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(Daily Kos)   File a complaint against a cop in Kansas and it gets dismissed? That's a felony   (dailykos.com) divider line 93
    More: Asinine, Kansas, Kansas House, Health Care, International, complaints, juvenile justice, felony charges, House Minority Leader  
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11620 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Mar 2014 at 2:35 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



93 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2014-03-19 01:10:48 PM  
False complaints against cops occur far too often, but this isn't the way to fix it. There are already laws against filing false police reports.
 
2014-03-19 01:23:49 PM  
FTFA: acknowledging that if their allegations are proven false, they can be charged with perjury,

Pretty okay with this, provided the underlined portions are held true. Should be a case by case basis, not another idiotic "Zero Tolerance" law.

FTFA:Furthermore, this bill prohibits a Kansas law enforcement agency from opening an investigation into a complaint if another law enforcement agency has already investigated the complaint and found in favor of the officer.

Absolutely NOT okay with this, however. This prevents the Kansas State Police and Kansas Bureau of Investigation from investigating police corruption and abuses against the citizens of the State. Fark that shiat.

FTFA: In other words, this bill would allow police departments to arrest the people who file complaints against police officers.

No, it doesn't, unless there is something in the bill that is not being reported by DailyKOS. The wording of the bill states the complaint would not only have to be found unsubstantiated, but outright false and malicious.
 
2014-03-19 01:25:23 PM  

CruiserTwelve: False complaints against cops occur far too often, but this isn't the way to fix it. There are already laws against filing false police reports.


Yeah, doesn't perjury already cover this?
 
2014-03-19 01:30:28 PM  

EvilEgg: Yeah, doesn't perjury already cover this?


Not necessarily. It falls along the same lines as falsifying a rape allegation. Complaints are treated with the benefit of the doubt.
 
2014-03-19 01:36:13 PM  

hardinparamedic: EvilEgg: Yeah, doesn't perjury already cover this?

Not necessarily. It falls along the same lines as falsifying a rape allegation. Complaints are treated with the benefit of the doubt.


Well then, why not have this law apply to everyone?  Police should not be special.
 
2014-03-19 01:38:12 PM  

EvilEgg: Well then, why not have this law apply to everyone?  Police should not be special.


You don't think that Police would be in any position to be at a higher risk of someone filing an exaggerated or false claim?

Come on. You have people on FARK alone who gloat about how they would openly lie about something just to see a cop get in trouble. What makes you think that doesn't extend to the general public*.

*not talking about cases where ACTUAL misdeeds have been done.
 
2014-03-19 01:43:38 PM  

hardinparamedic: EvilEgg: Well then, why not have this law apply to everyone?  Police should not be special.

You don't think that Police would be in any position to be at a higher risk of someone filing an exaggerated or false claim?

Come on. You have people on FARK alone who gloat about how they would openly lie about something just to see a cop get in trouble. What makes you think that doesn't extend to the general public*.

*not talking about cases where ACTUAL misdeeds have been done.


I think they would be, but I don't think that makes the crime more severe.  There also other non-police that are in the same category.  Public school teacher, for one.
 
2014-03-19 02:13:17 PM  
EvilEgg:
I think they would be, but I don't think that makes the crime more severe.  There also other non-police that are in the same category.  Public school teacher, for one.

Having been through a false allegation and the legal misery it entails, I agree with you.
 
2014-03-19 02:34:59 PM  
i.imgur.com
 
2014-03-19 02:40:33 PM  

shanrick: [i.imgur.com image 850x223]


Or a biker, they will be more helpful
 
2014-03-19 02:40:50 PM  
I assume cops will also be charged with a felony if they arrest someone who is found to be innocent?
 
2014-03-19 02:44:47 PM  

hardinparamedic: You don't think that Police would be in any position to be at a higher risk of someone filing an exaggerated or false claim?


I would think because of the perception of retaliation the police would be at a lower risk of someone filing a claim at all. I won't even ask a cop for directions let alone file some complaint with my name attached to it.
 
2014-03-19 02:45:53 PM  

shanrick: [i.imgur.com image 850x223]


oi48.tinypic.com
 
2014-03-19 02:46:27 PM  

hardinparamedic: You don't think that Police would be in any position to be at a higher risk of someone filing an exaggerated or false claim?


