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(The Union Leader)   79-year-old substitute teacher quits her job rather than delete all her Facebook friends   (unionleader.com) divider line 75
    More: Asinine, friend, Facebook, substitute teacher, paraprofessionals, lesson plans  
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14499 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Apr 2014 at 4:08 PM (25 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-04-06 04:13:52 PM
Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.
 
2014-04-06 04:19:25 PM
I plan on going into welding and metal fabrication when I'm 57. That will teach the young whippersnappers with their Facebook this and Facebook that a thing or two. Just sayin'.
 
2014-04-06 04:21:15 PM
Typical asinine school/district policies, like back when I was a young boy and if someone acted up the lights went out and we all had to put our heads on our desks until everyone quietly complied.

There's nothing worse than a public school teacher with tenure or a school district administrator.  Each makes ridiculous rules and wonder why backlash occurs.  If any of them ever truly engaged his/her brain in through I best an anyeurism would erupt.
 
2014-04-06 04:22:16 PM
Zero tolerance = zero intelligence.
No, I wouldn't want to go back there either.
Move on Ma'am, you can do better.
 
2014-04-06 04:22:29 PM

Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.


Yea it's the same reason you don't connect with your vendors on LinkedIn. Even if 95% of your connections are fine it's the one idiot who can't handle themselves professionally that makes it a nightmare.
 
2014-04-06 04:23:26 PM

Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.


If the students had maintained private contact with her (say, through e-mail) I wonder if the schoolboard would have reacted the same way.

Was their true concern that the conversations were public?  If so, Why?

To this day I maintain cordial relationships with several past teachers, and occasionally their advice has been invaluable.

I really think the schoolboard over-reacted here.
 
2014-04-06 04:24:17 PM
Students using computers to communicate with people they see every day? What's next, letting them choose their own seats at lunch?
 
2014-04-06 04:24:20 PM
Good for her! The students can still be her FB friends and continue to confide in her.
 
2014-04-06 04:26:25 PM

To The Escape Zeppelin!: Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.

Yea it's the same reason you don't connect with your vendors on LinkedIn. Even if 95% of your connections are fine it's the one idiot who can't handle themselves professionally that makes it a nightmare.


LinkedIn is that site where people who get booted from their jobs every 6 months keep their resumes, right?
 
2014-04-06 04:29:28 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2014-04-06 04:31:51 PM
Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.
 
2014-04-06 04:34:26 PM
While not certified to teach, she was given charge of classrooms. Sometimes, it was a technical or vocational class that she took over. Rules prevented her from teaching in the shop class, so she would teach what she called motivational subjects, stressing truth, character and honesty. She said she would also work the concepts when taking an academic class in which she was following a lesson plan.

A substitute teacher who wasn't allowed to teach? What's going on here?
 
2014-04-06 04:34:40 PM
Good job, Mrs. T.

I respect someone who takes a stand and lives with the consequences.

I wonder what will happen when more and more part-time sub teachers do the same thing:  You want me to do what to an item that is entirely part of my personal life?  No thanks, find someone else.
 
2014-04-06 04:39:51 PM

red5ish: Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.


Quiet, you!  We're busy bein' made over here!
 
2014-04-06 04:40:16 PM

oryx: While not certified to teach, she was given charge of classrooms. Sometimes, it was a technical or vocational class that she took over. Rules prevented her from teaching in the shop class, so she would teach what she called motivational subjects, stressing truth, character and honesty. She said she would also work the concepts when taking an academic class in which she was following a lesson plan.

A substitute teacher who wasn't allowed to teach? What's going on here?


She's basically a babysitter. The school can't cancel classes or let kids go early so they basically need an adult to sit and watch the class.
 
2014-04-06 04:40:58 PM
Schools are little more than prisons for children. It's a giant industry with idiots at the helm. I thought it was bad when I was in school back in the 70s and 80s but it's truly a nightmare now.
 
2014-04-06 04:42:01 PM
Fark Facebook.
 
2014-04-06 04:44:47 PM
Facebook posting is more important than working at that school.    OK.

Strange choice, but hey whatever her deal is ....is up to her.   At 79,  who cares if she leaves.
 
2014-04-06 04:47:43 PM
I can respect someone who accepts the consequences of their actions. Good for her, despite the reasoning being iffy at best.

