Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(NBC News)   Reminder: Today is your last day of open enrollment and you must sign up for Obamacare now. The Obamacare web site has been helpfully rendered inoperable for your convenience   (nbcnews.com) divider line 611
    More: Fail, obamacare  
•       •       •

3769 clicks; posted to Main » on 31 Mar 2014 at 11:27 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



611 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread
 
2014-03-31 09:27:20 AM  
Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?
 
2014-03-31 09:36:46 AM  
Too bad healthcare.gov is back up now. Makes the overnight outage seem more like a bit of scheduled maintenance before the last day of signups than anything else.

/who really wanted to work on their application at 3:30am anyway?
 
2014-03-31 09:41:29 AM  
Um, it works perfectly fine.
 
2014-03-31 09:46:34 AM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


So screw over the people for which the penalty was the deciding factor in getting insurance?

When you have the choice of farking with one group of people or another, err on the side of the law.
 
2014-03-31 09:49:28 AM  
FTFA:  An administration spokesman said the website is usually offline for maintenance overnight, and was brought down for four extra hours by a technical glitch

Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...

*facepalm*

/of course, there's something to be said for not procrastinating, but still
 
2014-03-31 09:50:05 AM  
You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).
 
2014-03-31 09:52:13 AM  

xanadian: Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...


Or you could...you know....call an insurance agent today in the town where you live. Like people have been doing for years.
 
2014-03-31 09:55:39 AM  
So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?
 
2014-03-31 09:57:12 AM  

DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes


HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER!!!
 
2014-03-31 09:57:29 AM  

DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?


it's a deliberate tax grab attempt by 0bummer to steal my hard earned money!
 
2014-03-31 09:59:04 AM  

xanadian: FTFA:  An administration spokesman said the website is usually offline for maintenance overnight, and was brought down for four extra hours by a technical glitch


Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...

*facepalm*

/of course, there's something to be said for not procrastinating, but still


Once again, I ask who the hell was actually awake and desperate to work on their health insurance application at 3:30am? I can understand being desperate to work on it today at some point, but in the wee hours of the morning?
 
2014-03-31 10:00:51 AM  
And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!
 
2014-03-31 10:01:25 AM  

DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?


Obama lied.  He will always betray you.  The Obamacare implosion continues.

/amidoingitirght
 
2014-03-31 10:04:39 AM  

mrshowrules: DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?

Obama lied.  He will always betray you.  The Obamacare implosion continues.

/amidoingitirght


Obamacare raped my mother while pouring sugar into my gas tank.
 
2014-03-31 10:05:47 AM  

R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!


I doubt there is one adult in this country that has never broken ANY law.  even mundane or obscure shiat.
 
2014-03-31 10:07:12 AM  
obamacare isn't a service you can sign up for, I hope this helps
 
2014-03-31 10:08:51 AM  

ManateeGag: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

I doubt there is one adult in this country that has never broken ANY law.  even mundane or obscure shiat.


That makes it ok.
 
2014-03-31 10:10:01 AM  

Jackson Herring: obamacare isn't a service you can sign up for, I hope this helps


I'm pretty sure Obamacare is something you register for that allows treatment to be determined by Nancy Pelosi and delivered by Acorn health providers.
 
2014-03-31 10:13:29 AM  

R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!


Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.
 
2014-03-31 10:15:24 AM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


Tell Obama that.
 
2014-03-31 10:15:51 AM  
So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?
 
2014-03-31 10:17:21 AM  

R.A.Danny: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Tell Obama that.


Your thing doesn't contradict his thing.
 
2014-03-31 10:17:51 AM  

R.A.Danny: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Tell Obama that.


Obama is in charge of the Kaiser Family Foundation now? Shiat, next you'll tell me that he was the guy who oversalted my french fries last night!
 
2014-03-31 10:19:55 AM  

R.A.Danny: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Tell Obama that.


Not real clear on the whole "no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay" thing are we?
 
2014-03-31 10:22:49 AM  
This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?
 
2014-03-31 10:22:56 AM  

Serious Black: Once again, I ask who the hell was actually awake and desperate to work on their health insurance application at 3:30am? I can understand being desperate to work on it today at some point, but in the wee hours of the morning?


To be fair, people with horrific hours at horrific jobs with no insurance could be doing that.

Also, Americans traveling abroad in Zanzibar.
 
2014-03-31 10:24:37 AM  

R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?


Except for nobody said that.
 
2014-03-31 10:25:14 AM  

R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?


www.biopoliticaltimes.org

You explicitly said, and I quote: "And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!" Now you are saying they will be subjected to a tax, fine, or other penalty. There is a Grand Canyon-sized chasm between those two things. Stop moving the Goddamn goalposts and admit you were wrong.
 
2014-03-31 10:26:18 AM  
So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.
 
2014-03-31 10:26:26 AM  

R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?


From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.
 
2014-03-31 10:29:18 AM  

James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.


That's my point. Why is there an enumerated penalty if there's no "legal" way to collect?
 
2014-03-31 10:34:00 AM  

R.A.Danny: James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.

That's my point. Why is there an enumerated penalty if there's no "legal" way to collect?


There is a legal way to collect. It's for them to "to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns."

As noted in the link YOU provided and I just quoted back to you.
 
2014-03-31 10:34:11 AM  

R.A.Danny: James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.

That's my point. Why is there an enumerated penalty if there's no "legal" way to collect?


Likely because the drafters of that provision knew people who irrationally hate Obama and the Democrats were trying to declare everyone in the country criminals. What they forgot is that people like you would make that argument regardless of knowing whether it is true or false because it fits seamlessly into a pre-existing narrative about how Obama is a megalomaniacal dictator hellbent on remaking America in his image.
 
2014-03-31 10:47:17 AM  
Signed up my mother-in-law a few weeks ago.  It was surprisingly cheap and painless.

I assume this makes me worse than Hitler.
 
2014-03-31 10:49:14 AM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


Doesn't mean they won't get charged with something else, or that they IRS won't dun them, or that in a year or two the law will be changed so that they can be prosecuted/liened/levied.

Plus, I see some practical difficulties.

If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.

Really, the *ONLY* way I can see people not getting in legal trouble here is if they file a return where they owe money, and they don't send the portion of what they owe which they honestly calculate is their penalty for not having insurance.  Say the total they owe is $300 and the penalty is $95, and they send a check for $205, that sort of thing.

Which will be a small percentage.  Everyone else who breaks even or is due a refund would have to lie on their tax forms in order to not pay the penalty, and I'm willing to bet that's prosecutable.

Of course, they could also say "Hey, we subtracted out the penalty first, so you've only paid $110 of the $205 in taxes you owe", that sort of thing.  And they'd be completely honest that they aren't prosecuting or levying or placing a lien because you didn't pay the penalty.
 
2014-03-31 10:52:01 AM  
And now we see the republican ignore the actual law and skip off into the land hypothetical doom.
 
2014-03-31 10:53:55 AM  

R.A.Danny: ManateeGag: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

I doubt there is one adult in this country that has never broken ANY law.  even mundane or obscure shiat.

That makes it ok.


no, but don't act like we are suddenly make hundreds of thousands of people into criminals where they were innocent little lambs before.
 
2014-03-31 10:53:57 AM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.
 
2014-03-31 10:54:18 AM  
Pfft...just don't file your taxes and make sure to claim plenty of deductions on your W-4.
 
2014-03-31 10:57:09 AM  

dittybopper: If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.


You mean to tell me that the Federal government might take a dim view of cheating on one's taxes? Fetch me my laudanum! I have with the vapours!
 
2014-03-31 10:57:48 AM  

Somacandra: dittybopper: If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.

You mean to tell me that the Federal government might take a dim view of cheating on one's taxes? Fetch me my laudanum! I have with the vapours!


Seeing how little I earned last year, I think my return will be called frivolous anyway.
 
2014-03-31 10:59:03 AM  

Chris Ween: f I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others


Agreed. While we're at it, We should get rid of all fire departments because fires still happen. The best way to solve a problem is by ignoring it.
 
2014-03-31 11:02:34 AM  

Somacandra: Chris Ween: f I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others

Agreed. While we're at it, We should get rid of all fire departments because fires still happen. The best way to solve a problem is by ignoring it.


Government option or single payer.  The ACA is needlessly complicated and solves one problem while creating 10.

But, as I said, don't hurt yourself patting your back.  Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.  So, this isn't even 7 million of the 30 million uninsured.  I think we will see that the ACA made some things more affordable, many things more complicated, and fixed very little in terms of obtaining coverage for the uninsured.
 
2014-03-31 11:04:55 AM  

Chris Ween: Government option


You know, they tried to include that.  Those folks you vote for decided it was a back door to single payer and blocked it.
 
2014-03-31 11:05:52 AM  

Chris Ween: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.


So the problem is that is only reducing the uninsured?  Not clear on what your point is.

Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to.  Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

Finally, every single American benefits from the consumer protections in Obamacare, not to mention the fringe economic benefits of having your health care security detached from your employer, not to mention the likely reduction in medical bankruptcies going forward.

To say there are still many uninsured is short sighted.  Also, moving the goal post because the actual GOP guarantee was actually that Obamacare was going to destroy the country and cause 1,000 years of darkness
 
2014-03-31 11:06:38 AM  

James!: Chris Ween: Government option

You know, they tried to include that.  Those folks you vote for decided it was a back door to single payer and blocked it.


Doesn't change that I wanted it, and it was the best option.

I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.  But I still support Michigan.
 
2014-03-31 11:06:54 AM  

Serious Black: Obama is in charge of the Kaiser Family Foundation now?


Of course. Hitler inherited the remnants of Kaiser Wilhelm's government, and as we all know ChairMAO Balrog Insane B-Rock "The Islamic Shock" Hussein SuperAllah Hussein FartBama Al-Chicago Hussein is History's Greatest MonsterTM so of course he would have already seized the assets of the Third Reich along the way towards establishing the 666 Reich. See, its these things about the Kaiser Family Foundation that no one tells you.
 
2014-03-31 11:07:15 AM  

Somacandra: dittybopper: If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.

You mean to tell me that the Federal government might take a dim view of cheating on one's taxes? Fetch me my laudanum! I have with the vapours!


I was pointing out that the whole "We won't prosecute" thing only applies to a small percentage of the possible cases.

So it's not *QUITE* a lie, but it's not wholly truthful either.
 
2014-03-31 11:08:10 AM  

Chris Ween: James!: Chris Ween: Government option

You know, they tried to include that.  Those folks you vote for decided it was a back door to single payer and blocked it.

Doesn't change that I wanted it, and it was the best option.

I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.  But I still support Michigan.


I don't follow hockey.
 
2014-03-31 11:08:46 AM  

Chris Ween: Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.


That would indeed be interesting if it were true. Especially since those with employer-sponsored coverage (like me) are not eligible for any exchange subsidies.
 
2014-03-31 11:09:05 AM  

dittybopper: Somacandra: dittybopper: If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.

You mean to tell me that the Federal government might take a dim view of cheating on one's taxes? Fetch me my laudanum! I have with the vapours!

I was pointing out that the whole "We won't prosecute" thing only applies to a small percentage of the possible cases.

So it's not *QUITE* a lie, but it's not wholly truthful either.


It only applies to cases where you don't break a different law.  Great analysis there.
 
2014-03-31 11:09:50 AM  

Chris Ween: I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.


Wow. Poking the Modmins in the eye today? Have a good one :-)
 
2014-03-31 11:12:09 AM  

Somacandra: Chris Ween: I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.

Wow. Poking the Modmins in the eye today? Have a good one :-)


Yeah, Ween. You better watch your ass.
 
2014-03-31 11:12:32 AM  

dittybopper: Somacandra: dittybopper: If you just ignore section of your tax return on the insurance part, or lie and say you have insurance when you don't actually have it, they'll prosecute you for filing a frivolous return.

You mean to tell me that the Federal government might take a dim view of cheating on one's taxes? Fetch me my laudanum! I have with the vapours!

I was pointing out that the whole "We won't prosecute" thing only applies to a small percentage of the possible cases.

So it's not *QUITE* a lie, but it's not wholly truthful either.


Yes, but they won't be prosecuted for not paying the fine in that scenario you described. They'll be prosecuted for a tax issue that is, at the absolute most, tangentially related to them not paying the fine.
 
2014-03-31 11:12:57 AM  

mrshowrules: for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.


Yep. I'm one of them. $3000/mo premiums (pre-ACA) were a little steep. $275/mo (now) I can handle though.

/Self-employed
//Pre-existing conditions
 
2014-03-31 11:14:13 AM  

Somacandra: Chris Ween: Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.

That would indeed be interesting if it were true. Especially since those with employer-sponsored coverage (like me) are not eligible for any exchange subsidies.


Some people find it cheaper through the exchange even with the subsidies.  Hard to believe I know.

Somacandra: Chris Ween: I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.

Wow. Poking the Modmins in the eye today? Have a good one :-)


Heh.  Not to threadjack, but I was amazed at how well Kentucky played.  They will be good for this year and next, then all their Freshman will be in the NBA.
 
2014-03-31 11:15:18 AM  

Somacandra: Serious Black: Obama is in charge of the Kaiser Family Foundation now?

Of course. Hitler inherited the remnants of Kaiser Wilhelm's government, and as we all know ChairMAO Balrog Insane B-Rock "The Islamic Shock" Hussein SuperAllah Hussein FartBama Al-Chicago Hussein is History's Greatest MonsterTM so of course he would have already seized the assets of the Third Reich along the way towards establishing the 666 Reich. See, its these things about the Kaiser Family Foundation that no one tells you.


Kaiser Wilhelm!?  He's the most evil German of all time.
 
2014-03-31 11:17:22 AM  
Yeah, maybe don't wait until the last minute to try and use a web site that has had a history of load problems.
 
2014-03-31 11:24:11 AM  

James!: Somacandra: Chris Ween: I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.

Wow. Poking the Modmins in the eye today? Have a good one :-)

Yeah, Ween. You better watch your ass.


Heh.  I'm afraid all the Modmins know and dislike me already.
 
2014-03-31 11:32:16 AM  

James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?


Because it's "The Republicans" which are the problem.
 
2014-03-31 11:32:34 AM  

mrshowrules: So screw over the people for which the penalty was the deciding factor in getting insurance?


In an election year, absolutely.
 
2014-03-31 11:33:05 AM  

GWSuperfan: mrshowrules: for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Yep. I'm one of them. $3000/mo premiums (pre-ACA) were a little steep. $275/mo (now) I can handle though.

/Self-employed
//Pre-existing conditions


What is the GOP counter anecdote to something like this.  What is the rabid chupacabra to this rainbow unicorn?
 
2014-03-31 11:33:29 AM  
I heard I just have to say I tried and I get an extension.

I do not like it.
 
2014-03-31 11:34:01 AM  

Tom_Slick: mrshowrules: So screw over the people for which the penalty was the deciding factor in getting insurance?

In an election year, absolutely.


but every 2nd year in an election year...
 
2014-03-31 11:34:14 AM  
Well, considering open enrollment just started yesterday and the website is the only way you can sign up, this is an outrage.
 
2014-03-31 11:35:33 AM  

vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.


Do tell.
 
2014-03-31 11:35:41 AM  

Chris Ween: James!: Somacandra: Chris Ween: I didn't want Kentucky to be allowed to shoot that three yesterday with 2.3 seconds left either.

Wow. Poking the Modmins in the eye today? Have a good one :-)

Yeah, Ween. You better watch your ass.

Heh.  I'm afraid all the Modmins know and dislike me already.


You too?  Let's grab a beer and eat sushi off a hooker's belly
 
2014-03-31 11:36:11 AM  

Rincewind53: Um, it works perfectly fine.


WRONG!  The healthcare.gov website HAS NEVER WORKED, and WILL NEVER WORK.  Anyone who thinks it works has been hypnotized by the Soros Mind-Control Ray.
 
2014-03-31 11:36:17 AM  
 
2014-03-31 11:36:28 AM  

R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!


You think paying an excise tax makes you a "criminal"? So buying gas or tobacco makes one a "criminal"?
 
2014-03-31 11:36:43 AM  
Lined up to get enrolled at the Alamodome.

pbs.twimg.com
 
2014-03-31 11:37:22 AM  
Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....
 
2014-03-31 11:37:41 AM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Tell Obama that.

Obama is in charge of the Kaiser Family Foundation now? Shiat, next you'll tell me that he was the guy who oversalted my french fries last night!


You shouldn't be eating salty fried food.
 
2014-03-31 11:37:51 AM  

vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.


is this not a good thing?
 
2014-03-31 11:37:57 AM  

MemeSlave: James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?

Because it's "The Republicans" which are the problem.


Yes.
 
2014-03-31 11:38:16 AM  
If the government can't work flawlessly, it shouldn't waste our money trying.
 
2014-03-31 11:38:32 AM  
We should petition President Romney to put a stop to this!
 
2014-03-31 11:38:34 AM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


What about people that need insurance in case they get sick or injured?
 
2014-03-31 11:39:06 AM  
Did the Home For Right-wing Retards let the crew out early today?  This thread literally stinks of conservative desperation.
 
2014-03-31 11:39:08 AM  

dittybopper: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


Doesn't mean they won't get charged with something else, or that they IRS won't dun them, or that in a year or two the law will be changed so that they can be prosecuted/liened/levied.


How the fark is this an argument!?!?

"It's not true.  But it could be true in the future if they change it!"

Wtf is this shiat?  Seriously.  What the fark is this shiat.
 
2014-03-31 11:39:08 AM  

Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).


I'm really surprised no one has created a product at one of these insurance companies called "Obamacare", just so they can have a talking point "See, you can indeed sign up for Obamacare!"

Of course, the insurance companies like the extra customers, even if they don't like the 80/20 rule.
 
2014-03-31 11:39:15 AM  

mrshowrules: If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.

So the problem is that is only reducing the uninsured?  Not clear on what your point is.

Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to.  Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

Finally, every single American benefits from the consumer protections in Obamacare, not to mention the fringe economic benefits of having your health care security detached from your employer, not to mention the likely reduction in medical bankruptcies going forward.

To say there are still many uninsured is short sighted.  Also, moving the goal post because the actual GOP guarantee was actually that Obamacare was going to destroy the country and cause 1,000 years of darkness


I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick).

Also...it's complicated. TOO complicated.

Make it cheap, make it easy, and you incentivize people to buy in. Right now, it's pricey, it's complicated, and there's no real penalty for ducking...so they will. I'd bet $5 on it.
 
2014-03-31 11:39:23 AM  
I successfully enrolled in a silver Blue Cross plan via the ACA sight last Thursday. The site was fine, but I've yet to receive any type  of confirmation or payment instructions. A littleoff-putting  but I'm figuring they're being bombarded right now. Nonetheless, the Blue Cross has made me a criminal! Don't they want my money?
 
2014-03-31 11:40:04 AM  
OBAMACARE DEATH PANELS ARE REAL!!
s3.amazonaws.com
 
2014-03-31 11:40:34 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


It's still insurance.
 
2014-03-31 11:40:52 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


It's to discourage people from not buying any insurance until they get sick, get treated and cancel. That kinda defeats the whole model of for profit insurance.
 
2014-03-31 11:40:59 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


Qualifying life events like the birth of a child or a major job change entitle you to a special enrollment period where you can change your insurance.
 
2014-03-31 11:41:38 AM  

mrshowrules: Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to. Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.


o/
 
2014-03-31 11:41:44 AM  

Chris Ween: If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance. How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others? Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange. Maybe there weren't 30 million in need. Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.


Keep in mind, 7 million is the number of policies.  A policy can cover more than one person.  Also a lot are being covered by the expansion of Medicaid.

And, of course, some of those seven million are just people who switched policies and were already previously covered.
 
2014-03-31 11:42:41 AM  

MemeSlave: James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?

Because it's "The Republicans" which are the problem.


Anyone who stands in the way of the greatest assemblage of political minds in the history of the world is a scourge upon this nation.
 
2014-03-31 11:42:44 AM  
How about just nationalize it instead of pushing legislation allowing the insurance companies to profit?
 
2014-03-31 11:43:05 AM  

whistleridge: I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick).

Also...it's complicated. TOO complicated.

Make it cheap, make it easy, and you incentivize people to buy in. Right now, it's pricey, it's complicated, and there's no real penalty for ducking...so they will. I'd bet $5 on it.


Well the GOP killed the public option.  Anyways, Obamacare had a bumpy start and is doing exactly what it is supposed to.  It is fixing the biggest problems with previous system and is making health care insurance more affordable.
 
2014-03-31 11:43:33 AM  

Chris Ween: Some people find it cheaper through the exchange even with the subsidies. Hard to believe I know.


PARTY UF PERSINUL REPONSIBALITEE!!
 
2014-03-31 11:43:37 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


Thats how insursnce companies work. Theyve always had open enrollment periods even when getting healthcare through a job.

Have you never dealt with this before?
 
2014-03-31 11:43:39 AM  

Chris Ween: Somacandra: Chris Ween: f I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others

Agreed. While we're at it, We should get rid of all fire departments because fires still happen. The best way to solve a problem is by ignoring it.

Government option or single payer.  The ACA is needlessly complicated and solves one problem while creating 10.

But, as I said, don't hurt yourself patting your back.  Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.  So, this isn't even 7 million of the 30 million uninsured.  I think we will see that the ACA made some things more affordable, many things more complicated, and fixed very little in terms of obtaining coverage for the uninsured.


actually it has been estimated that 9.5 million new ppl have insurance that didn't previously.

75% of the ppl who signed up in the state of Kentucky alone previously had no insurance.


http://touch.latimes.com/#story/la-na-obamacare-uninsured-national-2 01 40331/
 
2014-03-31 11:43:56 AM  

Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?


A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.
 
2014-03-31 11:44:20 AM  
If you even have to visit healthcare.gov instead of a state exchange website, you have nobody to blame but your obstructionist state legislature.  They are the ones f*cking you over.
 
2014-03-31 11:44:30 AM  

Superjew: Did the Home For Right-wing Retards let the crew out early today?  This thread literally stinks of conservative desperation.


The desperation you smell is every Democrat senator trying to distance themselves from Obamacare
 
2014-03-31 11:44:59 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


You can still sign up, but I think you might get a prorated penalty if you wait.
 
2014-03-31 11:45:02 AM  

mrshowrules: Tom_Slick: mrshowrules: So screw over the people for which the penalty was the deciding factor in getting insurance?

In an election year, absolutely.

but every 2nd year in an election year...


Here is what is going to happen, the Administration is going to "Look into issues that may have prevented people from signing up" this will begin sometime in May, around September, they will look at polling numbers to see if it is effecting the House and Senate races.  If it has a negative effect they will roll the fine back for a year.
 
2014-03-31 11:45:07 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....

If you can enroll at any time you want there would be no reason for you to enroll before you got sick/injured.  But there are exceptions..............if you get married, divorced, have a kid, gain or lose access to other insurance you can enroll or unenroll in coverage within 30 days of the event.

 
2014-03-31 11:46:17 AM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


Because this phase gave you total confidence in the government's ability to not screw up single payer just as badly?
 
2014-03-31 11:46:39 AM  

Dafatone: Wtf is this shiat?


utterly predictable and in no way surprising is what it is
 
2014-03-31 11:46:49 AM  

whistleridge: mrshowrules: If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.

So the problem is that is only reducing the uninsured?  Not clear on what your point is.

Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to.  Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

Finally, every single American benefits from the consumer protections in Obamacare, not to mention the fringe economic benefits of having your health care security detached from your employer, not to mention the likely reduction in medical bankruptcies going forward.

To say there are still many uninsured is short sighted.  Also, moving the goal post because the actual GOP guarantee was actually that Obamacare was going to destroy the country and cause 1,000 years of darkness

I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick).

