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(Mental Floss)   100 years ago today, a group of radicals planned the murder of Franz Ferdinand. Hipster radicals, obviously, since they hated Franz Ferdinand well before the rest of us ever heard "Take Me Out"   (mentalfloss.com) divider line 117
    More: Interesting, Franz Ferdinand, radical planning, Bosnian Muslims, political union, Serbs, Albania, Sarajevo, Bosnians  
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3263 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Mar 2014 at 9:47 AM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2014-03-28 08:20:49 AM  
i522.photobucket.com
 
2014-03-28 08:58:52 AM  
100 years ago today, a group of radicals planned the murder of Franz Ferdinand. Hipster radicals, obviously, since they hated Franz Ferdinand well before the rest of us ever heard "Take Me Out"

This is bad news...for Led Zeppelin.
 
2014-03-28 09:48:27 AM  
SOMEONE HIT THE EMERGENCY BRAKE ON THE GREENLIGHT MACHINE IT'S GONNA BLOW
 
2014-03-28 09:50:21 AM  
First Princip of War Club...
 
2014-03-28 09:52:00 AM  
We'll just take out this dude, and no one will ever notice.
 
2014-03-28 09:52:55 AM  
Dan Carlin covers this in one of the recent episodes of Hardcore History. Interesting stuff.

What I learned from this article, however, is just how douchey everyone's mustaches were.
 
2014-03-28 09:54:11 AM  
Eh, I like "Take Me Out".
 
2014-03-28 09:55:11 AM  
Knowing what we now know about the horrors of WW1, it's safe to say that we're now immune to people trying to whip the country into war.
 
2014-03-28 09:56:29 AM  
Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.
 
2014-03-28 09:56:46 AM  

Jim.Casy: Dan Carlin covers this in one of the recent episodes of Hardcore History. Interesting stuff.

What I learned from this article, however, is just how douchey everyone's mustaches were.


Pounds of wax were necessary to deflect the Empresses' nether 'fros. An aardvark on speed couldn't plow through that. Children were born and immediately misplaced.
 
2014-03-28 09:57:41 AM  
Take me out to the Balkans
 
2014-03-28 09:57:49 AM  
Perhaps they were just a bunch of Ringo Starr fans who wanted the duke to Back Off.
 
2014-03-28 10:01:15 AM  
I like "Take Me Out" too, but that doesn't make the headline any less funny.  Good job, subby.
 
2014-03-28 10:02:19 AM  
So, the lesson is "Let the Elites do whatever they want or you proles will be slaughtered"?
 
2014-03-28 10:02:20 AM  
I'm pretty sure what got Franz Josef killed was his plan for the United States of Austria

upload.wikimedia.org

The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.
 
2014-03-28 10:02:32 AM  
Gets me that it started off as a major fail, then one of the dispersed assassins just happened to cross paths later in the day. Furthermore, the shot might not have been fatal if the duke's clothing didn't have to be unstiched to remove.
 
2014-03-28 10:03:59 AM  
Everything about the Balkins in the early 20th century fascinates me.

Jim.Casy: Dan Carlin covers this in one of the recent episodes of Hardcore History. Interesting stuff.


DON'T TURN DOWN THAT SIDE STREET!!!!!
 
2014-03-28 10:07:51 AM  

TheShavingofOccam123: The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.


Everyone was flexing nuts back then.  I am not sure that map was a realistic plan.

If I am wrong, just throw an olde timey bomb at me as punishment.
 
2014-03-28 10:12:00 AM  
Trotsky once described the Austro-Hungarian Empire as something along the lines as a nation readying itself for the undertaker.  Of course, Stalin once described Trotsky as "that guy I want someone to stick an ice ax in."

100 years from World War I (the war to end all wars) to World War III (the war that will truly end it all) not bad.
 
2014-03-28 10:16:33 AM  

TheShavingofOccam123: I'm pretty sure what got Franz Josef killed was his plan for the United States of Austria

[upload.wikimedia.org image 535x413]

The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.


That's not a plan of a future empire that is the Austrian-Hungarian empire in 1910. That map is just proposed administrative divisions.
 
2014-03-28 10:16:33 AM  

Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.


Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!
 
2014-03-28 10:18:06 AM  
Interpol should get involved before this escalates any further. And if it does, I hope we have enough British Sea Power to defend ourselves.
 
2014-03-28 10:19:07 AM  

Gunny Highway: TheShavingofOccam123: The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.

Everyone was flexing nuts back then.  I am not sure that map was a realistic plan.

If I am wrong, just throw an olde timey bomb at me as punishment.


