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(BBC)   Russia: Hey Ukraine, about that cheap gas we've been selling you. How about an 81% price rise   (bbc.co.uk) divider line 35
    More: Obvious, Gazprom, Hey Ukraine, Russia, Ukraine, Arseniy Yatsenyuk, energy minister, war of aggression  
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1065 clicks; posted to Business » on 05 Apr 2014 at 8:17 PM (15 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



35 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-04-05 07:49:42 PM
To think there were those who tried to say this was about economics.
 
2014-04-05 08:34:47 PM
Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?
 
2014-04-05 08:39:14 PM
It stinks.
 
2014-04-05 08:45:20 PM

The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?


Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.
 
2014-04-05 08:55:15 PM
Russia would not at all be pissed if we sent a few tankers.  I say go for it.
 
2014-04-05 08:55:56 PM
howaboutnobear.jpg

I read another article that said the reason Gazprom is raising the price is because the lower price was negotiated as a payment to Ukraine, for Russia's continuing use of naval facilities in Sevastopol.  So, Gazprom's logic is, now that Russia 'owns' Crimea, Ukraine's no longer entitled to the discount.

"Now that we've stolen this land from you, we no longer owe you anything for using it."

Pretty farked up.
 
2014-04-05 08:57:46 PM

jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.


www.quickmeme.com
 
2014-04-05 09:04:35 PM

jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.


Ukraine has the off switch.
Ukraine can buy gas from the west.

/Go ahead Putin, do it.
 
2014-04-05 09:05:03 PM

jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.


And Ukraine owns the land over which Russia is transporting gas to Europe.  Seems like they can charge whatever tariffs they like too.
 
2014-04-05 09:06:01 PM

ScaryBottles: jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.

[www.quickmeme.com image 611x404]


Does anyone know how Russia's new price compares to the international market? I've has a look online and prices seem to be in BTU, but the Russian prices is in 1,000 cubic metre units.
 
2014-04-05 09:08:56 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.

Ukraine has the off switch.
Ukraine can buy gas from the west.

/Go ahead Putin, do it.


The flow is currently East top West. It would take time to increase European production.
http://www.economist.com/news/briefing/21600111-reducing-europes-dep en dence-russian-gas-possiblebut-it-will-take-time-money-and-sustained
Short term Russia has the aces. Long term they need the foreign currency.
 
2014-04-05 09:12:04 PM

jamspoon: The Bestest: Ukraine: How about "bite me"? Does that work out for you?

Russia has the off switch. And to be fair it is their gas so they can charge what they like.

the market will bear.

fixed.
 
2014-04-05 09:12:10 PM
This is almost amusing. FTFA: The price increase could also affect gas supplies to Europe, as 40% of Russian gas to the continent travels through Ukraine, says the BBC's David Stern in Kiev.

If the Ukraine does not agree to the price increase and a deal cannot be settled upon, would Russia really turn off the pipe and lose the European customers?
 
2014-04-05 09:40:33 PM
Ukraine to Russia:  It would be a shame if we shut off all the electricity flowing into Crimea
 
2014-04-05 09:41:47 PM

geek_mars: This is almost amusing. FTFA: The price increase could also affect gas supplies to Europe, as 40% of Russian gas to the continent travels through Ukraine, says the BBC's David Stern in Kiev.

If the Ukraine does not agree to the price increase and a deal cannot be settled upon, would Russia really turn off the pipe and lose the European customers?


The fun part would be watching as Russia's oligarchs destroy Putin's government, because their money dries up. No more giraffes for you, assholes!
 
2014-04-05 09:48:19 PM

geek_mars: This is almost amusing. FTFA: The price increase could also affect gas supplies to Europe, as 40% of Russian gas to the continent travels through Ukraine, says the BBC's David Stern in Kiev.

If the Ukraine does not agree to the price increase and a deal cannot be settled upon, would Russia really turn off the pipe and lose the European customers?


Yeah, I'm thinking the Ukraine says, OK, we take 10% of all gas crossing our country as payment. Anything we do not need, we will sell to Europe at the rate you charge them.

Q.E.D.
 
