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(WPXI.com)   Reports that 20 students have been hurt after multiple stabbings at Franklin Regional High School near Pittsburgh   (wpxi.com ) divider line 742
    More: News, Franklin Regional High School, Pittsburgh, Westmoreland County  
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8481 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Apr 2014 at 9:57 AM (1 year ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-09 05:11:25 PM  

TNel: Johnny Texas: Frozboz: Kid with a knife = 20 kids with serious, but non-life threatening injuries.
Kid with a gun = 20 dead kids

So a kid with a gun suddenly becomes Rambo and only makes kill shots?

No but bulletts tend to punch nice sized holes in people that if they don't die from the hit, bleeding out is a very real happening, or they get hit in very important organs.

Knive wounds can be severe depending on the location but the thing a knife wound has going for it is that it's usually a clean slice that can be sewed/glued shut.


Oh come on. You know he didn't really want the answer to that question. Most particularly if it was grounded in fact.
 
2014-04-09 05:18:21 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: syrynxx: iq_in_binary: Expanding the NFA to all semiautos

I know this is a pet topic of yours, but you're really missing the point of the NFA when it was implemented in 1934.  The $200 tax stamp fee was a huge amount - so much so that many people got rid of their weapons rather than pay it.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MediaPages/ArticleDetail.aspx?mediaid =1 59
{
In regard to the tax stamp, keep in mind, $200 was equivalent to 5 months wages in 1934! It seems the transfer tax was meant as a deterrent to machinegun ownership in itself. That same $200 in 1934 would be the equivalent of perhaps $20,000 in 2008. Just be thankful the tax has not been raised to keep up with the times.
}

An online inflation calculator shows that it's more like $3500, but still - you want to slap a $3500 tax on a $350 pistol?  Tell me how that's not a defacto ban.

And that meant what to a mobster? He wasn't exactly working for wages.

No the reasons the NFA works are many:

First, it creates a registry.

Second, while it allows transfers, it ensures the transferee is eligible to own the weapon.

Third, it confiscates. If the stamp and the owner don't match up, the weapon is destroyed. How many years before the illicit guns on chicago's streets are cleaned up? I'd give it two.

No need to raise the stamp prices.

And what does it do about all the ones that will never be registered that are actually used in crimes?  Oh, that's right, nothing.


It gets them off the streets, if it doesn't have a stamp at all it is destroyed as well.

You know how many crime weapons criminals have been pulled over with, had their abode searched with, been arrested with, etc. ended up being returned to the criminal because there is absolutely no way to prove the weapon is illicit?

It also has the benefit of practically eliminating all straw sales.

Oh, and we can get rid of the Hughes amendment while we're at it.
 
2014-04-09 05:21:54 PM  

Nutsac_Jim: Shan: That's why the whole thing is a sticky-wicket.  Unless you somehow make mental-health exams mandatory for  everyone there will always be the possibility of a nutter getting his hands on a firearm through legal means.  If Joe Blow is schizophrenic; but doesn't realize it; and has never been to a doc about it; no system is going to red-flag him; but if you make mental exams mandatory you open up another can of worms entirely.

You can't say that "anybody wanting to buy a gun needs to go to a psych first for an exam" because then there's the issue of the doc potentially putting a personal bias on the results (remember; we still live in a world where some pharmacists refuse to give out birth-control and other BS); so the only way to be truly  fair is for the exams to be required for everyone regardless.  Which means you've got 300+ million people going for a service, which might only be of use to 1% of the population; and of that 1% how many might actually cause a problem for others? 1%?  0.1%?  That would be like making everyone take a yearly MRI  just in case.  Nevermind the cost; privacy issues etc.

That's pretty expensive.   It would be cheaper to just ban all guns unless you legitimately need one.


Thank, God rights don't work that way.   Well then again.  See paragraph 3.
 
2014-04-09 05:25:34 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: syrynxx: iq_in_binary: Expanding the NFA to all semiautos

I know this is a pet topic of yours, but you're really missing the point of the NFA when it was implemented in 1934.  The $200 tax stamp fee was a huge amount - so much so that many people got rid of their weapons rather than pay it.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MediaPages/ArticleDetail.aspx?mediaid =1 59
{
In regard to the tax stamp, keep in mind, $200 was equivalent to 5 months wages in 1934! It seems the transfer tax was meant as a deterrent to machinegun ownership in itself. That same $200 in 1934 would be the equivalent of perhaps $20,000 in 2008. Just be thankful the tax has not been raised to keep up with the times.
}

An online inflation calculator shows that it's more like $3500, but still - you want to slap a $3500 tax on a $350 pistol?  Tell me how that's not a defacto ban.

