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(The Raw Story)   The senior producer of The Principle congratulates himself for his dogged determination in reviving a 600-year-old argument, harshly criticizes those who dare call it a geocentric film and those who would distance themselves from this fine work   (rawstory.com ) divider line
    More: Fail, Lawrence Krauss, senior producer, release form, the principle, Michio Kaku, Kate Mulgrew, Copernicus, cosmic microwave backgrounds  
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2243 clicks; posted to Geek » on 09 Apr 2014 at 6:52 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-09 05:13:12 PM  
"You could say that the Earth is the center of the Universe. You could say that about any place. Since there is no center of the Universe, it can rightly be said that anywhere is the center of the Universe."

ZOMG, scientist says Earth is the center of the Universe!
 
2014-04-09 05:21:18 PM  
Just because we are all the center of our own universes, does not mean we are visable to the naked eye in anyone else's.

Science is supposed to weed out that subjective crap and look at things more objectively.
 
2014-04-09 05:23:33 PM  
Angelotti then told us we were wrong, The Principle wasn't about geocentrism. It was instead about challenging the "Copernican Principle" that we are not in either the center or in a special part of the universe.

So it isn't about geocentrism, it's about attacking the view that the earth isn't the center of the universe. Christ, this is as transparent as creationists saying their antics are not about creationism but about attacking evolution.
 
2014-04-09 05:24:20 PM  
Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.
 
2014-04-09 05:29:31 PM  
He chided us for not getting things right

Well that's farking rich.
 
2014-04-09 05:32:50 PM  

unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.


The earth is at the center of a circle whose definition is a circle with the earth at its center.

Brilliant.
 
2014-04-09 06:42:27 PM  
Eppur si derpe... (And yet it derps...)

/scusandoci con Galileo
 
2014-04-09 06:56:49 PM  
Fark Rawstory and its sideways scrolling. Fark it to the ninth farking circle of farking hell and may everyone involved DIA(nuclear)F!
 
2014-04-09 07:02:30 PM  
 
2014-04-09 07:11:40 PM  
My wife is the center of the universe. Just ask her.
 
2014-04-09 07:12:29 PM  

unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.


That assumes that we are able to see the same distance in all directions.
 
2014-04-09 07:15:43 PM  
Too bad we can't strap the film's producer into the Total Perspective Vortex.
 
2014-04-09 07:22:43 PM  

Yaw String: My wife is the center of the universe. Just ask her.


But enough about black holes
 
2014-04-09 07:23:56 PM  
Link is Farked - which, by the way, we don't get to say as often as we used to.
 
2014-04-09 07:24:12 PM  
I see the geocentrists are taking a page out of the old "we're only asking questions" handbook for the perennially persecuted professional creationist to cast doubt on a scientific principle they disagree with but have no real evidence to back up their position.

I mean, seriously, in this day and age, we've got people going to go back to an idea that is so demonstrably wrong?

No I am not new here, I just don't understand geocentrists as well as I do creationists.  The professional ones are hucksters (consciously or otherwise) doing it for money and power.  I think I'll have to assume the same with these geo-duds.
 
2014-04-09 07:26:26 PM  

Kome: Angelotti then told us we were wrong, The Principle wasn't about geocentrism. It was instead about challenging the "Copernican Principle" that we are not in either the center or in a special part of the universe.

So it isn't about geocentrism, it's about attacking the view that the earth isn't the center of the universe. Christ, this is as transparent as creationists saying their antics are not about creationism but about attacking evolution.


Yeah that last piece of the sentence really gave it away.  The whole "special piece of the universe" is and has long been code for YEC proponents and their supporters.  Oh and for those who aren't aware yet, Robert Sungenis has some very colorful things to say about Jews and the Holocaust as well http://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/50332/speaker-row-cancels-catholic- c onference
 
2014-04-09 07:33:47 PM  

meat0918: I see the geocentrists are taking a page out of the old "we're only asking questions" handbook for the perennially persecuted professional creationist to cast doubt on a scientific principle they disagree with but have no real evidence to back up their position.

