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(ABC)   16 year old survives in wheel well of a flight from California to Maui and, aside from being an idiot, is completely fine   (abcnews.go.com) divider line 113
    More: Dumbass, Maui, domestic flights, airport police, airport authorities, Hawaiian Airlines, the wheels, security question  
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7069 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Apr 2014 at 7:35 AM (26 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-21 09:40:26 AM  
theknuckler_33:

First of all, it doesn't seem like anyone knew he was a stow away until after they landed. Secondly, I'm pretty sure a flight from Fresno to Honolulu is just about exactly 5.5 hours.

Please stop using these 3 words in this sequence.

Thank you.
 
2014-04-21 09:40:52 AM  
5.5 hour trip with a cruising altitude of 38,000 feet.  I'll be generous and give the plane one hour to climb to 38,000 feet and one hour to descend from 38,000 feet.  (of course, the conditions at 31,000 feet or 27,000 feet aren't much better.)  That means he is at 38,000 feet for *only* 3.5 hours.

If you go straight from sea level to 38,000 feet in mere moments, like with a flight, you should be dead within 30 minutes due to lack of oxygen and acclimatization - even if the temperatures were not fatally cold, which they are at that height.
 
2014-04-21 09:43:13 AM  

inglixthemad: I'll fly myself and not be subjected to the useless groping.


Where's the fun in that?
 
2014-04-21 09:43:45 AM  

mike_d85: Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.

SF to Fresno?  I doubt there would be a significant amount of time at an extreme altitude that would drop temps in the wheel well that low.  I'm having trouble working out the oxygen thing, but a ski suit could probably keep you from freezing.


Someone didn't RTFA, SF to Kahului, not Fresno.
 
2014-04-21 09:44:17 AM  
Way to go, tax dollars. There's no farking excuse for this being able to happen.
 
2014-04-21 09:45:41 AM  

mike_d85: The cargo hold isn't pressurized either, though might afford a bit more warmth than the wheel well.


Yes it is.  Otherwise any liquid, gel, or household pet would freeze at altitude.
 
2014-04-21 09:45:45 AM  

mike_d85: ucfknightryan: dr_blasto: BS.

subfactorial: Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.

Right. About the only explanation that I can think of is that the cold essentially put him in a coma for the duration with such drastically reduced metabolic function that the little oxygen up there was enough. Similar to those people pulled out of frozen lakes after 30m and survive.

Basically another take on 'You're not dead until you're warm and dead.'

Several minutes in a lake vs 5.5 hours? Can you access the cargo hold from the wheel well?

iirc the cargo hold would be pressurized, so no.

One possibility, the article doesn't say how long they were at 38k feet.  Maybe they spent most of the flight at a more survivable altitude due to turbulence or something.

They pressurize the cargo hold?


I believe so, since there are at least three accidents that I'm aware of that involve explosive decompression after a cargo hold door failed.
 
2014-04-21 09:48:37 AM  
I think we just found the 2014 hide and seek grand champion.
 
2014-04-21 09:49:13 AM  
We found DB Cooper!
 
2014-04-21 09:53:46 AM  

MooseBayou: theknuckler_33:

First of all, it doesn't seem like anyone knew he was a stow away until after they landed. Secondly, I'm pretty sure a flight from Fresno to Honolulu is just about exactly 5.5 hours.

Please, stop using these 3 words in this sequence.

Thank you.


/Goatse
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2014-04-21 09:56:06 AM  
My recollection is the cargo hold is pressurized, but not heated. The cabin floor can not hold pressure. It's a lot easier to pressurize a cylinder than a half cylinder. A pressurized cylinder is in tension. A pressurized plate (cabin floor) has a strong bending and shear force.

For comparison, a standard design load for a building floor is 100 pounds per square foot. The cabin floor would have to support about 800 pounds per square foot if the space below were not pressurized.
 
2014-04-21 10:06:21 AM  

mike_d85: SF to Fresno?


Congrats, you managed to get both airports wrong.

WTF is up with people getting Fresno in this story?!? Flight originated in Silicon Valley, not Meth Valley, and went to Maui,
 
2014-04-21 10:11:51 AM  

inglixthemad: WhoopAssWayne: Before 9/11 - if it were more than 3 hours I'd fly (lived near a major airport, where I was also taking flight lessons, which I gave up) If it is on this continent now I drive. It's actually much easier travel.