No.

It is very naive to think they aren't already given special treatment in the criminal justice system.


hardinparamedic: What makes you think that doesn't extend to the general public


Even if it did, I have seen plenty of cases that prove that, even with this attitude, cops clearly get away with lying and breaking the law, on what appears to be, a routine basis.
 
2014-03-19 02:47:43 PM  

genner: I assume cops will also be charged with a felony if they arrest someone who is found to be innocent?


Police have qualified immunity, which means they cannot be convicted for misconduct unless they violate a "clearly established right".

So, arresting an innocent person?  No.  Arresting someone they know to be innocent?  Yes.
 
2014-03-19 02:48:09 PM  
69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.
 
2014-03-19 02:51:36 PM  

mlorton: genner: I assume cops will also be charged with a felony if they arrest someone who is found to be innocent?

Police have qualified immunity, which means they cannot be convicted for misconduct unless they violate a "clearly established right".

So, arresting an innocent person?  No.  Arresting someone they know to be innocent?  Yes.


www.quickmeme.com
 
2014-03-19 02:52:33 PM  
Since this is Daily Kos, can we assume the same credibility as Daily Fail, Fox News and the Onion?
 
2014-03-19 02:52:52 PM  

Headso: I would think because of the perception of retaliation the police would be at a lower risk of someone filing a claim at all.


Some cop decided to have his off duty pig* mess with my wife after he pulled her over.

I was on speaker phone for part of it, so after she hung up I called the police about it and the county cops denied she had been pulled over. Either they were lying or the sop who pulled her over didn't call it in. We were going to file a complaint but a buddy who was a state trooper said while it was completely farked up, and as far as he knew broke several rules, that it wasn't worth it. We have to drive through the county and they would fark with us in the future, and since there was no clear proof of breaking the law absolutely nothing would happen.

/I rarely use that term, deserved in this case.
 
2014-03-19 02:53:07 PM  
Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident
 
2014-03-19 02:53:48 PM  

mlorton: Arresting someone they know to be innocent? Yes


Sadly the answer in reality is still no.
 
2014-03-19 02:53:56 PM  

hardinparamedic: FTFA: acknowledging that if their allegations are proven false, they can be charged with perjury,

Pretty okay with this, provided the underlined portions are held true. Should be a case by case basis, not another idiotic "Zero Tolerance" law.

FTFA:Furthermore, this bill prohibits a Kansas law enforcement agency from opening an investigation into a complaint if another law enforcement agency has already investigated the complaint and found in favor of the officer.

Absolutely NOT okay with this, however. This prevents the Kansas State Police and Kansas Bureau of Investigation from investigating police corruption and abuses against the citizens of the State. Fark that shiat.

FTFA: In other words, this bill would allow police departments to arrest the people who file complaints against police officers.

No, it doesn't, unless there is something in the bill that is not being reported by DailyKOS. The wording of the bill states the complaint would not only have to be found unsubstantiated, but outright false and malicious.


What's the standard for this? If you misremember what time an altercation happened, but the rest of your testimony is true, is that a felony? How about if you are incorrect about what item the cop used to hit you?

I agree that there should be tougher repercussions for people who knowingly make false allegations against each other (whether it be against a cop or a neighbor). I had a family member who was arrested due to false allegations in an attempt to extort money from him. *shakes head*
 
2014-03-19 02:54:16 PM  
The good cops who protect bad cops are the worst cops of all.
 
2014-03-19 02:54:48 PM  
Oh Daily Kos; representing the bill in the worst possible light, why am I not surprised?

Granted, it's trash and it's not going to pass; but, it's not exactly pearl clutchy material. I agree that patiently false and malicious complaints should be punished; but, not at the cost of discouraging legit complaints.
 
2014-03-19 02:54:54 PM  

simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.


Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.
 
2014-03-19 02:55:59 PM  

hardinparamedic: No, it doesn't, unless there is something in the bill that is not being reported by DailyKOS. The wording of the bill states the complaint would not only have to be found unsubstantiated, but outright false and malicious.


Eh, maybe I take back my last response if this is really true.
 