I mean, seriously, in this day and age, we've got people going to go back to an idea that is so demonstrably wrong?

No I am not new here, I just don't understand geocentrists as well as I do creationists.  The professional ones are hucksters (consciously or otherwise) doing it for money and power.  I think I'll have to assume the same with these geo-duds.


Keep in mind there is a LOT of crossover between the two.  Near 100% would not shock me in the slightest.  The geocentric argument(at least the one most common in America) draws almost entirely from the Bible, they've just phrased things differently enough to make it seem different at first glance.
 
2014-04-09 07:34:18 PM  
The uniform Hubble red shift of the universe, where everything appears to be receeding from us at increasing velocities, is because YOU TOUCH YOURSELF!
 
2014-04-09 07:37:23 PM  
The universe is attracted to a point at infinity.  So instead of being the center of the universe, we are exactly the opposite.  We are the least attractive point in the universe.
 
2014-04-09 07:40:09 PM  

Yaw String: My wife is the center of the universe. Just ask her.


Wait until you have kids... Anyone who knows kids knows the universe has several equally probalistic centers that move around in a pretty good approximation of Brownian motion.
 
2014-04-09 07:41:29 PM  

wildcardjack: The uniform Hubble red shift of the universe, where everything appears to be receeding from us at increasing velocities, is because YOU TOUCH YOURSELF!


i1.ytimg.com
 
2014-04-09 07:43:41 PM  
nicely played, fusillade
 
2014-04-09 07:48:30 PM  
And they're so proud about it, they went to the Ben Stein school of lying to people about what their movie was about to get them to agree to talk to them so they can use their words against them.

/See Krauss, Lawrence and Mulgrew, Kate.
 
2014-04-09 07:57:48 PM  
i1.kym-cdn.com

Looks like we have a badass dumbass over here.
 
2014-04-09 08:09:59 PM  
We settled this argument a long time ago.

img.fark.net
 
2014-04-09 08:31:49 PM  
Any viewing of The Principle should also include a viewing of this.

/no, watch the whole thing
//the most savage takedown of Geocentrism ever
///not that it needed it. But it's good to have the physics down.
 
2014-04-09 08:41:55 PM  

Teufelaffe: unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.

That assumes that we are able to see the same distance in all directions.


Not necessary. The Earth is at the center. And so is Mars and so is Alpha Centauri and so is the Andromeda Galaxy and so is everything else in the Universe. Everything came from the same point, therefore there is no center because everywhere is the center.
 
2014-04-09 08:44:59 PM  
Hey "Earth is at the center of the Universe" guy.  Check out the picture below

www.space-pictures.com

See the tiny white dot on the right?  That's Earth, taken from a space probe that hadn't even left the solar system yet.  That was 13 years after launch- in about 40,000 more years they'll pass the *nearest* star to the Sun.

The Earth is utterly insignificant.  *You* are utterly insignificant.
 
2014-04-09 09:07:32 PM  
He needs health care.
 
2014-04-09 09:26:15 PM  

Ishkur: Teufelaffe: unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.

That assumes that we are able to see the same distance in all directions.

Not necessary. The Earth is at the center. And so is Mars and so is Alpha Centauri and so is the Andromeda Galaxy and so is everything else in the Universe. Everything came from the same point, therefore there is no center because everywhere is the center.


Wouldn't that point be the center?
 
2014-04-09 09:54:19 PM  
suuuz.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-04-09 09:54:43 PM  

Tigger: unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.

The earth is at the center of a circle whose definition is a circle with the earth at its center.

Brilliant.


Well as I observe it, the visible universe has me at the center.

You farkers and the Earth just happen to be nearby.
 
2014-04-09 09:57:32 PM  

Smackledorfer: Ishkur: Teufelaffe: unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.

That assumes that we are able to see the same distance in all directions.

Not necessary. The Earth is at the center. And so is Mars and so is Alpha Centauri and so is the Andromeda Galaxy and so is everything else in the Universe. Everything came from the same point, therefore there is no center because everywhere is the center.

Wouldn't that point be the center?


No.

Here is my favorite way of picturing the universe.