As a pilot, of small aircraft, fark the TSA. I'll fly myself and not be subjected to the useless groping.


That introduces a whole lot of new logistical problems that most of us don't have a technique for dealing with, but I agree with your sentiment.
 
2014-04-21 10:15:26 AM  

mike_d85: Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.

SF to Fresno?  I doubt there would be a significant amount of time at an extreme altitude that would drop temps in the wheel well that low.  I'm having trouble working out the oxygen thing, but a ski suit could probably keep you from freezing.


The headline says "California to Maui". That would be hours and hours at cruise altitude. More than 2,000 miles, and against the prevailing winds.
 
2014-04-21 10:15:34 AM  

ucfknightryan:
Someone didn't RTFA, SF to Kahului, not Fresno.

Nope, saw a blurb this morning and didn't bother.

MisterRonbo: Congrats, you managed to get both airports wrong.

WTF is up with people getting Fresno in this story?!? Flight originated in Silicon Valley, not Meth Valley, and went to Maui,


Fresno has meth?  I thought it had scrappy Asian prisoners of war.
 
2014-04-21 10:15:46 AM  

FLMountainMan: MooseBayou: theknuckler_33:

First of all, it doesn't seem like anyone knew he was a stow away until after they landed. Secondly, I'm pretty sure a flight from Fresno to Honolulu is just about exactly 5.5 hours.

Please, stop using these 3 words in this sequence.

Thank you.

/Goatse


/tub girl
 
2014-04-21 10:21:19 AM  
No, wheel wells are not pressurized.

Yes, cargo compartments are pressurized. And heated.

No, there is no access between wheel wells and cargo compartments.

Carry on.
 
2014-04-21 10:23:44 AM  
If Little Johnny Runaway's wheel well trick results in me getting probed by some TSA hamfist determined to make sure I'm not smuggling hobbits up my ass, I'm going to find him and beat him.
 
2014-04-21 10:24:44 AM  

inglixthemad: As a pilot, of small aircraft, fark the TSA. I'll fly myself and not be subjected to the useless groping.


What type? In the RDU area the NOTAMs just got straight up absurd.
 
2014-04-21 10:31:00 AM  

subfactorial: Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.

Right. About the only explanation that I can think of is that the cold essentially put him in a coma for the duration with such drastically reduced metabolic function that the little oxygen up there was enough. Similar to those people pulled out of frozen lakes after 30m and survive.

Basically another take on 'You're not dead until you're warm and dead.'


There is such a thing called the mammalian dive reflex that allows people to survive incidents of being submerged in cold water for long periods of time.  Basically, the body shuts. down. everything (that it doesn't need to survive) automatically once submerged.  Last I heard, medical experts thought the survivability time was about a hour and, perhaps a little longer, provided they received aggressive medical treatment upon recovery.  But that's the thing - you need to be revived.  I cannot recall ever hearing of a case where the victim reawakened on their own.

It's interesting what the human body can endure under certain circumstances.  Experts say some things are impossible, yet, here we are.
 
2014-04-21 10:34:31 AM  

Oblio13: No, wheel wells are not pressurized.

Yes, cargo compartments are pressurized. And heated.

No, there is no access between wheel wells and cargo compartments.

Carry on.


Yeah, but then you're lugging your bag through the aisles.
 
2014-04-21 10:47:55 AM  

ucfknightryan: Someone didn't RTFA, SF  San Jose   to Kahului, not Fresno.



Norm Mineta airport in San Jose, not SFO in Burlingame.
 
2014-04-21 10:53:17 AM  

MisterRonbo: ucfknightryan: Someone didn't RTFA, SF  San Jose   to Kahului, not Fresno.


Norm Mineta airport in San Jose, not SFO in Burlingame.


I am aware of that, he just seemed confused enough without bringing multiple airports in the same metro area into the discussion.
 
2014-04-21 10:58:12 AM  
There was a story of a pilot that got sucked out of an airplane when the windshield blew out. The crew had to hold onto his legs while the top half of his body was on the outside of the plane. He survived that with only a few bruises. Still, the idea that someone could survive in a wheel well for 5 1/2 hours seems implausible to me.
 
2014-04-21 11:16:39 AM  

vingamm: DAMN IT DARWIN! WHERE ARE YOU??


