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(Forbes)   In case you've ever wanted a beer brewing appliance that's the size of a microwave oven   (forbes.com) divider line 89
    More: Followup, brewing, gadgets, Nespresso, home brewing  
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7279 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Apr 2014 at 8:51 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-28 07:37:55 PM  
blogs-images.forbes.com

It has a beer face!

$1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'
 
2014-04-28 08:22:57 PM  
Stop... you had me at "In case you've ever wanted a beer brewing appliance."
 
2014-04-28 08:32:44 PM  
I wonder if they could genetically engineer some yeast that will work on small volumes of wort instantly. You could activate it by opening the top of the can. Why, no sir, I don't have any alcohol on me.
 
2014-04-28 08:55:20 PM  

markie_farkie: $1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'


If you spend $40 on beer a week, it will pay for itself in a year.


Not counting supplies of course.
But then again you save money on gas
And you should never have to worry about running out.
 
2014-04-28 08:57:06 PM  
Kind of want, but no money to lay out on such an item.
 
2014-04-28 08:57:16 PM  

markie_farkie: [blogs-images.forbes.com image 840x627]

It has a beer face!

$1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'


This.  I was intrigued until I saw the price tag. The whole being internet connected seemed a little unnecessary, but that might just be because I'm old and see no need for my refrigerator or stove to have a Twitter account.
 
2014-04-28 08:58:57 PM  
Yeah, but at $1700, how much does it produce?

That's the equivalent of about 53 cases of Heineken.

\\ Damn near a month's supply.
 
2014-04-28 09:00:21 PM  
What for?

4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2014-04-28 09:02:08 PM  
www.thelonelyd12.com
 
2014-04-28 09:03:50 PM  

buzzcut73: markie_farkie: [blogs-images.forbes.com image 840x627]

It has a beer face!

$1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'

This.  I was intrigued until I saw the price tag. The whole being internet connected seemed a little unnecessary, but that might just be because I'm old and see no need for my refrigerator or stove to have a Twitter account.


Trust me you don't want that. I found out my fridge has been making fat jokes about me on Twitter
 
2014-04-28 09:06:42 PM  
Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.
 
2014-04-28 09:06:45 PM  
$1700?  Pfft I spent more than twice that building my kegerator....

Would have spent 3 times that but couldn't find anyone selling a big enough piece of Koa for the collar.
 
2014-04-28 09:07:10 PM  
Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.
 
2014-04-28 09:08:31 PM  
beer machine has been around for over 10 years
 
2014-04-28 09:08:45 PM  
1700 bucks? Excuse me?  A Mr. Beer is like $40, tops.
 
2014-04-28 09:08:45 PM  

violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.


You sound hipster.
 
2014-04-28 09:10:44 PM  

Savage Belief: violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.

You sound hipster.


No, he sounds like a brewer that knows what he's talking about.
 
2014-04-28 09:10:57 PM  
Poor people brew my beer for me. This is useless to me
 
2014-04-28 09:11:22 PM  

markie_farkie: [blogs-images.forbes.com image 840x627]

It has a beer face!

$1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'


/Im with you there.  Even if i was a giant beer fan, which I'm not, i would figure that just running up to the gas station and paying 20 bucks for some beer would be much more economic.
 
2014-04-28 09:12:34 PM  

violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.


Splurge on the 5k, and get a real 10gal micro-brew setup. Just requires a little bit of knowledge to operate (which you can find in a how-to). Saving up for one as I make bbq sauce with my beer and want to churn out a bunch so I can market it.
 
2014-04-28 09:13:27 PM  

gfid: markie_farkie: $1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'

If you spend $40 on beer a week, it will pay for itself in a year.


Not counting supplies of course.
But then again you save money on gas
And you should never have to worry about running out.


What about electricity to run the thing? Maintenance? Opportunity cost of not wasting your time brewing beer that will invariably be terrible?
 
2014-04-28 09:15:53 PM  

wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.


