind.
 
2014-05-03 11:40:29 PM  
Every person in this story seems like an asshole.
 
2014-05-03 11:43:27 PM  
The sad part is that the Flaming Lips were one of the last great true Rock and Roll bands and the fact that they kept inter-band shiat private helped fuel their image and now that's gone.

/lighten up, Francis
 
2014-05-03 11:44:12 PM  
How tough can it be to find a new drummer? Hell, Def Leppard's drummer only has one arm
 
2014-05-03 11:52:12 PM  
Like I mentioned in the other thread, my brother knows Kliph, and he is a really funny, nice guy. Wayne is losing his F'in mind slowly but surely. Their music is going downhill even without this crap. They haven't put out one even listenable song in 5 years.
 
2014-05-04 12:39:15 AM  
Wayne Coyne  once threatened to give me malaria
 
2014-05-04 12:44:30 AM  
Flaming Lips = Raffi for hipsters
 
433 [TotalFark]
2014-05-04 12:53:40 AM  

omeganuepsilon: Poor taste?

How so? Just stating it doesn't make it so.
Challenge: Must be objective. Is that too much to ask.
What does it matter who's daughter she is?


Oklahoma has a large Indian population - however, there are no reservations in the state.  There are 39 tribal headquarters in the state.  The destination for many tribes in the US, especially in the Southeast, was Oklahoma, as they were forcibly moved there.  The license plate for Oklahoma includes Indian imagery until recently (I can't think of the name of the object, OK is north of me, I ought to know), and now features a non-descript Indian on the left hand side.  Simply put, Oklahoma has very strong Native American ties.  For the governor's daughter, the white governor's daughter, to wear a headdress, is similar to appearing in blackface.

I understand that it may be hard to gather how offensive it can be - Indians are an underrepresented group, and often, when they do speak up, the public at large does not take their sentiment seriously enough.  A prime example of this would be the recent furor over the Washington Redskins.

A young person could easily make the mistake she made, and when pointed out that perhaps it was not the wisest thing to do, avoid the behavior in the future, and as the current culture desires, issue an apology.  Instead, it seems that she sought to rub salt in the wound.  At that point, I have little to add or say, as the web of social media, and he-said she-said is involved.  It seems to me that a private issue reached the public, and people overreacted.

I appreciate your reply, thank you.  I would like to have replied in turn as you wished, but it is late, SNL is on, I'm prepping for a crawfish boil, and etcetera.  I appreciate that you did not choose to flame, but rather sought clarification.

In the end, these are all acts performed by other people, whom I do not know and in whom I have little or no personal investment.  This is really none of my concern, though I think it should be underscored that when a cultural item, artifact, or activity is used outside of that culture, that proper care and reverence be used.  There is then also the time and place for humor and parody, feelings will always be hurt, but mocking or inappropriate acculturation is not called for.
 
433 [TotalFark]
2014-05-04 01:07:20 AM  

omeganuepsilon: But it's a Native American issue, and there's still enough white guilt to choke a horse.


I think that is a huge part of it.

To wear a headdress would feel powerful, wondrous, perhaps.  In the era of white guilt and social consciousness in when we live, wearing a headdress as a non-Indian publicly becomes an issue, even with the best intentions.  It would be nice, but in a sense, that is not a nice thing we can have.  Not now, at least, not just yet.

If the perceived faux pas had been recognized, had its hands washed, and put away, it wouldn't be a big deal - but it seems that there are plenty of people who make these things big deals.

I don't know why these people can't communicate privately amongst themselves without going to Facebook or Twitter; it must suck to have thousands of people hating, when they have no stake on your game.

I blame the internet.
 
2014-05-04 01:10:17 AM  
Wayne Coyne is what the universe vomits out when it is asked the question, "Who is the worst possible person to be trapped in a long elevator ride with?".
 
