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(The New York Times)   While there may have been no legal wrongdoing, the investigator did find evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment. In unrelated news, our CEO submitted a pull request for his own resignation and we accepted it   (bits.blogs.nytimes.com) divider line 34
    More: Asinine, CEO, researchers, mistakes, Marc Andreessen, Andreessen Horowitz, resignations, wrongdoing, hostile work environment  
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2920 clicks; posted to Geek » on 24 Apr 2014 at 8:55 AM (31 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-24 08:22:31 AM  
i.imgur.com


(Why not both?)


TFA mentions this sub-article to explain the "culture of disrespect"  http://techcrunch.com/2014/03/15/julie-ann-horvath-describes-sexism-a n d-intimidation-behind-her-github-exit/

Which is some weird unverifiable innuendo based mostly around the fact that Lil Ms. Femynist Drama Queen wanted to quit for "feelings" and then had some cat fight with the boss's wife.
 
2014-04-24 08:59:30 AM  
"Alpha-male culture" and "software engineering" are two things that do not go together.

Look at that guy, asserting his dominance by sitting in his cube, with his headphones on, refusing to interact with anyone!
 
2014-04-24 09:10:14 AM  

DoBeDoBeDo: "Alpha-male culture" and "software engineering" are two things that do not go together.

Look at that guy, asserting his dominance by sitting in his cube, with his headphones on, refusing to interact with anyone!



I think she is confusing Alpha-male culture with a bunch of IT guys being typical "I know more than anyone" douche bags.  Apparently that is a poorly run environment.  You have a founder who may not be stupid or lazy, but doesn't really have leadership ability and suffers from "right-place, right-time" syndrome.  Then there's the typical "my husband has money" wife of his.

She may be a source of dysfunction for all I know.  And she may have been legitimately harassed and I'm sure she was when she started raising a stink.  But this whole thing my stem from the douche bag "know it all" culture that was allowed fester in the work place.
 
2014-04-24 09:13:07 AM  

DoBeDoBeDo: "Alpha-male culture" and "software engineering" are two things that do not go together.

Look at that guy, asserting his dominance by sitting in his cube, with his headphones on, refusing to interact with anyone!


First thing I thought too.
 
2014-04-24 09:17:13 AM  
Ms. Horvath is a prominent figure in the movement to change the culture for women in tech.

And she kicked that off by rage quitting and taking to twitter to air vague accusations that she apparently cannot back up with anything solid.

"Pushing women with strong opinions out of your company because they disagree with you is wrong"

This happens to men all the time. Maybe your strong opinions just sucked. Hit the bricks.
 
2014-04-24 10:22:25 AM  
I feel as if the last twitter commentator they used(for some reason) fails to accept that he lost his job because of this.

Did something, something bad happened - consequence.
 
2014-04-24 10:40:25 AM  
Few things are more disgusting than the liberal sexist IT douche.
 
2014-04-24 10:45:30 AM  
Sorry to see that the money man came down on the side of the Boss... as it is also well known here in Silly~kon Valley that venture capital flows to predominantly male run start ups/ men entrepreneurs... even after many an article/ tv reality show/ newspaper expose. So yeah, Tech Hipster douche bag start up a-hole, with a gold digging wife, who doesn't get that treat everyone with respect vibe and that he needs to build some social skills... that is why we can't have nice things.
 
2014-04-24 10:55:36 AM  

HotWingConspiracy: And she kicked that off by rage quitting and taking to twitter to air vague accusations that she apparently cannot back up with anything solid.


Obvious troll is obvious.

https://github.com/blog/1800-update-on-julie-horvath-s-departure
 
2014-04-24 10:56:33 AM  
This is no consequences for white men. The ethnic in one anothers arms, programmers in the cubicles--those prejudiced generations--at their typing, the water-cooler, the manager-crowded meeting rooms, employee, contractor, or manager, commend all agile-sprint long Whatever is modelled, designed, and implemented. Caught in that iso-certified workflow all neglect Monuments of unyielding feminism.
 