Probably off getting stoned on 4/20.
 
2014-04-21 11:24:23 AM  
World's most elaborate lookalike prank?
 
2014-04-21 11:32:20 AM  

Road Rash: Imagine if this becomes the new "in" thing for teens to do, after planking and such. One did it so now everyone has to try it. Darwin will triumph, and maybe people will actually start to check airport perimeters more carefully.


Came here to post this. After the terrorist tweets thing, is this going to be the new "in" for teens? It actually wouldn't surprise me if we start hearing more reports of kids trying to sneak onto airport tarmacs.
 
2014-04-21 11:37:27 AM  

Pontious Pilates: Simon said security footage from the San Jose airport verified that the boy from Santa Clara, Calif., hopped a fence to get to Hawaiian Airlines Flight 45 on Sunday morning.

Hey, that's great. He was caught on camera and everything, but still able to play ding dong ditch with the landing gear.

Remind me again why the TSA won't let me bring a bottle of water on board or say hi to my friend Jack, loudly and from a distance?


So much THIS!

If security is really that lax, it's a friggin wonder that terrorists haven't simply walkd up to a plane, lodged a bomb in the landing gear, and walked away.
 
2014-04-21 11:47:43 AM  

HillshirefarmsGOMEAT: There was a story of a pilot that got sucked out of an airplane when the windshield blew out. The crew had to hold onto his legs while the top half of his body was on the outside of the plane. He survived that with only a few bruises. Still, the idea that someone could survive in a wheel well for 5 1/2 hours seems implausible to me.


Keep in mind that the window out required them to make a rapid descent to 10,000 feet so the passengers could breath so he didn't spend that much time at extreme altitude.
 
Skr
2014-04-21 11:57:19 AM  

danielscissorhands: Skr: wowie! It will be interesting to hear this kids story on how it was up there, once he collects his thoughts.

You might want to rtfa...

"Doesn't even remember the flight," FBI spokesman Tom Simon in Honolulu told The Associated Press on Sunday night. "It's amazing he survived that."


Oh I read that, I just don't believe it =)
 
2014-04-21 12:00:26 PM  

Because People in power are Stupid: a man who fell onto a suburban London street as a flight from Angola began its descent in 2012.

It's raining men. Can I get a hallelujah?



And we're done here
 
2014-04-21 12:02:34 PM  
He thinks he's in trouble now. Just wait till his parents get the bill for the plane ride.
 
2014-04-21 12:08:04 PM  

stuffy: He thinks he's in trouble now. Just wait till his parents get the bill for the plane ride.


Yeah, but he really wasn't taking up a seat, so...  I dunno, half-price?
 
2014-04-21 12:58:38 PM  
Re: cargo holds... isn't that where pets go, so aren't they heated and pressurized, or do they have a special heated area for pets separate from the hold?

Seems unpossible that he could have survived at normal cruising altitude. Crazy! And yes, I bet his family sues the shiat out of the airline (and hopefully they will lose).
 
2014-04-21 01:13:00 PM  

Skr: danielscissorhands: Skr: wowie! It will be interesting to hear this kids story on how it was up there, once he collects his thoughts.

You might want to rtfa...

"Doesn't even remember the flight," FBI spokesman Tom Simon in Honolulu told The Associated Press on Sunday night. "It's amazing he survived that."

Oh I read that, I just don't believe it =)


I believe it. He was probably unconscious for most of it. But he might have remembered some of it.
 
2014-04-21 01:24:42 PM  

danielscissorhands: Skr: danielscissorhands: Skr: wowie! It will be interesting to hear this kids story on how it was up there, once he collects his thoughts.

You might want to rtfa...

"Doesn't even remember the flight," FBI spokesman Tom Simon in Honolulu told The Associated Press on Sunday night. "It's amazing he survived that."

Oh I read that, I just don't believe it =)

I believe it. He was probably unconscious for most of it. But he might have remembered some of it.


I would guess that most of what he would remember would be a feeling of impending doom as the temperature dropped and it got harder to breathe.
 
2014-04-21 01:27:03 PM  

Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.