2014-03-19 02:56:22 PM  

Spad31: Since this is Daily Kos, can we assume the same credibility as Daily Fail, Fox News and the Onion?


The Onion is way more reliable than any of those others. :P
 
2014-03-19 02:56:30 PM  
I had to file a complaint against an officer once.  When I went to the station to get the form to fill out, 2 cops asked me if I was sure I really wanted to do this.  When I asked for 2 more forms they quickly went into "oh were just looking out for your safety, a false report can lead to blah blah blah".  Drop that holier than thou attitude and maybe there would be less complaints to begin with.
 
2014-03-19 02:56:42 PM  

Prophet of Loss: Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident


Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.

Oh, wait. This is where you go "LOL I TROLL U", right?
 
2014-03-19 02:58:01 PM  
 
2014-03-19 02:58:17 PM  

hardinparamedic: FTFA: acknowledging that if their allegations are proven false, they can be charged with perjury,

Pretty okay with this, provided the underlined portions are held true. Should be a case by case basis, not another idiotic "Zero Tolerance" law.


What if you believe an allegation is true, and it isn't?

It's definitely possible for a guy who got beaten by/in a crowd to think a cop did it.  Maybe he thinks it's cop #6202 and it was actually cop #6220 or something.  If he has facts wrong, provably so, it doesn't mean the complaint is entirely invalid, and it certainly doesn't mean the complainant should be liable/charged.
 
2014-03-19 03:00:02 PM  
How can anyone think it should be legal for an officer to have the right to be able to read over the entire claim against them?  It gives the officer(s) in question an easy out, since they can always come up with a good story that will back up their side of a claim against them.

The only way to say that this suggested law is legal is to then state that every citizen of the state of Kansas is already a suspected criminal, and therefore anything they may say against an officer is considered to be suspect.
 
2014-03-19 03:00:12 PM  

elysive: Eh, maybe I take back my last response if this is really true.


I would hope that the bill would only reserve prosecution for people where they can prove the intent was malicious - i.e. they just wanted to ruin someone's career/life.

That said, I don't support the bill for the reason I mentioned in the initial post in this thread: It eliminates State oversight if the local department deems a complaint "False"
 
2014-03-19 03:02:02 PM  

CruiserTwelve: False complaints against cops occur far too often, but this isn't the way to fix it. There are already laws against filing false police reports.


Yeah, but cops get to do whatever they want AT whomever they want because SHUT UP COMMIE!
 
2014-03-19 03:04:26 PM  
If the police think you're guilty of a crime, you will be punished for that crime.  It's perfectly legal to keep innocent people in jail and never try them (if you find the right loophole).  It's perfectly legal to intimidate or confuse a 'confession' out of someone (as long as the officers don't admit to any misconduct).  It's perfectly legal to lie to a suspect to scare them into pleading guilty to a lesser crime to avoid a harsher sentence.

If you think the police are guilty of a crime, you will be punished for making the accusation.  The burden of proof is never on the police, yet they are the guardians of evidence.  If there is evidence damning them, they will destroy it.  If there is no evidence challenging your credibility, they will create it.  They can charge you with anything they want in retaliation, and they can prove it by saying it is so.

Do not fark with police.  Stay the fark away from police.  Do not call the police unless you are going to die otherwise.  Do not call them to protect property.  Do not call them to catch someone else breaking the law.  Do not give the police any reason whatsoever to know your name.

*adjusts tinfoil hat*
 
2014-03-19 03:06:03 PM  

walkerhound: simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.

Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.


Solved for "X" in dog-time.

www.petpro.com

/they make them for guns as well, but I wanted to post this since I actually have it up on our front gate.
 
2014-03-19 03:08:42 PM  

hardinparamedic: Prophet of Loss: Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident

Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.

Oh, wait. This is where you go "LOL I TROLL U", right?


You cut off her clothes...was there a massive amount of blood or something? Never mind, I don't want to know.

Anyway, that kind of crap happens all the time when you piss somebody off. Ex. We had a Lady file a formal complaint with the President of my company, because we caught her kid trying to steal stuff. Our legal department is so letigiphobic (if it's not a word, it is now) that I was wondering if we were all going to get canned over it.
 