And that meant what to a mobster? He wasn't exactly working for wages.

No the reasons the NFA works are many:

First, it creates a registry.

Second, while it allows transfers, it ensures the transferee is eligible to own the weapon.

Third, it confiscates. If the stamp and the owner don't match up, the weapon is destroyed. How many years before the illicit guns on chicago's streets are cleaned up? I'd give it two.

No need to raise the stamp prices.

And what does it do about all the ones that will never be registered that are actually used in crimes?  Oh, that's right, nothing.

It gets them off the streets, if it doesn't have a stamp at all it is destroyed as well.

You know how many crime weapons criminals have been pulled over with, had their abode searched with, been arrested with, etc. ended up being returned to the criminal because there is absolutely no way to prove the weapon is illicit?

It also has the benefit of practically eliminating all straw sales.

Oh, and we can get rid of the Hughes amendment while we're at it.


If there's no evidence of the weapon being illicit and the person in possession is not prohibited than why shouldn't it be returned?  You seem to have a little trouble telling criminals from non-criminals because the person that you described being pulled over doesn't sound like a criminal.

Eliminating straw sales?  Wow you are true believer.

Agreed on the Hughes Amendment.
 
2014-04-09 05:32:49 PM  

Shan: Unless you somehow make mental-health exams mandatory for  everyone there will always be the possibility of a nutter getting his hands on a firearm through legal means.  If Joe Blow is schizophrenic; but doesn't realize it; and has never been to a doc about it; no system is going to red-flag him; but if you make mental exams mandatory you open up another can of worms entirely.


Most of the "worms" would be solved by making the exams mandatory - stigma of mental illness goes away, cost of care and fears about insurance premiums rising aren't issues, etc.
 
2014-04-09 05:34:58 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: syrynxx: iq_in_binary: Expanding the NFA to all semiautos

I know this is a pet topic of yours, but you're really missing the point of the NFA when it was implemented in 1934.  The $200 tax stamp fee was a huge amount - so much so that many people got rid of their weapons rather than pay it.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MediaPages/ArticleDetail.aspx?mediaid =1 59
{
In regard to the tax stamp, keep in mind, $200 was equivalent to 5 months wages in 1934! It seems the transfer tax was meant as a deterrent to machinegun ownership in itself. That same $200 in 1934 would be the equivalent of perhaps $20,000 in 2008. Just be thankful the tax has not been raised to keep up with the times.
}

An online inflation calculator shows that it's more like $3500, but still - you want to slap a $3500 tax on a $350 pistol?  Tell me how that's not a defacto ban.

And that meant what to a mobster? He wasn't exactly working for wages.

No the reasons the NFA works are many:

First, it creates a registry.

Second, while it allows transfers, it ensures the transferee is eligible to own the weapon.

Third, it confiscates. If the stamp and the owner don't match up, the weapon is destroyed. How many years before the illicit guns on chicago's streets are cleaned up? I'd give it two.

No need to raise the stamp prices.

And what does it do about all the ones that will never be registered that are actually used in crimes?  Oh, that's right, nothing.

It gets them off the streets, if it doesn't have a stamp at all it is destroyed as well.

You know how many crime weapons criminals have been pulled over with, had their abode searched with, been arrested with, etc. ended up being returned to the criminal because there is absolutely no way to prove the weapon is illicit?

It also has the benefit of practically eliminating all straw sales.

Oh, and we can get rid of the Hughes amendment while we're at it.

If there's no evidence of the weapon being illicit and the person in possession is not prohibited than why shouldn't it be returned?  You seem to have a little trouble telling criminals from non-criminals because the person that you described being pulled over doesn't sound like a criminal.

Eliminating straw sales?  Wow you are true believer.

Agreed on the Hughes Amendment.