The universe is similar to an expanding balloon, but with an interesting twist.

The entire universe is not the space inside the balloon, IT IS THE SKIN OF THE BALLOON.
 
2014-04-09 10:32:57 PM  
I was going to make a post about relativity, and that Earth IS at the center of the observable universe, from our point of view, and that in that principle, it has a grain of truth.

And then I read the article, and did some checking, and realized that Our Beamish Boy is pants on head rucking fetarded, and then washed my hands several times to get the crazy off me...
 
2014-04-09 10:42:21 PM  

Glockenspiel Hero: *You* are utterly insignificant.


I don't believe in such talk as this.  I am nice man, with happy feelings.  All of the time!
 
2014-04-09 10:49:36 PM  

Smackledorfer: Ishkur: Teufelaffe: unyon: Actually, the earth is the center of the visible universe.

That assumes that we are able to see the same distance in all directions.

Not necessary. The Earth is at the center. And so is Mars and so is Alpha Centauri and so is the Andromeda Galaxy and so is everything else in the Universe. Everything came from the same point, therefore there is no center because everywhere is the center.

Wouldn't that point be the center?


If the Earth were the center and everything were orbiting around it, the Voyager probe would be moving faster than the speed of light.
 
2014-04-09 11:15:49 PM  
images.cryhavok.org

/Ia Dagon! Ia Cthulhu!
 
2014-04-09 11:20:54 PM  

Ishkur: Any viewing of The Principle should also include a viewing of this.


I'm liking that video, if only for the description of sourcing information from a "Geocentric web-shiate"

/even if that is simply a lisp, it's gold
 
2014-04-09 11:31:09 PM  
Hell, there is still both a flat earth society and a society for creative anachronism by me. Plenty of subjective derp to go around; and those Ren Faire Babes have big boobs.
 
2014-04-09 11:33:29 PM  

Speaker2Animals: Fark Rawstory and its sideways scrolling. Fark it to the ninth farking circle of farking hell and may everyone involved DIA(nuclear)F!


Uhhhhh....   What?
 
2014-04-09 11:34:21 PM  

IC Stars: The universe is similar to an expanding balloon, but with an interesting twist.
The entire universe is not the space inside the balloon, IT IS THE SKIN OF THE BALLOON.


But that's not quite right either because describing the Universe as an expansion or an explosion still evokes images of everything moving away from a central point. That's not what's happening. It's easier to picture it as none of the galaxies are really moving (relative to the Universe's expansion), but the space between the galaxies is filling up with more space, and this is a uniform distribution everywhere so it's pushing distant objects away from each other faster than near ones.
 
2014-04-09 11:40:06 PM  
Yes, it all makes perfect sense.  The earth is the center of the solar system, and the sun and all the planets move around the earth in a bizarre, ridiculous pattern which gives the illusion that everything is moving around the sun.  God likes to play jokes like that, having the planets and sun move around the earth in such a way that makes it look in every way like the sun is the center of the solar system.   Also, God likes to have wacky fun with the laws of the universe, by having Jupiter, with 300 times the mass of the Earth, and the sun, with 343,000 times the mass of the earth, orbit the earth.  God is such a prankster.
 
2014-04-09 11:43:09 PM  

Ghost Roach: I'm liking that video, if only for the description of sourcing information from a "Geocentric web-shiate"


You have to watch all eight parts. If you can follow the physics (he gets heavy into the math of what a geocentric Universe requires to fit the evidence), you'll come away stunned by all the mental gymnastics and shiatty math that Creationists need to make their Bible true.

The best one is that if the Earth was fixed, that means everything in the Universe is rotating around it like a vinyl record. The whole Universe revolving around the Earth every 24 hours (and also wobbling up and down 46 degrees like a top throughout the year). Since we know things on the edge of a record move faster than things near the center, that means everything beyond the orbit of Neptune is moving faster than the speed of light. The most distant galaxies are moving some 26 nonillion times the speed of light, which is utterly ludicrous (and I mean literally LUDICROUS speed, as that's how fast they are going).
 