2014-03-19 03:09:17 PM  

hardinparamedic: FTFA: acknowledging that if their allegations are proven false, they can be charged with perjury,

Pretty okay with this, provided the underlined portions are held true. Should be a case by case basis, not another idiotic "Zero Tolerance" law.


I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one.  You're obviously thinking like normal people here instead of someone with malicious intent.  With "proven false" it can be opened up to simple mistakes.  Say a witnesses name was Will Johnson and it's really John Williamson; bang, perjury charge.  Say officer Bill showed up first when it was officer Adam; bang, perjury charge.  There's an entire laundry list that "proven false" can be applied to.  You and I might say that would be stretching the law, but a malicious prosecutor could intimidate potential complaintants with it.

If the Kansas Legislature was actually wanting to be fair, they should have phrased it like "proven fabrication" so intent to lie was also included.
 
2014-03-19 03:09:34 PM  

hardinparamedic: Prophet of Loss: Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident

Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything.


If you don't know what the word "apologist" means, there are resources.  Sarcasm quotes do not help you.
 
2014-03-19 03:13:57 PM  
I think there should be civilian over-sight.  No internal affairs BS.  A complaint should be made to a non-police group with investigative powers.  If police are needed during an investigation they should be pulled from far flung regions far away from where the alleged abuse happened.

Any police officer caught planting evidence should get the same number of years that would have befallen their victim.  Any police officer that forgets they are there to protect and serve should be fired....and banned from law enforcement forever.
 
2014-03-19 03:15:31 PM  

Skyd1v: walkerhound: simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.

Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.

Solved for "X" in dog-time.

[www.petpro.com image 150x150]

/they make them for guns as well, but I wanted to post this since I actually have it up on our front gate.


I have this one on my front door:
img.auctiva.com

*his name was Ruger
 
2014-03-19 03:15:43 PM  

ciberido: Sarcasm quotes do not help you.


Well, since the intent wasn't picked up on, they were meant to demonstrate the amount of farks I give.

Instead, I'll present a handy, dandy pie chart on the amount I give of your personal opinion of me.

global3.memecdn.com

If you seriously can't take every case on a case-by-case basis while claiming to be open and rational, without resorting to argumentum ad odium as your justification for hating a group, then by all means, whatever lets you sleep at night.

iheartscotch: You cut off her clothes...was there a massive amount of blood or something? Never mind, I don't want to know.


Drunk and ejected was no way to go through life. The sexual assault claims magically appeared when her lawyer told her they used our field lab draw to get her BAL.
 
2014-03-19 03:15:45 PM  
The cops where I live all seem pretty good if you act normal. Must be the high pensions.
 
2014-03-19 03:17:31 PM  

codenamewizard: I think there should be civilian over-sight.  No internal affairs BS.  A complaint should be made to a non-police group with investigative powers.  If police are needed during an investigation they should be pulled from far flung regions far away from where the alleged abuse happened.

Any police officer caught planting evidence should get the same number of years that would have befallen their victim.  Any police officer that forgets they are there to protect and serve should be fired....and banned from law enforcement forever.


License cops the same they do Nurses, Doctors and Paramedics. At the State level. Establish a board made up of lawyers, civilian members, and experts in law enforcement best practices. Require every cop to carry "malpractice" insurance the same they do healthcare providers and firefighters.

No local investigations of wrongdoing.
 
2014-03-19 03:18:04 PM  
♫ ♪ When I fight authority, authority always wins. ♪ ♫
 
2014-03-19 03:19:29 PM  
I hate pigs, but on the scale of things to get outraged about "make it criminal to lie on a police complaint" falls pretty far down the list. I'm actually a lot more outraged at the "you can't investigate if another law enforcement org found in favor of the cop" part.
 
2014-03-19 03:19:41 PM  

69gnarkill69: shanrick: [i.imgur.com image 850x223]

[oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]


That's faster than light. Unpossible.
 
2014-03-19 03:25:48 PM  

walkerhound: He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.


check out the hook while dj revolves it.
 
2014-03-19 03:26:34 PM  
my.

..my dj...

/that joke is ruined now, RUINED!
 
2014-03-19 03:30:43 PM  

busy chillin': my.