Also...it's complicated. TOO complicated.

Make it cheap, make it easy, and you incentivize people to buy in. Right now, it's pricey, it's complicated, and there's no real penalty for ducking...so they will. I'd bet $5 on it.


Isnt there an excemption if its 8% or more of your income?
 
2014-03-31 11:47:34 AM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.


Right, because it was presented as "legit commentary from 100% of the country".
 
2014-03-31 11:47:36 AM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.


If you had bothered to click the provided link, you would see that those are the top rated comments for his page.
But if a conspiracy is much easier for your simple mind to comprehend then that people actually like the law, go let your freak flag fly.
 
2014-03-31 11:47:42 AM  

Serious Black: Too bad healthcare.gov is back up now. Makes the overnight outage seem more like a bit of scheduled maintenance before the last day of signups than anything else.

/who really wanted to work on their application at 3:30am anyway?


Rincewind53: Um, it works perfectly fine.


Maybe we have "special" internet.
 
2014-03-31 11:47:54 AM  
Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.
 
2014-03-31 11:48:05 AM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


The real problem is that there actually is a Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986.  Can we simplify the damned thing, eliminate all the loopholes (which only the rich have enough tax liability to use), reduce the percentage of our national productivity consumed by tax tracking and preparation, and reduce the necessity of armies of IRS workers?

Will Rogers posited that "The income tax has made more liars out of the American people than golf has."
 
2014-03-31 11:48:54 AM  

vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.


And probably 75% of those people don't realize they have the ACA to thank for that.
 
2014-03-31 11:49:00 AM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.


Moonbats with insurance
 
2014-03-31 11:49:26 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


There is an enrollment period because you shouldn't be able to wait to sign up right until you need it to cover something. If you break your leg you can't crawl back into the house and buy a plan.

If you lose your job, move out of state, get married, get divorced, or have a kid, it triggers another enrollment period during which you can enroll.
 
2014-03-31 11:49:30 AM  
Wait until the employer mandate kicks in, almost everyone who works for a living will only be able to afford a $5000 deductible plan. That's a tax folks, the largest in the history of our country.
 
2014-03-31 11:49:43 AM  

Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?


Ted, don't bring the Internet a stick to beat you with.
 
2014-03-31 11:49:45 AM  
Isnt there an excemption if its 8% or more of your income?

I'm not sure what the exact % is, but you are correct in saying their is a cap.  If the cost of coverage goes above that cap you are not required to buy it.

/ Thanks, Obama
 
2014-03-31 11:49:53 AM  

coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.


Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.
 
2014-03-31 11:50:54 AM  

ManateeGag: mrshowrules: DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?

Obama lied.  He will always betray you.  The Obamacare implosion continues.

/amidoingitirght

Obamacare raped my mother while pouring sugar into my gas tank.


Why was your mother putting sugar into your gas tank?
 
2014-03-31 11:52:09 AM  

R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?


Apparently everyone who pays taxes is a criminal now.  Thanks Danny.  You're helpful.  Full of helpful information that helps people.
 
2014-03-31 11:52:14 AM  

Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).

Uh huh.
As we enter the final days of this historic open enrollment period, more than 6 million Americans have signed up for coverage through the Health Insurance Marketplaces since October 1, thanks to the Affordable Care Act.
 
2014-03-31 11:52:48 AM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


hey, go here for the answer to your question:
https://www.healthcare.gov/what-key-dates-do-i-need-to-know/

A: Open Enrollment resumes on November 15, 2014, not next January
B: Lost your job? Got Married? Got Divorced?  Birth of a Child?  That is a LIFE CHANGING EVENT (see above link) that qualifies you for a SPECIAL ENROLLMENT PERIOD
 
2014-03-31 11:53:09 AM  

Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.

If you had bothered to click the provided link, you would see that those are the top rated comments for his page.
But if a conspiracy is much easier for your simple mind to comprehend then that people actually like the law, go let your freak flag fly.


Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

/I am guessing you follow Republicans on Facebook.
 
2014-03-31 11:53:58 AM  

Rapmaster2000: Signed up my mother-in-law a few weeks ago.  It was surprisingly cheap and painless.

I assume this makes me worse than Hitler.


47%er! Welfare Queen!
 
2014-03-31 11:54:57 AM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.

If you had bothered to click the provided link, you would see that those are the top rated comments for his page.
But if a conspiracy is much easier for your simple mind to comprehend then that people actually like the law, go let your freak flag fly.

Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

/I am guessing you follow Republicans on Facebook.


You seem extremely concerned about what other people are doing on Facebook.
 
2014-03-31 11:55:53 AM  

MBrady: Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).

then make sure you tell all the news media that, because that is precisely what they are calling it.  Signing up for 0bamacare.


The only people I've ever seen call it Zero-bamacare are idiots.
 
2014-03-31 11:56:15 AM  
You can use this magical website called a "Google" to look for printable versions of the application. Fill out your copy, mail it to the address shown, and some hapless worker in Kentucky will take care of all the website shenanigans for you.
 
2014-03-31 11:56:47 AM  

jjorsett: Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).Uh huh.
As we enter the final days of this historic open enrollment period, more than 6 million Americans have signed up for coverage through the Health Insurance Marketplaces since October 1, thanks to the Affordable Care Act.


Now this is a special kind of stupid. Jesus...
 
2014-03-31 11:56:54 AM  
Serves you right for waiting until the last possible minute, slackers.
 
2014-03-31 11:57:16 AM  
People who don't sign up for obamacare need to be rounded up and sent to FEMA camps. We need to start making examples of these scum. The health insurance companies have our best interest at heart here and they aren't concerned with making profits. Why would Obama pass this law then?
 
2014-03-31 11:57:16 AM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


After the freaking mess that this whole thing has caused, you want to give the feds ENTIRE control over all of it?  You unimaginable fool!

single payer = single denier.  And if you want to sign over your entire body to the control of federal government (who can't find their ass from a hole in the ground), fine have fun with that.  The rest of us don't want that nightmare, so don't inflict it on us.

If you don't think the feds will use the healthcare system as a weapon against their political enemies, the way they use the IRS, you're an even bigger fool.  And remember, the Dems won't always be the ones in charge.  So you may be the one with the target on your back.  Don't put it past them.

I don't trust the government enough to give them complete control over everything like that.  But it's cute that you do.
 
2014-03-31 11:57:20 AM  

I alone am best: Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.


Sorry reality doesn't match your pre-approved talking points.
 
2014-03-31 11:57:23 AM  
I'm already on the government single payer plan. Any meds I might ever need cost me $9/Month. All it took was having my body broken while in service to the United States Army.

/Thanks taxpayers!
//You're welcome.
 
2014-03-31 11:57:23 AM  

Mr. Right: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

The real problem is that there actually is a Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986.  Can we simplify the damned thing, eliminate all the loopholes (which only the rich have enough tax liability to use), reduce the percentage of our national productivity consumed by tax tracking and preparation, and reduce the necessity of armies of IRS workers?

Will Rogers posited that "The income tax has made more liars out of the American people than golf has."


Simple answe cause im on my phone:

Real life is a complex biatch if you try to make effective rules, and the more pieces and people involved the more rules you have to have to keep things from flying apart.

Things get complex for a reason.
 
2014-03-31 11:58:17 AM  
The only thing that matters here as far as whether ACA is going to stay or not is this:  are the insurance companies for it or against it?

If they are for it the Republicans will salute and carry on.  All the while biatching about how it is the death of freedom and liberty.

The most that might come out of it (if the Republicans regain control of the Senate and the Presidency) is that it will become ACA by another name.

When their corporate masters crack the whip, they jump through the flaming hoop.  Simple. (Both parties BTW).
 
2014-03-31 11:59:03 AM  

glassa: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

After the freaking mess that this whole thing has caused, you want to give the feds ENTIRE control over all of it?  You unimaginable fool!

single payer = single denier.  And if you want to sign over your entire body to the control of federal government (who can't find their ass from a hole in the ground), fine have fun with that.  The rest of us don't want that nightmare, so don't inflict it on us.

If you don't think the feds will use the healthcare system as a weapon against their political enemies, the way they use the IRS, you're an even bigger fool.  And remember, the Dems won't always be the ones in charge.  So you may be the one with the target on your back.  Don't put it past them.

I don't trust the government enough to give them complete control over everything like that.  But it's cute that you do.


Going to suggest you leave this kind of thing to Pocket Ninja and Mike Lowell.
 
2014-03-31 11:59:21 AM  

coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.


Not sure what your annual premium totals are but whatever the net savings/increases are, they should not be based on what you were paying before the law was passed but what you would have paid today if the law was never passed.  This is also assuming that any insurance company would want you as a client today based on your medical history.
 
2014-03-31 11:59:36 AM  
so am I gonna get arrested if I don't sign up?

I don't think so, but will I ave to pay a tax penalty?

Maybe.  I don't know.  I don't really even care.  I hope I die before get old.
 
2014-03-31 12:00:25 PM  
When was it operable?
 
2014-03-31 12:00:49 PM  

adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....


Things like getting married, having a baby, getting a giant raise, losing your job, or dying can dramatically effect your healthcare and tax situation.  News at 11.

Snark off/

Perviously, if you lost your job randomly, your options include COBRA or Medicaid.  If you lost your job, or really underwent any serious life-changing event, you get an individual enrollment period.  As it stands, I think you can enroll whenever through the exchange, it's just that we've attached a tax penalty to failure to enroll.  A penalty which demands some kind of deadline before it can be enforced.  They're being extraordinarily fair on this.

Like.  Unbelievably reasonable over a $95 dollar tax.  Imagine if the parking authority were this understanding about how you didn't move your car from a handicapped spot for three days cause you were 'busy'.  Or better yet because you have a religious opposition to catering to the handicapped and therefore can't recognize handicapped spots...
 
2014-03-31 12:00:53 PM  

jjorsett: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

Because this phase gave you total confidence in the government's ability to not screw up single payer just as badly?


The Republican Obstructionists can go fark themselves and then yes, we'll be just fine implementing new programs.
 
2014-03-31 12:01:28 PM  

advex101: The only thing that matters here as far as whether ACA is going to stay or not is this:  are the insurance companies for it or against it?


I'm assuming they are going to be for it because the only alternative will be single-payer.  They have a vested interest in it and insuring they keep on getting their 30% cut even thought they don't provide any service of actual use.
 
2014-03-31 12:01:55 PM  

MBrady: Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).

then make sure you tell all the news media that, because that is precisely what they are calling it.  Signing up for 0bamacare.


I can't help it that you love being lied to.  Get over that hurdle yourself.
 
2014-03-31 12:02:02 PM  

Best Princess Celestia: When was it operable?


On November 17th when I signed up.
Took 37.4 minutes.
But I was playing solitaire in another window.
 
2014-03-31 12:02:14 PM  
get it

the letter "o" is similar to the arabic numeral 0

it is a joke you see
 
2014-03-31 12:02:53 PM  

GWSuperfan: mrshowrules: for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Yep. I'm one of them. $3000/mo premiums (pre-ACA) were a little steep. $275/mo (now) I can handle though.

/Self-employed
//Pre-existing conditions


You obviously mis-typed those numbers... We all know from the news that everyone's premiums are skyrocketing. From what I have been following in the news, for example, I would say that your premiums really went from 7 cents a month to $10,000 a week, thanks to History's Greatest Monster.

amiite? ;-)
 
2014-03-31 12:03:15 PM  

Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

Sorry reality doesn't match your pre-approved talking points.


Says the guy who is cyber stalking a Senator from another state so he can upvote anecdotal stories from other people cyber stalking the same senator.
 
2014-03-31 12:03:25 PM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?



The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.
 
2014-03-31 12:03:26 PM  
6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!
 
2014-03-31 12:03:36 PM  

glassa: single payer = single denier. And if you want to sign over your entire body to the control of federal government (who can't find their ass from a hole in the ground), fine have fun with that. The rest of us don't want that nightmare, so don't inflict it on us.


I would much rather put it in the hands of for-profit insurance companies because they really care about me.
 
2014-03-31 12:03:37 PM  

Best Princess Celestia: When was it operable?


When I used it.  When my mom used it.  When my aunt used it. When about 6-10 million people used it.  Successfully.  Seems like it operated just fine.

But I must have imagined that cause the only thing the government can do right is waste money invading other countries or something.
 
2014-03-31 12:03:37 PM  
Well, before we declare the whole thing a failure and whargable everywhere what would actually constitute a "failure" of the plan? In my opinion:

1. If the number of uninsured doesn't drop in any significant way. The number is estimated at 30m. I think dropping that number to 20m would be a success.

2. If the price of healthcare increases. Reducing emergency room visits by the uninsured was one of the major goals of the program. If the price of healthcare increases then frankly everyone was monetarily better off sending the poor to the ER when they get ill.
 
2014-03-31 12:04:21 PM  

Dafatone: dittybopper: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


Doesn't mean they won't get charged with something else, or that they IRS won't dun them, or that in a year or two the law will be changed so that they can be prosecuted/liened/levied.

How the fark is this an argument!?!?

"It's not true.  But it could be true in the future if they change it!"

Wtf is this shiat?  Seriously.  What the fark is this shiat.


A friend who's a cop told me that all those radar enforced roadways are taking pictures of you plates and later they are going to change the speed limit and send out retro active speeding tickets.

He's pretty sure it's going to happen in the near future.

Trust me
 
2014-03-31 12:05:18 PM  
Well that settles it. Obamacare is a failure. Institute single player at once.
 
2014-03-31 12:05:38 PM  

manbart: adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....

It's to discourage people from not buying any insurance until they get sick, get treated and cancel. That kinda defeats the whole model of for profit insurance.


Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".  Only the exchanges do.  So, you get sick, you go buy a policy directly when you need it.

Oh, and if you lose your job, that qualifies as Hardship #14 that hasn't been widely publicized, which is essentially you state that you had "some other hardship" that prevented you from being insured, provide documentation if available.

I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14.  Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.
 
2014-03-31 12:06:42 PM  
Does one have the right to complain that the website is down when one has actively tried to bring it down?

Seriously, this is why I don't trust anyone who claims to be a Republican. This is how far they're willing to go to prevent the opposition from having a single victory.

They're not scared of the ACA because they think it'll fail. They're scared because they think it'll succeed.
 
2014-03-31 12:07:19 PM  

coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.


Small business owners. Family of four. Before ACA, $1200+ a month for shiatty coverage. After ACA, $230 a month for silver coverage. So that's a savings of  $11,640 a year for us. Except $1200 a month wasn't in the budget while also living in a home with walls, so we were without. I guess we can only estimate our savings based on the $6500*+ we spent out of pocket for medical expenses last year.

*Nothing chronic or life threatening in that number, just the average shiat that happens to an active family.
 
2014-03-31 12:08:15 PM  

dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".


Go to ehealthinsurance.com right now. Just the front page. Take a look at what it says.
 
2014-03-31 12:08:48 PM  

JolobinSmokin: Chris Ween: Somacandra: Chris Ween: f I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others

Agreed. While we're at it, We should get rid of all fire departments because fires still happen. The best way to solve a problem is by ignoring it.

Government option or single payer.  The ACA is needlessly complicated and solves one problem while creating 10.

But, as I said, don't hurt yourself patting your back.  Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.  So, this isn't even 7 million of the 30 million uninsured.  I think we will see that the ACA made some things more affordable, many things more complicated, and fixed very little in terms of obtaining coverage for the uninsured.

actually it has been estimated that 9.5 million new ppl have insurance that didn't previously.

75% of the ppl who signed up in the state of Kentucky alone previously had no insurance.


http://touch.latimes.com/#story/la-na-obamacare-uninsured-national-2 01 40331/


Don't you remember? Yesterday we were told that Obama was "cooking the books"... I don't recall if he was grilling them, maybe roasting them under the broiler. Either way, we were ASSURED that there was cooking going on. No evidence of this cooking, but being "assured" is enough, right?
 
2014-03-31 12:08:49 PM  

Aldon: 6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!


It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.
 
2014-03-31 12:09:00 PM  
My brother falls into the Medicaid hole here in Kansas. Thanks Republicans! You may be responsible for bureaucratic delays that could lead to his death!

Hey its all about being right isn't? Beating off to the mantra? Right up until you are wrong and people die. Unfortunately the GOP cares little about American Deaths.
 
2014-03-31 12:09:07 PM  

Summercat: Things get complex for a reason.


And that reason is that big campaign donors want tax breaks tailored to their situation and they get them.  Another reason:  politicians design tax codes in order to get themselves and/or their party re-elected.

To believe otherwise is naive.
 
2014-03-31 12:09:09 PM  

dok9874: I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14. Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.


File for unemployment.  They typically confirm with your employer that you were really laid off, and they include a statement about your earnings, and the date of your last paycheck in the info packets they mail you.

Whether you qualify or not it's a convenient way to obtain proof that you're unemployed as far as the state is concerned.
 
2014-03-31 12:09:31 PM  

DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.


Possibly. Except if I were the sort of person who wasn't likely to sign up anyway, I would be willing to wait 3-6 months on the bet that they waive any penalty for 2014.
 
2014-03-31 12:09:33 PM  

dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".


Um, no. Private insurers have always had enrollment periods.
 
2014-03-31 12:11:30 PM  

MemeSlave: James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?

Because it's "The Republicans" which are the problem.


or the last 10-12 years, they have been. They and their offspring the Tea Party. Oh, and those other morons who left the Republican party to become "Libertarians" without bothering to pay attention to what it entails. These splitoffs were both originally part of the Republican Party.
 
2014-03-31 12:11:32 PM  

I alone am best: Aldon: 6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!

It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.


Yeah all those people got was possibly life saving health insurance protection, what suckers!
 
2014-03-31 12:11:44 PM  

whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.

Possibly. Except if I were the sort of person who wasn't likely to sign up anyway, I would be willing to wait 3-6 months on the bet that they waive any penalty for 2014.



Are you being paid by the GOP to spread this FUD?
 
2014-03-31 12:11:59 PM  

dok9874: manbart: adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....

It's to discourage people from not buying any insurance until they get sick, get treated and cancel. That kinda defeats the whole model of for profit insurance.

Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".  Only the exchanges do.  So, you get sick, you go buy a policy directly when you need it.

Oh, and if you lose your job, that qualifies as Hardship #14 that hasn't been widely publicized, which is essentially you state that you had "some other hardship" that prevented you from being insured, provide documentation if available.

I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14.  Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.


I think you are mistaken about purchasing a plan directly form an insurance provider not having an enrollment period. Here are Anthem's open enrollment dates for individual plans (which are the same as the dates on the exchange websites).

Can't you get some documentation from your former employer that you are no longer an employee? Seems like it should be a common enough request for numerous reasons.
 
2014-03-31 12:12:45 PM  
Well this is what Im seeing when I try to login. Cool stuff, thanks obama.

img.fark.net
 
2014-03-31 12:12:59 PM  

BeesNuts: dok9874: I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14. Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.

File for unemployment.  They typically confirm with your employer that you were really laid off, and they include a statement about your earnings, and the date of your last paycheck in the info packets they mail you.

Whether you qualify or not it's a convenient way to obtain proof that you're unemployed as far as the state is concerned.


He should probably receive info about COBRA regardless. Granted, it probably doesn't make financial sense to go with COBRA now that the exchanges exist, but that packet should have enough info to prove the recent change in employment status. Also, if he "just got laid off", then he can head on over to the exchange website and sign up without having to bother with any of this. This guy's not trying to get answers, he's trying to spread FUD.
 
2014-03-31 12:13:12 PM  

I alone am best: Aldon: 6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!

It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.


Considering the estimates on uninsured driving, a crime which CAN lead to jail time btw, yeah...  people definitely follow the rules when threatened with less than a hundred dollar penalty if caught.  Yup.  We were coerced.  By gun point.  And jack boot.

Eat it, best.  The more you flail, the harder I find to not enjoy it.
 
2014-03-31 12:14:37 PM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

Sorry reality doesn't match your pre-approved talking points.

Says the guy who is cyber stalking a Senator from another state so he can upvote anecdotal stories from other people cyber stalking the same senator.


assets.diylol.com
 
2014-03-31 12:15:00 PM  
Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe
 
2014-03-31 12:15:25 PM  

I alone am best: It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.


Delude yourself into thinking all 6 million people were dragged into buying insurance by the power of legislation if you'd like, but many of those people (whether they made a cameo on Cruz's fb or not) are happily signing up and thankful that they are now allowed to buy insurance.  The young invincibles will eventually figure out that getting subsidized insurance is a hell of a lot better than not being covered and paying a fine.  The enrollments will swell over time and people will wonder why it took us so long to get some reform.
 
2014-03-31 12:15:31 PM  

Mr. Right: Summercat: Things get complex for a reason.

And that reason is that big campaign donors want tax breaks tailored to their situation and they get them.  Another reason:  politicians design tax codes in order to get themselves and/or their party re-elected.

To believe otherwise is naive.


Sorry, thatsabout seventy percent paranoia. Rules not just tax code - get complex the larger and more diverse a group they are supposed to cover.

I used to admin a large site. When it was smaller the rules were simple. The larger t got the more complex the rules got in reaction to events, decisions, and issues that came up.

Ive seen it time and time again, online andni person, and it is generally how history develops.

Complex shiat needs comex rules and we live in a complex society. You are kidding yourself if you think simple answers will be flexable enough to work.
 
2014-03-31 12:15:35 PM  

jjorsett: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

Because this phase gave you total confidence in the government's ability to not screw up single payer just as badly?


ACA's had screw ups. Oh well. It's the first run of the damn thing. But since you will pin any error in a website as a catastrophic failure, then my only choice is to say, "F*ck you, single payer." Because your alternative (My MS-stricken wife getting underwritten, not affording her medication, and dying while we go broke) is a no-go in the Toxin house.
 
2014-03-31 12:15:54 PM  

Serious Black: xanadian: FTFA:  An administration spokesman said the website is usually offline for maintenance overnight, and was brought down for four extra hours by a technical glitch

Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...

*facepalm*

/of course, there's something to be said for not procrastinating, but still

Once again, I ask who the hell was actually awake and desperate to work on their health insurance application at 3:30am? I can understand being desperate to work on it today at some point, but in the wee hours of the morning?


My friend and I were playing reaper of souls last night and he tried to finish his app when we took a break. Lol

/fun game
//crusader op.
 
2014-03-31 12:16:33 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


call this number 1-800-318-2596 rather than asking trolls on Fark.
 
2014-03-31 12:16:58 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


If you are currently unemployed and without an income, you are exempt from the penalty.
 
2014-03-31 12:17:31 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


I don't think so, but you're on a computer, so go to va.gov and search for further information.
 
2014-03-31 12:17:48 PM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

Sorry reality doesn't match your pre-approved talking points.

Says the guy who is cyber stalking a Senator from another state so he can upvote anecdotal stories from other people cyber stalking the same senator.


I was going to read your comment, but I'm afraid you'd report me for stalking.
 
2014-03-31 12:18:13 PM  

TheNewJesus: My brother falls into the Medicaid hole here in Kansas. Thanks Republicans! You may be responsible for bureaucratic delays that could lead to his death!

Hey its all about being right isn't? Beating off to the mantra? Right up until you are wrong and people die. Unfortunately the GOP cares little about American Deaths.


My mom is screwed by Indiana rejecting the Medicare expansion.  She's a month from retirement age with multiple health issues preventing her from working any more and she has been denied insurance because of her conditions for the past two years.  Her and my dad are currently filing for bankruptcy because they've been paying thousands a month out of pocket for her medications and treatments.  I feel your pain.
 
2014-03-31 12:18:35 PM  

Rincewind53: Um, it works perfectly fine.


