If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Huffington Post)   On the last episode of Cosmos: A Spacetime Odyssey, Neil deGrasse Tyson obliterated Young-Earth Creationism with one simple fact   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 210
    More: Spiffy, Neil deGrasse, Earth, last episode, Crab Nebula, innovations, universe, Milky Way Galaxy, Answers in Genesis  
•       •       •

11193 clicks; posted to Geek » on 01 Apr 2014 at 5:34 PM (16 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



210 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | » | Last | Show all
 
2014-04-01 02:50:35 PM
doesn't matter. as ken ham said, you could show him all the facts in the world - it would never change his mind.

in other words, his faith is stronger than reality.
 
2014-04-01 02:56:31 PM
Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.
 
2014-04-01 02:57:44 PM
And now the rebuttal from the Young-Earth Creationists: Is not
 
2014-04-01 02:59:07 PM
So rather than correct the weird ideas, I would rather them to know how to think in the first place

If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you.

If you actually make them think, they will hate you.
 
2014-04-01 02:59:55 PM

Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.


That's why He also buried dinosaur bones in the ground.  To test our "faith".
 
2014-04-01 03:01:36 PM
The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.
 
2014-04-01 03:01:42 PM
"Facts have a liberal bias." --Dalai Lama
 
2014-04-01 03:03:37 PM

Sin_City_Superhero: "Facts have a liberal bias." --Dalai Lama


~Rand Paul
 
2014-04-01 03:05:12 PM

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Sin_City_Superhero: "Facts have a liberal bias." --Dalai Lama

~Rand Paul

~Shia Labeouf
 
2014-04-01 03:09:39 PM

Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.


You are assuming his argument was directed at creationists. It wasn't. He knows full well you won't change anyone's mind who makes a conscious effort to resist what they don't want to believe.

There are a lot of scientifically ignorant people out there who genuinely don't know basic scientific facts, but are not religiously dogmatic.

THOSE are the people he intends to reach. People who aren't particularly invested either way, but are susceptible to the disingenuous vile bullshiat that Ken Ham and his ilk are trying to peddle. And I would wager that there are a lot more of them than there are evangelical creationists or scientifically literate people.

If Tyson can show those folks exactly how nonsensical the views on the creationist side of this "debate" is, he just might manage to make a difference in this country's future.
 
2014-04-01 03:16:44 PM
Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.
 
2014-04-01 03:20:15 PM

naughtyrev: Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.


Clearly you're not God. Maybe you're his son? Have you tried making wine out of water?
 
2014-04-01 03:22:01 PM

Sin_City_Superhero: naughtyrev: Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.

Clearly you're not God. Maybe you're his son? Have you tried making wine out of water?


I'll see what I can do tonight.
 
2014-04-01 03:22:09 PM
I didn't like this episode nearly as much as the last.  I guess all the science Halley was in to really blew me away.
 
2014-04-01 03:23:51 PM

FlashHarry: doesn't matter. as ken ham said, you could show him all the facts in the world - it would never change his mind.

in other words, his faith is stronger than reality.


Well, at some point it stops being faith and becomes a full-blown mental illness.
 
2014-04-01 04:14:22 PM

gilgigamesh: Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.

You are assuming his argument was directed at creationists. It wasn't. He knows full well you won't change anyone's mind who makes a conscious effort to resist what they don't want to believe.

There are a lot of scientifically ignorant people out there who genuinely don't know basic scientific facts, but are not religiously dogmatic.

THOSE are the people he intends to reach. People who aren't particularly invested either way, but are susceptible to the disingenuous vile bullshiat that Ken Ham and his ilk are trying to peddle. And I would wager that there are a lot more of them than there are evangelical creationists or scientifically literate people.

If Tyson can show those folks exactly how nonsensical the views on the creationist side of this "debate" is, he just might manage to make a difference in this country's future.


Yeah the argument in that case is: "science is difficult to understand and religion can't prove itself.  Therefore both sides are equally bad.  Do you trust some scientists you don't know?  What if they are lying to you?"
 
2014-04-01 04:32:27 PM

Sin_City_Superhero: naughtyrev: Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.

Clearly you're not God. Maybe you're his son? Have you tried making wine out of water?


I can make piss out of wine. Count?
 
2014-04-01 05:11:54 PM

Marcus Aurelius: Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.

That's why He also buried dinosaur bones in the ground.  To test our "faith".


The speed of light is a liberal plot.
 
2014-04-01 05:20:24 PM

gnosis301: I didn't like this episode nearly as much as the last.  I guess all the science Halley was in to really blew me away.