I understand you want to avoid inappropriate contact and that's great, but the world has changed since 1955 and fainting couches are harder to come by.
 
2014-04-06 04:47:51 PM

red5ish: Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.


that may well be true and if so we are well and truly boned.
 
2014-04-06 04:50:29 PM

Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.


I'd question if she crossed any professional lines. Yes you have to be careful to not do anything that may seem inappropriate with students, but at the same time, consider all the kids who have grown up to be good people because a teacher or mentor genuinely gave a damn, like this lady does.

There has to be a reasonable compromise somewhere.

red5ish: Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.

It's still a bad policy, regardless of who set it.
 
2014-04-06 04:52:22 PM

red5ish: Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager plaintiff's bar sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.


FTFY
 
2014-04-06 04:53:04 PM

Altoid: Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.

If the students had maintained private contact with her (say, through e-mail) I wonder if the schoolboard would have reacted the same way.

Was their true concern that the conversations were public?  If so, Why?

To this day I maintain cordial relationships with several past teachers, and occasionally their advice has been invaluable.

I really think the schoolboard over-reacted here.


I have a few past teachers I wouldn't mind looking up on Facebook. In fact I probably should. Of course, I'm an adult, and they aren't my teachers now, so it's okay. And one of them was a high school English teacher who I've run into once or twice. She said I could call her by her first name, which was cool, but odd. Hard to break the habit of using Mrs. (or, well, Ms. now, since she's divorced. Thank goodness. I had her ex as a teacher, too. He was a terrible teacher, and kind of sucked as a human being...)

The school board overreacted. But in the case of an adult friending minors over whom said adult holds authority (not much, but enough), I can kinda see why they might have a liability concern. Or... something.

/Wait 'til they graduate
 
2014-04-06 04:53:11 PM
I am pretty sure she is a cougar looking for some hookup with some young stud. I read about that stuff every day. The school was just protecting the students of an obvious predator.
 
2014-04-06 04:55:44 PM

Gary-L: There's nothing worse than a public school teacher with tenure



^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THISTHISTHIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

We ended up home-schooling because of an old out-of touch bat routinely belittled and harassed my child, and the principal couldn't do anything because of tenure.  (We didn't home-school for religious reasons, and he's in public high-school now, in NHS, an Eagle Scout, was on the baseball team, and doing just fine),

Our not-so CSB:
It was an early iteration of Common Core--AKA No Child Left Behind--that gave the biatch the idea to mock him for reading books above his grade level.  She called him out in class for "showing off", since he spoke with an elevated vocabulary, and laughed at him for reading Harry Potter books in fourth grade. We asked for meetings and she continually avoided us.  The principal did nothing to help--the old piece of shiat should have retired when Reagan left office.  When our other son was scheduled to have her the next year we pulled the plug.  When the principal called to see why we un-enrolled the kids, I told him because Mrs. Berry of Shady Lane Elementary School in Menomonee Falls was a horrid teacher.  He didn't put up any defense of her and said he hoped we would give the junior high a chance.  That's principal-speak for "I hear you, dude--please come back to the district when you can".
 
2014-04-06 04:58:43 PM

insertsnarkyusername: oryx: While not certified to teach, she was given charge of classrooms. Sometimes, it was a technical or vocational class that she took over. Rules prevented her from teaching in the shop class, so she would teach what she called motivational subjects, stressing truth, character and honesty. She said she would also work the concepts when taking an academic class in which she was following a lesson plan.

A substitute teacher who wasn't allowed to teach? What's going on here?

She's basically a babysitter. The school can't cancel classes or let kids go early so they basically need an adult to sit and watch the class.


Actually, the article got it wrong. "Mrs. T" responded in the comments and said she was a certified substitute.

I'm on the fence and I know it's zero tolerance policy for the brain -dead admin to follow. Especially since they didn't protect the student from the teacher that was fired earlier. However, it sounds like she does more good being accessible to students on FB than moving between schools as a sub. She sounds like she made the right choice for her situation. Good luck in the future, ma'am.
 
2014-04-06 05:00:42 PM
Well those are the rules. You have a problem following rules, subby?
 
2014-04-06 05:04:05 PM
I was on the fence with this, then I RTFA.

Stupid. She's doing nothing wrong. She's 70, why not tell them to fark off?  She is teaching for all the RIGHT reasons. Good job losing a true asset to children in a school system that is likely full of shiat.