The website's not down.  Your browser is racist.
 
2014-03-31 12:18:49 PM  

thurstonxhowell: BeesNuts: dok9874: I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14. Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.

File for unemployment.  They typically confirm with your employer that you were really laid off, and they include a statement about your earnings, and the date of your last paycheck in the info packets they mail you.

Whether you qualify or not it's a convenient way to obtain proof that you're unemployed as far as the state is concerned.

He should probably receive info about COBRA regardless. Granted, it probably doesn't make financial sense to go with COBRA now that the exchanges exist, but that packet should have enough info to prove the recent change in employment status. Also, if he "just got laid off", then he can head on over to the exchange website and sign up without having to bother with any of this. This guy's not trying to get answers, he's trying to spread FUD.


And I'm happy to alleviate said fake doubts, fears and uncertainties.

Like the one a moment ago complaining about the website.  This is what I see:
i59.tinypic.com

So basically they are being more amenable than any private company has in the history of ever.  But they are incompetent and want you to suffer.

I'm just *loving* the desperation.
 
2014-03-31 12:19:13 PM  

Carn: TheNewJesus: My brother falls into the Medicaid hole here in Kansas. Thanks Republicans! You may be responsible for bureaucratic delays that could lead to his death!

Hey its all about being right isn't? Beating off to the mantra? Right up until you are wrong and people die. Unfortunately the GOP cares little about American Deaths.

My mom is screwed by Indiana rejecting the Medicare expansion.  She's a month from retirement age with multiple health issues preventing her from working any more and she has been denied insurance because of her conditions for the past two years.  Her and my dad are currently filing for bankruptcy because they've been paying thousands a month out of pocket for her medications and treatments.  I feel your pain.


images.politico.com
 
2014-03-31 12:19:18 PM  

BeesNuts: I alone am best: Aldon: 6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!

It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.

Considering the estimates on uninsured driving, a crime which CAN lead to jail time btw, yeah...  people definitely follow the rules when threatened with less than a hundred dollar penalty if caught.  Yup.  We were coerced.  By gun point.  And jack boot.

Eat it, best.  The more you flail, the harder I find to not enjoy it.



Hey, it could work out. However, pointing to how many people have signed up is in no way indicative of the popularity since it was indeed coerced participation.
 
2014-03-31 12:20:12 PM  

DarnoKonrad: Carn: TheNewJesus: My brother falls into the Medicaid hole here in Kansas. Thanks Republicans! You may be responsible for bureaucratic delays that could lead to his death!

Hey its all about being right isn't? Beating off to the mantra? Right up until you are wrong and people die. Unfortunately the GOP cares little about American Deaths.

My mom is screwed by Indiana rejecting the Medicare expansion.  She's a month from retirement age with multiple health issues preventing her from working any more and she has been denied insurance because of her conditions for the past two years.  Her and my dad are currently filing for bankruptcy because they've been paying thousands a month out of pocket for her medications and treatments.  I feel your pain.

[images.politico.com image 605x328]


Exactly.  That motherf*cker can DIAF.
 
2014-03-31 12:20:35 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


IRS response:  move in with someone else or find a cheaper rent.. sell your car and eat less and pay  Pay PAY!!!!!

https://www.healthcare.gov/if-im-a-military-veteran-what-do-i-need-t o- know-about-the-marketplace/
 
2014-03-31 12:20:57 PM  

glassa: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

After the freaking mess that this whole thing has caused, you want to give the feds ENTIRE control over all of it?  You unimaginable fool!

single payer = single denier.  And if you want to sign over your entire body to the control of federal government (who can't find their ass from a hole in the ground), fine have fun with that.  The rest of us don't want that nightmare, so don't inflict it on us.

If you don't think the feds will use the healthcare system as a weapon against their political enemies, the way they use the IRS, you're an even bigger fool.  And remember, the Dems won't always be the ones in charge.  So you may be the one with the target on your back.  Don't put it past them.

I don't trust the government enough to give them complete control over everything like that.  But it's cute that you do.


Don't presume to speak for the rest of "us". We aren't all as ignorant as you are.
 
2014-03-31 12:21:12 PM  
I remember when I was back in college, and some poor souls tried to register for classes the day before registration closed. The computers always crashed. Always.

You know what the response was from the administrators?

"Ya'll are dumbshiats for trying to register at the last minute. You've had 4 months to register, and if you really cared about your schooling you would have done it by now."

It amazes me that large swaths of people would put off caring about their health until the very last second.
 
2014-03-31 12:21:14 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


IDK about VA benefits, but it can't hurt to get on the exchanges, you may qualify for medicaid.  Then again, you might already be covered.  I know this comes across as shocking, but the telephone lines are actually pretty helpful but they have wait times of about 2 hours average.  Probably worse today.
 
2014-03-31 12:22:06 PM  

Carn: We should petition President Romney to put a stop to this!


President Romney, on his first day in office, would have repealed Obamacare.... but first he would have set off those fireworks over the Boston Harbor.  Priorities, people!!!!  Priorities!!!!
 
2014-03-31 12:22:30 PM  

I alone am best: coerced participation


i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-31 12:22:35 PM  

I alone am best: BeesNuts: I alone am best: Aldon: 6 million sign ups are pretty amazing considering 26 Republican governors actively worked to make the program fail.

Thanks Obama!

It is amazing that 6 million people threatened with a penalty actually followed the law! This is just like the amazing popularity that the IRS commands. Just look at how many people filed taxes! The government is on a roll.

Considering the estimates on uninsured driving, a crime which CAN lead to jail time btw, yeah...  people definitely follow the rules when threatened with less than a hundred dollar penalty if caught.  Yup.  We were coerced.  By gun point.  And jack boot.

Eat it, best.  The more you flail, the harder I find to not enjoy it.


Hey, it could work out. However, pointing to how many people have signed up is in no way indicative of the popularity since it was indeed coerced participation.


I don't think people are citing those figures to point out its popularity.  I think it's to point out that it's working.  That people are getting health insurance.  I'm not sure you don't agree, but I'm quite certain it's not what you want to talk about, so carry on.
 
2014-03-31 12:22:46 PM  

Chris Ween: Most of those enrolled may have selected the marketplace options instead of their employer options.


Count me as one of these.  Company was paying $450/month for shiatty Aetna coverage, and through the ACA, I found fantastic coverage for $442/month. I managed to convince my boss to give me the $450/month instead of Aetna, and I'm in a much better position today than 3 months ago.  Prescriptions for a chronic condition that cost me thousands a year before will now cost me hundreds a year.

/I know not everyone has a boss who will work with them.  YMMV.
 
2014-03-31 12:23:03 PM  

Carn: My mom is screwed by Indiana rejecting the Medicare expansion.


Many of the states that chose not to expand are reconsidering that decision. Cross your fingers and write your congressional reps.
 
2014-03-31 12:23:05 PM  

glassa: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

After the freaking mess that this whole thing has caused, you want to give the feds ENTIRE control over all of it?  You unimaginable fool!

single payer = single denier.  And if you want to sign over your entire body to the control of federal government (who can't find their ass from a hole in the ground), fine have fun with that.  The rest of us don't want that nightmare, so don't inflict it on us.

If you don't think the feds will use the healthcare system as a weapon against their political enemies, the way they use the IRS, you're an even bigger fool.  And remember, the Dems won't always be the ones in charge.  So you may be the one with the target on your back.  Don't put it past them.

I don't trust the government enough to give them complete control over everything like that.  But it's cute that you do.


Is this the way the government in the UK is with their universal healthcare? You would think you'd hear more horror stories coming out of England about their evil, oppressive government controlling the lives of the citizens.
 
2014-03-31 12:23:40 PM  
Not happening. I make too much for MassHealth (hint: I don't) and the lowest possible plan they offer is approximately 27 hours' pay before taxes. So as soon as they get it down to, say, 15-20 hours, I'll get right on that....
 
2014-03-31 12:23:41 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


In the case of ZERO dollars, you are probably eligible for subsidies that may cover most if not all of your premium or as long as you are not living in a Red state with a$$hole legislature and governor, you are probably eligible now for the expanded Medicaid.
 
2014-03-31 12:25:28 PM  

James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?


I think we already know that answer.

images.wikia.com
 
2014-03-31 12:25:30 PM  

thornhill: vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.

And probably 75% of those people don't realize they have the ACA to thank for that.


In order for you to spout that 10 million gain number I guess you are looking at the list that contains 10 million names. Next to those names is the column that states the last time they had insurance, if ever, and whether they paid their premiums or not yet. If your not looking at this list are you regurgitating someone's talking points recently handed to you? I did not believe anything that came out of the Bush W.H. and will not believe anything that comes out of the Obama W.H.
 
2014-03-31 12:25:31 PM  

BeesNuts: thurstonxhowell: BeesNuts: dok9874: I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14. Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.

File for unemployment.  They typically confirm with your employer that you were really laid off, and they include a statement about your earnings, and the date of your last paycheck in the info packets they mail you.

Whether you qualify or not it's a convenient way to obtain proof that you're unemployed as far as the state is concerned.

He should probably receive info about COBRA regardless. Granted, it probably doesn't make financial sense to go with COBRA now that the exchanges exist, but that packet should have enough info to prove the recent change in employment status. Also, if he "just got laid off", then he can head on over to the exchange website and sign up without having to bother with any of this. This guy's not trying to get answers, he's trying to spread FUD.

And I'm happy to alleviate said fake doubts, fears and uncertainties.

Like the one a moment ago complaining about the website.  This is what I see:
[i59.tinypic.com image 850x598]

So basically they are being more amenable than any private company has in the history of ever.  But they are incompetent and want you to suffer.

I'm just *loving* the desperation.


Yeah, I'm totally comfortable with that.  Fark no.  I'm more likely
 
2014-03-31 12:25:32 PM  
In my state I can contact any insurance agent and get health insurance that meets the requirements of the ACA.   I can also go to the website of BCBS or Coventry directly and sign up online at either place.

The healthcare.gov is only one of the many many options that one can use to get healthcare.  It's a somewhat useful tool, but it's also not needed to get health insurance through an exchange.

I got my $205/mo gold plan as a 42 year old male by going directly to the BCBS of Kansas web site.  I'm a contractor with a few minor pre-existing conditions (that I don't currently require additional medication or treatment for, but I may someday).
 
2014-03-31 12:26:47 PM  

ManateeGag: mrshowrules: DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?

Obama lied.  He will always betray you.  The Obamacare implosion continues.

/amidoingitirght

Obamacare raped my mother while pouring sugar into my gas tank.


Obamacare raped my gas tank while pouring sugar into my mother.
 
2014-03-31 12:26:54 PM  

MithrandirBooga: I remember when I was back in college, and some poor souls tried to register for classes the day before registration closed. The computers always crashed. Always.

You know what the response was from the administrators?

"Ya'll are dumbshiats for trying to register at the last minute. You've had 4 months to register, and if you really cared about your schooling you would have done it by now."

It amazes me that large swaths of people would put off caring about their health until the very last second.


The administrators of that college are complete idiots and should be fired.  Everyone knows that people do shiat at the last minute and you plan for it.  Its called being human.
 
2014-03-31 12:26:57 PM  

tkwasny: thornhill: vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.

And probably 75% of those people don't realize they have the ACA to thank for that.

In order for you to spout that 10 million gain number I guess you are looking at the list that contains 10 million names. Next to those names is the column that states the last time they had insurance, if ever, and whether they paid their premiums or not yet. If your not looking at this list are you regurgitating someone's talking points recently handed to you? I did not believe anything that came out of the Bush W.H. and will not believe anything that comes out of the Obama W.H.


Yeah, if you didn't personally count each and every one of those 10 million by hand, it's a lie.
 
2014-03-31 12:27:17 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-31 12:27:38 PM  
I have coverage, but I am not going to enroll.
EVERYONE NOT EXEMPT MUST ENROLL...
but I refuse to do so...
 
2014-03-31 12:28:17 PM  

Witty_Retort: coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.

Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.


^This. I went from no insurance to having free insurance so I saved jack shiat.

/Obama lied. Ben Ghazi died.
 
2014-03-31 12:28:27 PM  
So tomorrow is when the economy collapses and Obama finally reveals his plans to convert all of AMerica to Islam?  That's what Obamacare is going to do right?
 
2014-03-31 12:28:36 PM  

gingerjet: MithrandirBooga: I remember when I was back in college, and some poor souls tried to register for classes the day before registration closed. The computers always crashed. Always.

You know what the response was from the administrators?

"Ya'll are dumbshiats for trying to register at the last minute. You've had 4 months to register, and if you really cared about your schooling you would have done it by now."

It amazes me that large swaths of people would put off caring about their health until the very last second.

The administrators of that college are complete idiots and should be fired.  Everyone knows that people do shiat at the last minute and you plan for it.  Its called being human.


Students procrastinate, therefore, the administrators are all idiots and should be fired. Brilliant!
 
2014-03-31 12:28:47 PM  

Abe Vigoda's Ghost: ManateeGag: mrshowrules: DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?

Obama lied.  He will always betray you.  The Obamacare implosion continues.

/amidoingitirght

Obamacare raped my mother while pouring sugar into my gas tank.

Obamacare raped my gas tank while pouring sugar into my mother.


In the name of love though? Because that is acceptable.

t3.gstatic.com
 
2014-03-31 12:29:23 PM  

bullsballs: I have coverage, but I am not going to enroll.
EVERYONE NOT EXEMPT MUST ENROLL...
but I refuse to do so...


Know how I know you don't actually understand what's going on?
 
2014-03-31 12:29:27 PM  

tkwasny: thornhill: vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.

And probably 75% of those people don't realize they have the ACA to thank for that.

In order for you to spout that 10 million gain number I guess you are looking at the list that contains 10 million names. Next to those names is the column that states the last time they had insurance, if ever, and whether they paid their premiums or not yet. If your not looking at this list are you regurgitating someone's talking points recently handed to you? I did not believe anything that came out of the Bush W.H. and will not believe anything that comes out of the Obama W.H.


Then won't you be screaming that the system allows for identity theft?
 
2014-03-31 12:29:30 PM  

bullsballs: I have coverage, but I am not going to enroll.
EVERYONE NOT EXEMPT MUST ENROLL...
but I refuse to do so...


lolwut?
 
2014-03-31 12:30:31 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Carn: My mom is screwed by Indiana rejecting the Medicare expansion.

Many of the states that chose not to expand are reconsidering that decision. Cross your fingers and write your congressional reps.


Sadly, my folks are already screwed, but hopefully the states do come around and less people get screwed in the future.  It's awesome that you can work your whole life, paying insurance premiums and making them oodles of money, and then finally when you get really sick and need real care they kick you to the curb and piss on your head and then people cheer them for it.
 
2014-03-31 12:31:36 PM  
Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.
 
2014-03-31 12:31:43 PM  
Thanks to all for the info/advice.  I just assumed that, if covered under VA, I wouldn't need it.  I guess I have some research to do.

/rarely get sick
//Going crazy with no job for 3 months
///Probably shouldn't have waited until the last minute
 
2014-03-31 12:31:49 PM  

Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).


My State is ran by asshats.

They have an political party even.

Their mascot is an Ass.
 
2014-03-31 12:32:02 PM  

I alone am best: Hey, it could work out. However, pointing to how many people have signed up is in no way indicative of the popularity since it was indeed coerced participation.


So you want to b*tch for the sake of it, and will find any reason to do it.
 
2014-03-31 12:32:10 PM  

Summercat: Mr. Right: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

The real problem is that there actually is a Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986.  Can we simplify the damned thing, eliminate all the loopholes (which only the rich have enough tax liability to use), reduce the percentage of our national productivity consumed by tax tracking and preparation, and reduce the necessity of armies of IRS workers?

Will Rogers posited that "The income tax has made more liars out of the American people than golf has."

Simple answe cause im on my phone:

Real life is a complex biatch if you try to make effective rules, and the more pieces and people involved the more rules you have to have to keep things from flying apart.

Things get complex for a reason.


And that reason is lawyers. Companies hire lawyers to root out every loophole they can find and exploit to improve their bottom line, which means the laws have to be thorough.

I'm not saying it's a perfect system, but if the ACA were ten pages long, the insurance companies' legal departments would have found a way to screw as many people as possible in a matter of days.
 
2014-03-31 12:33:26 PM  
Health Insurance "Scamming Middleman between you and your doctor since 1930"
 
2014-03-31 12:34:57 PM  

Chris Ween: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?

If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.


7 million is only the number of people signing up for coverage through public exchanges. The CBO also estimated a roughly equal amount of people signing up for coverage through private insurers outside of the exchanges and an even larger amount were supposed to be covered under Medicaid until the Supreme Court decision in 2012.

It's probably going to be 15 million-20 million covered by the law once this is finished, all told.
 
2014-03-31 12:35:15 PM  

Carn: It's awesome that you can work your whole life, paying insurance premiums and making them oodles of money, and then finally when you get really sick and need real care they kick you to the curb and piss on your head and then people cheer them for it.


Reminds me of this:

comicsidontunderstand.com
 
2014-03-31 12:35:40 PM  
Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.
 
2014-03-31 12:36:05 PM  

sdd2000: [img.fark.net image 403x403]


The DNC political ads write themselves
 
2014-03-31 12:36:26 PM  

DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.

Possibly. Except if I were the sort of person who wasn't likely to sign up anyway, I would be willing to wait 3-6 months on the bet that they waive any penalty for 2014.


Are you being paid by the GOP to spread this FUD?


If by 'paid by the GOP' you mean 'am a fan of ACA who is generally disappointed and cynical about the enforcement being any more effective than the rollout', then sure.

I hope I'm wrong. But I doubt it.
 
2014-03-31 12:36:55 PM  

bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.


If only the law included exemptions and subsidies for people with little or no income!
 
2014-03-31 12:37:27 PM  

bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.



If you have no money, you can't be fined.  it's levied against income.  If you have none, you can't pay it.  It's not a poll tax.
 
2014-03-31 12:37:32 PM  
imagine a health insurance card, thwapping into a human face, forever
 
2014-03-31 12:38:32 PM  

DarnoKonrad: bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.


If you have no money, you can't be fined.  it's levied against income.  If you have none, you can't pay it.  It's not a poll tax.


And if you have no income I am pretty sure you are exempt.
 
2014-03-31 12:39:08 PM  

James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?


About the same chance as the Democrats not being absolute piles of feces.

Slim to none, feces eaters, slim to none.
 
2014-03-31 12:39:17 PM  

whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.

Possibly. Except if I were the sort of person who wasn't likely to sign up anyway, I would be willing to wait 3-6 months on the bet that they waive any penalty for 2014.


Are you being paid by the GOP to spread this FUD?

If by 'paid by the GOP' you mean 'am a fan of ACA who is generally disappointed and cynical about the enforcement being any more effective than the rollout', then sure.

I hope I'm wrong. But I doubt it.



Even Drudge is paying the tax.  Calling it his "liberty tax."   If the mouthpieces of the wingnut nation can't be bothered with tax evasion, I doubt it's going to get any traction with the rank and file dullard.
 
2014-03-31 12:39:45 PM  

qorkfiend: If only the law included exemptions and subsidies for people with little or no income!


You mean like the ones that don't qualify for medicaid but are still poor?  Yeah, I'll look into that if my meds don't run out.
 
2014-03-31 12:39:53 PM  

bunner: Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.


What's your income level? You may qualify for subsidies that help pay for your insurance.
 
2014-03-31 12:40:56 PM  
a really big one though, like one of those giant novelty sized checks
 
2014-03-31 12:41:13 PM  

verbaltoxin: bunner: Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.

What's your income level? You may qualify for subsidies that help pay for your insurance.


Entirely too close to f*ck all, atm.  I DO have a Jim dandy 1099 tax bill coming for what little I do make, though,.  This is going to be a seriously sucky month.
 
2014-03-31 12:41:48 PM  

bullsballs: I have coverage, but I am not going to enroll.
EVERYONE NOT EXEMPT MUST ENROLL...
but I refuse to do so...


,,, why?
 
2014-03-31 12:42:27 PM  

James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.


What happens when I don't get anything back for my tax returns anyways? What if I owe taxes, in fact. Does this suddenly increase my taxes by 1%?
 
2014-03-31 12:42:45 PM  

bunner: verbaltoxin: bunner: Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.

What's your income level? You may qualify for subsidies that help pay for your insurance.

Entirely too close to f*ck all, atm.  I DO have a Jim dandy 1099 tax bill coming for what little I do make, though,.  This is going to be a seriously sucky month.


From my understanding, if you make under 10k you're exempt, if you're in a state that didn't except Medicaid expansion and you would have qualified for that, you're exempt as well.
 
2014-03-31 12:42:51 PM  

bunner: qorkfiend: If only the law included exemptions and subsidies for people with little or no income!

You mean like the ones that don't qualify for medicaid but are still poor?  Yeah, I'll look into that if my meds don't run out.


Yeah, something like that. I might suggest not having a governor and state legislature who are deliberately farking you, as well.
 
2014-03-31 12:43:18 PM  

Level5: Well this is what Im seeing when I try to login. Cool stuff, thanks obama.

[img.fark.net image 800x346]


If Obama had released his transcripts, we might have found out that he failed his Web Development courses. No wonder he had to be a community organizer...

/derp
 
2014-03-31 12:43:20 PM  

KellyX: bunner: verbaltoxin: bunner: Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.

What's your income level? You may qualify for subsidies that help pay for your insurance.

Entirely too close to f*ck all, atm.  I DO have a Jim dandy 1099 tax bill coming for what little I do make, though,.  This is going to be a seriously sucky month.

From my understanding, if you make under 10k you're exempt, if you're in a state that didn't except Medicaid expansion and you would have qualified for that, you're exempt as well.


accept... ugh
 
2014-03-31 12:43:32 PM  
At the end of the day, medicine is either about healing or making exorbitant amounts of money.  This is plan A for option B.  And little else.  It  doesn't adress the inherent problem of medicine for profit.  It's just taps a different vein.
 
2014-03-31 12:43:33 PM  

whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


if they do that, then only the old and sick will sign up this year and the prices for plans will skyrocket next year.  death spiral.
 
2014-03-31 12:43:39 PM  

bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.


There are plenty of republics with low taxes, low government overhead, and all the personal freedom you and a private army can buy. Feel free to go there.
 
2014-03-31 12:43:44 PM  

machoprogrammer: How about just nationalize it instead of pushing legislation allowing the insurance companies to profit?


Because a) the Republicans and Medicare recipients shiat their pants over that idea and b) we were in a recession at the time and the insurance industry would have had mass layoffs.
 
2014-03-31 12:44:10 PM  

RaiderFanMikeP: Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe

IRS response:  move in with someone else or find a cheaper rent.. sell your car and eat less and pay  Pay PAY!!!!!

https://www.healthcare.gov/if-im-a-military-veteran-what-do-i-need-t o- know-about-the-marketplace/


He said he was covered by VA benefits, so your link says roughly the opposite of what you say it does. Which you would know if you had bothered to read the first sentence of the answer provided.
 
2014-03-31 12:44:22 PM  

bunner: verbaltoxin: bunner: Went to site.  Signed up.  Got usr/pw.  I have no money to buy any of this sh*t.  Wont any time soon.  Site offered me things to do until the site is back up.  Site should install pong game.

What's your income level? You may qualify for subsidies that help pay for your insurance.

Entirely too close to f*ck all, atm.  I DO have a Jim dandy 1099 tax bill coming for what little I do make, though,.  This is going to be a seriously sucky month.


Then there's a chance you do qualify for the subsidies.
 