All weapon transfers require a transfer stamp. If a bunch of guns that one guy bought keep ending up in other people's hands without that transfer stamp, you now have proof of straw sales. Guy goes away for life, guns get destroyed, people have a huge disincentive to get into straw sales all of a sudden.

You keep forgetting that the NFA IS a registry. And that it allows new registries, transfers, and even modifications. Bonus, once we negotiate the repeal of the Hughes amendment in return for the expansion of it, IT DOESN'T BAN anything.
 
2014-04-09 05:40:15 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: syrynxx: iq_in_binary: Expanding the NFA to all semiautos

I know this is a pet topic of yours, but you're really missing the point of the NFA when it was implemented in 1934.  The $200 tax stamp fee was a huge amount - so much so that many people got rid of their weapons rather than pay it.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/MediaPages/ArticleDetail.aspx?mediaid =1 59
{
In regard to the tax stamp, keep in mind, $200 was equivalent to 5 months wages in 1934! It seems the transfer tax was meant as a deterrent to machinegun ownership in itself. That same $200 in 1934 would be the equivalent of perhaps $20,000 in 2008. Just be thankful the tax has not been raised to keep up with the times.
}

An online inflation calculator shows that it's more like $3500, but still - you want to slap a $3500 tax on a $350 pistol?  Tell me how that's not a defacto ban.

And that meant what to a mobster? He wasn't exactly working for wages.

No the reasons the NFA works are many:

First, it creates a registry.

Second, while it allows transfers, it ensures the transferee is eligible to own the weapon.

Third, it confiscates. If the stamp and the owner don't match up, the weapon is destroyed. How many years before the illicit guns on chicago's streets are cleaned up? I'd give it two.

No need to raise the stamp prices.

And what does it do about all the ones that will never be registered that are actually used in crimes?  Oh, that's right, nothing.

It gets them off the streets, if it doesn't have a stamp at all it is destroyed as well.

You know how many crime weapons criminals have been pulled over with, had their abode searched with, been arrested with, etc. ended up being returned to the criminal because there is absolutely no way to prove the weapon is illicit?

It also has the benefit of practically eliminating all straw sales.

Oh, and we can get rid of the Hughes amendment while we're at it.

If there's no evidence of the weapon being illicit and the person in possession is not prohibited than why shouldn't it be returned?  You seem to have a little trouble telling criminals from non-criminals because the person that you described being pulled over doesn't sound like a criminal.

Eliminating straw sales?  Wow you are true believer.

Agreed on the Hughes Amendment.


Oh and to your first point, most illicit weapons are stolen or straw sale, remember?

If the weapon and the name on the stamp don't match up, it's an illicit weapon. It gets confiscated and either returned to its owner (there's a system for this in place and NFA weapons have been stolen and returned before) or destroyed.

Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.
 
2014-04-09 05:42:17 PM  

iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.


No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.
 
2014-04-09 05:43:48 PM  

iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.


You keep saying things like this as if they are true.
 
2014-04-09 05:46:15 PM  
iq_in_binary:

It gets them off the streets, if it doesn't have a stamp at all it is destroyed as well.

You know how many crime weapons criminals have been pulled over with, had their abode searched with, been arrested with, etc. ended up being returned to the criminal because there is absolutely no way to prove the weapon is illicit?

It also has the benefit of practically eliminating all straw sales.

Oh, and we can get rid of the Hughes amendment while we're at it.


No.  Do you?
 
2014-04-09 05:47:23 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.


Tax stamp, remember?

Even a liberal SCOTUS would put the kabosh on that.
 
2014-04-09 05:52:01 PM  

Bullseyed: brokendownyota: Frozboz: Kid with a knife = 20 kids with serious, but non-life threatening injuries.
Kid with a gun = 20 dead kids


Right, that's why people shot by cops, who are supposedly professionals and thus trained and proficient in firearms manipulation and shot placement, never, EVER survive.

Guns = killmachines.  No wounding shots, ever.  Especially when used by wigged out, untrained, pre-pubescents who's only exposure to pulling the trigger involved clicking a mouse while badmouthing others on the internet.

/pants-on-head retarded statement is retarded
//unless that was a troll
///in which case, well done.

Would have been with you in this, but there is zero correlation between video games and violence, so you can go fark yourself.