This lady was trying to be a mentor and found social media as a way of giving her own time to helping the youth that she dealt with on a daily basis. I am sure she will find another outlet.   Good for her, hope she has many years left.
 
2014-04-06 05:08:43 PM
She told to take their job and shovel it.
 
2014-04-06 05:13:54 PM
Dammit lady, will you please stop caring? Paying more attention to these kids that you are compelled to by state minimum requirements makes both the other teachers and their apathetic parents look bad. Just process them and move on.
 
2014-04-06 05:18:37 PM

Canton: I have a few past teachers I wouldn't mind looking up on Facebook. In fact I probably should. Of course, I'm an adult, and they aren't my teachers now, so it's okay. And one of them was a high school English teacher who I've run into once or twice. She said I could call her by her first name, which was cool, but odd. Hard to break the habit of using Mrs. (or, well, Ms. now, since she's divorced. Thank goodness. I had her ex as a teacher, too. He was a terrible teacher, and kind of sucked as a human being...)


So did you... y'know... did you ever...
img.fark.netimg.fark.net
 
2014-04-06 05:18:48 PM

Gary-L: Typical asinine school/district policies, like back when I was a young boy and if someone acted up the lights went out and we all had to put our heads on our desks until everyone quietly complied.

There's nothing worse than a public school teacher with tenure or a school district administrator.  Each makes ridiculous rules and wonder why backlash occurs.  If any of them ever truly engaged his/her brain in through I best an anyeurism would erupt.


One rule for them all. Yes this nice lady might be good and all. But she puts the school At liability.


So much can go wrong.

A student posts about suicide and if she doesn't call the police the patents can site the school.

If this lady can friend students, so can the creepy teacher who will eventually get the school sued for inappropriate posts.

Our litigious society forces is to obey general rules.

Hell, the 14th Amendment requires that rules treat us all equally!
 
2014-04-06 05:19:41 PM

graeylin: Good job, Mrs. T.

I respect someone who takes a stand and lives with the consequences.

I wonder what will happen when more and more part-time sub teachers do the same thing:  You want me to do what to an item that is entirely part of my personal life?  No thanks, find someone else.


They will be fired and new people will take their jobs?
 
2014-04-06 05:22:10 PM

strangeluck: Somaticasual: Started to post in defense of the teacher, but there are some professional lines that really shouldn't be crossed in reality.

I'd question if she crossed any professional lines. Yes you have to be careful to not do anything that may seem inappropriate with students, but at the same time, consider all the kids who have grown up to be good people because a teacher or mentor genuinely gave a damn, like this lady does.

There has to be a reasonable compromise somewhere.

red5ish: Please be advised that the school system's insurance carrier's risk assessment manager sets policy in these matters. School administrators' hands are tied.

It's still a bad policy, regardless of who set it.


The policy protects the school from liability.

Want less policies like this? Make schools no longer liable for employee behavior or student behavior.

Then they won't need zero tolerance policies to protect them from lawsuits.
 
2014-04-06 05:24:13 PM

fickenchucker: Gary-L: There's nothing worse than a public school teacher with tenure


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THISTHISTHIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

We ended up home-schooling because of an old out-of touch bat routinely belittled and harassed my child, and the principal couldn't do anything because of tenure.  (We didn't home-school for religious reasons, and he's in public high-school now, in NHS, an Eagle Scout, was on the baseball team, and doing just fine),

Our not-so CSB:
It was an early iteration of Common Core--AKA No Child Left Behind--that gave the biatch the idea to mock him for reading books above his grade level.  She called him out in class for "showing off", since he spoke with an elevated vocabulary, and laughed at him for reading Harry Potter books in fourth grade. We asked for meetings and she continually avoided us.  The principal did nothing to help--the old piece of shiat should have retired when Reagan left office.  When our other son was scheduled to have her the next year we pulled the plug.  When the principal called to see why we un-enrolled the kids, I told him because Mrs. Berry of Shady Lane Elementary School in Menomonee Falls was a horrid teacher.  He didn't put up any defense of her and said he hoped we would give the junior high a chance.  That's principal-speak for "I hear you, dude--please come back to the district when you can".


Teacher tenure really doesn't exist outside of New York.

