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(Telegraph)   You know how biofuels like ethanol were supposed to help the environment? About that   (telegraph.co.uk) divider line 15
    More: Interesting, palm oil, sunflowers, cultivation, biofuels, effects of global warming, biodiesel, sugar canes, agricultural land  
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3331 clicks; posted to Geek » on 29 Mar 2014 at 8:39 AM (26 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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NFA [TotalFark]
2014-03-29 09:22:02 AM
4 votes:
Ethanol is a terrible fuel.  It's corrosive to fuel systems.  It's destroys lawn equipment if it sits for 6 months or more.  A buddy of mine does small engine repair and ethanol damage alone has quadrupled his repair sales.

They're right, Ethanol pushes up food prices.  In Mexico, they've had riots because the price of corn flour (a food staple)  has skyrocketed because per bushel price of corn exploded.  Why? Because of the American Ethanol production efforts.  When you put a huge load on a fixed supply the price goes up.

Just before the US started using Ethanol in fuel, the price of corn was around $250 per ton.  A year later????? around $550 per ton.  In 2012 it jumped to $800 per ton.  This has caused a dramatic rise in meat prices and an increase in cost of corn products.
2014-03-29 09:01:41 AM
4 votes:
Doktor_Zhivago:
Apparently the telegraph is confused by nuanced issues such as energy policy

"Nuance" is a modern code word for "I can't really defend this, so I'm going to just pretend I'm so smart I can't explain it."
2014-03-29 08:54:13 AM
4 votes:
Ethanol was never a great solution.  Algae-based biofuels seem a lot more realistic in terms of actual logistics.
2014-03-29 11:15:04 AM
3 votes:
The problem isn't biofuels, it's using stupid-ass crops like corn to make the fuel. Which, itself, is a problem with crooked politicians rigging the agricultural subsidies system for personal gain.
2014-03-29 10:05:27 AM
2 votes:
Remember when california liberals forced MTBE into the gas supply "for the environment"?

/// cleanup for that little escapade is estimated to run around 25-30 billion.
//// yes, with a "b".
2014-03-29 09:23:22 AM
2 votes:
All I know from my time living in Nebraska is that too many people see ethanol as a way to make the Great Plains into the new Arabia. They're close to being correct: It's full of religious nutjobs reliant on one commodity for their success.
2014-03-29 09:09:47 AM
2 votes:

GRCooper: Read a report in the Economist a few years back - it takes 26 or so gallons of water to create 1 gallon of ethanol (versus 1:1 for gasoline )

If true, it doesn't sound viable as a gas replacement - WW3 will be fought over water


When water is used, it is gone forever. This is why the oceans have dried up.
2014-03-29 09:01:03 AM
2 votes:
Read a report in the Economist a few years back - it takes 26 or so gallons of water to create 1 gallon of ethanol (versus 1:1 for gasoline )

If true, it doesn't sound viable as a gas replacement - WW3 will be fought over water
2014-03-29 11:59:14 PM
1 votes:

jso2897: What do you mean "biofuels like ethanol"?
As far as I know, the only biofuel that is "like ethanol" is ethanol.


The main difference is polarized molecules vs. non-polarized molecules.  Dino-fuels are symmetric, with a bunch of hydrocarbons in the middle and a hydrogen on each end.  They want nothing from no one.  Alcohols and other non-symmetric molecules have a positive end and a negative end.  The positive end wants to grab electrons from whatever it runs into - 'oxidation' - and this causes corrosion.

Biofuels are only helpful if you were otherwise going to throw that biomass away.  Once you have to grow biofuel sources on arable land, you've lost the game.  They're like rooftop solar panels - they may make for one or two great anecdotes but they're simply not scalable.  There are too many people.
2014-03-29 01:49:40 PM
1 votes:

Shakin_Haitian: Not all water is from that aquifer. You qualified where the water was coming from. You should have done that in the first place in order to not look like someone who reasons as poorly as a creationist.


So, in your reasoning, the fact that the USA produces between a third and half of the worlds corn, and that the vast majority of that corn is produced in an area irrigated using the aquifer system I mentioned, and that we're currently dropping water levels there around 2% per year or so, and that 100,000 years of natural rainfall would be required to replenish that system has NO bearing on the cost of using corn ethanol as a fuel?

Maybe it's just me, but I kinda see Fark threads as a conversation over beers at a bar.  I've been unable to picture a single scenario like that in which I don't see you sitting in the corner, drooling.
2014-03-29 12:42:37 PM
1 votes:

jso2897: What do you mean "biofuels like ethanol"?
As far as I know, the only biofuel that is "like ethanol" is ethanol.


In common use, that phrase means ethanol is an example of a type of biofuel.


Also, since you knew this and probably thought you were showing your smartitude by being a language nerd, see definition 4:
http://i.word.com/idictionary/-like

When feigning ignorance in a pedantic fashion, one ought to be at least technically correct :)
2014-03-29 12:19:48 PM
1 votes:
Environmentalists thought ethanol was a bad idea since day one.  It was nothing more than a handout from Bush to his Midwest supporters.
2014-03-29 11:05:32 AM
1 votes:
I heard wind power kills birds.

Burning coal is way better
2014-03-29 11:00:39 AM
1 votes:

edmo: Cars pollute way more than horses which is why they never really took off.

/People miss the point that alternative fuels are about finding new sources of energy more than they are being nice to the environment


No we have to squeeze every drop of oil out of every rock because the alternatives aren't perfect enough and ruin lawnmowers
2014-03-29 10:16:04 AM
1 votes:
All tractors should run on ethanol. Checkmate.
 
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