Oi - I never claimed there was.  I'm saying that COD is as close to a firearm as a lot of people (and in this case, the potential attacker) have ever come.  No correlation between videogames and violence, I'm with you on that, despite what Grossman preaches..
 
2014-04-09 05:52:09 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.


Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?
 
2014-04-09 05:54:54 PM  

Dr Jack Badofsky: Kit Fister: demaL-demaL-yeH: Columbine.

[citation needed]

The Columbine kids also had homemade bombs with on their person, too.  I think they may have used a few of them in their assault.  Nope, I don't think this one counts, either.


Crikey! Here's a lovely example of the "we can kill with things that aren't firearms, so let's not take any constructive steps with respect to them" argument in the wild. This bold critter is not easily scared off, and it can't be shamed, not even by pointed, sarcastic ridicule. It will keep popping up.

/Exactly nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with a bomb.
 
2014-04-09 06:00:04 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.

Tax stamp, remember?

Even a liberal SCOTUS would put the kabosh on that.


Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.
 
2014-04-09 06:00:54 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?


There's more of that true believer again.
 
2014-04-09 06:01:53 PM  
demaL-demaL-yeH

Exactly nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with a bomb.

Nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with anything but a 9mm or a shotgun. These will never be banned. There are no "constructive steps" that could have been taken to stop this.
 
2014-04-09 06:04:43 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Dr Jack Badofsky: Kit Fister: demaL-demaL-yeH: Columbine.

[citation needed]

The Columbine kids also had homemade bombs with on their person, too.  I think they may have used a few of them in their assault.  Nope, I don't think this one counts, either.

Crikey! Here's a lovely example of the "we can kill with things that aren't firearms, so let's not take any constructive steps with respect to them" argument in the wild. This bold critter is not easily scared off, and it can't be shamed, not even by pointed, sarcastic ridicule. It will keep popping up.

/Exactly nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with a bomb.


Yes, but exactly everybody killed at Oklahoma City was.

168 Death
680+ injured

The method isn't the problem, the cause(crazy) is.
 
2014-04-09 06:10:03 PM  

Facetious_Speciest: demaL-demaL-yeH

Exactly nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with a bomb.

Nobody murdered at Columbine was killed with anything but a 9mm or a shotgun. These will never be banned. There are no "constructive steps" that could have been taken to stop this.


YOU, my friend, are not cooperating with the narrative.
 
2014-04-09 06:11:00 PM  
Picture of the offending student:
img.fark.net
Next up for banning: Anything that is sharp.

Guns, knives, brass knuckles, bows, crossbows, polearms, tanks, bazookas, explosives, spoons, crowbars, baseball bats, lacrosse sticks, candlesticks, hammers, and even prison shanks: they are all tools.

Tools do not kill people.

The people kill people, and they generally use something to do it.  If you want to stop violence, taking away tool might slow them down.  The one who are really determined will find a way to do it with something else that you would never think of.

Second point on gun control: All gun control does is prevent law abiding citizens from obtaining guns, which is their constitutional right.  Do you really think a criminal is going to bother to go to a gun store?

I'm also going to go out on a limb and besides mental issues, predict that bullying was involved in some way, shape, manner, or form, in this incident.
 
2014-04-09 06:19:00 PM  

iq_in_binary: If you had read what I just said you'd have known that the families didn't stop warring until well into the 50's. They were around for another decade until the FBI was even able to start making a dent in their numbers via convictions and deportations. But machine gun massacres stopped immediately after the passage of the NFA. You'd know that if you knew anything about gun crime and statistics.


So the NFA stopped the mob from using machine guns.

The same mobsters that were stopped from killing people by murder laws and from importing and selling liquor by Prohibition, right? Those mobsters?

This had nothing at all to do with public distaste for notorious mob hits, the rise of (much safer) wire fraud, and the collapse of the illicit alcohol trade, right?
 
2014-04-09 06:50:41 PM  

jankyboy: demaL-demaL-yeH: jankyboy: demaL-demaL-yeH: NickelP: Publikwerks: Cyrusv10: Why are those anti-gun Farkers so silent all the sudden?

Because all the retards who think that any sort of gun registration/mental health check = gun grabbing have blown their saved up load of wharbagarble before anything remotely resembling an argument could form.