You do have to show cause. But that doesn't make it impossible to fire a teacher. They just have the basic protection all workers should have.
 
2014-04-06 05:26:01 PM

fickenchucker: Gary-L: There's nothing worse than a public school teacher with tenure


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^THISTHISTHIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

We ended up home-schooling because of an old out-of touch bat routinely belittled and harassed my child, and the principal couldn't do anything because of tenure.  (We didn't home-school for religious reasons, and he's in public high-school now, in NHS, an Eagle Scout, was on the baseball team, and doing just fine),


Other side of that sort of situation: I had a third-grade teacher, tough but fair, did a good job with nearly everyone willing to learn.  Well, some time after I had her, some girl did enough stupid shiat to get on the bad side of this teacher, who then wouldn't let her get away with anything the rest of the year.  The petty asshole (student, not the teacher), harbored a grudge for more than 20 years, until her OWN kid was in this lady's class, and she basically instructed the kid to bait the teacher every possible chance he could, and finally, the teacher caught the kid wearing a wire!  biatchmom sent her kid in wearing a recording device to try to stick it to her old "nemesis," and the teacher caught him.

There was an incredible shiatstorm.  The teacher ended up not just getting charges pressed against the mother, she also got a small settlement from the district, a written apology from the district AND a personal apology from biatchmom.

Then she basically flipped them all off, walked out the door and retired at 62.  She'd had enough of whiny, entitled PARENTS and district staff who refused to ever support the teaching staff.  Tenure was the only weapon she had to defend herself against a whiny brat who never learned to grow the fark up.
 
2014-04-06 05:28:18 PM
www.tshirtvortex.net
 
2014-04-06 05:29:16 PM

shtychkn: graeylin: Good job, Mrs. T.

I respect someone who takes a stand and lives with the consequences.

I wonder what will happen when more and more part-time sub teachers do the same thing:  You want me to do what to an item that is entirely part of my personal life?  No thanks, find someone else.

They will be fired and new people will take their jobs?


And I am okay with that, just like Mrs. T is. If enough people decide they don't want to work for USD 123, because they require all subs to provide all email, social network, instagram, and linkedin passwords, along with their hard drive passwords for a home computer checkscan, then maybe USD 123 will have to either rethink their stupid policies, or the admins will have to do something resembling actual work, and teach/babysit a class.
 
2014-04-06 05:29:57 PM
I feel kind of bad for the old lady but I actually side with the school on this one.  The first time some pedo picks a kid out from a photo on her page for some kidnapping and rape you know the school will get its ass sued.  Not to mention that it didn't sound like she was getting the parents permission to post photos of their kids.  Some of us still like some privacy.  You won't find any photos of me or my kids online.
 
2014-04-06 05:31:56 PM

Rand's lacy underwear: Canton: I have a few past teachers I wouldn't mind looking up on Facebook. In fact I probably should. Of course, I'm an adult, and they aren't my teachers now, so it's okay. And one of them was a high school English teacher who I've run into once or twice. She said I could call her by her first name, which was cool, but odd. Hard to break the habit of using Mrs. (or, well, Ms. now, since she's divorced. Thank goodness. I had her ex as a teacher, too. He was a terrible teacher, and kind of sucked as a human being...)

So did you... y'know... did you ever...
[img.fark.net image 624x352][img.fark.net image 624x352]


Oh geez. Don't let me get in the way of your fantasies, but, uh, I don't swing that way.

/Or any way.
//Had some great teachers
///Some for multiple years (French teacher for four, orchestra teacher for seven)
////Smallish district
 
2014-04-06 05:34:10 PM

graeylin: shtychkn: graeylin: Good job, Mrs. T.

I respect someone who takes a stand and lives with the consequences.

I wonder what will happen when more and more part-time sub teachers do the same thing:  You want me to do what to an item that is entirely part of my personal life?  No thanks, find someone else.

They will be fired and new people will take their jobs?

And I am okay with that, just like Mrs. T is. If enough people decide they don't want to work for USD 123, because they require all subs to provide all email, social network, instagram, and linkedin passwords, along with their hard drive passwords for a home computer checkscan, then maybe USD 123 will have to either rethink their stupid policies, or the admins will have to do something resembling actual work, and teach/babysit a class.


I know or seems like admin doesn't do anything.

But what they do is deal with hundreds of student and patent issues.

