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(CBC)   Parti Québécois handed worst defeat since 1970 at the hands of anglo immigrants and students; Liberal victors interpret this as mandate to be anything but PQ   (cbc.ca) divider line 65
    More: Followup, Parti Quebecois, Quebec General elections, Philippe Couillard, Jean Chretien, Pauline Marois, Quebec, Financial crisis of 2007-2009, individual mandate  
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1241 clicks; posted to Politics » on 08 Apr 2014 at 9:56 AM (23 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-08 08:48:20 AM
Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding. Marios took a solid lead in the poles before the election and turned it into a resounding defeat.

I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.
 
2014-04-08 08:54:32 AM
I guess the good people of Quebec decided against brown as a shirt colour.  Vous avez choisi à bon escient, mes amis.
 
2014-04-08 10:01:02 AM
That's great news for the rest of Canada. Stability is what Quebec needs now to rebuild their economy and clean up the infrastructure. Now they can get back to what is important: Poutine, Corruption and Strippers.
 
2014-04-08 10:01:48 AM
Huh. I thought it was 'money and the ethnic vote'.
 
2014-04-08 10:02:57 AM
The geniuses thought everyone wanted seperation, so much so that they called an election 18 months into their term. They were so sure they would go from minority govt to majority. And they were crushed. My newly purchased house (bought right before the election for a steal) just jumped in value by at least 20-25%.

Thanks PKP!
 
2014-04-08 10:06:02 AM

Pope Larry II: Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding. Marios took a solid lead in the poles before the election and turned it into a resounding defeat.

I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.


Poppycock!!  Those dastardly Anglo students from Onterrible illegally voted and skewed the whole thing!
 
2014-04-08 10:15:26 AM
This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.
 
2014-04-08 10:26:44 AM
Merde!  Does that mean we can actually get some bi-lingual signage in some of the hick places in QC?
 
2014-04-08 10:28:02 AM

Pope Larry II: Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding.


I really am horrible about headlines. 30 seconds after I submitted, I was like, "Wow, I should've made a crack about the hilarious pic of Couillard that's in it."

/ subby
// got one for the year, can now relax
 
2014-04-08 10:28:06 AM

ColonelCathcart: Merde!  Does that mean we can actually get some bi-lingual signage in some of the hick places in QC?


There is no problem with bilingual signage provided the French signage is larger and more prominent.
 
2014-04-08 10:30:44 AM
I guess playing the feverish anti-islam card outside of Europe isn't magic after all.
 
2014-04-08 10:34:14 AM

mrshowrules: ColonelCathcart: Merde!  Does that mean we can actually get some bi-lingual signage in some of the hick places in QC?

There is no problem with bilingual signage provided the French signage is larger and more prominent.


Are you serious that there is "no problem" with signage in Quebec for non-francophones?
 
2014-04-08 10:38:16 AM

mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.


Oh that is funny. Separatism will always run high to some degree in Quebec. Hell the Liberal Party of Quebec already said they will bring it up federally. Also if you look at the three main parties in QC, they all have ties to separation.
 
2014-04-08 10:38:43 AM
GOOD, Marois was smoking something good, she thought Quebec could separate but "have no borders, no tolls". DA FAQ?

This is actually a good sign, playing to the old racist guard isn't going to work anymore, time for the Gen Xers and Millennials to fix things up.
 
2014-04-08 10:40:22 AM
It's now time for everybody who's not from Quebec to point and laugh at the French language police.
 
2014-04-08 10:45:52 AM

ColonelCathcart: mrshowrules: ColonelCathcart: Merde!  Does that mean we can actually get some bi-lingual signage in some of the hick places in QC?

There is no problem with bilingual signage provided the French signage is larger and more prominent.

Are you serious that there is "no problem" with signage in Quebec for non-francophones?


No, just that technical bilingual signage is not prohibited by the law.
 
2014-04-08 10:47:14 AM

shortymac: GOOD, Marois was smoking something good, she thought Quebec could separate but "have no borders, no tolls". DA FAQ?

This is actually a good sign, playing to the old racist guard isn't going to work anymore, time for the Gen Xers and Millennials to fix things up.


Countries in Europe have very loose borders today.
 
2014-04-08 10:47:36 AM
Now they automatically have to stop pretending to speak French.
 