The bottom line is that this is a sad occurrence, but it would have been alot worse if he had a gun. And if we could get past all the BS, maybe we could figure out a way to keep guns out of the hand of people who would do these type of attacks. So that the headlines would stay 20 injured instead of 20 killed

is there a single school shooting a gun registration would have stopped?

Columbine.

Do explain.

Gun registration isn't exactly a preventative control.

Straw. Purchases.

Riiight registering ownership and transfers is unpossible, unworkable, and ineffective[SIC].

I know what a straw purchaser is, but I fail to see how registration would have stopped (your word) Columbine. Registration might deter someone from giving a gun to another individual who is prohibited from owning a gun, but it doesn't prevent them from doing so.


No, bubba, stopped was not my word.
Now go back and read the linked peer-reviewed article with bonus statisticles that says that registration and licensing significantly decrease straw purchases. Go on. It won't hurt ...


/anything, well, except for your preconceptions.
 
2014-04-09 06:56:46 PM  

Callous: And what does it do about all the ones that will never be registered that are actually used in crimes?  Oh, that's right, nothing.


Put the users and the sellers in prison, if any legislator is smart enough to impose a seriously reduced sentence in exchange for the seller.

And serious criminal charges for possession of unregistered firearms, after a two-year amnesty period to register.
Didn't register? Enjoy being an disarmed felon for the rest of your life.
 
2014-04-09 06:58:04 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.


It's not like people have ever made weapons, or repurposed tools to kill people. I mean, that's just crazy talk.

/chef
//I have more ways to kill folks at my hand right now than I have people I think need to shuffle of gently into that good night
 
2014-04-09 07:00:03 PM  
So mental healthcare still not an issue. Good to know. You know we have an army of unemployed how about we raise everyone's taxes a smidge say .03% on the lowest up to 1.03% in the highest including on stocks/dividends and educate and hire an army of mental health providers?

It's either that or surrender your weapons, all of them, including your fists.
 
2014-04-09 07:04:17 PM  

dababler: So mental healthcare still not an issue. Good to know. You know we have an army of unemployed how about we raise everyone's taxes a smidge say .03% on the lowest up to 1.03% in the highest including on stocks/dividends and educate and hire an army of mental health providers?

It's either that or surrender your weapons, all of them, including your fists.


You can have my fists when you pry them from my cold, dead.....................uh, hold on a second - not sure where I'm going with this............
 
2014-04-09 07:11:51 PM  

Callous: Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.


So do driver licenses and vehicle registration, Selective Service registrations, voter registrations, phone books, and assignment of Social Security numbers. Have "they" confiscated your car, drafted your paranoid assin peacetime, deprived you of the right to vote based on your skin melanin levels, confiscated your telephone, or denied you Social Security after you've earned eligibility?

That saying "too old to cut the muster" referred to a man being dropped from the registration and attendance rolls of the active Militia due to age. Registering your militia arms is almost as old as Amendment II, as in three months "younger".

/Let me guess: You also object to vehicle registration and mandatory insurance with reporting requirements, too.
 
2014-04-09 07:16:54 PM  

bobothemagnificent: All gun control does is prevent law abiding citizens from obtaining guns, which is their constitutional right.


Yup. Just like those pesky licensing and registration requirements keep you from obtaining and driving an automobile.
 
2014-04-09 07:21:24 PM  

syrynxx: An online inflation calculator shows that it's more like $3500, but still - you want to slap a $3500 tax on a $350 pistol? Tell me how that's not a defacto ban.


Oddly enough, $200 was the price of a Thompson submachine gun back in the day.  The tax matched it.

And yes, defacto ban.  Even before they closed the list violence with a legally held private machine gun was statistically insignificant.
 
2014-04-09 07:21:25 PM  
Class of '83 here. Sad news. My nephew wasn't hurt but damn. Scary shiat.
 
2014-04-09 07:27:44 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.

Tax stamp, remember?

Even a liberal SCOTUS would put the kabosh on that.

Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.


And BECAUSE OF THE TAX STAMP not even a liberal SCOTUS in the foreseeable future would allow rank confiscation.
 
2014-04-09 07:28:47 PM  
Surprised only one person mentioned The Following.  Was definitely my first thought, and I'll lay odds this kid has the first season on DVD and the second season DVR'd if he has one.
 
2014-04-09 07:28:49 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?

There's more of that true believer again.


