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(NYPost)   So I'm guilty, eh? Whatever. Can I get a drink?   (nypost.com) divider line 79
    More: Dumbass, Margaritaville, brooklyn federal court, minimum sentence, Akeem Monsalvatge  
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8179 clicks; posted to Main » on 05 Apr 2014 at 10:12 PM (42 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



79 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2014-04-06 12:37:35 AM  
This black guy at work got pissed at me last week because I made the joke that from my expirence waiting tables black people always order blended parton margaritas. Mayber I should send him this article, I'm sure that would help the situation.
 
2014-04-06 12:45:35 AM  

frozenhotchocolate: Mayber I should send him this article, I'm sure that would help the situation


How would that help the fact that he has an insensitive and unfunny coworker?
 
2014-04-06 12:46:51 AM  

frozenhotchocolate: This black guy at work got pissed at me last week because I made the joke that from my expirence waiting tables black people always order blended parton margaritas. Mayber I should send him this article, I'm sure that would help the situation.


As a diner in Japan, I always notice girls get white wine or a fruity cocktail while men get a beer.

But, when I was a waiter, every damn time a couple came in and ordered a beer and fruity cocktail, the girl took the beer and the guy took the fruity drink. It was weird.

Maybe it's a perspective thing.
 
2014-04-06 12:55:30 AM  

proteus_b: frozenhotchocolate: Mayber I should send him this article, I'm sure that would help the situation

How would that help the fact that he has an insensitive and unfunny coworker?


I was just told today he was bi-polar, I didn't know. I should not have said that, he hates me now. But I thought it was funny and that's all that matters to me.
 
2014-04-06 01:02:21 AM  

doglover: Abacus9: Just put a bullet in their head.

Because, in the execution of their crime no one was hurt but insurance companies and they showed a hell of a lot more brain power than anyone on Fark.com ever has. It's not quite the same as one of Dick Turpin's bungling attacks.

Also, bullets are wasteful and messy. A guillotine or sword works just fine, if it comes to that.


Armed robbery. No one got hurt. Would you make the same argument about drunk driving?
 
2014-04-06 01:06:56 AM  

frozenhotchocolate: proteus_b: frozenhotchocolate: Mayber I should send him this article, I'm sure that would help the situation

How would that help the fact that he has an insensitive and unfunny coworker?

I was just told today he was bi-polar, I didn't know. I should not have said that, he hates me now. But I thought it was funny and that's all that matters to me.


So, you're telling us you're an asshole on many levels?
 
2014-04-06 01:07:47 AM  

Abacus9: doglover: Abacus9: Just put a bullet in their head.

Because, in the execution of their crime no one was hurt but insurance companies and they showed a hell of a lot more brain power than anyone on Fark.com ever has. It's not quite the same as one of Dick Turpin's bungling attacks.

Also, bullets are wasteful and messy. A guillotine or sword works just fine, if it comes to that.

Armed robbery. No one got hurt. Would you make the same argument about drunk driving?


Really, Judge Dredd. What about shoplifting? It's stealing too, just not with a gun. That has to be worth at least 5 years.
 
2014-04-06 01:31:12 AM  

Abacus9: doglover: Abacus9: Just put a bullet in their head.

Because, in the execution of their crime no one was hurt but insurance companies and they showed a hell of a lot more brain power than anyone on Fark.com ever has. It's not quite the same as one of Dick Turpin's bungling attacks.

Also, bullets are wasteful and messy. A guillotine or sword works just fine, if it comes to that.

Armed robbery. No one got hurt. Would you make the same argument about drunk driving?


I do. Frequently. America is set up in such a way that to enjoy the legal boon of alcohol at a bar, you have to drive in most places. Then, instead of helping people with a reasonable time frame where they can sober up or drink till they pass out and sleep it, they force everyone out onto the road at 2 AM. Then, to make things even extra special, they have DUI checkpoints near the bars to catch "dangerous" drunk drivers. Thanks to the laws, at certain hours, there's more drunks than sobers on the road.That's not crime prevention, that's criminalization by proxy.