2014-05-04 02:00:02 AM  

Owangotang: Wayne Coyne is what the universe vomits out when it is asked the question, "Who is the worst possible person to be trapped in a long elevator ride with?".


Dustin Diamond.
 
2014-05-04 02:57:36 AM  
I know Kliph from way back and he is a solid dude.
 
2014-05-04 04:11:23 AM  
Jesus.

If you use the phrase "white guilt," you're either an asshole or a communist.

Possibly both.

/here's a hint:  white people imitating a race they nearly wiped out to look cool is, in fact, worse than a race that's been nearly wiped out imitating white people to look cool.
 
2014-05-04 04:19:21 AM  

Dafatone: Jesus.

If you use the phrase "white guilt," you're either an asshole or a colummunist.

 
2014-05-04 06:04:09 AM  

Dafatone: Jesus.

If you use the phrase "white guilt," you're either an asshole or a communist.

Possibly both.


I rarely hear the phrase used seriously any more - it's use is usually sarcastic or ironic, and part of an attack on some "race traitor" who has acknowledged that his white skin may have possibly conferred some teensy-weensy advantage on him at some point in life.
"Self loathing" is another old time fave with that crowd.
 
2014-05-04 09:06:02 AM  

433: Bunch of (almost)reasons.


So, still nothing objective.

Dafatone: Jesus.

If you use the phrase "white guilt," you're either an asshole or a communist.

Possibly both.

/here's a hint:   white people imitating a race they nearly wiped out to look cool is, in fact, worse than a race that's been nearly wiped out imitating white people to look cool.


Careful who you're lumping togethere there pal.  This girl is not old enough to have taken part in any of that, pretty much no one alive today was alive when the extermination was happening.

If you think descendents are still to be held responsible for the sins of their great great grandparents, then you've got some really farked up world views.

Sure, remember it and try to not let bad things from history repeat, but to hold people alive today to blame for what happened is a not just a bit on the irrational side, it's farking nuts.

You say white guilt is ridiculous, and then turn right around and say whites should have the guilt.

jso2897: it's use is usually sarcastic or ironic, and part of an attack on some "race traitor" who has acknowledged that his white skin may have possibly conferred some teensy-weensy advantage on him at some point in life.


See above, since you clearly don't understand the concept.
 
2014-05-04 09:53:10 AM  
Why does everyone is this country shiat their pants as soon as they get out of bed in the morning? I'd really like to know.....
 
2014-05-04 09:53:54 AM  
*in'


/it's early
// I crapped my pants...
 
2014-05-04 10:11:29 AM  

FlippityFlap: Why does everyone is this country shiat their pants as soon as they get out of bed in the morning? I'd really like to know.....


Because otherwise you'd spend all day washing the sheets.
 
2014-05-04 10:19:41 AM  
4.bp.blogspot.com

wdfyfe.files.wordpress.com
248shooter.comwww.politifake.org strategylab.ca 2.bp.blogspot.com
treasure.diylol.com
 
2014-05-04 10:46:55 AM  
Maybe, just maybe, a band like the Flaming Lips has a lot of drug addicted artists in it, and that may explain some of their douchey actions and petty grudges.

/Seriously, nobody gets fired from a band over a girl posting a photo on the internet. There's some deep, albeit stupid, sh*t between these guys.
 
2014-05-04 11:06:25 AM  

omeganuepsilon: 433: It is certainly in poor taste for the daughter of the OK governor to wear an Indian headdress

Poor taste?

How so?  Just stating it doesn't make it so.
Challenge:  Must be objective.  Is that too much to ask.
What does it matter who's daughter she is?

salvador.hardin: However, it appears that you are putting Native Americans into a pretty undesirable list of groups there. You are referring to other threads, so perhaps some context or elaboration of your point is in order.

If you're(collective) placing that much cultural value, and hence outrage, over a hat, I don't think there needs to be much more context.

No more sane than the manufactured outrage from all those other groups, which is to say not at all.  This is the proverbial witch-hunt.