I think it was the best yet but then I like discussions about light and gravity.  I was hoping he would go into more detail about space-time compression and all that but maybe that is for another episode.  I like that he hinted at a future episode about origins of the universe (pre-BB).  That should be mind-blowing....at least for non-science types.
 
2014-04-01 05:33:26 PM
i was almost hoping he'd record a quick epilogue in light of the recent discovery of "gravity waves" from the big bang.
 
2014-04-01 05:35:58 PM
Simple facts don't always convince simple people.
 
2014-04-01 05:39:21 PM
They don't care.

Kenny boy is more concerned with the movie Noah at the moment than Cosmos.
 
2014-04-01 05:40:46 PM
Episode still sucked. Having destroyed Trek, Brannon Braga now moves on to destroying science....
 
2014-04-01 05:43:00 PM

gilgigamesh: If Tyson can show those folks exactly how nonsensical the views on the creationist side of this "debate" is, he just might manage to make a difference in this country's future.


I said it in the last thread and I'll say it again:  I don't think the show should have gotten involved at all.  They didn't need to dig against creationists to explain that light from distant stars can take billions of years to reach earth.

For one thing, it's petty.  For another, it brings the creationist argument into a show that's supposed to be about the love of science.  And it also gives the show an agenda against one specific group of people who are already claiming to be aggrieved by it.  This is justified ammunition for their argument - the show now has an agenda, and it's not just "for" science, it's also now demonstrably "against" creationists.  It was easy bait and they took it.

Furthermore, they chose to correct one specific group of believers.  They didn't go after all origin stories, or theistic evolution, or other belief systems.  They went after one.  So the next time someone asks "does the new Cosmos hate creationists?" you can honestly answer "yes."  Beyond Seth Macfarlane wanting to be a dick, it served no higher purpose, and it damaged the show in my opinion.

Think of it like this: they could cover the gravitational waves discovery from two weeks ago and use it to explain that it bolsters the argument for a multi-verse, which would make our observable universe common in the grand scheme of things.  They could even go out on a limb and say that rather than divine origin, it seems the universe sprouting into existence is something as mundane as tying your shoes.  If they then follow THAT up with "but humans are stupid so they invented a God to explain it all because they didn't know any better" - is that really necessary?
 
2014-04-01 05:44:30 PM

Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.


This is just the lip of the existential rabbit hole you can tumble down:

"The Devil created Jesus so that he could put those light particles there. Believing in Jesus is exactly what the Devil wants you to do. He made Christianity feel right in your heart to deceive you, just like a piece of chocolate cake tastes great but is actually bad for you."
 
2014-04-01 05:44:42 PM

SnakeLee: gilgigamesh: Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.

You are assuming his argument was directed at creationists. It wasn't. He knows full well you won't change anyone's mind who makes a conscious effort to resist what they don't want to believe.

There are a lot of scientifically ignorant people out there who genuinely don't know basic scientific facts, but are not religiously dogmatic.

THOSE are the people he intends to reach. People who aren't particularly invested either way, but are susceptible to the disingenuous vile bullshiat that Ken Ham and his ilk are trying to peddle. And I would wager that there are a lot more of them than there are evangelical creationists or scientifically literate people.

If Tyson can show those folks exactly how nonsensical the views on the creationist side of this "debate" is, he just might manage to make a difference in this country's future.

Yeah the argument in that case is: "science is difficult to understand and religion can't prove itself.  Therefore both sides are equally bad.  Do you trust some scientists you don't know?  What if they are lying to you?"


Tyson admitted that science makes mistakes, and they get corrected.  See, the scientist who's lying to you will eventually get called out by someone who analyzed the experiment without screwing it up.
 
2014-04-01 05:44:53 PM
Where in the video is it? I'm not watching a 42 minute video with a bunch of commercials.
 
2014-04-01 05:45:36 PM

FatherChaos: SnakeLee: gilgigamesh: Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.

You are assuming his argument was directed at creationists. It wasn't. He knows full well you won't change anyone's mind who makes a conscious effort to resist what they don't want to believe.

There are a lot of scientifically ignorant people out there who genuinely don't know basic scientific facts, but are not religiously dogmatic.

THOSE are the people he intends to reach. People who aren't particularly invested either way, but are susceptible to the disingenuous vile bullshiat that Ken Ham and his ilk are trying to peddle. And I would wager that there are a lot more of them than there are evangelical creationists or scientifically literate people.

If Tyson can show those folks exactly how nonsensical the views on the creationist side of this "debate" is, he just might manage to make a difference in this country's future.

Yeah the argument in that case is: "science is difficult to understand and religion can't prove itself.  Therefore both sides are equally bad.  Do you trust some scientists you don't know?  What if they are lying to you?"