You know where DUI isn't a big problem? Tokyo. Public drinking is legal, it goes 24 hours, and there's enough light rail, bus, and taxi goodness that you can get fall down drunk and still make it home without even owning a car. Plenty of crash space oriented business, as well. Europe is like this too. In the Netherlands, drunk cycling is encouraged. It's safer than operating cars. If DUI was such a big problem, We could easily regulate it out of existence with a few simple rules changes, easing up on alternative, and an investment in public transport. Harm reduction, works every time.


But America's legal system imprisons Justice in stone and plants her outside with a blindfold and her back to the proceedings. That's your first clue something is dreadfully wrong with it. When an armed robbery with no shots fired, no deaths or injuries, nets a mandatory MINIMUM sentence that is less than that of first degree murder. That's just insanity.
 
2014-04-06 02:02:54 AM  

Mugato: Abacus9: doglover: Abacus9: Just put a bullet in their head.

Because, in the execution of their crime no one was hurt but insurance companies and they showed a hell of a lot more brain power than anyone on Fark.com ever has. It's not quite the same as one of Dick Turpin's bungling attacks.

Also, bullets are wasteful and messy. A guillotine or sword works just fine, if it comes to that.

Armed robbery. No one got hurt. Would you make the same argument about drunk driving?

Really, Judge Dredd. What about shoplifting? It's stealing too, just not with a gun. That has to be worth at least 5 years.


Don't be so dramatic. Armed robbery is different because it involves arms.
 
2014-04-06 02:13:55 AM  

doglover: Abacus9: doglover: Abacus9: Just put a bullet in their head.

Because, in the execution of their crime no one was hurt but insurance companies and they showed a hell of a lot more brain power than anyone on Fark.com ever has. It's not quite the same as one of Dick Turpin's bungling attacks.

Also, bullets are wasteful and messy. A guillotine or sword works just fine, if it comes to that.

Armed robbery. No one got hurt. Would you make the same argument about drunk driving?

I do. Frequently. America is set up in such a way that to enjoy the legal boon of alcohol at a bar, you have to drive in most places. Then, instead of helping people with a reasonable time frame where they can sober up or drink till they pass out and sleep it, they force everyone out onto the road at 2 AM. Then, to make things even extra special, they have DUI checkpoints near the bars to catch "dangerous" drunk drivers. Thanks to the laws, at certain hours, there's more drunks than sobers on the road.That's not crime prevention, that's criminalization by proxy.

You know where DUI isn't a big problem? Tokyo. Public drinking is legal, it goes 24 hours, and there's enough light rail, bus, and taxi goodness that you can get fall down drunk and still make it home without even owning a car. Plenty of crash space oriented business, as well. Europe is like this too. In the Netherlands, drunk cycling is encouraged. It's safer than operating cars. If DUI was such a big problem, We could easily regulate it out of existence with a few simple rules changes, easing up on alternative, and an investment in public transport. Harm reduction, works every time.


But America's legal system imprisons Justice in stone and plants her outside with a blindfold and her back to the proceedings. That's your first clue something is dreadfully wrong with it. When an armed robbery with no shots fired, no deaths or injuries, nets a mandatory MINIMUM sentence that is less than that of first degree murder. That's just insanity.


Armed robbery is a serious crime. The fact that the perp didn't actually pull the trigger means nothing. They were still willing to waste someone, a human, over a few bucks. They don't deserve to live, and I thought you understood that.
 
2014-04-06 02:43:11 AM  

Abacus9: Armed robbery is a serious crime.


And slavery is a serious punishment. But, as the judge said "Each of you showed great potential," he said. "You had the benefit of youth, which will be squandered behind bars."

That's what's wrong with the US legal system. We make criminals out of everyone, stuff 'em in with sardines, and to what end? It just overloads the system so that when guys like this crop up we can only stick them in a hole and let them rot. We're squandering our own people.

We could easily utilize these guys to help society instead of lining the pockets of a for-profit prison system if we had enough free prison resources.

You know who else was an armed bank robber who never shot anyone, if you'll believe him: Ice T.

assets-s3.rollingstone.com

Don't know how much of that confession on air was an act, but he did confess to doing some robberies after the military and he's pretty much the opposite of a drain on society. And every veteran of every war ever fought was a violent criminal during their time on the battlefield. Somehow, most of them turn out alright, too.