2014-04-24 10:58:38 AM  

Kerr Avon: HotWingConspiracy: And she kicked that off by rage quitting and taking to twitter to air vague accusations that she apparently cannot back up with anything solid.

Obvious troll is obvious.

https://github.com/blog/1800-update-on-julie-horvath-s-departure


That doesn't change anything that I posted.
 
2014-04-24 10:59:13 AM  
Someone anonymously filling in details from the other side of the story.

Moral of the story:  don't date people at work.
 
2014-04-24 11:19:47 AM  

SansNeural: Moral of the story: don't date people at work.


Unless they're really hot.
pbs.twimg.com

// it never surprises me when coworkers date and things end badly - "What did you think was going to happen?!"
// of course, I also know two married couples who met at work
// and there are some cute women around here...
 
2014-04-24 12:08:22 PM  
while there may have been no legal wrongdoing, the investigator did find evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment

. . . which would have been illegal if he wasn't rich.
 
2014-04-24 12:48:31 PM  
Github would be really cool if they had finished the farking UI and you didn't have to command line everything important
 
JW
2014-04-24 01:22:04 PM  
Twitter is the greatest thing to happen for shiat journalism in some time.  No more man on the street interviews.  Instead we just cherry pick tweets and that's half the article there!
 
2014-04-24 01:33:20 PM  
So 2 women fight, and 1 man gets fired? *Quizzical Dog*?

Seriously, techies are un-PC douchebags (and the bit where we import a bunch of "Women should be in the kitchen" SE Asian males makes tech actually sexist instead of just douchebaggy).  It works if you un-PC right back.  It doesn't work if you get all politically correct.

In a similar vein, running to the NYT and biatching about how the developers on your sexting app make porn jokes is missing the point.  OF COURSE, they make porn jokes.  They're developers.  On a sexting app.  WTF did you think was going to happen?
 
2014-04-24 02:52:18 PM  

meyerkev: So 2 women fight, and 1 man gets fired? *Quizzical Dog*?


1 man brings his non-employee wife to the workplace, lets her harass employees, berates employees when they complain about his wife, and gets fired? And you're quizzical?

Seriously, techies are un-PC douchebags (and the bit where we import a bunch of "Women should be in the kitchen" SE Asian males makes tech actually sexist instead of just douchebaggy).  It works if you un-PC right back.  It doesn't work if you get all politically correct.

Bullshiat... When have misogynists, when faced with misandry, ever said "gosh, now I respect you completely and will change my behavior"? Typically, they point to "man-hating feminazis" as justification for their misogyny.

In a similar vein, running to the NYT and biatching about how the developers on your sexting app make porn jokes is missing the point.  OF COURSE, they make porn jokes.  They're developers.  On a sexting app.  WTF did you think was going to happen?

The person whom the NYT sought out for the story was a developer. On a sexting app. Who didn't make porn jokes. Apparently, you have blinders on.
 
2014-04-24 02:55:30 PM  

SansNeural: Someone anonymously filling in details from the other side of the story.

Moral of the story:  don't date people at work.


If those points are true (and for all we know they might be) it points to someone playing the discrimination card and having it work for them.  However this would not be an acceptable story to link to her story, even though (for all we know) they are both as factual as the other.
 
2014-04-24 03:02:08 PM  

HotWingConspiracy: Ms. Horvath is a prominent figure in the movement to change the culture for women in tech.

And she kicked that off by rage quitting and taking to twitter to air vague accusations that she apparently cannot back up with anything solid.

"Pushing women with strong opinions out of your company because they disagree with you is wrong"

This happens to men all the time. Maybe your strong opinions just sucked. Hit the bricks.


This shiat is ridiculous. Maybe the guy was a royal PITA, but tech has always been (since I've been in it) a fight to see who has the best idea. You go to a meeting, you have your points, you think you have the counterpoints covered, and people are going to try and shred you if they don't like it. That isn't gender based, it's 'I hate your farking idea and here's why I think it's stupid' office fighting. Suck it up, and either fire back at the person shredding your idea or slink away because they were right.