2014-04-05 10:10:18 PM

jamspoon: Short term Russia has the aces. Long term they need the foreign currency.


long term, as in 2017 they have to worry about the Israel/Cypriot Leviathan and Turkish/Georgian pipeline cutting into their ability to use gas as a threat. Even if those countries don't enough to replace Russian entirely they will have enough to undermine price gouging by underselling Russia
 
2014-04-05 10:16:53 PM
Again, fark Gerhardt Shroeder with a rusty dildo
 
2014-04-05 10:22:31 PM
It's like the stomach telling asshole, that after getting a colostomy bag, its days are numbered.
 
2014-04-05 11:45:18 PM

jamspoon: Russia has the off switch.


Russia has  an off switch. I'm not saying they won't get away with this, just that the Ukraine has some options here.
 
2014-04-06 02:44:37 AM
The Ukraine weak. It's a road apple. I think we should put some hurt on the Ukraine.

www.nba.com
 
2014-04-06 02:51:40 AM
1) Ukraine can and will buy gas from Europe. However, Europe made it abundantly clear that all that gas will be sold at market price. As Slovenian president said, "Slovenia is more than happy to help Ukraine, Slovenia, however, will not pay for that help."

2) Ukraine once already tried this shtick with pipeline blackmail. Didn't play well: Stockholm arbitration court ordered Ukraine to return the gas stolen. Also, specifically to avoid that scenario, Nord Stream Pipeline was born, connecting Russia directly to Germany. So, Russia can turn off Ukrainian pipe and yet fulfill significant part of its obligations to Europe.

3) Ukraine is dependent on Europe's goodwill for everything. "Europe, in our fight against Russia we are turning off your gas, wreaking havoc with industry and energy-heat generation of other Eastern European countries. It's a sacrifice Ukraine is ready to make" will not play well in Europe. Sure, Russia will be blamed publicly, but the amount of good will towards Ukraine will be significantly reduced.

We shall see how it'll play out.
 
2014-04-06 04:35:19 AM
Freedom from Russia's evil grasp should be worth that.  May be the next green energy breakthrough will come from a Ukrainian.
 
2014-04-06 05:36:12 AM

rev. dave: Freedom from Russia's evil grasp should be worth that.  May be the next green energy breakthrough will come from a Ukrainian.


The world is more complex than that. Russia has interests which are in many respects diametrically opposed to ours. That does not make Russia evil any more than it makes us righteous.
 
2014-04-06 05:58:06 AM

Angela Lansbury's Merkin: Ukraine to Russia:  It would be a shame if we shut off all the electricity flowing into Crimea


"It'd be a bigger shame if we told NATO they could build silos in our country".
 
2014-04-06 06:01:11 AM
Doesn't Russia import a lot of their food from Ukraine?

Given that we're now in Cold War Part Two, we should be spending at least half our military budget on energy independence, finding a way through renewables to make all the natural gas we need and also be able to supply other nations to remove Russia's influence through fossil fuels.
 
2014-04-06 08:58:30 AM
Ukraine protests the sh*t out of every exploration rig that has tried to drill there.  Any lack of oil and gas they have is their own damn fault.
 
2014-04-06 09:23:17 AM

NightSteel: I read another article that said the reason Gazprom is raising the price is because the lower price was negotiated as a payment to Ukraine, for Russia's continuing use of naval facilities in Sevastopol. So, Gazprom's logic is, now that Russia 'owns' Crimea, Ukraine's no longer entitled to the discount.

"Now that we've stolen this land from you, we no longer owe you anything for using it."

Pretty farked up.


OH THE IRONY!

Lets ask some Native Americans what they think about that comment.
 
2014-04-06 10:19:48 AM

Befuddled: Doesn't Russia import a lot of their food from Ukraine?


Some, but not exactly "a lot". Russia have more than enough territories and people for lots of farming, but little incentive to develop it, so far.

Befuddled: Given that we're now in Cold War Part Two


We are? Don't you think that "local power, a tiny shadow of its former self, being rude and uncultured in its own immediate surrounding, but unable (and having no desire) to threaten in any way whatsoever anyone but its closest neighbors, and even those on extremely limited scale" is a bit of downgrade of Cold War?