2014-04-08 10:50:54 AM

shortymac: GOOD, Marois was smoking something good, she thought Quebec could separate but "have no borders, no tolls". DA FAQ?

This is actually a good sign, playing to the old racist guard isn't going to work anymore, time for the Gen Xers and Millennials to fix things up.


What she meant by "separation" was "we have the power to enshrine racist dickbag laws while still effectively being in Canada", that's all. Basically the Canadian version of "States' rights *nudge nudge*"
 
2014-04-08 10:50:59 AM
img.fark.net
 
2014-04-08 11:00:09 AM

mr.doctor: mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.

Oh that is funny. Separatism will always run high to some degree in Quebec. Hell the Liberal Party of Quebec already said they will bring it up federally. Also if you look at the three main parties in QC, they all have ties to separation.


The hell are you smoking? Got any citations to back the bolded statements up? Separatism sentiment has never been weaker in Québec. We booted the Bloc out of the federal scene a few years back in favour of the NDP, and now we've swept the PQ even out of its leader's own freakin' riding. I wouldn't be surprised if Coalition Avenir Québec (CAQ) became the Liberal's new opposition in the near future, as it actually focuses on the issues we want to hear about, namely the economy and healthcare.

No matter how much rhetoric you may hear from separatist hardliners (who, admittedly, have always been the most vocal and gotten the most press, since folks love a good rant), Quebecers are sick of separatism. We're sick of hearing about it as a platform item. Of the four parties on the electoral radar, namely the PLQ, PQ, CAQ and QS (Québec Solidaire), only the PQ and QS actually have outright separation as part of their core platform. The CAQ was formed by a former PQ player, François Legault, specifically because he was tired of having separatism take center stage in provincial politics. He wanted to talk about infrastructure, business and health, and judging by this last election, his party is gaining mad traction. If separatism is even an item with this guy, he'll be bringing it up after our economy's fixed (about a day after never).

I, for one, am glad we've moved beyond the see-saw between the PLQ and PQ that's prevailed since the late 70s. I'm thrilled we're moving beyond separatism and that we use our voting power to oust those who would discriminate and marginalize. The times, they are a-changin'.
 
2014-04-08 11:02:43 AM

mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.


Not really. Québec's leadership has been shifting between the PQ and PLQ since the 70s, yet the PQ has always been the separatist party. They've lost plenty of times before, but never so spectacularly.

Good.
 
2014-04-08 11:02:53 AM

Geotpf: It's now time for everybody who's not from Quebec to point and laugh at the French language police.


img.photobucket.com
 
2014-04-08 11:05:42 AM

mrshowrules: There is no problem with bilingual signage provided the French signage is larger and more prominent


I know what they are compensating for.
/Anglo
//The Quebec ladies seems to be attracted to me.
 
2014-04-08 11:06:47 AM
Quebecers have a collective unconscious memory of a romantic time of the pioneer days.  Taming the land and building cities and a future.  It is like their Camelot.  I grew-up in Quebec and had those memories too.  It was an escape from the shackles of European tyranny.  A truly prosperous time.  Songs, stories and an oral history creating memories so vivid they feel real to people born just 20 years ago.

The feelings and emotions are all very real.  Pride, love, hard work, family.  Very real except for very important point.  What they don't realize is that the peak of prosperity, peace and well being they are remembering was actually after they lost the war and the English and French were working together.

Feelings are real and even the unconscious memories are real.  The mistake they make and which politicians foster is the association of these feelings with the period of Quebec independence before the French/English war.  That was actually a period of great suffering, strife and conflict.
 
2014-04-08 11:07:23 AM
Good for Quebec. Marois and her minions needed to go, and so they got stomped in an election they themselves called. Brilliant.

Now Canada just has to get rid of The Harper Government, and they can go back to being hands down the greatest country in North America.
 
2014-04-08 11:08:53 AM

mr.doctor: mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.

Oh that is funny. Separatism will always run high to some degree in Quebec. Hell the Liberal Party of Quebec already said they will bring it up federally. Also if you look at the three main parties in QC, they all have ties to separation.


To be more specific, I don't think you will have another referendum on seperation in my lifetime certainly but probably never.
 
2014-04-08 11:17:39 AM

Pope Larry II: I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.


Actually, the Charter of Values was what had the PQ way up in the polls at the start of the election. It's not popular in the cities, but it was quite popular out in rural areas with the simple farmers, the people of the land, you know... morons.