My wife didn't understand this for the longest time: Men fight to get the idea, and then work together to implement. Women collaborate to come up with an idea (and try not to hurt any feelings in the process) and then back stab each other while trying to implement it.  Don't believe me? Start an all-female company of grrl power women. Oh, wait, that's a terrible idea.

Not everything that you take so personally was said or done because you were a woman. Heck, probably not even 10% of what happens is because you're a woman. No, we just think you have a stupid idea, and it wouldn't hurt our feelings to say this stuff.
 
2014-04-24 03:10:17 PM  

mjbok: SansNeural: Someone anonymously filling in details from the other side of the story.

Moral of the story:  don't date people at work.

If those points are true (and for all we know they might be) it points to someone playing the discrimination card and having it work for them.  However this would not be an acceptable story to link to her story, even though (for all we know) they are both as factual as the other.


Yes, but on the other hand, we generally give a person who is willing to publicly stand up and make a statement more credibility than an anonymous coward who is slinging around wild accusations while hiding in the shadows.
 
2014-04-24 03:30:40 PM  

Theaetetus: Yes, but on the other hand, we generally give a person who is willing to publicly stand up and make a statement more credibility than an anonymous coward who is slinging around wild accusations while hiding in the shadows.


True.  The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.  Some of the accusations (from the anonymous source) could be verified easily enough, but it's easier to just say both were at fault and leave it at that.
 
2014-04-24 05:00:44 PM  
I wonder whose version of the truth we should accept..

//if only there were some way of numbering it to keep track...
 
2014-04-24 05:37:45 PM  

Because People in power are Stupid: [i.imgur.com image 425x426]


(Why not both?)


TFA mentions this sub-article to explain the "culture of disrespect"  http://techcrunch.com/2014/03/15/julie-ann-horvath-describes-sexism-a n d-intimidation-behind-her-github-exit/

Which is some weird unverifiable innuendo based mostly around the fact that Lil Ms. Femynist Drama Queen wanted to quit for "feelings" and then had some cat fight with the boss's wife.


That doesn't seem like sexism much. At least, not sexism in the usual sense, men looking down at women. Just stupid bad office drama and infighting by people who don't know how to be employers.
 
2014-04-24 06:01:17 PM  

mjbok: Theaetetus: Yes, but on the other hand, we generally give a person who is willing to publicly stand up and make a statement more credibility than an anonymous coward who is slinging around wild accusations while hiding in the shadows.

True.  The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.  Some of the accusations (from the anonymous source) could be verified easily enough, but it's easier to just say both were at fault and leave it at that.


Sure, that makes sense. Incidentally, I heard this anonymous tip that you blow goats. Sure, you'll deny it here, but the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, right? Like baby goats or something.

Or, perhaps, anonymous accusations shouldn't be given equal weight, and, absent some sort of corroboration, they should be pretty much ignored?
 
2014-04-24 06:21:05 PM  

Theaetetus: Sure, that makes sense. Incidentally, I heard this anonymous tip that you blow goats. Sure, you'll deny it here, but the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, right? Like baby goats or something.


That's exactly the same scenario, isn't it.?  No, it's not, because the anonymous source obviously knows information about the parties involved.  Whether or not the information they share is accurate is something else.  Why be anonymous?  The CEO was forced to step down, perhaps this person: 1.  Wants to keep their job; 2: Wants the truth (or at least their version of it) to be heard.

Why should the word of a disgruntled former employee be given so much weight?
 
2014-04-24 06:36:45 PM  

KeatingFive: DoBeDoBeDo: "Alpha-male culture" and "software engineering" are two things that do not go together.

Look at that guy, asserting his dominance by sitting in his cube, with his headphones on, refusing to interact with anyone!

First thing I thought too.


So much this.  I don't care what hardware you have, leave me alone so I can get stuff done.
 
2014-04-24 07:36:22 PM  
That place is full of gits.
 