I wonder if it's similar to some of the "miracle" stories of surviving hypothermia?  I.e. the kid's core temp went down just right and so he was in a state of very slow barely biologically functioning, thus not requiring much oxygen?  There's been some cases of younger kids drowning in frozen lakes and being revived 45 minutes later, similar principle.  And with death from exposure/hypothermia, the rule is they don't pronounce anyone dead until they're warmed up and STILL have no heartbeat.

But yeah, that is some crazy odds.

lifeboat: There is such a thing called the mammalian dive reflex that allows people to survive incidents of being submerged in cold water for long periods of time.  Basically, the body shuts. down. everything (that it doesn't need to survive) automatically once submerged.  Last I heard, medical experts thought the survivability time was about a hour and, perhaps a little longer, provided they received aggressive medical treatment upon recovery.  But that's the thing - you need to be revived.  I cannot recall ever hearing of a case where the victim reawakened on their own.


Indeed - the kid woke up by himself?

People claiming it's a hoax would need to give another explanation for all this (if he actually was inside the plane without paying probably that would be a bigger concern for the TSA) but... yeah, kid is on the ground in Hawaii, and on the security camera in California, so he travelled SOMEHOW.

Crazy story.
 
2014-04-21 01:28:05 PM  

anfrind: I would guess that most of what he would remember would be a feeling of impending doom as the temperature dropped and it got harder to breathe.


Probably had the "oh shiat I'm going to actually DIE this was a very very very very bad idea..." thought before passing out.
 
2014-04-21 01:28:51 PM  
I miss military transport. Wish I could still do it. Say, $100 anywhere in the US one way. No seats, no reading lights, no air waitress, no interior comforts. Just walk on the unfinished interior of an aircraft with your luggage. A crew member lashes all the bags down to the floor someplace while you find a place to sit on a mesh bench and put earplugs in.

It's really loud, so nobody tries to talk to you. No hustle and bustle of bags going in and out of the overhead. No waking people up when you step over them to take a piss  - just take a nap and wake up where you want to be. Less illness, everything is metal and nylon, so they can just pressure wash to clean, (the carpet and fabric in commercial is, well, nasty.) Plus, you can stretch your legs all the way out, or even lay flat out if the passenger load is light.

Know how when the plane arrives and people are crowded in the aisle and hunch up under the overhead, with everyone frustrated? Don't get that with cargo flights. You can stand up and walk around. No waiting at baggage for the belt to start - pick your stuff up and go.

It's ironic that you go to the airport, get in a Q to check bags, then go through security and sit on hard benches for an hour or two, just to sit on an uncomfortable, but stylish, aircraft seat to be served crap food by someone burned out by routine.

Hell, I'd fly the wheel well for $25 - just give me a jumpsuit and oxygen mask.
 
2014-04-21 01:37:12 PM  
FYI - from anotther news site - "A total of 105 people are known to have attempted to fly inside wheel wells on 94 flights worldwide, the FAA's Civil Aerospace Medical Institute says. Of those, 25 made it through, including a 9-year-old child -- a survival rate of 24%. One of the flights went as high as 39,000 feet."

So it is do able, lousy odds though. You'd have to be Stupid or Desperate or Both.
 
2014-04-21 01:39:52 PM  

itazurakko: Oblio13: dinch: Wheel wells are pressurized?

They're not, and i'm having a hard time believing this, too. Several hours with temps of probably 40 below, and essentially no oxygen.

I wonder if it's similar to some of the "miracle" stories of surviving hypothermia?  I.e. the kid's core temp went down just right and so he was in a state of very slow barely biologically functioning, thus not requiring much oxygen?  There's been some cases of younger kids drowning in frozen lakes and being revived 45 minutes later, similar principle.  And with death from exposure/hypothermia, the rule is they don't pronounce anyone dead until they're warmed up and STILL have no heartbeat.

But yeah, that is some crazy odds.

lifeboat: There is such a thing called the mammalian dive reflex that allows people to survive incidents of being submerged in cold water for long periods of time.  Basically, the body shuts. down. everything (that it doesn't need to survive) automatically once submerged.  Last I heard, medical experts thought the survivability time was about a hour and, perhaps a little longer, provided they received aggressive medical treatment upon recovery.  But that's the thing - you need to be revived.  I cannot recall ever hearing of a case where the victim reawakened on their own.

Indeed - the kid woke up by himself?