The video on their website is even less helpful, it seems like it takes longer to brew than normal all-grain and they don't have a cooling mechanism, nor did they mention how large a brew you can do, how much grain can be used, what the efficiency is, etc. There was a whole lot of nothing going on there.
 
2014-04-28 09:16:22 PM  
 
2014-04-28 09:16:34 PM  

wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.


I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.
 
2014-04-28 09:18:57 PM  
In my experience, 18 years of brewing, every home brewer I have ever met goes from simple extract boils to more involved and complex processes. There are a few reasons for this. For me, personally, I love the science involved. The water chemistry and profiles I build for each recipe, monitoring the pH, and so on. Other folks like creating their own brew rigs and tweaking them constantly to get everything just right. It's all part of the hobby. Buying a machine that does everything for you is like a model builder buying a machine that builds the models for you. Or a guy who restores antique cars buying an appliance that rebuilds the engines for him.

This is interesting as a project to see if it could be done. It won't make any money in my opinion, certainly not with the home brewing crowd.
 
2014-04-28 09:23:27 PM  
www.beermachine.ca
$1700 dollars you say?
 
2014-04-28 09:29:34 PM  

doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.


Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?
 
2014-04-28 09:34:13 PM  
No. Just no. For that amount you could have a home brewery that'd knock people over at 20 paces....that would make immensely more beer. And? Home brewing is not difficult. Grow a pair, take a couple hours to learn, and brew beer, tech-weeny.
 
2014-04-28 09:35:11 PM  

gfid: markie_farkie: $1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'

If you spend $40 on beer a week, it will pay for itself in a year.


Not counting supplies of course.
But then again you save money on gas
And you should never have to worry about running out.


You sound bad at math. You kind of need to include supplies in a cost analysis. It's actually pretty crucial. Aside from that $40, a week on beer? Either you drink expensive beer or you are a freakin' alcoholic. I mean seriously, that's 30 or more bottles of Red Hook, or at least four beer every day of the week, every week of the year. More if you buy it on sale at Safeway.
 
2014-04-28 09:40:37 PM  

Savage Belief: violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.

You sound hipster.


Didn't realize using milled grain for brewing was hipster...
 
2014-04-28 09:41:51 PM  

xevian: violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.

Splurge on the 5k, and get a real 10gal micro-brew setup. Just requires a little bit of knowledge to operate (which you can find in a how-to). Saving up for one as I make bbq sauce with my beer and want to churn out a bunch so I can market it.


You are getting into a shiat storm of paperwork there.
 
2014-04-28 09:43:29 PM  
Speaking as a home brewer, that looks like a colossal waste of money.
 
2014-04-28 09:44:39 PM  
TFA said he's a busy exec. He probably values his time fairly highly. If there were an appliance that would let him do what he loves, and save time, it would be well worth it.

WinoRhino: In my experience, 18 years of brewing, every home brewer I have ever met goes from simple extract boils to more involved and complex processes. There are a few reasons for this. For me, personally, I love the science involved. The water chemistry and profiles I build for each recipe, monitoring the pH, and so on. Other folks like creating their own brew rigs and tweaking them constantly to get everything just right. It's all part of the hobby. Buying a machine that does everything for you is like a model builder buying a machine that builds the models for you. Or a guy who restores antique cars buying an appliance that rebuilds the engines for him.

This is interesting as a project to see if it could be done. It won't make any money in my opinion, certainly not with the home brewing crowd.


Having a machine do a lot of the work takes variables out of the equation. That could be very useful for someone who's interested in the science and tweaking that goes into making beer. I've had some problems when trying to tweak a brew - for example I used a different malt and it came out a bit sweeter, but was it because of the malt or because my mash-in temperature was 2 degrees higher or 10 minutes longer. A machine would have taken those variables out of the equation allowing me to know for certain the effect of the new malt. That's hard to do when using a 5 gallon stock pot and HDPE bucket.

I'm not saying it's better, just different. It's important to realize the trade-off between usability and functionality, but after that realization you could certainly use this machine as a home brewer..
 