2014-04-24 08:21:15 PM  
Maybe it's different at one of these high flying startups, but every IT shop I've worked in, most the guys are more interested in getting their work done so they don't have to work a 16 hour day than harassing you for being a woman.  Now if you're not pulling your weight causing them to pull a 16 hour day, or causing serious drama, then you might get some flack.  And if you're doing that repeatedly, you might deserve it.

Also if you're in IT learn to have a bit of a sense of humor.  We make crappy jobs and terrible puns to help handle the crappy hours.
 
2014-04-24 08:43:54 PM  

mjbok: Theaetetus: Sure, that makes sense. Incidentally, I heard this anonymous tip that you blow goats. Sure, you'll deny it here, but the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, right? Like baby goats or something.

That's exactly the same scenario, isn't it.?  No, it's not, because the anonymous source obviously knows information about the parties involved.


I heard that the goat was mostly white, with some brown speckles, and went by "Sylvia". Obviously, the anonymous tipster knows some information about the parties involved.

Clearly, the tipster here isn't some schmuck from Reddit, but is someone involved - probably the CEO's wife. Of course she "knows information about the parties involved", but do we have to give her any credibility? While she's choosing to remain anonymous and snipe from the dark? Nope, none whatsoever.

Whether or not the information they share is accurate is something else.  Why be anonymous?  The CEO was forced to step down, perhaps this person: 1.  Wants to keep their job; 2: Wants the truth (or at least their version of it) to be heard.
Why should the word of a disgruntled former employee be given so much weight?


Because when the company's board looked into the former employee's allegations, they admitted that they found "evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment." Dude, it's in the headline. You didn't even have to follow the link.
 
2014-04-24 09:20:13 PM  

Mad_Radhu: That place is full of gits.


Are you suggesting there were acts of subversion that undermined the team's foundation? You must perforce be joking; there's a clear case history that suggests more of these people will be working at CVS by the time this is over.
 
2014-04-25 12:32:03 AM  

Twilight Farkle: Mad_Radhu: That place is full of gits.

Are you suggesting there were acts of subversion that undermined the team's foundation? You must perforce be joking; there's a clear case history that suggests more of these people will be working at CVS by the time this is over.


I just find it hilariously ironic that the company seems to be filled with bastards, when you consider the name. That's the only downfall of open source, the terrible, terrible names programmers come up with when there isn't a marketing department around to tell them how stupid the name is they came up with. As great a tool as git is, I still can't look at the name with a straight face.
 
2014-04-25 12:49:29 AM  

Mad_Radhu: Twilight Farkle: Mad_Radhu: That place is full of gits.

Are you suggesting there were acts of subversion that undermined the team's foundation? You must perforce be joking; there's a clear case history that suggests more of these people will be working at CVS by the time this is over.

I just find it hilariously ironic that the company seems to be filled with bastards, when you consider the name. That's the only downfall of open source, the terrible, terrible names programmers come up with when there isn't a marketing department around to tell them how stupid the name is they came up with. As great a tool as git is, I still can't look at the name with a straight face.


I can overlook the name. It's a way to get your source code and git 'er done. It's not like the GIMP ("The GIMP's not working / then I guess I'll have to recompile it") or anything in the history of bad marketing decisions.

If I can get serious for a bit, the problem is that they still think they're in startup mode when they need to be in enterprise mode. Part of that means not letting a founder's wife, even if she does have half the founder's equity in the event of divorce, have access to the employees. After you've raised capital and become a real company, you keep the family out of the business and vice versa. These guys learned that lesson the hard way. A pox on both sides' houses insofar as the soap opera goes.

I'd like to know what a16z has in mind as an exit strategy. Being the LinkedIn for coders is worth a lot of money, but will it end up being worth $500M-$1B given the initial $100M stake? Farked if I know.
 
2014-04-25 07:38:07 AM  

Theaetetus: Because when the company's board looked into the former employee's allegations, they admitted that they found "evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment."


They also said they found no evidence of gender discrimination, which is what she alleged.
 
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