2014-03-31 12:45:02 PM  

bunner: At the end of the day, medicine is either about healing or making exorbitant amounts of money.  This is plan A for option B.  And little else.  It  doesn't adress the inherent problem of medicine for profit.  It's just taps a different vein.


Well sure, but it's not supposed to address the problems inherent in medicine for profit.
 
2014-03-31 12:45:10 PM  

Serious Black: xanadian: FTFA:  An administration spokesman said the website is usually offline for maintenance overnight, and was brought down for four extra hours by a technical glitch

Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...

*facepalm*

/of course, there's something to be said for not procrastinating, but still

Once again, I ask who the hell was actually awake and desperate to work on their health insurance application at 3:30am? I can understand being desperate to work on it today at some point, but in the wee hours of the morning?


Not everyone shares the same bedtime as you. There's no curfew stating when people need to be off of their computers. One of the benefits of a website is supposed to be 24/7 availability.

/I was up until about 5am this morning
 
2014-03-31 12:45:23 PM  

verbaltoxin: bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.

There are plenty of republics with low taxes, low government overhead, and all the personal freedom you and a private army can buy. Feel free to go there.


Gee, if YOU say it's OK.  *snort*  You own one of those crying eagle T-shirtsm, don't you?
 
2014-03-31 12:46:24 PM  

bunner: verbaltoxin: bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.

There are plenty of republics with low taxes, low government overhead, and all the personal freedom you and a private army can buy. Feel free to go there.

Gee, if YOU say it's OK.  *snort*  You own one of those crying eagle T-shirtsm, don't you?


You're just jealous because I'm more freedomer than you.
 
2014-03-31 12:46:35 PM  
Sorry, but if the best America can do is "Hey, at least we're not Somalia", America is f*cked.
 
2014-03-31 12:46:36 PM  
Yeah, 0bummercare is great.  It might help my family.  Circus performers, and other high-risk groups not so much.  In the Bizarro-world of left-wing blog posts, I suppose this counts as a success.  But wisdom is like pearls before swine for you social parasites.  I suppose you think what's good for urban populations is what is good for real Americans living in the boondocks.  The impact hits close to home when you realize that if you merely miss a date to sign up, you could now be a criminal.  Or, sign up with all those other millions of new patients, and end up only being able to get into see a doctor who prescribes pickles if you're pregnant. But appealing to the betterment of the downtrodden is red meat to limousine liberals, and so now every welfare queen with a Cadillac full of rugrats can now afford to go overboard on their healthcare without ending up in the penalty box.  Of course, when our nation is sinking like the Titanic under the fifth wave of debt, it will take all of you out of the gene pool.  Don't cry to me when the debt dunes bury this nation.
 
2014-03-31 12:47:01 PM  

vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.


Citation needed.  And make sure you exclude from the count all the people that lost insurance.
 
2014-03-31 12:47:16 PM  

verbaltoxin: You're just jealous because I'm more freedomer than you.


That must be it.
 
2014-03-31 12:48:11 PM  

DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: DarnoKonrad: whistleridge: Or, you know, just  don't sign up. I'm sure when 25,000,000 people all complain, they'll wind up just waiving it for the year. There's simply no way they try to enforce this in an election year. As bad as it is to cave, it would be far, far worse to fine a bunch of people.

/ can we have single-payer yet?


The IRS has never worked that way.  Don't pay any of your taxes.  They won't do anything but send you a sternly  worded letter, but they WILL get around to prosecuting you in the next couple of years, and you will lose.

Possibly. Except if I were the sort of person who wasn't likely to sign up anyway, I would be willing to wait 3-6 months on the bet that they waive any penalty for 2014.


Are you being paid by the GOP to spread this FUD?

If by 'paid by the GOP' you mean 'am a fan of ACA who is generally disappointed and cynical about the enforcement being any more effective than the rollout', then sure.

I hope I'm wrong. But I doubt it.


Even Drudge is paying the tax.  Calling it his "liberty tax."   If the mouthpieces of the wingnut nation can't be bothered with tax evasion, I doubt it's going to get any traction with the rank and file dullard.


Because one rich douchebag trying and failing to score political points is a good point of measure for the whole system?

Even if everything goes perfectly, millions are going to miss the deadline. It's unavoidable. A bunch are going to plausibly claim they were unable to comply for technical reasons. Will they be penalized?

I doubt it. Next year, yes. But not during the trial year.
 
2014-03-31 12:48:59 PM  

Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe


There have been several good responses to your question, but the bottom line is if you are currently enrolled in VA healthcare (not just eligible- you must be enrolled) you meet the qualifications for healthcare under the ACA. If you are not enrolled- GET ENROLLED!  The process takes months. (about 6 months for me).
 
2014-03-31 12:49:07 PM  
I just went to healthcare.gov and now my screen says, "WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF AIDS!" in what appears to be lipstick.
 
2014-03-31 12:49:42 PM  

whistleridge: Because one rich douchebag trying and failing to score political points is a good point of measure for the whole system?


No, but when 90% of the people with a useful pen fit that description, it is.
 
2014-03-31 12:50:23 PM  

Epic Fap Session: I just went to healthcare.gov and now my screen says, "WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF AIDS!" in what appears to be lipstick.


i371.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-31 12:50:48 PM  

UNC_Samurai: Summercat: Mr. Right: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

The real problem is that there actually is a Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986.  Can we simplify the damned thing, eliminate all the loopholes (which only the rich have enough tax liability to use), reduce the percentage of our national productivity consumed by tax tracking and preparation, and reduce the necessity of armies of IRS workers?

Will Rogers posited that "The income tax has made more liars out of the American people than golf has."

Simple answe cause im on my phone:

Real life is a complex biatch if you try to make effective rules, and the more pieces and people involved the more rules you have to have to keep things from flying apart.

Things get complex for a reason.

And that reason is lawyers. Companies hire lawyers to root out every loophole they can find and exploit to improve their bottom line, which means the laws have to be thorough.

I'm not saying it's a perfect system, but if the ACA were ten pages long, the insurance companies' legal departments would have found a way to screw as many people as possible in a matter of days.


Extrapolate this to a larger ruleset. There are ALWAYS people who try to find ways around the rules to do what they want, ways to misinterpret rules, ways to subvert and pervert the intent of the rules to allow themselves to do what the rules were intended to stop, limit, etc.

THAT is a near constant among humans. Lawyers, on both sides of the equation, are just experts in that skill and knowledgebase.

I keep going back to my experience, but used to be on said site I was an admin on, EVERYTHING was allowed. This included drawn images of underaged characters. Then the rules changed to disallow that. We later had to update the rule from "If it's underaged it is not allowed" to "If it looks underaged" because people would go "OH, he's not really 9, he's really a 5000 year old vampire shapeshifter!". I called it the Shippo Rule (after the Inuyasha character who looks 6 but is 900).

Between THAT as a human nature, and the fact that while individuals are good at self-regulating at some things, societies are not, we have rules. And the larger and more diverse a society, the more complex the rules - because as Zero Tolerance has shown, simple rules are farking stupid.

For another example, let's take Roundabouts, also known as Traffic Circles. I recently encountered these while on a trip to Australia (Sydney and Canberra), where they are fairly common - and in low traffic areas, they worked much better  than traffic lights, and so where installed in many places.

But then populations grew, and these traffic circles were no longer working better than traffic lights. They in fact were worse off (even accounting for the fact I'm an American driving in Australia). They hindered traffic and worsened the flow. I was told in many areas that were growing in population they were putting lights up on the traffic circles, and eventually ripping them out and putting in lighted intersections.

/I found that to be a good metaphor for my concepts
//Liberatrianism: Works GREAT with tiny populations
///And Zero Tolerance is a simple solution, isn't it.
 
2014-03-31 12:51:01 PM  

Skleenar: Yeah, 0bummercare is great.  It might help my family.  Circus performers, and other high-risk groups not so much.  In the Bizarro-world of left-wing blog posts, I suppose this counts as a success.  But wisdom is like pearls before swine for you social parasites.  I suppose you think what's good for urban populations is what is good for real Americans living in the boondocks.  The impact hits close to home when you realize that if you merely miss a date to sign up, you could now be a criminal.  Or, sign up with all those other millions of new patients, and end up only being able to get into see a doctor who prescribes pickles if you're pregnant. But appealing to the betterment of the downtrodden is red meat to limousine liberals, and so now every welfare queen with a Cadillac full of rugrats can now afford to go overboard on their healthcare without ending up in the penalty box.  Of course, when our nation is sinking like the Titanic under the fifth wave of debt, it will take all of you out of the gene pool.  Don't cry to me when the debt dunes bury this nation.


Uh, movies? Adult Swim cartoons? I'm not sure.
 
2014-03-31 12:51:21 PM  
From the CBO: Over time, more people are expected to respond to the new coverage options, so enrollment is projected to increase sharply in 2015 and 2016. Starting in 2017, between 24 million and 25 million people are expected to obtain coverage each year through exchanges, and roughly 80 percent of those enrollees are expected to receive subsidies for purchasing that insurance.

It's here. Get used to it.
 
2014-03-31 12:51:49 PM  

thurstonxhowell: RaiderFanMikeP: Melvin Lovecraft: Honest question here:  If, as a vet, I am able to go to a VA hospital, do I still need to sign up for ACA?  Currently unemployed (got laid off in December).  I have ZERO dollars to pay for health insurance.  After rent, car note and groceries, I'm flat broke.  It won't last forever, but for right now, I simply don't have any extra money for insurance.

/another penalty is meaningless...they can get in line for what they say I owe

IRS response:  move in with someone else or find a cheaper rent.. sell your car and eat less and pay  Pay PAY!!!!!

https://www.healthcare.gov/if-im-a-military-veteran-what-do-i-need-t o- know-about-the-marketplace/

He said he was covered by VA benefits, so your link says roughly the opposite of what you say it does. Which you would know if you had bothered to read the first sentence of the answer provided.


real answer was link.. no he doesn't have to pay for ACA plans if he has VA Coverage

 snarky answer was IRS response which i know they want every penny owed them  (not related to ACA in general if your excuse is "i have rent car note and food to buy"  they would say "screw you and pay"   not ACA premium but tax bill..  sorry for confusion..
 
2014-03-31 12:52:39 PM  

Skleenar: Yeah, 0bummercare is great.  It might help my family.  Circus performers, and other high-risk groups not so much.  In the Bizarro-world of left-wing blog posts, I suppose this counts as a success.  But wisdom is like pearls before swine for you social parasites.  I suppose you think what's good for urban populations is what is good for real Americans living in the boondocks.  The impact hits close to home when you realize that if you merely miss a date to sign up, you could now be a criminal.  Or, sign up with all those other millions of new patients, and end up only being able to get into see a doctor who prescribes pickles if you're pregnant. But appealing to the betterment of the downtrodden is red meat to limousine liberals, and so now every welfare queen with a Cadillac full of rugrats can now afford to go overboard on their healthcare without ending up in the penalty box.  Of course, when our nation is sinking like the Titanic under the fifth wave of debt, it will take all of you out of the gene pool.  Don't cry to me when the debt dunes bury this nation.


I think those are all comics.
 
2014-03-31 12:52:45 PM  

Skleenar: Yeah, 0bummercare is great.  It might help my family.  Circus performers, and other high-risk groups not so much.  In the Bizarro-world of left-wing blog posts, I suppose this counts as a success.  But wisdom is like pearls before swine for you social parasites.  I suppose you think what's good for urban populations is what is good for real Americans living in the boondocks.  The impact hits close to home when you realize that if you merely miss a date to sign up, you could now be a criminal.  Or, sign up with all those other millions of new patients, and end up only being able to get into see a doctor who prescribes pickles if you're pregnant. But appealing to the betterment of the downtrodden is red meat to limousine liberals, and so now every welfare queen with a Cadillac full of rugrats can now afford to go overboard on their healthcare without ending up in the penalty box.  Of course, when our nation is sinking like the Titanic under the fifth wave of debt, it will take all of you out of the gene pool.  Don't cry to me when the debt dunes bury this nation.


you're giving me a headache, would you please stop
 
2014-03-31 12:53:24 PM  

verbaltoxin: Skleenar: Yeah, 0bummercare is great.  It might help my family.  Circus performers, and other high-risk groups not so much.  In the Bizarro-world of left-wing blog posts, I suppose this counts as a success.  But wisdom is like pearls before swine for you social parasites.  I suppose you think what's good for urban populations is what is good for real Americans living in the boondocks.  The impact hits close to home when you realize that if you merely miss a date to sign up, you could now be a criminal.  Or, sign up with all those other millions of new patients, and end up only being able to get into see a doctor who prescribes pickles if you're pregnant. But appealing to the betterment of the downtrodden is red meat to limousine liberals, and so now every welfare queen with a Cadillac full of rugrats can now afford to go overboard on their healthcare without ending up in the penalty box.  Of course, when our nation is sinking like the Titanic under the fifth wave of debt, it will take all of you out of the gene pool.  Don't cry to me when the debt dunes bury this nation.

Uh, movies? Adult Swim cartoons? I'm not sure.


Comic Strips?
 
2014-03-31 12:53:52 PM  
seriously you guys missed like half of them
 
2014-03-31 12:54:20 PM  

Summercat: Comic Strips?


Yeah that makes more sense. I don't know comic strips very well.
 
2014-03-31 12:54:45 PM  

SlothB77: vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.

Citation needed.  And make sure you exclude from the count all the people that lost insurance.


But add in people like me who bought through an insurance broker an ACA compliant plan in that I would not get a subsidy, but am able to now get insurance. Under the prior system due to pre-existing condition my only choices in Texas were employer based insurance (causing me to delay retirement) or the Texas High Risk pool which was nicknamed "Denial Care". I now have a plan that is about 1/2 the cost of the Texas high risk plan, with no lifetime caps, prescription coverage that is better than my employer plan. All in all I must say the ACA has been a godsend to me. For your citation please see.
 
2014-03-31 12:55:02 PM  

Jackson Herring: you're giving me a headache, would you please stop


arresting me?
 
2014-03-31 12:55:10 PM  
Politics tab must have taken the day off to go get health insurance. 3 friggin articles is all I have to read at lunch???
 
2014-03-31 12:55:18 PM  

SlothB77: vernonFL: So far, 10 million more people have health insurance- either privately or through medicaid expansion- than had it before.

Citation needed.  And make sure you exclude from the count all the people that lost insurance.


Do you have a citation on who lost insurance rather than simply signing up for a different plan?
 
2014-03-31 12:55:43 PM  
We're 17,000,000,000,000.00 in debt and we're still cutting checks.  Mostly to the people who already have whatever actual wealth is left in their sock drawers.  This ain't gonna fix sh*t.
 
2014-03-31 12:56:26 PM  

atomic-age: machoprogrammer: How about just nationalize it instead of pushing legislation allowing the insurance companies to profit?

Because a) the Republicans and Medicare recipients shiat their pants over that idea and b) we were in a recession at the time and the insurance industry would have had mass layoffs.


All this talk about Republicans.  Not one single Republican voted for it.  So, can you please stop blaming Republicans?  They had nothing to do with Obamacare. It's 100% Democrat.  For good or ill.
 
2014-03-31 12:56:37 PM  

verbaltoxin: Summercat: Comic Strips?

Yeah that makes more sense. I don't know comic strips very well.


Neither do I; I just don't think there was a Pearls before Swine animation, whereas I know that's a comic. I know Boondocks started as one, and I think there was a Rugrats one. Don't know the others and I haven't read the comics section in years.
 
2014-03-31 12:57:45 PM  

pnome: atomic-age: machoprogrammer: How about just nationalize it instead of pushing legislation allowing the insurance companies to profit?

Because a) the Republicans and Medicare recipients shiat their pants over that idea and b) we were in a recession at the time and the insurance industry would have had mass layoffs.

All this talk about Republicans.  Not one single Republican voted for it.  So, can you please stop blaming Republicans?  They had nothing to do with Obamacare. It's 100% Democrat.  For good or ill.


Was this before or after the ACA was amended/altered in accordance with negotiation with Republicans who then said "No" to the entire deal?
 
2014-03-31 12:58:19 PM  
Less than a million people actually lost health insurance indirectly because of the ACA. There has been a net gain of 9.5 million insured Americans.

Link
 
2014-03-31 12:58:51 PM  

Jackson Herring: seriously you guys missed like half of them


I suck at these things more than people think I suck... other things.

That's a lot.
 
2014-03-31 12:58:58 PM  

Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?


now THAT is awesome.
 
2014-03-31 01:00:27 PM  

Epic Fap Session: Less than a million people actually lost health insurance indirectly because of the ACA. There has been a net gain of 9.5 million insured Americans.

Link


A quick read of the link doesn't say if the people who lost their plans were rolled over automagically to other plans, as I recall being done a few months ago.
 
2014-03-31 01:00:34 PM  
Healthcare.gov has been spamming my inbox for weeks, and if you click in unsubscribe there is no way to actually unsubscribe on the website.  Intentional?
 
2014-03-31 01:01:29 PM  

CruJones: Healthcare.gov has been spamming my inbox for weeks, and if you click in unsubscribe there is no way to actually unsubscribe on the website.  Intentional?


I think that's healthcare.cx.
 
2014-03-31 01:02:13 PM  

Summercat: Complex shiat needs comex rules and we live in a complex society. You are kidding yourself if you think simple answers will be flexable enough to work.


Systems get more complex as they get more intrusive and controlling.  When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair.  The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.  If you want to exclude a necessity like food, that's a pretty simple fix.   If you venture into property taxes, income taxes, and corporate taxes, that will be much more complex.  But when you start passing out favors to various constituent groups and campaign donors is when it explodes beyond comprehension.  There is no way a rational tax code requires 5000 sections just in Title D.  The result is a tax code that is incomprehensible even to those whose job it is to administer it.

The sheer size and complexity of the Affordable Care Act is what will doom it to failure.  Add to that the seemingly weekly changes, delays, waivers, new regulations and there won't even be an agency capable of knowing what the law is, let alone actually administer it.
 
2014-03-31 01:02:15 PM  
Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.
 
2014-03-31 01:02:44 PM  
barry has been focused like a laser beam on his signature scheme for about 5 years. That's why obamacare is so great. Yes lies were told about keeping your plan, keeping your doctor, saving you money, costing under a trillion at only 900 billion. The most transparent administration can't tell anyone how many obamacare sign ups actually paid, how many signups are young/healthy types, how many signups got kicked off plans and had to get obamacare. This is because most Americans are too stupid to understand how great obamacare is. It has to be great because barry has been telling us how great it is for years. Dems only had to spend about 600 million tax dollars promoting it. That's less than 600 Super Bowl commercials. That alone should tell you how great obamacare is. It's darn near perfect if you ask me. It's so great that every single democrat in congress voted for obamacare. That includes all the Senators up for reelection in the fall of 2014. They wouldn't support this knowing their cushy political careers were in jeopardy if it wasn't great.
Get your lazy selves in gear and sign up for this free healthcare. It only costs about $250 - $1000 a month. Think of it as paying your fair share.
If you don't sign up, then you're a RACIST!
 
2014-03-31 01:03:16 PM  
img.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-31 01:03:52 PM  

the_immoral_minority: Wait until the employer mandate kicks in, almost everyone who works for a living will only be able to afford a $5000 deductible plan. That's a tax folks, the largest in the history of our country.




Aren't you special.

googledrive.com
 
2014-03-31 01:05:09 PM  

Serious Black: xanadian: FTFA:  An administration spokesman said the website is usually offline for maintenance overnight, and was brought down for four extra hours by a technical glitch

Good thing there isn't a deadline or anything that could end up costing individual taxpayers $95 or 1% of their annual income, whichever is higher...

*facepalm*

/of course, there's something to be said for not procrastinating, but still

Once again, I ask who the hell was actually awake and desperate to work on their health insurance application at 3:30am? I can understand being desperate to work on it today at some point, but in the wee hours of the morning?


Why would you even risk an update on the night of a deadline...........................
 
2014-03-31 01:05:49 PM  

Launch Code: barry has been focused like a laser beam on his signature scheme for about 5 years. That's why obamacare is so great. Yes lies were told about keeping your plan, keeping your doctor, saving you money, costing under a trillion at only 900 billion. The most transparent administration can't tell anyone how many obamacare sign ups actually paid, how many signups are young/healthy types, how many signups got kicked off plans and had to get obamacare. This is because most Americans are too stupid to understand how great obamacare is. It has to be great because barry has been telling us how great it is for years. Dems only had to spend about 600 million tax dollars promoting it. That's less than 600 Super Bowl commercials. That alone should tell you how great obamacare is. It's darn near perfect if you ask me. It's so great that every single democrat in congress voted for obamacare. That includes all the Senators up for reelection in the fall of 2014. They wouldn't support this knowing their cushy political careers were in jeopardy if it wasn't great.
Get your lazy selves in gear and sign up for this free healthcare. It only costs about $250 - $1000 a month. Think of it as paying your fair share.
If you don't sign up, then you're a RACIST!



Game shows
 
2014-03-31 01:06:15 PM  

MechaPyx: My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.


i'm sorry your representatives cared more about grandstanding, misinforming the general public and sticking it to the dirty Libs rather than your personal needs.
 
2014-03-31 01:06:30 PM  

whistleridge: Because one rich douchebag trying and failing to score political points is a good point of measure for the whole system?

Even if everything goes perfectly, millions are going to miss the deadline. It's unavoidable. A bunch are going to plausibly claim they were unable to comply for technical reasons. Will they be penalized?

I doubt it. Next year, yes. But not during the trial year.


The penalties start low for a reason.   1% of income this year.   Which isn't even a child tax credit.
 
2014-03-31 01:06:47 PM  

MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.


If you have no or low income, there is no penalty for you.
 
2014-03-31 01:06:54 PM  

Summercat: Epic Fap Session: Less than a million people actually lost health insurance indirectly because of the ACA. There has been a net gain of 9.5 million insured Americans.

Link

A quick read of the link doesn't say if the people who lost their plans were rolled over automagically to other plans, as I recall being done a few months ago.


From the article (which is a summary of a study): Fewer than a million people who had health plans in 2013 are now uninsured because their plans were canceled for not meeting new standards set by the law, the Rand survey indicates.
 
2014-03-31 01:08:23 PM  

whistleridge: mrshowrules: If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.

So the problem is that is only reducing the uninsured?  Not clear on what your point is.

Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to.  Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

Finally, every single American benefits from the consumer protections in Obamacare, not to mention the fringe economic benefits of having your health care security detached from your employer, not to mention the likely reduction in medical bankruptcies going forward.

To say there are still many uninsured is short sighted.  Also, moving the goal post because the actual GOP guarantee was actually that Obamacare was going to destroy the country and cause 1,000 years of darkness

I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick ...


I'm going to go with BS.
Just plugged in a *hypothetical* 28 yo on 22k year income.  Bronze plan @ less than 80 per month.
 
2014-03-31 01:09:03 PM  

Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?


Thank you Jesus! That was beautiful! Where does this Cruz Moran get all his support?
 
2014-03-31 01:11:45 PM  
Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.
 
2014-03-31 01:11:57 PM  

bunner: We're 17,000,000,000,000.00 in debt and we're still cutting checks.  Mostly to the people who already have whatever actual wealth is left in their sock drawers.  This ain't gonna fix sh*t.


All they have left is this half hearted hate.  Can't even get excited about our debt or call this a tyrannical government takeover.  Just... meh... this doesn't help.. *kicks dirt around a little*
 
2014-03-31 01:12:10 PM  

Leader O'Cola: whistleridge: mrshowrules: If I recall, Obama ran on the idea that 30 million people were not covered by health insurance.  How is an enrollment goal of 7 million by today going to solve it for the others?  Isn't this kinda of a minor milestone since, years after passage, most of those 30 million are still going to be uncovered?