2014-04-09 11:46:07 PM  

Ishkur: IC Stars: The universe is similar to an expanding balloon, but with an interesting twist.
The entire universe is not the space inside the balloon, IT IS THE SKIN OF THE BALLOON.

But that's not quite right either because describing the Universe as an expansion or an explosion still evokes images of everything moving away from a central point. That's not what's happening. It's easier to picture it as none of the galaxies are really moving (relative to the Universe's expansion), but the space between the galaxies is filling up with more space, and this is a uniform distribution everywhere so it's pushing distant objects away from each other faster than near ones.



Someone (Dawkins?) suggested raisin bread. The raisins don't move through the loaf as the bread rises but they all get further apart. (And the difference would be greater for more distant raisins.)
 
2014-04-09 11:50:55 PM  

Ishkur: The most distant galaxies are moving some 26 nonillion times the speed of light, which is utterly ludicrous (and I mean literally LUDICROUS speed, as that's how fast they are going).


By "distant galaxies" you mean "Vault of the Heavens", right?
 
2014-04-10 12:08:55 AM  

Monkeyfark Ridiculous: Someone (Dawkins?) suggested raisin bread. The raisins don't move through the loaf as the bread rises but they all get further apart. (And the difference would be greater for more distant raisins.)


Careful .. you start talking about science and bread, and the Jebus-freaks will be all up in your dough ... they kinda have this whole Body-of-Christ thing ... they might take it the wrong way
 
2014-04-10 12:59:13 AM  

Ishkur: The best one is that if the Earth was fixed, that means everything in the Universe is rotating around it like a vinyl record. The whole Universe revolving around the Earth every 24 hours (and also wobbling up and down 46 degrees like a top throughout the year).

Yeah, this was brought up by the people in the article as well. If the stars rotate around the Earth every 24 hours then they can't be very far away at all, or else they'd be moving ludicrous-fast. And if they are not far away at all then they can't really be stars. So what the fark are they, then?

Also, we know from observation that moons revolve around other planets, and that planets revolve around distant stars. Does a geocentric view of the universe even allow this?

He's got to be trolling. Even a creationist isn't that stupid.

/whartime cube, wharr?
 
2014-04-10 01:08:07 AM  

Zombalupagus: Ishkur: The best one is that if the Earth was fixed, that means everything in the Universe is rotating around it like a vinyl record. The whole Universe revolving around the Earth every 24 hours (and also wobbling up and down 46 degrees like a top throughout the year).
Yeah, this was brought up by the people in the article as well. If the stars rotate around the Earth every 24 hours then they can't be very far away at all, or else they'd be moving ludicrous-fast. And if they are not far away at all then they can't really be stars. So what the fark are they, then?

Also, we know from observation that moons revolve around other planets, and that planets revolve around distant stars. Does a geocentric view of the universe even allow this?

He's got to be trolling. Even a creationist isn't that stupid.

/whartime cube, wharr?


Never set up the Universe with a straight line like that, it's is all but guaranteed that there is at least one person out there that is that dumb, yet would be seen in a court of law as being of sound mind and body
 
2014-04-10 02:12:34 AM  

Zombalupagus: Also, we know from observation that moons revolve around other planets, and that planets revolve around distant stars. Does a geocentric view of the universe even allow this?


Sure, you can even have some of our planets orbiting the sun (to deal with the pesky phases/transit of Venus).


Zombalupagus: Yeah, this was brought up by the people in the article as well. If the stars rotate around the Earth every 24 hours then they can't be very far away at all, or else they'd be moving ludicrous-fast. And if they are not far away at all then they can't really be stars. So what the fark are they, then?



Offhand, I would guess they'd say: a) The distant ones are some kind of firmament or projection - they could put that point reasonably far out depending how much stellar parallax they want to account for. b) Ludicrous speed is possible, because if you're geocentric why bother obeying the farking speed limit. c) it's somehow analogous to the way some distant objects are receding from us at more than light speed due to expansion.
 
2014-04-10 07:50:59 AM  
"Obviously she knew what the film was about. She read the script into a microphone," he said.
i2.photobucket.com
 
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