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(Cleveland Plain Dealer)   Where'd it start going downhill for the Browns? Hmm, let's look at the first five rounds of the 1974 draft: Cleveland--Billy Corbett and Mark Ilgenfritz. Pittsburgh: Lynn Swann, Jack Lambert, Jon Stallworth, Mike Webster   (cleveland.com) divider line 35
    More: Asinine, Mike Webster, Lynn Swann, Browns, Cleveland, Steelers, NFL, Art Rooney, CFL  
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533 clicks; posted to Sports » on 20 Apr 2014 at 7:46 PM (31 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-20 03:50:18 PM  
And Cleveland had to endure another 21 years of that worthless POS Modell.
 
2014-04-20 04:09:30 PM  
The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.
 
2014-04-20 06:34:25 PM  
Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.
 
2014-04-20 06:48:12 PM  

teto85: The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.


This
 
2014-04-20 07:15:11 PM  

mikemoto: teto85: The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.

This


Perhaps, but he made some rather major blunders himself -- getting rid of Hall of Famers Doug Atkins, Willie Davis, Henry Jordan, Len Dawson and Bobby Mitchell. He only took Jim Brown in 1957 because two QBs he wanted to pick, John Brodie and Dawson, were already taken. Mitchell was a bad trade; getting rid of an all-pro for a college phenom, no matter how good the phenom was, is always a bad move. (And Modell had obviously not learned that lesson a decade later when he traded Paul Warfield for Mike Phipps.) And when Brown did get Dawson, in 1960, he rarely played him and eventually let him go to the AFL in 1962.
 
2014-04-20 07:49:39 PM  

SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.


No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.
 
2014-04-20 08:08:58 PM  
I used to hate the browns and loved it when the stillers kicked their butt. Now I just feel sorry for them.

/go pens
 
2014-04-20 08:13:52 PM  

CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.


Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.
 
2014-04-20 08:22:58 PM  
Modell.  Sure, the game was starting to get away from Brown at the end, but in the end, Modell was in charge of what has become one of the longest slides in NFL history.  (I don't really count the Cards or Lions; the hill they've slid down may be longer, but it sure as shiat wasn't ever as steep.)  And before it gets said, remember that he really wasn't pulling strings with the 2000 Ravens.
 
2014-04-20 08:32:20 PM  

llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.



Well, there's nobody on the level of Luck this year, but there might be a Flacco or a Matt Ryan lurking in the draft.

I just know I'm glad the Eagles have Foles and don't have to take a QB.
 
2014-04-20 08:48:56 PM  
Comparing any team's draft to the best single draft a team has ever made will always make it pale in comparison.
 
2014-04-20 08:50:06 PM  
i192.photobucket.com

They have the start of something good, but, just can't quite get the key pieces in place, but, I look at them as being potentially dangerous. They just need 1 or 2 stars and a season or two of confidence and they'll be competitive.

Once the draft is over, I'll start the hatred up again.
 
2014-04-20 08:50:35 PM  

llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.


They'll more than likely be sticking it out with Hoyer for this year, regardless of who they draft. Like SilentStrider said, there aren't any Andrew Lucks in this draft, but there are guys who, with the benefit of a year or two to just sit and learn the game, could potentially be on the level of Matt Stafford (on his good days) or Colin Kaepernick.

The key difference between this upcoming season and any other season for the Browns since 1999 is that whoever takes over at QB will actually have weapons and protection, thus eliminating another Colt McCoy scenario where the guy plays like sh*t but still maintains a large and loyal fanbase who contend that the reason he stinks on ice is because he doesn't have anything to work with on offense.

/They'll still find some way to muck it up.
 
2014-04-20 08:53:10 PM  

SilentStrider: llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.


Well, there's nobody on the level of Luck this year, but there might be a Flacco or a Matt Ryan lurking in the draft.

I just know I'm glad the Eagles have Foles and don't have to take a QB.


Bridgewater could be the next Pennington (and will probably be picked by Jacksonville).  I don't know enough about  Garoppolo to say either way.

Bortles, Manziel, and Carr? bust, bust, and bigger bust than his brother.
 
2014-04-20 09:55:32 PM  

llortcM_yllort: SilentStrider: llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.


Well, there's nobody on the level of Luck this year, but there might be a Flacco or a Matt Ryan lurking in the draft.

I just know I'm glad the Eagles have Foles and don't have to take a QB.

Bridgewater could be the next Pennington (and will probably be picked by Jacksonville).  I don't know enough about  Garoppolo to say either way.

Bortles, Manziel, and Carr? bust, bust, and bigger bust than his brother.