Think of how much derp is on the Internet. Well, that's what they spend their day dealing with.
 
2014-04-06 05:35:50 PM

shtychkn: Teacher tenure really doesn't exist outside of New York.

You do have to show cause. But that doesn't make it impossible to fire a teacher. They just have the basic protection all workers should have.



You know how I know you don't know what you're talking about?  Getting rid of bad teachers around here is about as easy as extracting helium from Mars.  or, considering your comment, Uranus.  "At will" employment isn't a bad thing, considering I work under those rules and have the same job for 18 years and through three downsizings.  Mad skillz, as the kids say, keep one employed.

Corollary to my CSB:
My brother is a terrible teacher and always in trouble, but unfireable due to tenure.
 
2014-04-06 05:38:38 PM

fickenchucker: shtychkn: Teacher tenure really doesn't exist outside of New York.

You do have to show cause. But that doesn't make it impossible to fire a teacher. They just have the basic protection all workers should have.


You know how I know you don't know what you're talking about?  Getting rid of bad teachers around here is about as easy as extracting helium from Mars.  or, considering your comment, Uranus.  "At will" employment isn't a bad thing, considering I work under those rules and have the same job for 18 years and through three downsizings.  Mad skillz, as the kids say, keep one employed.

Corollary to my CSB:
My brother is a terrible teacher and always in trouble, but unfireable due to tenure.


Give a verbal warning to the teacher about the issue.

Write the teacher up for the reason they deserved to be fired.

Create an improvement Plan to fix the problem.

Problem not fixed? Now you can fire.


What's so hard about that?
 
2014-04-06 05:39:24 PM

fickenchucker: shtychkn: Teacher tenure really doesn't exist outside of New York.

You do have to show cause. But that doesn't make it impossible to fire a teacher. They just have the basic protection all workers should have.


You know how I know you don't know what you're talking about?  Getting rid of bad teachers around here is about as easy as extracting helium from Mars.  or, considering your comment, Uranus.  "At will" employment isn't a bad thing, considering I work under those rules and have the same job for 18 years and through three downsizings.  Mad skillz, as the kids say, keep one employed.

Corollary to my CSB:
My brother is a terrible teacher and always in trouble, but unfireable due to tenure.


What state does your brother work in?
 
2014-04-06 05:45:55 PM
Posting pictures of current students? Eh... no...
 
2014-04-06 05:56:24 PM

graeylin: Good job, Mrs. T.

I respect someone who takes a stand and lives with the consequences.

I wonder what will happen when more and more part-time sub teachers do the same thing:  You want me to do what to an item that is entirely part of my personal life?  No thanks, find someone else.


She most likely has tenure and a nice pension waiting.  I doubt the decision was very hard.  A true hero of our time.
 
2014-04-06 05:58:19 PM
My 4th grade teacher found me on FB a few years ago. I LOVED her when she was my teacher. When we were younger my best friend and I would walk to her house during spring and summer breaks to visit and say hello. It never occurred to us that it was inappropriate although reflecting back it explains why we would just sit on her front porch and shoot the shiat.

She's the only teacher of mine I'd ever accept a friend request from. I still smiled like an idiot when she liked and commented a picture of me that was posted where I accepting an award of recognition for an incident I handled. Kind of reminds me of this lady.....lots of former students on her FB and they all loved her. I suppose that's where the similarity ends...i don't think she would've ever accepted a current student had the Facebooks been around before she retired.

She passed away in June. RIP Mrs. M :(
 
2014-04-06 05:59:46 PM

InternetSecurityGuard: She told to take their job and shovel it.


We should throw her a retirement party. Somewhere really, really special unique unusual. Like, Taco Bell!

/no more Mrs. T?
//I pity da school
 
2014-04-06 06:05:38 PM
"In truth, being a caring, lovely woman doesn't give you immunity to ignore a school board policy that's designed to protect everyone make no farking difference whatsoever, but cover our a$$es legally,"
 
2014-04-06 06:10:15 PM

Vangor: Posting pictures of current students? Eh... no...


If I rtfa correctly, she wasn't posting their picyures; she required the student who sent her a friend request to have his/her picture up so she could verify who it was. The admin's concern was that someone among her thousands of FB friends might try to connect with one of the other thousands. Because in real life, people who know me personally would never have an opportunity to meet each other....
 
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