This is what creationists do to teachers of evolution.  This is why Westboro Baptists protest funerals. etc.

An irrational sense of oppression.  It was a picture of a girl in a hat.  She wasn't defecating on it.  She wasn't making any sort of superiority statement on behalf of her race, or denigrating another race.  She wore a hat because it looked pretty.

It was treated with outrage because she is white.  But the Fark Social Justice Warrior Brigade is blind to that sort of racism.

[img.photobucket.com image 450x300]
Apparently, all christians think that's fine, because reasons.  The sane ones do at any rate.

But some feathers in a headband, ooohhh, that's so much bigotry, because... reasons.

People the world over borrow styles from other cultures, and almost never is a stink made about it, aside from thinking someone looks ridiculous.

But it's a Native American issue, and there's still enough white guilt to choke a horse.  We openly mock conservatives and deeply religious and applaud when it's clever.

Hell, we live in a country where it's permissible to burn the national flag(as long as you're not violating any local fire codes).  That even makes many patriot's happy, because doing so in a different country coul ...


Ironic (or some would say hypocritical) that you're using the same arguments that creationists use against evolutionists to (unsuccessfully) try to negate their arguments. None of us were alive when (mostly white) Americans owned other people, both domestic and foreign. However, it's still in poor taste for a white person to wear blackface, despite it being a dominant form of American entertainment for decades (long after the Civil War ended).

Your failure to understand the significance of a native headdress does not, in any way, diminish its importance to them. The war bonnet is an item of great religious value, worn only on special occasions and only with permission of tribal leadership.

Taste is, by definition, not an objective quality. Cultural differences are among the reasons why it's considered poor taste to show some individuals the bottom of your foot, or offering your left hand for a handshake even if you are left-handed. Ignorance of cultural differences does not diminish those differences.

What is the statute of limitations on a sense of oppression, rational or not? The Bosniaks, Rwandan Tutsis, Jews, Roma, and homosexuals would like to know.
 
2014-05-04 11:31:32 AM  

bgflores: However, it's still in poor taste for a white person to wear blackface, despite it being a dominant form of American entertainment for decades (long after the Civil War ended).

Blackface =\= appropriating a clothing style because you find it aesthetically pleasing.

Black face was created with the intention of degrading or perpetuating stereotypes.

You are bad at analogies.

bgflores: What is the statute of limitations on a sense of oppression


She wore a hat.  She wasn't oppressing anyone.

It's so irrational that the rest of the question is irrelevant.

People who are oppressed, you can measure this objectively, have a rational reason to have that "sense". LBGT people in this country are oppressed, ie many places don't allow them to marry.

People who are not oppressed, possessing an irrational sense of it, are unintelligent morons.  Like the christians that constantly talk about being oppressed when people talk about evolution.  They're ignored because they're dipshiats.

bgflores: Ironic (or some would say hypocritical) that you're using the same arguments that creationists use against evolutionists to (unsuccessfully) try to negate their arguments.


What?  I'm moving that there is nothing sacred about a hat, and somehow I'm akin to a creationist?

Borderline Insane Troll Logic.

My argument is that of rational people against creationists and other parties that think along the same lines.
 
2014-05-04 11:38:29 AM  
433 makes some valid points, but it does seem predecated on the assertion that wearing a headdress is morally equivalent to blackface.  I'm way too far away to know ... Is this true? Is this opinion widely held by Native Americans?
 
2014-05-04 11:54:37 AM  

omeganuepsilon: Borderline Insane Troll Logic.


...and there went my last ironicalometer. This is getting expensive.
 