Tyson admitted that science makes mistakes, and they get corrected.  See, the scientist who's lying to you will eventually get called out by someone who analyzed the experiment without screwing it up.


Er, sorry, SCIENTISTS make mistakes.  Science, on the other hand, always works the same way.
 
2014-04-01 05:49:32 PM

Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.


Well, duh. Yahweh is one of those douchey AbercromWIE and Fitch style gods who will only lord over a universe that had a "distressed" look. Who do you think he is, a nerd like Anu who creates a universe that looks like he got it from K-Mart?
 
2014-04-01 05:49:32 PM
He also trolled Gravity on Twitter and boy was that pretty hilarious!
 
2014-04-01 05:51:23 PM

abhorrent1: Where in the video is it? I'm not watching a 42 minute video with a bunch of commercials.


basically he says:

we can see objects in the observable universe that are farther away than 6,500 light years. if the universe were only 6,500 years old,this would be impossible. QED.
 
2014-04-01 05:53:18 PM
that's great and all but he'd do better service to outright define that creationism isn't science because it isn't falsifiable.

give 5-10 examples of falsified hypotheses.
beat it into people's heads.
 
2014-04-01 05:57:23 PM
I heard he also trolled Gravity on Twitter and it was pretty amazing.
 
2014-04-01 05:59:41 PM
OK, two things here...

First: Why would this stop a dedicated YEC? They'd just insist that the science was "wrong", or that "God made it htat way".

Second: FTFA...

Tyson's comments may have been a bit out of character for the celebrated astrophysicist. In a March interview with The Huffington Post, Tyson said he typically doesn't make it his business to correct people's scientific misconceptions.
"As an educator
, I try to get people to be fundamentally curious and to question ideas that they might have or that are shared by others," he told HuffPost Science. "In that state of mind, they have earned a kind of inoculation against the fuzzy thinking of these weird ideas floating around out there. So rather than correct the weird ideas, I would rather them to know how to think in the first place. Then they can correct the weird idea themselves. I don't just tell them no. That's pontifical."


Isn't the pretty much the DEFINITION if an "educator"? You fix people's misconceptions by teaching them the correct facts and methodology?
 
2014-04-01 06:00:10 PM
Magic isn't real?

/dnrtfa
 
2014-04-01 06:01:19 PM
I'm REALLY loving this mini-series.  I was a little worried that he'd try to "be" Carl Sagan, but that worry was without warrant.  He made it his own and it is pretty damned well done.  Yeah, the spaceship thing is a tad cheesy but I can forgive that.
 
2014-04-01 06:01:46 PM

Mikey1969: OK, two things here...

First: Why would this stop a dedicated YEC? They'd just insist that the science was "wrong", or that "God made it htat way".

Second: FTFA...

Tyson's comments may have been a bit out of character for the celebrated astrophysicist. In a March interview with The Huffington Post, Tyson said he typically doesn't make it his business to correct people's scientific misconceptions.
"As an educator, I try to get people to be fundamentally curious and to question ideas that they might have or that are shared by others," he told HuffPost Science. "In that state of mind, they have earned a kind of inoculation against the fuzzy thinking of these weird ideas floating around out there. So rather than correct the weird ideas, I would rather them to know how to think in the first place. Then they can correct the weird idea themselves. I don't just tell them no. That's pontifical."

Isn't the pretty much the DEFINITION if an "educator"? You fix people's misconceptions by teaching them the correct facts and methodology?


Telling someone they are wrong only hardens their heart and mind against you.

Leading them to the answer, so that they are the ones that discover they were mistaken, is the better way.

Educators educate, not indoctrinate.

//Which is why creationist "educators" are anything but.
 
2014-04-01 06:02:03 PM

Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.


See, the problem is that's actually a more intelligent and well thought out rebuttal than you'll get from actual young earthers...

Case in Point:

scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net
 
2014-04-01 06:04:11 PM
Is this about the light thing?  And only being able to observe 6500 ly of space?

*rtfa*

Yep.

Awesome episode, btw.
 
2014-04-01 06:05:21 PM

Sin_City_Superhero: naughtyrev: Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.

Clearly you're not God. Maybe you're his son? Have you tried making wine out of water?


I can make pee out of beer.  Is that miraculous?
 
2014-04-01 06:06:20 PM

Telos: Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.

See, the problem is that's actually a more intelligent and well thought out rebuttal than you'll get from actual young earthers...

Case in Point:

[scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net image 850x729]


...

I think I need more Miracle Making Water..... :(

/re: beer
 
2014-04-01 06:08:48 PM

Delawheredad: The Young Earth creations believe that God made the universe to APPEAR Aged! We can see things beyond the Crab nebula because God placed us in an aged universe!