2014-04-28 09:45:36 PM  

mainsail: No. Just no. For that amount you could have a home brewery that'd knock people over at 20 paces....that would make immensely more beer. And? Home brewing is not difficult. Grow a pair, take a couple hours to learn, and brew beer, tech-weeny.


The selling point, looking at their video on their kickstarter page, is that you don't have to scrub the kettle.  You just put the drawer in the dishwasher.

Boo. Farking. Hoo.

This thing makes 5 gallons of beer in a corny keg.  You still have to measure grain, measure hops, mill the grain (I assume, they only show whole grain, which confuses me), sanitize the drawer before brewing, cool the wort after the brew, set the airlock, and if you don't have a kegerator, sanitize bottles, rack out, and cap.  Then sanitize the keg and the lines for the next brew.

All you really save is washing one kettle, and you gain having to clean out lines (which I find far more of a pain in the ass).  That's not worth $1600 to me.

Plus, as stated above, $1600 buys a metric shiatload of beer anyway.
 
2014-04-28 09:48:15 PM  

violentsalvation: Too small of a scale, can't cool the wort, or mill the grain. It's a waste of money.


Agreed. My wort chiller is a modified stainless steel beer keg with a couple hundred feet of copper tubing. I don't mill the grains but I'm a sparging fool. It took me a month to convince Mrs Fappomatic that I had to build a 3 step sparging rack.
 
2014-04-28 09:53:19 PM  
One of the reasons that I brew at home is because I enjoy the basic process. Stirring, measuring, smelling the grain as it's crushed, watching the boil, and even cleaning the vessels. It makes me feel like I'm carrying on a millennia-old tradition that hasn't changed a whole lot.
 
2014-04-28 09:57:13 PM  

wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.


There was a different Fark link months ago on this same machine (probably enough time has past that it's not a 'repeat' per se).  Basically we are talking a bread machine here.  Yes a bread machine basically does nothing.  You can use the exact same incredients, mix them up, let them rise, knead it, put it in a loaf pan, and then pop it in the oven.  But the bread machine offers two things.  1. Set it and forget it.  2. consistency.  Is bread machine bread as good as the best homemade bread?  Probably not.  Is it better than store bought white bread?  Certainly.  So you get 80% of the result of artisan homemade bread with 20% of the effort.  Same here.  The designer argues that having the consistencies in the process is most of the battle with quality.  Same with the bread.
 
2014-04-28 09:59:07 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: mainsail: No. Just no. For that amount you could have a home brewery that'd knock people over at 20 paces....that would make immensely more beer. And? Home brewing is not difficult. Grow a pair, take a couple hours to learn, and brew beer, tech-weeny.

The selling point, looking at their video on their kickstarter page, is that you don't have to scrub the kettle.  You just put the drawer in the dishwasher.

Boo. Farking. Hoo.

This thing makes 5 gallons of beer in a corny keg.  You still have to measure grain, measure hops, mill the grain (I assume, they only show whole grain, which confuses me), sanitize the drawer before brewing, cool the wort after the brew, set the airlock, and if you don't have a kegerator, sanitize bottles, rack out, and cap.  Then sanitize the keg and the lines for the next brew.

All you really save is washing one kettle, and you gain having to clean out lines (which I find far more of a pain in the ass).  That's not worth $1600 to me.

Plus, as stated above, $1600 buys a metric shiatload of beer anyway.


PBW is what, 6 bucks for a pound? Screw 'em.
 
2014-04-28 10:00:17 PM  

sgh46: for example I used a different malt and it came out a bit sweeter, but was it because of the malt or because my mash-in temperature was 2 degrees higher or 10 minutes longer. A machine would have taken those variables out of the equation allowing me to know for certain the effect of the new malt. That's hard to do when using a 5 gallon stock pot and HDPE bucket.

I'm not saying it's better, just different. It's important to realize the trade-off between usability and functionality, but after that realization you could certainly use this machine as a home brewer..