People claiming it's a hoax would need to give another explanation for all this (if he actually was inside the plane without paying probably that would be a bigger concern for the TSA) but... yeah, kid is on the ground in Hawaii, and on the security camera in California, so he travelled SOMEHOW.

Crazy story.


People have survived it before. So, it's not impossible that he survived it.
 
2014-04-21 02:17:15 PM  
I can understand the semi-coma state from the cold and lack of oxygen allowing him to somehow live being unlikely, but possible.  But how does he revive once they are preparing for landing and they lower the gear to land at Maui?  Assuming this isn't an elaborate hoax, a lot of freakish things had to go right for him to not only survive the flight, but survive the landing and rollout allowing him to get off the gear on the runway. Perhaps he should be kept in custody and studied/dissected to find out what makes him special.
 
2014-04-21 02:18:14 PM  

Maul555: I hope someone explains to him that this is "3rd worlder with a death wish" behavior, and that many people have literaly died from this.   Now go ground him until he is 18 and then kick him out.


He was trying to escape the third world hell hole known as 'California'.

/submitted this with a better headline
 
2014-04-21 02:23:04 PM  

Daedalus27: I can understand the semi-coma state from the cold and lack of oxygen allowing him to somehow live being unlikely, but possible.  But how does he revive once they are preparing for landing and they lower the gear to land at Maui?  Assuming this isn't an elaborate hoax, a lot of freakish things had to go right for him to not only survive the flight, but survive the landing and rollout allowing him to get off the gear on the runway. Perhaps he should be kept in custody and studied/dissected to find out what makes him special.


If he was wedged in well, he could have been asleep until the plane was at the gate, and then slowly came to as his body got used to normal oxygen levels again.  There isn't a lot of space in a wheel well, but it is possible.
 
2014-04-21 02:28:00 PM  
I liked pinball
 
2014-04-21 02:34:57 PM  
Google "Fidel Maruhi".
 
2014-04-21 02:38:33 PM  
This thread was finished before it even took off.

/let off some steam
 
2014-04-21 02:42:05 PM  

AngryDragon: Walker: Great security there airports. If a 16-year-old can hop a fence and get on a plane what's to stop a terrorist from doing it? Answer: Nothing.

Meanwhile for the rest of us inside the airport......
"Sir, I'm gonna need to look inside your asshole"
[img.photobucket.com image 769x431]

[img.photobucket.com image 600x522]

Nobody could be so stupid as to believe that we aren't spending a disgusting amount on "homeland security" that is probably only marginally effective and that maybe we need to rethink this insanity.

FTA: "I have long been concerned about security at our airport perimeters. #Stowaway teen demonstrates vulnerabilities that need to be addressed," tweeted Rep. Eric Swalwell, a Democrat who represents the San Francisco Bay Area's eastern cities and suburbs. "

OH GODDAMN IT!


Uh, the reason is because the majority of the 300 million people in this country would not fly on air planes if they just accepted the risk of terrorism or death on an aircraft.  The TSA was literally started to provide the flying public with the reassurance that flying is safe, even if it is only the public appearance of safety. 

Remember after 9/11 when most of the national airlines were headed towards bankruptcy because the flying population dropped significantly in response to threat of terror in the skies? Yeah, well, welcome to how you keep businesses in business. 

People don't want to accept that everyday, they could be nuked from orbit by some ex-CCCP general that sold some spare bomb parts to Habib in Pakistan.  They would just rather pretend and/or ignore those threats while driving in a car that is, statistically far less safe, than an aircraft.

TL;DR verion - people are pants-wettingly scared of anything that goes "boo" and will do anything for the reassurance that noise-cancelling headphones offer.
 
2014-04-21 02:42:08 PM  
I just had a thought...   if the planes wheels where sitting in the sun for a while before takeoff, they might retain enough heat to stop him from freezing to death...   But that is a lot of hours...
 
2014-04-21 02:58:12 PM  

Maul555: I just had a thought...   if the planes wheels where sitting in the sun for a while before takeoff, they might retain enough heat to stop him from freezing to death...   But that is a lot of hours.


Any kind of "stored" heat would go away pretty quickly at 38,000 feet where temps are usually -75F and going ~500 knots for 5.5 hours.

Kid will face charges if the TSA takes a lot of heat for this.  Parents better hope that Britney flashes her hoo-ha again to distract the general public.
 
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