/Yes that makes no sense. But Mr Cosmos won't change one opinion.


The idea isn't to change opinions but expose children who aren't being taught science to basic scientific concepts etc. If you're an adult and you still think that the Earth formed in a day you're pretty much a lost cause.
 
2014-04-01 06:16:50 PM
The New Cosmos is a really shiatty disappointing show and I'm contemplating removing the series pass from my dvr.

They keep starting a lot of thoughts but the show never gets around to finishing them. Like the Einstein in the Italian countryside light speed thought experiment. They spent money to send NDT out to Italy. He shows a bike and then .... nothing. Move on to talk about black holes.

On the original show, Sagan spent a lot of time using bikes and discussing the "cosmic speed limit" to get into how relativity works, why time dilation, twin paradox, red shifts, etc., and how this leads into determining the size of the universe, and so on.

For the NDT Cosmos, it looks like they filmed an hour show, cut out 20 random minutes, and are broadcasting whatever random parts are left.
 
2014-04-01 06:19:10 PM
I can make wine taste awful. I start with a spoonful of Miracle Whip...
 
2014-04-01 06:21:20 PM

Telos: Quasar: Jesus's Razor suggests that God put the light particles where they were to make it appear that the universe was 14 billion years old, because reasons.

See, the problem is that's actually a more intelligent and well thought out rebuttal than you'll get from actual young earthers...

Case in Point:

[scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net image 850x729]


*twitch*
 
2014-04-01 06:22:10 PM
I'm not religious, but it seems to me like this version is more about attacking Christianity than promoting the sciences. Also, and I was a kid for the original, but is anyone learning much? Seems like most of us pick this up in high school and college.
Cool Show Bro, but I've been disappointed so far.
 
2014-04-01 06:22:57 PM

gilgigamesh: There are a lot of scientifically ignorant people out there who genuinely don't know basic scientific facts, but are not religiously dogmatic.

THOSE are the people he intends to reach. People who aren't particularly invested either way, but are susceptible to the disingenuous vile bullshiat that Ken Ham and his ilk are trying to peddle. And I would wager that there are a lot more of them than there are evangelical creationists or scientifically literate people.


Yep.  How often we forget in today's environment that not all ignorance is willful. Some people just had crappy educations and figuratively don't know anything about this stuff.  If a bunch of people say the universe is X years old then who are they to argue?  Before they had no ammo.  After this episode, some of them might.


Lsherm: I said it in the last thread and I'll say it again: I don't think the show should have gotten involved at all. They didn't need to dig against creationists to explain that light from distant stars can take billions of years to reach earth.

For one thing, it's petty. For another, it brings the creationist argument into a show that's supposed to be about the love of science. And it also gives the show an agenda against one specific group of people who are already claiming to be aggrieved by it. This is justified ammunition for their argument - the show now has an agenda, and it's not just "for" science, it's also now demonstrably "against" creationists. It was easy bait and they took it.


After a point the "respect my beliefs" defense has to stop working.  This is something that is past that point. NDT isn't attacking creationism as much as he is pointing out something which is demonstrably, factually wrong.  He hasn't said God isn't real, he hasn't claimed that there never was a Jesus, or a Buddha, or even the angel Meroni.  The only thing he's said is that the universe is older than a relatively small number that is trivially easy to disprove.

It's not like this is something he can tip-toe around.  A bulk of the show involves talking about how old the universe is.
 
2014-04-01 06:23:19 PM

SnakeLee: Yeah the argument in that case is: "science is difficult to understand and religion can't prove itself.  Therefore both sides are equally bad.  Do you trust some scientists you don't know?  What if they are lying to you?"


What does a scientist get by lying to you?

What does a religious leader get by lying to you?
 
2014-04-01 06:28:19 PM

WippitGuud: SnakeLee: Yeah the argument in that case is: "science is difficult to understand and religion can't prove itself.  Therefore both sides are equally bad.  Do you trust some scientists you don't know?  What if they are lying to you?"

What does a scientist get by lying to you?

What does a religious leader get by lying to you?


Yeah, but Religious Guy gives you a thimble o' grape juice and a cracker!  Beat THAT, Science Guy!
 
2014-04-01 06:29:13 PM

xanadian: Sin_City_Superhero: naughtyrev: Oh, sure, god can make the universe appear to be a certain age, but I have to wait for my beer to ferment.

Clearly you're not God. Maybe you're his son? Have you tried making wine out of water?

I can make pee out of beer.  Is that miraculous?


Some people even figured out how to make beer out of pee

i.imgur.com
 
Displayed 50 of 210 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report