Nah, that doesn't make any sense to me. There are plenty of brewers who can replicate temps, gravity, etc, from batch to batch. At least close enough to tell the effects of different malts. I would just brew two batches side by side, exact same recipe, with the malt change. Use the same yeast starter split into the two. Also, how do you know if the machine is exactly the same from batch to batch? There is no guarantee of that.
 
2014-04-28 10:01:57 PM  

wildcardjack: doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.

Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?


Nope, full glass carboys.

Like this:

www.mikepomranz.com
 
2014-04-28 10:08:07 PM  

doglover: wildcardjack: doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.

Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?

Nope, full glass carboys.

Like this:

[www.mikepomranz.com image 500x658]


Where the hell do you get carboys for $5.00?  I've never, ever seen them that cheap, and I've brewed for 15 years now.
 
2014-04-28 10:10:18 PM  
No point to that, honestly, except for folks with more money than sense and skill. $70.00 at my local brewing supply would buy you a complete starter kit, and you really don't need much more than that to brew good, satisfying beer for a few bucks a gallon - spend about $100 more, and you can brew constantly, by alternating carboys, and spend the next 20-30 years trying to spend another $1,500 on hops, yeast, malt, and adjuncts.

Damned silly, that thing. Damned silly.
 
2014-04-28 10:10:54 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: mainsail: No. Just no. For that amount you could have a home brewery that'd knock people over at 20 paces....that would make immensely more beer. And? Home brewing is not difficult. Grow a pair, take a couple hours to learn, and brew beer, tech-weeny.

The selling point, looking at their video on their kickstarter page, is that you don't have to scrub the kettle.  You just put the drawer in the dishwasher.

Boo. Farking. Hoo.

This thing makes 5 gallons of beer in a corny keg.  You still have to measure grain, measure hops, mill the grain (I assume, they only show whole grain, which confuses me), sanitize the drawer before brewing, cool the wort after the brew, set the airlock, and if you don't have a kegerator, sanitize bottles, rack out, and cap.  Then sanitize the keg and the lines for the next brew.

All you really save is washing one kettle, and you gain having to clean out lines (which I find far more of a pain in the ass).  That's not worth $1600 to me.

Plus, as stated above, $1600 buys a metric shiatload of beer anyway.


I haven't seen specifics anywhere on their site, but I'd be surprised if the machine could even do 5 gallon batches, I mean they have like a 2.5 gallon corny keg hooked up to it in the photos and video that I've seen. I'm guessing it is also intended to set up the keg as the primary fermenter. So if we're in at $1700 for the machine, they are also assuming whoever purchases the machine has the equipment or other means to mill the grain, cool the wort, oxygenate the wort. And hell since a keg is involved they are probably assuming that whoever buys the machine will have kegs, a co2 tank, regulator, plumbing, kegerator, etc.

But if I already have all that equipment why in the world would I want to buy a machine that does 1/3 of the beer making process at around 1/4 scale of the rest of my equipment? It just doesn't make any sense.
 
2014-04-28 10:11:25 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: doglover: wildcardjack: doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.

Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?

Nope, full glass carboys.

Like this:

[www.mikepomranz.com image 500x658]

Where the hell do you get carboys for $5.00?  I've never, ever seen them that cheap, and I've brewed for 15 years now.


Only way I can get glass carboys that cheap is to find them used - a new one runs me around $30.
 
2014-04-28 10:15:09 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: doglover: wildcardjack: doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.

Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?

Nope, full glass carboys.

Like this:

[www.mikepomranz.com image 500x658]

Where the hell do you get carboys for $5.00?  I've never, ever seen them that cheap, and I've brewed for 15 years now.


It's not like a regular thing.

They wanted them gone, I took them off their hands. Might have been a firesale. But 1600/40 sounds expensive when I can get old 55 gallon pickle barrels for $12 from the Del Monte factory for that sealed in caper goodness.
 
2014-04-28 10:17:38 PM  

Jument: gfid: markie_farkie: $1700 will buy you a shiatload of decent beer at retail, too..  Just sayin'

If you spend $40 on beer a week, it will pay for itself in a year.