This is strange.  Maybe there weren't 30 million in need.  Or maybe people just can't be trusted to get their own coverage...even when spoon fed and forced to at tax penalty point.

So the problem is that is only reducing the uninsured?  Not clear on what your point is.

Keep in mind that this represents millions of people who couldn't get insurance before but wanted to.  Not sure on the precise number but for these people, Obamacare is actually a rainbow shiatting unicorn.

Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

Finally, every single American benefits from the consumer protections in Obamacare, not to mention the fringe economic benefits of having your health care security detached from your employer, not to mention the likely reduction in medical bankruptcies going forward.

To say there are still many uninsured is short sighted.  Also, moving the goal post because the actual GOP guarantee was actually that Obamacare was going to destroy the country and cause 1,000 years of darkness

I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick ...

I'm going to go with BS.
Just plugged in a *hypothetical* 28 yo on 22k year income.  Bronze plan @ less than 80 per month.


That's the bare minimum. Search 32, 2 kids, pre-existing condition. It's still a very valid price, but...not if you're the kind of person who is looking to duck.
 
2014-03-31 01:13:32 PM  

Skleenar: Launch Code: barry has been focused like a laser beam on his signature scheme for about 5 years. That's why obamacare is so great. Yes lies were told about keeping your plan, keeping your doctor, saving you money, costing under a trillion at only 900 billion. The most transparent administration can't tell anyone how many obamacare sign ups actually paid, how many signups are young/healthy types, how many signups got kicked off plans and had to get obamacare. This is because most Americans are too stupid to understand how great obamacare is. It has to be great because barry has been telling us how great it is for years. Dems only had to spend about 600 million tax dollars promoting it. That's less than 600 Super Bowl commercials. That alone should tell you how great obamacare is. It's darn near perfect if you ask me. It's so great that every single democrat in congress voted for obamacare. That includes all the Senators up for reelection in the fall of 2014. They wouldn't support this knowing their cushy political careers were in jeopardy if it wasn't great.
Get your lazy selves in gear and sign up for this free healthcare. It only costs about $250 - $1000 a month. Think of it as paying your fair share.
If you don't sign up, then you're a RACIST!


Game shows


lol nice!
 
2014-03-31 01:13:46 PM  

williesleg: Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.


Are you suggesting people don't understand the difference?
 
2014-03-31 01:14:08 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-31 01:15:22 PM  

williesleg: Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.


This is your big entrance?  This is what you waited all morning to post?  This?
 
2014-03-31 01:15:23 PM  

Level5: Well this is what Im seeing when I try to login. Cool stuff, thanks obama.

[img.fark.net image 800x346]


God! That looks like something James O"Keefe and his ilk would have done to hack the site.
The GOPac should cover their tracks better.
 
2014-03-31 01:16:46 PM  

Summercat: pnome: atomic-age: machoprogrammer: How about just nationalize it instead of pushing legislation allowing the insurance companies to profit?

Because a) the Republicans and Medicare recipients shiat their pants over that idea and b) we were in a recession at the time and the insurance industry would have had mass layoffs.

All this talk about Republicans.  Not one single Republican voted for it.  So, can you please stop blaming Republicans?  They had nothing to do with Obamacare. It's 100% Democrat.  For good or ill.

Was this before or after the ACA was amended/altered in accordance with negotiation with Republicans who then said "No" to the entire deal?


Also the whole ACA is based on RomneyCare in MA which was first conceptualized by the very conservative Heritage foundation in 1989 as a "market based solution" for universal healthcare.
 
2014-03-31 01:17:06 PM  

whistleridge: I'm going to go with 'when you're working for $11/hr, paying an average of $1300 for rent with 3 roommates, have a car payment, a student loan payment/kids to feed/both, and zero savings, an extra couple hundred a month for health insurance is one hit to your wallet that you will avoid for as long as possible'. It's not that people are stupid, lazy, or disinterested in their health, it's that the real problems of today (my roommate didn't pay rent, I need $450 TODAY) outweigh the potential problems of tomorrow (I could get sick).


Also...it's complicated. TOO complicated.

Make it cheap, make it easy, and you incentivize people to buy in. Right now, it's pricey, it's complicated, and there's no real penalty for ducking...so they will. I'd bet $5 on it.


1.bp.blogspot.com

"Why don't you just ask your parent's for the money? Or sell some stock, that's what I did when I was 'broke' in college!"

 
2014-03-31 01:18:33 PM  

JusticeandIndependence: williesleg: Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.

This is your big entrance?  This is what you waited all morning to post?  This?


Yep!

Been on the phone all morning with my health insurance company because they refuse to pay my hospital stay.  Thanks Obamacare.
 
2014-03-31 01:21:10 PM  

BeesNuts: adamatari: Why is there even an "enrollment period"? Isn't it part of the point of this that people can get healthcare without having to worry about "sorry you can only sign up once a year, so you have to wait 9 months now, newby"? Or is this for tax purposes - "you missed the period, so now you have to pay the tax for the year, though you signed up a day later"?

What about people who lose their jobs randomly and such? If I lose my job in May, will I be able to sign up for Obamacare or do I have to wait until January of next year?

This is the sort of shiat we were trying to get away from....

Things like getting married, having a baby, getting a giant raise, losing your job, or dying can dramatically effect your healthcare and tax situation.  News at 11.

Snark off/

Perviously, if you lost your job randomly, your options include COBRA or Medicaid.  If you lost your job, or really underwent any serious life-changing event, you get an individual enrollment period.  As it stands, I think you can enroll whenever through the exchange, it's just that we've attached a tax penalty to failure to enroll.  A penalty which demands some kind of deadline before it can be enforced.  They're being extraordinarily fair on this.

Like.  Unbelievably reasonable over a $95 dollar tax.  Imagine if the parking authority were this understanding about how you didn't move your car from a handicapped spot for three days cause you were 'busy'.  Or better yet because you have a religious opposition to catering to the handicapped and therefore can't recognize handicapped spots...


The problem is that they are being to reasonable.  Are sure hope they have the flexibility of regularly increasing tax penalty.  If the mandate has no teeth, it will hurt the framework the law requires to obtain the goals it needs to.
 
2014-03-31 01:21:28 PM  

williesleg: JusticeandIndependence: williesleg: Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.

This is your big entrance?  This is what you waited all morning to post?  This?

Yep!

Been on the phone all morning with my health insurance company because they refuse to pay my hospital stay.  Thanks Obamacare.


Single payer would fix that.
 
2014-03-31 01:21:28 PM  

williesleg: Been on the phone all morning with my health insurance company because they refuse to pay my hospital stay. Thanks Obamacare.


Obama's fault your private insurance company are assholes?
History's greatest monster.
 
2014-03-31 01:21:50 PM  
Nevermind the website, can they get some more jackasses to work at Experion for today? Maybe extend their hours so I can have a chance at proving my identity before they close up shop since their hours pretty much coincide with my work hours. Seriously should've used a 24 hour help line not a daylight central time only place.


There GOP use that in a campaign ad as a real life obamacare horror story you don't have to make up. Even though that really isn't bad just the timing sucks on my part.
 
2014-03-31 01:21:57 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Carn: It's awesome that you can work your whole life, paying insurance premiums and making them oodles of money, and then finally when you get really sick and need real care they kick you to the curb and piss on your head and then people cheer them for it.

Reminds me of this:

[comicsidontunderstand.com image 720x666]


That made me laugh.
 
2014-03-31 01:22:15 PM  

BeesNuts: bunner: We're 17,000,000,000,000.00 in debt and we're still cutting checks.  Mostly to the people who already have whatever actual wealth is left in their sock drawers.  This ain't gonna fix sh*t.

All they have left is this half hearted hate.  Can't even get excited about our debt or call this a tyrannical government takeover.  Just... meh... this doesn't help.. *kicks dirt around a little*


Your projector is making that *fip fip fip fip * noise like when the reel is empty.
 
2014-03-31 01:22:20 PM  

Leader O'Cola: I'm going to go with BS.
Just plugged in a *hypothetical* 28 yo on 22k year income. Bronze plan @ less than 80 per month.


You got that far before calling BS? Paying $1300 for rent with 3 roommates didn't do it? Do you know a lot of people making $11/hr paying 74% of their gross income to live in $5200/month apartments?
 
2014-03-31 01:22:33 PM  

MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.


Mr. Right: Summercat: Complex shiat needs comex rules and we live in a complex society. You are kidding yourself if you think simple answers will be flexable enough to work.

Systems get more complex as they get more intrusive and controlling.  When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair.  The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.  If you want to exclude a necessity like food, that's a pretty simple fix.   If you venture into property taxes, income taxes, and corporate taxes, that will be much more complex.  But when you start passing out favors to various constituent groups and campaign donors is when it explodes beyond comprehension.  There is no way a rational tax code requires 5000 sections just in Title D.  The result is a tax code that is incomprehensible even to those whose job it is to administer it.

The sheer size and complexity of the Affordable Care Act is what will doom it to failure.  Add to that the seemingly weekly changes, delays, waivers, new regulations and there won't even be an agency capable of knowing what the law is, let alone actually administer it.


So that's two, TWO more supporters for single payer, ah-ah-ah.

Launch Code: barry has been focused like a laser beam on his signature scheme for about 5 years. That's why obamacare is so great. Yes lies were told about keeping your plan, keeping your doctor, saving you money, costing under a trillion at only 900 billion. The most transparent administration can't tell anyone how many obamacare sign ups actually paid, how many signups are young/healthy types, how many signups got kicked off plans and had to get obamacare. This is because most Americans are too stupid to understand how great obamacare is. It has to be great because barry has been telling us how great it is for years. Dems only had to spend about 600 million tax dollars promoting it. That's less than 600 Super Bowl commercials. That alone should tell you how great obamacare is. It's darn near perfect if you ask me. It's so great that every single democrat in congress voted for obamacare. That includes all the Senators up for reelection in the fall of 2014. They wouldn't support this knowing their cushy political careers were in jeopardy if it wasn't great.
Get your lazy selves in gear and sign up for this free healthcare. It only costs about $250 - $1000 a month. Think of it as paying your fair share.
If you don't sign up, then you're a RACIST!


THREE single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!!
 
2014-03-31 01:22:56 PM  

williesleg: JusticeandIndependence: williesleg: Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.

This is your big entrance?  This is what you waited all morning to post?  This?

Yep!

Been on the phone all morning with my health insurance company because they refuse to pay my hospital stay.  Thanks Obamacare.


What does that have to do with healthCARE?
 
2014-03-31 01:24:06 PM  

whistleridge: That's the bare minimum. Search 32, 2 kids, pre-existing condition. It's still a very valid price, but...not if you're the kind of person who is looking to duck.


How can someone with a pre-existing condition find fault with Obamacare?  Let me guess, you only want to change the parts of Obamacare that aren't good for you?
 
2014-03-31 01:24:37 PM  

williesleg: Funny how everybody's in a rush to get health INSURANCE.

Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.


FOUR single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!
 
2014-03-31 01:25:25 PM  

thurstonxhowell: Leader O'Cola: I'm going to go with BS.
Just plugged in a *hypothetical* 28 yo on 22k year income. Bronze plan @ less than 80 per month.

You got that far before calling BS? Paying $1300 for rent with 3 roommates didn't do it? Do you know a lot of people making $11/hr paying 74% of their gross income to live in $5200/month apartments?


Only ones who have their parents paying the bills.
 
2014-03-31 01:25:48 PM  

sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]


FIVE single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!
 
2014-03-31 01:26:52 PM  

DamnYankees: So the site was down or a few minutes and its a headline?


I always knew your political arguments were bad, but they never suspected you of not being able to discern hours from minutes.
 
2014-03-31 01:27:07 PM  

Mr. Right: Summercat: Things get complex for a reason.

And that reason is that big campaign donors want tax breaks tailored to their situation and they get them.  Another reason:  politicians design tax codes in order to get themselves and/or their party re-elected.

To believe otherwise is naive.


The biggest reason is that people do everything they can to find loopholes and exploit them. And once something to close the loophole is put in the code, someone looks for another way around that.

Sure there are plenty of credits and deductions (which create more oppotunitirs for people and businesses to work around the law), but they are also the most efficient way for the government to encourage or discourage certain activities instead of instituting a whole new system. For example, in this case, all you need is a few lines on your tax return. To do it not through taxes you would have to set up a whole new system of enforcement.
 
2014-03-31 01:28:03 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: Carn: It's awesome that you can work your whole life, paying insurance premiums and making them oodles of money, and then finally when you get really sick and need real care they kick you to the curb and piss on your head and then people cheer them for it.

Reminds me of this:

[comicsidontunderstand.com image 720x666]


Yep, pretty much this.
 
2014-03-31 01:28:46 PM  

MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.


As has been pointed out several times so far, if you have no job or income, you are exempt from the penalty. Feel free to keep not having insurance.
 
2014-03-31 01:29:57 PM  

Mr. Right: Summercat: Complex shiat needs comex rules and we live in a complex society. You are kidding yourself if you think simple answers will be flexable enough to work.

Systems get more complex as they get more intrusive and controlling.  When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair.  The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.



...

Hey, rest of Fark?

How do you argue with something as stupid as a brick wall?
 
2014-03-31 01:31:02 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: williesleg: Wait 'till they find out health INSURANCE is NOT health CARE.

Are you suggesting people don't understand the difference?


I had a friend who was so proud to get insurance for his kids and only had to pay $14 a month for 3 kids up to $100,000 each!

He wanted to take them to the doctors...  I said you bought LIFE insurance  not health insurance..
 
2014-03-31 01:32:00 PM  

verbaltoxin: sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]

FIVE single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!


You ever notice how now some of the Republicans shills are all now screaming that ACA is a failure because it isn't a single payer system, and we need a single payer system? Remember before ACA was signed into law that these same people were screaming that any government subsidized health insurance program, especially a single payer system, was evil socialism and needed to be abolished? Kinda of funny how now they are all screaming for a single payer system, something that they were dead against and something that ACA is transitioning us into, all of a sudden.
 
2014-03-31 01:33:24 PM  

Mr. Right: When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair. The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.


Really?  unless you are already set with filet mignon and your house  and your kid going to a very private school and not sales taxes , the rest goes to investments and a capital gains tax.    Nice gig if you can get it.
 
2014-03-31 01:33:26 PM  

James!: So after tomorrow when the world doesn't end do you think republicans will stop being such morons?


No.
 
2014-03-31 01:35:04 PM  

ongbok: verbaltoxin: sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]

FIVE single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!

You ever notice how now some of the Republicans shills are all now screaming that ACA is a failure because it isn't a single payer system, and we need a single payer system? Remember before ACA was signed into law that these same people were screaming that any government subsidized health insurance program, especially a single payer system, was evil socialism and needed to be abolished? Kinda of funny how now they are all screaming for a single payer system, something that they were dead against and something that ACA is transitioning us into, all of a sudden.


They're screaming for it but don't realize they are. They still jack off to fantasies about a free market system that would only cover people with tons of money and nobody else, because there's no profit in covering poor and/or sick people. But supposedly churches and cash-only doctors will make up for or something, I don't know.

The thing is, once more boomers retire and can't stretch the 401ks that got flushed down the toilet in 2008, you'll see more conservatives coming around to what should've been passed five years ago.
 
2014-03-31 01:35:14 PM  

Best Princess Celestia: When was it operable?


Aren't you special.
Don't ever stop being you.

25.media.tumblr.com
 
2014-03-31 01:35:34 PM  
Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.
 
2014-03-31 01:36:46 PM  

riverwalk barfly: Mr. Right: When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair. The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.

Really?  unless you are already set with filet mignon and your house  and your kid going to a very private school and not sales taxes , the rest goes to investments and a capital gains tax.    Nice gig if you can get it.


Simple people want simple solutions, and it all sounds nice and fair!

And quite honestly? It's attractive. It would almost work well! Except, well... how goes the saying a friend gave me...

"I want to go to Theory! Everything works there."

(Now, if it were a tax on every transmission of money from one entity to another... maybe).
 
2014-03-31 01:36:59 PM  

Skleenar: dunes bury


This one was my favorite.
 
2014-03-31 01:37:44 PM  
Just wait till the death panels kick in on those folks who chose not to play.

//lude
 
2014-03-31 01:38:23 PM  

bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.


I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex
 
2014-03-31 01:38:34 PM  

namegoeshere: MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.

As has been pointed out several times so far, if you have no job or income, you are exempt from the penalty. Feel free to keep not having insurance.


I find it funny how all critics originally complained how many pages the law had.  Now they are secretly pissed off that all their bullshiat arguments are dealt with in all the complex provisions of the law.
 
2014-03-31 01:39:15 PM  

MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.


Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?
 
2014-03-31 01:39:29 PM  

MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.


From my understanding, if you make under 10k you're exempt, if you're in a state that didn't acceot Medicaid expansion and you would have qualified for that, you're exempt as well.
 
2014-03-31 01:39:48 PM  

Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions


I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.
 
2014-03-31 01:40:50 PM  

JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex


Really, why's that, then?  Specifically.
 
2014-03-31 01:41:54 PM  

bunner: Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions

I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.


Yes, it was quite doppish of us to get for that.
 
2014-03-31 01:41:58 PM  

bunner: a lot of people get paid for what's in the fine print.


FIFM
 
2014-03-31 01:42:12 PM  

lude: Just wait till the death panels kick in on those folks who chose not to play.

//lude


That's not how works.  The unemployed people not paying the penalty will be drafted to become the adjudicators on the death panels.  They are the ones who will decide how long Nana gets to live.  Ironically the job comes with free health insurance.
 
2014-03-31 01:43:07 PM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.


Ohio state constitution:
21 (A) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall compel, directly or indirectly, any person, employer, or health care provider to participate in a health care system. (emphasis mine)
(B) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall prohibit the purchase or sale of health care or health insurance.
(C) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall impose a penalty or fine for the sale or purchase of health care or health insurance.
(D) This section does not affect laws or rules in effect as of March 19, 2010; affect which services a health care provider or hospital is required to perform or provide; affect terms and conditions of government employment; or affect any laws calculated to deter fraud or punish wrongdoing int he health care industry.

Obamacare was signed into law four days later, on the 23rd.
 
2014-03-31 01:43:31 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?


It is true, most of the guys on Fark live in their mom's basement.
 
2014-03-31 01:44:40 PM  

sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]


fc03.deviantart.net
If you like our herp, you are going to love our derp.
 
2014-03-31 01:45:05 PM  

MechaPyx: Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.

How dumb are you?  Because you sound pretty dumb to me.  If you don't have an income then you'll either be put on Medicaid or you will get a subsidy that will pay for your insurance.  Jesus Christ.  This law was passed years ago.  Take five minutes and learn about it, you rock.

Read the bolded part. Medicaid is not an option for me and it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

So I'm stuck needing an extra couple grand a year I don't have and my only option is to ask relatives to lend it to me.


Why did you qualify that statement with, "It's my understanding that..."? If you were confident that this was the truth, you would have just stated it as fact. That you weakened your statement with a qualifier tells us that you're really not sure at all. You are complaining about your situation before you have gotten all the facts and know exactly what your situation is.

Stop it. Go do the research.
 
2014-03-31 01:46:43 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?


I think he was told that either by the Koch Brothers or by an email that had 8 or 9 FW: in the subject line.
 
2014-03-31 01:47:31 PM  

JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex


Sounds spot on to me. Maybe the percentage is off, but it's all about profit to them and their people do everything they can to find any problems in claims to reject it, even the companies that handle medicaid do everything they can to reject paying out.
 
2014-03-31 01:48:24 PM  

mrshowrules: sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]

[fc03.deviantart.net image 850x566]
If you like our herp, you are going to love our derp.


I have no problem with a fair and equitable tax base, properly used.  Call me when we have one.,
 
2014-03-31 01:49:01 PM  
The slogan for Healthcare.gov is "Take your health care into your own hands." 

Yes, by putting the government in control of it.  What a huge relief!
 
2014-03-31 01:49:20 PM  

bunner: Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions

I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.


If they're very bright and lucid, yet still want a simple solution to a complex problem, then I submit they are being very simple minded.
 
2014-03-31 01:49:36 PM  

Miss Alexandra: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Ohio state constitution:
21 (A) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall compel, directly or indirectly, any person, employer, or health care provider to participate in a health care system. (emphasis mine)
(B) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall prohibit the purchase or sale of health care or health insurance.
(C) No federal, state, or local law or rule shall impose a penalty or fine for the sale or purchase of health care or health insurance.
(D) This section does not affect laws or rules in effect as of March 19, 2010; affect which services a health care provider or hospital is required to perform or provide; affect terms and conditions of government employment; or affect any laws calculated to deter fraud or punish wrongdoing int he health care industry.

Obamacare was signed into law four days later, on the 23rd.


Yeah, good luck with that.
Sounds like something a moron who thinks the sun travels around the Earth would say.
 
2014-03-31 01:49:40 PM  

bunner: JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex

Really, why's that, then?  Specifically.


I tore my Achilles's last year. Had surgery a week later. Total out of pocket:

$250 deductible
$35 initial copay for diagnosis
$300 in copays for physical therapy.

They paid the rest without issue.
 
2014-03-31 01:49:43 PM  

KellyX: JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex

Sounds spot on to me. Maybe the percentage is off, but it's all about profit to them and their people do everything they can to find any problems in claims to reject it, even the companies that handle medicaid do everything they can to reject paying out.


Precisely.  Can anybody explain to me why, in any sense of the alleged services and prctices offered, a hospitla needs a CEO?
 
2014-03-31 01:49:50 PM  

GWSuperfan: $3000/mo premiums (pre-ACA) were a little steep. $275/mo (now) I can handle though.


Wow. That's serious awesome right there.
 
2014-03-31 01:50:15 PM  
Man, I think that FOX "news" is going to have some kind of meltdown. News of the website overload and therefore complete failure of Obamacare and therefore his entire Presidency is  even pushing their regular coverage of the Bengazhi "scandal" off its regular 10 minute rotation.
 
2014-03-31 01:51:22 PM  

Deftoons: Yes, by putting the government in control of it.


Good luck getting rid of Medicare and Tricare. I'm sure those constituents will love your twirling towards freedom.
 
2014-03-31 01:51:23 PM  

KellyX: JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex

Sounds spot on to me. Maybe the percentage is off, but it's all about profit to them and their people do everything they can to find any problems in claims to reject it, even the companies that handle medicaid do everything they can to reject paying out.


Since the law states that they must use 80% of all premiums to pay out medical claims wouldn't it be counterproductive to pay people specifically to avoid paying out medical claims?
 
2014-03-31 01:51:32 PM  

Deftoons: The slogan for Healthcare.gov is "Take your health care into your own hands." 

Yes, by putting the government in control of it.  What a huge relief!


The government controls all that private insurance companies?
 
2014-03-31 01:52:18 PM  

sdd2000: Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?

I think he was told that either by the Koch Brothers or by an email that had 8 or 9 FW: in the subject line.


We laugh but it really is that bad. Insurance brokers, especially ones in states that didn't take Medicaid expansion or create state exchanges, are doing very well right now sitting down with FW:FW:FW: readers and Facebook hoax believers. They're taking them onto Healthcare.gov (Which that person could've done at home for free, now the broker gets a cut) and putting their info into the forms so they can see what plans they can buy.

Some of these customers have expressed shock at learning that not only is the site "Obamacare," ALL insurance is "Obamacare." So you have people who actually believe Obamacare is a separate, government program like Medicare or Medicaid. They have NO idea the ACA is a law designed to provide private health insurance plans to as many people as possible. That's how deep the derp goes. Some have slurped the derp so much, they don't even know what they're herping about.