The whole point of crime and punishment is to prevent future crimes by rehabilitation or removal. 32 years in jail is neither and I can't justify the death penalty for someone who didn't kill anyone or order others to kill for them.
 
2014-04-06 02:59:03 AM  

doglover: I do. Frequently. America is set up in such a way that to enjoy the legal boon of alcohol at a bar, you have to drive in most places. Then, instead of helping people with a reasonable time frame where they can sober up or drink till they pass out and sleep it, they force everyone out onto the road at 2 AM. Then, to make things even extra special, they have DUI checkpoints near the bars to catch "dangerous" drunk drivers. Thanks to the laws, at certain hours, there's more drunks than sobers on the road.That's not crime prevention, that's criminalization by proxy.

You know where DUI isn't a big problem? Tokyo. Public drinking is legal, it goes 24 hours, and there's enough light rail, bus, and taxi goodness that you can get fall down drunk and still make it home without even owning a car. Plenty of crash space oriented business, as well. Europe is like this too. In the Netherlands, drunk cycling is encouraged. It's safer than operating cars. If DUI was such a big problem, We could easily regulate it out of existence with a few simple rules changes, easing up on alternative, and an investment in public transport. Harm reduction, works every time.


But America's legal system imprisons Justice in stone and plants her outside with a blindfold and her back to the proceedings. That's your first clue something is dreadfully wrong with it. When an armed robbery with no shots fired, no deaths or injuries, nets a mandatory MINIMUM sentence that is less than that of first degree murder. That's just insanity.


Then go live in Tokyo, jackass... Oh wait, you already do. America must have seriously wounded you, that you still complain about it even after having left its shores. The way that you whine about it, you make it sound like "they" designed the country just to make it hard for you to get drunk. What are you, twelve years old?
 
2014-04-06 03:07:33 AM  

doglover: Abacus9: Armed robbery is a serious crime.

And slavery is a serious punishment. But, as the judge said "Each of you showed great potential," he said. "You had the benefit of youth, which will be squandered behind bars."

That's what's wrong with the US legal system. We make criminals out of everyone, stuff 'em in with sardines, and to what end? It just overloads the system so that when guys like this crop up we can only stick them in a hole and let them rot. We're squandering our own people.

We could easily utilize these guys to help society instead of lining the pockets of a for-profit prison system if we had enough free prison resources.

You know who else was an armed bank robber who never shot anyone, if you'll believe him: Ice T.



Don't know how much of that confession on air was an act, but he did confess to doing some robberies after the military and he's pretty much the opposite of a drain on society. And every veteran of every war ever fought was a violent criminal during their time on the battlefield. Somehow, most of them turn out alright, too.

The whole point of crime and punishment is to prevent future crimes by rehabilitation or removal. 32 years in jail is neither and I can't justify the death penalty for someone who didn't kill anyone or order others to kill for them.


You originally suggested that prison is slavery. So it's that or death, unless you're suggesting they walk free.

I don't give a flying fark about a washed up rapper on a third rate show on a fifth rate network out of four.

I like you, but you should stop talking out of you're ass. No offense.
 
2014-04-06 04:13:55 AM  

doglover: But America's legal system imprisons Justice in stone and plants her outside with a blindfold and her back to the proceedings. That's your first clue something is dreadfully wrong with it. When an armed robbery with no shots fired, no deaths or injuries, nets a mandatory MINIMUM sentence that is less than that of first degree murder. That's just insanity.


OK, well, to put a cap on your ire, part of the issue here, I've found, after a bit of research, is that one reason for the harsh sentence is that these guys were tried in FEDERAL court, not state court. The Feds have different mandatory minimums for crimes than state courts do; so comparing a standard murderer's sentence (20 years) to what these douchebags got (30) is comparing apples to oranges in this instance.

Second, one of the guys, Monsalvatge, isn't on his first time around. He committed at least one other armed robbery in 2010, so this isn't his first time at the dock. Repeat offenders are always looking at harder time than first-timers, because they had their chance to be idiots and blew it. Also, Monsalvatge was no kid with a future and a chance of redemption. He's 37 and on his Facebook and LinkedIn page touts himself as some kind of professional.