Not counting supplies of course.
But then again you save money on gas
And you should never have to worry about running out.

You sound bad at math. You kind of need to include supplies in a cost analysis. It's actually pretty crucial. Aside from that $40, a week on beer? Either you drink expensive beer or you are a freakin' alcoholic. I mean seriously, that's 30 or more bottles of Red Hook, or at least four beer every day of the week, every week of the year. More if you buy it on sale at Safeway.


I'm fairly certain my math was correct.  I didn't count supplies (and even mentioned it) because I have no idea what they cost.

I do drink a lot of non-cheap beer.  Sometimes I even share it with others.
 
2014-04-28 10:21:00 PM  
Doesn't it take like a month to do a batch? 1700 To do 2.5 Gallons of beer a month sounds like bullshiat.
 
2014-04-28 10:21:51 PM  

violentsalvation: Benevolent Misanthrope: mainsail: No. Just no. For that amount you could have a home brewery that'd knock people over at 20 paces....that would make immensely more beer. And? Home brewing is not difficult. Grow a pair, take a couple hours to learn, and brew beer, tech-weeny.

The selling point, looking at their video on their kickstarter page, is that you don't have to scrub the kettle.  You just put the drawer in the dishwasher.

Boo. Farking. Hoo.

This thing makes 5 gallons of beer in a corny keg.  You still have to measure grain, measure hops, mill the grain (I assume, they only show whole grain, which confuses me), sanitize the drawer before brewing, cool the wort after the brew, set the airlock, and if you don't have a kegerator, sanitize bottles, rack out, and cap.  Then sanitize the keg and the lines for the next brew.

All you really save is washing one kettle, and you gain having to clean out lines (which I find far more of a pain in the ass).  That's not worth $1600 to me.

Plus, as stated above, $1600 buys a metric shiatload of beer anyway.

I haven't seen specifics anywhere on their site, but I'd be surprised if the machine could even do 5 gallon batches, I mean they have like a 2.5 gallon corny keg hooked up to it in the photos and video that I've seen. I'm guessing it is also intended to set up the keg as the primary fermenter. So if we're in at $1700 for the machine, they are also assuming whoever purchases the machine has the equipment or other means to mill the grain, cool the wort, oxygenate the wort. And hell since a keg is involved they are probably assuming that whoever buys the machine will have kegs, a co2 tank, regulator, plumbing, kegerator, etc.

But if I already have all that equipment why in the world would I want to buy a machine that does 1/3 of the beer making process at around 1/4 scale of the rest of my equipment? It just doesn't make any sense.



Their kickstarter page is where I got the 5 gallon figure.  And I agree wholeheartedly.  $1600 would buy me one helluva conventional rig.

I should add - their other selling point seems to be that you can program the thing to do consistent batches, time after time.  For me, tinkering and learning how to do that on my own were half the fun of brewing.
 
2014-04-28 10:23:10 PM  

doglover: Benevolent Misanthrope: doglover: wildcardjack: doglover: wildcardjack: Hmm, what the hell does it do? That farking article was nothing but biz jargon. $1600 would get you 40 home brew carboys.

I got my 5 gallon carboys for $5 each.

Methinks you paid too much.

Lemme guess, orange Home Depot buckets?

Nope, full glass carboys.

Like this:

[www.mikepomranz.com image 500x658]

Where the hell do you get carboys for $5.00?  I've never, ever seen them that cheap, and I've brewed for 15 years now.

It's not like a regular thing.

They wanted them gone, I took them off their hands. Might have been a firesale. But 1600/40 sounds expensive when I can get old 55 gallon pickle barrels for $12 from the Del Monte factory for that sealed in caper goodness.


Lucky duck.  I've seen carboys at $35 to $40 regularly.  We don't all live near food processing plants, after all.

/Rona buckets are food safe and cheap.
 
2014-04-28 10:24:22 PM  
That takes the fun out of making your own  gear. Like a homemade mill.

img.fark.net
 
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