/I heard it on NPR if you want a source.
 
2014-03-31 01:52:37 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-31 01:52:47 PM  

Summercat: bunner: Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions

I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.

If they're very bright and lucid, yet still want a simple solution to a complex problem, then I submit they are being very simple minded.


I submit that the problem isn't that complicated to begin with but it's a lot moe profitable to view it as one, because simplifying it means dismantling the appurtenant underbrush of gymnastic bullsh*t that doesn't serve anything but a failed status quo.
 
2014-03-31 01:53:03 PM  

Summercat: ..

Hey, rest of Fark?

How do you argue with something as stupid as a brick wall?


1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2014-03-31 01:53:32 PM  
You don't suppose the procrastination generation has anything to do with clogging the pipe do you?

I'd read the article but it won't load because the tubes are clogged.
 
2014-03-31 01:53:54 PM  

Deftoons: The slogan for Healthcare.gov is "Take your health care into your own hands." 

Yes, by putting the government in control of it.  What a huge relief!


SIX single payer supporters, ah-ah-ah!!
 
2014-03-31 01:54:22 PM  

R.A.Danny: James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.

That's my point. Why is there an enumerated penalty if there's no "legal" way to collect?


It's like the inefficient incandescent lightbulb ban. Republicans succeeded, in one of the recent budget bills, to remove funding for enforcing the import and manufacture bans.

So, it's still illegal to import or manufacture inefficient incandescent light bulbs, but since there is no funding to pay for the enforcement, you're only going to be able to prosecute a case if you have other charges pending.

The law is still there, but there are no teeth.
 
2014-03-31 01:55:22 PM  
And now that it loaded... those farkers are using a mobile layout? FFS!

So long NBC, welcome to 0.0.0.0
 
2014-03-31 01:56:34 PM  
TV News:  "Your deadline to enroll in Health Insurance for next year's taxes is tomorrow."
50% of Republican base: "You mean it wasn't declared unconstitutional?!"
Other 50%: "You mean it wasn't repealed?!"
***Around the country, 55 million Real Americans all try to access the website at once***
Healthcare.gov: Whoa, a million at a time, please!
 
2014-03-31 01:58:31 PM  

bunner: Summercat: bunner: Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions

I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.

If they're very bright and lucid, yet still want a simple solution to a complex problem, then I submit they are being very simple minded.

I submit that the problem isn't that complicated to begin with but it's a lot moe profitable to view it as one, because simplifying it means dismantling the appurtenant underbrush of gymnastic bullsh*t that doesn't serve anything but a failed status quo.


You can simplify the problem if you decide to just steamroll everything. Remove all tax credits and deductions, treat everything as the same, have a flat income tax - and you end up with a fairly useless system that does more harm than good.

We have these things for a reason; they make our society work and be workable. There's a reason there's different ways to run businesses and they're all treated differently under tax code, there's a reason we treat married couples differently from single, or parents from childless.

Unless you're challenging the entire concept of subsidies, credits, penalties, exemptions, etc that has arisen in response to need, demand, and the course of history as being "needlessly complex", and at that point I'd call you a fool. :\
 
2014-03-31 01:58:46 PM  

Witty_Retort: coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.

Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.


Tell ya what, I'm saving $3600 a year. I'll send you $300 to get you up to that $2500 that he promised. Deal?
 
2014-03-31 01:59:09 PM  

Summercat: Mr. Right: Summercat: Complex shiat needs comex rules and we live in a complex society. You are kidding yourself if you think simple answers will be flexable enough to work.

Systems get more complex as they get more intrusive and controlling.  When it comes to taxes, a sales tax is pretty fair.  The more money you have to spend, the more money you get charged in taxes.


...

Hey, rest of Fark?

How do you argue with something as stupid as a brick wall?


i.imgur.com


Use a Sledge Hammer?
 
2014-03-31 01:59:19 PM  
Alright, what happens if you enroll......tomorrow? or next week?  What if you are a broke student now, but may have a paying gig in 4 months?
 
2014-03-31 02:00:12 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: Alright, what happens if you enroll......tomorrow? or next week?  What if you are a broke student now, but may have a paying gig in 4 months?


You can't enroll until next November because there is a limited enrollment period.

https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/open-enrollment-period/
 
2014-03-31 02:00:27 PM  
Half hour until I'm off work. I need some more shills to turn up so I can make it to ten.
 
2014-03-31 02:01:34 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?


Yes I tried. It was the healthcare.gov site that was telling me I didn't qualify for a subsidy because someone else in the household had coverage through their employer. I'm still unclear on household income vs my specific income affecting what I qualify for. I called to get some answers but they're understandably busy at the moment. They said they'd call back in 5-7 business days. I'll be pleasantly surprised if they do actually call back.
 
2014-03-31 02:04:01 PM  

whistleridge: pre-existing condition...



And we're done.
 
2014-03-31 02:04:16 PM  

jst3p: KellyX: JusticeandIndependence: bunner: Insurance companies don't provide health care.  They provide rooms full of people who get paid to make sure your claim doesn't.  This is because health care is about a 3,000 % markup across the board for everything.  Medicine is an industry and like most industries, it's primary goal is to move money towards that indsutry and keep it.  If you get better in the process, oh happy day.

I'll take a bunch of crap that isn't true for $100, Alex

Sounds spot on to me. Maybe the percentage is off, but it's all about profit to them and their people do everything they can to find any problems in claims to reject it, even the companies that handle medicaid do everything they can to reject paying out.

Since the law states that they must use 80% of all premiums to pay out medical claims wouldn't it be counterproductive to pay people specifically to avoid paying out medical claims?


I don't know the current ACA law inside and out, so if it says that, fine, I agree that's what it's supposed to do. But I'm assuming that's what it's supposed to do post March 31st and that for the last 40+ years they haven't done that at all and everything said by bunnerand myself are probably correct or very near to it.

I know first hand that I've had to fight tooth and nail for my Girlfriend and her child, who are on Medicaid, to get them to pay out for medicine the doctor prescribed them.

The doctor was trying to find meds that WORKED for my GF and it took 2 tries to find some that WORKED for her. But the insurance company refused to pay and demanded the doctor try another type prior to using the one that worked, because you know meds that affect the brain are great to swap around constantly, right?

The doctor sent every goddamn piece of paper and notes to show this is solving the issue, nope... Not going to pay... Why? Because fark you, that's why!
 
2014-03-31 02:04:16 PM  

Summercat: You can simplify the problem if you decide to just steamroll everything. Remove all tax credits and deductions, treat everything as the same, have a flat income tax - and you end up with a fairly useless system that does more harm than good.


Sounds like a very limited view of alternatives.  Then again, if you mean GE, Monstanto, Koch Inc. and military contractors, I'll oink up gas money for the steamroller.  What's so f*cking difficult about a society that values actual wealth creation, taxes all the money that moves around - even for the untouchable corporate whorehouses - and then untilizes the revenue to serve the needs of the governed?  What page in the rocket surgery manual isn't in my .pdf?
 
2014-03-31 02:04:40 PM  

kidgenius: Tell ya what, I'm saving $3600 a year. I'll send you $300 to get you up to that $2500 that he promised. Deal?


I only saved $1700, so, if you send him the $300, me $800, and keep $2500 for yourself, we'll all be even! This is a good plan. You should do it.
 
2014-03-31 02:05:26 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: Alright, what happens if you enroll......tomorrow? or next week?  What if you are a broke student now, but may have a paying gig in 4 months?


If you are broke now, you use subsidies until you get money?
 
2014-03-31 02:06:51 PM  

Summercat: Unless you're challenging the entire concept of subsidies, credits, penalties, exemptions, etc that has arisen in response to need, demand, and the course of history as being "needlessly complex", and at that point I'd call you a fool. :\


Which is sort of a coincidence, because if you could assert with a straight face that a hopelessly gymnastic and unfair tax system is not only useful but necessary, at that point I'd call you a clinical imbecile, or worse, a congressman.   :  /
 
2014-03-31 02:07:37 PM  

bunner: What's so f*cking difficult about a society that values actual wealth creation, taxes all the money that moves around - even for the untouchable corporate whorehouses - and then untilizes the revenue to serve the needs of the governed?


Fundamental disagreement on what qualifies as "wealth creation" and "the needs of the governed"?
 
2014-03-31 02:07:40 PM  

MechaPyx: Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?

Yes I tried. It was the healthcare.gov site that was telling me I didn't qualify for a subsidy because someone else in the household had coverage through their employer. I'm still unclear on household income vs my specific income affecting what I qualify for. I called to get some answers but they're understandably busy at the moment. They said they'd call back in 5-7 business days. I'll be pleasantly surprised if they do actually call back.


They don't... When I first applied for everything in the beginning, I had a job... I lost it a month or so later, tried contacting them, since there is no method for updating your income at that time (don't know if there still is) they said they'd get back to me... Never did...
 
2014-03-31 02:07:49 PM  
Health Care Army!
 
2014-03-31 02:08:27 PM  

MechaPyx: Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

Who told you that?  Have you even tried to get insurance on the exchange?

Yes I tried. It was the healthcare.gov site that was telling me I didn't qualify for a subsidy because someone else in the household had coverage through their employer. I'm still unclear on household income vs my specific income affecting what I qualify for. I called to get some answers but they're understandably busy at the moment. They said they'd call back in 5-7 business days. I'll be pleasantly surprised if they do actually call back.


"Household" means insurable family unit. Whomever you live with would only affect your insurance if you qualified to be covered under their insurance, i.e. a parent, and you are still young enough for them to cover you under their policy. If that's the case, you should be on their policy. If you live with an uncle or a sibling or something, their insurance coverage does not affect your eligibility in the slightest, because they can not put you on their policy.
 
2014-03-31 02:08:42 PM  

MechaPyx: Yes I tried. It was the healthcare.gov site that was telling me I didn't qualify for a subsidy because someone else in the household had coverage through their employer. I'm still unclear on household income vs my specific income affecting what I qualify for.


This person in your household, are you married to them?  Are they your parents?
 
2014-03-31 02:09:35 PM  

qorkfiend: bunner: What's so f*cking difficult about a society that values actual wealth creation, taxes all the money that moves around - even for the untouchable corporate whorehouses - and then untilizes the revenue to serve the needs of the governed?

Fundamental disagreement on what qualifies as "wealth creation" and "the needs of the governed"?


I'm pretty sure that "juggling debt derivatives" and "upgrading stealth bombers while people sit at the kitchen table with 140,000.00 hospital bills" is neither.
 
2014-03-31 02:09:40 PM  

MBrady: Witty_Retort: MBrady: Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).

then make sure you tell all the news media that, because that is precisely what they are calling it.  Signing up for 0bamacare.

The only people I've ever seen call it Zero-bamacare are idiots.

The only people that blindly followed someone usually drank Kool-Aid laced with cyanide.

The only people that whine about insignificant crap are usually 12 year old school girls.  Are you one of those?


It was Flavor-Aid. History, FTW!
Cry moar over being called out.
 
2014-03-31 02:10:16 PM  

namegoeshere: MechaPyx: Soup4Bonnie: MechaPyx: Sign up for healthcare or they're going fine me. Yeah sure. I don't have any money so go for it. Fine me. See if you can get blood from a stone. And because of my circumstances no I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy. My state is one of those that didn't extend Medicaid among other things.

Seriously, mandating that I have to buy stuff when I have no job or income is not helping. Excuse the fark out of me for being poor.

How dumb are you?  Because you sound pretty dumb to me.  If you don't have an income then you'll either be put on Medicaid or you will get a subsidy that will pay for your insurance.  Jesus Christ.  This law was passed years ago.  Take five minutes and learn about it, you rock.

Read the bolded part. Medicaid is not an option for me and it's my understanding that because I live under the roof of a relative who does earn a wage and has health coverage through their employer I don't qualify for any kind of subsidy.

So I'm stuck needing an extra couple grand a year I don't have and my only option is to ask relatives to lend it to me.

Why did you qualify that statement with, "It's my understanding that..."? If you were confident that this was the truth, you would have just stated it as fact. That you weakened your statement with a qualifier tells us that you're really not sure at all. You are complaining about your situation before you have gotten all the facts and know exactly what your situation is.

Stop it. Go do the research.


Admittedly I'm not familiar with all the intricacies of insurance so I'm in the process of finding out lots of little details that I've never really had to deal with before. I find the whole thing extremely irritating. This is me being irritable. And venting.
 
2014-03-31 02:10:40 PM  

MBrady: BeesNuts: MBrady: Somacandra: You don't "sign up" for "Obamacare." The Federal and State exchanges merely facilitate the purchase of existing private insurance for those not already otherwise covered, or refer you to the existing Medicaid structure (if your state isn't run by asshats).

then make sure you tell all the news media that, because that is precisely what they are calling it.  Signing up for 0bamacare.

I can't help it that you love being lied to.  Get over that hurdle yourself.

there is much derpness in this one.

no don't watch fox news asshole.  the local news this morning was talking about the 0bamacare mobile that was sitting in some parking lot over the weekend signing up people for 0bamacare, jackass.


Let me rephras.  I can't help it that you listen to how the news tells you the news and care that they're a little loose with terminology.  That we call it Obamacare at all is stupid.  We've been saying it's stupid for a while now, but you know what, we stopped caring.  And if everybody wants to run around biatching about how long the bill is and how reading is hard and how they don't understand the law and how this and that, I find it hard to continue caring.

I cared for a nice long while.  I tried to correct the misinformation.  Hell, I wrote into my local newspaper to complain about the mischaracterization of the process.  No response.  I believe you when you say you're not a fox viewer, I'm familiar enough with your history here to buy that.  What I find confusing is that you're perpetuating a lie you seem to agree... is a lie.  Simply put, you're not helping.  If you're not helping at this point, I'm writing you off as a paid shill who is trying to FUD the waters up.  Sorry.  You're not in good company here.

Soma tried, as I have tried before, to correct this misunderstanding of what the ACA does, and instead of going "preach it brother" you go "but that's what the teevee tells me!"  and I'm supposed to think you're on the up and up?  Sorry bud.  Deal with it.
 
2014-03-31 02:11:05 PM  
Relax...they probably just need to load-balance traffic on the router.

4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2014-03-31 02:11:57 PM  

bunner: qorkfiend: bunner: What's so f*cking difficult about a society that values actual wealth creation, taxes all the money that moves around - even for the untouchable corporate whorehouses - and then untilizes the revenue to serve the needs of the governed?

Fundamental disagreement on what qualifies as "wealth creation" and "the needs of the governed"?

I'm pretty sure that "juggling debt derivatives" and "upgrading stealth bombers while people sit at the kitchen table with 140,000.00 hospital bills" is neither.


All joking aside, there are a lot of people who think "upgrading stealth bombers" and other national security expenditures are much more of a "need for the governed" than affordable medical care.
 
2014-03-31 02:13:04 PM  

bunner: mrshowrules: sritzhaupt: [img.fark.net image 402x337]

[fc03.deviantart.net image 850x566]
If you like our herp, you are going to love our derp.

I have no problem with a fair and equitable tax base, properly used.  Call me when we have one.,


Every Conservative supports a fair tax.  They just have a very ignorant perspective when it comes to defining what is fair.
 
2014-03-31 02:14:42 PM  

qorkfiend: All joking aside, there are a lot of people who think "upgrading stealth bombers" and other national security expenditures are much more of a "need for the governed" than affordable medical care.


And those people have kool aid on their chins and weeping eagle T-Shirts and like to pick fights in bars. caus "Murka!".  And are astoundingly bad at not only cost benefit analysis, but grasping the whole point of life on earth.
 
2014-03-31 02:15:11 PM  

bunner: Summercat: bunner: Summercat: Simple people want simple solutions

I would assert that very bright and lucid people want simple solutions and there is a misguided notion that straightforward, elegant  and effective solutions are surely the work of the doppish and ignorant because a lot of people get for what's in the fine print.

If they're very bright and lucid, yet still want a simple solution to a complex problem, then I submit they are being very simple minded.

I submit that the problem isn't that complicated to begin with but it's a lot moe profitable to view it as one, because simplifying it means dismantling the appurtenant underbrush of gymnastic bullsh*t that doesn't serve anything but a failed status quo.


Seeing as healthcare/pharmaceutical research is the only industry I'm willing to concede is complicated enough that it give my plans to abolish copyright law when I'm in charge pause...  I'm gonna say yeah, it's actually that complicated.

\The human body is crazy yo.
 
2014-03-31 02:18:33 PM  

BeesNuts: Seeing as healthcare/pharmaceutical research is the only industry I'm willing to concede is complicated enough that it give my plans to abolish copyright law when I'm in charge pause...  I'm gonna say yeah, it's actually that complicated.

\The human body is crazy yo.


Not as crazy complicated as the notion that if a tehnology is extant that improves the quality of life, it is the duty of humanity to immediately install a turnstile and start shopping for Bentleys.  The only reason that we are not up to our tits in polio is because Jonas Salk practiced medicine and not amateur stock brokery.
 
2014-03-31 02:18:35 PM  

stuff12345: [img.fark.net image 400x400]


fartmode is the greatest
 
2014-03-31 02:19:23 PM  

qorkfiend: bunner: qorkfiend: bunner: What's so f*cking difficult about a society that values actual wealth creation, taxes all the money that moves around - even for the untouchable corporate whorehouses - and then untilizes the revenue to serve the needs of the governed?

Fundamental disagreement on what qualifies as "wealth creation" and "the needs of the governed"?

I'm pretty sure that "juggling debt derivatives" and "upgrading stealth bombers while people sit at the kitchen table with 140,000.00 hospital bills" is neither.

All joking aside, there are a lot of people who think "upgrading stealth bombers" and other national security expenditures are much more of a "need for the governed" than affordable medical care.


I'm arguing with him, but don't agree on that. Especially considering we never demobilized from World War Two.

However, the majority of what he's complaining about isn't what he's bringing up, and the majority of it doesn't apply to most people. Anyone who files a 1040EZ or a 1040A is fairly damn simple. People who need to fill out one of the other forms... have a more complex situation, so if we're going to try to build a fair and progressive tax system, we need to take their complex situations into account.

And this isn't even getting to subsidies for industries (I'm certain we do want to keep food prices low while keeping farmers and agrobusiness in business, as an example, yes?), subsidies to encourage behaviors deemed beneficial to society (charity work, donations), or benefits towards families (Altered burden on married couples, child tax credits).

COULD THE TAX CODE BE SIMPLIFIED? Maybe. Possibly. But to say that because it is complex it therefore must be overly complex and therefore can be simplified a lot, is to ignore the reasonings and arguments that brought it to this situation.

The tax code could probably do with a large overhaul to streamline changes that had creeped in over time. I had to rewrite the chat channel rules for said website I used to admin. Doing so didn't change the complextivity of the rules, but it made them much clearer without all the addendums and updates tacked on.
 
2014-03-31 02:19:53 PM  

MechaPyx: Admittedly I'm not familiar with all the intricacies of insurance so I'm in the process of finding out lots of little details that I've never really had to deal with before. I find the whole thing extremely irritating. This is me being irritable. And venting.


You will have much less stress and anxiety in your life if you take the time to breathe and find out the facts of whatever situation is upsetting you before you go fighting monsters of your own creation.

/things my mother told me
//wish I had listened then instead of learning the hard way
///things I tell my children to which they probably aren't listening
////it's the circle of liiiiiiiiife....
 
2014-03-31 02:21:37 PM  

namegoeshere: MechaPyx: Admittedly I'm not familiar with all the intricacies of insurance so I'm in the process of finding out lots of little details that I've never really had to deal with before. I find the whole thing extremely irritating. This is me being irritable. And venting.

You will have much less stress and anxiety in your life if you take the time to breathe and find out the facts of whatever situation is upsetting you before you go fighting monsters of your own creation.

/things my mother told me
//wish I had listened then instead of learning the hard way
///things I tell my children to which they probably aren't listening
////it's the circle of liiiiiiiiife....


The monsters under my bed were never there.

They were campaigning on the Republican ticket. :/
 
2014-03-31 02:22:47 PM  

Epic Fap Session: From the article (which is a summary of a study): Fewer than a million people who had health plans in 2013 are now uninsured because their plans were canceled for not meeting new standards set by the law, the Rand survey indicates.


No plans were canceled for not meeting new standards.  Any old plan could have been continued by any insurer as long as they didn't significantly change the terms of the plan themselves.  If the insurer insisted on changing the deductible, max out-of-pocket, or the premiums by an amount not approximating inflation, then they had to meet the terms of all new plans.

However, if you liked your old plan you can keep it! The only caveat is that your old insurer must continue to sell you your old plan.  If they choose not to sell you the old plan, there's nothing the government can do to force them to.
 
2014-03-31 02:28:48 PM  

R.A.Danny: Serious Black: R.A.Danny: And tomorrow there will be hundreds of thousands more criminals in the US. YAY!

Section 5000A(g)(2) of Subtitle D of the IRS Code of 1986 says that no taxpayer can be subjected to criminal prosecution or have a lien or levy filed against their property for failure to pay the individual shared responsibility payment.

Tell Obama that.


He didn't say there wasn't a penalty. He said for all practical purposes, it's unenforceable. That was highlighted back when the USSC ruling came down as one of the huge weaknesses heart might kill the ACA.
 
2014-03-31 02:30:39 PM  

bunner: BeesNuts: Seeing as healthcare/pharmaceutical research is the only industry I'm willing to concede is complicated enough that it give my plans to abolish copyright law when I'm in charge pause...  I'm gonna say yeah, it's actually that complicated.

\The human body is crazy yo.

Not as crazy complicated as the notion that if a tehnology is extant that improves the quality of life, it is the duty of humanity to immediately install a turnstile and start shopping for Bentleys.  The only reason that we are not up to our tits in polio is because Jonas Salk practiced medicine and not amateur stock brokery.


This is word salad.  I tried.  I really did.  I'm curious about your point of view because I suspect we agree on lots, but this makes no sense to me.

Salk was actively discouraged from research into vaccination for his entire career.  Partly because he was Jewish.  But he did it anyway cause that's what mattered to him.  I'm not sure what that has to do with funding research into drugs, or with building the costs of that research into our health insurance premiums.
 
2014-03-31 02:35:16 PM  

BeesNuts: I really did.  I'm curious about your point of view because I suspect we agree on lots, but this makes no sense to me.


As soon as we develop something that improves the quality of human life, sort of the whole point of the species since we can use language and critical thinking and sh*t, we immediately make it about moving pieces of paper around, much to the consternation of of the people who haven't got a lot of pieces of paper.  This is widely held to be a rather self-defeating form of idiots delight in some circles.
 
2014-03-31 02:43:07 PM  

bunner: BeesNuts: I really did.  I'm curious about your point of view because I suspect we agree on lots, but this makes no sense to me.

As soon as we develop something that improves the quality of human life, sort of the whole point of the species since we can use language and critical thinking and sh*t, we immediately make it about moving pieces of paper around, much to the consternation of of the people who haven't got a lot of pieces of paper.  This is widely held to be a rather self-defeating form of idiots delight in some circles.


What is your ideal replacement for the "piece of paper" motivation?
 
2014-03-31 02:43:53 PM  

thurstonxhowell: dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".

Go to ehealthinsurance.com right now. Just the front page. Take a look at what it says.


I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance.  (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.
 
2014-03-31 02:46:06 PM  

kidgenius: Witty_Retort: coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.

Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.

Tell ya what, I'm saving $3600 a year. I'll send you $300 to get you up to that $2500 that he promised. Deal?


Without being snarky, can you spell out for me how you are saving $3,600 a year?
 
2014-03-31 02:47:19 PM  

Jackson Herring: obamacare isn't a service you can sign up for, I hope this helps


I'm still waiting for my Obamacare card in the mail.
 