It's actually much more amusing that it was talk of separation, basically the PQ's raison d'être, that killed their campaign.
 
2014-04-08 11:33:47 AM
Nothing like a good old fashioned Canadian Punishment Vote.
 
2014-04-08 11:38:41 AM

Savage Bacon: mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.

Not really. Québec's leadership has been shifting between the PQ and PLQ since the 70s, yet the PQ has always been the separatist party. They've lost plenty of times before, but never so spectacularly.

Good.


They haven't lost power because they were talking desperation.   They've gotten power talking about separation.  They've lost power after losing a referendum.  They've even retained power by avoiding the subject.  I think the distinction is important.  It means raising the topic can now be viewed as political suicide (perhaps).

It would be like suggesting that health care insurance be privatized, it will end you.
 
2014-04-08 11:41:11 AM

vudukungfu: mrshowrules: There is no problem with bilingual signage provided the French signage is larger and more prominent

I know what they are compensating for.
/Anglo
//The Quebec ladies seems to be attracted to me.


That's just a biological driver to get genetic material outside their pool.
 
2014-04-08 11:46:51 AM
GO figure.

I'll admit I do not follow Quebecois politics too much, only in relation to how it affects my travel there.

From what I know, the PQ made a bunch of promises and completely and totally welched on them.
 
2014-04-08 11:49:40 AM

D135: Pope Larry II: Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding. Marios took a solid lead in the poles before the election and turned it into a resounding defeat.

I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.

Poppycock!!  Those dastardly Anglo students from Onterrible illegally voted and skewed the whole thing!


Money and the ethnic vote.  :)
 
2014-04-08 11:50:18 AM

miscreant: Pope Larry II: I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.

Actually, the Charter of Values was what had the PQ way up in the polls at the start of the election. It's not popular in the cities, but it was quite popular out in rural areas with the simple farmers, the people of the land, you know... morons.

It's actually much more amusing that it was talk of separation, basically the PQ's raison d'être, that killed their campaign.


It was popular in areas that have no visible minorities, imagine that. I think the more people thought about it, the more they realized that "minorities" may not conform to their ideals and may just leave the province.
 
2014-04-08 11:57:40 AM
fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net
 
2014-04-08 12:00:14 PM

D135: Pope Larry II: Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding. Marios took a solid lead in the poles before the election and turned it into a resounding defeat.

I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.

Poppycock!!  Those dastardly Anglo students from Onterrible illegally voted and skewed the whole thing!


The plan would have worked fine if it wasn't for those damn meddling kids!
 
2014-04-08 12:06:50 PM

Pope Larry II: Subby, you missed the part about the leader of the PQ losing her own riding. Marios took a solid lead in the poles before the election and turned it into a resounding defeat.

I'm guessing the talk about the Charter of Values (aka let's force the immigrants out of the province) and the Referendum did not go over well.


Bingo. I am foreseeing the spectacular decline of the PQ. Péladeau did not enter the race to be an MNA or even a Minister: He wants the top job. His leadership will cause even more PQ throat slitting and back stabbing while Quebec moves away from fantastical ideologies. Who else is going to take the reins? Drainville? His Chartre was what started this gong show. Lisée? Even as Minister for English relations he couldn't budge anglophone support so that isn't going to fly.

Let the in-fighting begin!
 
2014-04-08 12:07:44 PM

Tr0mBoNe: That's great news for the rest of Canada. Stability is what Quebec needs now to rebuild their economy and clean up the infrastructure. Now they can get back to what is important: Poutine, Corruption and Strippers


No, what Canada really needs is to cut Quebec lose and join the US. Depriving the French speakers of power in the rest of Canada will allow us to further isolate them and use our cultural might to force their filthy language into decline and eventual extinction.
 
2014-04-08 12:09:07 PM
It's cute people say this is the end of separatist talk. That would be like North Korea giving up their nuclear deterrent. Quebec needs their bargaining chip to extract special treatment in Canada. They'll just never vote for separation from the cash cow.
 
2014-04-08 12:17:41 PM

Savage Bacon: mr.doctor: mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.

Oh that is funny. Separatism will always run high to some degree in Quebec. Hell the Liberal Party of Quebec already said they will bring it up federally. Also if you look at the three main parties in QC, they all have ties to separation.