Third, this wasn't a quick stick-up at the 7-11. These robbers arguably committed a "terroristic act" by taking a picture of the check-casher's house and showing it to her during the robbery. That indicates a degree of planning and an intent to follow through that's normally not seen in your typical convenience store heist. So does the purchase of $3000 full-face masks and disguising themselves as cops during the robbery.

Fourth, the dollar amount was pretty substantial. On the sentencing grid, after "threats uttered" and "weapons used" one of the key factors is "money taken." A $200 robbery isn't going to garner the kind of sentence that a $200,000 robbery is.

There are times and places to be outraged at excessively harsh sentences; but I'm not really sure this one is it.
 
2014-04-06 04:14:10 AM  

yukichigai: As far as I'm concerned, if you're going to spend more than $500 on a single piece of clothing it had better protect you from bullets, let you climb walls, be made of something REALLY exotic, or do something naughty to those "special" areas.


That's why I was willing to spend so lavishly on my velvet lined titanium posing pouch with built in grappling hook.
 
2014-04-06 04:59:30 AM  
Yeah, they're crazy armed robbers. Give 'em a scythe, let 'em cut grass for $10 an hour.

200,000+damages/10. Probably the same sentence.

But, the grass will be cut along I-79.
 
2014-04-06 05:21:36 AM  

doglover: Yeah, they're crazy armed robbers. Give 'em a scythe, let 'em cut grass for $10 an hour.

200,000+damages/10. Probably the same sentence.

But, the grass will be cut along I-79.


Actually, that would be less than a 10 yr sentence.
 
2014-04-06 05:22:40 AM  
mandatory minimum sentence of 32 years

the fark?

outrageous robbery of a Queens check-cashing store

they robbed a bank like store. Hang 'em high.

Meanwhile, in my country, someone who evaded taxes in excess of 30 million Euros gets ~3 years behind bars.
 
2014-04-06 07:56:20 AM  
I wonder what the sentence would have been were they white pretending to be black.
 
2014-04-06 08:04:28 AM  

Pichu0102: 32 years in prison over a robbery with no casualties? This tough on crime bullshiat has to stop.


Small wonder the US has so many in prison. In most countries first degree murder wouldn't even get you that.
 
2014-04-06 08:12:26 AM  

Abacus9: So, you're telling us you're an asshole on many levels?


Abacus9: Don't be so dramatic.


Abacus9: They don't deserve to live, and I thought you understood that.


Abacus9: you should stop talking out of you're ass


Dude, what the fark?  Can you post anything that's not hostile?
 
2014-04-06 08:43:57 AM  

Abacus9: Armed robbery is a serious crime. The fact that the perp didn't actually pull the trigger means nothing. They were still willing to waste someone, a human, over a few bucks. They don't deserve to live, and I thought you understood that.


You're a fool.
 
2014-04-06 08:46:33 AM  

proteus_b: Then go live in Tokyo, jackass... Oh wait, you already do. America must have seriously wounded you, that you still complain about it even after having left its shores. The way that you whine about it, you make it sound like "they" designed the country just to make it hard for you to get drunk. What are you, twelve years old?


You go with the "love it or leave it" response then ask HIM if he's twelve?

I love me some FARK sometimes...
 
2014-04-06 09:20:24 AM  

laid back w/bud light: doglover: Yeah, they're crazy armed robbers. Give 'em a scythe, let 'em cut grass for $10 an hour.

200,000+damages/10. Probably the same sentence.

But, the grass will be cut along I-79.

Actually, that would be less than a 10 yr sentence.


Damages could be in the millions.

Show me my own home and threaten it. If I can, I'll sue you down to the marrow, and more!
 
2014-04-06 09:23:15 AM  

doglover: Abacus9: Stone Meadow: doglover: mandatory minimum sentence of 32 years.

[www.themonolith.com image 292x302]

Yeah...wut?! Let's see...simple armed robbery with no one getting hurt gets a  MINIMUM sentence of 32 years? Fark me, New York, this bullshiat is why you can't have nice things.

From another article: "A recent report found the city's annual cost per inmate was $167,731 in 2012."

So lessee, in today dollars $167,731 x 3 guys x 32 years = $16,102,176. That's SIXTEEN MILLION DOLLARS. The city is going to spend more than twice what these guys stole the very first year of their incarceration. And then they're going to keep doing it for 30+ more years. Good luck with that.