..my dj...

/that joke is ruined now, RUINED!


Hey, I still thought it was funny.

/but I'm weird
 
2014-03-19 03:31:08 PM  

walkerhound: Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.


He should have said the response "speed" of the gun was 1800 ft/sec (or whatever it was).   Instead he called it time.  Time is not measured in ft/sec no matter how smart you think you are.
 
2014-03-19 03:31:27 PM  

hardinparamedic: ciberido: Sarcasm quotes do not help you.

Well, since the intent wasn't picked up on, they were meant to demonstrate the amount of farks I give.

Instead, I'll present a handy, dandy pie chart on the amount I give of your personal opinion of me.

[global3.memecdn.com image 640x492]


That's fine, but you should be aware that these posts are accomplishing nothing but demolishing your own credibility.

And let's just take it as given that you really don't care about that, either, shall we?  So there's really no need for you to actually go through with the inevitable insult or mockery.
 
2014-03-19 03:33:17 PM  

genner: mlorton: genner: I assume cops will also be charged with a felony if they arrest someone who is found to be innocent?

Police have qualified immunity, which means they cannot be convicted for misconduct unless they violate a "clearly established right".

So, arresting an innocent person?  No.  Arresting someone they know to be innocent?  Yes.

[www.quickmeme.com image 512x288]



well, it was pretty obvious that you were being sarcastic but i'm afraid i missed your point as well.
 
2014-03-19 03:33:33 PM  

I hate pigs, but on the scale of things to get outraged about "make it criminal to lie on a police complaint" falls pretty far down the list. I'm actually a lot more outraged at the "you can't investigate if another law enforcement org found in favor of the cop" part.

Giving them all evidence against them prior to questioning them is a big NO.

 
2014-03-19 03:33:52 PM  

ciberido: And let's just take it as given that you really don't care about that, either, shall we?  So there's really no need for you to actually go through with the inevitable insult or mockery.


It's just my innate masochism.
 
2014-03-19 03:35:35 PM  
shanrick [TotalFark]

call-a-hippy.jpg

If you think calling a police will actually get you help, you're dumber than a hippy.
 
2014-03-19 03:36:32 PM  
Skyd1v:

Cheers!
 
2014-03-19 03:37:01 PM  

iheartscotch: Oh Daily Kos; representing the bill in the worst possible light, why am I not surprised?

Granted, it's trash and it's not going to pass; but, it's not exactly pearl clutchy material. I agree that patiently false and malicious complaints should be punished; but, not at the cost of discouraging legit complaints.


Even law enforcement officers testified against it.

""The sheriff's office investigates numerous criminal cases, and we do not provide these materials to the interviewee prior the interview, thus I do not believe in providing deputies with evidence prior to the interview on alleged misconduct," [Sedgwick County Sheriff] Easter said...Easter said of the 152 complaints filed with the sheriff's office last year, only two were determined to be false and that the people who filed those complaints are already being prosecuted under current law for filing false police reports."

The only person who testified in favor of the bill was the lawyer for the Kansas law enforcement unions who was also, not coincidentally, the one who was behind the bill in the first place.
 
2014-03-19 03:38:21 PM  

rugman11: The only person who testified in favor of the bill was the lawyer for the Kansas law enforcement unions who was also, not coincidentally, the one who was behind the bill in the first place.


Imagine that. An LE union testifying in favor of a bill that would give them utter immunity in their actions.

Hey, did you know it's a day that ends in -y?
 
2014-03-19 03:39:08 PM  
We'll stop filing false police reports when they stop planting drugs on people
 
2014-03-19 03:41:15 PM  

simkatu: walkerhound: Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.

He should have said the response "speed" of the gun was 1800 ft/sec (or whatever it was).   Instead he called it time.  Time is not measured in ft/sec no matter how smart you think you are.


i1.ytimg.com
 
2014-03-19 03:43:26 PM  

busy chillin': walkerhound: He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.

check out the hook while dj revolves it.


Ice cold, man
 
2014-03-19 03:54:08 PM  

hardinparamedic: I'll present a handy, dandy pie chart on the amount I give of your personal opinion of me.