Having seen Bridgewater in action live several times last season he is a VERY good QB. Reminds me a lot of Big Ben just slightly smaller and more likely to run. He can take a hit though. He has had problems of overlooking wide open receivers down field but his short/medium range stuff is fantastic. I agree though he'll probably end up with the Jags.
 
2014-04-20 10:11:34 PM  

llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.


Or, y'know, maybe those flashes of Brian Hoyer were the real deal and he becomes Brady Jr.
 
2014-04-20 10:16:35 PM  
pretty sure it started going downhill when modell forced out the guy the franchise was friggin' named after

of course the browns did make it to 3 AFC championships in the 80's... and lost all 3, so they had that going for them

and then there was the Couch era

we'll see how the new regime does, whether it's a stop-gap or something else
 
2014-04-20 10:26:46 PM  

IlGreven: llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.

Or, y'know, maybe those flashes of Brian Hoyer were the real deal and he becomes Brady Jr.


He's too old to be Brady, Jr. At best, he's Kurt Warner Lite.

/Most likely just Derek Anderson with a higher IQ and less hair.
 
2014-04-20 10:38:11 PM  

llortcM_yllort: I don't know enough about Garoppolo to say either way.


He went to the same school as Tony Romo. Do with that what you will.

CavalierEternal: The key difference between this upcoming season and any other season for the Browns since 1999 is that whoever takes over at QB will actually have weapons and protection, thus eliminating another Colt McCoy scenario where the guy plays like sh*t but still maintains a large and loyal fanbase who contend that the reason he stinks on ice is because he doesn't have anything to work with on offense.


Who do they have at running back? Am I right in thinking they signed Ben Tate?
 
2014-04-20 11:16:22 PM  

SilentStrider: CavalierEternal: The key difference between this upcoming season and any other season for the Browns since 1999 is that whoever takes over at QB will actually have weapons and protection, thus eliminating another Colt McCoy scenario where the guy plays like sh*t but still maintains a large and loyal fanbase who contend that the reason he stinks on ice is because he doesn't have anything to work with on offense.


Who do they have at running back? Am I right in thinking they signed Ben Tate?


We've got Ben Tate, Dion Lewis coming back from a broken leg, Edmond Baker, who ran well for us at the end of last season, still on the roster and inevitably someone else in the early-to-mid rounds of the draft. Shouldn't be a weak spot.

/I say "shouldn't".
//It's still the Browns.
 
2014-04-21 12:31:00 AM  

CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: CavalierEternal: The key difference between this upcoming season and any other season for the Browns since 1999 is that whoever takes over at QB will actually have weapons and protection, thus eliminating another Colt McCoy scenario where the guy plays like sh*t but still maintains a large and loyal fanbase who contend that the reason he stinks on ice is because he doesn't have anything to work with on offense.


Who do they have at running back? Am I right in thinking they signed Ben Tate?

We've got Ben Tate, Dion Lewis coming back from a broken leg, Edmond Baker, who ran well for us at the end of last season, still on the roster and inevitably someone else in the early-to-mid rounds of the draft. Shouldn't be a weak spot.

/I say "shouldn't".
//It's still the Browns.



I'll say this... They fleeced Indy in the Richardson trade. That extra first round pick could help them immensely.
 
2014-04-21 01:00:24 AM  

SilentStrider: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: CavalierEternal: The key difference between this upcoming season and any other season for the Browns since 1999 is that whoever takes over at QB will actually have weapons and protection, thus eliminating another Colt McCoy scenario where the guy plays like sh*t but still maintains a large and loyal fanbase who contend that the reason he stinks on ice is because he doesn't have anything to work with on offense.


Who do they have at running back? Am I right in thinking they signed Ben Tate?

We've got Ben Tate, Dion Lewis coming back from a broken leg, Edmond Baker, who ran well for us at the end of last season, still on the roster and inevitably someone else in the early-to-mid rounds of the draft. Shouldn't be a weak spot.

/I say "shouldn't".
//It's still the Browns.


I'll say this... They fleeced Indy in the Richardson trade. That extra first round pick could help them immensely.


We also fleeced the Falcons three years ago and turned those picks into Trent Richardson and Brandon Weeden. You'll excuse me if I'm not particularly optimistic.
 
2014-04-21 01:49:52 AM  
I'd have to say day 1
 
2014-04-21 03:48:50 AM  
... " he stiff-armed the Browns on a run toward a bigger contract offer from the Toronto Argonauts of the Canadian Football League. Two years later, hampered by knee and foot injuries, the lineman returned to Cleveland overweight and percolating with confidence. "

Interesting. How much more insane would fantasy football be if movement between the CFL and NFL were a factor?
 