2014-05-04 12:01:58 PM  
omeganuepsilon: Spammy pics ofstraw folk and platitudes


You must stay up thinking about this type of stuff a lot. But not thinking in the fluid sense. Why is it that other people taking offense over this type of thing, which is pretty much a normal reaction, offend you so? It's like gay marriage, right? The offense taken and the person feeling the offense are consensual. Just like how a hat consents to be worn by a woman. Am I doing it right?  Why would you or anyone else care so much about others people's parameters of what offends them? I'm for offense equality. Are you saying that the definition of offense is sacred to you and that the offense that people are feeling towards this women is not the the true offense that God intended?  By your own logic, It's not really your business to judge what other people find to be offensive. Why does their personal, private, offense and their freedom to discuss it bother you so? Do you find it offensive?
 
2014-05-04 12:08:16 PM  

gwowen: 433 makes some valid points, but it does seem predecated on the assertion that wearing a headdress is morally equivalent to blackface.  I'm way too far away to know ... Is this true? Is this opinion widely held by Native Americans?


No, it's a vocal minority.

The one's offended that deeply by other races wearing "their" hat are a splinter group, very much akin to Westboro Baptists and Christians at large, or the KKK in relation to white people at large.
 
2014-05-04 12:08:52 PM  

omeganuepsilon: The ones


ftfm
 
2014-05-04 12:21:42 PM  
I'm sure there is far more to this story. Kilph has probably got the Don Felder syndrome - a whiny ass biatch. Nobody is innocent here. But it's Wayne's band. If Kilph didn't like it, form your own damn  band.
 
2014-05-04 12:26:26 PM  

Dafatone: Jesus.

If you use the phrase "white guilt," you're either an asshole or a communist.

Possibly both.

/here's a hint:  white people imitating a race they nearly wiped out to look cool is, in fact, worse than a race that's been nearly wiped out imitating white people to look cool.


Yeah. Good thing that is NOT what happened here. She wasn't trying to imitate jack squat. And peopke are confusing that "headdress" with a "war bonnet". What she wore was a costume piece made BY Native Americans for sale to be worn and displayed. The other is a sacred item mafe from eagle feathers, eaxhnof which tell a story and must be earned. People want to equate it to someone whi didn't earn a military medal wearing one and rightfully incurring the wrath of veterans who had. What she did was the equvilant of wearing a plastic medal that said "AWARD" on it, which no veteran would think twice about.
 
2014-05-04 12:38:54 PM  

omeganuepsilon: bgflores: However, it's still in poor taste for a white person to wear blackface, despite it being a dominant form of American entertainment for decades (long after the Civil War ended).

Blackface =\= appropriating a clothing style because you find it aesthetically pleasing.

Black face was created with the intention of degrading or perpetuating stereotypes.

You are bad at analogies.

bgflores: What is the statute of limitations on a sense of oppression

She wore a hat.  She wasn't oppressing anyone.

It's so irrational that the rest of the question is irrelevant.

People who are oppressed, you can measure this objectively, have a rational reason to have that "sense". LBGT people in this country are oppressed, ie many places don't allow them to marry.

People who are not oppressed, possessing an irrational sense of it, are unintelligent morons.  Like the christians that constantly talk about being oppressed when people talk about evolution.  They're ignored because they're dipshiats.

bgflores: Ironic (or some would say hypocritical) that you're using the same arguments that creationists use against evolutionists to (unsuccessfully) try to negate their arguments.

What?  I'm moving that there is nothing sacred about a hat, and somehow I'm akin to a creationist?

Borderline Insane Troll Logic.

My argument is that of rational people against creationists and other parties that think along the same lines.


You're either trolling, you're just that stupid, or you're so insanely blind of your own privilege that I'm surprised it hasn't gotten you killed. It's.not.just.a.hat.To be clear, I'm generally not supportive of any sort of religious or cultural appropriation in a manner perceived as mocking to those whose artifacts are being appropriated.

Aint' nobody got time to give you a history lesson of exactly how the native Americans have been oppressed, and how they continue to be largely underserved and underrepresented today.

This is all I have to say on your continued use of the word rational.
 
Displayed 50 of 66 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
On Twitter





In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report