I'd like to add on a personal note, considering the number of threads in which we've found ourselves in agreement and/or have backed each other up when a third party challenges something we said, I rather thought we had some some kind of mutual respect or fellow feeling.  I suppose it was naïve of me to imagine this feeling was mutual, but I admit I am saddened to discover you think so little of me.

Yes, yes, you don't care about this, either.  I get that.
 
2014-03-19 03:59:26 PM  

ciberido: I rather thought we had some some kind of mutual respect or fellow feeling.


Actually, cynicism aside, I have a lot of respect for you and your beliefs on this board.

To be honest, that was not so much delivered in regards to you, but rather in general, especially towards Prophet of Loss or  OnlyM3*. Sorry about that.

*I've had him ignored for the past two months, since every post addressed to be tends to be the rantings of a homophobic FARK Libertarian, or of his odd gay foot fetishes.
 
2014-03-19 04:07:25 PM  

walkerhound: simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.

Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.


Or, it's a stupid propaganda bit and deserves to be laughed at, just as you do.

/because he is correct and you're a tool
 
2014-03-19 04:12:07 PM  

ArcadianRefugee: walkerhound: simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.

Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.

Or, it's a stupid propaganda bit and deserves to be laughed at, just as you do.

/because he is correct and you're a tool


Something something Kessel Run something something parsecs.
 
2014-03-19 04:13:08 PM  

Spad31: Since this is Daily Kos, can we assume the same credibility


They link to, and quote, the Washington Post story the article is based on.
 
2014-03-19 04:15:03 PM  

hardinparamedic: Prophet of Loss: Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident

Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.

Oh, wait. This is where you go "LOL I TROLL U", right?


False my ass. Women don't lie about such things.
 
2014-03-19 04:18:37 PM  
This has been the law in California for decades.
 
2014-03-19 04:23:12 PM  

fnordfocus: This has been the law in California for decades.


that explains why you constantly see stories about the police beating up old and disabled people coming out of cali.
 
2014-03-19 04:29:53 PM  
Here is what happens when you walk into police the department and ask to file a complaint.
 
2014-03-19 04:36:37 PM  
Oh, and there's a beautiful gift to crooked LEOs hiding in the new law.  In Section 1(f)(2):

(f) A law enforcement agency shall not:
...
(3) open a separate investigation of a complaint if another agency has
investigated such complaint and found no evidence of misconduct on the
part of the law enforcement officer; or

So, if the local department rubber stamps an investigation that finds their Officer did nothing wrong, a state agency can't look into it.
 
2014-03-19 04:47:06 PM  

hardinparamedic: EvilEgg: Well then, why not have this law apply to everyone?  Police should not be special.

You don't think that Police would be in any position to be at a higher risk of someone filing an exaggerated or false claim?

Come on. You have people on FARK alone who gloat about how they would openly lie about something just to see a cop get in trouble. What makes you think that doesn't extend to the general public*.

*not talking about cases where ACTUAL misdeeds have been done.


I'm concerned that it says "proven false"--does that mean merely "unsubstantiated," or is there an additional component of malice that needs to be shown for a felony charge to be made?

A lot of people file misconduct complaints that are ultimately unfounded (ie false), but that doesn't mean there was malicious intent to cause harm.
 
2014-03-19 04:50:35 PM  
what, slander and liable law not good enough?

How about hiring better cops?

how about both?

Or is that not an option . . .
 
2014-03-19 04:59:34 PM  

Gyrfalcon: A lot of people file misconduct complaints that are ultimately unfounded


I have seen several people assert this but I am curious if it is even true, who are all these people  entitled enough to believe they can just file a complaint against what amounts to a gang and get away with it? The vast majority of people who get their rights violated are street smart enough to know not to put your name on a document that has complaints against the police.
 
2014-03-19 05:09:33 PM  

Gyrfalcon: 'm concerned that it says "proven false"--does that mean merely "unsubstantiated," or is there an additional component of malice that needs to be shown for a felony charge to be made?

A lot of people file misconduct complaints that are ultimately unfounded (ie false), but that doesn't mean there was malicious intent to cause harm.


I won't support this for the simple fact it gives the police unions a blanket immunity through people who are members investigating other members of it. The way this bill is written, it places responsibility for disciplinary action at the local department level, and actually prohibits State authorities from investigating.
 