So then do it. Go find a black market M16. Go ahead. Try.

You can't.
 
2014-04-09 07:34:36 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Callous: Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.

So do driver licenses and vehicle registration, Selective Service registrations, voter registrations, phone books, and assignment of Social Security numbers. Have "they" confiscated your car, drafted your paranoid assin peacetime, deprived you of the right to vote based on your skin melanin levels, confiscated your telephone, or denied you Social Security after you've earned eligibility?

That saying "too old to cut the muster" referred to a man being dropped from the registration and attendance rolls of the active Militia due to age. Registering your militia arms is almost as old as Amendment II, as in three months "younger".

/Let me guess: You also object to vehicle registration and mandatory insurance with reporting requirements, too.


Driving a car on public roads isn't a constitutionally protected right, stop with the false equivalency.
 
2014-04-09 07:35:19 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?

There's more of that true believer again.

So then do it. Go find a black market M16. Go ahead. Try.

You can't.


Just like I can't find pot, heroin, cocaine, etc?
 
2014-04-09 07:36:45 PM  

This text is now purple: iq_in_binary: If you had read what I just said you'd have known that the families didn't stop warring until well into the 50's. They were around for another decade until the FBI was even able to start making a dent in their numbers via convictions and deportations. But machine gun massacres stopped immediately after the passage of the NFA. You'd know that if you knew anything about gun crime and statistics.

So the NFA stopped the mob from using machine guns.

The same mobsters that were stopped from killing people by murder laws and from importing and selling liquor by Prohibition, right? Those mobsters?

This had nothing at all to do with public distaste for notorious mob hits, the rise of (much safer) wire fraud, and the collapse of the illicit alcohol trade, right?


Find me another usage of a Thompson in a crime after the passage of the NFA anywhere. The only one you'll find is kind of a moot point because it was a Sheriff. All of which can still get Thompsons if they wanted to anyway. They're exempt from the NFA Registry restrictions.

And keep in mind that Thompsons were still legal for purchase directly from the factory up until 1986. They're still legal for purchase today, they just have to be on the registry and you're getting it from a private citizen.
 
2014-04-09 07:38:40 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.

Tax stamp, remember?

Even a liberal SCOTUS would put the kabosh on that.

Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.

And BECAUSE OF THE TAX STAMP not even a liberal SCOTUS in the foreseeable future would allow rank confiscation.


Confiscation has already happened.  SKS rifles in CA, everything in NO during Katrina, CT wants everyone to register of surrender their "assault weapons" RIGHT NOW!!!  They closed the registry Jan 1.  So now anyone that still possessed one was instantly made a felon for doing nothing wrong.
 
2014-04-09 07:39:16 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?

There's more of that true believer again.

So then do it. Go find a black market M16. Go ahead. Try.

You can't.

Just like I can't find pot, heroin, cocaine, etc?


Different circumstance. For one, it's a different agency.

Like I said. Go look. Try to find a Colt M16 on the black market, go ahead and look.

I have, you can't.
 
2014-04-09 07:40:24 PM  

iq_in_binary: This text is now purple: iq_in_binary: If you had read what I just said you'd have known that the families didn't stop warring until well into the 50's. They were around for another decade until the FBI was even able to start making a dent in their numbers via convictions and deportations. But machine gun massacres stopped immediately after the passage of the NFA. You'd know that if you knew anything about gun crime and statistics.

So the NFA stopped the mob from using machine guns.

The same mobsters that were stopped from killing people by murder laws and from importing and selling liquor by Prohibition, right? Those mobsters?

This had nothing at all to do with public distaste for notorious mob hits, the rise of (much safer) wire fraud, and the collapse of the illicit alcohol trade, right?

Find me another usage of a Thompson in a crime after the passage of the NFA anywhere. The only one you'll find is kind of a moot point because it was a Sheriff. All of which can still get Thompsons if they wanted to anyway. They're exempt from the NFA Registry restrictions.

And keep in mind that Thompsons were still legal for purchase directly from the factory up until 1986. They're still legal for purchase today, they just have to be on the registry and you're getting it from a private citizen.


So because I was able to point out several occasions of non-registered machine guns being used in crimes after the NFA you are now moving the goalposts to just Thompsons?
 
2014-04-09 07:41:00 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?