If you couple the German Empire's desire to control Middle Eastern oil via the Bagdad Railroad with the British Empire's desire to control Middle Eastern oil and protect India, it's pretty interesting to think what a United States of Austria might have done to both those plans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baghdad_Railway

Interesting read. The British ended up in Basra during our Iraq War. That's just where the German Empire wanted to be in 1914. But in the end, the Brits ended up with the current oil contracts in Iraq.
 
2014-03-28 10:19:24 AM  
Man, like, World War Eye was a long time ago, why do we still care?
 
2014-03-28 10:20:52 AM  

Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!


You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.
 
2014-03-28 10:21:06 AM  
Anyone with any interest in this, please read Christopher Cook's book "The Sleepwalkers".  Extensive examination of Serbian/AH politics in this time period.  Also, he looks at HOW the war conditions came about, is not interested in the 'who to blame'.

On that though: funny how in all the discussions about the blame-game for who started WW1, Serbia rarely comes up on the list.
 
2014-03-28 10:21:18 AM  

Tyrone Slothrop: Eh, I like "Take Me Out".


I liked most of that album... and the one from last year, too. So there.
 
2014-03-28 10:23:54 AM  
my son was born on the day ferdinand was killed and ww1 started
my daughter born on aug 6th atom bomb day ww2 ended
i was married on hitlers birthday.


so... im pretty sure the world will end on the day i die:)
 
2014-03-28 10:24:44 AM  
Or maybe Gavrilo Princip just misinterpreted the title?
 
2014-03-28 10:26:01 AM  

EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.


I'd take out the guy that pissed him off so bad that he turned from Temujin into Genghis Khan. Although he did murder his half-brother pretty early on so maybe he was born that way.
 
2014-03-28 10:27:31 AM  

EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.


Sure, but his direct influence on Europe and America's history is more tenuous...unless of course, it results in China invading/colonizing the west coast of the Americas 200 years before Columbus got here. More alt history! :^)
 
2014-03-28 10:28:33 AM  
This news just in... Franz Ferdinand is still dead.
 
2014-03-28 10:28:49 AM  

EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.


Watch about 16% of Caucasian brunettes disappear? NO THANKS!
 
2014-03-28 10:28:49 AM  
RIP New Radicals

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2014-03-28 10:29:34 AM  

Stone Meadow: oast of the Americas 200 years before Columbus got here. More alt history! :^)


Ask the Brother of Jared about that.
 
2014-03-28 10:31:15 AM  

TheShavingofOccam123: I'm pretty sure what got Franz Josef killed was his plan for the United States of Austria

[upload.wikimedia.org image 535x413]

The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.


I think the Hungarians were the most pissed because they had the most to lose under such a proposal.  The idea itself was not really a bad one,  He wanted to transform Austria-Hungary into a blend of Switzerland and the USA.    Franz Joseph was also not liked by the Germans since he was opposed to starting a war the Germans were hot to start.  I could see why the English wouldn't like such a proposal......sets a bad example,  might put ideas in the heads of their subject wogs.

Oh, this reminds me a joke.  A very old man walked into a bar, where he saw a soccer game playing on the TV.  He asked the bartender, "Who's playing?"  The bartender replied, "Austria, Hungary."  Right said the old man, "Who are they playing?"
 
2014-03-28 10:35:53 AM  

Valiente: EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.

Watch about 16% of Caucasian brunettes disappear? NO THANKS!


That only happens if you assume that nobody takes the place of Genghis Khan in history. Consider the possibility that, let's say, 10 people do all the raping that Genghis Khan would have done in history had the time-travel assassination plot gone off without a hitch. Those females who make up the 16% of Caucasian brunettes in our present time would possibly still exist in the altered, Genghis-less reality, but they would have a different genetic makeup.

Or, maybe I can't have the time travel discussion before noon and without some grass.
 
kth
2014-03-28 10:37:30 AM  

EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.


There are a couple of fun books out there called What If? That explore various scenarios like that.

Subjunctive history - to steal from the play History Boys.
 
2014-03-28 10:38:24 AM  

Point02GPA: Man, like, World War Eye was a long time ago, why do we still care?


100 years is a long time?  Those Serb Assassins were pissed about what happened in 1389.

There is an old saying:  "In Europe 300 miles is long distance, in America 300 years is a long time."
 
2014-03-28 10:41:33 AM  

ObscureNameHere: Anyone with any interest in this, please read Christopher Cook's book "The Sleepwalkers".  Extensive examination of Serbian/AH politics in this time period.  Also, he looks at HOW the war conditions came about, is not interested in the 'who to blame'.