2014-03-31 02:49:09 PM  

dok9874: I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.


Haha!  Thanks for the laugh.

dok9874: And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance.  (they didn't quite think that one through).


Stop!  I'm going to choke!
 
2014-03-31 02:51:49 PM  

thurstonxhowell: BeesNuts: dok9874: I just got laid off, so that's my Hardship #14. Not sure how I'm going to provide documentation of not receiving a paycheck anymore though.

File for unemployment.  They typically confirm with your employer that you were really laid off, and they include a statement about your earnings, and the date of your last paycheck in the info packets they mail you.

Whether you qualify or not it's a convenient way to obtain proof that you're unemployed as far as the state is concerned.

He should probably receive info about COBRA regardless. Granted, it probably doesn't make financial sense to go with COBRA now that the exchanges exist, but that packet should have enough info to prove the recent change in employment status. Also, if he "just got laid off", then he can head on over to the exchange website and sign up without having to bother with any of this. This guy's not trying to get answers, he's trying to spread FUD.


Jiminy cricket clearly I should have added a /sarc.

/No COBRA because my employer didn't offer me health insurance
//still have no desire to sign up for Obamacare
///think it will be politically expedient for Obama to wave his magic wand and waive/delay the individual mandate/penalty/tax/shared responsibility payment like he's done 38 other times with the LAW
 
2014-03-31 02:52:00 PM  

dok9874: But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.


I agree, the best criticisms of the PPACA are completely made up scenarios.
 
2014-03-31 02:52:21 PM  
Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...
 
2014-03-31 02:55:00 PM  

Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...


Everyone needs health insurance.
 
2014-03-31 02:58:13 PM  

Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...


You don't have a job? That means your income is under 10K a year, which means you're exempt.
 
2014-03-31 02:58:29 PM  

jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.


Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!
 
2014-03-31 02:58:32 PM  

dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.


You will not find a site that will tell you that you absolutely cannot buy insurance outside the enrollment period because that is not true. What you will find on the site that you used as an example is this:

"After March 31, you cannot purchase a health insurance plan unless you have a qualifying life event, such as getting married or divorced, having or adopting a child, or moving to a new coverage area. "

Is that clear enough for you? As for the rest of your post, if it's true, look for a better plan. The cheapest one to buy might not be the cheapest one to use. Look into the details of the plan. Many of the nice ones cover you for a lot of things before the deductible.
 
2014-03-31 03:02:12 PM  

dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance.  (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.


Does it bother you at all that nearly every problem you have with new healthcare law has turned out to be false? Does that make you want to research it a little more? If you can't afford it, then you probably qualify for a subsidy. If you don't qualify for a subsidy because you make too much money and you are choosing not to be covered, that's just irresponsible. You say you will pay for your health care with cash, but what happens when you end up in the ICU for 2 weeks on a respirator? Who pays for that? The 12K is a drop in the bucket compared to the expense of trauma, cancer, etc. You may not need insurance for the sniffles, but you will need it when you need your leg rebuilt with screws.

The problem with people like you is that when you can't pay, the hospital absorbs the cost. Then when people who do have insurance go to the hospital, they pay higher prices. It's as if you are shoplifting healthcare and everyone else has to eat the cost.

You can choose not to have insurance, but you can't choose not to have healthcare. Not unless you would just suffer and die from a compound fracture when all you needed was a visit to the ER.
 
2014-03-31 03:02:51 PM  

Born_Again_Bavarian: jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.

Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!


No, everyone needs health CARE.  insurance companies need health insurance.
 
2014-03-31 03:03:57 PM  

Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...


If you have no income, you're exempt from the penalty.  But you can probably still get extremely affordable insurance through either medicare or exchange subsidies, if you aren't an idiot willing to risk life and limb just to stick it to libruls.
 
2014-03-31 03:04:42 PM  

jst3p: Everyone needs health insurance.


Bill Gates probably doesn't.

Daraymann: So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.


it's not every month, it is a tax that is assessed against your next year's Federal taxes.  Colorado expanded medicaid, so you are probably covered by that or you will get a government subsidy to cover your premium.  You may call it welfare if you like, but you just look silly.  The reason you are mandated to have individual coverage is because at some point in your life you will need health care and won't be able to afford.  That you don't think this is the case also makes you look very silly.  So does that picture in your profile; silly.
 
2014-03-31 03:06:12 PM  

Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...


OhmyfarkingGod are we still doing this?

If.
You.
Are.
Unemployed.
And/
Or.
Insurance.
Would.
Be.
8%.
Or.
More.
Of.
Your.
Income.
Or.
Your.
Income.
Is.
Below.
The.
Threshold.
For.
Filing.
Taxes.
You.
Are.
Exempt.
 
2014-03-31 03:06:20 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: jst3p: Everyone needs health insurance.

Bill Gates probably doesn't.


I bet he still has it.
 
2014-03-31 03:07:05 PM  

Born_Again_Bavarian: jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.

Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!


WELL, I've been to the doctor one time in the last 15 years, cost $80.  That's much cheaper then $200 a month.  Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.  Now help  me understand where the leeching off the system comes in or are you just being a derpy libtard?
 
2014-03-31 03:07:55 PM  

Summercat: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...


You don't have a job? That means your income is under 10K a year, which means you're exempt.


Not only exempt, but you may qualify for medicare if your state decided to expand the program... thanks to the ACA.

Also love the slashy name calling after an ignorant and self contradicting post.
 
2014-03-31 03:08:29 PM  

bunner: Born_Again_Bavarian: jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.

Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!

No, everyone needs health CARE.  insurance companies need health insurance.


Fair enough but in his profile it looks like he is 40+. Under the current system he needs health insurance.
 
2014-03-31 03:09:26 PM  

dok9874: thurstonxhowell: dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".

Go to ehealthinsurance.com right now. Just the front page. Take a look at what it says.

I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance. (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.


How about "un-signing up" by not paying the premium?
 
2014-03-31 03:10:20 PM  

Daraymann: Born_Again_Bavarian: jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.

Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!

WELL, I've been to the doctor one time in the last 15 years, cost $80.  That's much cheaper then $200 a month.  Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.


You, good sir, make much sense. Why, I have had homeowners insurance on my residence for the last 20 years and it has never caught fire! I should cancel it because clearly I do not need it!

 Now help  me understand where the leeching off the system comes in or are you just being a derpy libtard?

Because when you do catch fire you will bankruptcy out of your medical bills and we all get to pay for you, mooch.
 
2014-03-31 03:13:40 PM  

Daraymann: Born_Again_Bavarian: jst3p: Daraymann: Right now, I don't have a job and can't afford, nor do I need, health insurance.  So I have to either go on welfare or pay a fine every month and still not have health insurance.

/farking liberals...

Everyone needs health insurance.

Nuh-uh.  I plan on leeching off the system and other rate payers like a good bootstrappy Republican!

WELL, I've been to the doctor one time in the last 15 years, cost $80.  That's much cheaper then $200 a month.  Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.  Now help  me understand where the leeching off the system comes in or are you just being a derpy libtard?


When you do suffer something serious, and you will eventually - everyone does, if you are planning to lie down and die instead of seeking treatment, then no, you don't need insurance. If, on the other hand, you plan to seek some sort of medical treatment to attempt to survive the medical problem, or even for palliative care, then yes, you need insurance or you will be sticking everyone else with your medical bills that you will be completely unable to pay.
 
2014-03-31 03:14:12 PM  

jst3p: I bet he still has it.


Sure.  He's not an idiot.  I know an idiot when I see one.

Daraymann: Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.


Ca-caw!  Ca-caw!
 
2014-03-31 03:15:12 PM  

Daraymann: WELL, I've been to the doctor one time in the last 15 years, cost $80.  That's much cheaper then $200 a month.  Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.  Now help  me understand where the leeching off the system comes in or are you just being a derpy libtard?


I've never died, why the hell do I need life insurance?!?!

$200 a month is a DROP in the BUCKET compared to the real traumatic events. If you paid that much for 20 years, it would still be cheaper than a couple weeks in ICU. Or god forbid you ever need to be airlifted somewhere, that runs 15K+ ... then when you get to the hospital, those injuries tend to be of the six figure variety. Strokes, Cancer, heart attacks, or any other thing that is likely to happen to you if you live long enough can cost more than what you pay in several years just by being diagnosed.

The thing is, when you show up to the ER with your pelvis crushed, they don't just let you die because you don't have insurance. The doctors will perform life saving procedures on you and will keep you admitted for a couple weeks (month+ maybe) and then when you are discharged with $100K+ in medical bills, the hospital will absorb the cost. All because YOU decided that $200 a month was too much... well if you contribute that much for 40 years it won't be $100K.
 
2014-03-31 03:15:48 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: jst3p: I bet he still has it.

Sure.  He's not an idiot.  I know an idiot when I see one.

Daraymann: Me needing insurance is my decision, not a bunch of follow the leader government officials.

Ca-caw!  Ca-caw!


this post made me laugh in an out loud manner
 
2014-03-31 03:16:14 PM  

Daraymann: Me needing insurance is my decision


Unless you are a superhero, no, it is not. Because when you get sick or hurt and end up in the emergency room, the rest of us pick up the tab. You do not live in a universe until yourself. Your lack of action affects the rest of us. So show some personal responsibility and get insured.
 
2014-03-31 03:25:09 PM  

sdd2000: How about "un-signing up" by not paying the premium?


... or just cancel the plan. Why in the shiatting fark would the ACA need to include a provision to allow you to cancel your plan? Just cancel it. Call up your insurer and say "I no longer have need of your services, thank you". The ACA also doesn't have a provision to take your dick out and point it at something you don't mind getting piss on before you drain the lizard. Apparently, that means this guy's been pissing his pants for the past 4 years.
 
2014-03-31 03:26:27 PM  

simkatu: Epic Fap Session: From the article (which is a summary of a study): Fewer than a million people who had health plans in 2013 are now uninsured because their plans were canceled for not meeting new standards set by the law, the Rand survey indicates.

No plans were canceled for not meeting new standards.  Any old plan could have been continued by any insurer as long as they didn't significantly change the terms of the plan themselves.  If the insurer insisted on changing the deductible, max out-of-pocket, or the premiums by an amount not approximating inflation, then they had to meet the terms of all new plans.

However, if you liked your old plan you can keep it! The only caveat is that your old insurer must continue to sell you your old plan.  If they choose not to sell you the old plan, there's nothing the government can do to force them to.


Yes? I'm not complaining about ACA shortcomings. I was trying to use available data to respond to a question. 9.5 million insured is an encouraging net gain.
 
2014-03-31 03:26:59 PM  
I was able to finish my enrollment today. I logged in, and saw $180 a month payment! I was like: JESUS, WTF?! It was the catastrophic plan, so I decided to roll the dice and downgrade to a silver plan, costing me roughly $75 a month. I'm fairly poor, but it feels good to finally have insurance. I would NEVER have been able to afford a $200 a month health care plan through a private provider, so we'll see how this goes for me.
 
2014-03-31 03:30:43 PM  

Serious Black: R.A.Danny: James!: R.A.Danny: This one better? It's from the "other" side.

Or is anyone here going to step and tell us that there will be no tax, fine, or other penalty?

From that link.

The only way for the IRS to collect the fee for not having health insurance, if you choose not to pay it, is for them to withhold the money you would get back from the IRS after filing your income tax returns. The IRS cannot enforce the Individual Shared Responsibility provision with jail time, liens, or any other of typical methods of collection.

That's my point. Why is there an enumerated penalty if there's no "legal" way to collect?

Likely because the drafters of that provision knew people who irrationally hate Obama and the Democrats were trying to declare everyone in the country criminals. What they forgot is that people like you would make that argument regardless of knowing whether it is true or false because it fits seamlessly into a pre-existing narrative about how Obama is a megalomaniacal dictator hellbent on remaking America in his image.


Honestly the only criminals in this whole thing are the farking insurance companies who damn near doubled their rates. My Blue Cross policy when from 240 and change to 480 and change every 2 weeks. What part of Affordable didn't they understand?
 
2014-03-31 03:31:53 PM  

Mr.Poops: I was able to finish my enrollment today. I logged in, and saw $180 a month payment! I was like: JESUS, WTF?! It was the catastrophic plan, so I decided to roll the dice and downgrade to a silver plan, costing me roughly $75 a month. I'm fairly poor, but it feels good to finally have insurance. I would NEVER have been able to afford a $200 a month health care plan through a private provider, so we'll see how this goes for me.


*ppssssssst* your health insurance is still through a private provider.
 
2014-03-31 03:32:02 PM  
One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation.  That ACA legislation was then rammed down the throats of Americans by a host of liars telling their lies.  It was then implemented by the inept at the guidance of the inexperienced.  When that liberal finally admits and speaks these truths, other liberals will attack that individual.
 
2014-03-31 03:34:19 PM  

Netrngr: My Blue Cross policy when from 240 and change to 480 and change every 2 weeks


You are paying $960/month?  Are you on the individual market?
 
2014-03-31 03:36:06 PM  
Just wait a few months and we will start hearing horror stories about people who have bought this wonderful insurance and then when they have something besides preventative care, such as a broken arm, they will be horrified when the insurance won't pay for anything until those high deductibles have been reached.  All those people who could not pay for a monthly premium without a subsidy are going to expect the government to bail them out, right?  The hospitals are going to have to write off those losses when those bills aren't paid and so fewer and fewer hospitals will take Obamacare in the following years.  The epic fail continues...
 
2014-03-31 03:36:09 PM  

Tyee: One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation.  That ACA legislation was then rammed down the throats of Americans by a host of liars telling their lies.  It was then implemented by the inept at the guidance of the inexperienced.  When that liberal finally admits and speaks these truths, other liberals will attack that individual.


Instead of making blanket statements like these, maybe you should try to come up with a valid criticism.

Are GOP reps pretty truthful in your eyes?
 
2014-03-31 03:36:13 PM  

Tyee: One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation.  That ACA legislation was then rammed down the throats of Americans by a host of liars telling their lies.  It was then implemented by the inept at the guidance of the inexperienced.  When that liberal finally admits and speaks these truths, other liberals will attack that individual.


One day, we will sit back in the ruins of a nation that manufactures nothing but debt and CEOs, scratching the dirt and fetching drinks for wealthy Chinese businessmen who are enjoying their 50 acre vacation estates in SoCal and say "I can't b'leev we bought all that "Librul libtard / Neo CON Rethuglican horsesh*t all the way until the getaway car left."
 
2014-03-31 03:36:52 PM  

Tyee: One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation.  That ACA legislation was then rammed down the throats of Americans by a host of liars telling their lies.  It was then implemented by the inept at the guidance of the inexperienced.  When that liberal finally admits and speaks these truths, other liberals will attack that individual.


By attack, you mean ask them if they're feeling well, because they're spouting utter nonsense somewhat randomly? That's usually sign of a stroke. :(
 
2014-03-31 03:37:01 PM  

Tyee: One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation


One day? I'm a liberal and I'll tell you that right now. It isn't a liberal plan, sport. You need to recalibrate your political spectrometer. Which isn't to say it's not a step in the right direction, or worse than the nothing we had before.
 
2014-03-31 03:37:36 PM  

thurstonxhowell: dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

You will not find a site that will tell you that you absolutely cannot buy insurance outside the enrollment period because that is not true. What you will find on the site that you used as an example is this:

"After March 31, you cannot purchase a health insurance plan unless you have a qualifying life event, such as getting married or divorced, having or adopting a child, or moving to a new coverage area. "

Is that clear enough for you? As for the rest of your post, if it's true, look for a better plan. The cheapest one to buy might not be the cheapest one to use. Look into the details of the plan. Many of the nice ones cover you for a lot of things before the deductible.


The cheapest bronze plan for my family is $317.71 per month.  It has both individual deductibles ($6,000 each) and a family deductible ($12,700).  It has a special comment that says "you pay nothing after deductible".  Well, I don't have $6000 or $12,700 to pay for medical costs, so this policy is essentially worthless unless, as I've stated before, I get hit my a train.  This one costs me just under 23% of my yearly income.

Or I could go with a gold plan that costs $566.91 a month with $10 copays, individual deductibles of $1500 and a family deductible of $4500.  Even that one I'm still looking at at least $12,302 out of pocket costs for premiums plus deductibles before full coverage kicks in, but I'm still paying co-pays.  It's basic math. This one would cost me just over 22% of my yearly income for the gold plan, and I don't find these numbers under either policy anywhere near "Affordable".

Since paying the penalty is an option, that's the one I'm going with.  And as a previous poster stated, health insurance isn't healthcare, and the increasing costs of health care is a whole 'nother rant.
 
2014-03-31 03:38:29 PM  

WiredMann: Just wait a few months and we will start hearing horror stories about people who have bought this wonderful insurance and then when they have something besides preventative care, such as a broken arm, they will be horrified when the insurance won't pay for anything until those high deductibles have been reached.  All those people who could not pay for a monthly premium without a subsidy are going to expect the government to bail them out, right?  The hospitals are going to have to write off those losses when those bills aren't paid and so fewer and fewer hospitals will take Obamacare in the following years.  The epic fail continues...


What you don't know would take quite some time to explain.
 
2014-03-31 03:40:18 PM  
You know what I think would insure health?  Widely available socialized medicine.  Health insurance ensures income for insurers.  Nothing else.
 
2014-03-31 03:40:50 PM  
I'm in Maryland, so I just tried to browse available plans on Maryland Health Care Connection.  Unlike several weeks ago, the site works!   Entered information for my wife and me.  But the policy browsing page came up with two male icons at the top.  It asked about my health and the health of my male spouse.

Thinking I had failed to designate my spouse was female, I tried again.  Same result.

My GOP friends were right!  Now that Maryland allows same-sex marriage, we're being forced to be gay married!  Will mandatory abortions be next!?!?
 
2014-03-31 03:40:52 PM  

mrshowrules: Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.


img.fark.net

Please explain then how priced effectively double overnight? I'll tell you how. There were no provisions in the law to keep the bastard insurance companies from boosting rates to the moon. Granted we may not worry about someone else going to the ER but instead worry if we can afford it now. Don't get me wrong i think we should have all these provisions and more but there should have been safeguards in place before the laws went into effect. Kinda screwed the pooch on that side of it.
 
2014-03-31 03:41:36 PM  

Netrngr: Honestly the only criminals in this whole thing are the farking insurance companies who damn near doubled their rates. My Blue Cross policy when from 240 and change to 480 and change every 2 weeks. What part of Affordable didn't they understand?


Sounds like you live in a horrible state that lets the insurance companies write the policy rules.
You could petition DHHS to review the increase. The ACA gives them the ability to override burdensome increases and they've already used that power.
 
2014-03-31 03:41:51 PM  

dok9874: thurstonxhowell: dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

You will not find a site that will tell you that you absolutely cannot buy insurance outside the enrollment period because that is not true. What you will find on the site that you used as an example is this:

"After March 31, you cannot purchase a health insurance plan unless you have a qualifying life event, such as getting married or divorced, having or adopting a child, or moving to a new coverage area. "

Is that clear enough for you? As for the rest of your post, if it's true, look for a better plan. The cheapest one to buy might not be the cheapest one to use. Look into the details of the plan. Many of the nice ones cover you for a lot of things before the deductible.

The cheapest bronze plan for my family is $317.71 per month.  It has both individual deductibles ($6,000 each) and a family deductible ($12,700).  It has a special comment that says "you pay nothing after deductible".  Well, I don't have $6000 or $12,700 to pay for medical costs, so this policy is essentially worthless unless, as I've stated before, I get hit my a train.  This one costs me just under 23% of my yearly income.

Or I could go with a gold plan that costs $566.91 a month with $10 copays, individual deductibles of $1500 and a family deductible of $4500.  Even that one I'm still looking at at least $12,302 out of pocket costs for premiums plus deductibles before full coverage kicks in, but I'm still paying co-pays.  It's basic math. This one would cost me just over 22% of my yearly income for the gold plan, and I don't find these numbers under either policy anywhere near "Affordable".

Since paying the penalty is an option, that's the one I'm going with.  And as a previous poster stated, health insurance isn't healthcare, and the increasin ...


You make 17k a year? shiatballs.

Also, as that's over 8% of your income you're not exactly going to have to pay a penalty.
 
2014-03-31 03:43:45 PM  

Somacandra: That would indeed be interesting if it were true. Especially since those with employer-sponsored coverage (like me) are not eligible for any exchange subsidies.


RIght? How bad does that shiat suck BTW.
 
2014-03-31 03:44:00 PM  

tylerdurden217: dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance.  (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.

Does it bother you at all that nearly every problem you have with new healthcare law has turned out to be false? Does that make you want to research it a little more? If you can't afford it, then you probably qualify for a subsidy. If you don't qualify for a subsidy because you make too much money and you are choosing not to be covered, that's just irresponsible. You say you will pay for your health care with cash, but what happens when you end up in the ICU for 2 weeks on a respirator? Who pays for that? The 12K is a drop in the bucket compared to the expense of trauma, cancer, etc. You may not need insurance for the sniffles, but ...


So you're saying that because I've actually gone to the site and compared coverage and prices, that the information is false?  I've done my research Francis.  And yes, I've chosen many times not to have healthcare.  And when I do choose it, I pay for it myself.  Just like they used to do in the olden days.

You make your choices, I make mine.  Just because mine isn't the same as yours doesn't mean squat.
 
2014-03-31 03:44:27 PM  
Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?
 
2014-03-31 03:44:40 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: WiredMann: Just wait a few months and we will start hearing horror stories about people who have bought this wonderful insurance and then when they have something besides preventative care, such as a broken arm, they will be horrified when the insurance won't pay for anything until those high deductibles have been reached.  All those people who could not pay for a monthly premium without a subsidy are going to expect the government to bail them out, right?  The hospitals are going to have to write off those losses when those bills aren't paid and so fewer and fewer hospitals will take Obamacare in the following years.  The epic fail continues...

What you don't know would take quite some time to explain.



That's quite a brilliant response.  I applaud you debate skills.
 
2014-03-31 03:47:43 PM  

sdd2000: dok9874: thurstonxhowell: dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".

Go to ehealthinsurance.com right now. Just the front page. Take a look at what it says.

I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance. (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.

How about "un-signing up" by not paying the premium?


Ah yes, the premiums that are paid by automatic draft from your bank account.  You going to just switch bank accounts?  And that's not "unsigning up", that's welching on the contract where you agreed to pay the premiums.  I'm talking a legitimate way to cancel the policy.
 
2014-03-31 03:47:49 PM  

coffeeplease: kidgenius: Witty_Retort: coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.

Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.

Tell ya what, I'm saving $3600 a year. I'll send you $300 to get you up to that $2500 that he promised. Deal?

Without being snarky, can you spell out for me how you are saving $3,600 a year?


Sure....