Befuddled: we should be spending at least half our military budget on energy independence


Hear, hear! Cold war or not, but there is little downside to farking financing development of future infrastructure and technologies!

Befuddled: remove Russia's influence through fossil fuels.


And that would benefit not only the West, but Russia too, in the long run!
 
2014-04-06 12:54:36 PM

geek_mars: This is almost amusing. FTFA: The price increase could also affect gas supplies to Europe, as 40% of Russian gas to the continent travels through Ukraine, says the BBC's David Stern in Kiev.

If the Ukraine does not agree to the price increase and a deal cannot be settled upon, would Russia really turn off the pipe and lose the European customers?


Russia could start selling more to China.
 
2014-04-06 01:45:19 PM

FabulousFreep: NightSteel: I read another article that said the reason Gazprom is raising the price is because the lower price was negotiated as a payment to Ukraine, for Russia's continuing use of naval facilities in Sevastopol. So, Gazprom's logic is, now that Russia 'owns' Crimea, Ukraine's no longer entitled to the discount.

"Now that we've stolen this land from you, we no longer owe you anything for using it."

Pretty farked up.

OH THE IRONY!

Lets ask some Native Americans what they think about that comment.


Well, I just asked a Native American friend of mine and she thinks you're a farking moron for comparing a centuries old issue to a current geopolitical crisis.
 
2014-04-06 05:57:15 PM

Marmilman: FabulousFreep: NightSteel: I read another article that said the reason Gazprom is raising the price is because the lower price was negotiated as a payment to Ukraine, for Russia's continuing use of naval facilities in Sevastopol. So, Gazprom's logic is, now that Russia 'owns' Crimea, Ukraine's no longer entitled to the discount.

"Now that we've stolen this land from you, we no longer owe you anything for using it."

Pretty farked up.

OH THE IRONY!

Lets ask some Native Americans what they think about that comment.

Well, I just asked a Native American friend of mine and she thinks you're a farking moron for comparing a centuries old issue to a current geopolitical crisis.


Isn't crimea a centuries old issue for the Crimean Tartars?

/I am only 50% trolling
//You are 100% trolling
///Ukraine has raised internal prices 50%, Russia raised theirs 80%......blown out of proportion by the IMF
 
2014-04-07 12:40:43 AM

Tellurianix: rev. dave: Freedom from Russia's evil grasp should be worth that.  May be the next green energy breakthrough will come from a Ukrainian.

The world is more complex than that. Russia has interests which are in many respects diametrically opposed to ours. That does not make Russia evil any more than it makes us righteous.


A corrupting influence is evil.  Russian interests are at least part of the cause of corruption.
 
2014-04-07 03:40:01 AM

ColonelCathcart: ///Ukraine has raised internal prices 50%, Russia raised theirs 80%......blown out of proportion by the IMF


Well, I wouldn't say it's blown out of proportion. The agreement was like this: "your economy works for Russia, you are such a good friend to Russia, we are selling you gas for your industry and people on a large discount".

Now, when Ukraine's economy doesn't work for Russia anymore, instead turning to Europe, and Ukraine is not Russia's friend anymore, Russia sells gas to Ukraine using market rates, without sponsoring Ukraine's economy and people. "Let your new best friend forever, Europe, help you." Quite reasonable.

Europe, of course, is happy to help, but is not going to pay for Ukraine's gas. Which means, that Ukrainian industry, barely competitive as it was, with cheap gas, is in the total and utter shiater right now. It's not going to end well... So not exactly blown out of proportions, but neither Russia is a monster here.
 
2014-04-07 05:41:10 AM
Right now it appears Americans pay $9.24 dollars per 1000 ft3, while import/export price runs aronud 3.50. Ukraine was being charged $7.60 per 1000ft3. so they were not getting a great deal, but not a horrible deal either. Ukraine is late on payment for 6.3 billion cubic meters of gas, so Russia is just acting like the credit collector they have become. the 1st tactic of raising prices didn't work, so now Russia will have to come up with a second plan.
 
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