The hell are you smoking? Got any citations to back the bolded statements up? Separatism sentiment has never been weaker in Québec. We booted the Bloc out of the federal scene a few years back in favour of the NDP, and now we've swept the PQ even out of its leader's own freakin' riding. I wouldn't be surprised if Coalition Avenir Québec (CAQ) became the Liberal's new opposition in the near future, as it actually focuses on the issues we want to hear about, namely the economy and healthcare.

No matter how much rhetoric you may hear from separatist hardliners (who, admittedly, have always been the most vocal and gotten the most press, since folks love a good rant), Quebecers are sick of separatism. We're sick of hearing about it as a platform item. Of the four parties on the electoral radar, namely the PLQ, PQ, CAQ and QS (Québec Solidaire), only the PQ and QS actually have outright separation as part of their core platform. The CAQ was formed by a former PQ player, François Legault, specifically because he was tired of having separatism take center stage in provincial politics. He wanted to talk about infrastructure, business and health, and judging by this last election, his party is gaining mad traction. If separatism is even an item with this guy, he'll be bringing it up after our economy's fixed (about a day after never).

I, for one, am glad we've moved beyond the see-saw between the PLQ and PQ that's prevailed since the late 70s. I'm thrilled we're moving beyond separatism and that we use our voting power to oust those who would discriminate and marginalize. The times, t ...


Well The Globe and Mail states there is roughly a third of the country who still want separation:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/election-outcome-is-not- co uillards-win-as-much-as-maroiss-crushing-defeat/article17870504/

Also you can take it for a grain of salt but the right-wing Toronto Star: article on this:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/04/07/quebec_liberals_jump_t o_ early_lead_over_parti_qubcois.html

 Specifically saying:
"But that goodwill may be tested over such federal issues as the future of the embattled Senate. While the Conservatives want to bring in an elected, reformed Senate, the NDP favours the abolition of the upper chamber. If any of those proposals move ahead in the coming years, the Liberal leader has said that he will use any federal moves to change the Canadian Constitution to push for such things as Quebec's recognition as a distinct society within Canada, more power over Supreme Court appointments, limits on federal spending powers and powers to veto constitutional changes. "

While not entirely separatist plan, it is still playing with those people since they still can make changes in the province. We might not see another referendum on the board for a while (or again), you can never say for certain.

Also for the the three major parties still have some ties no matter what since the baby boomers are still around. CAQ has both Nationalist and Separatist in their wing, but they do not play that since it is more about fiscal responsibility. The Liberal Party has some ties into to play to the base. While no one is on the level of PQ on separatism, since they built their entire platform on it. Still maybe separatism is a strong word for it, but to say that it is dead now is still hard to say. It will take more than one or two election periods to prove this to me.

I am still happy in the end, with this result. This has always been an issue that has always nagged me since I live in Atlantic Canada. So good for the young people, and immigrants, and anglophones for getting them out.
 
2014-04-08 12:48:24 PM
Canadakota
 
2014-04-08 01:03:11 PM
So what will this do to the percentage of Canadians that want to kick Quebec out of the Confederation?
 
2014-04-08 01:08:58 PM
Savage Bacon:  I wouldn't be surprised if Coalition Avenir Québec (CAQ) became the Liberal's new opposition in the near future, as it actually focuses on the issues we want to hear about, namely the economy and healthcare.

I can't wait for the CAQ to get more popular. Imagine the election night headlines: "Quebecers prefer CAQ," "CAQ beats off opponents," etc. Yes, it's juvenile, but hey, it's better than all the xenophobia coming out of the PQ.
 
2014-04-08 01:20:34 PM

mr.doctor: Savage Bacon: mr.doctor: mrshowrules: This is the end of the separation movement.  It is the first time a party has lost power by even raising the concept of separation.

Oh that is funny. Separatism will always run high to some degree in Quebec. Hell the Liberal Party of Quebec already said they will bring it up federally. Also if you look at the three main parties in QC, they all have ties to separation.

The hell are you smoking? Got any citations to back the bolded statements up? Separatism sentiment has never been weaker in Québec. We booted the Bloc out of the federal scene a few years back in favour of the NDP, and now we've swept the PQ even out of its leader's own freakin' riding. I wouldn't be surprised if Coalition Avenir Québec (CAQ) became the Liberal's new opposition in the near future, as it actually focuses on the issues we want to hear about, namely the economy and healthcare.