There's more of that true believer again.

So then do it. Go find a black market M16. Go ahead. Try.

You can't.

Just like I can't find pot, heroin, cocaine, etc?

Different circumstance. For one, it's a different agency.

Like I said. Go look. Try to find a Colt M16 on the black market, go ahead and look.

I have, you can't.


You aren't looking in the right places.
 
2014-04-09 07:42:01 PM  

hubiestubert: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

It's not like people have ever made weapons, or repurposed tools to kill people. I mean, that's just crazy talk.

/chef
//I have more ways to kill folks at my hand right now than I have people I think need to shuffle of gently into that good night


Rudimentary weapons and zip guns aren't exactly the scourge of Chicago, Kansas City, Flint, Watts, Camden or Pheonix right now. Cheap semiautomatic handguns are.
 
2014-04-09 07:42:59 PM  

iq_in_binary: Bonus, once we negotiate the repeal of the Hughes amendment in return for the expansion of it, IT DOESN'T BAN anything.


But as the Hughes amendment shows, it can become a ban easily enough.
 
2014-04-09 07:44:09 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: This text is now purple: iq_in_binary: If you had read what I just said you'd have known that the families didn't stop warring until well into the 50's. They were around for another decade until the FBI was even able to start making a dent in their numbers via convictions and deportations. But machine gun massacres stopped immediately after the passage of the NFA. You'd know that if you knew anything about gun crime and statistics.

So the NFA stopped the mob from using machine guns.

The same mobsters that were stopped from killing people by murder laws and from importing and selling liquor by Prohibition, right? Those mobsters?

This had nothing at all to do with public distaste for notorious mob hits, the rise of (much safer) wire fraud, and the collapse of the illicit alcohol trade, right?

Find me another usage of a Thompson in a crime after the passage of the NFA anywhere. The only one you'll find is kind of a moot point because it was a Sheriff. All of which can still get Thompsons if they wanted to anyway. They're exempt from the NFA Registry restrictions.

And keep in mind that Thompsons were still legal for purchase directly from the factory up until 1986. They're still legal for purchase today, they just have to be on the registry and you're getting it from a private citizen.

So because I was able to point out several occasions of non-registered machine guns being used in crimes after the NFA you are now moving the goalposts to just Thompsons?


I said ANY NFA weapon.

He was trying to make the point that the repealing of Prohibition was the reason mobsters stopped using their favorite weapon. My point was that they could still get them, and yet they stopped using them.
 
2014-04-09 07:45:23 PM  

iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: This text is now purple: iq_in_binary: If you had read what I just said you'd have known that the families didn't stop warring until well into the 50's. They were around for another decade until the FBI was even able to start making a dent in their numbers via convictions and deportations. But machine gun massacres stopped immediately after the passage of the NFA. You'd know that if you knew anything about gun crime and statistics.

So the NFA stopped the mob from using machine guns.

The same mobsters that were stopped from killing people by murder laws and from importing and selling liquor by Prohibition, right? Those mobsters?

This had nothing at all to do with public distaste for notorious mob hits, the rise of (much safer) wire fraud, and the collapse of the illicit alcohol trade, right?

Find me another usage of a Thompson in a crime after the passage of the NFA anywhere. The only one you'll find is kind of a moot point because it was a Sheriff. All of which can still get Thompsons if they wanted to anyway. They're exempt from the NFA Registry restrictions.

And keep in mind that Thompsons were still legal for purchase directly from the factory up until 1986. They're still legal for purchase today, they just have to be on the registry and you're getting it from a private citizen.

So because I was able to point out several occasions of non-registered machine guns being used in crimes after the NFA you are now moving the goalposts to just Thompsons?

I said ANY NFA weapon.

He was trying to make the point that the repealing of Prohibition was the reason mobsters stopped using their favorite weapon. My point was that they could still get them, and yet they stopped using them.


And he was right and you are flailing around trying to double down on a ridiculous point.
 
2014-04-09 07:48:08 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

No it gives the government a list when they decide to confiscate.

Tax stamp, remember?

Even a liberal SCOTUS would put the kabosh on that.

Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.

And BECAUSE OF THE TAX STAMP not even a liberal SCOTUS in the foreseeable future would allow rank confiscation.