Before the exchanges were opened I had two ways I could buy insurance. 1) On the individual market or 2) Through my employer. I have to cover myself, two kids and my wife. Now, my employer's insurance plan would be equivalent to a Gold plan on the exchanges today. On the individual market, insurance wasn't too crazy, but it wasn't great. If I went through my employer, he would cover me, but I had to pay 100% of the premiums for my wife and kids. That was going to be over 1K a month. So what I did was put my kids onto an individual plan, and put my wife onto my employer's plan. I did the latter for my wife because IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE to purchase insurance individual plans that covered maternity (except for the 'complications' coverage). I could not write a check large enough to any of the providers. Humana, No. BCBS, No. Aetna, Hell No. Cigna, LOL No. United Healthcare, Are you kidding? And, this whole debacle began before we had kids five years ago. So, with the knowledge that kids were coming, I had no choice but to put her onto my boss' plan. So, adding up the various costs, I was paying $475 a month for my wife on a gold-equivalent plan, and $380 a month for the two kids on a bronze-level plan after the 1st of the year (was $330 a month throughout 2013). Our new ACA plan which we've had since Jan 1 covers my wife and kids, on a silver-level plan with maternity coverage included (lord help us if another comes along), all for the grand total of $550/month. Yes, our network isn't great, but it does cover my kids pediatrician and it also covers the really nice children's hospital in our area. Our deductibles are much better for things like ER visits (which, by chance, we've had to use twice this year so far), our out-of-pockets are lower for the kids, etc. Hell, the ER visits alone have saved us over a grand vs. what we would have had to pay before. Not to mention other benefits like having free birth control, and one of my wife's medications dropped from $10/month to $2/month. Not sure if that was due to the new insurance, but it first showed up in January when we did the first refill.

Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.
 
2014-03-31 03:48:37 PM  

Netrngr: Please explain then how priced effectively double overnight? I'll tell you how. There were no provisions in the law to keep the bastard insurance companies from boosting rates to the moon. Granted we may not worry about someone else going to the ER but instead worry if we can afford it now. Don't get me wrong i think we should have all these provisions and more but there should have been safeguards in place before the laws went into effect. Kinda screwed the pooch on that side of it.


There is a provision to keep insurance companies from "boosting rates to the moon". Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits. If they don't, then you get a rebate. So the rate increases would be justified or you get a check.
 
2014-03-31 03:48:44 PM  

dok9874: The cheapest bronze plan for my family is $317.71 per month. It has both individual deductibles ($6,000 each) and a family deductible ($12,700). It has a special comment that says "you pay nothing after deductible". Well, I don't have $6000 or $12,700 to pay for medical costs, so this policy is essentially worthless unless, as I've stated before, I get hit my a train. This one costs me just under 23% of my yearly income.


"The cheapest plan to buy might not be the cheapest one to use." You might want to look into what I meant by that.
 
2014-03-31 03:49:34 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Tyee: One day a liberal will admit the ACA was poorly conceived legislation

One day? I'm a liberal and I'll tell you that right now. It isn't a liberal plan, sport. You need to recalibrate your political spectrometer. Which isn't to say it's not a step in the right direction, or worse than the nothing we had before.


You realize if you owed that deductible, you can pay it off in installments right? You can arrange payment plans with the hospitals for like $100/month (or less if you need). Yes, 6k is a lot to come up with for many people in one fell swoop, but you have options there.
 
2014-03-31 03:50:14 PM  

dok9874: Ah yes, the premiums that are paid by automatic draft from your bank account. You going to just switch bank accounts? And that's not "unsigning up", that's welching on the contract where you agreed to pay the premiums. I'm talking a legitimate way to cancel the policy.


Did you ever think about calling them up and cancelling the policy? What the fark went wrong in your brain that made you forget that option?
 
2014-03-31 03:50:50 PM  

GTATL: Are GOP reps pretty truthful in your eyes?


In what regard?  When regarding the ACA?
 
2014-03-31 03:51:33 PM  

tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits.


This is news to me.  Do you have a cite for this?
 
2014-03-31 03:53:17 PM  

bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?


me!  my wife had kidney failure and all the visits to the specialist and dialysis were covered    no issues with prescriptions...  the only problem we had with insurance companies was office workers typing her name wrong and getting rejected..  once the name was fixed..  paid..
 
2014-03-31 03:54:29 PM  

bunner: tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits.

This is news to me.  Do you have a cite for this?


Let me Google that for you.
 
2014-03-31 03:54:47 PM  

bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?


*Raises Hand*

2 day stay for heart issue
torn achilles with physical therapy for two months twice weekly $50 co-pay
wife had a DNC

No issues with billing.  Sorry.
 
2014-03-31 03:55:21 PM  

kidgenius: You realize if you owed that deductible, you can pay it off in installments right? You can arrange payment plans with the hospitals for like $100/month (or less if you need). Yes, 6k is a lot to come up with for many people in one fell swoop, but you have options there.


Wrong person.
 
2014-03-31 03:55:27 PM  

RaiderFanMikeP: bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?

me!  my wife had kidney failure and all the visits to the specialist and dialysis were covered    no issues with prescriptions...  the only problem we had with insurance companies was office workers typing her name wrong and getting rejected..  once the name was fixed..  paid..


God bless ye.  Anybody else?
 
2014-03-31 03:55:29 PM  

dok9874: Ah yes, the premiums that are paid by automatic draft from your bank account. You going to just switch bank accounts? And that's not "unsigning up", that's welching on the contract where you agreed to pay the premiums. I'm talking a legitimate way to cancel the policy.


It varies depending on the PRIVATE INSURER you are buying your insurance through.
My bill goes to my debit card each month.
And you can go to your bank and tell them not to pay out to people who have auto-drafts.
 
2014-03-31 03:56:25 PM  

JusticeandIndependence: No issues with billing.  Sorry.


Don't be.
 
2014-03-31 03:56:51 PM  

WiredMann: I applaud you debate skills.


You should.  I am infinitely better than you at it.

Your post assumes that nobody has ever heard of let alone had to pay a high deductible before.  It fails to address that many people could not even get coverage before and are happy to pay the deductible just so they can get the treatment they weren't getting before.  It also doesn't mention the cap on out of pocket expenses, creates an imaginary scenario where the government is bailing people out and treats "Obamacare" as if it is thing that can be sold or used by hospitals and not a law that creates exchanges for private insurers to offer a product.

And this isn't an "epic fail".  Millions of people now have insurance that couldn't get it before.  There are a bunch of other new benefits, too, but again, I don't have time to explain to you what you should have been learning over the past four years.
 
2014-03-31 03:57:41 PM  

thurstonxhowell: dok9874: Ah yes, the premiums that are paid by automatic draft from your bank account. You going to just switch bank accounts? And that's not "unsigning up", that's welching on the contract where you agreed to pay the premiums. I'm talking a legitimate way to cancel the policy.

Did you ever think about calling them up and cancelling the policy? What the fark went wrong in your brain that made you forget that option?


Dude doesn't want any solutions. He just wants to sit on his balls and holler in pain instead of getting up off of them like everybody suggest that he do.
 
2014-03-31 03:57:55 PM  

kidgenius: Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.

Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.

Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.

Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.

Could it all be better, absolutely, Single-payer-FTW. But this is way better than what we had before.


Bears repeating.
 
2014-03-31 03:58:19 PM  

bunner: Barry, all things considered, has done a few useful things in his tenure.  Which, after all, isn't easy because, at the end of the day, he president is a sock puppet / scapegoat.  Forcing people to buy sketchy insurance from a selection of coporate whorehouses instead of working for socialized medicine, however, is not one of them.  This whole thing stinks to high heaven and when your government starts fining you for not having money, it's time to start packing.


bunner: tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits.

This is news to me.  Do you have a cite for this?


Seriously? Do you know ANYTHING about the PPACA? You should really try and find out a  little bit about it before talking about how crappy it is.
 
2014-03-31 03:58:34 PM  

bunner: tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits.

This is news to me.  Do you have a cite for this?


Sure do...
http://www.cms.gov/CCIIO/Programs-and-Initiatives/Health-Insurance-M ar ket-Reforms/Medical-Loss-Ratio.html
 
2014-03-31 03:59:18 PM  
For all the people white knighting / fine with for profit medicine, has it ever occurred to you that - in light of the fact that we're the only first world nation with for profit health care and not based on equitable tax revenues - that just mayhaps WE'RE the kids on the short bus licking the windows and saying "I wanna be a DOCTOR and make a lot of MONEY!"?
 
2014-03-31 03:59:39 PM  

bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?


Achilles surgery almost exactly a year ago.

Paid deductible and copays. No billing issues.

/BCBS for what it's worth
 
2014-03-31 03:59:41 PM  

dok9874: thurstonxhowell: dok9874: I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

You will not find a site that will tell you that you absolutely cannot buy insurance outside the enrollment period because that is not true. What you will find on the site that you used as an example is this:

"After March 31, you cannot purchase a health insurance plan unless you have a qualifying life event, such as getting married or divorced, having or adopting a child, or moving to a new coverage area. "

Is that clear enough for you? As for the rest of your post, if it's true, look for a better plan. The cheapest one to buy might not be the cheapest one to use. Look into the details of the plan. Many of the nice ones cover you for a lot of things before the deductible.

The cheapest bronze plan for my family is $317.71 per month.  It has both individual deductibles ($6,000 each) and a family deductible ($12,700).  It has a special comment that says "you pay nothing after deductible".  Well, I don't have $6000 or $12,700 to pay for medical costs, so this policy is essentially worthless unless, as I've stated before, I get hit my a train.  This one costs me just under 23% of my yearly income.

Or I could go with a gold plan that costs $566.91 a month with $10 copays, individual deductibles of $1500 and a family deductible of $4500.  Even that one I'm still looking at at least $12,302 out of pocket costs for premiums plus deductibles before full coverage kicks in, but I'm still paying co-pays.  It's basic math. This one would cost me just over 22% of my yearly income for the gold plan, and I don't find these numbers under either policy anywhere near "Affordable".

Since paying the penalty is an option, that's the one I'm going with.  And as a previous poster stated, health insurance isn't healthcare, and the increasin ...



It is far from worthless.  Let's say you get cancer.  After $50,000 in expenses your life is saved.  You front the first $6,000.  Balance: $44,000.  I'm guessing your coinsurance is 30% and your maximum out of pocket is about $12,000.  So for the next $6,000 you pay $1800 while the insurance company pays $4200.  Total out of pocket for you so far: $7,800.  Balance: $38,000.  For the rest the insurance company picks up the tab 100%.  So when all is said and done you will have paid $7,800 while the inusrance company picked up $42,200.

I get that $7,800 is a large bill, but it is less than +$40,000.   And every hospital in America is willing to work with you and a payment plan.

Tell me again how this insurance is worthless?

Based on the numbers you posted your insurance costs would exceed the 8% threshold which means you aren't required to buy insurance.  But also based on your numbers you would probably qualify for a decent subsidy.  Assuming a family of 3 you could possibly get a silver plan for a little over $100/month.  So one or more of the following must be true:

1.   Obvious troll is obvious
2.   You suck at the maths
3.   You haven't done any research on this...........at all
4.   You watch a lot of Fox News
 
2014-03-31 03:59:52 PM  
 
2014-03-31 04:00:18 PM  

tylerdurden217: bunner: tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to spend at least 80-85% of premium dollars on health costs and claims instead of administrative costs and profits.

This is news to me.  Do you have a cite for this?

Sure do...
http://www.cms.gov/CCIIO/Programs-and-Initiatives/Health-Insurance-M ar ket-Reforms/Medical-Loss-Ratio.html


Thanks.
 
2014-03-31 04:00:32 PM  

Netrngr: mrshowrules: Secondly, this reduces the burden on hundreds of millions of responsible insurance holders because they won't have to cover as much in terms of emergency room visits from the uninsured.

[img.fark.net image 500x375]

Please explain then how priced effectively double overnight? I'll tell you how. There were no provisions in the law to keep the bastard insurance companies from boosting rates to the moon. Granted we may not worry about someone else going to the ER but instead worry if we can afford it now. Don't get me wrong i think we should have all these provisions and more but there should have been safeguards in place before the laws went into effect. Kinda screwed the pooch on that side of it.


Not true, there are margins defined where the insurance company can only spend x% on non-claims costs and premium collected over x% above that must be returned to policy holders. CA insurers have already had to pay refunds.
 
2014-03-31 04:03:14 PM  
Is anybody else getting their browsers randomly hijacked here and then needing to click their back button to return to this thread?
 
2014-03-31 04:04:56 PM  
On rate hikes:

Keep in mind that the law has a series of features designed to protect or at least insulate individuals from excessive rate hikes. These include something called the "medical-loss ratio," which limits insurer profits, and various "shock absorbers" designed to compensate carriers that end up with less healthy beneficiaries than they anticipated. Regulators also have power to challenge rate increases, though authority and willingness to use it varies from state to state. Then there are the law's subsidies-those federal tax credits, which provide some consumers with huge discounts. By design, they limit what most marketplace customers will pay for the standard insurance plan, regardless of what that plan actually costs.
 
2014-03-31 04:05:00 PM  

bunner: Is anybody else getting their browsers randomly hijacked here and then needing to click their back button to return to this thread?


You potatoed your browser with all of the derp you have been typing into it.
 
2014-03-31 04:05:56 PM  
Never mind.  I got the old "place where the margin ad is shifts and you clicked on it, ha ha" thing.
 
2014-03-31 04:06:11 PM  

dok9874: sdd2000: dok9874: thurstonxhowell: dok9874: Except that buying insurance directly from the provider, or say through ehealthinsurance.com, doesn't HAVE "enrollment periods".

Go to ehealthinsurance.com right now. Just the front page. Take a look at what it says.

I see a lot of maybes and might nots and no guarantee thats, but I don't see anything that says I absolutely positively will not in any way shape or form be able to get insurance outside of the Obamacare enrollment period.

But it still doesn't matter to me, because I'm STILL not jumping on the idiot bandwagon to pay for a product that would cost me $12,700 out of pocket on top of premiums before any shiat is covered.  I don't have $12,700 plus premiums (which for me adds another $4400 on top of the family deductible), to pay for medical care because shiatty policy doesn't cover shiat.  Not to mention limited networks where you are allowed to use the shiatty policy.  And unless I got hit by a train, it's highly unlikely I'd ever have that much in medical costs in a year, so I'm paying out the wazoo for nothing.  I'd have better luck with a lottery ticket.

I'll hang on to my $17k+ and continue to pay for my healthcare like I always have: with cash.  You get a better rate paying cash rather than using "health insurance" anyway.  The only thing health insurance ensures is that the insurance companies get richer.

And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance. (they didn't quite think that one through).

Thanks, but no thanks.

How about "un-signing up" by not paying the premium?

Ah yes, the premiums that are paid by automatic draft from your bank account.  You going to just switch bank accounts?  And that's not "unsigning up", that's welching on the contract where you agreed to pay the premiums.  I'm talking a legitimate way to cancel the policy.


This is an example of weapons grade ignorance.  Putting this level of derp on display for children under the age of 12 could get you charged with a war crime.
 
2014-03-31 04:06:42 PM  

Netrngr: Please explain then how priced effectively double overnight? I'll tell you how. There were no provisions in the law to keep the bastard insurance companies from boosting rates to the moon. Granted we may not worry about someone else going to the ER but instead worry if we can afford it now. Don't get me wrong i think we should have all these provisions and more but there should have been safeguards in place before the laws went into effect. Kinda screwed the pooch on that side of it.


Of course, insurance premium will continue to rise.  They are rising just as much under Obamacare as they were previously.  That's just the reality of pricing a commodity with an inelastic demand via the free market.

You want health care costs to drop, you need single payer.  Obamacare reduces the worse aspects of the train wreck of a system you had but it is only a stop-gap measure I will conceded.

What Obamacare does, is prevent a growing number of uninsured people passing on their emergency room care to responsible people with insurance.

When sick people go to doctors instead, everyone will save money.
 
2014-03-31 04:06:57 PM  

bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?


Yep. Six high risk pregnancies (two successful) 3 d&c's, much testing including $$$$$$$ genetic testing, frequent sonograms, weekly appointments, referrals to high risk specialists, no problem.

Oh wait. They did at one point send me a letter asking me if I wanted a case manager because my case was complicated. I wrote back and said, no thank you. They said, okay then. Carry on.

BC/BS rocked that way, actually. Then Mr Namegoeshere left that job to start his own company and we could no longer afford them... : (
 
2014-03-31 04:07:30 PM  
dok9874:
And then there's the issue that once you sign up for Obamacare, there is no mechanism to UN-sign up if say, you get a job that offers health insurance.  (they didn't quite think that one through).


Just burn your OBAMACARE CARD!
You do have your 0bamacare card don't you?
 
2014-03-31 04:07:57 PM  
I know math does not bode well among Farkers, but your total monthly premium payment should include the deductable!
The affordable part of this plan is bull shiat!
Single 42 and I'm in the $500+/ month with a $4,000 deductable. Sorry but that's a tad steep for my financial situation at the moment.

/penalty is much cheaper.
//Healthy until I post this then I'll probably end up with a rare form of cancer.
/// hope not!
 
2014-03-31 04:08:10 PM  

Dusk-You-n-Me: Meanwhile, At 49 Percent Support, Obamacare Hits a High


The GOP should be very concerned with this vector.
 
2014-03-31 04:09:32 PM  

ongbok: bunner: Is anybody else getting their browsers randomly hijacked here and then needing to click their back button to return to this thread?

You potatoed your browser with all of the derp you have been typing into it.


Who could possibly bring viable insistance to the contrary to such learned and intellectually acute assertions, fraught with gravitas and 16 year old snapchat junkie gravitas?  Come on Erato, I'm up for a troll banning.  Yours, I mean.   :  )
 
2014-03-31 04:10:17 PM  

meenkya: I know math does not bode well among Farkers, but your total monthly premium payment should include the deductable!
The affordable part of this plan is bull shiat!
Single 42 and I'm in the $500+/ month with a $4,000 deductable. Sorry but that's a tad steep for my financial situation at the moment.

/penalty is much cheaper.
//Healthy until I post this then I'll probably end up with a rare form of cancer.
/// hope not!


Well it also depends how much stuff you have.  In effect, health care insurance is covering everything you own (house, car, etc.)
 
2014-03-31 04:12:30 PM  

namegoeshere: bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?

Yep. Six high risk pregnancies (two successful) 3 d&c's, much testing including $$$$$$$ genetic testing, frequent sonograms, weekly appointments, referrals to high risk specialists, no problem.

Oh wait. They did at one point send me a letter asking me if I wanted a case manager because my case was complicated. I wrote back and said, no thank you. They said, okay then. Carry on.

BC/BS rocked that way, actually. Then Mr Namegoeshere left that job to start his own company and we could no longer afford them... : (


Three examples, so far, and all of them encouraging.  Now imagine what it would be like to only have to walk into any medical faility with proof of citizenship and be covered without cutting an extra check every month to some private company.
 
2014-03-31 04:12:35 PM  

jonnya: I successfully enrolled in a silver Blue Cross plan via the ACA sight last Thursday. The site was fine, but I've yet to receive any type  of confirmation or payment instructions. A littleoff-putting  but I'm figuring they're being bombarded right now. Nonetheless, the Blue Cross has made me a criminal! Don't they want my money?


Blue cross is who we have here and while its fine insurance , don't get me wrong it really kicks ass, our premiums doubled and its on par with that the exchange has so how do you explain a shiat ton of cash rolling in causing costs to double? Really?? Maybe there is something im not seeing but all I see is a shameless money grab based on a law that failed to put in place protections for the people it was intended to help.
 
2014-03-31 04:13:34 PM  

namegoeshere: bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?

Yep. Six high risk pregnancies (two successful) 3 d&c's, much testing including $$$$$$$ genetic testing, frequent sonograms, weekly appointments, referrals to high risk specialists, no problem.

Oh wait. They did at one point send me a letter asking me if I wanted a case manager because my case was complicated. I wrote back and said, no thank you. They said, okay then. Carry on.

BC/BS rocked that way, actually. Then Mr Namegoeshere left that job to start his own company and we could no longer afford them... : (


And I'm not white knighting private for-profit insurance. I am and will continue to be in favor of socialized medicine. But I am well aware that I will probably be dead of extreme old age before we ever see that here (thanks obstructionist GOP) so I am happy with the ACA because it is much much much better than what we had before the ACA.
 
2014-03-31 04:14:51 PM  

mrshowrules: meenkya: I know math does not bode well among Farkers, but your total monthly premium payment should include the deductable!
The affordable part of this plan is bull shiat!
Single 42 and I'm in the $500+/ month with a $4,000 deductable. Sorry but that's a tad steep for my financial situation at the moment.

/penalty is much cheaper.
//Healthy until I post this then I'll probably end up with a rare form of cancer.
/// hope not!

Well it also depends how much stuff you have.  In effect, health care insurance is covering everything you own (house, car, etc.)


Don't have much, but paying another mortgage payment every month is out of the question.

/self employed
//things are getting better.
 
2014-03-31 04:16:34 PM  

mrshowrules: It is fixing the biggest problems with previous system and is making health care insurance more affordable.


img.fark.net
 
2014-03-31 04:17:14 PM  

bunner: Three examples, so far, and all of them encouraging. Now imagine what it would be like to only have to walk into any medical faility with proof of citizenship and be covered without cutting an extra check every month to some private company.


That would be f*cking fantastic! I would love that. I support that fully.

And I know that with the political situation we have here in this country, we are so very far away from seeing that in our lifetimes, as much as I might want it.

The ACA is not perfect. It's not even great. But it's better than the shiat sandwich we had before.
 
2014-03-31 04:18:19 PM  

bunner: RaiderFanMikeP: bunner: Would everybody here who has ever had medical care,a  treatment or prodcedure over and above preventative and had their insurer PAY THE WHOLE THING without being jerked around like a chihuahua on a tow chain, please raise their hands?

me!  my wife had kidney failure and all the visits to the specialist and dialysis were covered    no issues with prescriptions...  the only problem we had with insurance companies was office workers typing her name wrong and getting rejected..  once the name was fixed..  paid..

God bless ye.  Anybody else?


Yup, two kids born, one as a teenager had two stays at Boston Childrens, lots of follow up. No problems with the insurance or scripts. She's now a nurse because of the positive interactions she had through all of it.  I have a kick ass employer covered plan that will probably become part of my taxable income down the road.
 
2014-03-31 04:20:16 PM  
boudicabpi.files.wordpress.com
 
2014-03-31 04:20:53 PM  

mrshowrules: meenkya: I know math does not bode well among Farkers, but your total monthly premium payment should include the deductable!
The affordable part of this plan is bull shiat!
Single 42 and I'm in the $500+/ month with a $4,000 deductable. Sorry but that's a tad steep for my financial situation at the moment.

/penalty is much cheaper.
//Healthy until I post this then I'll probably end up with a rare form of cancer.
/// hope not!

Well it also depends how much stuff you have.  In effect, health care insurance is covering everything you own (house, car, etc.)


So if my house or car gets cancer, I don't need to worry?
 
2014-03-31 04:20:58 PM  

I alone am best: Witty_Retort: I alone am best: Witty_Retort: [1.bp.blogspot.com image 551x844]
[2.bp.blogspot.com image 545x852]
Quick poll: Obamacare was signed into law four years ago yesterday. Are you better off now than you were then?

A bunch of Liberals following a Republican senator on facebook. Seems like a legit commentary from 100% of the country, not a bunch of moonbats who have nothing better to do.

If you had bothered to click the provided link, you would see that those are the top rated comments for his page.
But if a conspiracy is much easier for your simple mind to comprehend then that people actually like the law, go let your freak flag fly.

Oh, I see. That changes things, or it doesnt. Yeah, I am going to just use the same argument I used last time for this post.

/I am guessing you follow Republicans on Facebook.



You do know that some people are so stupid that they allow anyone to post on their feed without necessarily having to like or follow them, right?

/I don't follow, nor like, Cruz and was all over his feed yesterday.
 
2014-03-31 04:22:44 PM  

Witty_Retort: coffeeplease: Waiting patiently to see the $2,500 in cost savings Obama promised I would see.

Considering your comments, I doubt you are an Average American.

/i saved only $2,200 per year, so Obama is a big fat poopyhead liar.


How the hell did you do that? What were you paying a month before? Like I said mine doubled.
 
2014-03-31 04:23:04 PM  
bunner: tylerdurden217: Insurance companies are required to