No matter how much rhetoric you may hear from separatist hardliners (who, admittedly, have always been the most vocal and gotten the most press, since folks love a good rant), Quebecers are sick of separatism. We're sick of hearing about it as a platform item. Of the four parties on the electoral radar, namely the PLQ, PQ, CAQ and QS (Québec Solidaire), only the PQ and QS actually have outright separation as part of their core platform. The CAQ was formed by a former PQ player, François Legault, specifically because he was tired of having separatism take center stage in provincial politics. He wanted to talk about infrastructure, business and health, and judging by this last election, his party is gaining mad traction. If separatism is even an item with this guy, he'll be bringing it up after our economy's fixed (about a day after never).

I, for one, am glad we've moved beyond the see-saw between the PLQ and PQ that's prevailed since the late 70s. I'm thrilled we're moving beyond separatism and that we use our voting power to oust those who would discriminate and marginalize ...


From your article: "And yet the old isolated incidents that gave birth to the charter are not at the forefront of Quebeckers' concerns. Survey after survey showed they were more preoccupied with jobs, Quebec's sluggish economy, the province's health-care network or its staggering debt - "les vraies affaires" or the real issues, as the Liberal slogan had it."

There it is. This is why the PQ lost and the PLQ won. The article is correct in saying that this was more of a crushing PQ defeat than a brilliant PLQ victory. The PQ damned itself quite effectively. Furthermore, a recent article in La Presse, one of Montréal's foremost French-language newspapers, quoted CAQ leader François Legault as saying that the province shouldn't be voting PLQ just to get away from separatism, which I have to admit is a compellingreason to do so.

It is true that Legault came from the PQ, but he moved away from it because he felt, quite rightly, I believe, that the notion of an independent Québec is a pipe dream that draws attention away from things that actually matter. Naturally, he wants other PQ members to have the same "awakening" as he did and join him in CAQ. This doesn't mean that separatism will now build in this new party, but rather that people who choose to join it are tired of separatism and have become disillusioned with the PQ. Also, Couillard's talk of a "distinct society" doesn't mean "separation". It's just a Liberal way of saying "Look, we aren't saying Québec should be its o country, but it's foolish to think of it as just another Canadian province, as the cultural differences and history, stretching back hundreds of years, means that there will always be distinctions to be made". While I somewhat agree with this, I guess it all depends on one's definition of "distinct". To me, it's mostly nominal, not a way to go against the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

You're correct in saying that the PLQ is using this angle to win over voters that have at least some separatist sentiment, but if this mollifies everyone enough so that we can get separatism off the freakin' table and move on to practical things, then I'm all for it.
 
2014-04-08 01:21:01 PM
Huh.

Today I learned that Canada has politics, too.  Tiny widdle politics.  So adorable!
 
2014-04-08 01:21:06 PM
Has Quebec decided what portion of the national debt they are taking on if they succeed? Or even figured how they are issuing passports? The answer for the passport thing I keep hearing is that they will retain Canadian passports but they have yet to explain how they will make another sovereign country issue passports for their citizens.
 
2014-04-08 01:22:55 PM

sendtodave: Huh.

Today I learned that Canada has politics, too.  Tiny widdle politics.  So adorable!


Yep! We also have more than two parties, because our brains can handle higher numbers!
 
2014-04-08 01:26:18 PM

insertsnarkyusername: Has Quebec decided what portion of the national debt they are taking on if they

secede? Or even figured how they are issuing passports? The answer for the passport thing I keep hearing is that they will retain Canadian passports but they have yet to explain how they will make another sovereign country issue passports for their citizens.

/ftfm
 
2014-04-08 01:28:05 PM

Savage Bacon: sendtodave: Huh.

Today I learned that Canada has politics, too.  Tiny widdle politics.  So adorable!

Yep! We also have more than two parties, because our brains can handle higher numbers!


Daaaaw...

Very good, little guy!  Two IS bigger than one!
 
2014-04-08 01:32:27 PM

sendtodave: Savage Bacon: sendtodave: Huh.

Today I learned that Canada has politics, too.  Tiny widdle politics.  So adorable!

Yep! We also have more than two parties, because our brains can handle higher numbers!

Daaaaw...

Very good, little guy!  Two IS bigger than one!


But enough about the extent of your knowledge...
 
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