Confiscation has already happened.  SKS rifles in CA, everything in NO during Katrina, CT wants everyone to register of surrender their "assault weapons" RIGHT NOW!!!  They closed the registry Jan 1.  So now anyone that still possessed one was instantly made a felon for doing nothing wrong.


First, those are states, not the federal government. And many of those are going to get struck down by SCOTUS and you know it. Second, there's no reason not to add protections from state governments on NFA stamped items as a prerequisite. My proposal already carries the cost of repealing the Hughes amendment.
 
2014-04-09 07:52:14 PM  

Callous: demaL-demaL-yeH: Callous: Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.

So do driver licenses and vehicle registration, Selective Service registrations, voter registrations, phone books, and assignment of Social Security numbers. Have "they" confiscated your car, drafted your paranoid assin peacetime, deprived you of the right to vote based on your skin melanin levels, confiscated your telephone, or denied you Social Security after you've earned eligibility?

That saying "too old to cut the muster" referred to a man being dropped from the registration and attendance rolls of the active Militia due to age. Registering your militia arms is almost as old as Amendment II, as in three months "younger".

/Let me guess: You also object to vehicle registration and mandatory insurance with reporting requirements, too.

Driving a car on public roads isn't a constitutionally protected right, stop with the false equivalency.


Thank you for making my point: Constitutional rights have a much  higher level of protection.
 
2014-04-09 07:53:58 PM  

Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Callous: iq_in_binary: Eventually illicit weapons will be very hard to come by.

You keep saying things like this as if they are true.

Go ahead and try to buy a select fire M16 outside of the NFA registry.

Oh you can't? I wonder why?

There's more of that true believer again.

So then do it. Go find a black market M16. Go ahead. Try.

You can't.

Just like I can't find pot, heroin, cocaine, etc?

Different circumstance. For one, it's a different agency.

Like I said. Go look. Try to find a Colt M16 on the black market, go ahead and look.

I have, you can't.

You aren't looking in the right places.


I've met every kind of interesting character you can imagine over the course of several interesting lines of work.

So, if you say they're so easy to get on the black market, you can show me an example of a stock select fire M16 or M4 being seized or used in a crime.

I'll wait. And no, illegally converted ARs don't count.
 
2014-04-09 08:02:21 PM  

Firethorn: iq_in_binary: Bonus, once we negotiate the repeal of the Hughes amendment in return for the expansion of it, IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

But as the Hughes amendment shows, it can become a ban easily enough.


Only on new registries. But in order to accomplish the expansion of the NFA, they have to repeal it.
 
2014-04-09 08:02:51 PM  

demaL-demaL-yeH: Callous: demaL-demaL-yeH: Callous: Registration, remember?  You said it yourself.  That gives the government a list.

So do driver licenses and vehicle registration, Selective Service registrations, voter registrations, phone books, and assignment of Social Security numbers. Have "they" confiscated your car, drafted your paranoid assin peacetime, deprived you of the right to vote based on your skin melanin levels, confiscated your telephone, or denied you Social Security after you've earned eligibility?

That saying "too old to cut the muster" referred to a man being dropped from the registration and attendance rolls of the active Militia due to age. Registering your militia arms is almost as old as Amendment II, as in three months "younger".

/Let me guess: You also object to vehicle registration and mandatory insurance with reporting requirements, too.

Driving a car on public roads isn't a constitutionally protected right, stop with the false equivalency.

Thank you for making my point: Constitutional rights have a much  higher level of protection.


Look to NO during Katrina, California SKS owners(well former owners), and Connecticut SB1160.  Tell me again how it can't happen.
 
2014-04-09 08:05:41 PM  

iq_in_binary: Firethorn: iq_in_binary: Bonus, once we negotiate the repeal of the Hughes amendment in return for the expansion of it, IT DOESN'T BAN anything.

But as the Hughes amendment shows, it can become a ban easily enough.

Only on new registries. But in order to accomplish the expansion of the NFA, they have to repeal it.


That's a ban.

The "assault weapons" ban prohibited the purchase of new "assault weapons" but grandfathered the ones already in circulation.  The Hughes amendment did EXACTLY the same thing.  Call it what it is, it's a ban.  And so if we get the Hughes Amendment repealed and then add everything to the NFA, what's stopping them from enacting the Hughes Amendment again?
 
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