PJ-
2014-03-19 05:15:47 PM  
My dealings with police is always the same, no matter what the situation, even if I'm the one who is a victim of a crime.

Cop: 'What do you remember about what happened?'
Me: 'nothing, I was looking at something else at the time'
cop: 'well, did you hear anything?'
me: 'nope'

Sure, I've had a couple cops try to get heavy handed with me, and I just shrug it off and ask if I'm free to go.  I have zero trust of all cops, and it's the best way of staying safe from the actual bad cops.  So I keep interaction between the cops and myself to a minimum.

Sure, there may be a time where I will need a cop to save me some unknown danger, but that's what I pay my taxes for.  I don't pay taxes to be treated like a potential suspect at all times thanks.
 
2014-03-19 05:16:21 PM  

rugman11: iheartscotch: Oh Daily Kos; representing the bill in the worst possible light, why am I not surprised?

Granted, it's trash and it's not going to pass; but, it's not exactly pearl clutchy material. I agree that patiently false and malicious complaints should be punished; but, not at the cost of discouraging legit complaints.

Even law enforcement officers testified against it.

""The sheriff's office investigates numerous criminal cases, and we do not provide these materials to the interviewee prior the interview, thus I do not believe in providing deputies with evidence prior to the interview on alleged misconduct," [Sedgwick County Sheriff] Easter said...Easter said of the 152 complaints filed with the sheriff's office last year, only two were determined to be false and that the people who filed those complaints are already being prosecuted under current law for filing false police reports."

The only person who testified in favor of the bill was the lawyer for the Kansas law enforcement unions who was also, not coincidentally, the one who was behind the bill in the first place.


Who hired him?
 
2014-03-19 05:24:31 PM  

shanrick: [i.imgur.com image 850x223]


The ONE time in my life I called the cops, I was handcuffed.  Long story short, drunk ex-girlfriend, blah, blah.  She was smashing out my windows.  I called the cops, they arrive and handcuff me to "stabilize the situation".  In the end, they let her drunk ass drive off and told me I'd be arrested if there were anymore calls that night.  Fark every single one of them.  I'll take my chances without these morons.
 
2014-03-19 05:29:06 PM  
TFA uses the words "dismissed" and "proven false" as though they mean the same thing. They don't. Complaints can conceivably be dismissed for lack of sufficient evidence without being "proven false".

And I believe that perjury statutes usually require that a statement be knowingly false, and made with intent to deceive. An incorrect statement made in good faith is not perjury.
 
2014-03-19 05:31:16 PM  
Uh .. "when you report police abuse, you must swear out an affidavit which makes you subject to felony charges if any portion is 'shown false' and the officer is provided all of this information ahead of time.  .."

Filing a false report  ought to get you whacked.

Just as not putting a serious whack on police who cross the line is wrong

/whack
//whacka whacka whacka
 
2014-03-19 05:49:19 PM  

hardinparamedic: Prophet of Loss: Hardin and 12 - Fark's resident cop apologists.

/Isolated incident

Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.

Oh, wait. This is where you go "LOL I TROLL U", right?


Was she hot? Pictures?
 
2014-03-19 05:55:17 PM  

ciberido: hardinparamedic: I'll present a handy, dandy pie chart on the amount I give of your personal opinion of me.

I'd like to add on a personal note, considering the number of threads in which we've found ourselves in agreement and/or have backed each other up when a third party challenges something we said, I rather thought we had some some kind of mutual respect or fellow feeling.  I suppose it was naïve of me to imagine this feeling was mutual, but I admit I am saddened to discover you think so little of me.

Yes, yes, you don't care about this, either.  I get that.


hardinparamedic: ciberido: I rather thought we had some some kind of mutual respect or fellow feeling.

Actually, cynicism aside, I have a lot of respect for you and your beliefs on this board.

To be honest, that was not so much delivered in regards to you, but rather in general, especially towards Prophet of Loss or  OnlyM3*. Sorry about that.

*I've had him ignored for the past two months, since every post addressed to be tends to be the rantings of a homophobic FARK Libertarian, or of his odd gay foot fetishes.