2014-04-21 08:26:23 AM  

Professor Farksworth: llortcM_yllort: SilentStrider: llortcM_yllort: CavalierEternal: SilentStrider: Or you know, in their inaugural re-start season when they picked Tim Couch instead of Culpepper or McNabb.

No matter which QB was drafted in '99, they were doomed. Tim Couch had all of the tools to be a good 10+ years starter in the NFL. Unfortunately, the Browns never got him any receivers, a running game or an offensive line, the latter of which caused him to be out of the league in five years.

You can give the Browns sh*t for overpaying Alex Mack this offseason, but they did what they had to do to keep the line together and prevent another Tim Couch/David Carr scenario.

Unfortunately for the Browns, there are no good QBs this year.  Their options are either stick it out with Hoyer, hope that Manziel becomes the first Air Raid QB to not suck in the NFL, or hitch their hopes to Weeden Jr.  Either way, they're hosed.


Well, there's nobody on the level of Luck this year, but there might be a Flacco or a Matt Ryan lurking in the draft.

I just know I'm glad the Eagles have Foles and don't have to take a QB.

Bridgewater could be the next Pennington (and will probably be picked by Jacksonville).  I don't know enough about  Garoppolo to say either way.

Bortles, Manziel, and Carr? bust, bust, and bigger bust than his brother.

Having seen Bridgewater in action live several times last season he is a VERY good QB. Reminds me a lot of Big Ben just slightly smaller and more likely to run. He can take a hit though. He has had problems of overlooking wide open receivers down field but his short/medium range stuff is fantastic. I agree though he'll probably end up with the Jags.


He's 45 pounds smaller than Roethlisberger was at the start of his rookie year.  That's not slightly smaller.  That's a better description of Bortles than it is of Bridgewater.
 
2014-04-21 08:44:40 AM  
Am I the only one who looks at Johnny Manziel and starts thinking about Ryan Leaf?

And Clowney will play maybe thirty games in his career, which will be about four seasons long. He's this year's JaMarcus Russell.
 
2014-04-21 09:34:36 AM  

teto85: The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.


Sooner than that...you're forgetting the fact that the Browns HAD BILL WALSH on staff but Paul Brown wouldn't give him the reins, and what's more Brown actively discouraged anyone who showed any interest in hiring Walsh.  And he did this more than once.

Huge mistake there.
 
2014-04-21 10:09:54 AM  
Any Steeler fans know how much input Noll had on draft picks?
 
2014-04-21 10:14:59 AM  

DanInKansas: Am I the only one who looks at Johnny Manziel and starts thinking about Ryan Leaf?

And Clowney will play maybe thirty games in his career, which will be about four seasons long. He's this year's JaMarcus Russell.


The jury is out on Clowney, but I can't help but feel that Johnny Football's improvisation/happy feet won't get him all that far in the NFL as he won't be going up against college Ds anymore (see: Tim Tebow).
 
2014-04-21 11:01:38 AM  

ristst: teto85: The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.

Sooner than that...you're forgetting the fact that the Browns Bengals HAD BILL WALSH on staff but Paul Brown wouldn't give him the reins, and what's more Brown actively discouraged anyone who showed any interest in hiring Walsh.  And he did this more than once.

Huge mistake there.


Speaking of mistakes...
 
2014-04-21 11:04:48 AM  

NotoriousW.O.P: ristst: teto85: The Browns stared going downhill when they fired Paul Brown.

Sooner than that...you're forgetting the fact that the Browns Bengals HAD BILL WALSH on staff but Paul Brown wouldn't give him the reins, and what's more Brown actively discouraged anyone who showed any interest in hiring Walsh.  And he did this more than once.

Huge mistake there.

Speaking of mistakes...


Oh FFS....Bengals?

Uh.....well....the uniforms were exactly the same.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
 
2014-04-21 04:00:04 PM  

Speaker2Animals: Any Steeler fans know how much input Noll had on draft picks?


A very large amount.  Obviously, Rooney had the final say, but Noll was the brains behind the drafting.
 
2014-04-21 04:16:16 PM  

upndn: I used to hate the browns and loved it when the stillers kicked their butt. Now I just feel sorry for them.

/go pens


Yeah, this.

/kicks back to relive those Steeler glory days
//old
 
2014-04-21 04:25:46 PM  

flak attack: Speaker2Animals: Any Steeler fans know how much input Noll had on draft picks?

A very large amount.  Obviously, Rooney had the final say, but Noll was the brains behind the drafting.


The Rooney's have always given the coach a tremendous amount of respect, leeway, and input.

It's one of the things that makes it great to be a sports fan in Pgh.
 
2014-04-21 05:28:02 PM  
About the time the Packers went into their 20 year slide? The key difference being that the Packers ended theirs 20 years ago. Of all the Factory of Sadnesses, they are the Browniest.
 
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