Are you actually white knighting armed robbery?

There are punishments other than jail. Jail time is the stupidest idea anyone's ever come up with. It does nothing but destroy people. 32 years in jail minimum? That's worse than the punishment reserved for high treason. All it will do is destroy them, and if they even survive they will continue to be a burden to society because they'll be too old to work, too unemployable to get jobs even if they weren't felons, and they'll probably wind up robbing another bank just to go back to jail where there's food and blankets.

They've successfully stolen a few million more dollars from us all and we've reinforced their particular chapter of the 415 KUMI by giving them two more potential thugs. 32 years is a life sentence and if you're in for what's gonna be life, why not add another lifetime on top of that and kill some Aryan Brotherhood leader with your toothbrush shiv in exchange for some butt smuggled drugs or a few hundred in your commissary account? It's the kind of thing that happens in prisons.

Meanwhile, if we just had them to do menial labor for low pay till the money they stole was repaid and take them on a tour of local high schools in chains to explain to the kids that if you want to rob a bank, you have to work your way up to manager first or this will be your fate we'd wind up doing basically the same exact sentence but, and this is really the crux of the issue, it would be morally acceptable. We'd be training them for life in the real world by giving them at least a decade of vocational experience. We could even teach them some of the trades. Give them some books on plumbing. What else do you have to do while in a prison cell but read? We might actually rehabilitate them into productive citizens by the end of such a work program. Always gonna be clogged toilets. Instead of lining a private prison's pockets, they'd be paying taxes and , if they fark up, we could just shoot them dead on the spot. Bingo-bango.

And, with a lighter prisoner load from all the vice laws I would see repealed, prisons would actually have the resources to focus on rehabilitation, reintegration, and elimination as individual prisoners' needs and potential demanded.

But no one elects me king of everything. I'm always a write in.


I hope the current king of everything reads fark.

Even if he did, he couldn't do anything about it short of starting a war for pretext. People accept change when scared, otherwise the attitude is if it ain't broke don't fix it. I know it is indeed broken, but Joe 6 pack might want it to stay a hellhole because he served a few and got out. Or someone would say there are not enough jobs around to let folks out of jail (willfully ignoring your job training portion).

To them, jail is supposed to just lock you away, break you, like an animal, and there are plenty of folks who would gladly do that, let alone get paid to do it! These institutions and ideas are immortal and I'm not sure if anyone can change that.
 
2014-04-06 05:38:26 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: Afterward, the childhood pals set out on a shopping spree from Manhattan to Beverly Hills, buying such luxury items as $1,600 Christian Louboutin shoes and $600 Louis Vuitton belts.

They deserve 30 years just for spending so much money on tacky.


If somebody robs a bank to feed their starving family, pay for their poor but smart daughter to go to college, or pay for the operation their mother needs to save her life, you might feel some sympathy and look to at least reduce the jail sentence.
A$$sholes like this, you start wondering why we don't have hard-labour chain gangs anymore.
 
2014-04-06 10:33:33 PM  

Gunboat: Abacus9: So, you're telling us you're an asshole on many levels?

Abacus9: Don't be so dramatic.

Abacus9: They don't deserve to live, and I thought you understood that.

Abacus9: you should stop talking out of you're ass

Dude, what the fark?  Can you post anything that's not hostile?


1. Racist comments and comments denigrating the mentally ill make my statement correct.
2. Calling someone dramatic isn't hostility.
3. Armed robbery is a very serious crime. I agree our system is too harsh in many cases, but some people just need to be thrown away.
4. Did you miss the part where I mentioned that I like him? He's always good for a spirited debate. I'm really not that hostile, but don't suffer foolish arguments gladly.
 
2014-04-06 10:35:41 PM  

Geoff Peterson: Abacus9: Armed robbery is a serious crime. The fact that the perp didn't actually pull the trigger means nothing. They were still willing to waste someone, a human, over a few bucks. They don't deserve to live, and I thought you understood that.

You're a fool.


In what way? Are you saying violent crime shouldn't be punished?
 
2014-04-07 12:35:04 AM  

Geoff Peterson: You go with the "love it or leave it" response then ask HIM if he's twelve?


It's not really "love it or leave it", it's just "shut up about it". Neither he nor I live in America.
 
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