On that though: funny how in all the discussions about the blame-game for who started WW1, Serbia rarely comes up on the list.


Another good one is July 1914.
 
2014-03-28 10:47:36 AM  

TheShavingofOccam123: I'm pretty sure what got Franz Josef killed was his plan for the United States of Austria

[upload.wikimedia.org image 535x413]

The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.


And the Latverians would've gone apesh*t.
 
2014-03-28 10:48:53 AM  

Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.



What about Princip's mother, Sarah C.Princip?
 
2014-03-28 10:55:40 AM  

MemeSlave: Stone Meadow: oast of the Americas 200 years before Columbus got here. More alt history! :^)

Ask the Brother of Jared about that.


Win!
 
2014-03-28 10:56:45 AM  

goatan: TheShavingofOccam123: I'm pretty sure what got Franz Josef killed was his plan for the United States of Austria

[upload.wikimedia.org image 535x413]

The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.

That's not a plan of a future empire that is the Austrian-Hungarian empire in 1910. That map is just proposed administrative divisions.


I have to remember "United States" doesn't necessarily mean elective representative government.
 
2014-03-28 10:57:44 AM  

TheShavingofOccam123: Gunny Highway: TheShavingofOccam123: The German, British and Russian empires probably wouldn't have liked its creation. Apparently, the Croats weren't too keen on it either.

Everyone was flexing nuts back then.  I am not sure that map was a realistic plan.

If I am wrong, just throw an olde timey bomb at me as punishment.

If you couple the German Empire's desire to control Middle Eastern oil via the Bagdad Railroad with the British Empire's desire to control Middle Eastern oil and protect India, it's pretty interesting to think what a United States of Austria might have done to both those plans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baghdad_Railway

Interesting read. The British ended up in Basra during our Iraq War. That's just where the German Empire wanted to be in 1914. But in the end, the Brits ended up with the current oil contracts in Iraq.


Cheers.  Thanks!
 
2014-03-28 11:01:16 AM  

Mentat: ObscureNameHere: Anyone with any interest in this, please read Christopher Cook's book "The Sleepwalkers".  Extensive examination of Serbian/AH politics in this time period.  Also, he looks at HOW the war conditions came about, is not interested in the 'who to blame'.

On that though: funny how in all the discussions about the blame-game for who started WW1, Serbia rarely comes up on the list.

Another good one is July 1914.


cache0.bdcdn.net

Another good book that covers importance of The Balkans Wars and Marocco "situations."
 
2014-03-28 11:08:04 AM  
Also, weirdly enough in hindsight, Britain was not at all happy with what they percieved as potential Russian encroachment on their Far East possessions.  Why does this matter?   It matters because certainly one of the 'You're Not Helping' factors of 1914 was that Britain was deliberately and entirely unclear with France and the other powers about how exactly their foreign policy would play out in the event of hostilities.   There was even discussions in France about their treaties with Russia and how much hostility was needed to actually invoke the terms of the treaty.

This 'fog of war' in diplomacy played out everywhere with all the nations in making decisions on the basis of no or incorrect information.  So, as Chris Cook states, by August 1914 you had all of the major European powers going to war with each other even though none had actually been attacked.  And a war that each believed was a defensive action.
 
2014-03-28 11:13:28 AM  
And 84 years ago Constantinople became Istanbul

/TMBG FTW
 
2014-03-28 11:13:48 AM  

EyeballKid: Stone Meadow: Levarien: Some people say that the first thing you do with a time machine is kill Hitler.  I think Princip is a better target.

Agreed. We could have done without that 75-year-long world war. The timing being what it is, last month NPR ran several articles about recently written alternative histories in which Princip fails to kill the Archduke...Hitler goes to art school, the October Revolution fails, and women still wouldn't have the right to vote. Here's a handy link. Enjoy!

You wanna really alter history, though? Take out Genghis Khan.


All three here are excellent examples.  But here's one somewhat overlooked but related point.
WWII is often looked at as a means to get the economy of the world back on it's feet.  Industry profited.  And most importantly, a whole helluva lot of people got killed.  This readjusted the population to a more sustainable level.

I forget the name of it...  But there is some equation out there that says that the population of the earth cannot support constant growth.
No one wants to be the one to make the ultimate sacrifice.  But apparently, shaving off huge parts of the population is good for the overall stability of life.
 
2014-03-28 11:14:45 AM  
Damn, that's a name I haven't heard in forever! Loved the first cd, hated the 2nd, then forgot about them.
 
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