Good, good....now you two kiss....
 
2014-03-19 06:32:15 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2014-03-19 07:00:40 PM  
"I'm filing a report against you, pig! I'm gonna sue your ass!"

talesfromthelou.files.wordpress.com

"Haha, this here's Kansas, boy! You ain't filing nuttin"
 
2014-03-19 07:25:24 PM  

hardinparamedic: Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.


Why'd that take 6 months? Simply have the 'woman deputy' talk to the 'little tart's'* lawyer, and tell him what really happened, and how she'll testify. What idiot lawyer would take the case after that?

*nice way to refer to someone, btw. Kinda doesn't support your case, though.
 
2014-03-19 08:15:42 PM  

EvilEgg: hardinparamedic: EvilEgg: Yeah, doesn't perjury already cover this?

Not necessarily. It falls along the same lines as falsifying a rape allegation. Complaints are treated with the benefit of the doubt.

Well then, why not have this law apply to everyone?  Police should not be special.


Au contraire.  It's vital that we hold police to lower standards, because their jobs are almost as dangerous as those of lumberjacks and fishermen.
 
2014-03-19 08:19:08 PM  

fredklein: hardinparamedic: Please quote where I have "apologized" for anything. I spent six months defending myself along with a non-commissioned deputy against a false sexual assault charge because I cut the clothes off a drunk teenager to ensure she didn't have a life-threatening injury. Somehow, despite a woman deputy in the back with this little tart, we both managed to tag-team rape her in-between the scene and the Regional Medical Center.

Why'd that take 6 months? Simply have the 'woman deputy' talk to the 'little tart's'* lawyer, and tell him what really happened, and how she'll testify. What idiot lawyer would take the case after that?

*nice way to refer to someone, btw. Kinda doesn't support your case, though.


Wouldn't you use a nasty derogatory name for someone who tried to get you fired and thrown in jail, just to get out of a DUI?

And no, once the wheels of an sexual assault investigation are set in motion, a nice little chat from the deputy doesn't make it go away. There are multiple interviews and much fact-gathering by the police, then more by your employer, then more by any unions or professional associations you belong to.
 
2014-03-19 09:22:32 PM  

foxyshadis: Wouldn't you use a nasty derogatory name for someone who tried to get you fired and thrown in jail, just to get out of a DUI?


Officers get people fired and thrown in jail for bogus reasons all the team.

When us little people use derogatory names for Officers, we get the fark beat out of us.
 
2014-03-19 10:13:07 PM  

CruiserTwelve: False complaints against cops occur far too often, but this isn't the way to fix it. There are already laws against filing false police reports.


Police misconduct also occurs far to often.  

Clean up your house and start arresting your 'brothers' for their crimes.   Get serous about addressing the legitimate complaints, stop dismissing real complaints as false ones, and maybe we'll be a little more sympathetic about the really false ones.
 
2014-03-20 01:25:37 AM  

abmoraz: ArcadianRefugee: walkerhound: simkatu: 69gnarkill69:    [oi48.tinypic.com image 726x396]

That's a speed not a measurement of time.

Dependent on how far the target is at the time.  He basically gave you an equation for "X" and you're too dumb to solve it.

Or, it's a stupid propaganda bit and deserves to be laughed at, just as you do.

/because he is correct and you're a tool

Something something Kessel Run something something parsecs.


Exactly.

/wait, what?
 
2014-03-20 01:50:12 AM  

hardinparamedic: ciberido: I rather thought we had some some kind of mutual respect or fellow feeling.

Actually, cynicism aside, I have a lot of respect for you and your beliefs on this board.

To be honest, that was not so much delivered in regards to you, but rather in general, especially towards Prophet of Loss or  OnlyM3*. Sorry about that.

*I've had him ignored for the past two months, since every post addressed to be tends to be the rantings of a homophobic FARK Libertarian, or of his odd gay foot fetishes.


I am so heartbroken some random self-righteous arrogant prick on the internet doesn't like me.

I am going to have a good cry.
 
2014-03-20 01:55:17 AM  

Clint_Torres: [img.fark.net image 468x304]


OK, THAT was a blast from the past that nobody remembers. Holy shiat.
 
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